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Modifying Icom IC-M800
Larry W4CSC wrote:
To operate GMDSS/DSC, you are required to be a licensed GMDSS OPERATOR, having passed elements 1 and 7 of the General Radio Operator's License examinations (GROL). http://wireless.fcc.gov/commoperators/do.html (I'll probably get slammed for pointing this out, but you can read it for yourself on the webpages.) Radio salesmen selling GMDSS equipment to yachties never mention any of this, of course, as it would stop sales of expensive equipment. It's NOT a cellphone. Larry, where do you get the stuff you post? Is there an exhaust leak on your old bread truck or something? For American recreational vessels under 20 meters operating only in American waters, no license of any sort is required to operate a DSC equipped VHF radio. For those who travel abroad a simple no test Restricted ticket and a ship station license is still all that is needed. Just because a VHF with DSC is part of the suite of equipment that makes up a GMDSS installation does not mean that a GMDSS operator's ticket is needed to own or use one. Perhaps you should read your own links.Those radio salesmen know more than you do about their customers and their needs. There is not even a requirement for a ship station license for that vessel. The MMSI will be issued without a station or operators license. I am sure we are all impressed to no end that you hold GMDSS operator and maintainer tickets but that obviously has no bearing on how much you know about the rules for using them. Besides, 99.999 percent of small boaters probably could care less about "maintaining" their DSC radios. Rick |
#2
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Modifying Icom IC-M800
"Rick" wrote Larry W4CSC wrote: To operate GMDSS/DSC, you are required to be a licensed GMDSS OPERATOR, having passed elements 1 and 7 of the General Radio Operator's License examinations (GROL). http://wireless.fcc.gov/commoperators/do.html Just because a VHF with DSC is part of the suite of equipment that makes up a GMDSS installation does not mean that a GMDSS operator's ticket is needed to own or use one. Perhaps you should read your own links.Those radio salesmen know more than you do about their customers and their needs. There is not even a requirement for a ship station license for that vessel. The MMSI will be issued without a station or operators license. Rick I believe the thread has been dealing only with HF, where a license is required. I operate under NTIA not FCC so I haven't had that issue come up...but Larry certainly would on a sail yacht with licensed equipment. I can say that the equipment is certainly different where HF is concerned, but not as much fun as pinging your buddy's GPS with your position and channel on VHF-DSC. Jack |
#3
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Modifying Icom IC-M800
Jack Painter wrote:
I believe the thread has been dealing only with HF, where a license is required. I operate under NTIA not FCC so I haven't had that issue come up...but Larry certainly would on a sail yacht with licensed equipment. I can say that the equipment is certainly different where HF is concerned, but not as much fun as pinging your buddy's GPS with your position and channel on VHF-DSC. There is no requirement for a commercial radio operator's license to carry or use an HF or a VHF set on a US recreational vessel. In the US a restricted radio operator's permit and a ship station license is all that is required to operate HF. If the recreational vessel makes no international voyages then no license of any sort is required for VHF/DSC installations or use. Like I wrote earlier, just because a radio incorporates one of the features that comprise part of a GMDSS suite does not mean that the operator hold a GMDSS license. Rick |
#4
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Modifying Icom IC-M800
Rick wrote in
ink.net: Jack Painter wrote: I believe the thread has been dealing only with HF, where a license is required. I operate under NTIA not FCC so I haven't had that issue come up...but Larry certainly would on a sail yacht with licensed equipment. I can say that the equipment is certainly different where HF is concerned, but not as much fun as pinging your buddy's GPS with your position and channel on VHF-DSC. There is no requirement for a commercial radio operator's license to carry or use an HF or a VHF set on a US recreational vessel. In the US a restricted radio operator's permit and a ship station license is all that is required to operate HF. If the recreational vessel makes no international voyages then no license of any sort is required for VHF/DSC installations or use. Like I wrote earlier, just because a radio