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#1
posted to rec.boats
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? for those with older trailers
On Jul 7, 8:50*am, Richard Casady wrote:
On Wed, 7 Jul 2010 04:40:31 -0700 (PDT), jamesgangnc wrote: I'm thinking that it's just sagged over the years till it has negative camber. *That seems to be the most logical explanation since I have the same wear problem on both sides. *A bent axle would not likely be bent symetrically. *Nor does it seem reasonable that the toe would change on both sides. It is not going to break. The yield point is a substantial percentage of the stress at which it would break. It it bends sitting, it would break the first time you hit a bump. Question is will my parking it with a floor jack under the center bent it back over time. No. See above. Really? Cause it bows up about 3" in the center when I lift the entire trailer and boat from the center of the axle with the floor jack. You're saying that doesn't matter, that's not enough to bend it any. Even if I do this for cummulative months? |
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#2
posted to rec.boats
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? for those with older trailers
On Wed, 7 Jul 2010 06:46:03 -0700 (PDT), jamesgangnc
wrote: On Jul 7, 8:50*am, Richard Casady wrote: On Wed, 7 Jul 2010 04:40:31 -0700 (PDT), jamesgangnc wrote: I'm thinking that it's just sagged over the years till it has negative camber. *That seems to be the most logical explanation since I have the same wear problem on both sides. *A bent axle would not likely be bent symetrically. *Nor does it seem reasonable that the toe would change on both sides. It is not going to break. The yield point is a substantial percentage of the stress at which it would break. It it bends sitting, it would break the first time you hit a bump. Question is will my parking it with a floor jack under the center bent it back over time. No. See above. Really? Cause it bows up about 3" in the center when I lift the entire trailer and boat from the center of the axle with the floor jack. You're saying that doesn't matter, that's not enough to bend it any. Even if I do this for cummulative months? Consider buildings, water towers, bridges. They are loaded initially, and bend at that time. They then stay elastically bent forever, without any permanent deformation. Things are not designed so weak that they are loaded too near the breaking point and take up a permanent set, creep is a word for it. Something like an axle will break the first time you hit a bump if it has already been loaded to the yield point just sitting there. To digress, brittle materials cannot be permanently bent. That is what brittle means. Those Roman stacked masonry arcades with the aquaducts on top that are still standing after a couple of thousand years are a good example. They have not shown any signs of slumping. Casady |
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#3
posted to rec.boats
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? for those with older trailers
On Jul 8, 9:10*am, Richard Casady wrote:
On Wed, 7 Jul 2010 06:46:03 -0700 (PDT), jamesgangnc wrote: On Jul 7, 8:50*am, Richard Casady wrote: On Wed, 7 Jul 2010 04:40:31 -0700 (PDT), jamesgangnc wrote: I'm thinking that it's just sagged over the years till it has negative camber. *That seems to be the most logical explanation since I have the same wear problem on both sides. *A bent axle would not likely be bent symetrically. *Nor does it seem reasonable that the toe would change on both sides. It is not going to break. The yield point is a substantial percentage of the stress at which it would break. It it bends sitting, it would break the first time you hit a bump. Question is will my parking it with a floor jack under the center bent it back over time. No. See above. Really? *Cause it bows up about 3" in the center when I lift the entire trailer and boat from the center of the axle with the floor jack. *You're saying that doesn't matter, that's not enough to bend it any. *Even if I do this for cummulative months? Consider buildings, water towers, bridges. They are loaded initially, and bend at that time. They then stay elastically bent forever, without any permanent deformation. Things are not designed so weak that they are loaded too near the breaking point and take up a permanent set, creep is a word for it. Something like an axle will break the first time you hit a bump if it has already been loaded to the yield point just sitting there. To digress, brittle materials cannot be permanently bent. That is what brittle means. Those Roman stacked masonry arcades with the aquaducts on top that are still standing after a couple of thousand years are a good example. They have not shown any signs of slumping. Casady- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - You're full of crap. |
