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Propane canister from hell
On Jun 14, 11:01*pm, Wayne B wrote:
On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 19:26:59 -0700, wrote: But he's out cruising the Bahamas so he's doing something right. Yes, that's laudable, but he also doesn't appear to completely have his sh*t together either. Fixing things with what you have on hand and dealing with the unexpected are all part of international cruising, sometimes a big part. *The big mega yacht cruisers are maintained to a very high degree of reliability but they generally have an engineer in the crew and a big supply of spares on hand to keep things working. * Since we bought the trawler 7 years ago I've learned enough new skills, and acquired the tools, to be a junior tradesman in 3 or 4 different fields. 3% propane in air (by volume) is explosive. Think about that when you think of the size of your bilge and consider that concentration can rise quickly becaus eof the density of the propane. Then consider that when it explodes the gas then takes up 270X the volume of the previous air/propane mixture and you can see it can make a big explosion for a small amount of propane. A small leaking cylinder is a major safety hazard requiring immediate action. Even a few minutes of a leaking cylinder can turn your boat into a bomb. By volume propane is more explosive than gasoline and is explosive over a wider range of concentration so is more dangerous than gasoline vapor. You may not want to admit I am right but if thinking about it keeps you from storing a canister on your boat then I am happy. |
Propane canister from hell
"Frogwatch" wrote in message
... On Jun 14, 11:01 pm, Wayne B wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 19:26:59 -0700, wrote: But he's out cruising the Bahamas so he's doing something right. Yes, that's laudable, but he also doesn't appear to completely have his sh*t together either. Fixing things with what you have on hand and dealing with the unexpected are all part of international cruising, sometimes a big part. The big mega yacht cruisers are maintained to a very high degree of reliability but they generally have an engineer in the crew and a big supply of spares on hand to keep things working. Since we bought the trawler 7 years ago I've learned enough new skills, and acquired the tools, to be a junior tradesman in 3 or 4 different fields. 3% propane in air (by volume) is explosive. Think about that when you think of the size of your bilge and consider that concentration can rise quickly becaus eof the density of the propane. Then consider that when it explodes the gas then takes up 270X the volume of the previous air/propane mixture and you can see it can make a big explosion for a small amount of propane. A small leaking cylinder is a major safety hazard requiring immediate action. Even a few minutes of a leaking cylinder can turn your boat into a bomb. By volume propane is more explosive than gasoline and is explosive over a wider range of concentration so is more dangerous than gasoline vapor. You may not want to admit I am right but if thinking about it keeps you from storing a canister on your boat then I am happy. Reply: For those who think a 16 oz. container is not much, think how much you can cook on a 2 burner Coleman stove with just one canister. Or how long a propane lantern sheds light for with a single cartridge. |
Propane canister from hell
On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 19:54:31 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch
wrote: On Jun 14, 10:28*pm, North Star wrote: On Jun 14, 11:24*pm, wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 15:10:49 -0700 (PDT), North Star wrote: On Jun 14, 5:22*pm, Frogwatch wrote: On Jun 14, 4:12*pm, Richard Casady wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 12:49:49 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: On Jun 14, 3:38*pm, wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 15:07:16 -0400, iBoat wrote: In article 4789ce48-54a7-4d7a-8dc5- , says... On Jun 14, 2:30 pm, I_am_Tosk wrote: In article , says... In article , says... On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 10:08:51 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: On Jun 14, 1:05 pm, wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 09:04:40 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: Thinking about my wayward dinghy caused me to remember another wandering object on one of my recent Bahamas trips. I had finished cooking on the magma grill (spoiled crew demanded warm mac and cheese) and tried removing the 3/4 full propane canister. Once removed, it was leaking propane, uh oh. No way this thing is staying aboard. I cannot leave it on the grill cuz it is choppy and the grill has to be stowed. After considering various options, I decided littering was the safest one so I simply threw it overboard and settled down to do some reading. A bit later, "Thunk, Thunk, WTF?", I go outside and look down and there's the canister bumping on the hull so I fished it out with the crab net. This time, I really heave it far away and go to bed. Yeah, you guessed right, middle of the night, "Thunk, Thunk", tide had carried it right back to me. Realizing I'm gonna have to get serious about this, I pull out the tide tables and turn on a light eliciting lots of complaints from sleeping crew but I find the tide will be running out in an hour. So, I wait up till then and finally get rid of the canister but never did get back to sleep waiting for the "Thunk, Thunk" again. Why didn't you just slowly open it up down wind, let it empty, then tie it up outside overnight? No wind. Seems like there would be something. None at all? All night? How about tying a weight to it and the boat, then opening the valve... it would sink down current of your boat, bubble along, then you could pull it back in. I thought boaters were all about creative thinking? Yeah, take all night to come up with a scheme to get rid of a little propane gas...... brilliant. Progressive "thinkers".. How much weight do you suppose it would take to sink a half full tank? snerk... -- Team Rowdy Mouse, Banned from the Mall for life! People on the west coast have no idea how glassy still the Gulf of Mexico can get. *When holding a leaking canister aboard a boat, time is critical lest the heavy propane get in your bilge. *Even holding it over the side leaking could be dangerous. *In this case, safety takes precedence over not littering. Let alone the fact that it's heavier than air and will fill a boat cabin in a heartbeat. Wow... you guys call yourselves sailors? How about closing up the boat. Isn't that what you're supposed to do when you gas up? Sheesh... and I don't know diddly about boats. Good Gawd, don't be so anal y'all. *I take the grill off the stern rail because if there is any chop it could fall overboard. *It was a very still night but chop can happen in a few minutes. Getting the canister below surface would not stop it from leaking near my boat and propane could get aboard. *Safety requires you get rid of it ASAP. *Sinking it even "just below the surface" would require several pounds of weight and unless I want to sacrifice some wrenches, I cannot think of anything that would sink it and as I just pointed out, sinking it does not stop it from leaking. *BTW, physics says enough to sink it "just below the surface" is the same as "all the way to the bottom" at least in shallow water. Hazard to navigation? *WHAT? *In a few hours, it will be empty and you think a small propane canister is a hazard to nav? *Be serious. I don't consider it boating, more like cave diving, far too risky, but they sell hundred mile per hour boats. You would hit with four hundred times the impact energy at 100 as you would at 5, with, say, a sailboat. Such a boat might be badly, even fatally, damaged. Less farfetched, I would not care to pay the possible repairs to the sterndrive on my starcraft. Casady If yer worried about a 16 oz canister, are you more worried about the logs floating around out there from the rivers?- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - 16 oz canister?? I envisioned a 10 lb propane tank...... the kind we carried on my buddy's Mirage 33. That's the normal size, right? The kind people connect to their stove? That's what I was originally thinking he had, but no, it's some tiny container for little bbq.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Normal home BBQ's use the 20 lb size. You might see the smaller 10s on small tent trailers or older sailboats. MY god, do any of you ever see accident reports? A 16 oz propane container has enough explosive potential to sink a large boat. You can make quite an explosion by putting a few seconds worth of the propane in a bag and igniting it. YES, I truly do mean the coleman stove size canisters. I also know from experience that a few mg of calcium carbide in water will produce a mega explosion if the acetylene is allowed to accumulate. Propane is almost as dangerous. Clearly none of you has any experience with fuel air explosions. The amount of ignorance exhibited here is astonishing and dangerous. All you have to do is google propane boat accidents to see. Come on. This has nothing to do with the scenario you described... a slow leak from a 16oz container, with no ability to concentrate fumes. You're going to tell us that propane, a heavier than air gas, is going to run back up the current, then back up the sides of your boat.. what 3 feet off the water? Then, get below and go boom. On which planet do you sail.. Jupiter? |
Propane canister from hell
On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 20:34:25 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch
