To haul a real boat you need a real truck
 

On 7/12/2014 9:44 AM, Wayne.B wrote:
On Sat, 12 Jul 2014 09:25:37 -0500, H*a*r*r*o*l*d
wrote:

Krause fancies himself as a small arms expert. Doubt his book learnin
makes him a good shooter though. What he does well is produce hot air.

===

Which would be OK if it weren't for the sewage smell.

Are you implying that he talks out his ass?

--
"I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the
government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of
taking care of them".
Thomas Jefferson

To haul a real boat you need a real truck
 

On 7/12/14, 10:30 AM, wrote:
On Sat, 12 Jul 2014 08:02:14 -0400, F*O*A*D wrote:

On 7/12/14, 12:42 AM, wrote:
On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 22:44:10 -0500, Califbill
wrote:

Wayne.B wrote:
On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 17:12:38 -0500, H*a*r*r*o*l*d
wrote:

357 magnum and 45 are not target rounds unless your target has flesh and
blood.

===

Actually I know quite a few guys who shoot targets with 45s. The
recoil is not that bad and they do their own reloads, usually on the
soft side. Shooting a 357 magnum for fun strains my credibility a
bit however.

I used to like shooting my .357, when I still shot a lot. But rarely with a
magnum load. Light load 38's.

Same here. I was reloading 148gr wad cutters with about 2.5 gr of
Bullseye. That is a very pleasant load to shoot that provides
excellent accuracy.


I don't shoot non-jacketed bullets. Too messy. The .38 specials are
ok...I have some and shoot them, but they tend to leave a carbon residue
in the chambers near and at the front of the cylinder. That means more
time cleaning. The .38 specials feel like .22LR rounds in my
revolver...the .357 mags feel like 9 mm. Perhaps you need a heavier
revolver with a 6" barrel and full underlug. Makes a big difference.

This is a 40 oz OM match Colt, heavy enough for you?

http://gfretwell.com/ftp/Colt%20OM%20Match.jpg

BTW what is the difference between a .38 and a .357 when you are
shooting subsonic loads? (like that wad cutter I was talking about)

It certainly isn't the extra .1" of case length if you are using .357
brass.

Very few .38 loads use jacketed bullets. Why pay triple for a bullet
designed to go 2x as fast with much higher pressures?
An extra couple minutes cleaning is not worth paying 20 cents a shot
or more extra.


Once again, I don't shoot wadcutters. The few times I have seem any
listed on the ammo bots, they were either reloads and more expensive
than what I shoot, or they were factory loads and far more expensive
than what I shoot now. Further, the wadcutters in .357 MAG seem shorter
than the metal jacket .357 MAG rounds. If that is the case, then they'll
leave even more residue in my cylinder chambers, and they probably won't
cycle properly in my new rifle.

The factory wadcutters in .38 special are far more expensive than the
jacketed ammo I use.

I have zero interest in reloading ammo.

So, wadcutters are messy, and they cost more than what I use

BTW, is your Colt OM a pre-war model?



--
Republicans . . . the anti-immigrant, anti-contraception, anti-student,
anti-middle class, pro-impeachment party that shut down the government
last year for no reason.

To haul a real boat you need a real truck
 

On Sat, 12 Jul 2014 09:55:08 -0500, H*a*r*r*o*l*d wrote:

On 7/12/2014 9:19 AM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/12/14, 9:56 AM, Poquito Loco wrote:
On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 21:08:13 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 17:12:38 -0500, H*a*r*r*o*l*d
wrote:

357 magnum and 45 are not target rounds unless your target has flesh
and
blood.

===

Actually I know quite a few guys who shoot targets with 45s. The
recoil is not that bad and they do their own reloads, usually on the
soft side. Shooting a 357 magnum for fun strains my credibility a
bit however.

My Kimber .45 is absolutely spectacular for shooting targets.


You, on the other hand, probably need a seeing eye dog to point your
hand in the direction of the targets.




Your 15 year old lasiked eyes have suffered further hardening since your
treatment. What's your vision now? What do you reach for first when you
get up to empty your ostamy bag, your glasses or your walker?

Having met the guy in person, I find it hard to believe that he will put down the physical
attributes of *anyone*!

To haul a real boat you need a real truck
 

On 7/12/14, 11:56 AM, Poquito Loco wrote:
On Sat, 12 Jul 2014 09:55:08 -0500, H*a*r*r*o*l*d wrote:

On 7/12/2014 9:19 AM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/12/14, 9:56 AM, Poquito Loco wrote:
On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 21:08:13 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 17:12:38 -0500, H*a*r*r*o*l*d
wrote:

357 magnum and 45 are not target rounds unless your target has flesh
and
blood.

===

Actually I know quite a few guys who shoot targets with 45s. The
recoil is not that bad and they do their own reloads, usually on the
soft side. Shooting a 357 magnum for fun strains my credibility a
bit however.

My Kimber .45 is absolutely spectacular for shooting targets.


You, on the other hand, probably need a seeing eye dog to point your
hand in the direction of the targets.




Your 15 year old lasiked eyes have suffered further hardening since your
treatment. What's your vision now? What do you reach for first when you
get up to empty your ostamy bag, your glasses or your walker?

Having met the guy in person, I find it hard to believe that he will put down the physical
attributes of *anyone*!


You mean, in 2003, when you looked as if you were in the last stages of
brittle bone AIDs, and I was 35 pounds heavier than I am now?
Interestingly, *you* have had a number of surgeries over the past decade
and I have not needed any.

Your asshole buddy, FlaJim, doesn't seem to get very much right. My
Lasik'd eyes check out 20/20 in my left eye and 20/25-30 in my right
eye. My near vision, however, sucks, as is fairly common for old farts,
so I have to use reading glasses for the usual reasons. I do have a pair
of shooting glasses with a non-RX glass lens for the left eye, and a
specially measured for firearms sights for the right eye. Works out very
well for me with handgun sights. I'm going to be putting a scout scope
on my lever action rifle, so the only glasses I'll need when shooting it
are a pair of non-RX shooter's protective glasses.


--
Republicans . . . the anti-immigrant, anti-contraception, anti-student,
anti-middle class, pro-impeachment party that shut down the government
last year for no reason.

To haul a real boat you need a real truck
 

On 7/12/14, 11:52 AM, wrote:
On Sat, 12 Jul 2014 11:09:06 -0400, F*O*A*D wrote:



The factory wadcutters in .38 special are far more expensive than the
jacketed ammo I use.

I have zero interest in reloading ammo.

So, wadcutters are messy, and they cost more than what I use

BTW, is your Colt OM a pre-war model?




