OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
By JEANNINE AVERSA, Associated Press Writer

WASHINGTON - The economy grew at a blistering 7.2 percent annual rate in the
third quarter in the strongest pace in nearly two decades. Consumers spent
with abandon and businesses ramped up investment, compelling new evidence of
an economic resurgence.



The increase in gross domestic product, the broadest measure of the
economy's performance, in the July-September quarter was more than double
the 3.3 percent rate registered in the second quarter, the Commerce
Department reported Thursday.


The 7.2 percent pace marked the best showing since the first quarter of
1984. It exceeded analysts' forecasts for a 6 percent growth rate for
third-quarter GDP, which measures the value of all goods and services
produced within the United States.


"This is a gangbuster number. Everything came together for the economy in
the third quarter," said Mark Zandi, chief economist at Economy.com.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------



I guess we can take "bagging on the economy" off the '04 Democratic election
strategy...

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

"NOYB" wrote in message
link.net...
Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
By JEANNINE AVERSA, Associated Press Writer

WASHINGTON - The economy grew at a blistering 7.2 percent annual rate in
the
third quarter in the strongest pace in nearly two decades. Consumers spent
with abandon and businesses ramped up investment, compelling new evidence
of
an economic resurgence.

While going into further debt. Washington is setting the tone, we're in
love with deficit spending.


The increase in gross domestic product, the broadest measure of the
economy's performance, in the July-September quarter was more than double
the 3.3 percent rate registered in the second quarter, the Commerce
Department reported Thursday.

Because the cupboards were nearly empty from reduced production (of
everything but job cuts) for months.

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

"jps" wrote in message
...
"NOYB" wrote in message
link.net...
Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
By JEANNINE AVERSA, Associated Press Writer

WASHINGTON - The economy grew at a blistering 7.2 percent annual rate in
the
third quarter in the strongest pace in nearly two decades. Consumers
spent
with abandon and businesses ramped up investment, compelling new
evidence
of
an economic resurgence.

While going into further debt. Washington is setting the tone, we're in
love with deficit spending.

There's nothing wrong with deficit spending when you have the ability to
borrow ad infinitum...especially when GDP increases as sharply as it did.
The net tax receipts grow (despite a rate cut), as GDP grows...but there is
at least a 1-1 1/2 year lag. The ol' deficit will shrink in the very near
future again. Nevertheless, increases in the deficit don't matter as long
as there are proportional increases in GDP.




The increase in gross domestic product, the broadest measure of the
economy's performance, in the July-September quarter was more than
double
the 3.3 percent rate registered in the second quarter, the Commerce
Department reported Thursday.

Because the cupboards were nearly empty from reduced production (of
everything but job cuts) for months.

Spin away Dem-boy...but there's nothing but good news in a 7.2% jump in the
GDP.

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

"NOYB" wrote in message
hlink.net...

Spin away Dem-boy...but there's nothing but good news in a 7.2% jump in
the
GDP.

It's all relative Neo-boy. When a company goes in the ****ter and then
"doubles profits" in the subsequent quarters, it can still be doing 1/10th
the business it did previously. Statistical analysis is fun for you. The
truth is that America is going into debt, both gov't and its citizens.

I don't care how you paint it, that's not good.

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

NOYB:

I thought you guys on the right were business savvy.

Yeah, once you screw something up *tremendously*, it's easier to post some
pretty impressive percentage numbers as the rebound begins.

Example: Your practice is capable of handling 20 patients per day. You begin
spouting off about your politics while your victims (er, I mean patients) are
strapped into the chair with a mouth full of crap and unable to respond. Your
patient load drops from 20 per day to 5. You finally realize that dentistry and
politics don't mix, and shut the heck up. Your patient load goes from 5
patients per day to 8. Wo ho! Brilliant management! You just posted a 60%
increase. :-)

I once took over a sales situation where I achieved a 120% increase in less
than six months. But it wasn't any big deal, all I really did was get
production up to about where it should have been all along. That percentage
increase sure looked good on the resume for a while, though.

