On May 20, 2:46*am, "Eisboch" wrote:
"Calif Bill" wrote in message

m...

From son in law:

Yes, it's true. *The main problem is Boeing's delay of their Block IIF
satellites. *The AF is planning to buy 12 of them.

IIF was originally supposed to launch in 2000.... then 2004..... now late
2009 (optimistically).

It's not all Boeing's fault. *The Gov't caused a lot of problems with
requirements creep, ill defined needs, and late design changes. *You can
read the GAO report online. *It' has all the gory detail.

I think they should put new tubes in the old LORAN system transmitters and
keep 'em running for a while.

Eisboch

A lot of folks would agree.....

On May 20, 6:16*am, "D.Duck" wrote:
"Eisboch" wrote in message

...





"Calif Bill" wrote in message
om...
From son in law:

Yes, it's true. *The main problem is Boeing's delay of their Block IIF
satellites. *The AF is planning to buy 12 of them.

IIF was originally supposed to launch in 2000.... then 2004..... now late
2009 (optimistically).

It's not all Boeing's fault. *The Gov't caused a lot of problems with
requirements creep, ill defined needs, and late design changes. *You can
read the GAO report online. *It' has all the gory detail.

I think they should put new tubes in the old LORAN system transmitters and
keep 'em running for a while.

Eisboch

They'd probably have to get the "tubes" from Russia.

You obviously don't know where to buy tubes......

"Wizard of Woodstock" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 20 May 2009 17:25:21 -0700, "Calif Bill"
wrote:


"Wizard of Woodstock" wrote in message
. ..
On Wed, 20 May 2009 02:46:50 -0400, "Eisboch"
wrote:

I think they should put new tubes in the old LORAN system transmitters
and
keep 'em running for a while.

There 'ya go - Tubes.

WHOO HOO!!!

~~ From a radio Luddite ~~

Last Loran I had did not have Valves.

You know - you could make the argument that transistors are nothing
more than solid state vacuum tubes.

Which would make them valves.


Heat up that xsister and you have neither

"Eisboch" wrote in message
...

"Wizard of Woodstock" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 20 May 2009 17:25:21 -0700, "Calif Bill"
wrote:


"Wizard of Woodstock" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 20 May 2009 02:46:50 -0400, "Eisboch"
wrote:

I think they should put new tubes in the old LORAN system transmitters
and
keep 'em running for a while.

There 'ya go - Tubes.

WHOO HOO!!!

~~ From a radio Luddite ~~

Last Loran I had did not have Valves.

You know - you could make the argument that transistors are nothing
more than solid state vacuum tubes.

Which would make them valves.




True, but in conventional wisdom, tubes are valves, transistors are simply
"solid state".

For Calif Bill's benefit, I wasn't referring to a LORAN receiver which is
most assuredly solid state.
I was speaking of the transmitters that are very likely to still use big
old vacuum tube power amp outputs.

Eisboch

I know all about those transmitters. Worked on Loran and Tacan in the USAF.
You know. Military Light.

"Wizard of Woodstock" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 20 May 2009 20:53:26 -0400, "Eisboch"
wrote:


"Wizard of Woodstock" wrote in message
. ..
On Wed, 20 May 2009 17:25:21 -0700, "Calif Bill"
wrote:


"Wizard of Woodstock" wrote in message
m...
On Wed, 20 May 2009 02:46:50 -0400, "Eisboch"
wrote:

I think they should put new tubes in the old LORAN system transmitters
and
keep 'em running for a while.

There 'ya go - Tubes.

WHOO HOO!!!

~~ From a radio Luddite ~~

Last Loran I had did not have Valves.

You know - you could make the argument that transistors are nothing
more than solid state vacuum tubes.

Which would make them valves.

True, but in conventional wisdom, tubes are valves, transistors are simply
"solid state".

For Calif Bill's benefit, I wasn't referring to a LORAN receiver which is
most assuredly solid state.
I was speaking of the transmitters that are very likely to still use big
old
vacuum tube power amp outputs.

MORE POWER!!!

3CX3000A7 baby....