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#4
posted to rec.boats
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? for those with older trailers
On Jul 7, 10:37*am, W1TEF wrote:
On Wed, 7 Jul 2010 06:46:03 -0700 (PDT), jamesgangnc wrote: On Jul 7, 8:50*am, Richard Casady wrote: On Wed, 7 Jul 2010 04:40:31 -0700 (PDT), jamesgangnc wrote: I'm thinking that it's just sagged over the years till it has negative camber. *That seems to be the most logical explanation since I have the same wear problem on both sides. *A bent axle would not likely be bent symetrically. *Nor does it seem reasonable that the toe would change on both sides. It is not going to break. The yield point is a substantial percentage of the stress at which it would break. It it bends sitting, it would break the first time you hit a bump. Question is will my parking it with a floor jack under the center bent it back over time. No. See above. Really? *Cause it bows up about 3" in the center when I lift the entire trailer and boat from the center of the axle with the floor jack. *You're saying that doesn't matter, that's not enough to bend it any. *Even if I do this for cummulative months? Did I understand you right - it bows a full 3"? There is no way it should flex a full 3" and that is probably your problem.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - No, you don't understand. It only flexes up when I put a floor jack under the center of the axle and jack it up till it's trying to lift the whole thing off the ground. It's only a 2" square tube axle with a 19' V8 boat on the trailer. 2" square axles can be used up to 3500lbs. The axle between the springs normally doesn't have any significant load. The load is all on the last 4" from the springs to the spindle. I'm doing this because I'm thinking that over the 20 yeasr of it's life it has slowly sagged in the other direction. Now I'm trying to make it sag back the other way but hopefully a bit faster since I'm putting a lot more stress on it. |
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#5
posted to rec.boats
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? for those with older trailers
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#6
posted to rec.boats
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? for those with older trailers
On Jul 7, 12:02*pm, I am Tosk wrote:
In article 6ff46d9b-d811-4174-ae40-ed87d596d354 @z10g2000yqb.googlegroups.com, says... On Jul 7, 10:37*am, W1TEF wrote: On Wed, 7 Jul 2010 06:46:03 -0700 (PDT), jamesgangnc wrote: On Jul 7, 8:50*am, Richard Casady wrote: On Wed, 7 Jul 2010 04:40:31 -0700 (PDT), jamesgangnc wrote: I'm thinking that it's just sagged over the years till it has negative camber. *That seems to be the most logical explanation since I have the same wear problem on both sides. *A bent axle would not likely be bent symetrically. *Nor does it seem reasonable that the toe would change on both sides. It is not going to break. The yield point is a substantial percentage of the stress at which it would break. It it bends sitting, it would break the first time you hit a bump. Question is will my parking it with a floor jack under the center bent it back over time. No. See above. Really? *Cause it bows up about 3" in the center when I lift the entire trailer and boat from the center of the axle with the floor jack. *You're saying that doesn't matter, that's not enough to bend it any. *Even if I do this for cummulative months? Did I understand you right - it bows a full 3"? There is no way it should flex a full 3" and that is probably your problem.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - No, you don't understand. *It only flexes up when I put a floor jack under the center of the axle and jack it up till it's trying to lift the whole thing off the ground. *It's only a 2" square tube axle with a 19' V8 boat on the trailer. *2" square axles can be used up to 3500lbs. *The axle between the springs normally doesn't have any significant load. *The load is all on the last 4" from the springs to the spindle. I'm doing this because I'm thinking that over the 20 yeasr of it's life it has slowly sagged in the other direction. *Now I'm trying to make it sag back the other way but hopefully a bit faster since I'm putting a lot more stress on it. If it does go back it will have been bent in two directions and the metal will be weakened at the bend point and will soon bend again. Three options stand out. Get a new Axel weld support into old axle once it is in place. Leave the bend in the middle and do two proper bends in a "unbent" area further out from the middle of the axle on each side... -- Rowdy Mouse Racing - We race for cheese!- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - It's not visibly out of straight or visibly bent anywhere. I'm not trying to bend it at one point, I'm trying to bend it all across the axle. So I'm thinking we're talking about nanometers of strech at any one given point on the axle. I'm having trouble seeing how that weakens it any appreciable amount. Not to mention that if I take it to a shop they are just going to "bend" it as well. Since it's galvanized they can't heat treat it. So I think your "weakened" theory doesn't hold water. |
