K Smith wrote:



You really have no clue do you??


Since you are totally devoid of any recognized credentials in the area
of engine design, rebuilding, repair or maintenance, and most likely
have never even seen a FICHT or even an OptiMax engine's innards, it
more easily may be concluded that *you* are the clueless one on this matter.

Moreover, you obviously have a hidden agenda here.

Got a college degree in anything? Got an engineering degree in anything?
Ever worked as a senior level mechanic? Ever been to a high-level
training school for mechanics? Ever been published in a professional
magazine?

I didn't think so. The best guess is that you once worked as a
receptionist, phone answerer and coffee go-fer for a little boatyard in
Australia.



--
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email sent to will *never* get to me.

Harry Krause wrote:
K Smith wrote:


You really have no clue do you??



Since you are totally devoid of any recognized credentials in the area
of engine design, rebuilding, repair or maintenance, and most likely
have never even seen a FICHT or even an OptiMax engine's innards, it
more easily may be concluded that *you* are the clueless one on this matter.

Moreover, you obviously have a hidden agenda here.

Got a college degree in anything? Got an engineering degree in anything?
Ever worked as a senior level mechanic? Ever been to a high-level
training school for mechanics? Ever been published in a professional
magazine?

I didn't think so. The best guess is that you once worked as a
receptionist, phone answerer and coffee go-fer for a little boatyard in
Australia.




Here's another of your lies for you Harry, it's a measure of your lack
of anything that you don't realise just how stupid your stories are.
Your education lies?? you are the master of cut & paste never ever
any5thing original let alone anything that might take some
understanding, then there's your complete lack of boating knowledge,
when compared to your lies.

Here's another of your obvious lies for you, seeing a pattern?? yes
mental illness.

As far as your other complaints, well, almost every president in my memory,
and I *remember* Truman, Eisenhower (who cheated on his wife), Kennedy,
Johnson, Nixon, Ford, Carter, Reagan and Bush, lied and participated in
deceit to one degree or another, and on issues far more important than who
was giving them blow jobs.

Good lord. I met *every* president in the damned group except Bush, and I
worked once for his father.

paste of Harry the king of BS from 97;

Have you ever sailed from San Francisco to Hawaii? I have.
Have you ever rounded Cape Horn? I have, twice.
Have you ever transited the Panama Canal? I have.
Have you owned more than 20 boats in your lifetime? I have.
Have you ever sailed large boats competitively? I have.
Have you ever been hundreds of miles from land in a powerboat under your
command? I have.

Bill,

Great post...fact as opposed to "Ka Ka".

My 2000 115 Ficht still runs great. I wouldn't have any other motor.

Nick in Spartanburg, SC

"Billgran" wrote in message
...

"Jim and Becky" wrote in message
. ..
So, has the Ficht issue been resolved on brand new models?
If so what would be considered the most recent year that they are
considered
reliable?
What was the first year of Ficht?


FICHT history


The first production FICHT came out as a 20" shaft 150hp Johnson or
Evinrude
in late 1996 and was targeted for the bass boat and sport boat models. It
worked as designed and had won the Popular Science innovation award.

In '98, the came out with the V4 90-115hp and the 175, along with extra
long
shaft lengths for the offshore boats. In some applications, usually larger
boats that were over-propped, problems developed in the 150-175 series.
The
then president of OMC David Jones said that about 20% had problems and had
a
crash program to find out why and what to do about fixing it. According to
findings from consultants all over the world, hired by OMC, the
abrasiveness
of soot buildup due to poor mid-range combustion scored the internal parts
of the motor. All the boating magazines had articles about it and what the
company was doing about it. This was published also in the Australian and
European press.

