|
Is Wilbur the only one here with real cruising experience?
That's the impression I get.
|
Is Wilbur the only one here with real cruising experience?
"Road Rage!" wrote in news:1uh40v.bb8.17.1
@news.alt.net: That's the impression I get. Only if you believe a person who's full of themselves. From what I can tell, his only boat is in his dreams or floats in his bath tub. Wilbur just likes to demean others. While he may have some positives, his negatives well outweigh his positives. What's really sad is how often he squelches meaningful conversations among people who have things to contribute. It's actually been quite pleasant in here lately without his rancor. Let's hope that he's moved to alt.sailing.asa which is much more his style. Of course your monicker makes me suspect that you're another of Wilbur's impersonations and just another sad aspect of the individual. -- Geoff www.GeoffSchultz.org |
Is Wilbur the only one here with real cruising experience?
On 2008-06-09 19:39:46 -0400, Geoff Schultz said:
Let's hope that he's moved to alt.sailing.asa which is much more his style. I'm a little more charitable and hope he's out and actually getting some experience, not that he's likely to do any "lessons learned" posts. -- Jere Lull Xan-à-Deux -- Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD Xan's pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/ Our BVI trips & tips: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/ |
Is Wilbur the only one here with real cruising experience?
"Jere Lull" wrote in message
news:2008060919540716807-jerelull@maccom... On 2008-06-09 19:39:46 -0400, Geoff Schultz said: Let's hope that he's moved to alt.sailing.asa which is much more his style. I'm a little more charitable and hope he's out and actually getting some experience, not that he's likely to do any "lessons learned" posts. -- Jere Lull Xan-à-Deux -- Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD Xan's pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/ Our BVI trips & tips: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/ That would be naive not charitable. :) He hasn't sailing in several years. I'm sure he has a nice, low-end RV, but given the high cost of fuel probably don't get out much. RR! is just a sockpuppet... hard to tell who's. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
Is Wilbur the only one here with real cruising experience?
Jere Lull wrote in
news:2008060919540716807-jerelull@maccom: On 2008-06-09 19:39:46 -0400, Geoff Schultz said: Let's hope that he's moved to alt.sailing.asa which is much more his style. I'm a little more charitable and hope he's out and actually getting some experience, not that he's likely to do any "lessons learned" posts. I think that it's great that you're willing to be charitable to someone who has exhibited no charity to anyone else. I'm just not one of those who is willing to extend the same. More power to you! -- Geoff www.GeoffSchultz.org |
Is Wilbur the only one here with real cruising experience?
On Jun 9, 8:06 pm, Geoff Schultz wrote:
Jere Lull wrote innews:2008060919540716807-jerelull@maccom: On 2008-06-09 19:39:46 -0400, Geoff Schultz said: Let's hope that he's moved to alt.sailing.asa which is much more his style. I'm a little more charitable and hope he's out and actually getting some experience, not that he's likely to do any "lessons learned" posts. I think that it's great that you're willing to be charitable to someone who has exhibited no charity to anyone else. I'm just not one of those who is willing to extend the same. More power to you! -- Geoffwww.GeoffSchultz.org Yup, he cruises back and forth to the likker store. |
Is Wilbur the only one here with real cruising experience?