I guess we can all be thankful that one of our longer and deeper recessions may
be coming to an end in many places throughout the country. The West Coast is
seeing no part of it. You know it *must* have been the tax cuts. This is the
very first time that the economy *ever* recovered from a recession, right?

Get thou real, Doc. :-)

Meanwhile, back at the Crawford Ranch,
the R controlled White House and the R controlled Congress have increased our
national debt 43 BILLION DOLLARS since
October 1st. Why all the outrage about 87 billion for Iraq? We're peeing that
away as a matter of course every 60 days as it is.

It's all part of the PNAC's agenda to move to a British capital, imperialist
system.
We will have to raise interest rates to attract enough investors to shoulder
this debt, and at that time those few people sitting on hundreds of millions in
cash will be on easy (or easier) street.


Current
Month

10/27/2003 $6,847,911,183,949.94
10/24/2003 $6,847,437,986,849.37
10/23/2003 $6,846,423,952,526.25
10/22/2003 $6,834,787,133,873.25
10/21/2003 $6,837,578,313,166.46
10/20/2003 $6,834,248,759,903.16
10/17/2003 $6,834,021,912,939.72
10/16/2003 $6,830,709,313,106.40
10/15/2003 $6,819,991,274,100.25
10/14/2003 $6,816,232,489,123.39
10/10/2003 $6,815,997,835,664.82
10/09/2003 $6,818,335,215,910.51
10/08/2003 $6,815,762,633,308.91
10/07/2003 $6,817,256,800,753.20
10/06/2003 $6,814,440,215,107.91
10/03/2003 $6,812,573,929,325.08
10/02/2003 $6,805,599,570,918.78
10/01/2003 $6,804,504,127,055.70

If you guys keep this up, you'll give the American public a 7 Trillion dollar
debt just in time for Christmas. What a nice thought the have stuffed up your
chimney- tinsel, pointy star, and all.

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

It's all relative Neo-boy.

You're right, it is all relative.
Relatively speaking our debt is lower now than it was throughout the 90's.

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

"Joe" wrote in message
...

It's all relative Neo-boy.

You're right, it is all relative.
Relatively speaking our debt is lower now than it was throughout the 90's.

Let's see what you're basing that on...

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

You're right, it is all relative.
Relatively speaking our debt is lower now than it was throughout the 90's.

Relatively speaking?

Maybe if you're a relative of a right wing radio spin doctor.

Our current debt is about 1 1/2 times what it averaged in the 90's. Is somebody
trying to state that the size of our (recessed) economy is more than 150% of
what it was in the 90's and therefore the debt is
still in proportion? That's easy to say, but I think it would be impossible to
come up with any evidence to support such a s-t-r-e-t-c-h of logic.

You also have to examine the trend. The national debt increased more in single
fiscal year ended 9-30-2003 (about $500 billion) than it did in any single year
in the 90's, and indeed more than it did in almost any 2 year period you can
find during the 90's.


Prior Fiscal
Years

09/30/2003 $6,783,231,062,743.62
09/30/2002 $6,228,235,965,597.16
09/28/2001 $5,807,463,412,200.06
09/29/2000 $5,674,178,209,886.86
09/30/1999 $5,656,270,901,615.43
09/30/1998 $5,526,193,008,897.62
09/30/1997 $5,413,146,011,397.34
09/30/1996 $5,224,810,939,135.73
09/29/1995 $4,973,982,900,709.39
09/30/1994 $4,692,749,910,013.32
09/30/1993 $4,411,488,883,139.38
09/30/1992 $4,064,620,655,521.66
09/30/1991 $3,665,303,351,697.03
09/28/1990 $3,233,313,451,777.25
09/29/1989 $2,857,430,960,187.32
09/30/1988 $2,602,337,712,041.16
09/30/1987 $2,350,276,890,953.00

SOURCE: BUREAU OF THE PUBLIC DEBT

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

It's all relative Neo-boy.

