Has anyone seen any used AIS class A transponders for sale? I do enough
off-shore sailing to want a class A instead of a class B.

-- Geoff
www.GeoffSchultz.org

On Jun 11, 3:34*am, Geoff Schultz wrote:
Has anyone seen any used AIS class A transponders for sale? *I do enough
off-shore sailing to want a class A instead of a class B.

-- Geoffwww.GeoffSchultz.org

I bought a brand new ACR/Nauticast class A AIS transponder on ebay
for $1100. It was sold by a seller in Singapore who lists high end
commercial marine gear from time to time. He had a high reserve
($1800?) in the first auction and nobody bid high enough. I made him
the $1100 offer and he eventually took it. Shipping was expensive,
about $75.

http://www.acrelectronics.com/global...balwatch2.html

At $1100 it was not cheap but still way lower than list price. It
lacked cables and GPS antenna, but I found a 5 VDC amplified GPS
antenna on eBay for $10 that was plug and play (SMA connector). I saw
a nearly new Furuno class A AIS go for about $900 on ebay a while
back.

My ACR AIS Xponder runs on 24 VDC and my boat is 12 VDC, but I can
find a bunch of easy ways to convert 12 to 24, including a cheap
inverter and AC supply. I am sure there is a linear regulator insdie
that probably knocks down 24 to 12 VDC, but I dont want to modify
anything in case I need factory service.

My boat is a commercial fishing boat but small enough that AIS is not
mandatory. I sometimes fish in foggy crowded waters off San Francisco
and wanted the best AIS I could afford. The more frequent
transmissions of class A and the large number of message options
appealed to me. I also wanted a self contained unit that didnt need a
laptop or anything else.

Mark

377 wrote in news:e862609d-7bee-4afa-be3c-
:

On Jun 11, 3:34*am, Geoff Schultz wrote:
Has anyone seen any used AIS class A transponders for sale? *I do
enoug
h
off-shore sailing to want a class A instead of a class B.

-- Geoffwww.GeoffSchultz.org

I bought a brand new ACR/Nauticast class A AIS transponder on ebay
for $1100. It was sold by a seller in Singapore who lists high end
commercial marine gear from time to time. He had a high reserve
($1800?) in the first auction and nobody bid high enough. I made him
the $1100 offer and he eventually took it. Shipping was expensive,
about $75.

http://www.acrelectronics.com/global...balwatch2.html

At $1100 it was not cheap but still way lower than list price. It
lacked cables and GPS antenna, but I found a 5 VDC amplified GPS
antenna on eBay for $10 that was plug and play (SMA connector). I saw
a nearly new Furuno class A AIS go for about $900 on ebay a while
back.

My ACR AIS Xponder runs on 24 VDC and my boat is 12 VDC, but I can
find a bunch of easy ways to convert 12 to 24, including a cheap
inverter and AC supply. I am sure there is a linear regulator insdie
that probably knocks down 24 to 12 VDC, but I dont want to modify
anything in case I need factory service.

My boat is a commercial fishing boat but small enough that AIS is not
mandatory. I sometimes fish in foggy crowded waters off San Francisco
and wanted the best AIS I could afford. The more frequent
transmissions of class A and the large number of message options
appealed to me. I also wanted a self contained unit that didnt need a
laptop or anything else.

Mark

I've been watching for used AIS transponders on Ebay for a while and
haven't seen any. That's why I asked here. I agree with your reasoning
for wanting one. I just ordered a Comar CSB-200 class B transponder
based upon my research. I'm also considering an active radar reflector.

-- Geoff
www.GeoffSchultz.org

Geoff Schultz wrote:
377 wrote in news:e862609d-7bee-4afa-be3c-
:

On Jun 11, 3:34 am, Geoff Schultz wrote:
Has anyone seen any used AIS class A transponders for sale? I do
enoug
h
off-shore sailing to want a class A instead of a class B.

-- Geoffwww.GeoffSchultz.org
I bought a brand new ACR/Nauticast class A AIS transponder on ebay
for $1100. It was sold by a seller in Singapore who lists high end
commercial marine gear from time to time. He had a high reserve
($1800?) in the first auction and nobody bid high enough. I made him
the $1100 offer and he eventually took it. Shipping was expensive,
about $75.

http://www.acrelectronics.com/global...balwatch2.html

At $1100 it was not cheap but still way lower than list price. It
lacked cables and GPS antenna, but I found a 5 VDC amplified GPS
antenna on eBay for $10 that was plug and play (SMA connector). I saw
a nearly new Furuno class A AIS go for about $900 on ebay a while
back.

