I know by their postings that many conservatives here don't have a clue
what true liberalism is about. Harry doesn't have a clue, neither. So,
to clear things up, from Wiki:

Liberalism (from the Latin liberalis, "of freedom")[1] is the belief in
the importance of liberty and equal rights.[2] Liberals espouse a wide
array of views depending on their understanding of these principles, but
generally, liberals support ideas such as constitutionalism, liberal
democracy, free and fair elections, human rights, capitalism, and
freedom of religion.[3][4][5][6][7] These ideas are widely accepted,
even by political groups that do not openly profess a liberal
ideological orientation. Liberalism encompasses several intellectual
trends and traditions, but the dominant variants are classical
liberalism, which became popular in the eighteenth century, and social
liberalism, which became popular in the twentieth century.

Liberalism first became a powerful force in the Age of Enlightenment,
rejecting several foundational assumptions that dominated most earlier
theories of government, such as nobility, established religion, absolute
monarchy, and the Divine Right of Kings. The early liberal thinker John
Locke, who is often credited for the creation of liberalism as a
distinct philosophical tradition, employed the concept of natural rights
and the social contract to argue that the rule of law should replace
absolutism in government, that rulers were subject to the consent of the
governed, and that private individuals had a fundamental right to life,
liberty, and property.

The revolutionaries in the American Revolution and the French Revolution
used liberal philosophy to justify the armed overthrow of tyrannical
rule. The nineteenth century saw liberal governments established in
nations across Europe, Latin America, and North America. Liberal ideas
spread even further in the twentieth century, when liberal democracies
triumphed in two world wars and survived major ideological challenges
from fascism and communism. Today, liberalism in its many forms remains
as a political force to varying degrees of power and influence on all
major continents.

On 10/24/2011 12:39 PM, iBoaterer wrote:
I know by their postings that many conservatives here don't have a clue
what true liberalism is about. Harry doesn't have a clue, neither. So,
to clear things up, from Wiki:

Liberalism (from the Latin liberalis, "of freedom")[1] is the belief in
the importance of liberty and equal rights.[2] Liberals espouse a wide
array of views depending on their understanding of these principles, but
generally, liberals support ideas such as constitutionalism, liberal
democracy, free and fair elections, human rights, capitalism, and
freedom of religion.[3][4][5][6][7] These ideas are widely accepted,
even by political groups that do not openly profess a liberal
ideological orientation. Liberalism encompasses several intellectual
trends and traditions, but the dominant variants are classical
liberalism, which became popular in the eighteenth century, and social
liberalism, which became popular in the twentieth century.

Liberalism first became a powerful force in the Age of Enlightenment,
rejecting several foundational assumptions that dominated most earlier
theories of government, such as nobility, established religion, absolute
monarchy, and the Divine Right of Kings. The early liberal thinker John
Locke, who is often credited for the creation of liberalism as a
distinct philosophical tradition, employed the concept of natural rights
and the social contract to argue that the rule of law should replace
absolutism in government, that rulers were subject to the consent of the
governed, and that private individuals had a fundamental right to life,
liberty, and property.

The revolutionaries in the American Revolution and the French Revolution
used liberal philosophy to justify the armed overthrow of tyrannical
rule. The nineteenth century saw liberal governments established in
nations across Europe, Latin America, and North America. Liberal ideas
spread even further in the twentieth century, when liberal democracies
triumphed in two world wars and survived major ideological challenges
from fascism and communism. Today, liberalism in its many forms remains
as a political force to varying degrees of power and influence on all
major continents.



Hmmm. Maybe that's why Harry changed his stripes to Progressive.

In article om,
says...

On 10/24/2011 12:39 PM, iBoaterer wrote:
I know by their postings that many conservatives here don't have a clue
what true liberalism is about. Harry doesn't have a clue, neither. So,
to clear things up, from Wiki:

Liberalism (from the Latin liberalis, "of freedom")[1] is the belief in
the importance of liberty and equal rights.[2] Liberals espouse a wide
array of views depending on their understanding of these principles, but
generally, liberals support ideas such as constitutionalism, liberal
democracy, free and fair elections, human rights, capitalism, and
freedom of religion.[3][4][5][6][7] These ideas are widely accepted,
even by political groups that do not openly profess a liberal
ideological orientation. Liberalism encompasses several intellectual
trends and traditions, but the dominant variants are classical
liberalism, which became popular in the eighteenth century, and social
liberalism, which became popular in the twentieth century.

