On 8/28/2014 4:25 PM, Wayne.B wrote:
On Thu, 28 Aug 2014 15:30:54 -0400, F*O*A*D wrote:

On 8/28/14 3:13 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 28 Aug 2014 13:58:25 -0400, F*O*A*D wrote:

You might be able to hold down a job as
a punch-list guy, maybe.


Uh huh. You really are clueless about me aren't you.



I don't see you welding tubes and pipes at a pharma lab or nuclear power
plant, or working as a manufacturing plant electrician, or as a
bricklayer knowing the chemistry necessary to mix up and apply various
high strength or high or low temp mortars, or the strength to fling 40
pound concrete block all day, or maintaining and repairing railroad
diesel-electric powerplants, or even how to mitigate hazardous materials.

===

None of those skills are particularly difficult to learn for someone
who is moderately intelligent, motivated and reasonably fit.

I guess that leaves you out.

Greg worked for IBM back in the days when you really had to be able to
analyze complex computer system problems while working with customers
in a courteous and professional manner, something that I'm sure you've
never done.


or can read the side of the box....

On 8/28/2014 4:58 PM, Harrold wrote:
On 8/28/2014 2:30 PM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 8/28/14 3:13 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 28 Aug 2014 13:58:25 -0400, F*O*A*D wrote:

You might be able to hold down a job as
a punch-list guy, maybe.


Uh huh. You really are clueless about me aren't you.



I don't see you welding tubes and pipes at a pharma lab or nuclear power
plant, or working as a manufacturing plant electrician, or as a
bricklayer knowing the chemistry necessary to mix up and apply various
high strength or high or low temp mortars, or the strength to fling 40
pound concrete block all day, or maintaining and repairing railroad
diesel-electric powerplants, or even how to mitigate hazardous materials.

It's simple if you are literate enough to read the instructions.
5 Years apprenticeship to mix mortar. Really?

Yup... union workers and trained monkeys, the only difference is the
monkeys smell better.

On 8/28/2014 7:40 PM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 8/28/14 6:42 PM, Poco Loco wrote:
On Thu, 28 Aug 2014 15:58:32 -0500, Harrold wrote:

On 8/28/2014 2:30 PM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 8/28/14 3:13 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 28 Aug 2014 13:58:25 -0400, F*O*A*D wrote:

You might be able to hold down a job as
a punch-list guy, maybe.


Uh huh. You really are clueless about me aren't you.



I don't see you welding tubes and pipes at a pharma lab or nuclear power
plant, or working as a manufacturing plant electrician, or as a
bricklayer knowing the chemistry necessary to mix up and apply various
high strength or high or low temp mortars, or the strength to fling 40
pound concrete block all day, or maintaining and repairing railroad
diesel-electric powerplants, or even how to mitigate hazardous materials.

It's simple if you are literate enough to read the instructions.
5 Years apprenticeship to mix mortar. Really?

I can testify to the fact that carrying concrete blocks all day does not
require a lick of training
or specialized skill. Buying a bag of mortar and following the mixing
directions doesn't take a lot
of skill either, although a little knowledge of the English language may be helpful.



You would certainly be the "go to" guy for jobs requiring no useful
skills, but mixing a bag of sakcrete was not what I was describing. And,
actually, carrying or lifting 40 to 50 pound block all day long does
require some training so that you don't injure yourself or others. But,
as I said previously, you don't have the skills to qualify as a hod carrier.

Does not take a union card to be able weld nuclear plant tubes. About 6
months training. My brother did weld on a nuclear plant, and that is after
a couple months navy schooling. He was able to weld before joining the
service, you can go to my local JC and take a 2 year welding course and
get certified. Not union.


A friend of mine in the 80's was an electrician at nuke plants. He said
the workers there sucked, "you could walk through the openings they left
in concrete walls"...

On Thu, 28 Aug 2014 22:05:42 -0400, wrote:

On Thu, 28 Aug 2014 16:25:55 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

Greg worked for IBM back in the days when you really had to be able to
analyze complex computer system problems while working with customers
in a courteous and professional manner, something that I'm sure you've
never done.

That is a business that simply does not exist anymore and the writing
was on the wall by 1989 or so. That is why I started putting different
cards in my wallet around 1990.
IBM did pay for about $100,000 worth of education in the early 90s for
me.
They were trying to find new markets and I was willing to be on the
leading edge on that. I pursued my other electrical interests on my
own. I wasn't sure whether I wanted to be a contractor or an
inspector/plans examiner so I sat for both suites of tests.

