wrote in message
...
On Thu, 10 Sep 2009 10:04:13 -0700, "nom=de=plume"
wrote:

wrote in message
. ..
And the evidence for this is???


The difference between candidate Obama circa 3q 2007 - 1q 2008 (a guy
I supported here) and president Obama today?
He has this health care red herring and that is pretty much the only
thing that makes his policies different than Bush.
He doubled down on Bush's bailouts, Didn't close Gitmo, Didn't stop
either war, didn't do anything about the erosion of our rights and
doubled Bush's deficit

New boss
... same as the old boss



He has done much more than that. Re the bailout, he listened to the
experts
and did the right thing, as evidence, the economy is slowly improving. He
is
in the process of closing Gitmo, and he's winding down the war in Iraq. He
never claimed he would do that in Afg.

Nothing has actually happened. Nixon said he would get us out of
Vietnam too. It just didn't happen until Ford finally pulled the plug.

Do you really credit Ford with ending the war? I'm inclined to give Nixon
that one, despite the timing.


I have no idea what you're talking about re "our rights." He's opened up
an
investigation (limited right now) into the torture stuff. More is surely
to
come.

Several years ago everyone on the left was howling about the patriot
act. Obama rubber stamped it. Gitmo never affected our rights, only
aliens who never set foot here (the point of Gitmo)

It absolutely has. It's a slippery slope when you start treating the worst
like animals.

If you want a real example of losing your rights, look at the drug
war. That was where the 4th amendment was shredded. It is also when
illegal domestic wiretapping really took off. I don't see Obama
softening that.

I don't know of any examples of illegal wiretapping wrt to the drug war.
However, the Bush administration pushed through the end run around the FISA
court. Obama hasn't done enough to end that end run.


While the deficit is an important issue, it's not unusual for that to
happen. The gov't has to spend money to fix the near depression we're
having.

The real question is whether we made good choices in where we spent
the money. I bet most of the people who voted for those phone book
sized bills ever read any of them. They were catch alls, scooping up
every pork bill that was languishing around the capitol for the last 8
years.

Probably right, but you really can't blame Obama for this. I'm even willing
to give Paulson a snap for doing what he and other economists thought was
right. He didn't have any accountability in what he did, and Geitner did
more toward that.

--
Nom=de=Plume