"Larry W4CSC" wrote

To operate GMDSS/DSC, you are required to be a licensed GMDSS OPERATOR,
having passed elements 1 and 7 of the General Radio Operator's License
examinations (GROL).

http://wireless.fcc.gov/commoperators/do.html



Larry, all I could find was information regarding compulsory GMDSS ships. Is
there a listing you are aware of for voluntary-equipped GMDSS? HF is the
issue, of course ;-)

http://wireless.fcc.gov/marine/gmdss.html

Jack

Jack Painter wrote:

Larry, all I could find was information regarding compulsory GMDSS ships. Is
there a listing you are aware of for voluntary-equipped GMDSS? HF is the
issue, of course ;-)

Unless Larry holds, and is required to hold, a current USCG license as a
merchant marine officer with an STCW certificate endorsed as a radio
operator he only holds the GMDSS tickets for ego purposes. No one else
needs one unless they work for a shorebased maintenance firm doing work
on GMDSS equipment on ships. He obviously doesn't understand the GMDSS
system concept and is posting nonsense.

If you want reliable information that applies to you and your particular
circumstances just Google "gmdss voluntary station operator license"

There are plenty of pages. Here is a link that pretty much states what
Larry would have known if he had any training and held the license for
anything other than some kind of redneck ham radio bragging rights:

http://www.navcen.uscg.gov/marcomms/gmdss/cvib-2.doc

Training, Licensing and Certification

The Master and all Mates on SOLAS vessels are now required to hold the
FCC GMDSS Radio Operator?s License (GOC) for Sea Areas A2, A3 (Inmarsat
coverage), and A4 (polar regions) or the Restricted GMDSS Radio
Operator?s License (ROC) for operations in Sea Area A1. They must also
hold a Coast Guard STCW 95 GMDSS endorsement. The STCW endorsement
requires mandatory training and demonstrated ability to operate all
GMDSS systems. Most small commercial vessels are not required to be STCW
compliant, however, and are permitted to use any GMDSS equipment without
mandated GMDSS training. Small commercial vessels mandated to carry
radio for safety reasons are required to hold a radio station license
and the appropriate operator permits. Vessels subject to the
Bridge-to-Bridge act are also required to hold a radio station license.

Rick

"Rick" wrote

If you want reliable information that applies to you and your particular
circumstances just Google "gmdss voluntary station operator license"
http://www.navcen.uscg.gov/marcomms/gmdss/cvib-2.doc

Thanks. I used the search-engine inside the FCC pages, and it had the same
info, except the part about voluntary equipped stations, which we now know
is open to any owner/operator etc.

Jack

Rick wrote in
ink.net:

Jack Painter wrote:

Larry, all I could find was information regarding compulsory GMDSS
ships. Is there a listing you are aware of for voluntary-equipped
GMDSS? HF is the issue, of course ;-)

Unless Larry holds, and is required to hold, a current USCG license as
a merchant marine officer with an STCW certificate endorsed as a radio
operator he only holds the GMDSS tickets for ego purposes. No one else
needs one unless they work for a shorebased maintenance firm doing
work on GMDSS equipment on ships. He obviously doesn't understand the
GMDSS system concept and is posting nonsense.

You are posting the nonsense. See my other post and READ THE REGS I posted
there. You must NOT operate any GMDSS on a LICENSED SHIP STATION until you
have the GMDSS Operator's License, even if your boat is a goddamn rowboat!

You must also read the regulations to understand that you do NOT have to be
a STCW radio operator to be a licensed GMDSS operator. READ THE REGS in
references I posted to another responder.....it's all there.

The old unionized radio operators are now a dead issue once compulsory
ships get rid of their Morse equipment. Most ROs are not being renewed in
their cushy union jobs.


