In article d02777de-b898-427e-a0a1-
, says...

On Dec 25, 7:14*pm, John H wrote:
...Change is coming!

The NYTimes is giving seniors a Christmas present to ponder.

http://tinyurl.com/yl9vumo

"Peter R. Orszag, the White House budget director and a disciple of
the Dartmouth data, has noted. We can no longer afford an overall
health care system in which the thought is more is always better,
because it s not. "

Another - "Because Dartmouth s analysis focuses solely on patients who
have died, a case like Mr. Putrus s would not show up in its data.
That is why critics say Dartmouth s approach takes an overly
pessimistic view of medicine: if you consider only the patients who
die, there is really no way to know whether it makes sense to spend
more on one case than another."

A preview of things to come?
--

Have a Super Christmas and a Spectacular New Year!

John H

John, couldn't you, at least during the holidays stop your stupid and
inane everything Obama is bad bull****?

Pfffftttt, are you gonna' stop the "everything is Rush and Hannity"
bull****?

On Dec 27, 10:02*am, I am Tosk
wrote:
In article d02777de-b898-427e-a0a1-
, says...







On Dec 25, 7:14*pm, John H wrote:
...Change is coming!

The NYTimes is giving seniors a Christmas present to ponder.

http://tinyurl.com/yl9vumo

"Peter R. Orszag, the White House budget director and a disciple of
the Dartmouth data, has noted. We can no longer afford an overall
health care system in which the thought is more is always better,
because it s not. "

Another - "Because Dartmouth s analysis focuses solely on patients who
have died, a case like Mr. Putrus s would not show up in its data.
That is why critics say Dartmouth s approach takes an overly
pessimistic view of medicine: if you consider only the patients who
die, there is really no way to know whether it makes sense to spend
more on one case than another."

A preview of things to come?
--

Have a Super Christmas and a Spectacular New Year!

John H

John, couldn't you, at least during the holidays stop your stupid and
inane everything Obama is bad bull****?

Pfffftttt, are you gonna' stop the "everything is Rush and Hannity"
bull****?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

You know what, Scotty? Go right to **** ahead. Do just like John, make
yourself look like an unhinged, narrow minded fool.

On 12/27/09 10:15 AM, Loogypicker wrote:
On Dec 27, 10:02 am, I am
wrote:
In articled02777de-b898-427e-a0a1-
, says...







On Dec 25, 7:14 pm, John wrote:
...Change is coming!

The NYTimes is giving seniors a Christmas present to ponder.

http://tinyurl.com/yl9vumo

"Peter R. Orszag, the White House budget director and a disciple of
the Dartmouth data, has noted. We can no longer afford an overall
health care system in which the thought is more is always better,
because it s not. "

Another - "Because Dartmouth s analysis focuses solely on patients who
have died, a case like Mr. Putrus s would not show up in its data.
That is why critics say Dartmouth s approach takes an overly
pessimistic view of medicine: if you consider only the patients who
die, there is really no way to know whether it makes sense to spend
more on one case than another."

A preview of things to come?
--

Have a Super Christmas and a Spectacular New Year!

John H

John, couldn't you, at least during the holidays stop your stupid and
inane everything Obama is bad bull****?

Pfffftttt, are you gonna' stop the "everything is Rush and Hannity"
bull****?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

You know what, Scotty? Go right to **** ahead. Do just like John, make
yourself look like an unhinged, narrow minded fool.


Actually, all three of you are unhinged, narrow-minded fools, along with
BAR, the Krueger of the day, Canuck, the unemployed inventor of the
florida panhandle, and a few others. You and JustHate, though, still
share the trophy of dumbest posters in rec.boats.