You're right, it is all relative.
Relatively speaking our debt is lower now than it was throughout the
90's.

Let's see what you're basing that on...


Percentage of debt to GDP.

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

The Bush Prosperity:

Divide the 43 Billion dollar increase in the national debt by 300 million.
(approximate pop)

The answer is $143.33

Multiply that amount by the number of people in your family. Rather than use a
liberal-friendly example of a family of 11 (grin), let's use a realistic
example of a family of 5.

5 x 143.33 = $716

If you are part of a 5-person family, your family's portion of the national
debt increased $716 in the last 30 days.
Plus interest, as it gets paid off. (If it ever gets paid off).

So, whatever you think you took home for the family kitty- deduct $716 for
October.
That's the "deferred" cost of Bush's so-called recovery. Just like "deferred
maintenance", we can be sure it will ultimately cost a lot more than if we had
just dealt with it up front. :-(

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

Percentage of debt to GDP.

Bow-gus!

In billions of dollars:
1997 GDP: 8,318.4
2002 GDP: 10446.2

Compare that to the national debt for the same years. It's close, so use a
calculator.

While the difference is slight, the current debt is *higher than*, not *less
than* the debt to GDP ratio in 1997.

GDP is a deceptive figure anyway, as it includes the appreciation of primary
residence real estate as some sort of actual wealth or economic production.
Planning to sell your house and live in a tent any time soon?
Subtract the appreciation of residential real estate, and watch the comparsion
skew right off the chart. We are way the hell out of whack from where we were
in the 90's.

When interest rates go back up to service the debt, those house prices will
take a mighty tumble. People will spend as much for a house as the monthly
payments allow. When a lot more of that payment is going for interest, guess
what has to give?

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

"Gould 0738" wrote in message
...
NOYB:

I thought you guys on the right were business savvy.

Yeah, once you screw something up *tremendously*, it's easier to post some
pretty impressive percentage numbers as the rebound begins.

So you admit that a rebound has begun?

Nevertheless, your theory is discredited by the fact that GDP currently
stands at a figure that is almost 11% higher than when Bush took office.
Anyway you spin it, that represents real growth.



Example: Your practice is capable of handling 20 patients per day. You
begin
spouting off about your politics while your victims (er, I mean patients)
are
strapped into the chair with a mouth full of crap and unable to respond.
Your
patient load drops from 20 per day to 5. You finally realize that
dentistry and
politics don't mix, and shut the heck up. Your patient load goes from 5
patients per day to 8. Wo ho! Brilliant management! You just posted a 60%
increase. :-)


Good try, Gould...but we've had consistent *growth* in GDP...not a decline.



I once took over a sales situation where I achieved a 120% increase in
less
than six months. But it wasn't any big deal, all I really did was get
production up to about where it should have been all along. That
percentage
increase sure looked good on the resume for a while, though.

I guess we can all be thankful that one of our longer and deeper
recessions may
be coming to an end in many places throughout the country. The West Coast
is
seeing no part of it.

That's because your state governments are run by Democrats...who have
*raised* your state taxes.


You know it *must* have been the tax cuts. This is the
very first time that the economy *ever* recovered from a recession, right?

Last time that the GDP jumped that much was in 1984...following the Reagan
tax cut.

Did you see Sen. Corzine's (D) comments about the tax cut and the economy?
He broke ranks with his fellow Dems and attributed a large part of the
rebound to the tax cut.

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

"Joe" wrote in message
...

It's all relative Neo-boy.

You're right, it is all relative.
Relatively speaking our debt is lower now than it was throughout the 90's.

Hehehe.

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

"Gould 0738" wrote in message
...
You're right, it is all relative.
Relatively speaking our debt is lower now than it was throughout the
90's.

Relatively speaking?

