"jps" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 30 Nov 2009 14:50:35 -0800, Eddie
wrote:

On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 23:54:03 -0800, jps wrote:



I went without eating beef for 15 years, not because of my health but
because of the perversity of supporting a system that plunders our
country's resources.

Vegetarians, in my experience, are more likely to be aware of their
own health and the health of the environment. No wonder the Bigot
Steve doesn't understand them.
There is no scientific or medical evidence that vegetarians live
longer or are healthier than non-vegetarians.*
Eddie

*Dr. Dean Edell on KGO radio, SF CA

I can come up with any number of quotes from reputable doctors who'd
say exactly the opposite.

How about heart disease and ingesting animal fat. Think there's no
correlation?


There's some evidence that a severely restricted diet increases life
expectancy, but it doesn't sound like much fun.

--
Nom=de=Plume

On Mon, 30 Nov 2009 14:26:16 -0800, Frogwatch wrote:

Meat will
be produced from modified zero-conciousness life forms ...

for modified zero-consciousness life forms.

I don't have any soft spot for chickens, damn stupid animals, but you
might want to consider what these factory farms are doing to our health.
We are running out of effective antibiotics due to resistant bacteria.
It's mostly due to the overuse of antibiotics on these factory farms.
Growth hormones? What the hey, we need 400 lb. football players. The
sewage, loaded down with said antibiotics, growth hormones, other drugs,
and pesticides? No problem, it just adds flavoring to our drinking water.

On Mon, 30 Nov 2009 17:22:05 -0800, "nom=de=plume"
wrote:

"jps" wrote in message
.. .
On Mon, 30 Nov 2009 11:31:24 -0800, "nom=de=plume"
wrote:

"jps" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 18:43:22 -0800, "nom=de=plume"
wrote:

"Steve B" wrote in message
...

"John H" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 17:07:27 -0800 (PST), Frogwatch
wrote:

ALL of my seven sisters have become veggie nut cases although
fortunately their kids have not succumbed. So, I was naturally
skeptical to see a vague meat-looking waaaaay too symmetrical blob
covered with gravy and dressing at Thanksgiving AND, there was an
identical one next to it. Yeah, sorta meat-like texture but no
internal structure. I just had to ask, Yup, it was Tofurkey and to
be
nice I had to take some. If you smothered it with enough gravy and
had a few drinks, MAYBE you could accept it.
Fortunately, my brother had made some smoked turkey and brother in
law
made some smoked mullet.

I have never ever met a vegetarian who was NOT a nutcase. If this is
so
good for you, why is it that the practitioners of it are so
agressively
adamant about it? It seems to radically change their internal
chemistry,
and dominoes into their personality. Some of these people who you
would
think eat nuts and berries turn into people with the personality of
grizzly bears.

Just MHO, YMMV

Steve

Sure thing... grease burgers are heart food.

I went without eating beef for 15 years, not because of my health but
because of the perversity of supporting a system that plunders our
country's resources.

Vegetarians, in my experience, are more likely to be aware of their
own health and the health of the environment. No wonder the Bigot
Steve doesn't understand them.


I've never been a true vegetarian but I've cut way down on meat. Sushi is
my
favorite, but a burger or roast can't be beat sometimes.

Kid's are growing and the protein is good for them. We've relaxed but
only buy beef that was raised well and died humanely. No feed lot
purchases. Free range chicken/turkey. Getting a little freaked out
by the overfishing so going easy on sushi. Make California rolls at
home. Love uni and there's plenty of that.

Have a friend who slow roasts ribs... Mmmmmmmm.


Yeah... ribs.... I have a great recipe. I'd do that for the holidays, but
everyone wants more traditional food.

You might want to consider organic or biodynamic vs. free range:

http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/f...view/index.htm

I'll have a look but I often use those terms interchangably and likely
incorrectly. We had an organic Kosher bird for TG and then cooked
another free range/organic on Sunday for friends who lost their dog on
TG night.

By Saturday, the fanciest birds were 75% off!!! $14 for 14 lb bird.

On Mon, 30 Nov 2009 17:23:43 -0800, "nom=de=plume"
wrote:

"jps" wrote in message
.. .
On Mon, 30 Nov 2009 14:50:35 -0800, Eddie
wrote:

On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 23:54:03 -0800, jps wrote:



I went without eating beef for 15 years, not because of my health but
because of the perversity of supporting a system that plunders our
country's resources.

Vegetarians, in my experience, are more likely to be aware of their
own health and the health of the environment. No wonder the Bigot
Steve doesn't understand them.
There is no scientific or medical evidence that vegetarians live
longer or are healthier than non-vegetarians.*
Eddie

*Dr. Dean Edell on KGO radio, SF CA

I can come up with any number of quotes from reputable doctors who'd
say exactly the opposite.

