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Homicides up 7% in Stand Your Ground States..
Whatever the merits of "Stand Your Ground" laws, they appear to increase
homicides by at least 7%, reports NPR. It cites a Texas A&M study of the 23 states that have enacted "Stand Your Ground" laws since 2005. Researchers looked at the homicide rate in those states pre- and post-law, as well as the rates of non-Stand Your Ground states. It determined between 500 and 700 additional homicides take place annually as a result. "These laws lower the cost of using lethal force," says Mark Hoekstra, the economist behind the study. "Our study finds that, as a result, you get more of it. Homicides go up by 7% to 9% in states that pass the laws." http://tinyurl.com/ah9gucl |
Homicides up 7% in Stand Your Ground States..
On Jan 3, 3:46*pm, ESAD wrote:
Whatever the merits of "Stand Your Ground" laws, they appear to increase homicides by at least 7%, reports NPR. It cites a Texas A&M study of the 23 states that have enacted "Stand Your Ground" laws since 2005. Researchers looked at the homicide rate in those states pre- and post-law, as well as the rates of non-Stand Your Ground states. It determined between 500 and 700 additional homicides take place annually as a result. "These laws lower the cost of using lethal force," says Mark Hoekstra, the economist behind the study. "Our study finds that, as a result, you get more of it. Homicides go up by 7% to 9% in states that pass the laws." http://tinyurl.com/ah9gucl I dont' agree with the assesment- Chicago is a very "blue" city in a very 'blue' state, and it is no "Stand your Ground" City in a no "stand your ground" state...and that city has some of the strictest gun laws of any place in the nation and the gun crime beats out NYC, Detroit, and just about every other major metro area in our country. Two homicides in the Chicago-land area on New Years eve and 5 already this year http://homicides.redeyechicago.com/date/2013/1/ |
Homicides up 7% in Stand Your Ground States..
On Jan 3, 9:03*pm, Tim wrote:
Two homicides in the Chicago-land area on New Years eve and 5 already this year http://homicides.redeyechicago.com/date/2013/1/ I take that back. http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/l...,6730065.story |
Homicides up 7% in Stand Your Ground States..
On 1/3/13 10:03 PM, Tim wrote:
On Jan 3, 3:46 pm, ESAD wrote: Whatever the merits of "Stand Your Ground" laws, they appear to increase homicides by at least 7%, reports NPR. It cites a Texas A&M study of the 23 states that have enacted "Stand Your Ground" laws since 2005. Researchers looked at the homicide rate in those states pre- and post-law, as well as the rates of non-Stand Your Ground states. It determined between 500 and 700 additional homicides take place annually as a result. "These laws lower the cost of using lethal force," says Mark Hoekstra, the economist behind the study. "Our study finds that, as a result, you get more of it. Homicides go up by 7% to 9% in states that pass the laws." http://tinyurl.com/ah9gucl I dont' agree with the assesment- Chicago is a very "blue" city in a very 'blue' state, and it is no "Stand your Ground" City in a no "stand your ground" state...and that city has some of the strictest gun laws of any place in the nation and the gun crime beats out NYC, Detroit, and just about every other major metro area in our country. Two homicides in the Chicago-land area on New Years eve and 5 already this year http://homicides.redeyechicago.com/date/2013/1/ Which has nothing to do with the Texas A&M study. |
Homicides up 7% in Stand Your Ground States..
On Jan 4, 5:39*am, ESAD wrote:
On 1/3/13 10:03 PM, Tim wrote: On Jan 3, 3:46 pm, ESAD wrote: Whatever the merits of "Stand Your Ground" laws, they appear to increase homicides by at least 7%, reports NPR. It cites a Texas A&M study of the 23 states that have enacted "Stand Your Ground" laws since 2005. Researchers looked at the homicide rate in those states pre- and post-law, as well as the rates of non-Stand Your Ground states. It determined between 500 and 700 additional homicides take place annually as a result. "These laws lower the cost of using lethal force," says Mark Hoekstra, the economist behind the study. "Our study finds that, as a result, you get more of it. Homicides go up by 7% to 9% in states that pass the laws." http://tinyurl.com/ah9gucl I dont' agree with the assesment- Chicago is a very "blue" city in a very 'blue' state, and it is no "Stand your Ground" *City in a no "stand your ground" state...and that city has some of the strictest gun laws of any place in the nation and the gun crime beats out NYC, *Detroit, and just about every other major metro area in our country. Two homicides in the Chicago-land area on New Years eve and 5 already this year http://homicides.redeyechicago.com/date/2013/1/ Which has nothing to do with the Texas A&M study. And the Texas A&M study has nothing to do with a boating news group Neither does this for any matter- http://www.samharris.org/blog/item/t...dle-of-the-gun |
Homicides up 7% in Stand Your Ground States..
