A school counselor suffering an apparent heart attack died in a
Philadelphia emergency room after waiting nearly 80 minutes for help -
and a trio of homeless drug addicts nearby stole his watch instead of
seeking aid, police said.

Joaquin Rivera, 63, died before seeing a triage nurse at Atria
Health's Frankford Campus over the weekend, police said.

Rivera, a musician and activist in the city's Latino community, had
spent more than 30 years working as a bilingual counselor at an
inner-city high school.

"We're all destroyed. A guy like that, for him to leave us the way
that he did - and with what happened to him - everybody's destroyed,"
said Jesse Bermudez, a friend and fellow musician.

Rivera's cruel end was captured on security videotape, much like the
June 2008 death of Esmin Green, who died on a hospital floor as
staffers at Kings County Hospital Center in Brooklyn ignored her.
Green's family recently settled a lawsuit against the city for $2
million.

Rivera had walked to the Northeast Philadelphia hospital late Saturday
from his home a few blocks away after pain started shooting down his
right side. He registered at 10:45 p.m. and took a seat, chatting for
about 20 minutes with two men and a woman nearby.

Based on witness accounts, police believe Rivera passed out about an
hour later. Security video then shows one of the men steal his watch
and briefly pass it to the other.

"There's no resistance from Mr. Rivera at all, which is why we believe
he's probably dead. There's no stirring from him," said Capt. Jack
McGinnis, a city detective.

The second suspect is then seen by doctors, and a security guard
arrives to ask his sleeping companions to leave. A witness first
reports that Rivera may be dead.

At 12:04 a.m., he is pronounced dead.

"You would hope he would have died with dignity," McGinnis said.

Aria Health offered condolences to the family Tuesday but otherwise
declined comment, citing patient confidentiality and the pending
criminal case.

On Tue, 01 Dec 2009 20:26:24 -0500, wrote:

On Tue, 01 Dec 2009 14:41:56 -0800, jps wrote:


A school counselor suffering an apparent heart attack died in a
Philadelphia emergency room after waiting nearly 80 minutes for help -
and a trio of homeless drug addicts nearby stole his watch instead of
seeking aid, police said.

Joaquin Rivera, 63, died before seeing a triage nurse at Atria
Health's Frankford Campus over the weekend, police said.

Rivera, a musician and activist in the city's Latino community, had
spent more than 30 years working as a bilingual counselor at an
inner-city high school.

"We're all destroyed. A guy like that, for him to leave us the way
that he did - and with what happened to him - everybody's destroyed,"
said Jesse Bermudez, a friend and fellow musician.

Rivera's cruel end was captured on security videotape, much like the
June 2008 death of Esmin Green, who died on a hospital floor as
staffers at Kings County Hospital Center in Brooklyn ignored her.
Green's family recently settled a lawsuit against the city for $2
million.

Rivera had walked to the Northeast Philadelphia hospital late Saturday
from his home a few blocks away after pain started shooting down his
right side. He registered at 10:45 p.m. and took a seat, chatting for
about 20 minutes with two men and a woman nearby.

Based on witness accounts, police believe Rivera passed out about an
hour later. Security video then shows one of the men steal his watch
and briefly pass it to the other.

"There's no resistance from Mr. Rivera at all, which is why we believe
he's probably dead. There's no stirring from him," said Capt. Jack
McGinnis, a city detective.

The second suspect is then seen by doctors, and a security guard
arrives to ask his sleeping companions to leave. A witness first
reports that Rivera may be dead.

At 12:04 a.m., he is pronounced dead.

"You would hope he would have died with dignity," McGinnis said.

Aria Health offered condolences to the family Tuesday but otherwise
declined comment, citing patient confidentiality and the pending
criminal case.

He could have had the best insurance in the world and died if the
ambulance took him to that ER. What's your point?
I suppose you could make the case that this is what happens in a
government hospital but I bet that is not where you were going with
this.