"Road Rage!" wrote in message ... That's the impression I get. You have good instincts and you are correct. Compared to me most of the others who post here are duffers. Here are my credentials. 1) have lived aboard and cruised extensively since 1985. 2) have a Master license from USCG 3) aged mid-sixties with the mind and body of a 30-year-old 4) never had to be rescued or even close to it 5) never had a boat founder 6) have weathered aboard no fewer than 18 hurricanes and tropical storms 7) have a Ph.D. in English 8) IQ tested in the 145-160 range on standard tests professionally administered 9) uncommonly handsome 10) three single-handed circumnavigations 11) continue to live aboard and cruise (Allied Seawind 32) 12) never abused illegal recreational drugs, can't abide people who do 13) outspoken and enjoy telling it like it is 14) can't abide wimps, sissies and pretenders like Geoff Schultz, for example. 15) maintain with conviction that roll-up sails identify any cruiser as lazy and inept 16) know for a fact that diesels are anathema to sailing 17) know for a fact that women have no place aboard a well-found cruiser 18) can sail circles around anybody who posts to this group 19) have natural 20-20 vision 20) world famous The subscribers here are so very stupid and ignorant. The things they discuss are mostly motor related or things they've read on the Internet. They rarely go anywhere under sail let alone venture offshore. None of these people live aboard permanently or have the balls to try it. None can anchor under sail or sail out their anchors. Motor headed mentality is all that's in evidence here. None of these people have the guts to speak their mind; they have to couch everything in politically correct terms. Is it any wonder I tend to speak down to subscribers. I can't help it. I stand so far above you all that it's laughable. Wilbur Hubbard |
Is Wilbur the only one here with real cruising experience?
"WaIIy" wrote in message ... On Mon, 9 Jun 2008 20:35:32 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard" wrote: 17) know for a fact that women have no place aboard a well-found cruiser Translation: I'm a wimpy English major who can't find another gay guy to sail with. Does that mean you're interested in a berth? Wilbur Hubbard |
Is Wilbur the only one here with real cruising experience?
Wilbur how was the boat festival in Mahone Bay last year?
Roger Long wrote: I suggest you look at the RBC Profiles page: http://www.sailnow.com/RBC/RBCprofiles.htm You can find links here to websites and photo collections maintained by several of the the regulars here that make it quite clear that they have real boats and go real places. See Wilbur's pathetic response in this thread. Do you really think someone so boastful and full of it would fail to provide photos of his boat and descriptions of his travels if anything he said was true? He'll be back here shortly to say that we are too far beneath him to be privy to his travels but this group seems to occupy and inordinate amount of his time. Anyone who actually owned a Swan 68 could afford to hire a webmaster to back up his ravings. Anyone with such an ego would certainly show up plenty of pictures. He's said some things that make me think that he may have had some cruising and sailing experience in the past but his cruising now is pretty clearly limited to trips between his room and the recreation room of whatever facility he is currently in. As they say in Texas, "All hat and no cattle." (Yes, I know you, the OP, are really just Neal / Wilbur in one of his various guises but am responding for the benifit of anyone new here.) -- Roger Long (Old ball cap, couple of cows) |
Is Wilbur the only one here with real cruising experience?
That's all fine and good Wilbur but Capt Neal can sail his boat backwards
and maneuver it into a slip for the few rare times it is ever necessary. I bet you can't sail backwards. "Wilbur Hubbard" wrote in message ews.com... "Road Rage!" wrote in message ... That's the impression I get. You have good instincts and you are correct. Compared to me most of the others who post here are duffers. Here are my credentials. 1) have lived aboard and cruised extensively since 1985. 2) have a Master license from USCG 3) aged mid-sixties with the mind and body of a 30-year-old 4) never had to be rescued or even close to it 5) never had a boat founder 6) have weathered aboard no fewer than 18 hurricanes and tropical storms 7) have a Ph.D. in English 8) IQ tested in the 145-160 range on standard tests professionally administered 9) uncommonly handsome 10) three single-handed circumnavigations 11) continue to live aboard and cruise (Allied Seawind 32) 12) never abused illegal recreational drugs, can't abide people who do 13) outspoken and enjoy telling it like it is 14) can't abide wimps, sissies and pretenders like Geoff Schultz, for example. 15) maintain with conviction that roll-up sails identify any cruiser as lazy and inept 16) know for a fact that diesels are anathema to sailing 17) know for a fact that women have no place aboard a well-found cruiser 18) can sail circles around anybody who posts to this group 19) have natural 20-20 vision 20) world famous The subscribers here are so very stupid and ignorant. The things they discuss are mostly motor related or things they've read on the Internet. They rarely go anywhere under sail let alone venture offshore. None of these people live aboard permanently or have the balls to try it. None can anchor under sail or sail out their anchors. Motor headed mentality is all that's in evidence here. None of these people have the guts to speak their mind; they have to couch everything in politically correct terms. Is it any wonder I tend to speak down to subscribers. I can't help it. I stand so far above you all that it's laughable. Wilbur Hubbard |
Is Wilbur the only one here with real cruising experience?