Maybe if you're a relative of a right wing radio spin doctor.

Our current debt is about 1 1/2 times what it averaged in the 90's.

But our current debt as a percentage of GDP is almost exactly what it
averaged in Clinton's first term. With this shockingly high spike in GDP,
the ratio will drop sharply, too.


Is somebody
trying to state that the size of our (recessed) economy is more than 150%
of
what it was in the 90's and therefore the debt is
still in proportion? That's easy to say, but I think it would be
impossible to
come up with any evidence to support such a s-t-r-e-t-c-h of logic.

Look at the numbers Gould:
http://www.house.gov/budget/msrslide4bgt071703.pdf

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

"Gould 0738" wrote in message
...
The Bush Prosperity:

Divide the 43 Billion dollar increase in the national debt by 300 million.
(approximate pop)

The answer is $143.33

Multiply that amount by the number of people in your family. Rather than
use a
liberal-friendly example of a family of 11 (grin), let's use a realistic
example of a family of 5.

5 x 143.33 = $716

If you are part of a 5-person family, your family's portion of the
national
debt increased $716 in the last 30 days.

Good. But since the note never really comes "due", the more ancestors I
leave, the easier it will be for them to pay it off. ;-)

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

Good. But since the note never really comes "due", the more ancestors I
leave, the easier it will be for them to pay it off. ;-)

The note's due now. What is the effect on the value of the dollar when so many
of them are committed to the future?

(Some of)You guys on the right have the same attitude toward the national debt
as you do the environment! "Let my kids and grandkids deal with it!" Ya otta
be proud.

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

Look at the numbers Gould:
http://www.house.gov/budget/msrslide4bgt071703.pdf



Why in the world would a Bush fan post that?! Especially to compare the
economic trends of the 90's with the economic trends so far in Bush's stint?

I rest my case!

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

Nevertheless, your theory is discredited by the fact that GDP currently
stands at a figure that is almost 11% higher than when Bush took office.

Maybe your primary residence is more clever than mine, or anybody else that I
know. Most of our houses haven't "produced" a darn thing (as in "gross domestic
product") yet the spike in selling prices (not to be confused with values)
inspired by the temporarily low interest rates is reflected in the GDP numbers.

Without the artificial "product" of escalating real estate prices (further
splitting the haves and the have-nots in this country) the GDP number would
reflect actual economic "growth" and would most likely be a negative number.

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

Hehehe.

He, he, he is talking through his hat!

You might do some math before blindly agreeing with statements that merely
sound good.

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

"Gould 0738" wrote in message
...
Look at the numbers Gould:
http://www.house.gov/budget/msrslide4bgt071703.pdf



Why in the world would a Bush fan post that?! Especially to compare the
economic trends of the 90's with the economic trends so far in Bush's
stint?

I rest my case!

This chart shows year to year deficits, not the total national debt as a
percentage of GDP.
The total debt GDP ratio is a better indicator than year to year
surplus/deficit numbers.

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

"Gould 0738" wrote in message
...
Look at the numbers Gould:
http://www.house.gov/budget/msrslide4bgt071703.pdf



Why in the world would a Bush fan post that?! Especially to compare the
economic trends of the 90's with the economic trends so far in Bush's
stint?


To show you that the current deficit of 4.2% of GDP is less than that same
ratio at the end of the last recession. We both agree that the economy is
improving. The current GDP spike shows is is zooming. The projections for
the next few years show a clear trend towards a reduction in the "debt as
percentage of GDP ratio".

In other words, the ratio hit it's peak and will fall rapidly with increased
booms in GDP numbers.

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

"Gould 0738" wrote in message
...
Good. But since the note never really comes "due", the more ancestors I
leave, the easier it will be for them to pay it off. ;-)

The note's due now. What is the effect on the value of the dollar when so
many
of them are committed to the future?