When I was shooting a lot I was reloading
(about 2-3 cents a shot at the time)
Since the bullet is most of the cost, cast bullets make a lot of sense
for sub sonic loads. I did not notice any significant extra cleaning
effort.. A quick hit with Hoppes on a brush and a swab, it was good.

Wad cutters are typically loaded flush with the case mouth so they
will be the overall length of the case. That does allow them to feed
in that special purpose S&W semi auto tho.(the number escapes me at
the moment)
I almost bought one years ago but I was not sure enough why to pay the
steep price they were going for.

My OM was made in 1951 according to Colt. I got it in the 60s and it
was not a virgin then. I think I only paid about $40 for it at Ye Olde
Hunter in 1967-8
I have put thousands of rounds through it since then.



Well, I'm sure my revolver would handle the wadcutters but they'd leave
behind a mess. But my new lever gun would not feed them. It wants "full
size" cartridges with an overall length of 40 mm, and maybe .38 special
cartridges measuring 39 mm.
--
Republicans . . . the anti-immigrant, anti-contraception, anti-student,
anti-middle class, pro-impeachment party that shut down the government
last year for no reason.

To haul a real boat you need a real truck
 

F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 11:44 PM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 7:01 PM, Califbill wrote:
H*a*r*r*o*l*d wrote:
On 7/11/2014 12:19 PM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 1:04 PM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 11:48 AM, True North wrote:
Imagine Johnny showing up at your place with the trailer.
Reminds me of that Chevy Chase movie where the redneck brother in law
pulls up and parks on the street in front of the house.


Herring wouldn't like our street. We have some folks in the
neighborhood with dark skin.


That why you keep all those large caliber firearms?


I don't shoot any "large caliber" firearms. The ones I do shoot are for
inanimate targets and right-wing zombies, of course.

357 magnum and 45 are not target rounds unless your target has flesh and blood.


They can be target rounds. And 357 mag is definitely a large caliber
round! .45 is bigger than a 44 magnum in diameter. Not as powerful, but
definitely a large caliber.


.357 rounds are about the same diameter as 9mm rounds. 9mm is available
with 147 grain and larger bullets. I shoot 125 grain and 158 grain .357.
It's not a large caliber round. I don't shoot .45 caliber.


Oh, and for FlaJim, who is about as ignorant of handguns and ammo as he
is of everything else, here's a vid of a fella shooting .357 Mags in
competition target shooting:

http://tinyurl.com/lyuxe6a

And another:

http://tinyurl.com/ofg4qwt



He is not shooting .357 magnum rounds. He is shooting very light loads.
Probably light for even .38 special. Little kick in the Ruger.


Gee, Bilious, just what *is* a .357 mag round, in your typically uninformed opinion?

I didn't see a "crawl" along the bottom of the vid indicating what powder
and how much was being used, along with the bullet weight. I shoot
standard, manufactured .357 Mag target loads, with 158 grain bullets.
They *are* .357 magnum rounds. There's very little recoil or muzzle flip
with my revolver. I do have some special self-defense rounds with a
lighter grain bullet, but I don't use them for target shooting.

This is yet another of those subjects about which you don't know your ass
from a hole in the ground.


Bull****. A 357 magnum round, unless very lightly loaded is a very
powerful round. You may buy light load target rounds, but other than
being called a 357, they are not magnums. Shoot light load 38 special, and
save more money, so you can pay your debts to society.

To haul a real boat you need a real truck
 

On 7/12/14, 2:28 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 12 Jul 2014 12:09:51 -0400, F*O*A*D wrote:

Well, I'm sure my revolver would handle the wadcutters but they'd leave
behind a mess. But my new lever gun would not feed them. It wants "full
size" cartridges with an overall length of 40 mm, and maybe .38 special
cartridges measuring 39 mm.
--

You could test it simply by cycling fired cases. The length is the
same.

I am still not sure of what "mess" you are talking about.

People have been shooting wad cutters out of .38s for a century. That
old OM has done a couple thousand.


Perhaps your cylinder tolerances are looser.

There's about a tenth of an inch of free bore in the .357 MAG cylinder
when you use .38 specials and more when you use wadcutters. The free
bore gets fouled with powder and residue from the rounds you fire. When
you switch to .357 MAGS, the rounds seat properly in the fouled
cylinder, but ejecting the shot rounds, the empty cases, is a pain in
the ass.

To haul a real boat you need a real truck
 

On 7/12/14, 2:36 PM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 11:44 PM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 7:01 PM, Califbill wrote:
H*a*r*r*o*l*d wrote:
On 7/11/2014 12:19 PM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 1:04 PM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 11:48 AM, True North wrote:
Imagine Johnny showing up at your place with the trailer.
Reminds me of that Chevy Chase movie where the redneck brother in law
pulls up and parks on the street in front of the house.


Herring wouldn't like our street. We have some folks in the
neighborhood with dark skin.


That why you keep all those large caliber firearms?


I don't shoot any "large caliber" firearms. The ones I do shoot are for
inanimate targets and right-wing zombies, of course.

357 magnum and 45 are not target rounds unless your target has flesh and blood.


They can be target rounds. And 357 mag is definitely a large caliber
round! .45 is bigger than a 44 magnum in diameter. Not as powerful, but
definitely a large caliber.


.357 rounds are about the same diameter as 9mm rounds. 9mm is available
with 147 grain and larger bullets. I shoot 125 grain and 158 grain .357.
It's not a large caliber round. I don't shoot .45 caliber.


Oh, and for FlaJim, who is about as ignorant of handguns and ammo as he
is of everything else, here's a vid of a fella shooting .357 Mags in
competition target shooting:

http://tinyurl.com/lyuxe6a

And another:

http://tinyurl.com/ofg4qwt



He is not shooting .357 magnum rounds. He is shooting very light loads.
Probably light for even .38 special. Little kick in the Ruger.


Gee, Bilious, just what *is* a .357 mag round, in your typically uninformed opinion?

I didn't see a "crawl" along the bottom of the vid indicating what powder
and how much was being used, along with the bullet weight. I shoot
standard, manufactured .357 Mag target loads, with 158 grain bullets.
They *are* .357 magnum rounds. There's very little recoil or muzzle flip
with my revolver. I do have some special self-defense rounds with a
lighter grain bullet, but I don't use them for target shooting.

This is yet another of those subjects about which you don't know your ass
from a hole in the ground.


Bull****. A 357 magnum round, unless very lightly loaded is a very
powerful round. You may buy light load target rounds, but other than
being called a 357, they are not magnums. Shoot light load 38 special, and
save more money, so you can pay your debts to society.