I wasn't making a point about insurance. Just about ERs who can't pay
attention because they're too busy. If they weren't so inundated by
everyday business, perhaps they would have noticed this guy taking a
powder in their waiting room.

Anyone who interviews a patient coming in with pains in his arm knows
that it's within reason he's having a cardiac episode.

Why not at this ER. Stupid or just too busy to notice?

On Tue, 01 Dec 2009 20:26:24 -0500, wrote:

On Tue, 01 Dec 2009 14:41:56 -0800, jps wrote:


A school counselor suffering an apparent heart attack died in a
Philadelphia emergency room after waiting nearly 80 minutes for help -
and a trio of homeless drug addicts nearby stole his watch instead of
seeking aid, police said.

Joaquin Rivera, 63, died before seeing a triage nurse at Atria
Health's Frankford Campus over the weekend, police said.

Rivera, a musician and activist in the city's Latino community, had
spent more than 30 years working as a bilingual counselor at an
inner-city high school.

"We're all destroyed. A guy like that, for him to leave us the way
that he did - and with what happened to him - everybody's destroyed,"
said Jesse Bermudez, a friend and fellow musician.

Rivera's cruel end was captured on security videotape, much like the
June 2008 death of Esmin Green, who died on a hospital floor as
staffers at Kings County Hospital Center in Brooklyn ignored her.
Green's family recently settled a lawsuit against the city for $2
million.

Rivera had walked to the Northeast Philadelphia hospital late Saturday
from his home a few blocks away after pain started shooting down his
right side. He registered at 10:45 p.m. and took a seat, chatting for
about 20 minutes with two men and a woman nearby.

Based on witness accounts, police believe Rivera passed out about an
hour later. Security video then shows one of the men steal his watch
and briefly pass it to the other.

"There's no resistance from Mr. Rivera at all, which is why we believe
he's probably dead. There's no stirring from him," said Capt. Jack
McGinnis, a city detective.

The second suspect is then seen by doctors, and a security guard
arrives to ask his sleeping companions to leave. A witness first
reports that Rivera may be dead.

At 12:04 a.m., he is pronounced dead.

"You would hope he would have died with dignity," McGinnis said.

Aria Health offered condolences to the family Tuesday but otherwise
declined comment, citing patient confidentiality and the pending
criminal case.

He could have had the best insurance in the world and died if the
ambulance took him to that ER. What's your point?
I suppose you could make the case that this is what happens in a
government hospital but I bet that is not where you were going with
this.

Great questions.
--

John H

On Tue, 01 Dec 2009 17:40:52 -0800, jps wrote:

On Tue, 01 Dec 2009 20:26:24 -0500, wrote:


He could have had the best insurance in the world and died if the
ambulance took him to that ER. What's your point?
I suppose you could make the case that this is what happens in a
government hospital but I bet that is not where you were going with
this.

What do you mean "inundated by everyday business?"
You mean by people without health insurance coming in for
non-emergency treatment?
That kind of crap doesn't really happen, does it?

I wasn't making a point about insurance. Just about ERs who can't pay
attention because they're too busy. If they weren't so inundated by
everyday business, perhaps they would have noticed this guy taking a
powder in their waiting room.

Anyone who interviews a patient coming in with pains in his arm knows
that it's within reason he's having a cardiac episode.

Why not at this ER. Stupid or just too busy to notice?

Maybe this guy had "the best insurance in the world" and died
because ER attention was being given to the uninsured.
You can google "stress emergency room" to get a clue.
All I know is a number of pols say "Everybody can get care in America.
Just go to the emergency room."
Of course maybe it was just his time to go.
Who knows.

--Vic

On Tue, 01 Dec 2009 21:25:54 -0600, Vic Smith
wrote:

On Tue, 01 Dec 2009 17:40:52 -0800, jps wrote:

On Tue, 01 Dec 2009 20:26:24 -0500, wrote:


He could have had the best insurance in the world and died if the
ambulance took him to that ER. What's your point?
I suppose you could make the case that this is what happens in a
government hospital but I bet that is not where you were going with
this.