===

Yes, the equipment became a lot more reliable and easier to service,
and at the same time the cost of components became a lot cheaper than
the labor to service them. That was a good thing for those of us on
the end user side, at least until the data center consolidation
movement got into full swing. After that it became a constant
scramble to find a horse you could ride for a while before it got shot
out from underneath you. It was a good career though with many
benefits and I have no regrets.

On Thu, 28 Aug 2014 22:16:20 -0400, wrote:

On Thu, 28 Aug 2014 18:42:51 -0400, Poco Loco
wrote:


I can testify to the fact that carrying concrete blocks all day does not require a lick of training
or specialized skill. Buying a bag of mortar and following the mixing directions doesn't take a lot
of skill either, although a little knowledge of the English language may be helpful.

I got a pretty good schooling on laying block when I was building my 3
additions in Maryland. My contractor (and a personal friend) was
teaching his boy the trade and I was just another student/helper on
that job. I mixed mortar, stacked block on the scaffolds and laid
block to the line in the field.
If you get the mortar right, not as easy as it would seem, and you
understand the process, you can learn to lay block to the line pretty
quickly. Laying the piers in the corners and getting everything
started is a trick. Actually going fast only comes with experience.
I still think that a reasonably intelligent person could be a pretty
decent block mason in a summer. Brick may take longer, particularly if
you want to go fast.
\
I built the back half of this
http://gfretwell.com/electrical/bric...ed%20house.jpg

===

Damn, that shed is built like the proverbial brick sh*t house!

:-)

Nice.

Wayne.B wrote:
On Thu, 28 Aug 2014 22:05:42 -0400, wrote:

On Thu, 28 Aug 2014 16:25:55 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

Greg worked for IBM back in the days when you really had to be able to
analyze complex computer system problems while working with customers
in a courteous and professional manner, something that I'm sure you've
never done.

That is a business that simply does not exist anymore and the writing
was on the wall by 1989 or so. That is why I started putting different
cards in my wallet around 1990.
IBM did pay for about $100,000 worth of education in the early 90s for
me.
They were trying to find new markets and I was willing to be on the
leading edge on that. I pursued my other electrical interests on my
own. I wasn't sure whether I wanted to be a contractor or an
inspector/plans examiner so I sat for both suites of tests.

===

Yes, the equipment became a lot more reliable and easier to service,
and at the same time the cost of components became a lot cheaper than
the labor to service them. That was a good thing for those of us on
the end user side, at least until the data center consolidation
movement got into full swing. After that it became a constant
scramble to find a horse you could ride for a while before it got shot
out from underneath you. It was a good career though with many
benefits and I have no regrets.

The component count plummeted! NCR put out a 605 Mimi controller. 4
boards. Had has much power as an NCR 315 did 15 years before. 315
probably had 200 boards. 2 flip flops per board. Later a 14 pin DIP
package ic 74ls74 was the same thing.

wrote:
On Thu, 28 Aug 2014 18:42:51 -0400, Poco Loco
wrote:


I can testify to the fact that carrying concrete blocks all day does not
require a lick of training
or specialized skill. Buying a bag of mortar and following the mixing
directions doesn't take a lot
of skill either, although a little knowledge of the English language may be helpful.

I got a pretty good schooling on laying block when I was building my 3
additions in Maryland. My contractor (and a personal friend) was
teaching his boy the trade and I was just another student/helper on
that job. I mixed mortar, stacked block on the scaffolds and laid
block to the line in the field.
If you get the mortar right, not as easy as it would seem, and you
understand the process, you can learn to lay block to the line pretty
quickly. Laying the piers in the corners and getting everything
started is a trick. Actually going fast only comes with experience.
I still think that a reasonably intelligent person could be a pretty
decent block mason in a summer. Brick may take longer, particularly if
you want to go fast.
\
I built the back half of this
http://gfretwell.com/electrical/bric...ed%20house.jpg

My dad was building an addition to his machine shop in the 1950's. Union
picketed and so they finally had a union crew one day. One day only. They
started in the morning and mixed a batch of mortar and added to it all day.
Night came and so little cement In the mortar that night a light rain and
the concrete block wall fell down. Never a word from the union, or a
picket again! Ya. Those union guys know how to mix mortar. Maybe not
correctly.