It doesn't matter. Here's an example.
A certain percentage of my Collections goes to pay debt. In my case, it's
roughly 10%. In 1999, that same percentage was closer to 15%. This has
occurred despite the fact that my overall debt has increased 25% over that
same period Why? Because collections increased at a proportional rate.

If GDP goes up at a near-equal rate (over the longterm...not in one, two, or
three given years), then an increasing debt does no harm to the value of the
dollar.





(Some of)You guys on the right have the same attitude toward the national
debt
as you do the environment! "Let my kids and grandkids deal with it!" Ya
otta
be proud.

No comparison...the difference being that the environment and it's natural
resources aren't growing.

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

"Gould 0738" wrote in message
...

GDP is a deceptive figure anyway, as it includes the appreciation of
primary
residence real estate as some sort of actual wealth or economic
production.

Too abstract. You'd better use bigger crayons to explain this to the Homers.

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

On 30 Oct 2003 15:55:47 GMT, (Gould 0738) wrote:

NOYB:

I thought you guys on the right were business savvy.

Yeah, once you screw something up *tremendously*, it's easier to post some
pretty impressive percentage numbers as the rebound begins.

Example: Your practice is capable of handling 20 patients per day. You begin
spouting off about your politics while your victims (er, I mean patients) are
strapped into the chair with a mouth full of crap and unable to respond. Your
patient load drops from 20 per day to 5. You finally realize that dentistry and
politics don't mix, and shut the heck up. Your patient load goes from 5
patients per day to 8. Wo ho! Brilliant management! You just posted a 60%
increase. :-)

I once took over a sales situation where I achieved a 120% increase in less
than six months. But it wasn't any big deal, all I really did was get
production up to about where it should have been all along. That percentage
increase sure looked good on the resume for a while, though.

I guess we can all be thankful that one of our longer and deeper recessions may
be coming to an end in many places throughout the country. The West Coast is
seeing no part of it. You know it *must* have been the tax cuts. This is the
very first time that the economy *ever* recovered from a recession, right?

Get thou real, Doc. :-)

Meanwhile, back at the Crawford Ranch,
the R controlled White House and the R controlled Congress have increased our
national debt 43 BILLION DOLLARS since
October 1st. Why all the outrage about 87 billion for Iraq? We're peeing that
away as a matter of course every 60 days as it is.

It's all part of the PNAC's agenda to move to a British capital, imperialist
system.
We will have to raise interest rates to attract enough investors to shoulder
this debt, and at that time those few people sitting on hundreds of millions in
cash will be on easy (or easier) street.


Current
Month

10/27/2003 $6,847,911,183,949.94
10/24/2003 $6,847,437,986,849.37
10/23/2003 $6,846,423,952,526.25
10/22/2003 $6,834,787,133,873.25
10/21/2003 $6,837,578,313,166.46
10/20/2003 $6,834,248,759,903.16
10/17/2003 $6,834,021,912,939.72
10/16/2003 $6,830,709,313,106.40
10/15/2003 $6,819,991,274,100.25
10/14/2003 $6,816,232,489,123.39
10/10/2003 $6,815,997,835,664.82
10/09/2003 $6,818,335,215,910.51
10/08/2003 $6,815,762,633,308.91
10/07/2003 $6,817,256,800,753.20
10/06/2003 $6,814,440,215,107.91
10/03/2003 $6,812,573,929,325.08
10/02/2003 $6,805,599,570,918.78
10/01/2003 $6,804,504,127,055.70

If you guys keep this up, you'll give the American public a 7 Trillion dollar
debt just in time for Christmas. What a nice thought the have stuffed up your
chimney- tinsel, pointy star, and all.

Chuck, you should also point out that virtually all of this money supports only
the agenda of Republicans.

John
On the 'Poco Loco' out of Deale, MD

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

"Gould 0738" wrote in message
...
Percentage of debt to GDP.

Bow-gus!