On Sat, 26 Dec 2009 19:42:17 -0500, Tom Francis wrote:

On Fri, 25 Dec 2009 23:17:46 -0600, thunder
wrote:

You mention a "business decision". It seems to me tying health insurance
to business, was a faulty paradigm from the beginning, competitively and
socially. However, health care has the potential of reviving this entire
economy. Health care jobs are well paying and *local*. IMO, they could
provide a replacement for the manufacturing jobs we have lost. Our
medical technology sector, already top of the world, could provide export
dollars. In the public debate, we've been looking at health care as a
drain on the economy. I'm thinking it could save the economy. It's
basic economics, manufacture something of value, and the whole world
values life, at least in theory.

You're right and as far as it goes, it would be a boon.

Unfortunately, that requires a free market approach to keep costs
competitive and we just got a crap sandwich of a "health care" bill.

This is gonna be a diaster and the more the details are being exposed,
it's becoming apparent that it's nothing more than a Chavez style take
over of a major industry - confiscatory and restrictive.

Hopefully, 2010 will bring a reversal of this boondoogle.

There has not been a free market for years. It has been a front to look
like a free market with cooperation amoung insurance carriers to set
prices and have had no control of who they can deny service to even if
they pay their premiums. A public option would prevent this and keep them
honest.

Been there, had this happen.

On 26/12/2009 4:49 PM, John H wrote:
On Sat, 26 Dec 2009 10:59:00 -0800 (PST),
wrote:

On Dec 26, 10:54 am, wrote:
On Dec 26, 10:15 am, wrote:





Loogypicker wrote:
On Dec 26, 8:34 am, John wrote:
On Sat, 26 Dec 2009 08:21:51 -0500, wrote:
Harry wrote:
On 12/26/09 12:20 AM, Steve B wrote:
wrote in message
...
On Fri, 25 Dec 2009 20:23:51 -0800, "Steve B"
wrote:
"John wrote in message
...
...Change is coming!
The NYTimes is giving seniors a Christmas present to ponder.
http://tinyurl.com/yl9vumo
"Peter R. Orszag, the White House budget director and a disciple of
the Dartmouth data, has noted. "We can no longer afford an overall
health care system in which the thought is more is always better,
because it's not.""
Another - "Because Dartmouth's analysis focuses solely on patients who
have died, a case like Mr. Putrus's would not show up in its data.
That is why critics say Dartmouth's approach takes an overly
pessimistic view of medicine: if you consider only the patients who
die, there is really no way to know whether it makes sense to spend
more on one case than another."
A preview of things to come?
--
Have a Super Christmas and a Spectacular New Year!
John H
If they were serious about saving money, wouldn't they just all get
on a
conference call instead of flying their jets to Denmark to schmooze
around?
Barry has some expensive tastes, and so does Michelle.
Steve
Jon Stewart pointed out that these climate savers managed to lease
every limo in western europe, some couriered in from as far away as
Germany so nobody had to share a ride.
Well, you can't have people who are interested in saving the planet
have to
ride two to a limo or two to a jet, now can you. It's just not done.
I wonder how many heating oil tanks could have been filled for what was
spent on that extravaganza.
BTW, what's a caviar wedge? I understand they ate a lot of caviar. That
would have bought a lot of turkeys at the shelters.
I bet they had expensive cognac and real Cuban cigars, too.
Nothing too good for our tax dollars.
Steve
Does anyone recall "stevie" objecting when bush was spending like a
drunken sailor, and cutting taxes for the wealthy at the same time?
Hypocrisy, thy real name is republican/conservative. Nothing is piled
higher than republican/conservative b.s.
Nothing except the burgeoning public debt.
Did someone justify Obama's spending using Bush as a rationale?

How silly.
--

John H

"Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the
gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery."

Churchill- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Ever hear of the word "precedent"? It's used legally binding all of
the time.

Can you clarify?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Yes:

prec?e?dent??/n. ?pr?s?d?nt; adj. pr??sidnt, ?pr?s?d?nt/ Show Spelled
Pronunciation [n. pres-i-duhnt; adj. pri-seed-nt, pres-i-duhnt] Show
IPA

–noun
1. Law. a legal decision or form of proceeding serving as an
authoritative rule or pattern in future similar or analogous cases.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

So if the person in front of you jumps off a cliff, then it's OK for
you to do it too?