My ACR AIS Xponder runs on 24 VDC and my boat is 12 VDC, but I can
find a bunch of easy ways to convert 12 to 24, including a cheap
inverter and AC supply. I am sure there is a linear regulator insdie
that probably knocks down 24 to 12 VDC, but I dont want to modify
anything in case I need factory service.

My boat is a commercial fishing boat but small enough that AIS is not
mandatory. I sometimes fish in foggy crowded waters off San Francisco
and wanted the best AIS I could afford. The more frequent
transmissions of class A and the large number of message options
appealed to me. I also wanted a self contained unit that didnt need a
laptop or anything else.

Mark

I've been watching for used AIS transponders on Ebay for a while and
haven't seen any. That's why I asked here. I agree with your reasoning
for wanting one. I just ordered a Comar CSB-200 class B transponder
based upon my research. I'm also considering an active radar reflector.

-- Geoff
www.GeoffSchultz.org

Panbo discussion
http://www.panbo.com/archives/2007/0...ally_work.html
G

Geoff Schultz wrote:
377 wrote in news:e862609d-7bee-4afa-be3c-
:

On Jun 11, 3:34 am, Geoff Schultz wrote:
Has anyone seen any used AIS class A transponders for sale? I do
enoug
h
off-shore sailing to want a class A instead of a class B.

-- Geoffwww.GeoffSchultz.org
I bought a brand new ACR/Nauticast class A AIS transponder on ebay
for $1100. It was sold by a seller in Singapore who lists high end
commercial marine gear from time to time. He had a high reserve
($1800?) in the first auction and nobody bid high enough. I made him
the $1100 offer and he eventually took it. Shipping was expensive,
about $75.

http://www.acrelectronics.com/global...balwatch2.html

At $1100 it was not cheap but still way lower than list price. It
lacked cables and GPS antenna, but I found a 5 VDC amplified GPS
antenna on eBay for $10 that was plug and play (SMA connector). I saw
a nearly new Furuno class A AIS go for about $900 on ebay a while
back.

My ACR AIS Xponder runs on 24 VDC and my boat is 12 VDC, but I can
find a bunch of easy ways to convert 12 to 24, including a cheap
inverter and AC supply. I am sure there is a linear regulator insdie
that probably knocks down 24 to 12 VDC, but I dont want to modify
anything in case I need factory service.

My boat is a commercial fishing boat but small enough that AIS is not
mandatory. I sometimes fish in foggy crowded waters off San Francisco
and wanted the best AIS I could afford. The more frequent
transmissions of class A and the large number of message options
appealed to me. I also wanted a self contained unit that didnt need a
laptop or anything else.

Mark

I've been watching for used AIS transponders on Ebay for a while and
haven't seen any. That's why I asked here. I agree with your reasoning
for wanting one. I just ordered a Comar CSB-200 class B transponder
based upon my research. I'm also considering an active radar reflector.

-- Geoff
www.GeoffSchultz.org

Seeing as how the ais xponder has to be programmed with your ships
info when you buy it, it wouldn't seem you will find any used ones about
or if you did, how would you get it reprogrammed?.
G

Geof,
I bought a 1 year old Class A Simrad unit used as a demo unit for marine
shows on eBay for $1300. Please note, there are substantial differences
between Class A and Class B. One of which is the Class A has its own
internal GPS among many others.
Steve

"Geoff Schultz" wrote in message
.. .
Has anyone seen any used AIS class A transponders for sale? I do enough
off-shore sailing to want a class A instead of a class B.

-- Geoff
www.GeoffSchultz.org

"Steve Lusardi" wrote in news:h25jht$484$01$1
@news.t-online.com:

Geof,
I bought a 1 year old Class A Simrad unit used as a demo unit for marine
shows on eBay for $1300. Please note, there are substantial differences
between Class A and Class B. One of which is the Class A has its own
internal GPS among many others.
Steve

"Geoff Schultz" wrote in message
.. .
Has anyone seen any used AIS class A transponders for sale? I do enough
off-shore sailing to want a class A instead of a class B.

