On this day, 9/11, let's pause to remember.

I remember the workers at Ground Zero, who were told by the new and
improved E.P.A., that the air was safe to breath.

I remember the 19 highjackers, all of whom were NOT from Iraq.

I remember the nations of Europe, who used to be our allies, and would
stick with us, who are now alienated from us.

I remember Osama's relatives, who were allowed free and easy transit
out of the United States.

I remember the firefighters who risked their lives at Ground Zero,
who, because of budget cuts from Bush, have had six of their
firehouses closed.

I remember the public relations stunt by the government to dupe people
into thinking that some heroics were involved in the saving of Jessica
Lynch.

I remember Bush in a flight suit, acting smug, and sticking his chest
out like he is actually a hero.

I remember what a shambles we left Afganistan in, the country is still
run mostly by warlords, and Al Queda.

I remember we went to Iraq for Weapons of Mass Destruction.

Mostly, I remember the men and women who are so wrapped up in their
political party, that they still believe all of the drivel that the
Bush administration shoves down their throat.

That is beyond a doubt, the cheapest shot I have ever seen.
To take the events of two years ago and distort them to fit YOUR agenda is
lower than the acts of those that perpatrated the attacks.
The politics here have hit an all time low.
YOU SHOULD BE ASHAMED!
(And also damned glad you weren't in front of me when you said it)

Cliff

To take the events of two years ago and distort them to fit YOUR agenda is
lower than the acts of those that perpatrated the attacks.

I presume you're addressing me?

How did I distort facts? Did I dispute that the WTC and the Pentagon were
attacked by criminal, *******, terrorists? No. Did I
chime in with the ridiculous crap swirling through the rumor mills that Bush
knew all about the attack in advance and let it happen anyway? No.

I stated I am still P.O.'d about 9-11.
That, is a fact. Aren't most of us?

I stated that the terrorists hoped the attack would do serious damage to the
American way of life. That is a fact.

I stated that repressive, reactionary elements in the US have used the events
of 9-11 to advocate the restriction or suspension of constitutionally
guaranteed freedoms. That too, is a fact.

So why are you so upset?
I assume you're not a terrorist. Perhaps you are in favor of surrendering or
modifying our civil liberties to make the federal government bigger, more
powerful, and less accountable after 9-11? Because you feel it will keep you
"safe" from terrorists (who would like to strip you of your unique rights as an
American)?
If so, you are currently among the majority in the United States. Sadly enough.

That doesn't make you a repressive reactionary, however, so don't take offense.
The dangerous repressive reactionaries are people who can effectively propose
repressive, reactionary policies. I stand fully behind my observation that
there are groups besides the terrorists who seek to take advantage of public
fear.

If that's the "cheapest shot you have ever seen", you really need to get out
more.


We should be fully asserting and exercising our freedoms, not compromising
them. Sort of a way of saying "Yeah? Well watch this you scum sucking murdering
*******s, we're as free as we ever have been. You terrorists live in nations
where the individual rights are suppressed for the benefit of the government,
but in the US we are a free people and we will never surrender our liberties!"

Learn to distrust big government. Learn to distrust big government unrestricted
by the Constitution even more. Fear a legislature
that blindly does the bidding of the executive branch rather than perform its
vital check and balance function. D's and R's alike.

Gould,
No, I was referring to basskisser's post. I should have made that more clear,
but I let the heat of the moment overcome me.
I was a firefighter for 28 years. I take the loss of life there VERY
seriously.
Cliff

The NYFD showed the world what it was made of on 9-11.

How many guts did it take to run *into* the second burning tower when its twin
brother had already collapsed? Not many of us
ever face a situation where we are faced with "If I do my duty, there is an
extremely high probability that I will die in the next half hour." To face that
proposition and do your duty anyway is just flat out courageous and well beyond
the normal decisions most of us make, most of the time. Fortunately, even our
police and firemen don't have to face a 9-11 decision every day.

**** you
"basskisser" wrote in message
om...
On this day, 9/11, let's pause to remember.

I remember the workers at Ground Zero, who were told by the new and
improved E.P.A., that the air was safe to breath.

I remember the 19 highjackers, all of whom were NOT from Iraq.

I remember the nations of Europe, who used to be our allies, and would
stick with us, who are now alienated from us.

I remember Osama's relatives, who were allowed free and easy transit
out of the United States.

I remember the firefighters who risked their lives at Ground Zero,
who, because of budget cuts from Bush, have had six of their
firehouses closed.

I remember the public relations stunt by the government to dupe people
into thinking that some heroics were involved in the saving of Jessica
Lynch.

I remember Bush in a flight suit, acting smug, and sticking his chest
out like he is actually a hero.

I remember what a shambles we left Afganistan in, the country is still
run mostly by warlords, and Al Queda.