The factory then spent big bucks sending special teams around the country
installing cylinder head and software fixes to the thousands of engines
that
were being used and made an upgrade kit available for dealer installation.
By then the 2000 models were ready for production and contained not only
the
fixes, but a second generation design called FICHT Ram. The computers were
more powerful and now were complete engine management modules, including
charging system operation. The new motors worked well and ran even
smoother
and more powerful than their predecessors. Boat tests and consumer tests
showed they were OK for all applications. For 2001 the big block V-6's
were
redesigned to a larger 3.3L block for the 200-225-250hp models. The first
20-225 models came out in '99 with a 3.0L block and worked OK, they did
not
have the application problems of the 150-175 series of that year, either
did
the V4 90-115"s.

The 2001 Evinrude FICHTS finished a close 2nd to Yamaha in the J.D.
Power's
survey that year and got an honorable mention (along with the Honda 130
4-stroke) the previous year.

OMC had money problems for quite a few years, had bad management
decisions,
then had a corporate raider as an owner, then when the corporate raider
was
indicted in a French banking scandal, he declared bankruptcy for the
company
after raiding the pension fund, according to stories in the papers.

Bombardier bought the assets in the bankruptcy auction and re-introduced
the
motors after building and up-to-date plant and improving quality control
of
the vendors and manufacturers. The 2002 models and later are next to
bulletproof and are more economical to run than the equivalent 4-stroke
models. The total emissions are even less than the 4-strokes. The motors
do
not run lean at power as someone posts over and over again. They use a
stratified charge at settings below 15% throttle opening, which on a
2-stroke is way less than 15% power output. Some aircraft engines are
leaned
out up to 75% power output without problems, according to their operating
handbooks. My old IO-360 Continental 6 cylinder aircraft motor allowed, if
I
remember correctly, 50 degrees lean of peak at cruise settings.

Since Bombardier took over, you do not hear about problems with the motors
on this or any other newsgroup. The bass boat crowd loves the HO series
200-225 models made specifically for those boats.

Like many things, the early problems in some situations were overblown and
rumors were spread mostly by those who were not familiar with the product
and what was being done. A lot of what you read and will read in this
newsgroup is from a small contingent of individuals who do not work on or
operate the motors, yet post lines and lines of hear-say, and even made up
stuff. Some even rant and rave and go off on a tangent since they do not
have the knowledge of what is happening.

FICHT and now its new generation called E-TECH are working well. The more
stringent future emission laws on the books and proposed, are easily met
today, where 4-strokes may need expensive catalytic converters, etc. to
comply. In the small motor categories, the carbureted 4-strokes cannot
meet
2008 and later specs, but future E-TECH motors will. I watched a 3hp
single
cylinder ETECH outboard rope start and run smoothly, and that was over a
year ago.

Bottom line is the 2000 and later 150-175hp FICHTS do not have problems
with
the design, but like some things, the reputation from 6 years ago still
gets
regurgitated.

Bill Grannis
service manager

"Billgran" wrote in message
...

"Jim and Becky" wrote in message
. ..
So, has the Ficht issue been resolved on brand new models?
If so what would be considered the most recent year that they are
considered
reliable?
What was the first year of Ficht?


FICHT history


The first production FICHT came out as a 20" shaft 150hp Johnson or
Evinrude
in late 1996 and was targeted for the bass boat and sport boat models.
It
worked as designed and had won the Popular Science innovation award.

In '98, the came out with the V4 90-115hp and the 175, along with
extra long
shaft lengths for the offshore boats. In some applications, usually
larger
boats that were over-propped, problems developed in the 150-175
series. The
then president of OMC David Jones said that about 20% had problems and
had a
crash program to find out why and what to do about fixing it.
According to
findings from consultants all over the world, hired by OMC, the
abrasiveness
of soot buildup due to poor mid-range combustion scored the internal
parts
of the motor. All the boating magazines had articles about it and what
the
company was doing about it. This was published also in the Australian
and
European press.