On 1/4/13 7:25 AM, Tim wrote:
On Jan 4, 5:39 am, ESAD wrote: On 1/3/13 10:03 PM, Tim wrote: On Jan 3, 3:46 pm, ESAD wrote: Whatever the merits of "Stand Your Ground" laws, they appear to increase homicides by at least 7%, reports NPR. It cites a Texas A&M study of the 23 states that have enacted "Stand Your Ground" laws since 2005. Researchers looked at the homicide rate in those states pre- and post-law, as well as the rates of non-Stand Your Ground states. It determined between 500 and 700 additional homicides take place annually as a result. "These laws lower the cost of using lethal force," says Mark Hoekstra, the economist behind the study. "Our study finds that, as a result, you get more of it. Homicides go up by 7% to 9% in states that pass the laws." http://tinyurl.com/ah9gucl I dont' agree with the assesment- Chicago is a very "blue" city in a very 'blue' state, and it is no "Stand your Ground" City in a no "stand your ground" state...and that city has some of the strictest gun laws of any place in the nation and the gun crime beats out NYC, Detroit, and just about every other major metro area in our country. Two homicides in the Chicago-land area on New Years eve and 5 already this year http://homicides.redeyechicago.com/date/2013/1/ Which has nothing to do with the Texas A&M study. And the Texas A&M study has nothing to do with a boating news group Neither do abo0ut 98% of the posts in this boating newsgroup. |
Homicides up 7% in Stand Your Ground States..
On Jan 3, 3:46*pm, ESAD wrote:
Whatever the merits of "Stand Your Ground" laws, they appear to increase homicides by at least 7%, reports NPR. It cites a Texas A&M study of the 23 states that have enacted "Stand Your Ground" laws since 2005. Researchers looked at the homicide rate in those states pre- and post-law, as well as the rates of non-Stand Your Ground states. It determined between 500 and 700 additional homicides take place annually as a result. "These laws lower the cost of using lethal force," says Mark Hoekstra, the economist behind the study. "Our study finds that, as a result, you get more of it. Homicides go up by 7% to 9% in states that pass the laws." http://tinyurl.com/ah9gucl You don't have to live in a Stand your Ground State to have an increase in gun crime... Chicago homicides are up 15 percent this year compared to the same period last year, according to RedEye data. Homicides were up 60 percent in March compared to 2011 but the rate has slowed since then. http://homicides.redeyechicago.com/#...ll-reaches-500 |
Homicides up 7% in Stand Your Ground States..
On Fri, 4 Jan 2013 04:37:29 -0800 (PST), Tim
wrote: You don't have to live in a Stand your Ground State to have an increase in gun crime... === The real issue is whether or not there is a demonstrable linkage between the "Stand Your Ground" laws and the increased homicide rate? - Are the homicides related to self defense situations, claimed or actual, i.e., justifiable homicide? - Is it possible that states with high or increasing homicide rates are more likely to enact Stand Your Ground legislation? I think that conceptually the stand your ground laws are a good thing, mainly because it takes some of the murkiness away from self defense situations. A person should not have to spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on legal defense expenses just because they chose to defend themselves against an attack. |
Homicides up 7% in Stand Your Ground States..
On Jan 4, 7:05*am, Wayne.B wrote:
On Fri, 4 Jan 2013 04:37:29 -0800 (PST), Tim wrote: You don't have to live in a Stand your Ground State to have an increase in gun crime... === The real issue is whether or not there is a demonstrable linkage between the "Stand Your Ground" laws and the increased homicide rate? - *Are the homicides related to self defense situations, claimed or actual, i.e., justifiable homicide? - Is it possible that states with high or increasing homicide rates are more likely to enact Stand Your Ground legislation? I think that conceptually the stand your ground laws are a good thing, mainly because it takes some of the murkiness away from self defense situations. * A person should not have to spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on legal defense expenses *just because they chose to defend themselves against an attack. agreed! |
Homicides up 7% in Stand Your Ground States..
