Hello there Dave.

I received some feedback on the oil pan rusting issue. In fact, better
than that the potential buyer sent me some pictures taken by his surveyor
with a camera that was lowered down below the engines.

No question about it. They are toast. In fact, one has a big fiberglass
patch over a section of it and oil can be seen oozing out from behind the
patch. It obviously wasn't prepared properly. The other engine is not
patched, but the surveyor said it is well beyond the typical surface rust
that develops over time. It is ready to let go, in his opinion.

The survey report I had done last May says, "The engines, with exception of
the exhaust hoses running from the manifolds to the mufflers appear to be in
excellent condition and have been well maintained". No mention of
fiberglass patches on the oil pans. I had the referenced hoses replaced
before I picked up the boat.

So, replace the pans, I must before it is launched. Meanwhile the buyer
has decided to move on to find another boat, so this sale is dead. There
were some other typical and relatively minor issues of an older boat found
in the survey that wouldn't be a deal breaker, but they, combined with the
oil pans scared the buyer off, so to speak.

Lesson learned. A survey is highly desirable however the qualifications of
the surveyor needs to be verified. The one I had is a well established, well
known and recommended father/son operation out of Gloucester, MA. I thought
I had picked a good one. He was even recommended by the Haverhill, MA
harbormaster.

I also accept some of the responsibility. With all the boats I've owned,
old and new, and the knowledge and experiences I've gained (in addition to
$$$ spent) I should have investigated this boat more personally.

Oh well. No big deal. It can be fixed.

Eisboch

"Eisboch" wrote in message
...

Hello there Dave.

I received some feedback on the oil pan rusting issue. In fact, better
than that the potential buyer sent me some pictures taken by his surveyor
with a camera that was lowered down below the engines.

No question about it. They are toast. In fact, one has a big fiberglass
patch over a section of it and oil can be seen oozing out from behind the
patch. It obviously wasn't prepared properly. The other engine is not
patched, but the surveyor said it is well beyond the typical surface rust
that develops over time. It is ready to let go, in his opinion.

The survey report I had done last May says, "The engines, with exception
of the exhaust hoses running from the manifolds to the mufflers appear to
be in excellent condition and have been well maintained". No mention of
fiberglass patches on the oil pans. I had the referenced hoses
replaced before I picked up the boat.

So, replace the pans, I must before it is launched. Meanwhile the
buyer has decided to move on to find another boat, so this sale is dead.
There were some other typical and relatively minor issues of an older boat
found in the survey that wouldn't be a deal breaker, but they, combined
with the oil pans scared the buyer off, so to speak.

Lesson learned. A survey is highly desirable however the qualifications
of the surveyor needs to be verified. The one I had is a well established,
well known and recommended father/son operation out of Gloucester, MA. I
thought I had picked a good one. He was even recommended by the
Haverhill, MA harbormaster.

I also accept some of the responsibility. With all the boats I've owned,
old and new, and the knowledge and experiences I've gained (in addition
to $$$ spent) I should have investigated this boat more personally.

Oh well. No big deal. It can be fixed.

Eisboch


Sorry to butt in...but I assume you'll be sending a note to your surveyor
and whatever association he belongs to to report his carelessness last year.
As you said before...if a large amount of oil had leaked into the water in
your boating area...we'd probably have to go visit you on the weekends.

"Don White" wrote in message
...

"Eisboch" wrote in message
...

Hello there Dave.

I received some feedback on the oil pan rusting issue. In fact, better
than that the potential buyer sent me some pictures taken by his surveyor
with a camera that was lowered down below the engines.

No question about it. They are toast. In fact, one has a big
fiberglass patch over a section of it and oil can be seen oozing out from
behind the patch. It obviously wasn't prepared properly. The other
engine is not patched, but the surveyor said it is well beyond the
typical surface rust that develops over time. It is ready to let go, in
his opinion.

The survey report I had done last May says, "The engines, with exception
of the exhaust hoses running from the manifolds to the mufflers appear to
be in excellent condition and have been well maintained". No mention of
fiberglass patches on the oil pans. I had the referenced hoses
replaced before I picked up the boat.

So, replace the pans, I must before it is launched. Meanwhile the
buyer has decided to move on to find another boat, so this sale is dead.
There were some other typical and relatively minor issues of an older
boat found in the survey that wouldn't be a deal breaker, but they,
combined with the oil pans scared the buyer off, so to speak.

Lesson learned. A survey is highly desirable however the qualifications
of the surveyor needs to be verified. The one I had is a well
established, well known and recommended father/son operation out of
Gloucester, MA. I thought I had picked a good one. He was even
recommended by the Haverhill, MA harbormaster.

I also accept some of the responsibility. With all the boats I've owned,
old and new, and the knowledge and experiences I've gained (in addition
to $$$ spent) I should have investigated this boat more personally.

Oh well. No big deal. It can be fixed.