"Road Rage!" wrote
I bet you can't sail backwards. Didn't you see the list? Wilbard completed three consecutive single-handed backward circumnavigations just yesterday. (I won't even go into what he did with his other hand.) |
Is Wilbur the only one here with real cruising experience?
"Road Rage!" wrote in message ... That's all fine and good Wilbur but Capt Neal can sail his boat backwards and maneuver it into a slip for the few rare times it is ever necessary. I bet you can't sail backwards. Never tried sailing backwards. Besides, the Good Captain can sail backwards into his slip all he wants but I prefer anchoring out. Slips are for women to wear under their skirts. Wilbur Hubbard "Wilbur Hubbard" wrote in message ews.com... "Road Rage!" wrote in message ... That's the impression I get. You have good instincts and you are correct. Compared to me most of the others who post here are duffers. Here are my credentials. 1) have lived aboard and cruised extensively since 1985. 2) have a Master license from USCG 3) aged mid-sixties with the mind and body of a 30-year-old 4) never had to be rescued or even close to it 5) never had a boat founder 6) have weathered aboard no fewer than 18 hurricanes and tropical storms 7) have a Ph.D. in English 8) IQ tested in the 145-160 range on standard tests professionally administered 9) uncommonly handsome 10) three single-handed circumnavigations 11) continue to live aboard and cruise (Allied Seawind 32) 12) never abused illegal recreational drugs, can't abide people who do 13) outspoken and enjoy telling it like it is 14) can't abide wimps, sissies and pretenders like Geoff Schultz, for example. 15) maintain with conviction that roll-up sails identify any cruiser as lazy and inept 16) know for a fact that diesels are anathema to sailing 17) know for a fact that women have no place aboard a well-found cruiser 18) can sail circles around anybody who posts to this group 19) have natural 20-20 vision 20) world famous The subscribers here are so very stupid and ignorant. The things they discuss are mostly motor related or things they've read on the Internet. They rarely go anywhere under sail let alone venture offshore. None of these people live aboard permanently or have the balls to try it. None can anchor under sail or sail out their anchors. Motor headed mentality is all that's in evidence here. None of these people have the guts to speak their mind; they have to couch everything in politically correct terms. Is it any wonder I tend to speak down to subscribers. I can't help it. I stand so far above you all that it's laughable. Wilbur Hubbard |
Is Wilbur the only one here with real cruising experience?
In article ,
"Road Rage!" wrote: That's the impression I get. Your an Idiot.... |
Is Wilbur the only one here with real cruising experience?
"You" wrote in message ... Your an Idiot.... No, you're the idiot. Only idiots live in Ketchikan. You can't even sail in Ketchikan. Well, maybe one or two months out of a year. The Alaska Marine Highway??? - gimme a break! -- Gregory Hall |
Is Wilbur the only one here with real cruising experience?
On 2008-06-09 20:35:32 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
said: 3) aged mid-sixties with the mind and body of a 30-year-old Evidence shows the mind of maybe a 12 year-old. 17) know for a fact that women have no place aboard a well-found cruiser Further evidence. Sailing/voyaging without a well-found woman may be many things, the least of which is "alone", but it's not well-found cruising. -- Jere Lull Xan-à-Deux -- Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD Xan's pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/ Our BVI trips & tips: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/ |
Is Wilbur the only one here with real cruising experience?