And the Texas A&M study has nothing to do with a boating news group Neither do abo0ut 98% of the posts in this boating newsgroup. The 2% matters but your horse**** doesn't doesn't. Have you made enough to pay your tax bill yet? |
Homicides up 7% in Stand Your Ground States..
On 1/4/2013 4:25 AM, Tim wrote:
And the Texas A&M study has nothing to do with a boating news group Neither does this for any matter- http://www.samharris.org/blog/item/t...dle-of-the-gun Sam is a thoughtful and reasonable guy. I hope you've given all his writings equal consideration. |
Homicides up 7% in Stand Your Ground States..
On 1/4/13 12:33 PM, thumper wrote:
On 1/4/2013 4:25 AM, Tim wrote: And the Texas A&M study has nothing to do with a boating news group Neither does this for any matter- http://www.samharris.org/blog/item/t...dle-of-the-gun Sam is a thoughtful and reasonable guy. I hope you've given all his writings equal consideration. Sam is also a well-known atheist who has strong thoughts that are anti-religion. |
Homicides up 7% in Stand Your Ground States..
On Jan 4, 11:33*am, thumper wrote:
On 1/4/2013 4:25 AM, Tim wrote: And the Texas A&M study has nothing to do with a boating news group Neither does this for any matter- http://www.samharris.org/blog/item/t...dle-of-the-gun Sam is a thoughtful and reasonable guy. *I hope you've given all his writings equal consideration. I have on his firearm views.... |
Homicides up 7% in Stand Your Ground States..
On Jan 4, 5:50*pm, Boating All Out wrote:
"Where there's more guns and firepower, there's more gun deaths. Simple as that. If CCW and SYG states have more gun deaths, it's not because of CCW or SYG, it's because those states have more guns. Gun culture states. " Montana and the Dakota's have the fewest homicides and gun deaths of any state, but they also have the most gun ownership per capita than anywhere in the nation |
Homicides up 7% in Stand Your Ground States..
On 1/4/2013 4:51 PM, Tim wrote:
On Jan 4, 5:50 pm, Boating All Out wrote: "Where there's more guns and firepower, there's more gun deaths. Simple as that. If CCW and SYG states have more gun deaths, it's not because of CCW or SYG, it's because those states have more guns. Gun culture states. " Montana and the Dakota's have the fewest homicides and gun deaths of any state, but they also have the most gun ownership per capita than anywhere in the nation 2011 state firearm murders/100K LA 10.16 MS 7.46 SC 5.41 ND 0.93 MT 0.76 SD 0.68 RI 0.57 NH 0.53 HI 0.07 |
Homicides up 7% in Stand Your Ground States..
On 1/4/2013 6:50 PM, Boating All Out wrote:
In article , lid says... On 1/4/2013 4:25 AM, Tim wrote: And the Texas A&M study has nothing to do with a boating news group Neither does this for any matter- http://www.samharris.org/blog/item/t...dle-of-the-gun Sam is a thoughtful and reasonable guy. I hope you've given all his writings equal consideration. Real slick gun nut. "But, unlike my friends, I own several guns and train with them regularly. Every month or two, I spend a full day shooting with a highly qualified instructor. This is an expensive and time-consuming habit, but I view it as part of my responsibility as a gun owner." This guy's mind is grounded in fear - and guns. He should be a cop or join a para-military group. Shows a revolver as the article graphic. How many of his "several guns" are high cap mag Glocks or other semi- autos? Maybe a Bushmaster waiting for somebody to take it away from his scared sorry ass after capping him? "According to Gallup, 16 percent of American men carry knives for personal protection......" ****ing moron. He believes that? He's a typical gun nut, scared, obsessed with his guns, and can't see the forest for the trees. Otherwise he wouldn't be obsessing on guns and bull**** about guns. Here's how it works. Where there's more guns and firepower, there's more gun deaths. Simple as that. If CCW and SYG states have more gun deaths, it's not because of CCW or SYG, it's because those states have more guns. Gun culture states. If this guy was simply concerned about defending his home, he'd get a cheap revolver or shotgun and put them somewhere he could get to them. A good revolver or shotgun if he wants. Spend a day at the range. That's all anybody but a moron needs to get good enough with a gun. If he travels where his fear gets the best of him, get a CCW and carry. That's it. He can do it. Nobody's stopping him. Then he'd just shut the **** up about guns. But nooooo, he writes loads of gun nuttery to justify his gun fetish. This guy is just another gun nut, justifying assault rifles, equating guns with knives and box cutters, talking about how you you don't need a gun to do mass murder, blah ****ing blah. Oh, and he is so concerned about "the children." Asshole. He said NOTHING that couldn't come straight from the NRA. His basic answer to gun deaths is "more guns." And then there's his dog whistling about "liberals,' like liberals aren't gun nuts too. Like Krause. Waaaaaahhhhh LOL! |
Homicides up 7% in Stand Your Ground States..