incorporates one of the features that comprise part of a GMDSS suite does not mean that the operator hold a GMDSS license. Rick The use of ANY HF equipment aboard ANY recreational boat DOES require a Ship Station License, even if it's in a backyard pond....because the HF station is INTERNATIONAL on any channel, as required by ITU. http://wireless.fcc.gov/marine/gmdss.html http://wireless.fcc.gov/marine/fctsht14.html Another note of interest from this website: "If your vessel requires licensing by the FCC after you have obtained an MMSI from BoatUS, MariTEL or Sea Tow Service that MMSI cannot be used during the application/licensing process when you file FCC Form 159 and 605 with the FCC. MMSIs issued by other authorized entities are valid only for ship stations that do not have FCC-issued licenses. Since the ULS will not accept the MMSI that was issued by another entity, you should not enter anything in item 10 on FCC Form 605, Schedule B. Leave this field blank and the FCC will issue you a new MMSI." Boat/US MMSIs are useless with FCC licensed stations.....(sigh) Also from this fctsht14 website is an answer about your unlicensed VHF walkie talkie being used as a CB on the dock, home, car, etc.: "MAY I USE MY HAND-HELD MARINE VHF RADIO ON LAND? You must have a special license, called a marine utility station license, to operate a hand-held marine radio from land -- a ship station license IS NOT sufficient. You may apply for this license by filing FCC Form 601 with the FCC. To be eligible for a marine utility station license, you must generally provide some sort of service to ships or have control over a bridge or waterway. Additionally, you must show a need to communicate using hand-held portable equipment from both a ship and from coast locations. Each unit must be capable of operation while being hand-carried by an individual. The station operates under the rules applicable to ship stations when the unit is aboard a ship, and under the rules applicable to private coast stations when the unit is on land." You CANNOT, legally, call your boat from your VHF marine radio on the beach. You don't have a "Marine Utility License".... As to the rules about the Commercial Operator's Licenses (GROL with GMDSS operator's endorsement), the rules are on: http://www.access.gpo.gov/nara/cfr/w...7cfr13_00.html You'll need, also, a copy of the maritime mobile radio service rules: http://www.access.gpo.gov/nara/cfr/w...7cfr80_00.html Voluntary ship license operators under 400 W PEP (all the SSB radios at 150W PEP you guys have), need Restricted Radio Telephone Operator Permits to operate VOICE on HF. http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/get- cfr.cgi?TITLE=47&PART=80&SECTION=165&YEAR=2000&TYP E=TEXT Now......about the GMDSS operator on your LICENSED SHIP STATION..... http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/get- cfr.cgi?TITLE=47&PART=80&SECTION=1073&YEAR=2000&TY PE=TEXT IT says, and I quote: "[Code of Federal Regulations] [Title 47, Volume 5, Parts 80 to End] [Revised as of October 1, 2000] From the U.S. Government Printing Office via GPO Access [CITE: 47CFR80.1073] [Page 170-171] TITLE 47--TELECOMMUNICATION COMMISSION (CONTINUED) PART 80--STATIONS IN THE MARITIME SERVICES--Table of Contents Subpart W--Global Maritime Distress and Safety System (GMDSS) Sec. 80.1073 Radio operator requirements for ship stations. (a) Ships must carry at least two persons holding GMDSS Radio Operator's Licenses as specified in Sec. 13.2 of this chapter for distress and safety radiocommunications purposes. The GMDSS Radio Operator's License qualifies personnel as GMDSS radio operator for the purposes of operating GMDSS radio installation, including basic equipment adjustments as denoted in knowledge requirements specified in Sec. 13.21 of this chapter. (1) One of the qualified GMDSS radio operators must be designated to have [[Page 171]] primary responsiblility for radiocommunications during distress incidents. (2) A second qualified GMDSS radio operator must be designated as backup for distress and safety radiocommunications. (b) A qualified GMDSS radio operator, and a qualified backup, as specified in paragraph (a) of this section must be: (1) Available to act as the dedicated radio operator in cases of distress as described in Sec. 80.1109(a); (2) Designated to perform as part of normal routine each of the applicable communications described in Sec. 80.1109(b); (3) Responsible for selecting HF DSC guard channels and receiving scheduled maritime safety information broadcasts; (4) Designated to perform communications described in Sec. 80.1109(c); (5) Responsible for ensuring that the watches required by Sec. 80.1123 are properly maintained; and (6) Responsible for ensuring that the ship's navigation position is entered, either manually or automatically through a navigation receiver, into all installed DSC equipment at least every four hours while the ship is underway." Notice that NO PLEASURE BOAT exemptions of any kind exist for the casual captain with an HF/SSB radio that has GMDSS/DSC radio equipment on the HF bands (below 30 Mhz) with a Ship License, which is MANDATORY for every boat with HF/SSB marine band equipment. 