Check out the graph on GDP to debt ratio.
http://www.ustreas.gov/press/release...2003charts.pdf


In billions of dollars:
1997 GDP: 8,318.4
2002 GDP: 10446.2

That's a nice 26.28% increase isn't it?
The national debt rose by 14.29% in the same period.

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

To show you that the current deficit of 4.2% of GDP is less than that same
ratio at the end of the last recession.

Apple vs. Oranges

Still fruit but not the same thing.

The budget deficit, while a contributing factor to the accumulated national
debt, is not the same thing at all.

Even when we run a budget surplus, (you remember surpluses- I think the D's
were in charge back then), that doesn't automatically reduce the national debt.
Your debt only goes down if you use money left over after paying current
expenses (the surplus) to retire a portion of it. You can run a suplus and
still see an increase in the national debt, just as if you
earn more household income than you spend in a month but then turn around and
allow your mortgage company to defer your payments.

Budget deficit is like current income. National debt is more like net worth.

Here's a little more math for you. That family of five? Owes just over $114,000
worth of the national debt. There's comfort for ya. That's got to be a
signficant portion of the "average" family's net assets in the US. More than
for a good many, especially if you take a "purist" approach to calculating net
worth and eliminate equity in a primary residence.

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

That's a nice 26.28% increase isn't it?
The national debt rose by 14.29% in the same period.

Nice dodge. Got a Chrysler to go with it?
Do the math and get back to us.

Compare the national debt to the GDP in 1997.

Compare the national dept to the GDP in 2002.

Post your findings he____________

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

Budget deficit is like current income. National debt is more like net
worth.

BINGO!

And our ratio is now lower than it was through the 90's. Our collective net
worth is much more important than the yearly deficit or surplus. In fact the
US went from a 80% debt ratio in 1950 to a low 20's ratio in 1980 with only
4 "surplus" years.

http://www.ustreas.gov/press/release...2003charts.pdf

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

On 30 Oct 2003 15:55:47 GMT, (Gould 0738) wrote:

NOYB:

I thought you guys on the right were business savvy.

Yeah, once you screw something up *tremendously*, it's easier to post some
pretty impressive percentage numbers as the rebound begins.

Example: Your practice is capable of handling 20 patients per day. You begin
spouting off about your politics while your victims (er, I mean patients) are
strapped into the chair with a mouth full of crap and unable to respond. Your
patient load drops from 20 per day to 5. You finally realize that dentistry and
politics don't mix, and shut the heck up. Your patient load goes from 5
patients per day to 8. Wo ho! Brilliant management! You just posted a 60%
increase. :-)

I once took over a sales situation where I achieved a 120% increase in less
than six months. But it wasn't any big deal, all I really did was get
production up to about where it should have been all along. That percentage
increase sure looked good on the resume for a while, though.

I guess we can all be thankful that one of our longer and deeper recessions may
be coming to an end in many places throughout the country. The West Coast is
seeing no part of it. You know it *must* have been the tax cuts. This is the
very first time that the economy *ever* recovered from a recession, right?

Get thou real, Doc. :-)

Meanwhile, back at the Crawford Ranch,
the R controlled White House and the R controlled Congress have increased our
national debt 43 BILLION DOLLARS since
October 1st. Why all the outrage about 87 billion for Iraq? We're peeing that
away as a matter of course every 60 days as it is.

It's all part of the PNAC's agenda to move to a British capital, imperialist
system.
We will have to raise interest rates to attract enough investors to shoulder
this debt, and at that time those few people sitting on hundreds of millions in
cash will be on easy (or easier) street.