On 1/4/13 10:51 PM, thumper wrote:
On 1/4/2013 4:51 PM, Tim wrote: On Jan 4, 5:50 pm, Boating All Out wrote: "Where there's more guns and firepower, there's more gun deaths. Simple as that. If CCW and SYG states have more gun deaths, it's not because of CCW or SYG, it's because those states have more guns. Gun culture states. " Montana and the Dakota's have the fewest homicides and gun deaths of any state, but they also have the most gun ownership per capita than anywhere in the nation 2011 state firearm murders/100K LA 10.16 MS 7.46 SC 5.41 ND 0.93 MT 0.76 SD 0.68 RI 0.57 NH 0.53 HI 0.07 American Gun Deaths to Exceed Traffic Fatalities by 2015 By Chris Christoff and Ilan Kolet on December 19, 2012 Guns and cars have long been among the leading causes of non-medical deaths in the U.S. By 2015, firearm fatalities will probably exceed traffic fatalities for the first time, based on data compiled by Bloomberg. While motor-vehicle deaths dropped 22 percent from 2005 to 2010, gun fatalities are rising again after a low point in 2000, according to the Atlanta-based Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. Shooting deaths in 2015 will probably rise to almost 33,000, and those related to autos will decline to about 32,000, based on the 10-year average trend. As the nation reels from the massacre at Sandy Hook Elementary School, the shift shows the effects of public policy, said Garen Wintemute, director of the Violence Prevention Research Program at the University of California, Davis. The fall in traffic deaths resulted from safer vehicles, restricted privileges for young drivers and seat-belt and other laws, he said. By contrast, “we’ve made policy decisions that have had the impact of making the widest array of firearms available to the widest array of people under the widest array of conditions.” While fewer households have guns, people who own guns are buying more of them, he said. The Dec. 14 slaying of 20 children and six adults at the school in Newtown, Connecticut, reignited a debate over gun violence. While mass murders are rare, shootings aren’t. About 85 Americans are shot dead daily -- 53 of them suicides. Every day, one of those killed by firearms is 14 or younger. ‘Game Changer’ Of the total, the CDC data show, 16 are between the ages of 15 and 24, mostly homicide victims. Wintemute said more than 200 people go to U.S. emergency rooms every day with gunshot wounds. Gun deaths by homicide, suicide or accident peaked at 37,666 in 1993 before declining to a low of 28,393 in 2000, the data show. Since then the total has risen to 31,328 in 2010, an increase of 2,935, or eight more victims a day. At the same time, violent crime and murder rates have fallen in the U.S., said Daniel Webster, director of the Johns Hopkins University Center for Gun Policy and Research in Baltimore. Homicides may be up this year, though the murder rate from 2006 to 2011 fell 19 percent, to 4.7 for every 100,000 people, Webster said in an e-mail. While recent gun sales haven’t led to an increase in crime, research indicates that over time, higher levels of gun ownership are associated with increased rates of homicide and suicide, Webster said. The Sandy Hook killings are a “potential game changer” for gun-control laws and the response to it unlike any incident he’s seen in 20 years of studying gun violence, he said. Police Crackdowns “We haven’t had a year like 2012 for mass shootings before, with each one being more disturbing than the last,” Webster said. “It’s harder to chalk this up to random acts than to flaws in our gun laws.” The drop in gun deaths since 1993 may be a result of less violence from drug trafficking, more people incarcerated and more police crackdowns on illegal firearms, according to both Webster and Wintemute. The percentage of gun-owning households has fallen since 2004 to 32 percent in 2010, according to the General Social Survey by NORC at the University of Chicago. The survey indicates at least 1.8 firearms per household, or at least 70 million in households nationwide, said Tom Smith, the survey’s principal investigator. Safer Driving It’s impossible to verify how many guns are owned legally or illegally, Webster said. A survey eight years ago pegged the number of firearms around 300 million, he said. Traffic fatalities in 2011 were the lowest since 1949, according to the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration. Although drivers in the U.S. logged fewer miles than in 2010, the fatality rate was the lowest on record, 1.1 deaths for each 100 million vehicle miles driven. There were 53,524 motor-vehicle deaths in 1979, compared with a projected 33,975 this year, according to the data compiled by Bloomberg. “In the past several decades, we’ve seen remarkable improvements in both the way motorists behave on our roadways and in the safety of the vehicles they drive,” according to a Dec. 10 statement by the agency. http://tinyurl.com/bmygqym |
Homicides up 7% in Stand Your Ground States..
