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Norway wants US Marines
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Norway wants US Marines
wrote:
On Thu, 14 Jun 2018 21:03:55 -0400, Keyser Söze wrote: Mr. Luddite wrote: On 6/14/2018 8:54 PM, Keyser Soze wrote: On 6/14/18 8:47 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote: On 6/14/2018 7:48 PM, wrote: On Thu, 14 Jun 2018 13:37:34 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: The USA did a lot to help beat the Germans and save Europe but sometimes I think we tend to minimize the contributions and sacrifices made by Russia. It the Germans had not screwed up and attacked Russia we might be looking at a completely different Europe, one that speaks German. If the Germans had simply concentrated on invading the UK in the summer of 41, and not instituting operation Barbarosa, I doubt anyone would have been able to stop them. The US was still pretending to be neutral at the time. If we really had to try to take back all of Europe from Western Africa with no infrastructure to support an invasion force and the Germans pretty much controlling the Atlantic from Gibraltar to Iceland along with choking off the Med and owning it, I don't even know how we would get there.* I am not even sure we would try. The United States suffered 419,400 fatalities for all WWII related causes and had 671,801 total injured. The Soviet Union suffered somewhere between 20,000,000 to 27,000,000 fatalities with 14,685,593 injured. That was the only point I was trying to make but now Harry calls me a Putin lover. Estimates vary, but the number of Russians killed by Stalin range from about 8 million to 20 million. What does that have to do with sacrifices made by the USSR in WWII? Try to pay attention. Life is considered cheap in Russia and lots of deaths may not be a strong motivator. Get it? It's a good thing too. If the Russians had of worried about the casualties and sued for peace in 1941-42 as Hitler thought they would and Stalin had pulled back to the territory he could keep, UK would have been crushed, long before there was anything we could have done to stop them. Was mostly the Russian winter that got the Germans. When I was with NCR, one of the customers data center manager was a German. We were talking about Mercedes and fine German Engineering. Otto spoke up and said it sucked. He was on the Russian front as a German artillery man. He said when winter came, their 88’s froze up. Could not be fired. When they fired, were extremely accurate. He said during the winter, the Russian guns only hit in the general area they were aimed. But they were a fraction bigger than his Weapon and could fire the German shells, but not the reverse. So, we sat and got the **** shot out of us with our own ammo. Some movies of the Russian retreating at Stalingrad and the lake ice is 4”of water on top as they hauled ass. Prevented the Russians from following. |
Norway wants US Marines
On Thu, 14 Jun 2018 19:25:50 -0400, wrote:
On Thu, 14 Jun 2018 13:05:55 -0400, John H. wrote: On Thu, 14 Jun 2018 12:18:15 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 6/14/2018 12:11 PM, True North wrote: On Thursday, 14 June 2018 12:13:42 UTC-3, wrote: On Thu, 14 Jun 2018 07:59:51 -0400, Keyser Soze wrote: On 6/13/18 10:37 PM, wrote: On Wed, 13 Jun 2018 16:29:04 -0400, Keyser Soze wrote: Norway is smart about money and resources...from Wiki: In March 2017, the Government Pension Fund controlled assets were valued at approximately US$913 billion (equal to US$182,000 per capita), which is about 178% of Norway's current GDP. It is the largest sovereign wealth fund in the world. The fund controls about 1.3% of all listed shares in Europe, and more than 1% of all the publicly traded shares in the world. The Norwegian Central Bank operates investment offices in London, New York, and Shanghai. Guidelines implemented in 2007 allow the fund to invest up to 60% of the capital in shares (maximum of 40% prior), while the rest may be placed in bonds and real-estate. As the stock markets tumbled in September 2008, the fund was able to buy more shares at low prices. In this way, the losses incurred by the market turmoil was recuperated by November 2009. Other nations with economies based on natural resources, such as Russia, are trying to learn from Norway by establishing similar funds. The investment choices of the Norwegian fund are directed by ethical guidelines; for example, the fund is not allowed to invest in companies that produce parts for nuclear weapons. Norway's highly transparent investment scheme is lauded by the international community. The future size of the fund is closely linked to the price of oil and to developments in international financial markets. In 2000, the government sold one-third of the state-owned oil company Statoil in an IPO. The next year, the main telecom supplier, Telenor, was listed on Oslo Stock Exchange. The state also owns significant shares of Norway's largest bank, DnB NOR and the airline SAS. Since 2000, economic growth has been rapid, pushing unemployment down to levels not seen since the early 1980s (unemployment in 2007: 1.3%). The international financial crisis has