-- Geoff
www.GeoffSchultz.org




Don't you have to have a Class A ship to use that? I didn't think pleasure
boats were supposed to be on Class A's turf.....or have the GMDSS
Operator's License from the FCC to operate it.

Bruce in Alaska? Which license does he need ship and operator for Class
A??

--
-----
Larry

If a man goes way out into the woods all alone and says something,
is it still wrong, even though no woman hears him?

Larry wrote:


Don't you have to have a Class A ship to use that? I didn't think pleasure
boats were supposed to be on Class A's turf.....or have the GMDSS
Operator's License from the FCC to operate it.

Bruce in Alaska? Which license does he need ship and operator for Class
A??

In the Carib. I saw several pleasure boats (admittedly mostly bigger
than us) with class A units. Don't know about the licensing, but it's
just another VHF radio.

Michael Porter

Michael Porter Marine Design
mporter at mp-marine dot com
www.mp-marine.com

Michael Porter wrote in
:

Don't know about the licensing, but it's
just another VHF radio.


Well, yes and no, it's not......

For US boats, the FCC says:

http://wireless.fcc.gov/services/index.htm?
job=licensing&id=ship_stations

"Who Needs a Ship Station License
You do not need a license to operate a marine VHF radio, radar, or
EPIRBs aboard voluntary ships operating domestically. The term
"voluntary ships" refers to ships that are not required by law to carry
a radio. Generally, this term applies to recreation or pleasure craft.
The term "voluntary ships" does not apply to the following:

1. Cargo ships over 300 gross tons navigating in the open sea;
2. Ships certified by the U.S. Coast Guard to carry more than 6
passengers for hire in the open sea or tidewaters of the U.S.;
3. Power driven ships over 20 meters in length on navigable
waterways;
4. Ships of more than 100 gross tons certified by the U.S. Coast
Guard to carry at least one passenger on navigable waterways;
5. Tow boats of more than 7.8 meters in length on navigable
waterways; and,
6. Uninspected commercial fishing industry vessels required to carry
a VHF radio.
7. Ships required to carry an Automatic Identification System (AIS)
transceiver by the U.S. Coast Guard regulations enacted pursuant to the
Maritime Transportation Security Act of 2000."

Either class of AIS transponder is NOT a "marine VHF radio", though it
operates on two their old marine operator channels.

Of course, in true bureaucratic form, FCC has a muddled legalese of
conflicting rules and regs only a Philadelphia lawyer can read:

"The GMDSS regulations are contained in 47 C.F.R. Part 80. Most of the
GMDSS regulations are in Subpart W of Part 80, but Subpart W also cross-
references certain other FCC rules, as follows (the cross-referencing
Subpart W is listed parenthetically after the cross-referenced rule):
13.2 (80.1073(a)), 13.21 (80.1073(a)), 80.334 (80.1114), 80.335
(80.1114), 80.836 (80.1065(b)(5)(iii)), 80.933 (80.1065(b)(5)(iii))."

Does 80.1065(b)(5)(iii) supercede 80.933 or is it separate in parens??
Who the hell set sails and read this?.....almost noone.

Look closely at your copy of:
Report and Order, PR Docket No. 90-480, FCC 92-19, 7 FCC Rcd 951 (1992)
to see some changes to GMDSS rules.

================================================== ================

On a separate issue, I don't understand this:

http://wireless.fcc.gov/services/ind...b=operations_2
&id=ship_stations

"What are the requirements regarding communications personnel aboard
GMDSS ships?
The FCC requires two licensed radio operators to be aboard all GMDSS
certified ships, one of whom must be available to act as a dedicated
radio operator during a distress situation. The radio operators must be
holders of a GMDSS Radio Operator's License. The GMDSS radio operator is
an individual licensed to handle radio communications aboard ships in
compliance with the GMDSS regulations, including basic equipment and
antenna adjustments. The GMDSS radio operator need not be a radio
officer.
Another IMO Convention requires all masters and mates to hold the GMDSS
Radio Operator's License and attend a two week training course and
demonstrate competency with operation of the GMDSS equipment. These
requirements would also carry to any person employed specifically to act
as a dedicated radio operator if the ship elected to carry such a
position."