Liberalism first became a powerful force in the Age of Enlightenment,
rejecting several foundational assumptions that dominated most earlier
theories of government, such as nobility, established religion, absolute
monarchy, and the Divine Right of Kings. The early liberal thinker John
Locke, who is often credited for the creation of liberalism as a
distinct philosophical tradition, employed the concept of natural rights
and the social contract to argue that the rule of law should replace
absolutism in government, that rulers were subject to the consent of the
governed, and that private individuals had a fundamental right to life,
liberty, and property.

The revolutionaries in the American Revolution and the French Revolution
used liberal philosophy to justify the armed overthrow of tyrannical
rule. The nineteenth century saw liberal governments established in
nations across Europe, Latin America, and North America. Liberal ideas
spread even further in the twentieth century, when liberal democracies
triumphed in two world wars and survived major ideological challenges
from fascism and communism. Today, liberalism in its many forms remains
as a political force to varying degrees of power and influence on all
major continents.



Hmmm. Maybe that's why Harry changed his stripes to Progressive.

Harry is just Harry, he wants the government to run his life for him,
tell him when to go to the doctor, and when to wipe his ass. He's not a
liberal in the true sense. Not even close.

On 24/10/2011 10:39 AM, iBoaterer wrote:
I know by their postings that many conservatives here don't have a clue
what true liberalism is about. Harry doesn't have a clue, neither. So,
to clear things up, from Wiki:

Liberalism (from the Latin liberalis, "of freedom")[1] is the belief in
the importance of liberty and equal rights.[2] Liberals espouse a wide
array of views depending on their understanding of these principles, but
generally, liberals support ideas such as constitutionalism, liberal
democracy, free and fair elections, human rights, capitalism, and
freedom of religion.[3][4][5][6][7] These ideas are widely accepted,
even by political groups that do not openly profess a liberal
ideological orientation. Liberalism encompasses several intellectual
trends and traditions, but the dominant variants are classical
liberalism, which became popular in the eighteenth century, and social
liberalism, which became popular in the twentieth century.

Liberalism first became a powerful force in the Age of Enlightenment,
rejecting several foundational assumptions that dominated most earlier
theories of government, such as nobility, established religion, absolute
monarchy, and the Divine Right of Kings. The early liberal thinker John
Locke, who is often credited for the creation of liberalism as a
distinct philosophical tradition, employed the concept of natural rights
and the social contract to argue that the rule of law should replace
absolutism in government, that rulers were subject to the consent of the
governed, and that private individuals had a fundamental right to life,
liberty, and property.

The revolutionaries in the American Revolution and the French Revolution
used liberal philosophy to justify the armed overthrow of tyrannical
rule. The nineteenth century saw liberal governments established in
nations across Europe, Latin America, and North America. Liberal ideas
spread even further in the twentieth century, when liberal democracies
triumphed in two world wars and survived major ideological challenges
from fascism and communism. Today, liberalism in its many forms remains
as a political force to varying degrees of power and influence on all
major continents.

By that definition then there are no liberals nor liberalism.

Today's people who call themselves liberals and liberal-socialists are
about discarding conservative values. No need to develop and invest in
ones self, save, invest, just whine and entitlement. Envy others for
their wealth not asking the obvious, how come they don't go out and work
for some of their own.

Equal rights also means I should be able to save and invest without my
liberal-socialist neighbor wanting to tax me for my success and reward
him for his failure. It includes economics and economic liberty from
debt-tax slavery.

Nope, liberal socialism is about discarding the conservative values that
made America great and rewarding losers that wallow in greed, envy and
whine.

Greedy *******s mortgaging our kids and gand kids with their selfishness
of "just more debt" today.

"In Debt We Trust!"
- 0bama and the new American liberal-socialist way.
--
Eat the rich, screw the companies and wonder why there are no jobs. But
we have big huge government we can't afford...
-- Obama and the lefty fleabagger attitude

On 10/24/11 2:56 PM, Canuck57 wrote:
On 24/10/2011 10:39 AM, iBoaterer wrote:
I know by their postings that many conservatives here don't have a clue
what true liberalism is about. Harry doesn't have a clue, neither. So,
to clear things up, from Wiki:

Liberalism (from the Latin liberalis, "of freedom")[1] is the belief in
the importance of liberty and equal rights.[2] Liberals espouse a wide
array of views depending on their understanding of these principles, but
generally, liberals support ideas such as constitutionalism, liberal
democracy, free and fair elections, human rights, capitalism, and
freedom of religion.[3][4][5][6][7] These ideas are widely accepted,
even by political groups that do not openly profess a liberal
ideological orientation. Liberalism encompasses several intellectual
trends and traditions, but the dominant variants are classical
liberalism, which became popular in the eighteenth century, and social
liberalism, which became popular in the twentieth century.