The manufactured .357 MAG ammo I buy is not a "light load target round."
It is .357 MAG, with 158 grain bullets and appropriate powder.
You don't have to be shooting 180 grain "buffalo bore" ammo to be using
"real" .357 MAG rounds.

And once again, Bilious, I ask you: just what are the specs in your mind
for a true, real .357 MAG round?

I shoot .38 specials and .357 mag rounds in my revolver. I'll stick to
the .357 mags for my rifle.



--
Republicans . . . the anti-immigrant, anti-contraception, anti-student,
anti-middle class, pro-impeachment party that shut down the government
last year for no reason.

To haul a real boat you need a real truck
 

On 7/12/14, 4:02 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 12 Jul 2014 15:28:53 -0400, F*O*A*D wrote:

I shoot .38 specials and .357 mag rounds in my revolver. I'll stick to
the .357 mags for my rifle.

I never really got the point of a .357 carbine. I have a Ruger in .44
mag and it is pretty useless too. Not enough power for a hunting rifle
and not enough magazine capacity for a serious self defense weapon.
(also a PITA to load/unload)

I doubt I have fired it a dozen times and when I tried hunting with
it, I lost more rounds than I shot.



I don't hunt, but both the .357 and .44 carbines will drop a deer at at
least 100-125 yards. That's the length of a football field. What are you
hunting down there in SW Florida? Armadillos?



--
Republicans . . . the anti-immigrant, anti-contraception, anti-student,
anti-middle class, pro-impeachment party that shut down the government
last year for no reason.

To haul a real boat you need a real truck
 

On 7/12/14, 4:10 PM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/12/14, 4:02 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 12 Jul 2014 15:28:53 -0400, F*O*A*D wrote:

I shoot .38 specials and .357 mag rounds in my revolver. I'll stick to
the .357 mags for my rifle.

I never really got the point of a .357 carbine. I have a Ruger in .44
mag and it is pretty useless too. Not enough power for a hunting rifle
and not enough magazine capacity for a serious self defense weapon.
(also a PITA to load/unload)

I doubt I have fired it a dozen times and when I tried hunting with
it, I lost more rounds than I shot.



I don't hunt, but both the .357 and .44 carbines will drop a deer at at
least 100-125 yards. That's the length of a football field. What are you
hunting down there in SW Florida? Armadillos?





This shot's for you, Gregg:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gPBKt3fFCw

--
Republicans . . . the anti-immigrant, anti-contraception, anti-student,
anti-middle class, pro-impeachment party that shut down the government
last year for no reason.

To haul a real boat you need a real truck
 

On 7/12/14, 4:20 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 12 Jul 2014 16:10:04 -0400, F*O*A*D wrote:

On 7/12/14, 4:02 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 12 Jul 2014 15:28:53 -0400, F*O*A*D wrote:

I shoot .38 specials and .357 mag rounds in my revolver. I'll stick to
the .357 mags for my rifle.

I never really got the point of a .357 carbine. I have a Ruger in .44
mag and it is pretty useless too. Not enough power for a hunting rifle
and not enough magazine capacity for a serious self defense weapon.
(also a PITA to load/unload)

I doubt I have fired it a dozen times and when I tried hunting with
it, I lost more rounds than I shot.



I don't hunt, but both the .357 and .44 carbines will drop a deer at at
least 100-125 yards. That's the length of a football field. What are you
hunting down there in SW Florida? Armadillos?

It was in Maryland and a .357 does not meet the minimum energy
requirement for deer. The .44 barely makes it?



I'll keep that mind the next time I'm not hunting deer.

--
Republicans . . . the anti-immigrant, anti-contraception, anti-student,
anti-middle class, pro-impeachment party that shut down the government
last year for no reason.

To haul a real boat you need a real truck
 

On Sat, 12 Jul 2014 15:57:38 -0400, wrote:

On Sat, 12 Jul 2014 15:22:33 -0400, F*O*A*D wrote:

On 7/12/14, 2:28 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 12 Jul 2014 12:09:51 -0400, F*O*A*D wrote:

Well, I'm sure my revolver would handle the wadcutters but they'd leave
behind a mess. But my new lever gun would not feed them. It wants "full
size" cartridges with an overall length of 40 mm, and maybe .38 special
cartridges measuring 39 mm.
--

You could test it simply by cycling fired cases. The length is the
same.

I am still not sure of what "mess" you are talking about.

People have been shooting wad cutters out of .38s for a century. That
old OM has done a couple thousand.


Perhaps your cylinder tolerances are looser.

There's about a tenth of an inch of free bore in the .357 MAG cylinder
when you use .38 specials and more when you use wadcutters. The free
bore gets fouled with powder and residue from the rounds you fire. When
you switch to .357 MAGS, the rounds seat properly in the fouled
cylinder, but ejecting the shot rounds, the empty cases, is a pain in
the ass.


I have never had powder fouling that did not come out with a quick
pass of a brush. You have exactly the same issue with powder fouling
forward of the case mouth if you are shooting .357 brass. The bullet
itself will not enter into it. Chambers in a revolver are usually
straight bored all the way to the end. That is a good thing for
reloaders since you do not have to size cases for length like you do
on a .45 ACP.
That is still going to be there any time you fire .38 brass in a .357
or a .22 short in a .22lr
You are the first person I have ever heard who thought it was a
burden.

I've also fired hundreds of wad cutters through my Mod 28. My brother, the cop, got them free. Gave
me a big box full. Didn't have any problem with them. Cleaning a gun is about as much fun as
shooting it anyway.

But hey, if the name of the game is to be disagreeable, then the boy has to come up with something!

To haul a real boat you need a real truck
 

F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/12/14, 2:36 PM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 11:44 PM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 7:01 PM, Califbill wrote:
H*a*r*r*o*l*d wrote:
On 7/11/2014 12:19 PM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 1:04 PM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 11:48 AM, True North wrote:
Imagine Johnny showing up at your place with the trailer.
Reminds me of that Chevy Chase movie where the redneck brother in law
pulls up and parks on the street in front of the house.


Herring wouldn't like our street. We have some folks in the
neighborhood with dark skin.


That why you keep all those large caliber firearms?


I don't shoot any "large caliber" firearms. The ones I do shoot are for
inanimate targets and right-wing zombies, of course.

357 magnum and 45 are not target rounds unless your target has flesh and blood.


They can be target rounds. And 357 mag is definitely a large caliber
round! .45 is bigger than a 44 magnum in diameter. Not as powerful, but
definitely a large caliber.


