This accident with the NFL players off Clearwater where the boat
overturned is tragic. What went wrong? The weather forecast was poor
when they left shore, so what were they thinking? Was it simply a
matter of being too macho to exercise common sense?
Next, once a boat turns upside down, is there any way to right them?
Once righted, would a motor start (assume a 2 cycle).
I'd like to know how the boat was anchored, was it from the stern,
classical mistake resulting in this.
Going offshore with no EPIRB used to be acceptable but today?

On Mar 3, 11:30*am, Frogwatch wrote:
This accident with the NFL players off Clearwater where the boat
overturned is tragic. *What went wrong? *The weather forecast was poor
when they left shore, so what were they thinking? *Was it simply a
matter of being too macho to exercise common sense?
Next, once a boat turns upside down, is there any way to right them?
Once righted, would a motor start (assume a 2 cycle).
I'd like to know how the boat was anchored, was it from the stern,
classical mistake resulting in this.
Going offshore with no EPIRB used to be acceptable but today?

Without watching the vid, or knowing all the facts, I'd guess it was
the skippers fault. The person should have known better.

On Tue, 03 Mar 2009 16:22:35 -0500, wrote:

BTW when they were retrieving their PFDs they should have got some
rope. If everyone was tied together they would have still been next to
the boat. It is clear the survivor was a survivor because he was
"riding the outboard" foot and didn't drift away. A capsized boat is
not easy to hold on to.
I keep several hanked lines clipped to my rails that are easy to grab,
whether the boat us upright or not.

I was thinking along those lines. When I saw the Coast Guard video of
the one guy hanging on it was apparent how there were no handholds
on the hull.
A rope tied gunnel to gunnel over the hull might have kept them all
with the boat.
It's fine and dandy to talk "never" getting in the situation, but that
video make me thing that an unsinkable boat won't do you much good if
you can't hang onto it.
This incident made me thing about a lot of things, including a ditch
bag that won't disappear, and some other safety issues.

--Vic

On Tue, 3 Mar 2009 08:30:06 -0800 (PST), Frogwatch
wrote:

This accident with the NFL players off Clearwater where the boat
overturned is tragic. What went wrong? The weather forecast was poor
when they left shore, so what were they thinking? Was it simply a
matter of being too macho to exercise common sense?
Next, once a boat turns upside down, is there any way to right them?

It would be difficult to impossible even in calm water.

Once righted, would a motor start (assume a 2 cycle).

No. They need to be drained and dried out first.

I'd like to know how the boat was anchored, was it from the stern,
classical mistake resulting in this.
Going offshore with no EPIRB used to be acceptable but today?

An EPIRB will help people find your body.

What went wrong?

They took a 21 ft single engine open boat 40 miles offshore in the
face of a marginal weather forecast. They had no business being out
there. In addition, they had four 250 pounders aboard which is
marginal loading for a boat that size.

20 something boats get capsized all the time in Florida, especially on
the east coast where the Gulf Stream can kick up big breaking seas in
no time at all. There was a west coast boat a couple of years ago
that got into trouble on a fishing trip. They were out of Marco
Island in something like a 24 ft Grady, went missing, presumably
capsized, and the boat was eventually found upside down on an east
coast beach about a month later.

"Wayne.B" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 3 Mar 2009 08:30:06 -0800 (PST), Frogwatch
wrote:

This accident with the NFL players off Clearwater where the boat
overturned is tragic. What went wrong? The weather forecast was poor
when they left shore, so what were they thinking? Was it simply a
matter of being too macho to exercise common sense?
Next, once a boat turns upside down, is there any way to right them?

It would be difficult to impossible even in calm water.

Once righted, would a motor start (assume a 2 cycle).

No. They need to be drained and dried out first.

I'd like to know how the boat was anchored, was it from the stern,
classical mistake resulting in this.
Going offshore with no EPIRB used to be acceptable but today?

An EPIRB will help people find your body.

What went wrong?

They took a 21 ft single engine open boat 40 miles offshore in the
face of a marginal weather forecast. They had no business being out
there. In addition, they had four 250 pounders aboard which is
marginal loading for a boat that size.

20 something boats get capsized all the time in Florida, especially on
the east coast where the Gulf Stream can kick up big breaking seas in
no time at all. There was a west coast boat a couple of years ago
that got into trouble on a fishing trip. They were out of Marco
Island in something like a 24 ft Grady, went missing, presumably
capsized, and the boat was eventually found upside down on an east
coast beach about a month later.

I'd say that's a pretty good analysis.