Liberalism first became a powerful force in the Age of Enlightenment,
rejecting several foundational assumptions that dominated most earlier
theories of government, such as nobility, established religion, absolute
monarchy, and the Divine Right of Kings. The early liberal thinker John
Locke, who is often credited for the creation of liberalism as a
distinct philosophical tradition, employed the concept of natural rights
and the social contract to argue that the rule of law should replace
absolutism in government, that rulers were subject to the consent of the
governed, and that private individuals had a fundamental right to life,
liberty, and property.

The revolutionaries in the American Revolution and the French Revolution
used liberal philosophy to justify the armed overthrow of tyrannical
rule. The nineteenth century saw liberal governments established in
nations across Europe, Latin America, and North America. Liberal ideas
spread even further in the twentieth century, when liberal democracies
triumphed in two world wars and survived major ideological challenges
from fascism and communism. Today, liberalism in its many forms remains
as a political force to varying degrees of power and influence on all
major continents.

By that definition then there are no liberals nor liberalism.

Today's people who call themselves liberals and liberal-socialists are
about discarding conservative values.

There are no conservative values beyond greed and a stated belief in
Christianity and, once stated, mostly ignored. I know this because I
watched several of the recent GOP nominee debates, and I never heard any
of the candidates espouse anything beyond simple-minded bumpersticker
slogans.

On 10/24/2011 3:00 PM, X ` Man wrote:
On 10/24/11 2:56 PM, Canuck57 wrote:
On 24/10/2011 10:39 AM, iBoaterer wrote:
I know by their postings that many conservatives here don't have a clue
what true liberalism is about. Harry doesn't have a clue, neither. So,
to clear things up, from Wiki:

Liberalism (from the Latin liberalis, "of freedom")[1] is the belief in
the importance of liberty and equal rights.[2] Liberals espouse a wide
array of views depending on their understanding of these principles, but
generally, liberals support ideas such as constitutionalism, liberal
democracy, free and fair elections, human rights, capitalism, and
freedom of religion.[3][4][5][6][7] These ideas are widely accepted,
even by political groups that do not openly profess a liberal
ideological orientation. Liberalism encompasses several intellectual
trends and traditions, but the dominant variants are classical
liberalism, which became popular in the eighteenth century, and social
liberalism, which became popular in the twentieth century.

Liberalism first became a powerful force in the Age of Enlightenment,
rejecting several foundational assumptions that dominated most earlier
theories of government, such as nobility, established religion, absolute
monarchy, and the Divine Right of Kings. The early liberal thinker John
Locke, who is often credited for the creation of liberalism as a
distinct philosophical tradition, employed the concept of natural rights
and the social contract to argue that the rule of law should replace
absolutism in government, that rulers were subject to the consent of the
governed, and that private individuals had a fundamental right to life,
liberty, and property.

The revolutionaries in the American Revolution and the French Revolution
used liberal philosophy to justify the armed overthrow of tyrannical
rule. The nineteenth century saw liberal governments established in
nations across Europe, Latin America, and North America. Liberal ideas
spread even further in the twentieth century, when liberal democracies
triumphed in two world wars and survived major ideological challenges
from fascism and communism. Today, liberalism in its many forms remains
as a political force to varying degrees of power and influence on all
major continents.

By that definition then there are no liberals nor liberalism.

Today's people who call themselves liberals and liberal-socialists are
about discarding conservative values.

There are no conservative values beyond greed and a stated belief in
Christianity and, once stated, mostly ignored. I know this because I
watched several of the recent GOP nominee debates, and I never heard any
of the candidates espouse anything beyond simple-minded bumpersticker
slogans.

Like "hope and change" or "yes we can" Don't knock stupid slogans. They
worked for one clown.