How about heart disease and ingesting animal fat. Think there's no
correlation?


There's some evidence that a severely restricted diet increases life
expectancy, but it doesn't sound like much fun.

People on calorie restriction look like they've got half a foot in the
grave already.

"jps" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 30 Nov 2009 17:23:43 -0800, "nom=de=plume"
wrote:

"jps" wrote in message
. ..
On Mon, 30 Nov 2009 14:50:35 -0800, Eddie
wrote:

On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 23:54:03 -0800, jps wrote:



I went without eating beef for 15 years, not because of my health but
because of the perversity of supporting a system that plunders our
country's resources.

Vegetarians, in my experience, are more likely to be aware of their
own health and the health of the environment. No wonder the Bigot
Steve doesn't understand them.
There is no scientific or medical evidence that vegetarians live
longer or are healthier than non-vegetarians.*
Eddie

*Dr. Dean Edell on KGO radio, SF CA

I can come up with any number of quotes from reputable doctors who'd
say exactly the opposite.

How about heart disease and ingesting animal fat. Think there's no
correlation?


There's some evidence that a severely restricted diet increases life
expectancy, but it doesn't sound like much fun.

People on calorie restriction look like they've got half a foot in the
grave already.


I saw something on TV about it. They were very, very concerned about some
tomato soup or some such nonsense.

--
Nom=de=Plume

On Mon, 30 Nov 2009 21:42:15 -0600, thunder
wrote:

On Mon, 30 Nov 2009 14:26:16 -0800, Frogwatch wrote:

Meat will
be produced from modified zero-conciousness life forms ...

for modified zero-consciousness life forms.

Perfect. Thank you.

On Mon, 30 Nov 2009 20:07:16 -0800, "nom=de=plume"
wrote:

"jps" wrote in message
.. .
On Mon, 30 Nov 2009 17:23:43 -0800, "nom=de=plume"
wrote:

"jps" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 30 Nov 2009 14:50:35 -0800, Eddie
wrote:

On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 23:54:03 -0800, jps wrote:



I went without eating beef for 15 years, not because of my health but
because of the perversity of supporting a system that plunders our
country's resources.

Vegetarians, in my experience, are more likely to be aware of their
own health and the health of the environment. No wonder the Bigot
Steve doesn't understand them.
There is no scientific or medical evidence that vegetarians live
longer or are healthier than non-vegetarians.*
Eddie

*Dr. Dean Edell on KGO radio, SF CA

I can come up with any number of quotes from reputable doctors who'd
say exactly the opposite.

How about heart disease and ingesting animal fat. Think there's no
correlation?


There's some evidence that a severely restricted diet increases life
expectancy, but it doesn't sound like much fun.

People on calorie restriction look like they've got half a foot in the
grave already.


I saw something on TV about it. They were very, very concerned about some
tomato soup or some such nonsense.

Good diet for those suffering from OCD.

"jps" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 30 Nov 2009 17:22:05 -0800, "nom=de=plume"
wrote:

"jps" wrote in message
. ..
On Mon, 30 Nov 2009 11:31:24 -0800, "nom=de=plume"
wrote:

"jps" wrote in message
m...
On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 18:43:22 -0800, "nom=de=plume"
wrote:

"Steve B" wrote in message
...

"John H" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 17:07:27 -0800 (PST), Frogwatch
wrote:

ALL of my seven sisters have become veggie nut cases although
fortunately their kids have not succumbed. So, I was naturally
skeptical to see a vague meat-looking waaaaay too symmetrical blob
covered with gravy and dressing at Thanksgiving AND, there was an
identical one next to it. Yeah, sorta meat-like texture but no
internal structure. I just had to ask, Yup, it was Tofurkey and to
be
nice I had to take some. If you smothered it with enough gravy
and
had a few drinks, MAYBE you could accept it.
Fortunately, my brother had made some smoked turkey and brother in
law
made some smoked mullet.

I have never ever met a vegetarian who was NOT a nutcase. If this
is
so
good for you, why is it that the practitioners of it are so
agressively
adamant about it? It seems to radically change their internal
chemistry,
and dominoes into their personality. Some of these people who you
would
think eat nuts and berries turn into people with the personality of
grizzly bears.

Just MHO, YMMV

Steve

Sure thing... grease burgers are heart food.

I went without eating beef for 15 years, not because of my health but
because of the perversity of supporting a system that plunders our
country's resources.

Vegetarians, in my experience, are more likely to be aware of their
own health and the health of the environment. No wonder the Bigot
Steve doesn't understand them.


I've never been a true vegetarian but I've cut way down on meat. Sushi
is
my
favorite, but a burger or roast can't be beat sometimes.

Kid's are growing and the protein is good for them. We've relaxed but
only buy beef that was raised well and died humanely. No feed lot
purchases. Free range chicken/turkey. Getting a little freaked out
by the overfishing so going easy on sushi. Make California rolls at
home. Love uni and there's plenty of that.

