On Tue, 18 Dec 2012 16:47:34 -0500, wrote:

I keep hearing about these closed mental hospitals but most were
actually closed because civil rights and privacy advocates took away
all of the patients. It is very hard to keep someone in a mental
hospital after 72 hours if they want to go.

There is a guy around the corner from me who has been "Baker acted" at
least 30 times in the last 10 years (hauled away by the cops and put
in for observation). Sometimes he goes into rehab for a few weeks on
our dime, he calls it the spa, but most of the time he is home after
a few days.

Even court ordered (non-criminal) commitments can easily be vacated if
the patient files a "show cause" motion and there are lots of "rights"
groups who will file the motion for you.


There are at least three large mental health facilities with forensic
wards in your state of Florida. My wife did her internship at one of
them, a 650-bed facility. At the time she worked there, there were
several hundred persons resident who had been committed for substantial
or even indeterminate terms as a result of serious, violent criminal
activities in which they had engaged.

Your "guy around the corner" sounds like someone who is a drug addict
and who gets out of control but is not judged a threat to others. A
"Baker Act" commitment is for 72 hours, after which a judge determines
if cause can be demonstrated for a longer commitment. If not, as is
usually the case, the individual is released.

Most communities these days simply don't have out-patient treatment
available for the indigent, so they end up hospitalized.

On 12/19/2012 9:46 AM, ESAD wrote:

On Tue, 18 Dec 2012 16:47:34 -0500, wrote:

I keep hearing about these closed mental hospitals but most were
actually closed because civil rights and privacy advocates took away
all of the patients. It is very hard to keep someone in a mental
hospital after 72 hours if they want to go.

There is a guy around the corner from me who has been "Baker acted" at
least 30 times in the last 10 years (hauled away by the cops and put
in for observation). Sometimes he goes into rehab for a few weeks on
our dime, he calls it the spa, but most of the time he is home after
a few days.

Even court ordered (non-criminal) commitments can easily be vacated if
the patient files a "show cause" motion and there are lots of "rights"
groups who will file the motion for you.


There are at least three large mental health facilities with forensic
wards in your state of Florida. My wife did her internship at one of
them, a 650-bed facility. At the time she worked there, there were
several hundred persons resident who had been committed for substantial
or even indeterminate terms as a result of serious, violent criminal
activities in which they had engaged.

Your "guy around the corner" sounds like someone who is a drug addict
and who gets out of control but is not judged a threat to others. A
"Baker Act" commitment is for 72 hours, after which a judge determines
if cause can be demonstrated for a longer commitment. If not, as is
usually the case, the individual is released.

Most communities these days simply don't have out-patient treatment
available for the indigent, so they end up hospitalized.



She'd have to be a real bruiser to be assigned that sort of duty.

In article ,
says...

On Tue, 18 Dec 2012 16:47:34 -0500, wrote:

I keep hearing about these closed mental hospitals but most were
actually closed because civil rights and privacy advocates took away
all of the patients. It is very hard to keep someone in a mental
hospital after 72 hours if they want to go.

There is a guy around the corner from me who has been "Baker acted" at
least 30 times in the last 10 years (hauled away by the cops and put
in for observation). Sometimes he goes into rehab for a few weeks on
our dime, he calls it the spa, but most of the time he is home after
a few days.

Even court ordered (non-criminal) commitments can easily be vacated if
the patient files a "show cause" motion and there are lots of "rights"
groups who will file the motion for you.


There are at least three large mental health facilities with forensic
wards in your state of Florida. My wife did her internship at one of
them, a 650-bed facility. At the time she worked there, there were
several hundred persons resident who had been committed for substantial
or even indeterminate terms as a result of serious, violent criminal
activities in which they had engaged.

The assumption is that your wife met you at one of these mental
hospitals or during a group therapy session where you were a mandatory
attendee.

Your "guy around the corner" sounds like someone who is a drug addict
and who gets out of control but is not judged a threat to others. A
"Baker Act" commitment is for 72 hours, after which a judge determines
if cause can be demonstrated for a longer commitment. If not, as is
usually the case, the individual is released.

Thirty times in 10 years is a pattern. The guy is not right in the head.

Most communities these days simply don't have out-patient treatment
available for the indigent, so they end up hospitalized.

Maybe if you paid your taxes the government could afford to run in-
patient facilities.

wrote:
On Thu, 20 Dec 2012 07:38:18 -0500, BAR wrote:

Your "guy around the corner" sounds like someone who is a drug addict
and who gets out of control but is not judged a threat to others. A
"Baker Act" commitment is for 72 hours, after which a judge determines
if cause can be demonstrated for a longer commitment. If not, as is
usually the case, the individual is released.