DSC, the selective calling and distress messaging part of your
unlicensed VHF radio they told you didn't require a license, is PART OF
GMDSS! So, requires TWO licensed radio operators holding GMDSS Radio
Operator's Licenses, one of which must be free to operate the GMDSS
equipment during emergencies. All masters and mates must hold GMDSS
Radio Operator's Licenses and attend a two week training course and
demonstrate competency with operation of the GMDSS Equipment.

The question has never been adequately answered......What about using
the DSC part of GMDSS on a sailboat that has no license at all??.....

It's a bureaucratic nightmare........

Then there's Maritel's money grab:

http://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_publi...-03-3669A1.doc

"Domestic vessels would be charged an initial registration fee of $300
(for mandatory carriage vessels) or $375 (for non-mandatory carriage
vessels), with an annual renewal fee of $75. Foreign vessels subject to
the SOLAS Convention would be charged a $75 annual fee. Shore stations
would be charged an initial fee of $4,500 per site for processing and RF
engineering study, and a $750 annual renewal fee thereafter."

How much money you got for AIS transponders? That was in 2003! It's
STILL on the FCC's website!

You'll need to keep checking:

http://www.hallikainen.org/FCC/FccRu...ind/080373.htm

as they can't seem to make up their minds even which of Maritel's
precious coast station channels they're going to use for AIS. Early AIS
equipment, like you may have purchased use, might not operate on the
newer channels Maritel and the FCC have been haggling over to maximize
profits....??

As you can see, the FCC websites are a hodge-podge of GMDSS intersperced
with snippets about AIS. The Coast Guard is more sure of itself, even
though it hasn't a clue, most of the time. At least there's some less
conflicting information:
http://www.navcen.uscg.gov/enav/ais/default.htm

I think you need to first see if that box you bought is "AIS Certified"
by both FCC and USCG:
http://www.navcen.uscg.gov/enav/ais/...tification.htm
There's a ton of pointers, of course, to a hodge podge of rules and
regulations. So, we go he
http://cgmix.uscg.mil/Equipment/EquipmentSearch.aspx
Click the box that leads to certifications up to include toilet paper
and pick:
Automatic Identification System (AIS)- 165.155
from the pick list.
THERE YA GO! THERE'S ONLY 22 DIFFERENT UNITS CERTIFIED BY USCG!
Is one of these YOURS? If not....dump it...you can't use it.




--
-----
Larry

If a man goes way out into the woods all alone and says something,
is it still wrong, even though no woman hears him?

Larry,
This database is at 4 least years outdated. The Simrad model that has the
approval has been out of production for at least 4 years. My AIS , bought in
the US, is at least 2 generations newer. Manufactured in 2007.
Steve


"Larry" wrote in message
...
Michael Porter wrote in
:

Don't know about the licensing, but it's
just another VHF radio.


Well, yes and no, it's not......

For US boats, the FCC says:

http://wireless.fcc.gov/services/index.htm?
job=licensing&id=ship_stations

"Who Needs a Ship Station License
You do not need a license to operate a marine VHF radio, radar, or
EPIRBs aboard voluntary ships operating domestically. The term
"voluntary ships" refers to ships that are not required by law to carry
a radio. Generally, this term applies to recreation or pleasure craft.
The term "voluntary ships" does not apply to the following:

1. Cargo ships over 300 gross tons navigating in the open sea;
2. Ships certified by the U.S. Coast Guard to carry more than 6
passengers for hire in the open sea or tidewaters of the U.S.;
3. Power driven ships over 20 meters in length on navigable
waterways;
4. Ships of more than 100 gross tons certified by the U.S. Coast
Guard to carry at least one passenger on navigable waterways;
5. Tow boats of more than 7.8 meters in length on navigable
waterways; and,
6. Uninspected commercial fishing industry vessels required to carry
a VHF radio.
7. Ships required to carry an Automatic Identification System (AIS)
transceiver by the U.S. Coast Guard regulations enacted pursuant to the
Maritime Transportation Security Act of 2000."

Either class of AIS transponder is NOT a "marine VHF radio", though it
operates on two their old marine operator channels.

