wrote in message
...
On Thu, 8 Apr 2010 19:39:21 -0700, "nom=de=plume"
wrote:

Has anyone ever explained how many fees
you are paying for that 401k? It is one of the biggest scams in the
history of robbing the little guy and by the time the tax man gets
through with you, you would have been better off keeping your money
under your mattress.


401K are still a good deal. I certainly did really well with mine. They
matched a percentage, which was icing on the cake.

I agree the match was a good deal but the 401k itself, not so much.
Fees are typically several percent a year and over the life of a
career's worth of a 401k that can easily cost you close a million
dollars.
We still don't have a clue what the tax implications and market impact
will be when the boomers start pulling their money.
I have long predicted that the taxes on 401ks in the next decade will
end up being more than if you had just paid them when you earned the
money. I am looking at rolling mine into a Roth while these tax rates
are so low.


The 401K is the vehicle whereby people who work for companies save for their
retirement in a somewhat responsible manner. It's fine if you have the will
to do it yourself, but many don't.

Sure.. there's no absolute certainty that the tax rates will be lower for
those who retire. But, historically, that's what happens.

Roths are good if you can do it.

--
Nom=de=Plume

wrote in message
...
On Thu, 8 Apr 2010 22:19:50 -0700, "nom=de=plume"
wrote:

Sure.. there's no absolute certainty that the tax rates will be lower for
those who retire. But, historically, that's what happens.

History is irrelevant

Whew... that's a pretty bold statement. Are you sure you subscribe to that
notion? There are lots of bad things that can happen if you ignore history.

There has never been a retirement cadre the size of the boomers in the
history of the world. Europe is in more trouble than the US because of
their demographics. We are going to end up with less than 3 workers
per retiree. That is unsustainable. There is really no "savings" in
any real way. We are simply invested in the dreams of growth and the
likely rate of growth can't sustain the investment.

Well, I guess we should all hide under the bed. So far, and I haven't heard
one single viable solution to this situation. The Republicans are certainly
doing nothing, not even bothering to work a full schedule. The Democrats are
mostly trying, but the rabid reactions of those on the far right and the
lobbying money flowing aren't helping. When people listen to the likes of
Beck/Rush, guys who make millions a year, guys who couldn't give a hoot
about anyone save themselves, and the people can't figure out they're worse
than snake-oil salesmen, there's no telling what'll happen. I prefer to
believe that sanity will prevail, given our history of making good choices
(eventually).

--
Nom=de=Plume

wrote in message
...
On Fri, 9 Apr 2010 00:10:40 -0700, "nom=de=plume"
wrote:

wrote in message
. ..
On Thu, 8 Apr 2010 22:19:50 -0700, "nom=de=plume"
wrote:

Sure.. there's no absolute certainty that the tax rates will be lower
for
those who retire. But, historically, that's what happens.

History is irrelevant

Whew... that's a pretty bold statement. Are you sure you subscribe to that
notion? There are lots of bad things that can happen if you ignore
history.

Nothing like this has ever happened in history, at least not recently.
see below.

Come on.. Again, it's not like the world is ending. Things change. It's part
of life.


There has never been a retirement cadre the size of the boomers in the
history of the world. Europe is in more trouble than the US because of
their demographics. We are going to end up with less than 3 workers
per retiree. That is unsustainable. There is really no "savings" in
any real way. We are simply invested in the dreams of growth and the
likely rate of growth can't sustain the investment.

Well, I guess we should all hide under the bed. So far, and I haven't
heard
one single viable solution to this situation. The Republicans are
certainly
doing nothing, not even bothering to work a full schedule. The Democrats
are
mostly trying,

How are the democrats trying? Certainly not by addressing the deficit.
In this regard there is no difference between the parties.
I would not plan on getting everything you think you are "entitled"
to.,

They ARE addressing the deficit by passing healthcare reform. I'm going to
take the CBO's word for it on this, not to mention most economists. You'll
forgive me if I don't take your word for it. As to 'getting everything', I'm
not sure what that has to do with the previous sentence.

Hiding under the bed is not the answer but shedding your personal
debt and being prepared to live very cheaply is not a bad plan. You
better have the home to keep that bed, you want to hide under, paid
for.

Well, that's always a good plan.

Then you only have to be afraid that the government will tax you out
of it.


Property tax increases are always a possibility, although not very
politically viable. Sure. Anything is possible, including asteroids
destroying the earth.

--
Nom=de=Plume

wrote in message
...
On Fri, 9 Apr 2010 11:27:31 -0700, "nom=de=plume"
wrote:

How are the democrats trying? Certainly not by addressing the deficit.
In this regard there is no difference between the parties.
I would not plan on getting everything you think you are "entitled"
to.,

They ARE addressing the deficit by passing healthcare reform. I'm going to
take the CBO's word for it on this, not to mention most economists. You'll
forgive me if I don't take your word for it. As to 'getting everything',
I'm
not sure what that has to do with the previous sentence.

I certainly don't see any deficit reduction in this plan.

The CBO ?? stop it, I am hurting myself laughing. When have they EVER
been right?
They were off by a factor of 10 on their 10 year medicare projections
and you don't even want to talk about how bad they bungled the cost of
the Gulf War(s)

Hiding under the bed is not the answer but shedding your personal
debt and being prepared to live very cheaply is not a bad plan. You
better have the home to keep that bed, you want to hide under, paid
for.

Well, that's always a good plan.

Then you only have to be afraid that the government will tax you out
of it.


Property tax increases are always a possibility, although not very
politically viable. Sure. Anything is possible, including asteroids
destroying the earth.

A devastating meteor hit is about 50:1 in any given lifetime according
to the people who study these things, an extinction event is about
1000 to one in the same period and a globe altering event about 10,000
to one.
All way better than hitting a 5 number lottery ticket.

Property tax increases are almost a given when you look at the state
budgets


That's the agency that both sides uses. If you have another, have at it.

--
Nom=de=Plume