Steve

On Tue, 03 Mar 2009 21:33:46 -0500, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Tue, 3 Mar 2009 08:30:06 -0800 (PST), Frogwatch
wrote:

This accident with the NFL players off Clearwater where the boat
overturned is tragic. What went wrong? The weather forecast was poor
when they left shore, so what were they thinking? Was it simply a
matter of being too macho to exercise common sense?
Next, once a boat turns upside down, is there any way to right them?

It would be difficult to impossible even in calm water.

Once righted, would a motor start (assume a 2 cycle).

No. They need to be drained and dried out first.

I'd like to know how the boat was anchored, was it from the stern,
classical mistake resulting in this.
Going offshore with no EPIRB used to be acceptable but today?

An EPIRB will help people find your body.


EPIRBs have saved a lot of lives, Wayne. The faster they can locate
you, the better the chance that you'll be alive whern they get there.

On Mar 3, 11:30*am, Frogwatch wrote:
This accident with the NFL players off Clearwater where the boat
overturned is tragic. *What went wrong? *The weather forecast was poor
when they left shore, so what were they thinking? *Was it simply a
matter of being too macho to exercise common sense?
Next, once a boat turns upside down, is there any way to right them?
Once righted, would a motor start (assume a 2 cycle).
I'd like to know how the boat was anchored, was it from the stern,
classical mistake resulting in this.
Going offshore with no EPIRB used to be acceptable but today?

one strategy to take is to call the coast guard (assuming you are
close in enough to have radio contact). with rescue 21 in place
coverage is pretty good. ask them to set up a comms schedule every 20
minutes or so as you return to shore, giving your position. if they're
not busy often they'll maintain a watch for you.

dont do this as a matter of course since watchstanders have plenty to
do...but if you're concerned about what's going on at least someone
will know where to come for you if things turn ugly.

On Wed, 04 Mar 2009 06:28:59 -0500, wrote:

EPIRBs have saved a lot of lives, Wayne. The faster they can locate
you, the better the chance that you'll be alive whern they get there.

I own a pretty good EPIRB but I don't have any illusions about being
found alive in cold rough water - in a life raft, OK - tropical water,
OK if the sharks don't find you first - 65 degree water, not so much.

"Wayne.B" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 04 Mar 2009 06:28:59 -0500, wrote:

EPIRBs have saved a lot of lives, Wayne. The faster they can locate
you, the better the chance that you'll be alive whern they get there.

I own a pretty good EPIRB but I don't have any illusions about being
found alive in cold rough water - in a life raft, OK - tropical water,
OK if the sharks don't find you first - 65 degree water, not so much.

I see lot of people talking in the vein of "Oh, I would do this or that."
If you have never been overboard, or in a dangerous situation in cold water
or rough water, one is not qualified to speak credibly about "what to do."
If you're in the water, the cold saps you quickly. Even cool water. (of
course, people will say what about survival suits) If you are in a boat
being tossed and slamming from gunnel to gunnel, it doesn't take long to
soften up even hardened football players. One good hit, and they're stunned
of unconscious. After that, it's just tumble die. I have been in some
monster sea conditions in larger vessels in very dangerous circumstances.
But, about the scariest thing I can think of is to be in big water with
three big bubbas on a small vessel. Sometimes we just dogged the doors and
let it rip. Waves crashing over the wheelhouse where you thought the
windows were coming in. Shuddering throughout the whole vessel from hitting
walls of water. Everything in the cabinets and drawers being tossed out.
Unable to walk around or do anything. Lights going on and off. Off limits
(suicide) to walk outside. Now, multiply that by about 20, and you have
life on a small craft in high seas. I surely bet they will never do THAT
again.

Steve

On Mar 4, 10:48*am, wrote:
On Wed, 04 Mar 2009 08:29:07 -0500, Wayne.B

wrote:
On Wed, 04 Mar 2009 06:28:59 -0500, wrote:

EPIRBs have saved a lot of lives, Wayne. The faster they can locate
you, the better the chance that you'll be alive whern they get there.

I own a pretty good EPIRB but I don't have any illusions about being
found alive in cold rough water - in a life raft, OK - tropical water,
OK if the sharks don't find you first - 65 degree water, not so much.

I didn't say it was a guarantee of anything. There is no doubt that it
greatly improves your chances. There is certainly no downside to
having one. A slim chance is better than no chance.

These guys were wearing PFDs. If they had had EPIRBS and stayed
together, they would probably all be alive right now.

hell if they'd had a radio and made a call, rescue 21 could probably
have narrowed the search area quite abit