"Jere Lull" wrote in message news:2008061019440016807-jerelull@maccom... On 2008-06-09 20:35:32 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard" said: 3) aged mid-sixties with the mind and body of a 30-year-old Evidence shows the mind of maybe a 12 year-old. 17) know for a fact that women have no place aboard a well-found cruiser Further evidence. Sailing/voyaging without a well-found woman may be many things, the least of which is "alone", but it's not well-found cruising. -- Jere Lull Xan-à-Deux -- Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD Xan's pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/ Our BVI trips & tips: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/ Have been checking your site. Nice boat but not too well integrated in the accommodation. Looks like it's sort of flimsy furniture-wise and I had a good laugh at the picture of the engine that brags about the access. Looks pretty cramped in there to me. Now, if you'd lose the womenfolk perhaps you'd be able to really take advantage of the boat. If you were a dedicated lone-hander you would modify the interior so it had two real sea berths, a better galley, a decent chart table, more storage space for groceries, more water tankage and I sure hope those aren't opening ports in the v-berth. If so, get rid of them or they will surely sink your vessel if you ever do any serious off shore voyaging. And that unbalance rudder is sure to be way too much of a chore, especially when close-hauled. That keel, I don't think I'd trust it in heavy weather. It looks to be only about four inches thick where it connects to the hull. It's got to be way overstressed in that area. The gel coat is very nice but, then again, that's something women appreciate more. The bulkhead repair looks to have been quite a job. Too bad they didn't do it right in the first place. You won't find a Coronado 27, for example, with any of the shortcomings I listed above. Too bad Capt. Neal took down his world famous mariner website. The differences in quality between the Tanzer and the Coronado are readily apparent. The Coronado is an obvious offshore capable yacht while the Tanzer is a near coastal week-ender. But, to each his own. Wilbur Hubbard |
Is Wilbur the only one here with real cruising experience?
"Jere Lull" wrote
the mind of maybe a 12 year-old. [Vox Groucho] ...and I'll bet he was glad to get rid of it. |
Is Wilbur the only one here with NO real cruising experience?
On Jun 9, 6:33*pm, "Road Rage!" wrote:
That's the impression I get. Hi RR, I fixed your typo! Man you looked like a fool, careful next time. Fred |
Is Wilbur the only one here with real cruising experience?
On 2008-06-10 20:09:11 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
said: Xan's pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/ Have been checking your site. Nice boat but not too well integrated in the accommodation. Looks like it's sort of flimsy furniture-wise and I had a good laugh at the picture of the engine that brags about the access. Looks pretty cramped in there to me. Was a tough pic to take, but everything aft of the doors is stowage, tankage or engine. It echoes. You really have to see it to believe how easy it is to access everything -- without taking anything apart or removing panels. Morning checks are a 5-minute deal. If you were a dedicated lone-hander Don't want to be a lone-hander! That's what started this all. you would modify the interior so it had two real sea berths You didn't notice the "coffin berth" to starboard? Quite comfy on either tack and you're not going to roll out. You also might have missed how *comfy* the "V" is, with real foot-space for two and 6'8" length. (I'm more interested the rack almost-always enjoyed.) , a better galley, Only used for coffee. In fact, since switched to a portable stove so I could stay outside. a decent chart table, more storage space for groceries, Oh, you didn't notice how much stowage I have for groceries? -- two deep shelves along most of the perimeter and caverns under all berths. more water tankage and I sure hope those aren't opening ports in the v-berth. Nope. Not needed. And that unbalance rudder is sure to be way too much of a chore, especially when close-hauled. It's one-finger steering up through 20+ knots. (NACA 0012, with center of lift 1" behind the pintles.) That keel, I don't think I'd trust it in heavy weather. It looks to be only about four inches thick where it connects to the hull. It's got to be way overstressed in that area. What you don't see is the flange above, MUCH wider. That thinness, btw, improves the water flow right where it counts. You missed that the keel's not NACA, but sorta slabby tapered. The bulkhead repair looks to have been quite a job. Too bad they didn't do it right in the first place. That was my error in not fixing a persistent leak. Replacement pretty easy, most of it done single-handed over a weekend. (and I varnished a bunch of the furniture the same weekend.) You won't find a Coronado 27, for example, with any of the shortcomings I listed above. snicker We saw some when we were doing "the search". Too bad Capt. Neal took down his world famous mariner website. The differences in quality between the Tanzer and the Coronado are readily