'Tis not to poopoo, "Oh, we don't need that because we are a little sailboat with a GMDSS-equipped HF/SSB radio." By international agreement, and ITU regulations, ALL GMDSS-EQUIPPED HF/SSB radios are REQUIRED to have, not one, but TWO LICENSED GMDSS OPERATORS aboard, one of which is, and I quote once again, "Available to act as the dedicated radio operator in cases of distress as described in Sec. 80.1109(a)" No mention in the GMDSS regulations says anything about a casual "voluntary ship" (your sailboat) being exempt that I can find. Please quote it if you find it to enlighten us all. In the GMDSS question section, it says: "Can I use my current FCC operator license aboard GMDSS ships? No. Any person who wants to become a GMDSS radio operator must pass a new examination to receive the GMDSS license." This would, also, include the yachtie with a Restricted Radio Telephone Operator's Permit. GMDSS must NOT be operated by anyone UNTIL he has taken the element exams for GMDSS operator and has that license in his hands. Conclusion - Unless you are willing to go to this extreme, do NOT buy an HF/SSB radio with GMDSS/DSC capabilities for your yacht. You cannot operate it until two of you have GMDSS Operator Licenses. Larry Still interested in getting your GMDSS Operator's License? It's not rocket science: http://wireless.fcc.gov/commoperators/do.html Don't press the red button without it....(c; |
#5
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Modifying Icom IC-M800
"Jack Painter" wrote in
news:_nKGc.8282$pY2.8013@lakeread01: I believe the thread has been dealing only with HF, where a license is required. I operate under NTIA not FCC so I haven't had that issue come up...but Larry certainly would on a sail yacht with licensed equipment. I can say that the equipment is certainly different where HF is concerned, but not as much fun as pinging your buddy's GPS with your position and channel on VHF-DSC. Jack I was referring to the HF GMDSS system, which goes along with the Icom M800 HF/SSB rig of this thread, although it does not have GMDSS..... NOT UNLICENSED VHF.... To operate HF GMDSS aboard your sailboat, a GMDSS OPERATORS license IS required, no matter what the Waste Marine salesman told you... Larry |
#6
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Modifying Icom IC-M800
"Larry W4CSC" wrote "Jack Painter" wrote in I believe the thread has been dealing only with HF, where a license is required. I operate under NTIA not FCC so I haven't had that issue come up...but Larry certainly would on a sail yacht with licensed equipment. I can say that the equipment is certainly different where HF is concerned, but not as much fun as pinging your buddy's GPS with your position and channel on VHF-DSC. Jack I was referring to the HF GMDSS system, which goes along with the Icom M800 HF/SSB rig of this thread, although it does not have GMDSS..... NOT UNLICENSED VHF.... To operate HF GMDSS aboard your sailboat, a GMDSS OPERATORS license IS required, no matter what the Waste Marine salesman told you... Larry, it's a confusing matter, and I don't want in the middle of something I cannot offer evidence for. So I will just add that when Rick quoted or refeernced the NavCenter pages, I will caution that we have not done a bang-up job of maintainng that website. I have had to clairify boater's questions there about watchstanding before as it is very confusing in some areas. Like this (NavCenter) For MF Radios the watch is maintained on 2182 kHz and for MF-DSC radios on 2187.5 kHz. There are similar requirements that voluntary vessels with HF-DSC radios and Inmarsat Satellite terminals cruise with the radios turned on and watching the emergency channels -- Realize that 5 years after that was published, we STILL don't have a Sea Area A-2 yet! And we do a somewhat less than credible job of monitoring 2182 from lousy whips antennas at Groups. And where I work, we missed the 2187.5 GMDSS distress call sent by the exploded T/V Bow Mariner some 80 miles away from our main DSC antenna.. So if it's an FCC rule we are talking about, then I would recommend avoiding the USCG websites as a source of conclusive information. We'll try to answer questions about our own rules, not the FCC's thank you. Best, jack |
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