If you want reliable information that applies to you and your
particular circumstances just Google "gmdss voluntary station operator
license"

There are plenty of pages. Here is a link that pretty much states what
Larry would have known if he had any training and held the license for
anything other than some kind of redneck ham radio bragging rights:

http://www.navcen.uscg.gov/marcomms/gmdss/cvib-2.doc

Training, Licensing and Certification

The Master and all Mates on SOLAS vessels are now required to hold the
FCC GMDSS Radio Operator?s License (GOC) for Sea Areas A2, A3
(Inmarsat coverage), and A4 (polar regions) or the Restricted GMDSS
Radio Operator?s License (ROC) for operations in Sea Area A1. They
must also hold a Coast Guard STCW 95 GMDSS endorsement. The STCW
endorsement requires mandatory training and demonstrated ability to
operate all GMDSS systems. Most small commercial vessels are not
required to be STCW compliant, however, and are permitted to use any
GMDSS equipment without mandated GMDSS training. Small commercial
vessels mandated to carry radio for safety reasons are required to
hold a radio station license and the appropriate operator permits.
Vessels subject to the Bridge-to-Bridge act are also required to hold
a radio station license.


Old information. CG has turned GMDSS operator and maintainer licensing
over to the FCC. There's a reference to just this point on the FCC
webpages I quoted to another responder.

Larry

Larry W4CSC wrote:

You are posting the nonsense. See my other post and READ THE REGS I posted
there. You must NOT operate any GMDSS on a LICENSED SHIP STATION until you
have the GMDSS Operator's License, even if your boat is a goddamn rowboat!

Sorry, larry, you missed again. Read the regs or talk to a West Marine
salesman. They know more than you do.

You must also read the regulations to understand that you do NOT have to be
a STCW radio operator to be a licensed GMDSS operator. READ THE REGS in
references I posted to another responder.....it's all there.

If you don't sail as a licensed officer on a ship that requires a GMDSS
installation by international treaty and stand a bridge watch, you do
not need a GMDSS license. If you want to repair GMDSS equipment you need
a maintainer's license. If you are a watchstanding officer who is
required by the Coast Guard to hold a GMDSS license you must also have a
GMDSS endorsement on your STCW certificate.

Any fool can get a GMDSS license, very few NEED one.

The old unionized radio operators are now a dead issue once compulsory
ships get rid of their Morse equipment. Most ROs are not being renewed in
their cushy union jobs.

A little bit jealous are you?

Old information. CG has turned GMDSS operator and maintainer licensing
over to the FCC. There's a reference to just this point on the FCC
webpages I quoted to another responder.

If you knew anything about GMDSS you would know that the FCC has always
handled the licensing. The CG is charge with enforcing the IMO
regulations that established the GMDSS requirements for SOLAS vessels.

And the FCC still doesn't seem to list you as anything other than a ham
radio operator. That would explain why you seem so confused about this
issue.

Rick

Larry W4CSC wrote:

You are posting the nonsense. See my other post and READ THE REGS I posted
there. You must NOT operate any GMDSS on a LICENSED SHIP STATION until you
have the GMDSS Operator's License, even if your boat is a goddamn rowboat!

I did read your posts, Larry ... including the ones where you claimed to
have a "DB" license, and how you get all goggle-eyed looking at the
"First Class Radiotelephone" license above your desk, and disgusted you
are at how easy it is for anyone to get a license these days.

You are making your claims in a glass house, Larry.

So how come the FCC database that lists all licenses held, operator and
station, only lists a ham license when I enter:

http://wireless2.fcc.gov/UlsApp/UlsS...chAdvanced.jsp

and type in BUTLER, LARRY E in the name block?

That
Rick

"Jack Painter" wrote in
news:PxKGc.8284$pY2.2932@lakeread01:



Larry, all I could find was information regarding compulsory GMDSS
ships. Is there a listing you are aware of for voluntary-equipped
GMDSS? HF is the issue, of course ;-)

http://wireless.fcc.gov/marine/gmdss.html

Jack

See my long other post I just sent.....

There is no differences in voluntary and compulsory ships operating GMDSS
in any regulation I can find, except your voluntary ship isn't required to
have it in the first place.

If you want to operate it, you must comply with all the ship regulations
for it....TWO licensed GMDSS ops, REDUNDANT equipment and all!!

"Larry W4CSC" wrote
"Jack Painter" wrote in
news:PxKGc.8284$pY2.2932@lakeread01:

Larry, all I could find was information regarding compulsory GMDSS
ships. Is there a listing you are aware of for voluntary-equipped
GMDSS? HF is the issue, of course ;-)

There is no differences in voluntary and compulsory ships operating GMDSS
in any regulation I can find, except your voluntary ship isn't required to
have it in the first place.

If you want to operate it, you must comply with all the ship regulations
for it....TWO licensed GMDSS ops, REDUNDANT equipment and all!!

