"Herodotus" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 22 Jul 2008 08:46:01 -0700, "Capt. JG"
wrote:

"Stephen Trapani" wrote in message
...
Capt. JG wrote:
"Stephen Trapani" wrote in message
...
Capt. JG wrote:
"Stephen Trapani" wrote in message
...
Capt. JG wrote:
"Stephen Trapani" wrote in message
...
Roger Long wrote:
"Bruce in Bangkok" wrote

Bush can read?

OK, OK, it was a cheap shot.
Not a cheap shot at all. Of course he can read. He has however,
admitted on several occasions that he doesn't. If you know what
is
right, are firm in your convictions, and are guided by faith and
prayer, there is nothing on paper you need to learn in order to
make the right decisions. Facts are simply confusing and
temptations to depart from the path of righteousness that the
lord
has laid out for you.

Believe me, this is not satire. I'm absolutely serious.
Gosh when a set-up is this easy, with moralizing about "facts" not
getting in the way of predetermined biases; and with so many
people
needing to believe so many false facts to ridicule Bush, I just
couldn't let this go.

For those who want to retain their ignorant bias about Bush's
reading, I recommend avoiding this link:

http://www.usnews.com/usnews/news/ar...7bushbooks.htm

Stephen
Posting the same link yet again?
Sorry, connection problem.

Check this, but don't let your head explode!

http://www.jibjab.com/view/209630
I subscribe to the Maher podcast and have seen and heard him many
times. Was there something in the link having anything to do with
what
we are talking about here? If not, why did you recommend it?



I wasn't trying to get your head to explode! Nothing to recommend,
except to vote for McCain if you like the way things have gone in the
last 7 years.
Everything in my personal world, everything I contact even the
government has been very good. Wouldn't want anything to change there.

Things been pretty bad for you though, eh? Why do you think the
president can change things for you?

Stephen


Wrong again Stephen. Things have been very, very good for me and mine.
That's not the point. Do you think Bush and Company had nothing to do
with the last seven years?

If things have been so good for you and you think a Republican president
has been largely responsible, why do you want that to change?

Stephen


Because it's not all about me or you or likely anyone who's on this
newsgroup.

It's about the suffering going on due to Bush's insolence and corruption.
I'm sick of his pandering to the right-wing religious nuts who want gov't
to
stay out of their lives, but who want to turn this into a
religious/fascist/fundamentalist state of their own design, but not that
dissimilar to the Taliban. I'm sick of him starting and then perpetuating
a
war of choice (Iraq) vs. one of necessity (Afganistan) and lying about it
the whole time. I'm sick of him ignoring and being so out of touch with
what's going on in this country that he thinks everything is just fine
with
the economy, the lack of affordable healthcare for those worse off than
people like me and you, and ignoring the people in desperate situations
(e.g., New Orleans).

Don't think I'm absolving the formerly Republican controlled Congress
either. They are at least complicit. The Republicans are holding fast even
though the Dems are not in charge, basically preventing anything
meaningful
to get done, because it's an election year. And, don't think I'm absolving
the Dem leadership in Congress either. I'm not happy that Pelosi refused
to
consider impeachment. It was just fine to put the country through an
impeachment trial because Clinton lied about a blowjob, but it's not ok to
put the country through an impeachment trial because Bush/Cheney lied
about
an unnecessary war? Absolutely unbelievable. Even one of our own Senators
(Feinstein), a supposed liberal, refuses to consider it.

The gov't in this country is spying on its citizens, detaining people
without trial (not just foreigners, but it's own citizens), and generally
trashing our civil rights. Overseas, even with the grudging funding of HIV
programs in Africa by the Bush Administration, there are so many strings
attached that countries are barred from using their own money to promote
safer sex with condoms if they want to receive money from the US.... all
of
this due to the religio-fascists who have a strangle hold on that jerk in
office.

Regarding the presidential candidates.... Obama is far from perfect, but
compared to McCain.... someone who employs the same people who Bush used
to
trash him in the 2000 election, who employs people who supposedly know
something about economics (Graham's PhD) who don't have a clue about the
level of pain felt by ordinary US citizens, who employs people who were
vocal supports of Jack Abramoff (who's sitting in prison convicted of
fraud), who was reprimanded himself over the Keating scandal (using very
poor judgement), who promotes this "family values" crap, while having a
somewhat less than stellar fidelity problem of his own (not just divorcing
his first wife when she was disabled, but cheating on her during their
marriage). Sure, McCain was a war hero. Nothing bad about that. He served
honorably, but for him to sit there and tell us that this qualifies him to
make good decisions is just plain dumb. He's been in the Senate for
decades
and should have known better about Iraq. He used to be opposed to torture,
e.g., waterboarding, something used during the Spanish Inquisition to
torture people into false confessions, but he's ok with it now. He used to
be pro-choice, now his anti-choice, etc., etc.

Sorry for the rant, but you asked! LOL

Very well put Jonathon,

The most important part of democracy is not just the voting and being
enabled to vote, but the obligation on those voters to question,
examine and maintain a watch on those people elected and their
actions.

Having listened to a number of American citizens over the years
regurgitating (perhaps not quite the right word) their stand on
democracy and that the US is the only country with the only proper
form of it, I cannot help but wonder if perhaps a course on critical
political examination or ethics should not be included in schools.

I believe that, without such self examination and scrutiny, the
inculcation of democracy is little more than brainwashing akin to that
practiced in the Third Reich. It sounds like that from those that I
have heard and that is the danger that can easily lead to tyranny.
History has several examples of how various forms of government by
citizens evolved into oligarchies and tyrannies due to the complacency
and uniformedness of those charged with electing their
representatives.

That is why I find your words refreshing.

Thank you.

Peter

Glad to hear it.

It's the obligation of the majority in a democracy to protect those in the
minority.


--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com