What do you mean "inundated by everyday business?"
You mean by people without health insurance coming in for
non-emergency treatment?
That kind of crap doesn't really happen, does it?

I assume you're being facetious.

I wasn't making a point about insurance. Just about ERs who can't pay
attention because they're too busy. If they weren't so inundated by
everyday business, perhaps they would have noticed this guy taking a
powder in their waiting room.

Anyone who interviews a patient coming in with pains in his arm knows
that it's within reason he's having a cardiac episode.

Why not at this ER. Stupid or just too busy to notice?

Maybe this guy had "the best insurance in the world" and died
because ER attention was being given to the uninsured.
You can google "stress emergency room" to get a clue.
All I know is a number of pols say "Everybody can get care in America.
Just go to the emergency room."

Exactly my point.

I assumed the audience would connect the dots as you did. Thanks for
filling in the detail.

Gfretwell, Plume and I have traveled this road previously, dragging an
old turd from N. California behind us.

On Tue, 01 Dec 2009 23:30:37 -0500, wrote:

On Tue, 01 Dec 2009 21:25:54 -0600, Vic Smith
wrote:

On Tue, 01 Dec 2009 17:40:52 -0800, jps wrote:

On Tue, 01 Dec 2009 20:26:24 -0500, wrote:


He could have had the best insurance in the world and died if the
ambulance took him to that ER. What's your point?
I suppose you could make the case that this is what happens in a
government hospital but I bet that is not where you were going with
this.

What do you mean "inundated by everyday business?"
You mean by people without health insurance coming in for
non-emergency treatment?
That kind of crap doesn't really happen, does it?

I wasn't making a point about insurance. Just about ERs who can't pay
attention because they're too busy. If they weren't so inundated by
everyday business, perhaps they would have noticed this guy taking a
powder in their waiting room.

Anyone who interviews a patient coming in with pains in his arm knows
that it's within reason he's having a cardiac episode.

Why not at this ER. Stupid or just too busy to notice?

Maybe this guy had "the best insurance in the world" and died
because ER attention was being given to the uninsured.
You can google "stress emergency room" to get a clue.
All I know is a number of pols say "Everybody can get care in America.
Just go to the emergency room."
Of course maybe it was just his time to go.
Who knows.

--Vic



It appears the dead guy did have pretty good insurance, he was a
public school employee in Philadelphia (the web site says Aetna or
Blue Cross).
This is just the problem of walking into a hospital alone and not
having a family member or friend directing your care.

Or maybe an admitting nurse with a brain or presence of mind to check
on him. Pains up and down the arm are a strong indicator of cardiac
trouble.

The hospital's insurance company will be compensating the family.

So, here's another reason our health insurance rates are high. The
hospitals have to figure in the costs of their ****ups into whatever
service they provide.

"jps" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 01 Dec 2009 21:25:54 -0600, Vic Smith
wrote:

On Tue, 01 Dec 2009 17:40:52 -0800, jps wrote:

On Tue, 01 Dec 2009 20:26:24 -0500, wrote:


He could have had the best insurance in the world and died if the
ambulance took him to that ER. What's your point?
I suppose you could make the case that this is what happens in a
government hospital but I bet that is not where you were going with
this.

What do you mean "inundated by everyday business?"
You mean by people without health insurance coming in for
non-emergency treatment?
That kind of crap doesn't really happen, does it?

I assume you're being facetious.

I wasn't making a point about insurance. Just about ERs who can't pay
attention because they're too busy. If they weren't so inundated by
everyday business, perhaps they would have noticed this guy taking a
powder in their waiting room.

Anyone who interviews a patient coming in with pains in his arm knows
that it's within reason he's having a cardiac episode.

Why not at this ER. Stupid or just too busy to notice?

Maybe this guy had "the best insurance in the world" and died
because ER attention was being given to the uninsured.
You can google "stress emergency room" to get a clue.
All I know is a number of pols say "Everybody can get care in America.
Just go to the emergency room."