primarily affected the industrial sector, but unemployment has remained low, and was at 3.3% (86,000 people) in August 2011. Norway contains significant mineral resources, and in 2013, its mineral production was valued at US$1.5 billion (Norwegian Geological Survey data). The most valuable minerals are calcium carbonate (limestone), building stone, nepheline syenite, olivine, iron, titanium, and nickel. Norway is also the world's second-largest exporter of fish (in value, after China). Hydroelectric plants generate roughly 9899% of Norway's electric power, more than any other country in the world. Somehow, I think the Norwegians will figure out how to secure their future. I am sure they will because they "privatized" their old age pension fund and invested it in real things instead of just spending the money and putting IOUs in the box. They are not dipping into the general fund or borrowing money to pay their pensioners. Their "future" is secure as long as we keep them safe and they should doing that themselves, not sponging off of us. And, once again, without our international commitments, there would be more justification for shrinking our outrageous military budgets. So why don't we? I would start with Europe. A lot of your military costs are by your own doing...that is sticking your beak into any and every trouble spot. Viet Nam was a good example. You like to project your power whether it's requested or not. It would be interesting for historians to speculate on what the planet would be like today if the USA (and Canada) had completely followed a "we'll mind are own business" policy since the end of WWII. How about since prior to WWI? You mean like the turn of the century when we engineered the taking of Panama? (no canal) or all of the stuff we got from the Spanish American war?. You could even go back to the Mexican war. I think they like to point out the end of WWII because that was when the world pretty much stopped using wars as an excuse for Europeans and Americans to take other people's land ... well maybe with one exception. No, what would the world be like if we had just stayed home, as donnee suggested, from about 1913 on? |
Norway wants US Marines
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Norway wants US Marines
On 6/14/18 10:08 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 14 Jun 2018 21:16:02 -0400, Keyser Söze wrote: Mr. Luddite wrote: On 6/14/2018 9:03 PM, Keyser Söze wrote: Mr. Luddite wrote: On 6/14/2018 8:54 PM, Keyser Soze wrote: On 6/14/18 8:47 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote: On 6/14/2018 7:48 PM, wrote: On Thu, 14 Jun 2018 13:37:34 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: The USA did a lot to help beat the Germans and save Europe but sometimes I think we tend to minimize the contributions and sacrifices made by Russia. It the Germans had not screwed up and attacked Russia we might be looking at a completely different Europe, one that speaks German. If the Germans had simply concentrated on invading the UK in the summer of 41, and not instituting operation Barbarosa, I doubt anyone would have been able to stop them. The US was still pretending to be neutral at the time. If we really had to try to take back all of Europe from Western Africa with no infrastructure to support an invasion force and the Germans pretty much controlling the Atlantic from Gibraltar to Iceland along with choking off the Med and owning it, I don't even know how we would get there.* I am not even sure we would try. The United States suffered 419,400 fatalities for all WWII related causes and had 671,801 total injured. The Soviet Union suffered somewhere between 20,000,000 to 27,000,000 fatalities with 14,685,593 injured. That was the only point I was trying to make but now Harry calls me a Putin lover. Estimates vary, but the number of Russians killed by Stalin range from about 8 million to 20 million. What does that have to do with sacrifices made by the USSR in WWII? Try to pay attention. Life is considered cheap in Russia and lots of deaths may not be a strong motivator. Get it? No. Motivator for what? Kicking an invading army's ass? I was commenting on sacrifices made in WWII. I guess it's impossible for me to think like you. Those sacrfices might not have been a motivator for the Sov’s land snatch. I am not sure you can call a 4 1/2 year campaign against a very motivated German army a "snatch". They were just following a 4000 year tradition. You get to keep what you take in a war. It was even true after WWI setting into motion problems that still plague us today in the middle east. I am actually surprised the French gave up their sector of Germany is easily as they did. If it wasn't for pressure from the US they may have still been there. The French, since it was contiguous territory, thought it should be theirs anyway. They did annex the Saar for a while until we made them give it back. I assume your reference to "problems that still plague us" is just an oblique way of bringing up your objections to the Balfour Declaration and the promise of Great Britain to re-establish a Jewish state in the Middle East. |
Norway wants US Marines
The John flushes his head...