apparent. You missed a *number* of points -- not unexpected as they're subtle, such as the oak beam above the bulkhead and the longitudinal oak beam above The Coronado is an obvious offshore capable yacht while the Tanzer is a near coastal week-ender. But, to each his own. They're both rated near-coastal, though a couple of Xan's sisters have done the Med and back on their own keels (one twice) and I am in occasional contact with two doing some years in the Caribbean. But coastal's fine for me for the foreseeable future, island-hopping with a couple of 1-2 day legs between anchorages. I've no interest in going outside of the east coast and Caribbean for a while, and there are a bunch of places along that path we want to visit. Why rush, bypassing all of them? Now, where Xan will really show the Coronado up is under sail. She leaves them in her wake without even working hard. In a race, we'd have to give them 20 seconds a mile. -- Jere Lull Xan-à-Deux -- Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD Xan's pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/ Our BVI trips & tips: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/ |
Is Wilbur the only one here with real cruising experience?
"Jere Lull" wrote in message
news:2008061203070616807-jerelull@maccom... On 2008-06-10 20:09:11 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard" said: Xan's pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/ Have been checking your site. Nice boat but not too well integrated in the accommodation. Looks like it's sort of flimsy furniture-wise and I had a good laugh at the picture of the engine that brags about the access. Looks pretty cramped in there to me. Was a tough pic to take, but everything aft of the doors is stowage, tankage or engine. It echoes. You really have to see it to believe how easy it is to access everything -- without taking anything apart or removing panels. Morning checks are a 5-minute deal. If you were a dedicated lone-hander Don't want to be a lone-hander! That's what started this all. you would modify the interior so it had two real sea berths You didn't notice the "coffin berth" to starboard? Quite comfy on either tack and you're not going to roll out. You also might have missed how *comfy* the "V" is, with real foot-space for two and 6'8" length. (I'm more interested the rack almost-always enjoyed.) , a better galley, Only used for coffee. In fact, since switched to a portable stove so I could stay outside. a decent chart table, more storage space for groceries, Oh, you didn't notice how much stowage I have for groceries? -- two deep shelves along most of the perimeter and caverns under all berths. more water tankage and I sure hope those aren't opening ports in the v-berth. Nope. Not needed. And that unbalance rudder is sure to be way too much of a chore, especially when close-hauled. It's one-finger steering up through 20+ knots. (NACA 0012, with center of lift 1" behind the pintles.) That keel, I don't think I'd trust it in heavy weather. It looks to be only about four inches thick where it connects to the hull. It's got to be way overstressed in that area. What you don't see is the flange above, MUCH wider. That thinness, btw, improves the water flow right where it counts. You missed that the keel's not NACA, but sorta slabby tapered. The bulkhead repair looks to have been quite a job. Too bad they didn't do it right in the first place. That was my error in not fixing a persistent leak. Replacement pretty easy, most of it done single-handed over a weekend. (and I varnished a bunch of the furniture the same weekend.) You won't find a Coronado 27, for example, with any of the shortcomings I listed above. snicker We saw some when we were doing "the search". Too bad Capt. Neal took down his world famous mariner website. The differences in quality between the Tanzer and the Coronado are readily apparent. You missed a *number* of points -- not unexpected as they're subtle, such as the oak beam above the bulkhead and the longitudinal oak beam above The Coronado is an obvious offshore capable yacht while the Tanzer is a near coastal week-ender. But, to each his own. They're both rated near-coastal, though a couple of Xan's sisters have done the Med and back on their own keels (one twice) and I am in occasional contact with two doing some years in the Caribbean. But coastal's fine for me for the foreseeable future, island-hopping with a couple of 1-2 day legs between anchorages. I've no interest in going outside of the east coast and Caribbean for a while, and there are a bunch of places along that path we want to visit. Why rush, bypassing all of them? Now, where Xan will really show the Coronado up is under sail. She leaves them in her wake without even working hard. In a race, we'd have to give them 20 seconds a mile. -- Jere Lull Xan-à-Deux -- Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD Xan's pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/ Our BVI trips & tips: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/ I like the look of the Tanzer... sort of a flat-top like some of the Cals, but it has portlights aplenty. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
Is Wilbur the only one here with real cruising experience?