wrote: On Jun 14, 11:01*pm, Wayne B wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 19:26:59 -0700, wrote: But he's out cruising the Bahamas so he's doing something right. Yes, that's laudable, but he also doesn't appear to completely have his sh*t together either. Fixing things with what you have on hand and dealing with the unexpected are all part of international cruising, sometimes a big part. *The big mega yacht cruisers are maintained to a very high degree of reliability but they generally have an engineer in the crew and a big supply of spares on hand to keep things working. * Since we bought the trawler 7 years ago I've learned enough new skills, and acquired the tools, to be a junior tradesman in 3 or 4 different fields. 3% propane in air (by volume) is explosive. Think about that when you think of the size of your bilge and consider that concentration can rise quickly becaus eof the density of the propane. Then consider that when it explodes the gas then takes up 270X the volume of the previous air/propane mixture and you can see it can make a big explosion for a small amount of propane. A small leaking cylinder is a major safety hazard requiring immediate action. Even a few minutes of a leaking cylinder can turn your boat into a bomb. By volume propane is more explosive than gasoline and is explosive over a wider range of concentration so is more dangerous than gasoline vapor. You may not want to admit I am right but if thinking about it keeps you from storing a canister on your boat then I am happy. How is said propane supposed to get in your bilge from below the water and down current? I'm still waiting for your answer. If it's so deadly, why did you worry about it coming back up current after you tossed it? |
Propane canister from hell
On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 21:38:13 -0700, "Califbill"
wrote: "Frogwatch" wrote in message ... On Jun 14, 11:01 pm, Wayne B wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 19:26:59 -0700, wrote: But he's out cruising the Bahamas so he's doing something right. Yes, that's laudable, but he also doesn't appear to completely have his sh*t together either. Fixing things with what you have on hand and dealing with the unexpected are all part of international cruising, sometimes a big part. The big mega yacht cruisers are maintained to a very high degree of reliability but they generally have an engineer in the crew and a big supply of spares on hand to keep things working. Since we bought the trawler 7 years ago I've learned enough new skills, and acquired the tools, to be a junior tradesman in 3 or 4 different fields. 3% propane in air (by volume) is explosive. Think about that when you think of the size of your bilge and consider that concentration can rise quickly becaus eof the density of the propane. Then consider that when it explodes the gas then takes up 270X the volume of the previous air/propane mixture and you can see it can make a big explosion for a small amount of propane. A small leaking cylinder is a major safety hazard requiring immediate action. Even a few minutes of a leaking cylinder can turn your boat into a bomb. By volume propane is more explosive than gasoline and is explosive over a wider range of concentration so is more dangerous than gasoline vapor. You may not want to admit I am right but if thinking about it keeps you from storing a canister on your boat then I am happy. Reply: For those who think a 16 oz. container is not much, think how much you can cook on a 2 burner Coleman stove with just one canister. Or how long a propane lantern sheds light for with a single cartridge. And, think about how long it'll last if the valve is open in 10 feet of water.. 5 minutes maybe? I'm still waiting for him to justify his inane response to a simple problem. |
Propane canister from hell
In article ,
says... On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 19:26:59 -0700, wrote: But he's out cruising the Bahamas so he's doing something right. Yes, that's laudable, but he also doesn't appear to completely have his sh*t together either. Fixing things with what you have on hand and dealing with the unexpected are all part of international cruising, sometimes a big part. The big mega yacht cruisers are maintained to a very high degree of reliability but they generally have an engineer in the crew and a big supply of spares on hand to keep things working. Since we bought the trawler 7 years ago I've learned enough new skills, and acquired the tools, to be a junior tradesman in 3 or 4 different fields. Plum is just trolling. Look how many answers she has gotten just by calling the same name over and over again.... dumb... -- Team Rowdy Mouse, Banned from the Mall for life! |
Propane canister from hell
On 6/14/11 11:01 PM, Wayne B wrote:
On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 19:26:59 -0700, wrote: But he's out cruising the Bahamas so he's doing something right. Yes, that's laudable, but he also doesn't appear to completely have his sh*t together either. Fixing things with what you have on hand and dealing with the unexpected are all part of international cruising, sometimes a big part. The big mega yacht cruisers are maintained to a very high degree of reliability but they generally have an engineer in the crew and a big supply of spares on hand to keep things working. Since we bought the trawler 7 years ago I've learned enough new skills, and acquired the tools, to be a junior tradesman in 3 or 4 different fields. Spending most of one's time on a boat fixing what lack of proper maintenance caused is fun for some people, I guess. If you are retired and therefore your time isn't valuable, wasting a lot of it trying to get a generator, engine, refrigeration unit, transmission, et cetera, working may be part of "international cruising," as you say, and which means I'd never enjoy being an "international cruiser." Whatever floats your boat. -- Want to discuss recreational boating and fishing in a forum where personal insults are not allowed? http://groups.google.com/group/rec-boating-fishing |
Propane canister from hell
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Propane canister from hell
In article ,
says... On 6/14/11 11:01 PM, Wayne B wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 19:26:59 -0700, wrote: But he's out cruising the Bahamas so he's doing something right. Yes, that's laudable, but he also doesn't appear to completely have his sh*t together either. Fixing things with what you have on hand and dealing with the unexpected are all part of international cruising, sometimes a big part. The big mega yacht cruisers are maintained to a very high degree of reliability but they generally have an engineer in the crew and a big supply of spares on hand to keep things working. Since we bought the trawler 7 years ago I've learned enough new skills, and acquired the tools, to be a junior tradesman in 3 or 4 different fields. Spending most of one's time on a boat fixing what lack of proper maintenance caused is fun for some people, I guess. If you are retired and therefore your time isn't valuable, wasting a lot of it trying to get a generator, engine, refrigeration unit, transmission, et cetera, working may be part of "international cruising," as you say, and which means I'd never enjoy being an "international cruiser." Whatever floats your boat. Who gives a **** what YOU would or would not enjoy? Go back to your own fantastic group. |
Propane canister from hell
On Jun 15, 8:24*am, iBoat wrote:
In article , says... On 6/14/11 11:01 PM, Wayne B wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 19:26:59 -0700, wrote: But he's out cruising the Bahamas so he's doing something right. Yes, that's laudable, but he also doesn't appear to completely have his sh*t together either. Fixing things with what you have on hand and dealing with the unexpected are all part of international cruising, sometimes a big part. *The big mega yacht cruisers are maintained to a very high degree of reliability but they generally have an engineer in the crew and a big supply of spares on hand to keep things working. Since we bought the trawler 7 years ago I've learned enough new skills, and acquired the tools, to be a junior tradesman in 3 or 4 different fields. Spending most of one's time on a boat fixing what lack of proper maintenance caused is fun for some people, I guess. If you are retired and therefore your time isn't valuable, wasting a lot of it trying to get a generator, engine, refrigeration unit, transmission, et cetera, working may be part of "international cruising," as you say, and which means I'd never enjoy being an "international cruiser." Whatever floats your boat. Who gives a **** what YOU would or would not enjoy? Go back to your own fantastic group. Why does plum seem to think that putting the canister in water affects its release of gas? 10' of water is only 5.2 psi diff. Yes, a cloud of gas will rise above the water. Most sailboats, mine included have cockpit drains close to the water thru which gas can rise meaning a rise of only about 3' to get in the boat. Plum seems to have a basic misunderstanding of the simplest physical concepts. |
Propane canister from hell
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Propane canister from hell
On Jun 15, 10:56*am, I_am_Tosk