.357 rounds are about the same diameter as 9mm rounds. 9mm is available
with 147 grain and larger bullets. I shoot 125 grain and 158 grain .357.
It's not a large caliber round. I don't shoot .45 caliber.


Oh, and for FlaJim, who is about as ignorant of handguns and ammo as he
is of everything else, here's a vid of a fella shooting .357 Mags in
competition target shooting:

http://tinyurl.com/lyuxe6a

And another:

http://tinyurl.com/ofg4qwt



He is not shooting .357 magnum rounds. He is shooting very light loads.
Probably light for even .38 special. Little kick in the Ruger.


Gee, Bilious, just what *is* a .357 mag round, in your typically uninformed opinion?

I didn't see a "crawl" along the bottom of the vid indicating what powder
and how much was being used, along with the bullet weight. I shoot
standard, manufactured .357 Mag target loads, with 158 grain bullets.
They *are* .357 magnum rounds. There's very little recoil or muzzle flip
with my revolver. I do have some special self-defense rounds with a
lighter grain bullet, but I don't use them for target shooting.

This is yet another of those subjects about which you don't know your ass
from a hole in the ground.


Bull****. A 357 magnum round, unless very lightly loaded is a very
powerful round. You may buy light load target rounds, but other than
being called a 357, they are not magnums. Shoot light load 38 special, and
save more money, so you can pay your debts to society.



The manufactured .357 MAG ammo I buy is not a "light load target round."
It is .357 MAG, with 158 grain bullets and appropriate powder.
You don't have to be shooting 180 grain "buffalo bore" ammo to be using
"real" .357 MAG rounds.

And once again, Bilious, I ask you: just what are the specs in your mind
for a true, real .357 MAG round?

I shoot .38 specials and .357 mag rounds in my revolver. I'll stick to
the .357 mags for my rifle.




If that revolver does not kick nastily with a 357 round, it is not magnum
loaded. Plus the noise is a lot louder. I rarely shoot a 357 in my Colt.
I shoot wad cutter 38's.

To haul a real boat you need a real truck
 

On 7/12/14, 5:15 PM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/12/14, 2:36 PM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 11:44 PM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 7:01 PM, Califbill wrote:
H*a*r*r*o*l*d wrote:
On 7/11/2014 12:19 PM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 1:04 PM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 11:48 AM, True North wrote:
Imagine Johnny showing up at your place with the trailer.
Reminds me of that Chevy Chase movie where the redneck brother in law
pulls up and parks on the street in front of the house.


Herring wouldn't like our street. We have some folks in the
neighborhood with dark skin.


That why you keep all those large caliber firearms?


I don't shoot any "large caliber" firearms. The ones I do shoot are for
inanimate targets and right-wing zombies, of course.

357 magnum and 45 are not target rounds unless your target has flesh and blood.


They can be target rounds. And 357 mag is definitely a large caliber
round! .45 is bigger than a 44 magnum in diameter. Not as powerful, but
definitely a large caliber.


.357 rounds are about the same diameter as 9mm rounds. 9mm is available
with 147 grain and larger bullets. I shoot 125 grain and 158 grain .357.
It's not a large caliber round. I don't shoot .45 caliber.


Oh, and for FlaJim, who is about as ignorant of handguns and ammo as he
is of everything else, here's a vid of a fella shooting .357 Mags in
competition target shooting:

http://tinyurl.com/lyuxe6a

And another:

http://tinyurl.com/ofg4qwt



He is not shooting .357 magnum rounds. He is shooting very light loads.
Probably light for even .38 special. Little kick in the Ruger.


Gee, Bilious, just what *is* a .357 mag round, in your typically uninformed opinion?

I didn't see a "crawl" along the bottom of the vid indicating what powder
and how much was being used, along with the bullet weight. I shoot
standard, manufactured .357 Mag target loads, with 158 grain bullets.
They *are* .357 magnum rounds. There's very little recoil or muzzle flip
with my revolver. I do have some special self-defense rounds with a
lighter grain bullet, but I don't use them for target shooting.

This is yet another of those subjects about which you don't know your ass
from a hole in the ground.


Bull****. A 357 magnum round, unless very lightly loaded is a very
powerful round. You may buy light load target rounds, but other than
being called a 357, they are not magnums. Shoot light load 38 special, and
save more money, so you can pay your debts to society.



The manufactured .357 MAG ammo I buy is not a "light load target round."
It is .357 MAG, with 158 grain bullets and appropriate powder.
You don't have to be shooting 180 grain "buffalo bore" ammo to be using
"real" .357 MAG rounds.

And once again, Bilious, I ask you: just what are the specs in your mind
for a true, real .357 MAG round?

I shoot .38 specials and .357 mag rounds in my revolver. I'll stick to
the .357 mags for my rifle.




If that revolver does not kick nastily with a 357 round, it is not magnum
loaded. Plus the noise is a lot louder. I rarely shoot a 357 in my Colt.
I shoot wad cutter 38's.



Right, Bilious. As usual, you don't know what you are talking about. And
it isn't my problem that you are too weak-wristed to control a good .357
MAG revolver.

--
Republicans . . . the anti-immigrant, anti-contraception, anti-student,
anti-middle class, pro-impeachment party that shut down the government
last year for no reason.

To haul a real boat you need a real truck
 

On 7/12/14, 8:14 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 12 Jul 2014 16:18:21 -0400, F*O*A*D wrote:

On 7/12/14, 4:10 PM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/12/14, 4:02 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 12 Jul 2014 15:28:53 -0400, F*O*A*D wrote:

I shoot .38 specials and .357 mag rounds in my revolver. I'll stick to
the .357 mags for my rifle.

I never really got the point of a .357 carbine. I have a Ruger in .44
mag and it is pretty useless too. Not enough power for a hunting rifle
and not enough magazine capacity for a serious self defense weapon.
(also a PITA to load/unload)

I doubt I have fired it a dozen times and when I tried hunting with
it, I lost more rounds than I shot.



I don't hunt, but both the .357 and .44 carbines will drop a deer at at
least 100-125 yards. That's the length of a football field. What are you
hunting down there in SW Florida? Armadillos?





This shot's for you, Gregg:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gPBKt3fFCw

Plenty of muzzle flip there, even with a heavy 6-7" barrel and a
muzzle brake.. THAT looks like a real .357
Those other guys were shooting .38 class ammo, probably on the order
of the wad cutters I used to load.

BTW have you ever seen that guy who does stuff like that with a 2"?



He's shooting out of a tripod, so his grip on the pistol isn't ideal for
controlling flip.