"Jere Lull" wrote in message news:2008061203070616807-jerelull@maccom... On 2008-06-10 20:09:11 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard" said: Xan's pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/ Have been checking your site. Nice boat but not too well integrated in the accommodation. Looks like it's sort of flimsy furniture-wise and I had a good laugh at the picture of the engine that brags about the access. Looks pretty cramped in there to me. Was a tough pic to take, but everything aft of the doors is stowage, tankage or engine. It echoes. You really have to see it to believe how easy it is to access everything -- without taking anything apart or removing panels. Morning checks are a 5-minute deal. If you were a dedicated lone-hander Don't want to be a lone-hander! That's what started this all. That tells me you'd rather sail by committee. That's the path to failure - remember the fate of the erstwhile "Red Cloud" which was abandoned and lost due to the whinings of a wimp crew. you would modify the interior so it had two real sea berths You didn't notice the "coffin berth" to starboard? Quite comfy on either tack and you're not going to roll out. You also might have missed how *comfy* the "V" is, with real foot-space for two and 6'8" length. (I'm more interested the rack almost-always enjoyed.) I guess I missed the coffin berth. Good that Xan has at least one decent sea berth because every real off shore sailor know the v-verth is untenable most of the time as its motion is a bit to brisk for comfort. Real voyagers often use the v-berth for storing light but bulky items as it is only a viable berth at anchor. , a better galley, Only used for coffee. In fact, since switched to a portable stove so I could stay outside. Coffee isn't going to get the job done. You need a real galley where hot meals can be produced while underway. At least one good hot meal a day is a necessary thing when voyaging for maintaining strength and moral. a decent chart table, more storage space for groceries, Oh, you didn't notice how much stowage I have for groceries? -- two deep shelves along most of the perimeter and caverns under all berths. Groceries stored on those so-called deep shelves will all end up on the sole in a big, dangerous mess when the going gets rough. You'll be lucky to not be knocked on the head by canned goods and such storing them there. Storage under the berths is acceptable but I bet you don't have any way to secure the access boards under the cushions. Few stock boats do. You've got to get real and make your boat's interior proof from a 360 degree rollover. Every hatch has to have the ability to be dogged down. Batteries and other heavy items MUST be strapped securely in place. Anything on shelves needs to be stowed inside a locker which also must have a latch so it cannot pop open in a knock down or a roll over. more water tankage and I sure hope those aren't opening ports in the v-berth. Nope. Not needed. Easy to say now but you'll regret saying it if you very find yourself off shore and dying of thirst. . . And that unbalance rudder is sure to be way too much of a chore, especially when close-hauled. It's one-finger steering up through 20+ knots. (NACA 0012, with center of lift 1" behind the pintles.) Poppycock! No transom hung rudder is balanced unless they dogleg under the transome on the lower part. Straight ones like yours all have severe imbalance problems by their very design. Do you even know what a balanced rudder is? That keel, I don't think I'd trust it in heavy weather. It looks to be only about four inches thick where it connects to the hull. It's got to be way overstressed in that area. What you don't see is the flange above, MUCH wider. That thinness, btw, improves the water flow right where it counts. You missed that the keel's not NACA, but sorta slabby tapered. Sorry but thicker above the thin still results in the thin part being the weakest. Not only that but the thicker part atop the thin concentrates the forces onto the thin portion. Believe me that is a weakness about which you should concern yourself. If the keel is not a NACA foil then it is inefficient compared to the proper NACA foil. The bulkhead repair looks to have been quite a job. Too bad they didn't do it right in the first place. That was my error in not fixing a