wrote: In article 61bf9a6f-2085-4fe0-8a3d-de56b62dbe10 @z33g2000yqb.googlegroups.com, says... On Jun 15, 8:24 am, iBoat wrote: In article , says... On 6/14/11 11:01 PM, Wayne B wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 19:26:59 -0700, wrote: But he's out cruising the Bahamas so he's doing something right.. Yes, that's laudable, but he also doesn't appear to completely have his sh*t together either. Fixing things with what you have on hand and dealing with the unexpected are all part of international cruising, sometimes a big part. The big mega yacht cruisers are maintained to a very high degree of reliability but they generally have an engineer in the crew and a big supply of spares on hand to keep things working. Since we bought the trawler 7 years ago I've learned enough new skills, and acquired the tools, to be a junior tradesman in 3 or 4 different fields. Spending most of one's time on a boat fixing what lack of proper maintenance caused is fun for some people, I guess. If you are retired and therefore your time isn't valuable, wasting a lot of it trying to get a generator, engine, refrigeration unit, transmission, et cetera, working may be part of "international cruising," as you say, and which means I'd never enjoy being an "international cruiser." Whatever floats your boat. Who gives a **** what YOU would or would not enjoy? Go back to your own fantastic group. Why does plum seem to think that putting the canister in water affects its release of gas? *10' of water is only 5.2 psi diff. *Yes, a cloud of gas will rise above the water. *Most sailboats, mine included have cockpit drains close to the water thru which gas can rise meaning a rise of only about 3' to get in the boat. *Plum seems to have *a basic misunderstanding of the simplest physical concepts. She is just trolling you... you are giving her what she wants, attention... We all get it, and so does she... -- Team Rowdy Mouse, Banned from the Mall for life! Tosk: I agree, yer right, subject closed. |
Propane canister from hell
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Propane canister from hell
On Wed, 15 Jun 2011 07:54:44 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch
wrote: On Jun 15, 8:24*am, iBoat wrote: In article , says... On 6/14/11 11:01 PM, Wayne B wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 19:26:59 -0700, wrote: But he's out cruising the Bahamas so he's doing something right. Yes, that's laudable, but he also doesn't appear to completely have his sh*t together either. Fixing things with what you have on hand and dealing with the unexpected are all part of international cruising, sometimes a big part. *The big mega yacht cruisers are maintained to a very high degree of reliability but they generally have an engineer in the crew and a big supply of spares on hand to keep things working. Since we bought the trawler 7 years ago I've learned enough new skills, and acquired the tools, to be a junior tradesman in 3 or 4 different fields. Spending most of one's time on a boat fixing what lack of proper maintenance caused is fun for some people, I guess. If you are retired and therefore your time isn't valuable, wasting a lot of it trying to get a generator, engine, refrigeration unit, transmission, et cetera, working may be part of "international cruising," as you say, and which means I'd never enjoy being an "international cruiser." Whatever floats your boat. Who gives a **** what YOU would or would not enjoy? Go back to your own fantastic group. Why does plum seem to think that putting the canister in water affects its release of gas? 10' of water is only 5.2 psi diff. Yes, a cloud of gas will rise above the water. Most sailboats, mine included have cockpit drains close to the water thru which gas can rise meaning a rise of only about 3' to get in the boat. Plum seems to have a basic misunderstanding of the simplest physical concepts. Come on! You're talking about a miniscule amount of gas, that would easily dissipate no where near your boat. You're just trying to justify your panicky reaction. You're a joke! |
Propane canister from hell
On Wed, 15 Jun 2011 08:52:16 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch
wrote: On Jun 15, 10:56*am, I_am_Tosk wrote: In article 61bf9a6f-2085-4fe0-8a3d-de56b62dbe10 @z33g2000yqb.googlegroups.com, says... On Jun 15, 8:24 am, iBoat wrote: In article , says... On 6/14/11 11:01 PM, Wayne B wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 19:26:59 -0700, wrote: But he's out cruising the Bahamas so he's doing something right. Yes, that's laudable, but he also doesn't appear to completely have his sh*t together either. Fixing things with what you have on hand and dealing with the unexpected are all part of international cruising, sometimes a big part. The big mega yacht cruisers are maintained to a very high degree of reliability but they generally have an engineer in the crew and a big supply of spares on hand to keep things working. Since we bought the trawler 7 years ago I've learned enough new skills, and acquired the tools, to be a junior tradesman in 3 or 4 different fields. Spending most of one's time on a boat fixing what lack of proper maintenance caused is fun for some people, I guess. If you are retired and therefore your time isn't valuable, wasting a lot of it trying to get a generator, engine, refrigeration unit, transmission, et cetera, working may be part of "international cruising," as you say, and which means I'd never enjoy being an "international cruiser." Whatever floats your boat. Who gives a **** what YOU would or would not enjoy? Go back to your own fantastic group. Why does plum seem to think that putting the canister in water affects its release of gas? *10' of water is only 5.2 psi diff. *Yes, a cloud of gas will rise above the water. *Most sailboats, mine included have cockpit drains close to the water thru which gas can rise meaning a rise of only about 3' to get in the boat. *Plum seems to have *a basic misunderstanding of the simplest physical concepts. She is just trolling you... you are giving her what she wants, attention... We all get it, and so does she... -- Team Rowdy Mouse, Banned from the Mall for life! Tosk: I agree, yer right, subject closed. Yep... another coward who can't even justify his own post. Feel free to run and hide. |
Propane canister from hell
In article ,
says... On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 19:24:51 -0700, wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 15:10:49 -0700 (PDT), North Star wrote: On Jun 14, 5:22*pm, Frogwatch wrote: On Jun 14, 4:12*pm, Richard Casady wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 12:49:49 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: On Jun 14, 3:38*pm, wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 15:07:16 -0400, iBoat wrote: In article 4789ce48-54a7-4d7a-8dc5- , says... On Jun 14, 2:30 pm, I_am_Tosk wrote: In article , says... In article , says... On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 10:08:51 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: On Jun 14, 1:05 pm, wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 09:04:40 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: Thinking about my wayward dinghy caused me to remember another wandering object on one of my recent Bahamas trips. I had finished cooking on the magma grill (spoiled crew demanded warm mac and cheese) and tried removing the 3/4 full propane canister. Once removed, it was leaking propane, uh oh. No way this thing is staying aboard. I cannot leave it on the grill cuz it is choppy and the grill has to be stowed. After considering various options, I decided littering was the safest one so I simply threw it overboard and settled down to do some reading. A bit later, "Thunk, Thunk, WTF?", I go outside and look down and there's the canister bumping on the hull so I fished it out with the crab net. This time, I really heave it far away and go to bed. Yeah, you guessed right, middle of the night, "Thunk, Thunk", tide had carried it right back to me. Realizing I'm gonna have to get serious about this, I pull out the tide tables and turn on a light eliciting lots of complaints from sleeping crew but I find the tide will be running out in an hour. So, I wait up till then and finally get rid of the canister but never did get back to sleep waiting for the "Thunk, Thunk" again. Why didn't you just slowly open it up down wind, let it empty, then tie it up outside overnight? No wind. Seems like there would be something. None at all? All night? How about tying a weight to it and the boat, then opening the valve... it would sink down current of your boat, bubble along, then you could pull it back in. I thought boaters were all about creative thinking? Yeah, take all night to come up with a scheme to get rid of a little propane gas...... brilliant. Progressive "thinkers".. How much weight do you suppose it would take to sink a half full tank? snerk... -- Team Rowdy Mouse, Banned from the Mall for life! People on the west coast have no idea how glassy still the Gulf of Mexico can get. *When holding a leaking canister aboard a boat, time is critical lest the heavy propane get in your bilge. *Even holding it over the side leaking could be dangerous. *In this case, safety takes precedence over not littering. Let alone the fact that it's heavier than air and will fill a boat cabin in a heartbeat. Wow... you guys call yourselves sailors? How about closing up the boat. Isn't that what you're supposed to do when you gas up? Sheesh... and I don't know diddly about boats. Good Gawd, don't be so anal y'all. *I take the grill off the stern rail because if there is any chop it could fall overboard. *It was a very still night but chop can happen in a few minutes. Getting the canister below surface would not stop it from leaking near my boat and propane could get aboard. *Safety requires you get rid of it ASAP. *Sinking it even "just below the surface" would require several pounds of weight and unless I want to sacrifice some wrenches, I cannot think of anything that would sink it and as I just pointed out, sinking it does not stop it from leaking. *BTW, physics says enough to sink it "just below the surface" is the same as "all the way to the bottom" at least in shallow water. Hazard to navigation? *WHAT? *In a few hours, it will be empty and you think a small propane canister is a hazard to nav? *Be serious. I don't consider it boating, more like cave diving, far too risky, but they sell hundred mile per hour boats. You would hit with four hundred times the impact energy at 100 as you would at 5, with, say, a sailboat. Such a boat might be badly, even fatally, damaged. Less farfetched, I would not care to pay the possible repairs to the sterndrive on my starcraft. Casady If yer worried about a 16 oz canister, are you more worried about the logs floating around out there from the rivers?- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - 16 oz canister?? I envisioned a 10 lb propane tank...... the kind we carried on my buddy's Mirage 33. That's the normal size, right? The kind people connect to their stove? That's what I was originally thinking he had, but no, it's some tiny container for little bbq. The normal size is five gallons or twenty pounds. Tiny disposable 14 ounce cans are for soldering, not cooking. Casady Guess you never saw a Magma stove, eh? http://compare.ebay.com/like/190537311893? var=noa&sort=BestMatch&clk_rvr_id=240682281683 |