Exactly my point.

I assumed the audience would connect the dots as you did. Thanks for
filling in the detail.

Gfretwell, Plume and I have traveled this road previously, dragging an
old turd from N. California behind us.


Ummm.... I usually leave my turds undisturbed.

--
Nom=de=Plume

On Wed, 2 Dec 2009 01:13:02 -0800, "nom=de=plume"
wrote:

"jps" wrote in message
.. .
On Tue, 01 Dec 2009 21:25:54 -0600, Vic Smith
wrote:

On Tue, 01 Dec 2009 17:40:52 -0800, jps wrote:

On Tue, 01 Dec 2009 20:26:24 -0500, wrote:


He could have had the best insurance in the world and died if the
ambulance took him to that ER. What's your point?
I suppose you could make the case that this is what happens in a
government hospital but I bet that is not where you were going with
this.

What do you mean "inundated by everyday business?"
You mean by people without health insurance coming in for
non-emergency treatment?
That kind of crap doesn't really happen, does it?

I assume you're being facetious.

I wasn't making a point about insurance. Just about ERs who can't pay
attention because they're too busy. If they weren't so inundated by
everyday business, perhaps they would have noticed this guy taking a
powder in their waiting room.

Anyone who interviews a patient coming in with pains in his arm knows
that it's within reason he's having a cardiac episode.

Why not at this ER. Stupid or just too busy to notice?

Maybe this guy had "the best insurance in the world" and died
because ER attention was being given to the uninsured.
You can google "stress emergency room" to get a clue.
All I know is a number of pols say "Everybody can get care in America.
Just go to the emergency room."

Exactly my point.

I assumed the audience would connect the dots as you did. Thanks for
filling in the detail.

Gfretwell, Plume and I have traveled this road previously, dragging an
old turd from N. California behind us.


Ummm.... I usually leave my turds undisturbed.

I was, of course, speaking of the old floater (boating reference) that
resides on the left half of your fair state.

"jps" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 2 Dec 2009 01:13:02 -0800, "nom=de=plume"
wrote:

"jps" wrote in message
. ..
On Tue, 01 Dec 2009 21:25:54 -0600, Vic Smith
wrote:

On Tue, 01 Dec 2009 17:40:52 -0800, jps wrote:

On Tue, 01 Dec 2009 20:26:24 -0500, wrote:


He could have had the best insurance in the world and died if the
ambulance took him to that ER. What's your point?
I suppose you could make the case that this is what happens in a
government hospital but I bet that is not where you were going with
this.

What do you mean "inundated by everyday business?"
You mean by people without health insurance coming in for
non-emergency treatment?
That kind of crap doesn't really happen, does it?

I assume you're being facetious.

I wasn't making a point about insurance. Just about ERs who can't pay
attention because they're too busy. If they weren't so inundated by
everyday business, perhaps they would have noticed this guy taking a
powder in their waiting room.

Anyone who interviews a patient coming in with pains in his arm knows
that it's within reason he's having a cardiac episode.

Why not at this ER. Stupid or just too busy to notice?

Maybe this guy had "the best insurance in the world" and died
because ER attention was being given to the uninsured.
You can google "stress emergency room" to get a clue.
All I know is a number of pols say "Everybody can get care in America.
Just go to the emergency room."

Exactly my point.

I assumed the audience would connect the dots as you did. Thanks for
filling in the detail.

Gfretwell, Plume and I have traveled this road previously, dragging an
old turd from N. California behind us.


Ummm.... I usually leave my turds undisturbed.

I was, of course, speaking of the old floater (boating reference) that
resides on the left half of your fair state.


You're gonna get Kalif Swill all worked up.
He'll be here later on, sputtering and spitting all over himself.

nom=de=plume wrote:

Gfretwell, Plume and I have traveled this road previously, dragging an
old turd from N. California behind us.


Ummm.... I usually leave my turds undisturbed.


"usually"? What do you do the rest of the..forget it.

Rob