Hey, they set a precedent. There's good ones and bad ones. According
to Loogy, they should all be emulated just 'cause they're precedents.

Liberal judges in New Hampshire and elsewhere set precedents when
they let child rapists off with a one year sentence. Those precedents
leads to things like this:

http://tinyurl.com/yd8s8yf

Sad and sick. Especailly if the authorities were listening they could
ahve predicted it.

http://tinyurl.com/yjp6jt7

This guy is a preditor and maybe this time the liberal judge will be
told how to make the senatance if they like there job. I also found a
reference to a conviction in 2000. Has a long history, why only one
year on his last round about is beyond me.

On Dec 27, 10:18*am, Harry wrote:
On 12/27/09 10:15 AM, Loogypicker wrote:





On Dec 27, 10:02 am, I am
wrote:
In articled02777de-b898-427e-a0a1-
, says....

On Dec 25, 7:14 pm, John *wrote:
...Change is coming!

The NYTimes is giving seniors a Christmas present to ponder.

http://tinyurl.com/yl9vumo

"Peter R. Orszag, the White House budget director and a disciple of
the Dartmouth data, has noted. We can no longer afford an overall
health care system in which the thought is more is always better,
because it s not. "

Another - "Because Dartmouth s analysis focuses solely on patients who
have died, a case like Mr. Putrus s would not show up in its data.
That is why critics say Dartmouth s approach takes an overly
pessimistic view of medicine: if you consider only the patients who
die, there is really no way to know whether it makes sense to spend
more on one case than another."

A preview of things to come?
--

Have a Super Christmas and a Spectacular New Year!

John H

John, couldn't you, at least during the holidays stop your stupid and
inane everything Obama is bad bull****?

Pfffftttt, are you gonna' stop the "everything is Rush and Hannity"
bull****?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

You know what, Scotty? Go right to **** ahead. Do just like John, make
yourself look like an unhinged, narrow minded fool.

Actually, all three of you are unhinged, narrow-minded fools, along with
BAR, the Krueger of the day, Canuck, the unemployed inventor of the
florida panhandle, and a few others. You and JustHate, though, still
share the trophy of dumbest posters in rec.boats.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

See you this spring!

In article ,
says...

In article d02777de-b898-427e-a0a1-
, says...

On Dec 25, 7:14*pm, John H wrote:
...Change is coming!

The NYTimes is giving seniors a Christmas present to ponder.

http://tinyurl.com/yl9vumo

"Peter R. Orszag, the White House budget director and a disciple of
the Dartmouth data, has noted. We can no longer afford an overall
health care system in which the thought is more is always better,
because it s not. "

Another - "Because Dartmouth s analysis focuses solely on patients who
have died, a case like Mr. Putrus s would not show up in its data.
That is why critics say Dartmouth s approach takes an overly
pessimistic view of medicine: if you consider only the patients who
die, there is really no way to know whether it makes sense to spend
more on one case than another."

A preview of things to come?
--

Have a Super Christmas and a Spectacular New Year!

John H

John, couldn't you, at least during the holidays stop your stupid and
inane everything Obama is bad bull****?

Pfffftttt, are you gonna' stop the "everything is Rush and Hannity"
bull****?

I just finished watching David Gregory on Meet the Press interview Janet
Napalitano about the terrorist incident on the NWA flight from Amsterdam
to Detroit. I think that David Gregory tapes up his seams before each
show just to hold himself together and not call some of the people he
interviews the idiots they are. Nepalitano sounded more like Gibbs, a
press secretary than a cabinet secretary. I could tell he was just about
to burst at the aforementioned seams and call her an idiot and ask here
how she got her job.

What does this have to do with Obama? Obama appointed Naplitano to be
the head of DHS. Obviously Obama didn't want a competent person at the
helm of the DHS or Obama is an idiot too in that he can't see
incompetence when it is staring him in the face.

In article ,
says...