In article ,
says... In article , lid says... On 1/4/2013 4:25 AM, Tim wrote: And the Texas A&M study has nothing to do with a boating news group Neither does this for any matter- http://www.samharris.org/blog/item/t...dle-of-the-gun Sam is a thoughtful and reasonable guy. I hope you've given all his writings equal consideration. Real slick gun nut. "But, unlike my friends, I own several guns and train with them regularly. Every month or two, I spend a full day shooting with a highly qualified instructor. This is an expensive and time-consuming habit, but I view it as part of my responsibility as a gun owner." This guy's mind is grounded in fear - and guns. He should be a cop or join a para-military group. Shows a revolver as the article graphic. How many of his "several guns" are high cap mag Glocks or other semi- autos? Maybe a Bushmaster waiting for somebody to take it away from his scared sorry ass after capping him? "According to Gallup, 16 percent of American men carry knives for personal protection......" ****ing moron. He believes that? He's a typical gun nut, scared, obsessed with his guns, and can't see the forest for the trees. Otherwise he wouldn't be obsessing on guns and bull**** about guns. Here's how it works. Where there's more guns and firepower, there's more gun deaths. Simple as that. If CCW and SYG states have more gun deaths, it's not because of CCW or SYG, it's because those states have more guns. Gun culture states. If this guy was simply concerned about defending his home, he'd get a cheap revolver or shotgun and put them somewhere he could get to them. A good revolver or shotgun if he wants. Spend a day at the range. That's all anybody but a moron needs to get good enough with a gun. If he travels where his fear gets the best of him, get a CCW and carry. That's it. He can do it. Nobody's stopping him. Then he'd just shut the **** up about guns. But nooooo, he writes loads of gun nuttery to justify his gun fetish. This guy is just another gun nut, justifying assault rifles, equating guns with knives and box cutters, talking about how you you don't need a gun to do mass murder, blah ****ing blah. Oh, and he is so concerned about "the children." Asshole. He said NOTHING that couldn't come straight from the NRA. His basic answer to gun deaths is "more guns." And then there's his dog whistling about "liberals,' like liberals aren't gun nuts too. Like Krause. The NRA gun nuts don't realize there are other ways to protect yourself than with weapons. To them there is only one thing, guns, more guns and bigger guns. |
Homicides up 7% in Stand Your Ground States..
In article 7df1bb04-f742-4b23-84b5-8e7f16506555
@w3g2000yqj.googlegroups.com, says... On Jan 4, 5:50*pm, Boating All Out wrote: "Where there's more guns and firepower, there's more gun deaths. Simple as that. If CCW and SYG states have more gun deaths, it's not because of CCW or SYG, it's because those states have more guns. Gun culture states. " Montana and the Dakota's have the fewest homicides and gun deaths of any state, but they also have the most gun ownership per capita than anywhere in the nation I agree, more guns, more gun deaths. Wouldn't the reverse be true then? Less guns, less gun deaths. Seems a pretty simple solution to me! |
Homicides up 7% in Stand Your Ground States..
In article , says...