Propane canister from hell
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Propane canister from hell
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Propane canister from hell
On Wed, 15 Jun 2011 15:42:54 -0400, iBoat wrote:
In article , says... On Wed, 15 Jun 2011 07:54:44 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: On Jun 15, 8:24*am, iBoat wrote: In article , says... On 6/14/11 11:01 PM, Wayne B wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 19:26:59 -0700, wrote: But he's out cruising the Bahamas so he's doing something right. Yes, that's laudable, but he also doesn't appear to completely have his sh*t together either. Fixing things with what you have on hand and dealing with the unexpected are all part of international cruising, sometimes a big part. *The big mega yacht cruisers are maintained to a very high degree of reliability but they generally have an engineer in the crew and a big supply of spares on hand to keep things working. Since we bought the trawler 7 years ago I've learned enough new skills, and acquired the tools, to be a junior tradesman in 3 or 4 different fields. Spending most of one's time on a boat fixing what lack of proper maintenance caused is fun for some people, I guess. If you are retired and therefore your time isn't valuable, wasting a lot of it trying to get a generator, engine, refrigeration unit, transmission, et cetera, working may be part of "international cruising," as you say, and which means I'd never enjoy being an "international cruiser." Whatever floats your boat. Who gives a **** what YOU would or would not enjoy? Go back to your own fantastic group. Why does plum seem to think that putting the canister in water affects its release of gas? 10' of water is only 5.2 psi diff. Yes, a cloud of gas will rise above the water. Most sailboats, mine included have cockpit drains close to the water thru which gas can rise meaning a rise of only about 3' to get in the boat. Plum seems to have a basic misunderstanding of the simplest physical concepts. Come on! You're talking about a miniscule amount of gas, that would easily dissipate no where near your boat. You're just trying to justify your panicky reaction. You're a joke! Bull****. Gas can and will re-condense into a pool in the bottom of a boat. Why do you think that with inboards you run the fan before you attempt to start it? So you're saying that out in the ocean in a small sailboat that you'd take chances like that? Harry would have nothing to do with you, he's afraid of his own shadow! Key words, "at the bottom of the boat." This has nothing to do with either my post or his. Good grief, learn to read. |
Propane canister from hell
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Propane canister from hell
On Wed, 15 Jun 2011 17:36:42 -0400, Wayne B
wrote: On Wed, 15 Jun 2011 11:44:06 -0700, wrote: Come on! You're talking about a miniscule amount of gas, that would easily dissipate no where near your boat. You're just trying to justify your panicky reaction. With all due respect, your reaction and responses are totally inappropriate. Propane is extremely explosive and quite deadly to boats and people in small quantities. The only acceptable level of risk is zero, and the only acceptable location for a leaking cylinder is somewhere else. You have no business posting advice or opinions on a boating group since you have no knowledge of boats to impart. With all due respect, what I said was totally appropriate. Frog over reacted and could easily have dealt with the situation without polluting the environment with a metal canister. He could have attached the can to his spare anchor (he has one right?), and dumped on the down current side of the boat. Then, any out-gassing would have moved with the current and away from his boat. He claims that it was leaking, so it couldn't have been full. He then goes on the claim that a wading pool is somehow equivalent to an entire ocean. Further, he claims that the gas would somehow migrate UP into his boat through various holes, then migrate UP some more to finally get into the cabin. Finally, you claim that I post off-topic and you don't like it. When I post something that's on topic, you don't like it and try to slam me for doing so. You're a hypocrite and not even good at hiding it. If you're so upset by me, why are you so concerned? Why don't you just ignore me like you ignore anything else that doesn't fit into your tiny little box of what is and what isn't acceptable? Frog has yet to address the quite valid responses and suggestions I made. If he were a real sailor, he would learn from his mistakes and accept the criticism. Obviously neither you nor he can do that. |
Propane canister from hell
On 6/15/2011 5:49 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 15 Jun 2011 17:36:42 -0400, Wayne B wrote: On Wed, 15 Jun 2011 11:44:06 -0700, wrote: Come on! You're talking about a miniscule amount of gas, that would easily dissipate no where near your boat. You're just trying to justify your panicky reaction. With all due respect, your reaction and responses are totally inappropriate. Propane is extremely explosive and quite deadly to boats and people in small quantities. The only acceptable level of risk is zero, and the only acceptable location for a leaking cylinder is somewhere else. You have no business posting advice or opinions on a boating group since you have no knowledge of boats to impart. With all due respect, what I said was totally appropriate. Frog over reacted and could easily have dealt with the situation without polluting the environment with a metal canister. He could have attached the can to his spare anchor (he has one right?), and dumped on the down current side of the boat. Then, any out-gassing would have moved with the current and away from his boat. He claims that it was leaking, so it couldn't have been full. He then goes on the claim that a wading pool is somehow equivalent to an entire ocean. Further, he claims that the gas would somehow migrate UP into his boat through various holes, then migrate UP some more to finally get into the cabin. Finally, you claim that I post off-topic and you don't like it. When I post something that's on topic, you don't like it and try to slam me for doing so. You're a hypocrite and not even good at hiding it. If you're so upset by me, why are you so concerned? Why don't you just ignore me like you ignore anything else that doesn't fit into your tiny little box of what is and what isn't acceptable? Frog has yet to address the quite valid responses and suggestions I made. If he were a real sailor, he would learn from his mistakes and accept the criticism. Obviously neither you nor he can do that. Some one struck a raw nerve, I see. Poor baby. Get over it. Or better yet, feel free to get out. |
Propane canister from hell
North Star wrote:
On Jun 14, 1:04 pm, wrote: Thinking about my wayward dinghy caused me to remember another wandering object on one of my recent Bahamas trips. I had finished cooking on the magma grill (spoiled crew demanded warm mac and cheese) and tried removing the 3/4 full propane canister. Once removed, it was leaking propane, uh oh. No way this thing is staying aboard. I cannot leave it on the grill cuz it is choppy and the grill has to be stowed. After considering various options, I decided littering was the safest one so I simply threw it overboard and settled down to do some reading. A bit later, "Thunk, Thunk, WTF?", I go outside and look down and there's the canister bumping on the hull so I fished it out with the crab net. This time, I really heave it far away and go to bed. Yeah, you guessed right, middle of the night, "Thunk, Thunk", tide had carried it right back to me. Realizing I'm gonna have to get serious about this, I pull out the tide tables and turn on a light eliciting lots of complaints from sleeping crew but I find the tide will be running out in an hour. So, I wait up till then and finally get rid of the canister but never did get back to sleep waiting for the "Thunk, Thunk" again. So now it's a hazzard to innocent sailors! Why didn't you put a match to it? What is a "hazzard", dummy? |
Propane canister from hell
In article ,