On Sat, 26 Dec 2009 19:42:17 -0500, Tom Francis wrote:

On Fri, 25 Dec 2009 23:17:46 -0600, thunder
wrote:

You mention a "business decision". It seems to me tying health insurance
to business, was a faulty paradigm from the beginning, competitively and
socially. However, health care has the potential of reviving this entire
economy. Health care jobs are well paying and *local*. IMO, they could
provide a replacement for the manufacturing jobs we have lost. Our
medical technology sector, already top of the world, could provide export
dollars. In the public debate, we've been looking at health care as a
drain on the economy. I'm thinking it could save the economy. It's
basic economics, manufacture something of value, and the whole world
values life, at least in theory.

You're right and as far as it goes, it would be a boon.

Unfortunately, that requires a free market approach to keep costs
competitive and we just got a crap sandwich of a "health care" bill.

This is gonna be a diaster and the more the details are being exposed,
it's becoming apparent that it's nothing more than a Chavez style take
over of a major industry - confiscatory and restrictive.

Hopefully, 2010 will bring a reversal of this boondoogle.

There has not been a free market for years. It has been a front to look
like a free market with cooperation amoung insurance carriers to set
prices and have had no control of who they can deny service to even if
they pay their premiums. A public option would prevent this and keep them
honest.

Been there, had this happen.

Remove government regulation of the medical insurance industry. The free
market will return.

Why should health insurance be treated any differently than your life,
home, auto and property insurance? Your previous history of claims and
behavior determines your ability to obtain insurance and the rates you
pay.

Besides you do not have a right to health insurance or health care.

On Sun, 27 Dec 2009 11:28:45 -0500, BAR wrote:


What does this have to do with Obama? Obama appointed Naplitano to be
the head of DHS. Obviously Obama didn't want a competent person at the
helm of the DHS or Obama is an idiot too in that he can't see
incompetence when it is staring him in the face.

Let's see, valedictorian of her college class, J.D. from University of
Virginia, US Attorney for the District of Arizona, Attorney General of
Arizona, Governor of Arizona ... yup, must be an idiot.

On 12/27/09 11:28 AM, BAR wrote:
In ,
says...

In articled02777de-b898-427e-a0a1-
, says...

On Dec 25, 7:14 pm, John wrote:
...Change is coming!

The NYTimes is giving seniors a Christmas present to ponder.

http://tinyurl.com/yl9vumo

"Peter R. Orszag, the White House budget director and a disciple of
the Dartmouth data, has noted. We can no longer afford an overall
health care system in which the thought is more is always better,
because it s not. "

Another - "Because Dartmouth s analysis focuses solely on patients who
have died, a case like Mr. Putrus s would not show up in its data.
That is why critics say Dartmouth s approach takes an overly
pessimistic view of medicine: if you consider only the patients who
die, there is really no way to know whether it makes sense to spend
more on one case than another."

A preview of things to come?
--

Have a Super Christmas and a Spectacular New Year!

John H

John, couldn't you, at least during the holidays stop your stupid and
inane everything Obama is bad bull****?

Pfffftttt, are you gonna' stop the "everything is Rush and Hannity"
bull****?

I just finished watching David Gregory on Meet the Press interview Janet
Napalitano about the terrorist incident on the NWA flight from Amsterdam
to Detroit. I think that David Gregory tapes up his seams before each
show just to hold himself together and not call some of the people he
interviews the idiots they are. Nepalitano sounded more like Gibbs, a
press secretary than a cabinet secretary. I could tell he was just about
to burst at the aforementioned seams and call her an idiot and ask here
how she got her job.

What does this have to do with Obama? Obama appointed Naplitano to be
the head of DHS. Obviously Obama didn't want a competent person at the
helm of the DHS or Obama is an idiot too in that he can't see
incompetence when it is staring him in the face.


You mean, he should have nominated a guy who barely got out of high
school, skipped college, joined the marines, and knows nothing about law
enforcement...someone like you, for example?