The factory then spent big bucks sending special teams around the
country
installing cylinder head and software fixes to the thousands of
engines that
were being used and made an upgrade kit available for dealer
installation.
By then the 2000 models were ready for production and contained not
only the
fixes, but a second generation design called FICHT Ram. The computers
were
more powerful and now were complete engine management modules,
including
charging system operation. The new motors worked well and ran even
smoother
and more powerful than their predecessors. Boat tests and consumer
tests
showed they were OK for all applications. For 2001 the big block V-6's
were
redesigned to a larger 3.3L block for the 200-225-250hp models. The
first
20-225 models came out in '99 with a 3.0L block and worked OK, they
did not
have the application problems of the 150-175 series of that year,
either did
the V4 90-115"s.

The 2001 Evinrude FICHTS finished a close 2nd to Yamaha in the J.D.
Power's
survey that year and got an honorable mention (along with the Honda
130
4-stroke) the previous year.

snip
Bottom line is the 2000 and later 150-175hp FICHTS do not have
problems with
the design, but like some things, the reputation from 6 years ago
still gets
regurgitated.

Bill Grannis
service manager


So to net it out, you would say that only the 150-175 models from
1997-1999 had reliability problems and those were related to
applications on heavy boats that were overpropped? If the fixes to the
earlier models did the job, why did they have to come out with the ram
stuff?

I am perfectly willing to admit I have no access to the statistics and
failure rates, so am asking these questions honestly in a spirit of
inquiry and interest in new technology. I am also still trying to
figure out how an Etec injector works. The Ficht used a metal rod driven
by an external solenoid. What is the difference in Etec? Got a patent
number or two?

del cecchi

I am also still trying to
figure out how an Etec injector works. The Ficht used a metal rod driven
by an external solenoid. What is the difference in Etec? Got a patent
number or two?

del cecchi


Hi Del,

It's been a long time.

Check out Patent No.6398511 B1. It works like an audio speaker where a pulse
of current makes the "armature" move forward, then an opposite pulse stops
it and returns the "armature" to its home position. Unlike the FICHT
injector, it does not depend on springs to return it to start its cycle all
over again. It still is a "linear motor" attached to a pump, but according
to the factory folks, it is not only more precise in delivery and supposidly
operational up to 10,000 rpm, but it can "pump" more fuel in a shorter time
frame so higher horsepower motors are possible. That is why Yamaha has to
use such high pressures, now up to 1000 psi, is to flow enough fuel in the
short amount of time it has between exhaust port closing and igntion. They
still have to start fuel injection before the exhaust is closed and that is
why they cannot meet 2008 emission specs, but only the 2006 ones..

From what I understand, OMC was working on this years back and now
Bombardier has the resources to get it into production. It is a Bombardier
patent and is not infringing on any Ficht family patents so they do not have
to use the FICHT name.

I haven't gotten to see or play with one yet but reports from the field
testers say the E-TECH idles very slow and doesn't even ripple the water
because it is so smooth. Time will tell when the production models roll off
the line next month. According to Bombardier, by next year's model
introduction, they will be the first company to have all their motors meet
2008 emission limits.

I did watch a 3hp rope start E-TECH run 2 years ago. Carbureted small hp
4-strokes can't meet the more stringent emission levels, but E-TECH can.

Bill Grannis
service manager

del cecchi wrote:
"Billgran" wrote in message
om...


I am also still trying to

figure out how an Etec injector works. The Ficht used a metal rod

driven

by an external solenoid. What is the difference in Etec? Got a

patent

number or two?

del cecchi


Hi Del,

It's been a long time.

Check out Patent No.6398511 B1. It works like an audio speaker where a

pulse

of current makes the "armature" move forward, then an opposite pulse

stops

it and returns the "armature" to its home position. Unlike the FICHT
injector, it does not depend on springs to return it to start its

cycle all

over again. It still is a "linear motor" attached to a pump, but

according

to the factory folks, it is not only more precise in delivery and

supposidly

operational up to 10,000 rpm, but it can "pump" more fuel in a shorter

time

frame so higher horsepower motors are possible. That is why Yamaha has

to

use such high pressures, now up to 1000 psi, is to flow enough fuel in

the

short amount of time it has between exhaust port closing and igntion.

They

still have to start fuel injection before the exhaust is closed and

that is

why they cannot meet 2008 emission specs, but only the 2006 ones..