Larry,

Noting the apparent lack of exception in FCC comments or rulemaking (and
they are indeed the authority on this subject, not the USCG as you pointed
out), there is nonetheless an interesting comment or two by the Ret. USCG
Capt, Chmn of the Implementaton Task Force at
http://www.navcen.uscg.gov/marcomms/gmdss/rvib-4.doc which states in parts:

GMDSS AND THE RECREATIONAL BOATER 16 May 2002

The FCC action has thus begun a very gradual shift to DSC by requiring new
models of MF and VHF radios sold in the U.S. to have at least a simplified
DSC capability.

Recreational vessels are not required to use DSC in the MF/HF bands and may
continue to use non-DSC MF radios and make voice calls on 2182 kHz if they
hold the necessary Ship Station License issued by the FCC.

(there's a key no-exception point - whether by omission or not, we cannot
assume that no mention of license exception for GMDSS means that they might
have intended one - but it MAY be included in the new
no-questions-asked-all-equipment restricted operators license!)

The new DSC calling identity is the nine digit Maritime Mobile Service
Identity (MMSI) that is
assigned by the FCC to vessels desiring or required to use DSC in the VHF,
MF, and HF maritime radio bands. The way to get an MMSI number assigned is
to apply to the FCC for a radio station license. Station licenses are no
longer required for recreational vessels less that 65 feet in length
operating on VHF exclusively in U.S. waters

(another no-exception for HF GMDSS comment - looking more like they either
missed the boat on this part entirely, or they never meant to exempt it. It
remains confusing , which is in keeping with what I said about NavCenter et
al before.

Anyway, the new operator licenses do "imply" that any equipment volutarily
carried (radar, HF, VHF, etc) does NOT have to be listed, therefore no
license mods are required when equipment is added. THAT implies GMDSS could
be part of the license-suite w/o special GMDSS quals.It is an interesting
issue that salesman and yachtsman alike should be very clear on before
selling owning or operating the equipment.

Jack

Jack Painter wrote:

Anyway, the new operator licenses do "imply" that any equipment volutarily
carried (radar, HF, VHF, etc) does NOT have to be listed, therefore no
license mods are required when equipment is added. THAT implies GMDSS could
be part of the license-suite w/o special GMDSS quals.It is an interesting
issue that salesman and yachtsman alike should be very clear on before
selling owning or operating the equipment.

An MMSI is an integral part of DSC and the GMDSS, it is kind of hard to
work without a unique indentifier and any vessel will get one for the
asking, licensed, cumpulsory, voluntary, or just a Bayliner with a VHF
DSC unit on an inland lake in Kansas. It will hardly be a Global system
if all vessels are not similarly equipped and any requirement for
commercial licensing would negate all of the benefits of such a valuable
system as GMDSS.

There is no requirement by the FCC or the CG for an operator to hold an
FCC license to operate GMDSS equipment on noncompulsary vessels.

For vessels which are compelled by IMO regulations to carry GMDSS
equipment there is a parallel requirement that watchtstanding officers
aretrained and certified as GMDSS operators. That training is documented
by an endorsement on the officer's STCW certificate.

There are no such rules for pleasure boaters regardless of the type of
equipment installed.

Larry has no clue what he is talking about. The FCC, the only American
authority to issue GMDSS licenses does not list him as a licensed
operator other than in the amateur radio service.

Rick

"Rick" wrote
An MMSI is an integral part of DSC and the GMDSS, it is kind of hard to
work without a unique indentifier and any vessel will get one for the
asking, licensed, cumpulsory, voluntary, or just a Bayliner with a VHF
DSC unit on an inland lake in Kansas. It will hardly be a Global system
if all vessels are not similarly equipped and any requirement for
commercial licensing would negate all of the benefits of such a valuable
system as GMDSS.

Rick,

Unfortunately, the entire database maintained by BoatUS/West etc turned out
to be useless. It was a great idea and encouraged boaters to be instantly
registered with an MMSI. But that database went nowhere and is of no use to
a Rescue Coordination Center. I do not know what went wrong with that plan,
but only the FCC issued MMSI are considered international, and we certainly
can't maintain dual-systems. If a boater already has a BoatUS MMSI they
should apply to the FCC for a new one.

Jack