No, what would the world be like if we had just stayed home, as donnee suggested, from about 1913* on?* Where did I say y'all should have stayed home, Johnny? Y'all loved being policeman of the world so quit crying about the expenses you incurred. |
Norway wants US Marines
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Norway wants US Marines
On Fri, 15 Jun 2018 07:31:42 -0400, John H.
wrote: On Thu, 14 Jun 2018 19:48:11 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 14 Jun 2018 13:37:34 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: The USA did a lot to help beat the Germans and save Europe but sometimes I think we tend to minimize the contributions and sacrifices made by Russia. It the Germans had not screwed up and attacked Russia we might be looking at a completely different Europe, one that speaks German. If the Germans had simply concentrated on invading the UK in the summer of 41, and not instituting operation Barbarosa, I doubt anyone would have been able to stop them. The US was still pretending to be neutral at the time. If we really had to try to take back all of Europe from Western Africa with no infrastructure to support an invasion force and the Germans pretty much controlling the Atlantic from Gibraltar to Iceland along with choking off the Med and owning it, I don't even know how we would get there. I am not even sure we would try. Sounds like you watched WWII in Color! .... or just about any other objective look at the war. The Germans had the ability to own all of Europe but Hitler let his ego and racism override his general's advice. He thought the Russians would be easy to beat and that was the worst mistake of the war. The Japanese really screwed him tho by attacking Pearl Harbor and getting the US into the war. Then he doubled down on that by declaring war on us himself. If he had just stayed quiet about the US and let us turn our focus west we might have actually backed off the help we were giving the Brits. So many of the things that affected major turning points were really bad decisions or in decisions by Hitler. I am watching Hitler's Inner Circle now on Netflix. They are talking about all of the infighting among the higher ups in the reich. It certainly does not look like one big happy family. |
Norway wants US Marines
On Fri, 15 Jun 2018 05:43:05 -0700 (PDT), True North wrote:
The John flushes his head... No, what would the world be like if we had just stayed home, as donnee suggested, from about 1913* on?* Where did I say y'all should have stayed home, Johnny? Y'all loved being policeman of the world so quit crying about the expenses you incurred. Perhaps I misunderstood. What did you mean by this comment: "A lot of your military costs are by your own doing...that is sticking your beak into any and every trouble spot. Viet Nam was a good example. You like to project your power whether it's requested or not." What would have happened had we *not* stuck our beak into the trouble spot whether requested or not - for WWI and WWII? Perhaps you'd care to honestly answer the question? |
Norway wants US Marines
Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 6/14/2018 7:24 PM, Alex wrote: Keyser Soze wrote: On 6/13/18 11:03 PM, wrote: On Wed, 13 Jun 2018 19:18:24 -0400, Alex wrote: Keyser Soze wrote: On 6/13/18 8:24 AM, Tim wrote: 7:10 AMKeyser Soze - show quoted text - I don't have a "brand new" Ducati. ......... I know... Mine has 4250 miles, several years old, hardly new. No dents or scratches, though. Let's see a picture of the motorcycle and odometer with a current newspaper in the photo, too. I'll give you a chance to win your $100 back. With Harry sitting on it. Considering the sort of malooks who form the majority in this pigpen, there is no way I am going to post photos of identifiable vehicles. An odometer and a newspaper? No need for a side shot just the gauges. Good luck. You can't trust pictures anymore. Photoshop is pretty good. There are people here that will know. He's not that good, I'm sure. |
Norway wants US Marines
John H. wrote:
On Thu, 14 Jun 2018 19:25:50 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 14 Jun 2018 13:05:55 -0400, John H. wrote: On Thu, 14 Jun 2018 12:18:15 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 6/14/2018 12:11 PM, True North wrote: On Thursday, 14 June 2018 12:13:42 UTC-3, wrote: On Thu, 14 Jun 2018 07:59:51 -0400, Keyser Soze wrote: On 6/13/18 10:37 PM, wrote: On Wed, 13 Jun 2018 16:29:04 -0400, Keyser Soze wrote: Norway is smart about money and resources...from Wiki: In March 2017, the Government Pension Fund controlled assets were valued at approximately US$913 billion (equal to US$182,000 per capita), which is about 178% of Norway's current GDP. It is the largest sovereign wealth fund in the world. The fund controls about 1.3% of all listed shares in Europe, and more than 1% of all the publicly traded shares in the world. The Norwegian Central Bank operates investment offices in London, New York, and Shanghai. Guidelines implemented in 2007 allow the fund to invest up to 60% of the capital in shares (maximum of 40% prior), while the rest may be placed in bonds and real-estate. As the stock markets tumbled in September 2008, the fund was able to buy more shares at low prices. In this way, the losses incurred by the market turmoil was recuperated by November 2009. Other nations with economies based on natural resources, such as Russia, are trying to learn from Norway by establishing similar funds. The investment choices of the Norwegian fund are directed by ethical guidelines; for example, the fund is not allowed to invest in companies that produce parts for nuclear weapons. Norway's highly transparent investment scheme is lauded by the international community. The future size of the fund is closely linked to the price of oil and to developments in international financial markets. In 2000, the government sold one-third of the state-owned oil company Statoil in an IPO. The next year, the main telecom supplier, Telenor, was listed on Oslo Stock Exchange. The state also owns significant shares of Norway's largest bank, DnB NOR and the airline SAS. Since 2000, economic growth has been rapid, pushing unemployment down to levels not seen since the early 1980s (unemployment in 2007: 1.3%). The international financial crisis has primarily affected the industrial sector, but unemployment has remained low, and was at 3.3% (86,000 people) in August 2011. Norway contains significant mineral resources, and in 2013, its mineral production was valued at US$1.5 billion (Norwegian Geological Survey data). The most valuable minerals are calcium carbonate (limestone), building stone, nepheline syenite, olivine, iron, titanium, and nickel. Norway is also the world's second-largest exporter of fish (in value, after China). Hydroelectric plants generate roughly 98–99% of Norway's electric power, more than any other country in the world. Somehow, I think the Norwegians will figure out how to secure their future. I am sure they will because they "privatized" their old age pension fund and invested it in real things instead of just spending the money and putting IOUs in the box. They are not dipping into the general fund or borrowing money to pay their pensioners. Their "future" is secure as long as we keep them safe and they should doing that themselves, not sponging off of us. And, once again, without our international commitments, there would be more justification for shrinking our outrageous military budgets. So why don't we? I would start with Europe. A lot of your military costs are by your own doing...that is sticking your beak into any and every trouble spot. Viet Nam was a good example. You like to project your power whether it's requested or not. It would be interesting for historians to speculate on what the planet would be like today if the USA (and Canada) had completely followed a "we'll mind are own business" policy since the end of WWII. How about since prior to WWI? You mean like the turn of the century when we engineered the taking of Panama? (no canal) or all of the stuff we got from the Spanish American war?. You could even go back to the Mexican war. I think they like to point out the end of WWII because that was when the world pretty much stopped using wars as an excuse for Europeans and Americans to take other people's land ... well maybe with one exception. No, what would the world be like if we had just stayed home, as donnee suggested, from about 1913 on? That wasn't Dumb Don. He just can't quote a thread properly. |
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