--
Republicans . . . the anti-immigrant, anti-contraception, anti-student,
anti-middle class, pro-impeachment party that shut down the government
last year for no reason.

To haul a real boat you need a real truck
 

On 7/12/14, 9:04 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 12 Jul 2014 20:57:43 -0400, F*O*A*D wrote:

On 7/12/14, 8:14 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 12 Jul 2014 16:18:21 -0400, F*O*A*D wrote:

On 7/12/14, 4:10 PM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/12/14, 4:02 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 12 Jul 2014 15:28:53 -0400, F*O*A*D wrote:

I shoot .38 specials and .357 mag rounds in my revolver. I'll stick to
the .357 mags for my rifle.

I never really got the point of a .357 carbine. I have a Ruger in .44
mag and it is pretty useless too. Not enough power for a hunting rifle
and not enough magazine capacity for a serious self defense weapon.
(also a PITA to load/unload)

I doubt I have fired it a dozen times and when I tried hunting with
it, I lost more rounds than I shot.



I don't hunt, but both the .357 and .44 carbines will drop a deer at at
least 100-125 yards. That's the length of a football field. What are you
hunting down there in SW Florida? Armadillos?





This shot's for you, Gregg:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gPBKt3fFCw

Plenty of muzzle flip there, even with a heavy 6-7" barrel and a
muzzle brake.. THAT looks like a real .357
Those other guys were shooting .38 class ammo, probably on the order
of the wad cutters I used to load.

BTW have you ever seen that guy who does stuff like that with a 2"?



He's shooting out of a tripod, so his grip on the pistol isn't ideal for
controlling flip.

Huh? I would think he was really holding it down tight.

It is still an accurate representation of a full power .357 load.


I dunno. I only get a bit of muzzle flip when I shoot "full power .357
loads. Maybe it's my grip of death. :)

--
Republicans . . . the anti-immigrant, anti-contraception, anti-student,
anti-middle class, pro-impeachment party that shut down the government
last year for no reason.

To haul a real boat you need a real truck
 

On 7/12/2014 8:14 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 12 Jul 2014 16:18:21 -0400, F*O*A*D wrote:

On 7/12/14, 4:10 PM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/12/14, 4:02 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 12 Jul 2014 15:28:53 -0400, F*O*A*D wrote:

I shoot .38 specials and .357 mag rounds in my revolver. I'll stick to
the .357 mags for my rifle.

I never really got the point of a .357 carbine. I have a Ruger in .44
mag and it is pretty useless too. Not enough power for a hunting rifle
and not enough magazine capacity for a serious self defense weapon.
(also a PITA to load/unload)

I doubt I have fired it a dozen times and when I tried hunting with
it, I lost more rounds than I shot.



I don't hunt, but both the .357 and .44 carbines will drop a deer at at
least 100-125 yards. That's the length of a football field. What are you
hunting down there in SW Florida? Armadillos?





This shot's for you, Gregg:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gPBKt3fFCw

Plenty of muzzle flip there, even with a heavy 6-7" barrel and a
muzzle brake.. THAT looks like a real .357
Those other guys were shooting .38 class ammo, probably on the order
of the wad cutters I used to load.

BTW have you ever seen that guy who does stuff like that with a 2"?



I've posted this before but here's a good view of the recoil differences
in .38 Special and .357 Magnum rounds. I am shooting a S&W 627 with a
5-inch barrel loaded with alternating .38 Special and .357 Magnum
rounds. No question which is which.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UF00rLj8AEY

To haul a real boat you need a real truck
 

F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/12/14, 5:15 PM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/12/14, 2:36 PM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 11:44 PM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 7:01 PM, Califbill wrote:
H*a*r*r*o*l*d wrote:
On 7/11/2014 12:19 PM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 1:04 PM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 11:48 AM, True North wrote:
Imagine Johnny showing up at your place with the trailer.
Reminds me of that Chevy Chase movie where the redneck brother in law
pulls up and parks on the street in front of the house.


Herring wouldn't like our street. We have some folks in the
neighborhood with dark skin.


That why you keep all those large caliber firearms?


I don't shoot any "large caliber" firearms. The ones I do shoot are for
inanimate targets and right-wing zombies, of course.

357 magnum and 45 are not target rounds unless your target has flesh and blood.


They can be target rounds. And 357 mag is definitely a large caliber
round! .45 is bigger than a 44 magnum in diameter. Not as powerful, but
definitely a large caliber.


.357 rounds are about the same diameter as 9mm rounds. 9mm is available
with 147 grain and larger bullets. I shoot 125 grain and 158 grain .357.
It's not a large caliber round. I don't shoot .45 caliber.


Oh, and for FlaJim, who is about as ignorant of handguns and ammo as he
is of everything else, here's a vid of a fella shooting .357 Mags in
competition target shooting:

http://tinyurl.com/lyuxe6a

And another:

http://tinyurl.com/ofg4qwt



He is not shooting .357 magnum rounds. He is shooting very light loads.
Probably light for even .38 special. Little kick in the Ruger.


Gee, Bilious, just what *is* a .357 mag round, in your typically uninformed opinion?

I didn't see a "crawl" along the bottom of the vid indicating what powder
and how much was being used, along with the bullet weight. I shoot
standard, manufactured .357 Mag target loads, with 158 grain bullets.
They *are* .357 magnum rounds. There's very little recoil or muzzle flip
with my revolver. I do have some special self-defense rounds with a
lighter grain bullet, but I don't use them for target shooting.

This is yet another of those subjects about which you don't know your ass
from a hole in the ground.


Bull****. A 357 magnum round, unless very lightly loaded is a very
powerful round. You may buy light load target rounds, but other than
being called a 357, they are not magnums. Shoot light load 38 special, and
save more money, so you can pay your debts to society.



The manufactured .357 MAG ammo I buy is not a "light load target round."
It is .357 MAG, with 158 grain bullets and appropriate powder.
You don't have to be shooting 180 grain "buffalo bore" ammo to be using
"real" .357 MAG rounds.

And once again, Bilious, I ask you: just what are the specs in your mind
for a true, real .357 MAG round?

I shoot .38 specials and .357 mag rounds in my revolver. I'll stick to
the .357 mags for my rifle.




If that revolver does not kick nastily with a 357 round, it is not magnum
loaded. Plus the noise is a lot louder. I rarely shoot a 357 in my Colt.
I shoot wad cutter 38's.



Right, Bilious. As usual, you don't know what you are talking about. And
it isn't my problem that you are too weak-wristed to control a good .357 MAG revolver.


Yup, you are Jack Armstrong strong. Mr. atlas.