Current
Month

10/27/2003 $6,847,911,183,949.94
10/24/2003 $6,847,437,986,849.37
10/23/2003 $6,846,423,952,526.25
10/22/2003 $6,834,787,133,873.25
10/21/2003 $6,837,578,313,166.46
10/20/2003 $6,834,248,759,903.16
10/17/2003 $6,834,021,912,939.72
10/16/2003 $6,830,709,313,106.40
10/15/2003 $6,819,991,274,100.25
10/14/2003 $6,816,232,489,123.39
10/10/2003 $6,815,997,835,664.82
10/09/2003 $6,818,335,215,910.51
10/08/2003 $6,815,762,633,308.91
10/07/2003 $6,817,256,800,753.20
10/06/2003 $6,814,440,215,107.91
10/03/2003 $6,812,573,929,325.08
10/02/2003 $6,805,599,570,918.78
10/01/2003 $6,804,504,127,055.70

If you guys keep this up, you'll give the American public a 7 Trillion dollar
debt just in time for Christmas. What a nice thought the have stuffed up your
chimney- tinsel, pointy star, and all.

And my parents' kids are better off than they were. My kids are better off than
I was at there age. My grand kids will be better off than their parents. Of
course, we all worked.

John
On the 'Poco Loco' out of Deale, MD

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

Nice dodge. Got a Chrysler to go with it?
Do the math and get back to us.

Compare the national debt to the GDP in 1997.

Compare the national dept to the GDP in 2002.

Post your findings he____________

Since your having such a problem figuring this out-

(In millions)
Source-US Federal Government

1997
GDP 8,185,200
Debt 5,369,694

Gross debt to GDP 65.6%

2002
GDP 10,336,600
Debt 6,137,074

Gross debt to GDP 59.3%

Class dismissed.

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

I just wish my stock prices would recover. I took a hit when the tech
stocks crashed.

Perhaps if we dumped NAFTA, the economy would take a big jump in
manufacturing!

Capt. Frank

NOYB wrote:

Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
By JEANNINE AVERSA, Associated Press Writer

WASHINGTON - The economy grew at a blistering 7.2 percent annual rate in the
third quarter in the strongest pace in nearly two decades. Consumers spent
with abandon and businesses ramped up investment, compelling new evidence of
an economic resurgence.



The increase in gross domestic product, the broadest measure of the
economy's performance, in the July-September quarter was more than double
the 3.3 percent rate registered in the second quarter, the Commerce
Department reported Thursday.


The 7.2 percent pace marked the best showing since the first quarter of
1984. It exceeded analysts' forecasts for a 6 percent growth rate for
third-quarter GDP, which measures the value of all goods and services
produced within the United States.


"This is a gangbuster number. Everything came together for the economy in
the third quarter," said Mark Zandi, chief economist at Economy.com.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------



I guess we can take "bagging on the economy" off the '04 Democratic election
strategy...

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

Put in that perspective, the outlook is pretty grim, eh Chuck?

But, all in all, Our charter boat corporation (Florida) is about to
finish up its second fiscal year (october 31), and we made a 3.6 percent
net profit after boss hog, err, ah, bush hog(s), was paid. Not too bad
for 4 old guys.

Capt. Frank

Gould 0738 wrote:

The Bush Prosperity:

Divide the 43 Billion dollar increase in the national debt by 300 million.
(approximate pop)

The answer is $143.33

Multiply that amount by the number of people in your family. Rather than use a
liberal-friendly example of a family of 11 (grin), let's use a realistic
example of a family of 5.

5 x 143.33 = $716

If you are part of a 5-person family, your family's portion of the national
debt increased $716 in the last 30 days.
Plus interest, as it gets paid off. (If it ever gets paid off).

So, whatever you think you took home for the family kitty- deduct $716 for
October.
That's the "deferred" cost of Bush's so-called recovery. Just like "deferred
maintenance", we can be sure it will ultimately cost a lot more than if we had
just dealt with it up front. :-(

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

"Gould 0738" wrote in message
...
Good. But since the note never really comes "due", the more ancestors I
leave, the easier it will be for them to pay it off. ;-)

The note's due now. What is the effect on the value of the dollar when so
many
of them are committed to the future?

(Some of)You guys on the right have the same attitude toward the national
debt
as you do the environment! "Let my kids and grandkids deal with it!" Ya
otta
be proud.