On Thu, 28 Aug 2014 22:40:33 -0400, Wayne.B wrote:

On Thu, 28 Aug 2014 22:05:42 -0400, wrote:

On Thu, 28 Aug 2014 16:25:55 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

Greg worked for IBM back in the days when you really had to be able to
analyze complex computer system problems while working with customers
in a courteous and professional manner, something that I'm sure you've
never done.

That is a business that simply does not exist anymore and the writing
was on the wall by 1989 or so. That is why I started putting different
cards in my wallet around 1990.
IBM did pay for about $100,000 worth of education in the early 90s for
me.
They were trying to find new markets and I was willing to be on the
leading edge on that. I pursued my other electrical interests on my
own. I wasn't sure whether I wanted to be a contractor or an
inspector/plans examiner so I sat for both suites of tests.

===

Yes, the equipment became a lot more reliable and easier to service,
and at the same time the cost of components became a lot cheaper than
the labor to service them. That was a good thing for those of us on
the end user side, at least until the data center consolidation
movement got into full swing. After that it became a constant
scramble to find a horse you could ride for a while before it got shot
out from underneath you. It was a good career though with many
benefits and I have no regrets.

You'll have noticed that Krause got out of this thread pretty fast. His bull**** didn't float long.

On 8/29/14 7:41 AM, Poco Loco wrote:
On Thu, 28 Aug 2014 22:40:33 -0400, Wayne.B wrote:

On Thu, 28 Aug 2014 22:05:42 -0400, wrote:

On Thu, 28 Aug 2014 16:25:55 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

Greg worked for IBM back in the days when you really had to be able to
analyze complex computer system problems while working with customers
in a courteous and professional manner, something that I'm sure you've
never done.

That is a business that simply does not exist anymore and the writing
was on the wall by 1989 or so. That is why I started putting different
cards in my wallet around 1990.
IBM did pay for about $100,000 worth of education in the early 90s for
me.
They were trying to find new markets and I was willing to be on the
leading edge on that. I pursued my other electrical interests on my
own. I wasn't sure whether I wanted to be a contractor or an
inspector/plans examiner so I sat for both suites of tests.

===

Yes, the equipment became a lot more reliable and easier to service,
and at the same time the cost of components became a lot cheaper than
the labor to service them. That was a good thing for those of us on
the end user side, at least until the data center consolidation
movement got into full swing. After that it became a constant
scramble to find a horse you could ride for a while before it got shot
out from underneath you. It was a good career though with many
benefits and I have no regrets.

You'll have noticed that Krause got out of this thread pretty fast. His bull**** didn't float long.


Hehehe. What an anal-yst you aren't. The reality is that once again I
got bored by Greg's over-responding, especially when he is working extra
hard to justify his right-wing prejudices.

Isn't there some ersatz bluegrass festival this weekend to which you can
tow your tin motel room? Or perhaps you can find another pistol you
can't shoot accurately...

On 8/29/2014 6:55 AM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 8/29/14 7:41 AM, Poco Loco wrote:
On Thu, 28 Aug 2014 22:40:33 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Thu, 28 Aug 2014 22:05:42 -0400, wrote:

On Thu, 28 Aug 2014 16:25:55 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

Greg worked for IBM back in the days when you really had to be able to
analyze complex computer system problems while working with customers
in a courteous and professional manner, something that I'm sure you've
never done.

That is a business that simply does not exist anymore and the writing
was on the wall by 1989 or so. That is why I started putting different
cards in my wallet around 1990.
IBM did pay for about $100,000 worth of education in the early 90s for
me.
They were trying to find new markets and I was willing to be on the
leading edge on that. I pursued my other electrical interests on my
own. I wasn't sure whether I wanted to be a contractor or an
inspector/plans examiner so I sat for both suites of tests.

===

Yes, the equipment became a lot more reliable and easier to service,
and at the same time the cost of components became a lot cheaper than
the labor to service them. That was a good thing for those of us on
the end user side, at least until the data center consolidation
movement got into full swing. After that it became a constant
scramble to find a horse you could ride for a while before it got shot
out from underneath you. It was a good career though with many
benefits and I have no regrets.

You'll have noticed that Krause got out of this thread pretty fast.
His bull**** didn't float long.


Hehehe. What an anal-yst you aren't. The reality is that once again I
got bored by Greg's over-responding, especially when he is working extra
hard to justify his right-wing prejudices.

Isn't there some ersatz bluegrass festival this weekend to which you can
tow your tin motel room? Or perhaps you can find another pistol you
can't shoot accurately...

Is there something of interest, to the group, you'd like to share about
your life?