To haul a real boat you need a real truck
 

On 7/12/14, 11:59 PM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/12/14, 5:15 PM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/12/14, 2:36 PM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 11:44 PM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 7:01 PM, Califbill wrote:
H*a*r*r*o*l*d wrote:
On 7/11/2014 12:19 PM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 1:04 PM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 11:48 AM, True North wrote:
Imagine Johnny showing up at your place with the trailer.
Reminds me of that Chevy Chase movie where the redneck brother in law
pulls up and parks on the street in front of the house.


Herring wouldn't like our street. We have some folks in the
neighborhood with dark skin.


That why you keep all those large caliber firearms?


I don't shoot any "large caliber" firearms. The ones I do shoot are for
inanimate targets and right-wing zombies, of course.

357 magnum and 45 are not target rounds unless your target has flesh and blood.


They can be target rounds. And 357 mag is definitely a large caliber
round! .45 is bigger than a 44 magnum in diameter. Not as powerful, but
definitely a large caliber.


.357 rounds are about the same diameter as 9mm rounds. 9mm is available
with 147 grain and larger bullets. I shoot 125 grain and 158 grain .357.
It's not a large caliber round. I don't shoot .45 caliber.


Oh, and for FlaJim, who is about as ignorant of handguns and ammo as he
is of everything else, here's a vid of a fella shooting .357 Mags in
competition target shooting:

http://tinyurl.com/lyuxe6a

And another:

http://tinyurl.com/ofg4qwt



He is not shooting .357 magnum rounds. He is shooting very light loads.
Probably light for even .38 special. Little kick in the Ruger.


Gee, Bilious, just what *is* a .357 mag round, in your typically uninformed opinion?

I didn't see a "crawl" along the bottom of the vid indicating what powder
and how much was being used, along with the bullet weight. I shoot
standard, manufactured .357 Mag target loads, with 158 grain bullets.
They *are* .357 magnum rounds. There's very little recoil or muzzle flip
with my revolver. I do have some special self-defense rounds with a
lighter grain bullet, but I don't use them for target shooting.

This is yet another of those subjects about which you don't know your ass
from a hole in the ground.


Bull****. A 357 magnum round, unless very lightly loaded is a very
powerful round. You may buy light load target rounds, but other than
being called a 357, they are not magnums. Shoot light load 38 special, and
save more money, so you can pay your debts to society.



The manufactured .357 MAG ammo I buy is not a "light load target round."
It is .357 MAG, with 158 grain bullets and appropriate powder.
You don't have to be shooting 180 grain "buffalo bore" ammo to be using
"real" .357 MAG rounds.

And once again, Bilious, I ask you: just what are the specs in your mind
for a true, real .357 MAG round?

I shoot .38 specials and .357 mag rounds in my revolver. I'll stick to
the .357 mags for my rifle.




If that revolver does not kick nastily with a 357 round, it is not magnum
loaded. Plus the noise is a lot louder. I rarely shoot a 357 in my Colt.
I shoot wad cutter 38's.



Right, Bilious. As usual, you don't know what you are talking about. And
it isn't my problem that you are too weak-wristed to control a good .357 MAG revolver.


Yup, you are Jack Armstrong strong. Mr. atlas.


You still haven't told us what a "real" .357 MAG round is, in terms of
bullet weight, powder charge, velocity, impact, et cetera.

--
Republicans . . . the anti-immigrant, anti-contraception, anti-student,
anti-middle class, pro-impeachment party that shut down the government
last year for no reason.

To haul a real boat you need a real truck
 

On Sat, 12 Jul 2014 22:50:59 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote:

On 7/12/2014 8:14 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 12 Jul 2014 16:18:21 -0400, F*O*A*D wrote:

On 7/12/14, 4:10 PM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/12/14, 4:02 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 12 Jul 2014 15:28:53 -0400, F*O*A*D wrote:

I shoot .38 specials and .357 mag rounds in my revolver. I'll stick to
the .357 mags for my rifle.

I never really got the point of a .357 carbine. I have a Ruger in .44
mag and it is pretty useless too. Not enough power for a hunting rifle
and not enough magazine capacity for a serious self defense weapon.
(also a PITA to load/unload)

I doubt I have fired it a dozen times and when I tried hunting with
it, I lost more rounds than I shot.



I don't hunt, but both the .357 and .44 carbines will drop a deer at at
least 100-125 yards. That's the length of a football field. What are you
hunting down there in SW Florida? Armadillos?





This shot's for you, Gregg:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gPBKt3fFCw

Plenty of muzzle flip there, even with a heavy 6-7" barrel and a
muzzle brake.. THAT looks like a real .357
Those other guys were shooting .38 class ammo, probably on the order
of the wad cutters I used to load.

BTW have you ever seen that guy who does stuff like that with a 2"?



I've posted this before but here's a good view of the recoil differences
in .38 Special and .357 Magnum rounds. I am shooting a S&W 627 with a
5-inch barrel loaded with alternating .38 Special and .357 Magnum
rounds. No question which is which.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UF00rLj8AEY

Krause would say you just got extremely limp wristed when the .357 rounds cycled up.

To haul a real boat you need a real truck
 

On 7/13/14, 10:40 AM, wrote:
On Sun, 13 Jul 2014 08:02:28 -0400, F*O*A*D wrote:

You still haven't told us what a "real" .357 MAG round is, in terms of
bullet weight, powder charge, velocity, impact, et cetera.

The short answer is "pressure".
38s are generally limited to 16,000-17,000 PSI, the +P can approach
20,000 if you are using a modern firearm.
.357 can get you up to 35,000 and some guys even exceed that a bit.

The reality is ".357" was simply a marketing term.
A large frame .38 like my OM was the original .357 platform and it has
the same amount of metal in the critical places as the Python. It is
quite easy to get a .357 load in a .38 case with plenty of room to
spare. They made the .357 cases larger to keep them out of Airweights
and Chief Specials along with all of those antique guns that would
chamber a .38 spl. There are plenty of old .38s that are not even safe
with a regular sub sonic .38 spl.




Grrr. I know what a .357 MAG is. I'm familiar with the SAAMI pressure
loads. Bilious is the one who kept saying, "They're not real .357 MAGs,"
as if he could discern that from information not presented.

Most ammo manufacturers don’t publish the pressures of their rounds.
Sellier & Bellot says its .357 Magnum FMJ’s, the ones I use, achieve a
muzzle velocity of 1263 FPS, and smack with 560 foot pounds of energy
out of the muzzle.

I have a couple of boxes of Hornady 125 grain FTX ammo, which achieve a
muzzle velocity of 1500 FPS, and smack with 624 foot pounds of energy.