On 24/10/2011 2:51 PM, Drifter wrote:
On 10/24/2011 3:00 PM, X ` Man wrote:
On 10/24/11 2:56 PM, Canuck57 wrote:
On 24/10/2011 10:39 AM, iBoaterer wrote:
I know by their postings that many conservatives here don't have a clue
what true liberalism is about. Harry doesn't have a clue, neither. So,
to clear things up, from Wiki:

Liberalism (from the Latin liberalis, "of freedom")[1] is the belief in
the importance of liberty and equal rights.[2] Liberals espouse a wide
array of views depending on their understanding of these principles,
but
generally, liberals support ideas such as constitutionalism, liberal
democracy, free and fair elections, human rights, capitalism, and
freedom of religion.[3][4][5][6][7] These ideas are widely accepted,
even by political groups that do not openly profess a liberal
ideological orientation. Liberalism encompasses several intellectual
trends and traditions, but the dominant variants are classical
liberalism, which became popular in the eighteenth century, and social
liberalism, which became popular in the twentieth century.

Liberalism first became a powerful force in the Age of Enlightenment,
rejecting several foundational assumptions that dominated most earlier
theories of government, such as nobility, established religion,
absolute
monarchy, and the Divine Right of Kings. The early liberal thinker John
Locke, who is often credited for the creation of liberalism as a
distinct philosophical tradition, employed the concept of natural
rights
and the social contract to argue that the rule of law should replace
absolutism in government, that rulers were subject to the consent of
the
governed, and that private individuals had a fundamental right to life,
liberty, and property.

The revolutionaries in the American Revolution and the French
Revolution
used liberal philosophy to justify the armed overthrow of tyrannical
rule. The nineteenth century saw liberal governments established in
nations across Europe, Latin America, and North America. Liberal ideas
spread even further in the twentieth century, when liberal democracies
triumphed in two world wars and survived major ideological challenges
from fascism and communism. Today, liberalism in its many forms remains
as a political force to varying degrees of power and influence on all
major continents.

By that definition then there are no liberals nor liberalism.

Today's people who call themselves liberals and liberal-socialists are
about discarding conservative values.

There are no conservative values beyond greed and a stated belief in
Christianity and, once stated, mostly ignored. I know this because I
watched several of the recent GOP nominee debates, and I never heard any
of the candidates espouse anything beyond simple-minded bumpersticker
slogans.

Like "hope and change" or "yes we can" Don't knock stupid slogans. They
worked for one clown.

0bama is hopeless and a chance. Depends if you donated money or not.
--
Eat the rich, screw the companies and wonder why there are no jobs. But
we have big huge government we can't afford...
-- Obama and the lefty fleabagger attitude

In article om,
says...

On 10/24/2011 3:00 PM, X ` Man wrote:
On 10/24/11 2:56 PM, Canuck57 wrote:
On 24/10/2011 10:39 AM, iBoaterer wrote:
I know by their postings that many conservatives here don't have a clue
what true liberalism is about. Harry doesn't have a clue, neither. So,
to clear things up, from Wiki:

Liberalism (from the Latin liberalis, "of freedom")[1] is the belief in
the importance of liberty and equal rights.[2] Liberals espouse a wide
array of views depending on their understanding of these principles, but
generally, liberals support ideas such as constitutionalism, liberal
democracy, free and fair elections, human rights, capitalism, and
freedom of religion.[3][4][5][6][7] These ideas are widely accepted,
even by political groups that do not openly profess a liberal
ideological orientation. Liberalism encompasses several intellectual
trends and traditions, but the dominant variants are classical
liberalism, which became popular in the eighteenth century, and social
liberalism, which became popular in the twentieth century.

Liberalism first became a powerful force in the Age of Enlightenment,
rejecting several foundational assumptions that dominated most earlier
theories of government, such as nobility, established religion, absolute
monarchy, and the Divine Right of Kings. The early liberal thinker John
Locke, who is often credited for the creation of liberalism as a
distinct philosophical tradition, employed the concept of natural rights
and the social contract to argue that the rule of law should replace
absolutism in government, that rulers were subject to the consent of the
governed, and that private individuals had a fundamental right to life,
liberty, and property.

The revolutionaries in the American Revolution and the French Revolution
used liberal philosophy to justify the armed overthrow of tyrannical
rule. The nineteenth century saw liberal governments established in
nations across Europe, Latin America, and North America. Liberal ideas
spread even further in the twentieth century, when liberal democracies
triumphed in two world wars and survived major ideological challenges
from fascism and communism. Today, liberalism in its many forms remains
as a political force to varying degrees of power and influence on all
major continents.

By that definition then there are no liberals nor liberalism.

Today's people who call themselves liberals and liberal-socialists are
about discarding conservative values.