Of course, in true bureaucratic form, FCC has a muddled legalese of
conflicting rules and regs only a Philadelphia lawyer can read:

"The GMDSS regulations are contained in 47 C.F.R. Part 80. Most of the
GMDSS regulations are in Subpart W of Part 80, but Subpart W also cross-
references certain other FCC rules, as follows (the cross-referencing
Subpart W is listed parenthetically after the cross-referenced rule):
13.2 (80.1073(a)), 13.21 (80.1073(a)), 80.334 (80.1114), 80.335
(80.1114), 80.836 (80.1065(b)(5)(iii)), 80.933 (80.1065(b)(5)(iii))."

Does 80.1065(b)(5)(iii) supercede 80.933 or is it separate in parens??
Who the hell set sails and read this?.....almost noone.

Look closely at your copy of:
Report and Order, PR Docket No. 90-480, FCC 92-19, 7 FCC Rcd 951 (1992)
to see some changes to GMDSS rules.

================================================== ================

On a separate issue, I don't understand this:

http://wireless.fcc.gov/services/ind...b=operations_2
&id=ship_stations

"What are the requirements regarding communications personnel aboard
GMDSS ships?
The FCC requires two licensed radio operators to be aboard all GMDSS
certified ships, one of whom must be available to act as a dedicated
radio operator during a distress situation. The radio operators must be
holders of a GMDSS Radio Operator's License. The GMDSS radio operator is
an individual licensed to handle radio communications aboard ships in
compliance with the GMDSS regulations, including basic equipment and
antenna adjustments. The GMDSS radio operator need not be a radio
officer.
Another IMO Convention requires all masters and mates to hold the GMDSS
Radio Operator's License and attend a two week training course and
demonstrate competency with operation of the GMDSS equipment. These
requirements would also carry to any person employed specifically to act
as a dedicated radio operator if the ship elected to carry such a
position."

DSC, the selective calling and distress messaging part of your
unlicensed VHF radio they told you didn't require a license, is PART OF
GMDSS! So, requires TWO licensed radio operators holding GMDSS Radio
Operator's Licenses, one of which must be free to operate the GMDSS
equipment during emergencies. All masters and mates must hold GMDSS
Radio Operator's Licenses and attend a two week training course and
demonstrate competency with operation of the GMDSS Equipment.

The question has never been adequately answered......What about using
the DSC part of GMDSS on a sailboat that has no license at all??.....

It's a bureaucratic nightmare........

Then there's Maritel's money grab:

http://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_publi...-03-3669A1.doc

"Domestic vessels would be charged an initial registration fee of $300
(for mandatory carriage vessels) or $375 (for non-mandatory carriage
vessels), with an annual renewal fee of $75. Foreign vessels subject to
the SOLAS Convention would be charged a $75 annual fee. Shore stations
would be charged an initial fee of $4,500 per site for processing and RF
engineering study, and a $750 annual renewal fee thereafter."

How much money you got for AIS transponders? That was in 2003! It's
STILL on the FCC's website!

You'll need to keep checking:

http://www.hallikainen.org/FCC/FccRu...ind/080373.htm

as they can't seem to make up their minds even which of Maritel's
precious coast station channels they're going to use for AIS. Early AIS
equipment, like you may have purchased use, might not operate on the
newer channels Maritel and the FCC have been haggling over to maximize
profits....??

As you can see, the FCC websites are a hodge-podge of GMDSS intersperced
with snippets about AIS. The Coast Guard is more sure of itself, even
though it hasn't a clue, most of the time. At least there's some less
conflicting information:
http://www.navcen.uscg.gov/enav/ais/default.htm

I think you need to first see if that box you bought is "AIS Certified"
by both FCC and USCG:
http://www.navcen.uscg.gov/enav/ais/...tification.htm
There's a ton of pointers, of course, to a hodge podge of rules and
regulations. So, we go he
http://cgmix.uscg.mil/Equipment/EquipmentSearch.aspx
Click the box that leads to certifications up to include toilet paper
and pick:
Automatic Identification System (AIS)- 165.155
from the pick list.
THERE YA GO! THERE'S ONLY 22 DIFFERENT UNITS CERTIFIED BY USCG!
Is one of these YOURS? If not....dump it...you can't use it.




--
-----
Larry

If a man goes way out into the woods all alone and says something,
is it still wrong, even though no woman hears him?