Either round probably will stop a usenet zombie.

Here's an interesting piece you might like to read:

http://www.leverguns.com/articles/pa...literature.htm



--
Republicans . . . the anti-immigrant, anti-contraception, anti-student,
anti-middle class, pro-impeachment party that shut down the government
last year for no reason.

To haul a real boat you need a real truck
 

F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/13/14, 10:40 AM, wrote:
On Sun, 13 Jul 2014 08:02:28 -0400, F*O*A*D wrote:

You still haven't told us what a "real" .357 MAG round is, in terms of
bullet weight, powder charge, velocity, impact, et cetera.

The short answer is "pressure".
38s are generally limited to 16,000-17,000 PSI, the +P can approach
20,000 if you are using a modern firearm.
.357 can get you up to 35,000 and some guys even exceed that a bit.

The reality is ".357" was simply a marketing term.
A large frame .38 like my OM was the original .357 platform and it has
the same amount of metal in the critical places as the Python. It is
quite easy to get a .357 load in a .38 case with plenty of room to
spare. They made the .357 cases larger to keep them out of Airweights
and Chief Specials along with all of those antique guns that would
chamber a .38 spl. There are plenty of old .38s that are not even safe
with a regular sub sonic .38 spl.




Grrr. I know what a .357 MAG is. I'm familiar with the SAAMI pressure
loads. Bilious is the one who kept saying, "They're not real .357 MAGs,"
as if he could discern that from information not presented.

Most ammo manufacturers don’t publish the pressures of their rounds.
Sellier & Bellot says its .357 Magnum FMJ’s, the ones I use, achieve a
muzzle velocity of 1263 FPS, and smack with 560 foot pounds of energy out of the muzzle.

I have a couple of boxes of Hornady 125 grain FTX ammo, which achieve a
muzzle velocity of 1500 FPS, and smack with 624 foot pounds of energy.

Either round probably will stop a usenet zombie.

Here's an interesting piece you might like to read:

http://www.leverguns.com/articles/pa...literature.htm




I am stating the shooter is not shooting a magnum load. He is shooting a
lightly loaded target round. Same case, but not highly loaded.

To haul a real boat you need a real truck
 

F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/12/14, 11:59 PM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/12/14, 5:15 PM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/12/14, 2:36 PM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 11:44 PM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 7:01 PM, Califbill wrote:
H*a*r*r*o*l*d wrote:
On 7/11/2014 12:19 PM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 1:04 PM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 11:48 AM, True North wrote:
Imagine Johnny showing up at your place with the trailer.
Reminds me of that Chevy Chase movie where the redneck brother in law
pulls up and parks on the street in front of the house.


Herring wouldn't like our street. We have some folks in the
neighborhood with dark skin.


That why you keep all those large caliber firearms?


I don't shoot any "large caliber" firearms. The ones I do shoot are for
inanimate targets and right-wing zombies, of course.

357 magnum and 45 are not target rounds unless your target has flesh and blood.


They can be target rounds. And 357 mag is definitely a large caliber
round! .45 is bigger than a 44 magnum in diameter. Not as powerful, but
definitely a large caliber.


.357 rounds are about the same diameter as 9mm rounds. 9mm is available
with 147 grain and larger bullets. I shoot 125 grain and 158 grain .357.
It's not a large caliber round. I don't shoot .45 caliber.


Oh, and for FlaJim, who is about as ignorant of handguns and ammo as he
is of everything else, here's a vid of a fella shooting .357 Mags in
competition target shooting:

http://tinyurl.com/lyuxe6a

And another:

http://tinyurl.com/ofg4qwt



He is not shooting .357 magnum rounds. He is shooting very light loads.
Probably light for even .38 special. Little kick in the Ruger.


Gee, Bilious, just what *is* a .357 mag round, in your typically uninformed opinion?

I didn't see a "crawl" along the bottom of the vid indicating what powder
and how much was being used, along with the bullet weight. I shoot
standard, manufactured .357 Mag target loads, with 158 grain bullets.
They *are* .357 magnum rounds. There's very little recoil or muzzle flip
with my revolver. I do have some special self-defense rounds with a
lighter grain bullet, but I don't use them for target shooting.

This is yet another of those subjects about which you don't know your ass
from a hole in the ground.


Bull****. A 357 magnum round, unless very lightly loaded is a very
powerful round. You may buy light load target rounds, but other than
being called a 357, they are not magnums. Shoot light load 38 special, and
save more money, so you can pay your debts to society.



The manufactured .357 MAG ammo I buy is not a "light load target round."
It is .357 MAG, with 158 grain bullets and appropriate powder.
You don't have to be shooting 180 grain "buffalo bore" ammo to be using
"real" .357 MAG rounds.

And once again, Bilious, I ask you: just what are the specs in your mind
for a true, real .357 MAG round?

I shoot .38 specials and .357 mag rounds in my revolver. I'll stick to
the .357 mags for my rifle.




If that revolver does not kick nastily with a 357 round, it is not magnum
loaded. Plus the noise is a lot louder. I rarely shoot a 357 in my Colt.
I shoot wad cutter 38's.



Right, Bilious. As usual, you don't know what you are talking about. And
it isn't my problem that you are too weak-wristed to control a good .357 MAG revolver.


Yup, you are Jack Armstrong strong. Mr. atlas.


You still haven't told us what a "real" .357 MAG round is, in terms of
bullet weight, powder charge, velocity, impact, et cetera.


A hell of a lot more force than a 22rf or a 9mm. Or a 38 special out of
the same weapon.

To haul a real boat you need a real truck
 

On 7/13/14, 3:51 PM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/13/14, 10:40 AM, wrote:
On Sun, 13 Jul 2014 08:02:28 -0400, F*O*A*D wrote:

You still haven't told us what a "real" .357 MAG round is, in terms of
bullet weight, powder charge, velocity, impact, et cetera.

The short answer is "pressure".
38s are generally limited to 16,000-17,000 PSI, the +P can approach
20,000 if you are using a modern firearm.
.357 can get you up to 35,000 and some guys even exceed that a bit.

The reality is ".357" was simply a marketing term.
A large frame .38 like my OM was the original .357 platform and it has
the same amount of metal in the critical places as the Python. It is
quite easy to get a .357 load in a .38 case with plenty of room to
spare. They made the .357 cases larger to keep them out of Airweights
and Chief Specials along with all of those antique guns that would
chamber a .38 spl. There are plenty of old .38s that are not even safe
with a regular sub sonic .38 spl.