Thirty times in 10 years is a pattern. The guy is not right in the head.

The cops have been there three times in the last 2 days and left
without him every time.
I don't think anything will be done until he kills someone or one of
my neighbors shoots him.
The seven years was up and he just got his driver's license back after
felony DUI so it will probably be someone on the road who gets it with
his pickup.

I guess the real question is exactly what you do. I don't think anyone
has actually been "cured" of mental illness. They can drug the people
into a compliant stupor but as soon as they stop taking the drug, they
are back to crazy, maybe even worse than before. The drugs also seem
to lose effectiveness over the years.
Are we really talking about a gulag mentality where they round up all
the people someone thinks are "mentally ill" and lock them up?

"Outpatient services" is really just a drug dispensary and the problem
is the patients are not real good about taking their drugs.

You are grossly overstating the problems here. Many mental illnesses can be
controlled with therapy and sometimes with therapy and medications. You are
giving the impression that if you have a mental illness your outlook is
forever dim. Many people with mental illnesses Are creative and productive
members of society. Your prejudices are really out there.

ESAD wrote:
wrote:
On Thu, 20 Dec 2012 07:38:18 -0500, BAR wrote:

Your "guy around the corner" sounds like someone who is a drug addict
and who gets out of control but is not judged a threat to others. A
"Baker Act" commitment is for 72 hours, after which a judge determines
if cause can be demonstrated for a longer commitment. If not, as is
usually the case, the individual is released.
Thirty times in 10 years is a pattern. The guy is not right in the head.
The cops have been there three times in the last 2 days and left
without him every time.
I don't think anything will be done until he kills someone or one of
my neighbors shoots him.
The seven years was up and he just got his driver's license back after
felony DUI so it will probably be someone on the road who gets it with
his pickup.

I guess the real question is exactly what you do. I don't think anyone
has actually been "cured" of mental illness. They can drug the people
into a compliant stupor but as soon as they stop taking the drug, they
are back to crazy, maybe even worse than before. The drugs also seem
to lose effectiveness over the years.
Are we really talking about a gulag mentality where they round up all
the people someone thinks are "mentally ill" and lock them up?

"Outpatient services" is really just a drug dispensary and the problem
is the patients are not real good about taking their drugs.
You are grossly overstating the problems here. Many mental illnesses can be
controlled with therapy and sometimes with therapy and medications. You are
giving the impression that if you have a mental illness your outlook is
forever dim. Many people with mental illnesses Are creative and productive
members of society. Your prejudices are really out there.
You are speaking about mental illness? Let me ask this: does extreme
narcissism limit/prevent your ability to pay taxes or are you just a
narcissist and, an unrelated, deadbeat?

On 12/20/12 5:16 PM, wrote:
On 20 Dec 2012 18:44:56 GMT, ESAD wrote:

wrote:
On Thu, 20 Dec 2012 07:38:18 -0500, BAR wrote:

Your "guy around the corner" sounds like someone who is a drug addict
and who gets out of control but is not judged a threat to others. A
"Baker Act" commitment is for 72 hours, after which a judge determines
if cause can be demonstrated for a longer commitment. If not, as is
usually the case, the individual is released.

Thirty times in 10 years is a pattern. The guy is not right in the head.

The cops have been there three times in the last 2 days and left
without him every time.
I don't think anything will be done until he kills someone or one of
my neighbors shoots him.
The seven years was up and he just got his driver's license back after
felony DUI so it will probably be someone on the road who gets it with
his pickup.

I guess the real question is exactly what you do. I don't think anyone
has actually been "cured" of mental illness. They can drug the people
into a compliant stupor but as soon as they stop taking the drug, they
are back to crazy, maybe even worse than before. The drugs also seem
to lose effectiveness over the years.
Are we really talking about a gulag mentality where they round up all
the people someone thinks are "mentally ill" and lock them up?

"Outpatient services" is really just a drug dispensary and the problem
is the patients are not real good about taking their drugs.

You are grossly overstating the problems here. Many mental illnesses can be
controlled with therapy and sometimes with therapy and medications. You are
giving the impression that if you have a mental illness your outlook is
forever dim. Many people with mental illnesses Are creative and productive
members of society. Your prejudices are really out there.

I am just looking at the actual results.
For every successful treatment there are dozens if not hundreds of
people who either end up in jail, terrorizing their neighbors or
living under a bridge.


What an interesting statistic. Do you have a source for it? I won't
argue that our system treats the indigent mentally ill well, because it
doesn't. That is part of the price one pays for living in a country
where profit is more important than people.