On 1/4/2013 6:50 PM, Boating All Out wrote: In article , lid says... On 1/4/2013 4:25 AM, Tim wrote: And the Texas A&M study has nothing to do with a boating news group Neither does this for any matter- http://www.samharris.org/blog/item/t...dle-of-the-gun Sam is a thoughtful and reasonable guy. I hope you've given all his writings equal consideration. Real slick gun nut. "But, unlike my friends, I own several guns and train with them regularly. Every month or two, I spend a full day shooting with a highly qualified instructor. This is an expensive and time-consuming habit, but I view it as part of my responsibility as a gun owner." This guy's mind is grounded in fear - and guns. He should be a cop or join a para-military group. Shows a revolver as the article graphic. How many of his "several guns" are high cap mag Glocks or other semi- autos? Maybe a Bushmaster waiting for somebody to take it away from his scared sorry ass after capping him? "According to Gallup, 16 percent of American men carry knives for personal protection......" ****ing moron. He believes that? He's a typical gun nut, scared, obsessed with his guns, and can't see the forest for the trees. Otherwise he wouldn't be obsessing on guns and bull**** about guns. Here's how it works. Where there's more guns and firepower, there's more gun deaths. Simple as that. If CCW and SYG states have more gun deaths, it's not because of CCW or SYG, it's because those states have more guns. Gun culture states. If this guy was simply concerned about defending his home, he'd get a cheap revolver or shotgun and put them somewhere he could get to them. A good revolver or shotgun if he wants. Spend a day at the range. That's all anybody but a moron needs to get good enough with a gun. If he travels where his fear gets the best of him, get a CCW and carry. That's it. He can do it. Nobody's stopping him. Then he'd just shut the **** up about guns. But nooooo, he writes loads of gun nuttery to justify his gun fetish. This guy is just another gun nut, justifying assault rifles, equating guns with knives and box cutters, talking about how you you don't need a gun to do mass murder, blah ****ing blah. Oh, and he is so concerned about "the children." Asshole. He said NOTHING that couldn't come straight from the NRA. His basic answer to gun deaths is "more guns." And then there's his dog whistling about "liberals,' like liberals aren't gun nuts too. Like Krause. Waaaaaahhhhh LOL! Wow, what an informative intelligent reply. Now go lock-step to FOX. |
Homicides up 7% in Stand Your Ground States..
iBoaterer wrote:
In article 7df1bb04-f742-4b23-84b5-8e7f16506555 @w3g2000yqj.googlegroups.com, says... On Jan 4, 5:50 pm, Boating All Out wrote: "Where there's more guns and firepower, there's more gun deaths. Simple as that. If CCW and SYG states have more gun deaths, it's not because of CCW or SYG, it's because those states have more guns. Gun culture states. " Montana and the Dakota's have the fewest homicides and gun deaths of any state, but they also have the most gun ownership per capita than anywhere in the nation I agree, more guns, more gun deaths. Wouldn't the reverse be true then? Less guns, less gun deaths. Seems a pretty simple solution to me! It's not simple. |
Homicides up 7% in Stand Your Ground States..
On 1/5/2013 10:33 PM, Earl wrote:
iBoaterer wrote: In article 7df1bb04-f742-4b23-84b5-8e7f16506555 @w3g2000yqj.googlegroups.com, says... On Jan 4, 5:50 pm, Boating All Out wrote: "Where there's more guns and firepower, there's more gun deaths. Simple as that. If CCW and SYG states have more gun deaths, it's not because of CCW or SYG, it's because those states have more guns. Gun culture states. " Montana and the Dakota's have the fewest homicides and gun deaths of any state, but they also have the most gun ownership per capita than anywhere in the nation I agree, more guns, more gun deaths. Wouldn't the reverse be true then? Less guns, less gun deaths. Seems a pretty simple solution to me! It's not simple. He just said that because it suits his agenda. |
Homicides up 7% in Stand Your Ground States..
In article , says...
On 1/5/2013 10:33 PM, Earl wrote: iBoaterer wrote: In article 7df1bb04-f742-4b23-84b5-8e7f16506555 @w3g2000yqj.googlegroups.com, says... On Jan 4, 5:50 pm, Boating All Out wrote: "Where there's more guns and firepower, there's more gun deaths. Simple as that. If CCW and SYG states have more gun deaths, it's not because of CCW or SYG, it's because those states have more guns. Gun culture states. " Montana and the Dakota's have the fewest homicides and gun deaths of any state, but they also have the most gun ownership per capita than anywhere in the nation I agree, more guns, more gun deaths. Wouldn't the reverse be true then? Less guns, less gun deaths. Seems a pretty simple solution to me! It's not simple. He just said that because it suits his agenda. He just said that because, unlike your stupid bull****, it's FACT. |
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