Grrr. I know what a .357 MAG is. I'm familiar with the SAAMI pressure
loads. Bilious is the one who kept saying, "They're not real .357 MAGs,"
as if he could discern that from information not presented.

Most ammo manufacturers don’t publish the pressures of their rounds.
Sellier & Bellot says its .357 Magnum FMJ’s, the ones I use, achieve a
muzzle velocity of 1263 FPS, and smack with 560 foot pounds of energy out of the muzzle.

I have a couple of boxes of Hornady 125 grain FTX ammo, which achieve a
muzzle velocity of 1500 FPS, and smack with 624 foot pounds of energy.

Either round probably will stop a usenet zombie.

Here's an interesting piece you might like to read:

http://www.leverguns.com/articles/pa...literature.htm




I am stating the shooter is not shooting a magnum load. He is shooting a
lightly loaded target round. Same case, but not highly loaded.



You have no idea what the shooter is shooting. You're just guessing.

--
Republicans . . . the anti-immigrant, anti-contraception, anti-student,
anti-middle class, pro-impeachment party that shut down the government
last year for no reason.

To haul a real boat you need a real truck
 

F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/13/14, 3:51 PM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/13/14, 10:40 AM, wrote:
On Sun, 13 Jul 2014 08:02:28 -0400, F*O*A*D wrote:

You still haven't told us what a "real" .357 MAG round is, in terms of
bullet weight, powder charge, velocity, impact, et cetera.

The short answer is "pressure".
38s are generally limited to 16,000-17,000 PSI, the +P can approach
20,000 if you are using a modern firearm.
.357 can get you up to 35,000 and some guys even exceed that a bit.

The reality is ".357" was simply a marketing term.
A large frame .38 like my OM was the original .357 platform and it has
the same amount of metal in the critical places as the Python. It is
quite easy to get a .357 load in a .38 case with plenty of room to
spare. They made the .357 cases larger to keep them out of Airweights
and Chief Specials along with all of those antique guns that would
chamber a .38 spl. There are plenty of old .38s that are not even safe
with a regular sub sonic .38 spl.




Grrr. I know what a .357 MAG is. I'm familiar with the SAAMI pressure
loads. Bilious is the one who kept saying, "They're not real .357 MAGs,"
as if he could discern that from information not presented.

Most ammo manufacturers don’t publish the pressures of their rounds.
Sellier & Bellot says its .357 Magnum FMJ’s, the ones I use, achieve a
muzzle velocity of 1263 FPS, and smack with 560 foot pounds of energy out of the muzzle.

I have a couple of boxes of Hornady 125 grain FTX ammo, which achieve a
muzzle velocity of 1500 FPS, and smack with 624 foot pounds of energy.

Either round probably will stop a usenet zombie.

Here's an interesting piece you might like to read:

http://www.leverguns.com/articles/pa...literature.htm




I am stating the shooter is not shooting a magnum load. He is shooting a
lightly loaded target round. Same case, but not highly loaded.



You have no idea what the shooter is shooting. You're just guessing.


Nope. I shoot a .357, so know the characteristics. Plus, he is shooting
completion. He is going to shoot heavy enough to score, but as light as he
can go, so he is on target again quicker. Look at the kick up on the
weapon. Definitely not a full load! Hell, he may be shooting wax bullets.
Safer for the spectators regards richoshet.

To haul a real boat you need a real truck
 

H*a*r*r*o*l*d wrote:
On 7/12/2014 6:33 AM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 11:44 PM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 7:01 PM, Califbill wrote:
H*a*r*r*o*l*d wrote:
On 7/11/2014 12:19 PM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 1:04 PM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 11:48 AM, True North wrote:
Imagine Johnny showing up at your place with the trailer.
Reminds me of that Chevy Chase movie where the redneck brother
in law
pulls up and parks on the street in front of the house.


Herring wouldn't like our street. We have some folks in the
neighborhood with dark skin.


That why you keep all those large caliber firearms?


I don't shoot any "large caliber" firearms. The ones I do shoot
are for
inanimate targets and right-wing zombies, of course.

357 magnum and 45 are not target rounds unless your target has
flesh and blood.


They can be target rounds. And 357 mag is definitely a large caliber
round! .45 is bigger than a 44 magnum in diameter. Not as powerful,
but
definitely a large caliber.


.357 rounds are about the same diameter as 9mm rounds. 9mm is
available
with 147 grain and larger bullets. I shoot 125 grain and 158 grain
.357.
It's not a large caliber round. I don't shoot .45 caliber.


Oh, and for FlaJim, who is about as ignorant of handguns and ammo
as he
is of everything else, here's a vid of a fella shooting .357 Mags in
competition target shooting:

http://tinyurl.com/lyuxe6a

And another:

http://tinyurl.com/ofg4qwt



He is not shooting .357 magnum rounds. He is shooting very light
loads.
Probably light for even .38 special. Little kick in the Ruger.


Gee, Bilious, just what *is* a .357 mag round, in your typically
uninformed opinion?

I didn't see a "crawl" along the bottom of the vid indicating what
powder and how much was being used, along with the bullet weight. I
shoot standard, manufactured .357 Mag target loads, with 158 grain
bullets. They *are* .357 magnum rounds. There's very little recoil or
muzzle flip with my revolver. I do have some special self-defense rounds
with a lighter grain bullet, but I don't use them for target shooting.

This is yet another of those subjects about which you don't know your
ass from a hole in the ground.

Krause fancies himself as a small arms expert. Doubt his book learnin
makes him a good shooter though. What he does well is produce hot air.



He's a known liar. You can't believe anything he posts.

To haul a real boat you need a real truck
 

Wayne.B wrote:
On Sat, 12 Jul 2014 09:56:17 -0400, Poquito Loco
wrote:

On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 21:08:13 -0400, Wayne.B wrote:

On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 17:12:38 -0500, H*a*r*r*o*l*d
wrote:

357 magnum and 45 are not target rounds unless your target has flesh and
blood.
===

Actually I know quite a few guys who shoot targets with 45s. The
recoil is not that bad and they do their own reloads, usually on the
soft side. Shooting a 357 magnum for fun strains my credibility a
bit however.
My Kimber .45 is absolutely spectacular for shooting targets.
===

Oh absolutely, the Kimber 45 is a very sweet gun. Let me know if you
ever want to sell it. On the other hand, a 357 magnum, unless
downloaded to low velocity 38s, is a very unpleasant to shoot (except
Harry's of course).

My .357 has a long barrel and is compensated so it really has very
little recoil. My .44 Magnum is the same with an even longer barrel and
a 2X pistol scope on top. Very little muzzle flip.