There are no conservative values beyond greed and a stated belief in
Christianity and, once stated, mostly ignored. I know this because I
watched several of the recent GOP nominee debates, and I never heard any
of the candidates espouse anything beyond simple-minded bumpersticker
slogans.

Like "hope and change" or "yes we can" Don't knock stupid slogans. They
worked for one clown.

Yeah, they did. "Mission Accomplished".

"iBoaterer" wrote in message
...


Like "hope and change" or "yes we can" Don't knock stupid slogans. They
worked for one clown.

Yeah, they did. "Mission Accomplished".

--------------------------------------------------

This myth keeps being perpetuated by the media and those who like to bash
Bush as if he was declaring the end of the war in Iraq.

The "Mission Accomplished" banner displayed on the USS Abraham Lincoln had
nothing to do with Iraq, despite what the media
and Bush haters would like to believe.

US Naval ships often deploy on long term "cruises" that typically last for
4-6 months or more away from their home port.
Each of these cruises have a specific "mission". The mission is unique to
the ship or the task force that it is part of.

Navy tradition includes a celebration of sorts by the ship (or task force)
to acknowledge that their specific, unique "Mission" has come to
an end and the ship(s) are returning to their home ports and families. On
smaller ships tradition often includes mounting a broom
upside down somewhere on the mast to indicate a "clean sweep" in the
performance of the unique cruise or mission.

When Bush visited the Abraham Lincoln, the aircraft carrier had just been
relieved by another carrier and was on it's way
back to it's home port. The "Mission Accomplished" banner on the ship was
in celebration of the end of it's specific cruise
and not the end of the Iraq war.

Eisboch (10 year Navy veteran)

On 24/10/2011 1:00 PM, X ` Man wrote:
On 10/24/11 2:56 PM, Canuck57 wrote:
On 24/10/2011 10:39 AM, iBoaterer wrote:
I know by their postings that many conservatives here don't have a clue
what true liberalism is about. Harry doesn't have a clue, neither. So,
to clear things up, from Wiki:

Liberalism (from the Latin liberalis, "of freedom")[1] is the belief in
the importance of liberty and equal rights.[2] Liberals espouse a wide
array of views depending on their understanding of these principles, but
generally, liberals support ideas such as constitutionalism, liberal
democracy, free and fair elections, human rights, capitalism, and
freedom of religion.[3][4][5][6][7] These ideas are widely accepted,
even by political groups that do not openly profess a liberal
ideological orientation. Liberalism encompasses several intellectual
trends and traditions, but the dominant variants are classical
liberalism, which became popular in the eighteenth century, and social
liberalism, which became popular in the twentieth century.

Liberalism first became a powerful force in the Age of Enlightenment,
rejecting several foundational assumptions that dominated most earlier
theories of government, such as nobility, established religion, absolute
monarchy, and the Divine Right of Kings. The early liberal thinker John
Locke, who is often credited for the creation of liberalism as a
distinct philosophical tradition, employed the concept of natural rights
and the social contract to argue that the rule of law should replace
absolutism in government, that rulers were subject to the consent of the
governed, and that private individuals had a fundamental right to life,
liberty, and property.

The revolutionaries in the American Revolution and the French Revolution
used liberal philosophy to justify the armed overthrow of tyrannical
rule. The nineteenth century saw liberal governments established in
nations across Europe, Latin America, and North America. Liberal ideas
spread even further in the twentieth century, when liberal democracies
triumphed in two world wars and survived major ideological challenges
from fascism and communism. Today, liberalism in its many forms remains
as a political force to varying degrees of power and influence on all
major continents.

By that definition then there are no liberals nor liberalism.

Today's people who call themselves liberals and liberal-socialists are
about discarding conservative values.

There are no conservative values beyond greed and a stated belief in
Christianity and, once stated, mostly ignored. I know this because I
watched several of the recent GOP nominee debates, and I never heard any
of the candidates espouse anything beyond simple-minded bumpersticker
slogans.

Funny, Rosanne Barr is a liberal religious nut ball, so are the Osmonds.
Religion has fanatics on both sides.

But agree, GOP could tone down the religious crap a bit. But I suspect
it is the liberal urinalism egging it on.

But 0bama is like a bad poker hand, even some democrats know when to quit.
--
Eat the rich, screw the companies and wonder why there are no jobs. But
we have big huge government we can't afford...
-- Obama and the lefty fleabagger attitude