I remember we went to Iraq for Weapons of Mass Destruction.

Mostly, I remember the men and women who are so wrapped up in their
political party, that they still believe all of the drivel that the
Bush administration shoves down their throat.

(Chief3mfc) wrote in message ...
That is beyond a doubt, the cheapest shot I have ever seen.
To take the events of two years ago and distort them to fit YOUR agenda is
lower than the acts of those that perpatrated the attacks.
The politics here have hit an all time low.
YOU SHOULD BE ASHAMED!
(And also damned glad you weren't in front of me when you said it)

Cliff


What part of it do you disagree with? All truth, and the truth should
be told. I'm patriotic, as opposed to goose stepping to the furor, no
matter how wrong he is. And, I'd be MORE than happy to be "in front of
you" when I said it.

"Michael Seeley" wrote in message link.net...
**** you

Hmm, I take it that is some ignorant way of saying you disagree? Which
parts do you find not true?

"basskisser" wrote in message
om...
On this day, 9/11, let's pause to remember.

I remember the workers at Ground Zero, who were told by the new and
improved E.P.A., that the air was safe to breath.

I remember the 19 highjackers, all of whom were NOT from Iraq.

I remember the nations of Europe, who used to be our allies, and would
stick with us, who are now alienated from us.

I remember Osama's relatives, who were allowed free and easy transit
out of the United States.

I remember the firefighters who risked their lives at Ground Zero,
who, because of budget cuts from Bush, have had six of their
firehouses closed.

I remember the public relations stunt by the government to dupe people
into thinking that some heroics were involved in the saving of Jessica
Lynch.

I remember Bush in a flight suit, acting smug, and sticking his chest
out like he is actually a hero.

I remember what a shambles we left Afganistan in, the country is still
run mostly by warlords, and Al Queda.

I remember we went to Iraq for Weapons of Mass Destruction.

Mostly, I remember the men and women who are so wrapped up in their
political party, that they still believe all of the drivel that the
Bush administration shoves down their throat.

EVERY DAMN PART OF THE
STATEMENT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!
There was the EPA, the City of NY, the State of NY, and private labs working
for the contractors on the cleanup. They all reported the same results. A
few hot spots but overall OK. I guess someone as brilliant as you can see
or know of the conspiracy in everything and anything.
Bill

"basskisser" wrote in message
om...
"Michael Seeley" wrote in message
link.net...
**** you

Hmm, I take it that is some ignorant way of saying you disagree? Which
parts do you find not true?

"basskisser" wrote in message
om...
On this day, 9/11, let's pause to remember.

I remember the workers at Ground Zero, who were told by the new and
improved E.P.A., that the air was safe to breath.

I remember the 19 highjackers, all of whom were NOT from Iraq.

I remember the nations of Europe, who used to be our allies, and would
stick with us, who are now alienated from us.

I remember Osama's relatives, who were allowed free and easy transit
out of the United States.

I remember the firefighters who risked their lives at Ground Zero,
who, because of budget cuts from Bush, have had six of their
firehouses closed.

I remember the public relations stunt by the government to dupe people
into thinking that some heroics were involved in the saving of Jessica
Lynch.

I remember Bush in a flight suit, acting smug, and sticking his chest
out like he is actually a hero.

I remember what a shambles we left Afganistan in, the country is still
run mostly by warlords, and Al Queda.

I remember we went to Iraq for Weapons of Mass Destruction.

Mostly, I remember the men and women who are so wrapped up in their
political party, that they still believe all of the drivel that the
Bush administration shoves down their throat.

Is your local firehouse and fire protection district a Federally run
operation?
Bill

"basskisser" wrote in message
om...
(Chief3mfc) wrote in message
...
Gould,
No, I was referring to basskisser's post. I should have made that more
clear,
but I let the heat of the moment overcome me.
I was a firefighter for 28 years. I take the loss of life there VERY
seriously.
Cliff


As you should. I do to. So, where did I say that I didn't take loss of
life seriously? Quite the contrary. I think that BUSH doesn't. How do
you feel about 6 of the firehouses in the vicinity of the World Trade
Centers being closed due to government budget cuts?

Is your local firehouse and fire protection district a Federally run
operation?
Bill

Bill, you'll find that under the Patriot Act the US GOVT can require local
governments to perform certain functions related to national security. In many
cases, these are additional duties that carry an expensive price tag.

In spite of the fact that we are running up a
record deficit, certain things are still going unpaid......(Good grief, how
much would we be spending if we were living up to all of our
promises?)........and among those things are the monies that the FEDGOV
promised city, county, and state governments to pay for the federally mandated
security measures.

That's the relationship between decisions made on the FEDGOV level, and closing
the local firehouse.