Eisboch


Sorry to butt in...but I assume you'll be sending a note to your surveyor
and whatever association he belongs to to report his carelessness last
year.
As you said before...if a large amount of oil had leaked into the water in
your boating area...we'd probably have to go visit you on the weekends.


Waste of time. Read the fine print of any surveyor's contract and you
will find that they are held harmless to anything they may have missed.

Eisboch

"Eisboch" wrote in message
...


Hello there Dave.

I received some feedback on the oil pan rusting issue. In fact, better
than that the potential buyer sent me some pictures taken by his
surveyor with a camera that was lowered down below the engines.



BTW .... I emailed a couple of the pictures to you. Interesting.

Eisboch

On Apr 17, 8:34*pm, "Eisboch" wrote:
"Eisboch" wrote in message

...



Hello there Dave.

I received some feedback on the oil pan rusting issue. * In fact, better
than that the potential buyer sent me some pictures taken by his
surveyor with a camera that was lowered down below the engines.

BTW .... I emailed a couple of the pictures to you. * Interesting.

Eisboch

hey Rich, send them to me too, if you please.

TSchnautz at gmail dot commmmmm.

"Tim" wrote in message
...
On Apr 17, 8:34 pm, "Eisboch" wrote:
"Eisboch" wrote in message

...



Hello there Dave.

I received some feedback on the oil pan rusting issue. In fact, better
than that the potential buyer sent me some pictures taken by his
surveyor with a camera that was lowered down below the engines.

BTW .... I emailed a couple of the pictures to you. Interesting.

Eisboch

hey Rich, send them to me too, if you please.

-----------------------------------------

sent

Eisboch

On Fri, 17 Apr 2009 20:10:16 -0400, Eisboch wrote:


Waste of time. Read the fine print of any surveyor's contract and
you will find that they are held harmless to anything they may have
missed.

It might not help you, but it might help the next customer of the
surveyor. If the guy is reputable, as his reputation suggests, he might
take a closer look on his future surveys.

"thunder" wrote in message
news
On Fri, 17 Apr 2009 20:10:16 -0400, Eisboch wrote:


Waste of time. Read the fine print of any surveyor's contract and
you will find that they are held harmless to anything they may have
missed.

It might not help you, but it might help the next customer of the
surveyor. If the guy is reputable, as his reputation suggests, he might
take a closer look on his future surveys.




More in frustration than anything else, I drafted and sent a e-mail to the
surveyor this morning indicating my displeasure with his service and
included pictures of the oil pans.

For those interested in what they look like, I put them on my website.

The first is the starboard engine oil pan that does not have the fiberglass
patch.

http://www.eisboch.com/starboardpan.jpg


This one is the port engine with the patch.

http://www.eisboch.com/portpanwithpatch.jpg


JiminFl made an interesting observation. The starboard dripless shaft seal
appears to have some white deposits on it.
It could be that it is leaking and spraying salt water onto the pan. I
don't know if this boat originally came with dripless shaft seals or not,
but it would still take several years to rust that badly, I would think.
The survey I had done was less than a year ago and his comments included,
"The engines appear to be in good condition and have been well maintained".

Right. I'd hate to see one that he considers to be in bad condition.


Eisboch

"Eisboch" wrote in message
...

"thunder" wrote in message
news
On Fri, 17 Apr 2009 20:10:16 -0400, Eisboch wrote:


Waste of time. Read the fine print of any surveyor's contract and
you will find that they are held harmless to anything they may have
missed.

It might not help you, but it might help the next customer of the
surveyor. If the guy is reputable, as his reputation suggests, he might
take a closer look on his future surveys.




More in frustration than anything else, I drafted and sent a e-mail to the
surveyor this morning indicating my displeasure with his service and
included pictures of the oil pans.

For those interested in what they look like, I put them on my website.

The first is the starboard engine oil pan that does not have the
fiberglass patch.

http://www.eisboch.com/starboardpan.jpg


This one is the port engine with the patch.

http://www.eisboch.com/portpanwithpatch.jpg


JiminFl made an interesting observation. The starboard dripless shaft
seal appears to have some white deposits on it.
It could be that it is leaking and spraying salt water onto the pan. I
don't know if this boat originally came with dripless shaft seals or not,
but it would still take several years to rust that badly, I would think.
The survey I had done was less than a year ago and his comments included,
"The engines appear to be in good condition and have been well
maintained".

Right. I'd hate to see one that he considers to be in bad condition.


Eisboch

Good move...if nothing else, he might be more careful with future customers.

Eisboch wrote:

Hello there Dave.
I received some feedback on the oil pan rusting issue. In fact, better
than that the potential buyer sent me some pictures taken by his
surveyor with a camera that was lowered down below the engines.

Nothing gets my attention more than my name in the subject line lol

It was great to see the pictures - they certainly tell the story.

Thanks for the update.


--
Regards,
Dave Brown
Brown's Marina Ltd
http://brownsmarina.com/