From what I understand, OMC was working on this years back and now
Bombardier has the resources to get it into production. It is a

Bombardier

patent and is not infringing on any Ficht family patents so they do

not have

to use the FICHT name.

I haven't gotten to see or play with one yet but reports from the

field

testers say the E-TECH idles very slow and doesn't even ripple the

water

because it is so smooth. Time will tell when the production models

roll off

the line next month. According to Bombardier, by next year's model
introduction, they will be the first company to have all their motors

meet

2008 emission limits.

I did watch a 3hp rope start E-TECH run 2 years ago. Carbureted small

hp

4-strokes can't meet the more stringent emission levels, but E-TECH

can.

Bill Grannis
service manager


Thanks for the patent pointer. The voice coil in a speaker or in a disk
drive is in a magnetic field from a perm. magnet, and is attached to the
cone or arm. I'm having trouble figuring out how the voice coil creates
the fuel pressure. Push on a rod or diaphram maybe?

I'll take a look at the patent when I am on wideband.

del cecchi




I mentioned at least a year ago that Ficht were mucking around with
capacitors, trying yet again to get something for nothing (NB patent
date 4 June 2002).

In short this is Ficht sans the name & if you read the patent look at
the effort they've put into making sure there's no mention of what
happens inside the "pump" part i.e. it's still the same old impact pump
with the same original defects from 98 not enough pressure, not enough
flow, not enough atomisation & still trying to meet regs with lean
mixtures, all = detonation failures in too high a percentage to be a
commercial proposition.

As I suggested when I first mentioned the capacitor thing, they are
well aware of the problem but have no solution, this is just more of the
same old OMC experimentation with consumers' money!! They've increased
the size of the electrical system so much that now they're trying to
milk as much energy out of it vs times available, as possible, trouble
is it's literally re-arranging deck chairs on the S(unken) S(hi.) Ficht.

It can't work any more than the original Ficht did & as then, the same
NG dealer lackies will deceive, spruik & BS.

K

"K Smith" wrote in message
...
del cecchi wrote:
snip
Thanks for the patent pointer. The voice coil in a speaker or in a
disk
drive is in a magnetic field from a perm. magnet, and is attached to
the
cone or arm. I'm having trouble figuring out how the voice coil
creates
the fuel pressure. Push on a rod or diaphram maybe?

I'll take a look at the patent when I am on wideband.

del cecchi




I mentioned at least a year ago that Ficht were mucking around with
capacitors, trying yet again to get something for nothing (NB patent
date 4 June 2002).

Recovering energy from the magnetic field and storing it in a capacitor
to be reused isn't something for nothing.


In short this is Ficht sans the name & if you read the patent look at
the effort they've put into making sure there's no mention of what
happens inside the "pump" part i.e. it's still the same old impact
pump
with the same original defects from 98 not enough pressure, not enough
flow, not enough atomisation & still trying to meet regs with lean
mixtures, all = detonation failures in too high a percentage to be a
commercial proposition.

Actually there is a patent under Bombardier for a spiffy new nozzle
also. :-)
And one on cold starting.

Hard to imagine the workings of an injector for an idling 3hp engine,
isn't it?


snip

It can't work any more than the original Ficht did & as then, the same
NG dealer lackies will deceive, spruik & BS.

K

It's their job. :-) If they didn't believe the mfg, then they couldn't
be dealers of that brand for long.

I haven't had time to read the patents well enough to see if there is
momentum involved or if it is a straightforward hydraulic pump deal.

del

del cecchi wrote:
"K Smith" wrote in message
...

del cecchi wrote:

snip

Thanks for the patent pointer. The voice coil in a speaker or in a

disk

drive is in a magnetic field from a perm. magnet, and is attached to

the

cone or arm. I'm having trouble figuring out how the voice coil

creates

the fuel pressure. Push on a rod or diaphram maybe?