says... On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 19:24:51 -0700, wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 15:10:49 -0700 (PDT), North Star wrote: On Jun 14, 5:22*pm, Frogwatch wrote: On Jun 14, 4:12*pm, Richard Casady wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 12:49:49 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: On Jun 14, 3:38*pm, wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 15:07:16 -0400, iBoat wrote: In article 4789ce48-54a7-4d7a-8dc5- , says... On Jun 14, 2:30 pm, I_am_Tosk wrote: In article , says... In article , says... On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 10:08:51 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: On Jun 14, 1:05 pm, wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 09:04:40 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: Thinking about my wayward dinghy caused me to remember another wandering object on one of my recent Bahamas trips. I had finished cooking on the magma grill (spoiled crew demanded warm mac and cheese) and tried removing the 3/4 full propane canister. Once removed, it was leaking propane, uh oh. No way this thing is staying aboard. I cannot leave it on the grill cuz it is choppy and the grill has to be stowed. After considering various options, I decided littering was the safest one so I simply threw it overboard and settled down to do some reading. A bit later, "Thunk, Thunk, WTF?", I go outside and look down and there's the canister bumping on the hull so I fished it out with the crab net. This time, I really heave it far away and go to bed. Yeah, you guessed right, middle of the night, "Thunk, Thunk", tide had carried it right back to me. Realizing I'm gonna have to get serious about this, I pull out the tide tables and turn on a light eliciting lots of complaints from sleeping crew but I find the tide will be running out in an hour. So, I wait up till then and finally get rid of the canister but never did get back to sleep waiting for the "Thunk, Thunk" again. Why didn't you just slowly open it up down wind, let it empty, then tie it up outside overnight? No wind. Seems like there would be something. None at all? All night? How about tying a weight to it and the boat, then opening the valve... it would sink down current of your boat, bubble along, then you could pull it back in. I thought boaters were all about creative thinking? Yeah, take all night to come up with a scheme to get rid of a little propane gas...... brilliant. Progressive "thinkers".. How much weight do you suppose it would take to sink a half full tank? snerk... -- Team Rowdy Mouse, Banned from the Mall for life! People on the west coast have no idea how glassy still the Gulf of Mexico can get. *When holding a leaking canister aboard a boat, time is critical lest the heavy propane get in your bilge. *Even holding it over the side leaking could be dangerous. *In this case, safety takes precedence over not littering. Let alone the fact that it's heavier than air and will fill a boat cabin in a heartbeat. Wow... you guys call yourselves sailors? How about closing up the boat. Isn't that what you're supposed to do when you gas up? Sheesh... and I don't know diddly about boats. Good Gawd, don't be so anal y'all. *I take the grill off the stern rail because if there is any chop it could fall overboard. *It was a very still night but chop can happen in a few minutes. Getting the canister below surface would not stop it from leaking near my boat and propane could get aboard. *Safety requires you get rid of it ASAP. *Sinking it even "just below the surface" would require several pounds of weight and unless I want to sacrifice some wrenches, I cannot think of anything that would sink it and as I just pointed out, sinking it does not stop it from leaking. *BTW, physics says enough to sink it "just below the surface" is the same as "all the way to the bottom" at least in shallow water. Hazard to navigation? *WHAT? *In a few hours, it will be empty and you think a small propane canister is a hazard to nav? *Be serious. I don't consider it boating, more like cave diving, far too risky, but they sell hundred mile per hour boats. You would hit with four hundred times the impact energy at 100 as you would at 5, with, say, a sailboat. Such a boat might be badly, even fatally, damaged. Less farfetched, I would not care to pay the possible repairs to the sterndrive on my starcraft. Casady If yer worried about a 16 oz canister, are you more worried about the logs floating around out there from the rivers?- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - 16 oz canister?? I envisioned a 10 lb propane tank...... the kind we carried on my buddy's Mirage 33. That's the normal size, right? The kind people connect to their stove? That's what I was originally thinking he had, but no, it's some tiny container for little bbq. The normal size is five gallons or twenty pounds. Tiny disposable 14 ounce cans are for soldering, not cooking. Casady Nope, I do a lot of camping and have a very small trailer. I use the tiny canisters, I can pack them easier... -- Team Rowdy Mouse, Banned from the Mall for life! |
Propane canister from hell
|
Propane canister from hell
In article ,
says... On Wed, 15 Jun 2011 14:55:11 -0400, wrote: On Wed, 15 Jun 2011 10:56:48 -0400, I_am_Tosk wrote: She is just trolling you... you are giving her what she wants, attention... We all get it, and so does she... I agree don't feed the troll. I really think plume is a teenager posing here. You notice that now that school is out (s)he is posting all day long? Every attorney I know is busy as hell all day and into the evening. I think you're just a bitter old man, who is unable or more likely unwilling to actually think coherently. I notice that you're unwilling to "engage" me, but you have no problem posting about me to others. So much for you ignoring me. Oh, the drama... -- Team Rowdy Mouse, Banned from the Mall for life! |
Propane canister from hell
On Wed, 15 Jun 2011 15:37:00 -0400, iBoat wrote:
In article , says... On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 19:24:51 -0700, wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 15:10:49 -0700 (PDT), North Star wrote: On Jun 14, 5:22*pm, Frogwatch wrote: On Jun 14, 4:12*pm, Richard Casady wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 12:49:49 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: On Jun 14, 3:38*pm, wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 15:07:16 -0400, iBoat wrote: In article 4789ce48-54a7-4d7a-8dc5- , says... On Jun 14, 2:30 pm, I_am_Tosk wrote: In article , says... In article , says... On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 10:08:51 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: On Jun 14, 1:05 pm, wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 09:04:40 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: Thinking about my wayward dinghy caused me to remember another wandering object on one of my recent Bahamas trips. I had finished cooking on the magma grill (spoiled crew demanded warm mac and cheese) and tried removing the 3/4 full propane canister. Once removed, it was leaking propane, uh oh. No way this thing is staying aboard. I cannot leave it on the grill cuz it is choppy and the grill has to be stowed. After considering various options, I decided littering was the safest one so I simply threw it overboard and settled down to do some reading. A bit later, "Thunk, Thunk, WTF?", I go outside and look down and there's the canister bumping on the hull so I fished it out with the crab net. This time, I really heave it far away and go to bed. Yeah, you guessed right, middle of the night, "Thunk, Thunk", tide had carried it right back to me. Realizing I'm gonna have to get serious about this, I pull out the tide tables and turn on a light eliciting lots of complaints from sleeping crew but I find the tide will be running out in an hour. So, I wait up till then and finally get rid of the canister but never did get back to sleep waiting for the "Thunk, Thunk" again. Why didn't you just slowly open it up down wind, let it empty, then tie it up outside overnight? No wind. Seems like there would be something. None at all? All night? How about tying a weight to it and the boat, then opening the valve... it would sink down current of your boat, bubble along, then you could pull it back in. I thought boaters were all about creative thinking? Yeah, take all night to come up with a scheme to get rid of a little propane gas...... brilliant. Progressive "thinkers".. How much weight do you suppose it would take to sink a half full tank? snerk... -- Team Rowdy Mouse, Banned from the Mall for life! People on the west coast have no idea how glassy still the Gulf of Mexico can get. *When holding a leaking canister aboard a boat, time is critical lest the heavy propane get in your bilge. *Even holding it over the side leaking could be dangerous. *In this case, safety takes precedence over not littering. Let alone the fact that it's heavier than air and will fill a boat cabin in a heartbeat. Wow... you guys call yourselves sailors? How about closing up the boat. Isn't that what you're supposed to do when you gas up? Sheesh... and I don't know diddly about boats. Good Gawd, don't be so anal y'all. *I take the grill off the stern rail because if there is any chop it could fall overboard. *It was a very still night but chop can happen in a few minutes. Getting the canister below surface would not stop it from leaking near my boat and propane could get aboard. *Safety requires you get rid of it ASAP. *Sinking it even "just below the surface" would require several pounds of weight and unless I want to sacrifice some wrenches, I cannot think of anything that would sink it and as I just pointed out, sinking it does not stop it from leaking. *BTW, physics says enough to sink it "just below the surface" is the same as "all the way to the bottom" at least in shallow water. Hazard to navigation? *WHAT? *In a few hours, it will be empty and you think a small propane canister is a hazard to nav? *Be serious. I don't consider it boating, more like cave diving, far too risky, but they sell hundred mile per hour boats. You would hit with four hundred times the impact energy at 100 as you would at 5, with, say, a sailboat. Such a boat might be badly, even fatally, damaged. Less farfetched, I would not care to pay the possible repairs to the sterndrive on my starcraft. Casady If yer worried about a 16 oz canister, are you more worried about the logs floating around out there from the rivers?- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - 16 oz canister?? I envisioned a 10 lb propane tank...... the kind we carried on my buddy's Mirage 33. That's the normal size, right? The kind people connect to their stove? That's what I was originally thinking he had, but no, it's some tiny container for little bbq. The normal size is five gallons or twenty pounds. Tiny disposable 14 ounce cans are for soldering, not cooking. Casady Guess you never saw a Magma stove, eh? http://compare.ebay.com/like/190537311893? var=noa&sort=BestMatch&clk_rvr_id=240682281683 THat is true. Around these parts a gas cooker is about two foot by four and had a 20 lb tank. There are the camping stoves sold at Wal-Mart and other places that take the small cylinder, but they sell a fitting and hose to connect to a five gallon tank, and many use them. Takes a lot of gas, ice fishing and I have a five gallon tank for the stove that takes a 14 ounce tank. Casady |
Propane canister from hell
|
Propane canister from hell
On Jun 15, 9:34*pm, Richard Casady
wrote: On Wed, 15 Jun 2011 15:37:00 -0400, iBoat wrote: In article , says... On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 19:24:51 -0700, wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 15:10:49 -0700 (PDT), North Star wrote: On Jun 14, 5:22 pm, Frogwatch wrote: On Jun 14, 4:12 pm, Richard Casady wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 12:49:49 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: On Jun 14, 3:38 pm, wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 15:07:16 -0400, iBoat wrote: In article 4789ce48-54a7-4d7a-8dc5- , says... On Jun 14, 2:30 pm, I_am_Tosk wrote: In article , says... In article , says... On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 10:08:51 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: On Jun 14, 1:05 pm, wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 09:04:40 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: Thinking about my wayward dinghy caused me to remember another wandering object on one of my recent Bahamas trips. I had finished cooking on the magma grill (spoiled crew demanded warm mac and cheese) and tried removing the 3/4 full propane canister. Once removed, it was leaking propane, uh oh. No way this thing is staying aboard. I cannot leave it on the grill cuz it is choppy and the grill has to be stowed. After considering various options, I decided littering was the safest one so I simply threw it overboard and settled down to do some reading. A bit later, "Thunk, Thunk, WTF?", I go outside and look down and there's the canister bumping on the hull so I fished it out with the crab net. This time, I really heave it far away and go to bed. Yeah, you guessed right, middle of the night, "Thunk, Thunk", tide had carried it right back to me. Realizing I'm gonna have to get serious about this, I pull out the tide tables and turn on a light eliciting lots of complaints from sleeping crew but I find the tide will be running out in an hour. So, I wait up till then and finally get rid of the canister but never did get back to sleep waiting for the "Thunk, Thunk" again. Why didn't you just slowly open it up down wind, let it empty, then tie it up outside overnight? No wind. Seems like there would be something. None at all? All night? How about tying a weight to it and the boat, then opening the valve... it would sink down current of your boat, bubble along, then you could pull it back in. I thought boaters were all about creative thinking? Yeah, take all night to come up with a scheme to get rid of a little propane gas...... brilliant. Progressive "thinkers".. How much weight do you suppose it would take to sink a half full tank? snerk... -- Team Rowdy Mouse, Banned from the Mall for life! People on the west coast have no idea how glassy still the Gulf of Mexico can get. When holding a leaking canister aboard a boat, time is critical lest the heavy propane get in your bilge. Even holding it over the side leaking could be dangerous. In this case, safety takes precedence over not littering. Let alone the fact that it's heavier than air and will fill a boat cabin in a heartbeat. Wow... you guys call yourselves sailors? How about closing up the boat. Isn't that what you're supposed to do when you gas up? Sheesh... and I don't know diddly about boats. Good Gawd, don't be so anal y'all. I take the grill off the stern rail because if there is any chop it could fall overboard. It was a very still night but chop can happen in a few minutes. Getting the canister below surface would not stop it from leaking near my boat and propane could get aboard. Safety requires you get rid of it ASAP. Sinking it even "just below the surface" would require several pounds of weight and unless I want to sacrifice some wrenches, I cannot think of anything that would sink it and as I just pointed out, sinking it does not stop it from leaking. BTW, physics says enough to sink it "just below the surface" is the same as "all the way to the bottom" at least in shallow water. Hazard to navigation? WHAT? In a few hours, it will be empty and you think a small propane canister is a hazard to nav? Be serious. I don't consider it boating, more like cave diving, far too risky, but they sell hundred mile per hour boats. You would hit with four hundred times the impact energy at 100 as you would at 5, with, say, a sailboat. Such a boat might be badly, even fatally, damaged. Less farfetched, I would not care to pay the possible repairs to the sterndrive on my starcraft. Casady If yer worried about a 16 oz canister, are you more worried about the logs floating around out there from the rivers?- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - 16 oz canister?? I envisioned a 10 lb propane tank...... the kind we carried on my buddy's Mirage 33. That's the normal size, right? The kind people connect to their stove? That's what I was originally thinking he had, but no, it's some tiny container for little bbq. The normal size is five gallons or twenty pounds. Tiny disposable 14 ounce cans are for soldering, not cooking. Casady Guess you never saw a Magma stove, eh? http://compare.ebay.com/like/190537311893? var=noa&sort=BestMatch&clk_rvr_id=240682281683 THat is true. Around these parts *a gas cooker is about two foot by four and had a 20 lb tank. There are the camping stoves sold at Wal-Mart and other places that take the small cylinder, but they sell a fitting and hose to connect to a five gallon tank, and many use them. Takes a lot of gas, ice fishing and I have a five gallon tank for the stove that takes a 14 ounce tank. Casady My gas grill is hooked up to a 500 gal. propane bottle which also heats my garage. . As far as cooking goes, I'll never use it all up. |
Propane canister from hell
On Jun 15, 4:49*pm, wrote:
On Wed, 15 Jun 2011 17:36:42 -0400, Wayne B wrote: On Wed, 15 Jun 2011 11:44:06 -0700, wrote: Come on! You're talking about a miniscule amount of gas, that would easily dissipate no where near your boat. You're just trying to justify your panicky reaction. With all due respect, your reaction and responses are totally inappropriate. * Propane is extremely explosive and quite deadly to boats and people in small quantities. *The only acceptable level of risk is zero, and the only acceptable location for a leaking cylinder is somewhere else. *You have no business posting advice or opinions on a boating group since you have no knowledge of boats to impart. With all due respect, what I said was totally appropriate. Frog over reacted and could easily have dealt with the situation without polluting the environment with a metal canister. "Without polluting the environment." Not according to your next statement. He could have attached the can to his spare anchor (he has one right?), and dumped on the down current side of the boat. Then, any out-gassing would have moved with the current and away from his boat. So, you endorse allowing toxic gasses to be injected into the ocean, D'Plume? He claims that it was leaking, so it couldn't have been full. He then goes on the claim that a wading pool is somehow equivalent to an entire ocean. Further, he claims that the gas would somehow migrate UP into his boat through various holes, then migrate UP some more to finally get into the cabin. Finally, you claim that I post off-topic and you don't like it. When I post something that's on topic, you don't like it and try to slam me for doing so. You're a hypocrite and not even good at hiding it. If you're so upset by me, why are you so concerned? Why don't you just ignore me like you ignore anything else that doesn't fit into your tiny little box of what is and what isn't acceptable? Heed your own advice, D'Plume. Frog has yet to address the quite valid responses and suggestions I made. If he were a real sailor, he would learn from his mistakes and accept the criticism. Obviously neither you nor he can do that. Apparently, you can not make a response, nor a criticism that is worthy of an answer. |
Propane canister from hell
On Jun 15, 6:33*pm, Jay wrote:
On 6/15/2011 5:49 PM, wrote: On Wed, 15 Jun 2011 17:36:42 -0400, Wayne B *wrote: On Wed, 15 Jun 2011 11:44:06 -0700, wrote: Come on! You're talking about a miniscule amount of gas, that would easily dissipate no where near your boat. You're just trying to justify your panicky reaction. With all due respect, your reaction and responses are totally inappropriate. * Propane is extremely explosive and quite deadly to boats and people in small quantities. *The only acceptable level of risk is zero, and the only acceptable location for a leaking cylinder is somewhere else. *You have no business posting advice or opinions on a boating group since you have no knowledge of boats to impart. With all due respect, what I said was totally appropriate. Frog over reacted and could easily have dealt with the situation without polluting the environment with a metal canister. He could have attached the can to his spare anchor (he has one right?), and dumped on the down current side of the boat. Then, any out-gassing would have moved with the current and away from his boat. He claims that it was leaking, so it couldn't have been full. He then goes on the claim that a wading pool is somehow equivalent to an entire ocean. Further, he claims that the gas would somehow migrate UP into his boat through various holes, then migrate UP some more to finally get into the cabin. Finally, you claim that I post off-topic and you don't like it. When I post something that's on topic, you don't like it and try to slam me for doing so. You're a hypocrite and not even good at hiding it. If you're so upset by me, why are you so concerned? Why don't you just ignore me like you ignore anything else that doesn't fit into your tiny little box of what is and what isn't acceptable? Frog has yet to address the quite valid responses and suggestions I made. If he were a real sailor, he would learn from his mistakes and accept the criticism. Obviously neither you nor he can do that. Some one struck a raw nerve, I see. Poor baby. Get over it. Or better yet, feel free to get out. And have a cookie... |
Propane canister from hell
On 6/15/2011 11:24 PM, Wayne B wrote:
On Wed, 15 Jun 2011 14:49:45 -0700, wrote: He could have attached the can to his spare anchor (he has one right?), and dumped on the down current side of the boat. Then, any out-gassing would have moved with the current and away from his boat. Propane moves with the wind (if any), not with the "current". I rest my case regarding your qualifications to offer advice. Youse guys gotta stop picking on Plume. She has a good heart and means well.............................................. .................. Belay that. I was thinking of someone else. |
Propane canister from hell
On 6/16/11 12:11 AM, Tim wrote:
On Jun 15, 9:34 pm, Richard wrote: On Wed, 15 Jun 2011 15:37:00 -0400, wrote: In , says... On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 19:24:51 -0700, wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 15:10:49 -0700 (PDT), North Star wrote: On Jun 14, 5:22 pm, wrote: On Jun 14, 4:12 pm, Richard wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 12:49:49 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: On Jun 14, 3:38 pm, wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 15:07:16 -0400, wrote: In article4789ce48-54a7-4d7a-8dc5- , says... On Jun 14, 2:30 pm, wrote: In , says... In , says... On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 10:08:51 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: On Jun 14, 1:05 pm, wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 09:04:40 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: Thinking about my wayward dinghy caused me to remember another wandering object on one of my recent Bahamas trips. I had finished cooking on the magma grill (spoiled crew demanded warm mac and cheese) and tried removing the 3/4 full propane canister. Once removed, it was leaking propane, uh oh. No way this thing is staying aboard. I cannot leave it on the grill cuz it is choppy and the grill has to be stowed. After considering various options, I decided littering was the safest one so I simply threw it overboard and settled down to do some reading. A bit later, "Thunk, Thunk, WTF?", I go outside and look down and there's the canister bumping on the hull so I fished it out with the crab net. This time, I really heave it far away and go to bed. Yeah, you guessed right, middle of the night, "Thunk, Thunk", tide had carried it right back to me. Realizing I'm gonna have to get serious about this, I pull out the tide tables and turn on a light eliciting lots of complaints from sleeping crew but I find the tide will be running out in an hour. So, I wait up till then and finally get rid of the canister but never did get back to sleep waiting for the "Thunk, Thunk" again. Why didn't you just slowly open it up down wind, let it empty, then tie it up outside overnight? No wind. Seems like there would be something. None at all? All night? How about tying a weight to it and the boat, then opening the valve... it would sink down current of your boat, bubble along, then you could pull it back in. I thought boaters were all about creative thinking? Yeah, take all night to come up with a scheme to get rid of a little propane gas...... brilliant. Progressive "thinkers".. How much weight do you suppose it would take to sink a half full tank?snerk... -- Team Rowdy Mouse, Banned from the Mall for life! People on the west coast have no idea how glassy still the Gulf of Mexico can get. When holding a leaking canister aboard a boat, time is critical lest the heavy propane get in your bilge. Even holding it over the side leaking could be dangerous. In this case, safety takes precedence over not littering. Let alone the fact that it's heavier than air and will fill a boat cabin in a heartbeat. Wow... you guys call yourselves sailors? How about closing up the boat. Isn't that what you're supposed to do when you gas up? Sheesh... and I don't know diddly about boats. Good Gawd, don't be so anal y'all. I take the grill off the stern rail because if there is any chop it could fall overboard. It was a very still night but chop can happen in a few minutes. Getting the canister below surface would not stop it from leaking near my boat and propane could get aboard. Safety requires you get rid of it ASAP. Sinking it even "just below the surface" would require several pounds of weight and unless I want to sacrifice some wrenches, I cannot think of anything that would sink it and as I just pointed out, sinking it does not stop it from leaking. BTW, physics says enough to sink it "just below the surface" is the same as "all the way to the bottom" at least in shallow water. Hazard to navigation? WHAT? In a few hours, it will be empty and you think a small propane canister is a hazard to nav? Be serious. I don't consider it boating, more like cave diving, far too risky, but they sell hundred mile per hour boats. You would hit with four hundred times the impact energy at 100 as you would at 5, with, say, a sailboat. Such a boat might be badly, even fatally, damaged. Less farfetched, I would not care to pay the possible repairs to the sterndrive on my starcraft. Casady If yer worried about a 16 oz canister, are you more worried about the logs floating around out there from the rivers?- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - 16 oz canister?? I envisioned a 10 lb propane tank...... the kind we carried on my buddy's Mirage 33. That's the normal size, right? The kind people connect to their stove? That's what I was originally thinking he had, but no, it's some tiny container for little bbq. The normal size is five gallons or twenty pounds. Tiny disposable 14 ounce cans are for soldering, not cooking. Casady Guess you never saw a Magma stove, eh? http://compare.ebay.com/like/190537311893? var=noa&sort=BestMatch&clk_rvr_id=240682281683 THat is true. Around these parts a gas cooker is about two foot by four and had a 20 lb tank. There are the camping stoves sold at Wal-Mart and other places that take the small cylinder, but they sell a fitting and hose to connect to a five gallon tank, and many use them. Takes a lot of gas, ice fishing and I have a five gallon tank for the stove that takes a 14 ounce tank. Casady My gas grill is hooked up to a 500 gal. propane bottle which also heats my garage. . As far as cooking goes, I'll never use it all up. I was going to do that...hook up the gas grill to our buried, 500-gallon tank, which supplies gas for cooking, backup heating, and fireplaces. My regular plumber said he could easily handle the connections, but advised me against doing it because of the length of exposed gas line it would require. I took his advice. -- Want to discuss recreational boating and fishing in a forum where personal insults are not allowed? http://groups.google.com/group/rec-boating-fishing |
Propane canister from hell
In article , payer33859