Have a friend who slow roasts ribs... Mmmmmmmm.


Yeah... ribs.... I have a great recipe. I'd do that for the holidays, but
everyone wants more traditional food.

You might want to consider organic or biodynamic vs. free range:

http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/f...view/index.htm

I'll have a look but I often use those terms interchangably and likely
incorrectly. We had an organic Kosher bird for TG and then cooked
another free range/organic on Sunday for friends who lost their dog on
TG night.

By Saturday, the fanciest birds were 75% off!!! $14 for 14 lb bird.


Nice price...

I worked on a somewhat related patent application... having to do with
bio-testing of cattle and poultry. Interesting issues involved, but there is
so much industry pressure and rear-end covering...

--
Nom=de=Plume

On Mon, 30 Nov 2009 20:24:48 -0800, "nom=de=plume"
wrote:

"jps" wrote in message
.. .
On Mon, 30 Nov 2009 17:22:05 -0800, "nom=de=plume"
wrote:

"jps" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 30 Nov 2009 11:31:24 -0800, "nom=de=plume"
wrote:

"jps" wrote in message
om...
On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 18:43:22 -0800, "nom=de=plume"
wrote:

"Steve B" wrote in message
...

"John H" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 29 Nov 2009 17:07:27 -0800 (PST), Frogwatch
wrote:

ALL of my seven sisters have become veggie nut cases although
fortunately their kids have not succumbed. So, I was naturally
skeptical to see a vague meat-looking waaaaay too symmetrical blob
covered with gravy and dressing at Thanksgiving AND, there was an
identical one next to it. Yeah, sorta meat-like texture but no
internal structure. I just had to ask, Yup, it was Tofurkey and to
be
nice I had to take some. If you smothered it with enough gravy
and
had a few drinks, MAYBE you could accept it.
Fortunately, my brother had made some smoked turkey and brother in
law
made some smoked mullet.

I have never ever met a vegetarian who was NOT a nutcase. If this
is
so
good for you, why is it that the practitioners of it are so
agressively
adamant about it? It seems to radically change their internal
chemistry,
and dominoes into their personality. Some of these people who you
would
think eat nuts and berries turn into people with the personality of
grizzly bears.

Just MHO, YMMV

Steve

Sure thing... grease burgers are heart food.

I went without eating beef for 15 years, not because of my health but
because of the perversity of supporting a system that plunders our
country's resources.

Vegetarians, in my experience, are more likely to be aware of their
own health and the health of the environment. No wonder the Bigot
Steve doesn't understand them.


I've never been a true vegetarian but I've cut way down on meat. Sushi
is
my
favorite, but a burger or roast can't be beat sometimes.

Kid's are growing and the protein is good for them. We've relaxed but
only buy beef that was raised well and died humanely. No feed lot
purchases. Free range chicken/turkey. Getting a little freaked out
by the overfishing so going easy on sushi. Make California rolls at
home. Love uni and there's plenty of that.

Have a friend who slow roasts ribs... Mmmmmmmm.


Yeah... ribs.... I have a great recipe. I'd do that for the holidays, but
everyone wants more traditional food.

You might want to consider organic or biodynamic vs. free range:

http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/f...view/index.htm

I'll have a look but I often use those terms interchangably and likely
incorrectly. We had an organic Kosher bird for TG and then cooked
another free range/organic on Sunday for friends who lost their dog on
TG night.

By Saturday, the fanciest birds were 75% off!!! $14 for 14 lb bird.


Nice price...

I worked on a somewhat related patent application... having to do with
bio-testing of cattle and poultry. Interesting issues involved, but there is
so much industry pressure and rear-end covering...

Hey, when Walmart gets in the business of "organic" food, you know
there's either going to be some rule changes or fudging...

Once all is said and done, "organic" will mean whatever you're eating
has been genetically engineered and flavored with lead.

On Mon, 30 Nov 2009 21:42:15 -0600, thunder
wrote:

On Mon, 30 Nov 2009 14:26:16 -0800, Frogwatch wrote:

Meat will
be produced from modified zero-conciousness life forms ...

for modified zero-consciousness life forms.

I don't have any soft spot for chickens, damn stupid animals, but you
might want to consider what these factory farms are doing to our health.
We are running out of effective antibiotics due to resistant bacteria.
It's mostly due to the overuse of antibiotics on these factory farms.
Growth hormones? What the hey, we need 400 lb. football players. The
sewage, loaded down with said antibiotics, growth hormones, other drugs,
and pesticides? No problem, it just adds flavoring to our drinking water.

So it's not the chickens, it's the chemicals fed to the chickens.
Sounds like a chemical problem, not a meat problem.

Surely Obama will fix that!
--

John H