I'll take a look at the patent when I am on wideband.

del cecchi




I mentioned at least a year ago that Ficht were mucking around with
capacitors, trying yet again to get something for nothing (NB patent
date 4 June 2002).


Recovering energy from the magnetic field and storing it in a capacitor
to be reused isn't something for nothing.


Exactly!! & this encapsulates their problem, to take pressures from
circulation to anything worthwhile in DFI terms (remember Yam are now up
at 1000psi of petrol) then back down to circulation again to recharge
the chamber in the time available per stroke for a high revving 2
stroke, takes energy & lots of it?? How much?? don't know, but you &
Marcus were starting to work it out years ago but ......

The impact injectors don't really increase the fuel pressure they just
impact velocity. The ups & downs cancel each other save some small
spillage, which isn't even a pump as such. i.e. there is no actual
displacement of the fluid.


In short this is Ficht sans the name & if you read the patent look at
the effort they've put into making sure there's no mention of what
happens inside the "pump" part i.e. it's still the same old impact

pump

with the same original defects from 98 not enough pressure, not enough
flow, not enough atomisation & still trying to meet regs with lean
mixtures, all = detonation failures in too high a percentage to be a
commercial proposition.


Actually there is a patent under Bombardier for a spiffy new nozzle
also. :-)
And one on cold starting.

They're prolific as OMC were. I think we've discussed before it's a tactic.


Hard to imagine the workings of an injector for an idling 3hp engine,
isn't it?

Well it's a spruiking story I'm sure we'll hear oft enough as they try
to sell these things again, we heard some doozies the first time around
& as then some will believe & some won't, however I'm hoping this time
people will be at least a bit wary of the dealers BS.



snip

It can't work any more than the original Ficht did & as then, the same
NG dealer lackies will deceive, spruik & BS.

K


It's their job. :-) If they didn't believe the mfg, then they couldn't
be dealers of that brand for long.

I guess that's fair enough but this NG is different, if they want to
advertise with deceptions there are plenty of forums etc for that, this
is supposed to be open discussion without spam. I accept I overreact but
don't apologise, I've had a flogging from these individuals over the
years & will not be silenced by bullies this time anymore than I was the
first time.


I haven't had time to read the patents well enough to see if there is
momentum involved or if it is a straightforward hydraulic pump deal.

They don't say; the patent concentrates on the drive system. I suspect
they have a license problem with Ficht if they use any of Ficht's
material & clearly they're desperate to dump the Ficht name (don't blame
them:-)) but to persist with the consumer funded experiments is outright
sad, if not illegal. This time I'm betting the good ol' boys will sue on
mass, as they should have the first time.

K

del

Harry Krause wrote:
K Smith wrote:

Here's another of your obvious lies for you, seeing a pattern?? yes
mental illness. Add the stalking of a NG member in real life & a
dangerous liar to boot.

Hows the Lobster boat & Parker lies going Harry???, you are full of crap.


As far as your other complaints, well, almost every president in my
memory,
and I *remember* Truman, Eisenhower (who cheated on his wife), Kennedy,
Johnson, Nixon, Ford, Carter, Reagan and Bush, lied and participated in
deceit to one degree or another, and on issues far more important
than who
was giving them blow jobs.

Good lord. I met *every* president in the damned group except Bush, and I
worked once for his father.


paste of Harry the king of BS from 97;

Have you ever sailed from San Francisco to Hawaii? I have.
Have you ever rounded Cape Horn? I have, twice.
Have you ever transited the Panama Canal? I have.
Have you owned more than 20 boats in your lifetime? I have.
Have you ever sailed large boats competitively? I have.
Have you ever been hundreds of miles from land in a powerboat under your
command? I have.

K Smith wrote:
Harry Krause wrote:
K Smith wrote:

Here's another of your obvious lies for you, seeing a pattern?? yes
mental illness. Add the stalking of a NG member in real life & a
dangerous liar to boot.

Hows the Lobster boat & Parker lies going Harry???, you are full of crap.


The boats are fine, Karen. Still no credentials, eh?




--
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email sent to will *never* get to me.