@mypacks.net says... On 6/16/11 12:11 AM, Tim wrote: On Jun 15, 9:34 pm, Richard wrote: On Wed, 15 Jun 2011 15:37:00 -0400, wrote: In , says... On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 19:24:51 -0700, wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 15:10:49 -0700 (PDT), North Star wrote: On Jun 14, 5:22 pm, wrote: On Jun 14, 4:12 pm, Richard wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 12:49:49 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: On Jun 14, 3:38 pm, wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 15:07:16 -0400, wrote: In article4789ce48-54a7-4d7a-8dc5- , says... On Jun 14, 2:30 pm, wrote: In , says... In , says... On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 10:08:51 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: On Jun 14, 1:05 pm, wrote: On Tue, 14 Jun 2011 09:04:40 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: Thinking about my wayward dinghy caused me to remember another wandering object on one of my recent Bahamas trips. I had finished cooking on the magma grill (spoiled crew demanded warm mac and cheese) and tried removing the 3/4 full propane canister. Once removed, it was leaking propane, uh oh. No way this thing is staying aboard. I cannot leave it on the grill cuz it is choppy and the grill has to be stowed. After considering various options, I decided littering was the safest one so I simply threw it overboard and settled down to do some reading. A bit later, "Thunk, Thunk, WTF?", I go outside and look down and there's the canister bumping on the hull so I fished it out with the crab net. This time, I really heave it far away and go to bed. Yeah, you guessed right, middle of the night, "Thunk, Thunk", tide had carried it right back to me. Realizing I'm gonna have to get serious about this, I pull out the tide tables and turn on a light eliciting lots of complaints from sleeping crew but I find the tide will be running out in an hour. So, I wait up till then and finally get rid of the canister but never did get back to sleep waiting for the "Thunk, Thunk" again. Why didn't you just slowly open it up down wind, let it empty, then tie it up outside overnight? No wind. Seems like there would be something. None at all? All night? How about tying a weight to it and the boat, then opening the valve... it would sink down current of your boat, bubble along, then you could pull it back in. I thought boaters were all about creative thinking? Yeah, take all night to come up with a scheme to get rid of a little propane gas...... brilliant. Progressive "thinkers".. How much weight do you suppose it would take to sink a half full tank?snerk... -- Team Rowdy Mouse, Banned from the Mall for life! People on the west coast have no idea how glassy still the Gulf of Mexico can get. When holding a leaking canister aboard a boat, time is critical lest the heavy propane get in your bilge. Even holding it over the side leaking could be dangerous. In this case, safety takes precedence over not littering. Let alone the fact that it's heavier than air and will fill a boat cabin in a heartbeat. Wow... you guys call yourselves sailors? How about closing up the boat. Isn't that what you're supposed to do when you gas up? Sheesh... and I don't know diddly about boats. Good Gawd, don't be so anal y'all. I take the grill off the stern rail because if there is any chop it could fall overboard. It was a very still night but chop can happen in a few minutes. Getting the canister below surface would not stop it from leaking near my boat and propane could get aboard. Safety requires you get rid of it ASAP. Sinking it even "just below the surface" would require several pounds of weight and unless I want to sacrifice some wrenches, I cannot think of anything that would sink it and as I just pointed out, sinking it does not stop it from leaking. BTW, physics says enough to sink it "just below the surface" is the same as "all the way to the bottom" at least in shallow water. Hazard to navigation? WHAT? In a few hours, it will be empty and you think a small propane canister is a hazard to nav? Be serious. I don't consider it boating, more like cave diving, far too risky, but they sell hundred mile per hour boats. You would hit with four hundred times the impact energy at 100 as you would at 5, with, say, a sailboat. Such a boat might be badly, even fatally, damaged. Less farfetched, I would not care to pay the possible repairs to the sterndrive on my starcraft. Casady If yer worried about a 16 oz canister, are you more worried about the logs floating around out there from the rivers?- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - 16 oz canister?? I envisioned a 10 lb propane tank...... the kind we carried on my buddy's Mirage 33. That's the normal size, right? The kind people connect to their stove? That's what I was originally thinking he had, but no, it's some tiny container for little bbq. The normal size is five gallons or twenty pounds. Tiny disposable 14 ounce cans are for soldering, not cooking. Casady Guess you never saw a Magma stove, eh? http://compare.ebay.com/like/190537311893? var=noa&sort=BestMatch&clk_rvr_id=240682281683 THat is true. Around these parts a gas cooker is about two foot by four and had a 20 lb tank. There are the camping stoves sold at Wal-Mart and other places that take the small cylinder, but they sell a fitting and hose to connect to a five gallon tank, and many use them. Takes a lot of gas, ice fishing and I have a five gallon tank for the stove that takes a 14 ounce tank. Casady My gas grill is hooked up to a 500 gal. propane bottle which also heats my garage. . As far as cooking goes, I'll never use it all up. I was going to do that...hook up the gas grill to our buried, 500-gallon tank, which supplies gas for cooking, backup heating, and fireplaces. My regular plumber said he could easily handle the connections, but advised me against doing it because of the length of exposed gas line it would require. I took his advice. Bull****. What is wrong with exposed gas line, dummy? |
Propane canister from hell
On Wed, 15 Jun 2011 23:24:27 -0400, Wayne B
wrote: On Wed, 15 Jun 2011 14:49:45 -0700, wrote: He could have attached the can to his spare anchor (he has one right?), and dumped on the down current side of the boat. Then, any out-gassing would have moved with the current and away from his boat. Propane moves with the wind (if any), not with the "current". I rest my case regarding your qualifications to offer advice. And, according to Frog, there _was no wind_. Just by friction, it would move with the current. Thus, no danger involved, as per my suggestion to sink it down current. I rest my case that you're a trivial, rude guy. |
One hand clapping...
In article ,
says... On Wed, 15 Jun 2011 23:24:27 -0400, Wayne B wrote: On Wed, 15 Jun 2011 14:49:45 -0700, wrote: He could have attached the can to his spare anchor (he has one right?), and dumped on the down current side of the boat. Then, any out-gassing would have moved with the current and away from his boat. Propane moves with the wind (if any), not with the "current". I rest my case regarding your qualifications to offer advice. And, according to Frog, there _was no wind_. Just by friction, it would move with the current. Thus, no danger involved, as per my suggestion to sink it down current. I rest my case that you're a trivial, rude guy. -- Team Rowdy Mouse, Banned from the Mall for life! |
One hand clapping...
On 6/16/11 3:48 PM, I_am_Tosk wrote:
In , says... On Wed, 15 Jun 2011 23:24:27 -0400, Wayne B wrote: On Wed, 15 Jun 2011 14:49:45 -0700, wrote: He could have attached the can to his spare anchor (he has one right?), and dumped on the down current side of the boat. Then, any out-gassing would have moved with the current and away from his boat. Propane moves with the wind (if any), not with the "current". I rest my case regarding your qualifications to offer advice. And, according to Frog, there _was no wind_. Just by friction, it would move with the current. Thus, no danger involved, as per my suggestion to sink it down current. I rest my case that you're a trivial, rude guy. One hand clap...what you get if you shake hands with a member of the Ingersoll family. -- Want to discuss recreational boating and fishing in a forum where personal insults are not allowed? http://groups.google.com/group/rec-boating-fishing |
One hand clapping...
In article , payer33859
@mypacks.net says... On 6/16/11 3:48 PM, I_am_Tosk wrote: In , says... On Wed, 15 Jun 2011 23:24:27 -0400, Wayne B wrote: On Wed, 15 Jun 2011 14:49:45 -0700, wrote: He could have attached the can to his spare anchor (he has one right?), and dumped on the down current side of the boat. Then, any out-gassing would have moved with the current and away from his boat. Propane moves with the wind (if any), not with the "current". I rest my case regarding your qualifications to offer advice. And, according to Frog, there _was no wind_. Just by friction, it would move with the current. Thus, no danger involved, as per my suggestion to sink it down current. I rest my case that you're a trivial, rude guy. One hand clap...what you get if you shake hands with a member of the Ingersoll family. Take your family insulting low life bull**** back to your new fabulous group. |
One hand clapping...
On 16/06/2011 1:49 PM, Harryk wrote:
On 6/16/11 3:48 PM, I_am_Tosk wrote: In , says... On Wed, 15 Jun 2011 23:24:27 -0400, Wayne B wrote: On Wed, 15 Jun 2011 14:49:45 -0700, wrote: He could have attached the can to his spare anchor (he has one right?), and dumped on the down current side of the boat. Then, any out-gassing would have moved with the current and away from his boat. Propane moves with the wind (if any), not with the "current". I rest my case regarding your qualifications to offer advice. And, according to Frog, there _was no wind_. Just by friction, it would move with the current. Thus, no danger involved, as per my suggestion to sink it down current. I rest my case that you're a trivial, rude guy. One hand clap...what you get if you shake hands with a member of the Ingersoll family. Hey harryk, all you do with crap like this is show what kind of a scum bag loser you really are. Only cowardly snipes go for family. But we already knew that about you and your bottom feeding habits. Hear the latest? Polosi flea bag no longer gets Wiener at the debriefings. -- Government isn't the solution to the bad economy, it is the problem. |
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