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#7
posted to rec.boats
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? for those with older trailers
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#8
posted to rec.boats
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? for those with older trailers
On Jul 7, 12:28*pm, I am Tosk wrote:
In article , says... On Wed, 7 Jul 2010 09:10:05 -0700 (PDT), jamesgangnc wrote: It's not visibly out of straight or visibly bent anywhere. *I'm not trying to bend it at one point, I'm trying to bend it all across the axle. *So I'm thinking we're talking about nanometers of strech at any one given point on the axle. *I'm having trouble seeing how that weakens it any appreciable amount. *Not to mention that if I take it to a shop they are just going to "bend" it as well. *Since it's galvanized they can't heat treat it. *So I think your "weakened" theory doesn't hold water. Well, to tell the truth, I've never had a trailer for 20 years so I suppose I'm not totally qualified to comment, but after that long a period of time it might have taken a "set" in one direction. * In any case, if it is "stretched" that wouldn't that mean that the metal is stressed? *Or was stressed? I'm just trying to learn here, not object to the observations. *It's an interesting question. Maybe you will get a different answer but when I suggested such, I was told my argument "didn't hold water". I am assuming he is suggesting it doesn't hold enough water to matter, but if the metal stretched, it *is* weakened, even if only a little. Teaspoon, Gallon, Ocean, water is water... -- Rowdy Mouse Racing - We race for cheese!- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - I'll give you that theoretically it is stretched and weakened. Since it's not visibly bent it would only be a few degrees out of straight. I'm not going to try to calculate the difference in length from the top to the bottom of a 90" by 2" rectange whos long sides are 3 degrees out of true but I'm guessing it is pretty small. A difference that makes no difference is no difference. Or by your analogy a teaspoon of water in your bilge isn't going to change anything. A new axle is $300. Since it's galvanized welding on it would not be a very good solution. |
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#10
posted to rec.boats
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? for those with older trailers
jamesgangnc wrote:
On Jul 7, 12:28 pm, I am wrote: In , says... On Wed, 7 Jul 2010 09:10:05 -0700 (PDT), jamesgangnc wrote: It's not visibly out of straight or visibly bent anywhere. I'm not trying to bend it at one point, I'm trying to bend it all across the axle. So I'm thinking we're talking about nanometers of strech at any one given point on the axle. I'm having trouble seeing how that weakens it any appreciable amount. Not to mention that if I take it to a shop they are just going to "bend" it as well. Since it's galvanized they can't heat treat it. So I think your "weakened" theory doesn't hold water. Well, to tell the truth, I've never had a trailer for 20 years so I suppose I'm not totally qualified to comment, but after that long a period of time it might have taken a "set" in one direction. In any case, if it is "stretched" that wouldn't that mean that the metal is stressed? Or was stressed? I'm just trying to learn here, not object to the observations. It's an interesting question. Maybe you will get a different answer but when I suggested such, I was told my argument "didn't hold water". I am assuming he is suggesting it doesn't hold enough water to matter, but if the metal stretched, it *is* weakened, even if only a little. Teaspoon, Gallon, Ocean, water is water... -- Rowdy Mouse Racing - We race for cheese!- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - I'll give you that theoretically it is stretched and weakened. Since it's not visibly bent it would only be a few degrees out of straight. I'm not going to try to calculate the difference in length from the top to the bottom of a 90" by 2" rectange whos long sides are 3 degrees out of true but I'm guessing it is pretty small. A difference that makes no difference is no difference. Or by your analogy a teaspoon of water in your bilge isn't going to change anything. A new axle is $300. Since it's galvanized welding on it would not be a very good solution. Does galvanized welding really exist or are you referring to an axle galvanized after it was welded? |
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