Funniest event during school at Keesler was during a TACAN class. We ran
the units on Low Power. Only 3000 volts on the tubes. About 3kw dummy
load. We had a Vietnamese MAP student in the class. Had absolutely no
common sense when it came to electricity! When you needed to work on the
unit, you turned the dial on the front of the drawer to zero. Open the
drawer and use a shorting bar to make sure all the caps are discharged. The
kid did not bother turning down the power, and opened the drawer and
proceeded to touch the shorting bar everywhere. Sparks bouncing off the 12'
ceiling and he never realized something was wrong or even different. The
instructor was in shock, the rest of us were in hysterics.

"Calif Bill" wrote in message
...


Funniest event during school at Keesler was during a TACAN class. We ran
the units on Low Power. Only 3000 volts on the tubes. About 3kw dummy
load. We had a Vietnamese MAP student in the class. Had absolutely no
common sense when it came to electricity! When you needed to work on the
unit, you turned the dial on the front of the drawer to zero. Open the
drawer and use a shorting bar to make sure all the caps are discharged.
The kid did not bother turning down the power, and opened the drawer and
proceeded to touch the shorting bar everywhere. Sparks bouncing off the
12' ceiling and he never realized something was wrong or even different.
The instructor was in shock, the rest of us were in hysterics.


I have been just as stupid. While on a mid-watch at a Navy transmitter
site in Puerto Rico, I was working on an old AN/FRT-40 HF transmitter.
Shut the thing down, opened the rear door to the power supply section and
then was interrupted by a phone call or something. When I returned to the
transmitter, I hit my hand against a connection to one of the huge power
supply filter capacitors and discharged it through me. The muscle
contractions caused me to fly backwards about 7 feet back and about 4 feet
up against the building wall and for several minutes all I saw were stars.

I was lucky. That was my first high voltage, high current experience.
Had another later as a civilian that was worse.
Knocked me out cold and was rushed to the emergency room. Fortunately, no
permanent injury other than some bad burns on my hands.

Eisboch

"Eisboch" wrote in message
...

"Calif Bill" wrote in message
...


Funniest event during school at Keesler was during a TACAN class. We ran
the units on Low Power. Only 3000 volts on the tubes. About 3kw dummy
load. We had a Vietnamese MAP student in the class. Had absolutely no
common sense when it came to electricity! When you needed to work on the
unit, you turned the dial on the front of the drawer to zero. Open the
drawer and use a shorting bar to make sure all the caps are discharged.
The kid did not bother turning down the power, and opened the drawer and
proceeded to touch the shorting bar everywhere. Sparks bouncing off the
12' ceiling and he never realized something was wrong or even different.
The instructor was in shock, the rest of us were in hysterics.


I have been just as stupid. While on a mid-watch at a Navy transmitter
site in Puerto Rico, I was working on an old AN/FRT-40 HF transmitter.
Shut the thing down, opened the rear door to the power supply section and
then was interrupted by a phone call or something. When I returned to the
transmitter, I hit my hand against a connection to one of the huge power
supply filter capacitors and discharged it through me. The muscle
contractions caused me to fly backwards about 7 feet back and about 4 feet
up against the building wall and for several minutes all I saw were stars.

I was lucky. That was my first high voltage, high current experience.
Had another later as a civilian that was worse.
Knocked me out cold and was rushed to the emergency room. Fortunately,
no permanent injury other than some bad burns on my hands.

Eisboch


My episode was checking the voltage on an airborne radar unit out of a
probably C-141. Do not remember the model number anymore. 400 VDC and a
meter lead unlike any I have ever seen before or sense. Had an extra ring
on the insulated part that was hot to the probe. About 20' later I get up
off the floor. Having missed every workbench and stand in the area. My
muscles hurt for at least 3 days afterwards.

On May 22, 2:07*am, "Calif Bill" wrote:
"Eisboch" wrote in message

...





"Calif Bill" wrote in message
...

Funniest event during school at Keesler was during a TACAN class. *We ran
the units on Low Power. *Only 3000 volts on the tubes. *About 3kw dummy
load. *We had a Vietnamese MAP student in the class. *Had absolutely no
common sense when it came to electricity! *When you needed to work on the
unit, you turned the dial on the front of the drawer to zero. *Open the
drawer and use a shorting bar to make sure all the caps are discharged..
The kid did not bother turning down the power, and opened the drawer and
proceeded to touch the shorting bar everywhere. *Sparks bouncing off the
12' ceiling and he never realized something was wrong or even different.

wrote:
On May 22, 2:07 am, "Calif Bill" wrote:
"Eisboch" wrote in message

...