Where were you guys on the Left when a Democrat controlled Congress was
spending like drunk'n sailors? The only reason Clinton showed a surplus
(well sort of) was the 92 Contract with America and the Republicans forced a
cut in spending. Unfortunately the Repubs are stupid and let Clinton take
all the Credit for the reduction. I understand the deficit spending is
still at about the same 3.2% of GDP that it has been for 30 years.

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

"Joe" wrote in message
...
Nice dodge. Got a Chrysler to go with it?
Do the math and get back to us.

Compare the national debt to the GDP in 1997.

Compare the national dept to the GDP in 2002.

Post your findings he____________

Since your having such a problem figuring this out-

(In millions)
Source-US Federal Government

1997
GDP 8,185,200
Debt 5,369,694

Gross debt to GDP 65.6%

2002
GDP 10,336,600
Debt 6,137,074

Gross debt to GDP 59.3%

Class dismissed.

Careful, Joe. You need to just swat the liberals around a little. If you
hit 'em too hard with your knockout blow right in the beginning, they
disappear and just start a new thread. Now, what fun is that?

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

When interest rates go back up to service the debt,

Sorry but there is no correlation between the rise, or fall, of the national
debt and interest rates.

http://www.taxfoundation.org/images/graph2.jpg

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

"Joe" wrote in message
...
Nice dodge. Got a Chrysler to go with it?
Do the math and get back to us.

Compare the national debt to the GDP in 1997.

Compare the national dept to the GDP in 2002.

Post your findings he____________

Since your having such a problem figuring this out-

(In millions)
Source-US Federal Government

1997
GDP 8,185,200
Debt 5,369,694

Gross debt to GDP 65.6%

2002
GDP 10,336,600
Debt 6,137,074

Gross debt to GDP 59.3%

Class dismissed.



Be careful Joe, you don't want to go confusing them with facts. ;-)

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

Another stat, more important than the overall national debt, is the total
amount of debt held by the public.
It was 46.1% in 1997 and 33% in 2002.

From the CBO

"Businesses and the financial markets pay close attention to (publicly held
debt) it because of its impact on the economy. When the Department of the
Treasury sells securities--in effect, borrows from the public--that activity
absorbs resources that otherwise might be invested in the private sector"

http://www.cbo.gov/showdoc.cfm?index=3948&sequence=0

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

Since your having such a problem figuring this out-

(In millions)
Source-US Federal Government

1997
GDP 8,185,200
Debt 5,369,694

Gross debt to GDP 65.6%

2002
GDP 10,336,600
Debt 6,137,074

Gross debt to GDP 59.3%

Class dismissed.

Try using the actual GDP figure for 2002.
Not something you got hell knows where to make your example work


9485.6


Nice try though. You had a couple of right wingers hootin' and hollerin' and
rootin you on. Guess they'll believe anything they see in print that verifies a
preconception.


Billions of chained (1996) dollars
Seasonally adjusted at annual rates
2002 2002:Q3 2002:Q4 2003:Q1 2003:Q2
2003:Q3
Gross domestic product (GDP)... 9439.9 9485.6 9518.2 9552.0 9629.4 9797.2


Cite:

http://www.bea.gov/briefrm/tables/ebr1.htm

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

Be careful Joe, you don't want to go confusing them with facts. ;-)

You've been had. The GDP number he used for 2002 was incorrect.

http://www.bea.gov/briefrm/tables/ebr1.htm

OT--Economy Grows at Fastest Pace Since 1984
 

Careful, Joe. You need to just swat the liberals around a little. If you
hit 'em too hard with your knockout blow right in the beginning, they
disappear and just start a new thread. Now, what fun is that?

The knockout blow is a sucker punch. And he seems to have suckered you big
time.
If you'd like to see what the *real* GDP was in 2002, follow this link:

http://www.bea.gov/briefrm/tables/ebr1.htm