"Calif Bill" wrote in message
...
Funniest event during school at Keesler was during a TACAN class. We ran
the units on Low Power. Only 3000 volts on the tubes. About 3kw dummy
load. We had a Vietnamese MAP student in the class. Had absolutely no
common sense when it came to electricity! When you needed to work on the
unit, you turned the dial on the front of the drawer to zero. Open the
drawer and use a shorting bar to make sure all the caps are discharged.
The kid did not bother turning down the power, and opened the drawer and
proceeded to touch the shorting bar everywhere. Sparks bouncing off the
12' ceiling and he never realized something was wrong or even different.
The instructor was in shock, the rest of us were in hysterics.
I have been just as stupid. While on a mid-watch at a Navy transmitter
site in Puerto Rico, I was working on an old AN/FRT-40 HF transmitter.
Shut the thing down, opened the rear door to the power supply section and
then was interrupted by a phone call or something. When I returned to the
transmitter, I hit my hand against a connection to one of the huge power
supply filter capacitors and discharged it through me. The muscle
contractions caused me to fly backwards about 7 feet back and about 4 feet
up against the building wall and for several minutes all I saw were stars.
I was lucky. That was my first high voltage, high current experience.
Had another later as a civilian that was worse.
Knocked me out cold and was rushed to the emergency room. Fortunately,
no permanent injury other than some bad burns on my hands.
Eisboch
My episode was checking the voltage on an airborne radar unit out of a
probably C-141. Do not remember the model number anymore. 400 VDC and a
meter lead unlike any I have ever seen before or sense. Had an extra ring
on the insulated part that was hot to the probe. About 20' later I get up
off the floor. Having missed every workbench and stand in the area. My
muscles hurt for at least 3 days afterwards.

Kinda like tricking some fool into ****ing on an Electric Fence.


Ooohhh....we could get Loogy/JustHate to do that...and Tom could
videotape it!

wrote in message
...
On May 22, 2:07 am, "Calif Bill" wrote:
"Eisboch" wrote in message

...





"Calif Bill" wrote in message
...

Funniest event during school at Keesler was during a TACAN class. We
ran
the units on Low Power. Only 3000 volts on the tubes. About 3kw dummy
load. We had a Vietnamese MAP student in the class. Had absolutely no
common sense when it came to electricity! When you needed to work on
the
unit, you turned the dial on the front of the drawer to zero. Open the
drawer and use a shorting bar to make sure all the caps are discharged.
The kid did not bother turning down the power, and opened the drawer
and
proceeded to touch the shorting bar everywhere. Sparks bouncing off the
12' ceiling and he never realized something was wrong or even
different.
The instructor was in shock, the rest of us were in hysterics.

I have been just as stupid. While on a mid-watch at a Navy transmitter
site in Puerto Rico, I was working on an old AN/FRT-40 HF transmitter.
Shut the thing down, opened the rear door to the power supply section
and
then was interrupted by a phone call or something. When I returned to
the
transmitter, I hit my hand against a connection to one of the huge power
supply filter capacitors and discharged it through me. The muscle
contractions caused me to fly backwards about 7 feet back and about 4
feet
up against the building wall and for several minutes all I saw were
stars.

I was lucky. That was my first high voltage, high current experience.
Had another later as a civilian that was worse.
Knocked me out cold and was rushed to the emergency room. Fortunately,
no permanent injury other than some bad burns on my hands.

Eisboch

My episode was checking the voltage on an airborne radar unit out of a
probably C-141. Do not remember the model number anymore. 400 VDC and a
meter lead unlike any I have ever seen before or sense. Had an extra ring
on the insulated part that was hot to the probe. About 20' later I get up
off the floor. Having missed every workbench and stand in the area. My
muscles hurt for at least 3 days afterwards.

Kinda like tricking some fool into ****ing on an Electric Fence.

Hurt much worse than touching an electric fence. Was smart enough to not
**** on one.