persistent leak. Replacement pretty easy, most of it done single-handed over a weekend. (and I varnished a bunch of the furniture the same weekend.) Quality boats don't have "persistent leaks!" You won't find a Coronado 27, for example, with any of the shortcomings I listed above. snicker We saw some when we were doing "the search". Too bad Capt. Neal took down his world famous mariner website. The differences in quality between the Tanzer and the Coronado are readily apparent. You missed a *number* of points -- not unexpected as they're subtle, such as the oak beam above the bulkhead and the longitudinal oak beam above Not smart putting all that weight high up like that. And, I couldn't help but notice the deck about which you swell with pride looks like a layman's copy of a Morgan Out Island 33 deck. Butt ugly! The Coronado is an obvious offshore capable yacht while the Tanzer is a near coastal week-ender. But, to each his own. They're both rated near-coastal, though a couple of Xan's sisters have done the Med and back on their own keels (one twice) and I am in occasional contact with two doing some years in the Caribbean. But Capt. Neal's blue water Coronado was modified in several ways to make it a capable blue water voyager. It didn't take much to accomplish the deed. You'd probably have to spend 20-30 large to make your Xan as seaworthy. But coastal's fine for me for the foreseeable future, island-hopping with a couple of 1-2 day legs between anchorages. I've no interest in going outside of the east coast and Caribbean for a while, and there are a bunch of places along that path we want to visit. Why rush, bypassing all of them? Nothing wrong with short legs but short legs can often throw at you conditions worse than you'll find further offshore by virtue of shoal water, currents and seas with very short periods and wavelengths. In other words even a coastal cruiser needs to be as stout as a blue water yacht. Failure to understand this fact will land you in trouble one of these days. Now, where Xan will really show the Coronado up is under sail. She leaves them in her wake without even working hard. In a race, we'd have to give them 20 seconds a mile. Until you run out of water in about three days and until you get famished trying to survive on coffee and peanut butter and crackers then the more capable Coronado will sail right by while you weakly shout, "A meal, a hot meal, a kindgom for a meal and a drink of water!" Wilbur Hubbard |
Is Wilbur the only one here with real cruising experience?
"Jere Lull" wrote in message news:2008061203070616807-jerelull@maccom... snipped But, you conveniently side-stepped the issue of a decent chart table. If there is one thing that is not arguable it that EVERY cruising or voyaging boat needs a decent chart table and chart stowage. It is hard to muster much respect for any so-called sailor who doesn't demand a dedicated, large and workable chart table with chart stowage nearby. Wilbur Hubbard |
Is Wilbur the only one here with real cruising experience?
You won't find a Coronado 27, for example, with any of the shortcomings
I listed above. snicker We saw some when we were doing "the search". Yep, been aboard several Coronados of varying sizes including the 27 (and the 45 FWIW). Basically they were marketed towards guys whose wives didn't like sailing but could be persuaded into a "biggest interior for the price point" boat. Build quality is what you'd expect for such. The Coronado is an obvious offshore capable yacht while the Tanzer is a near coastal week-ender. ??!?? Oh wait, consider the source. They're both rated near-coastal, though a couple of Xan's sisters have done the Med and back on their own keels (one twice) and I am in occasional contact with two doing some years in the Caribbean. The lift-keel version? Now, where Xan will really show the Coronado up is under sail. She leaves them in her wake without even working hard. In a race, we'd have to give them 20 seconds a mile. Yeah but you know "real cruisers" don't care about that. What's funny is the number of boats that are claimed to be "faster than XYZ" (giving name or type of boat widely recognized for performance) on the basis that they passed one, once, years ago, when boat XYZ was aground or being sailed by a rookie or just loafing along under reduced sail. A cruiser we know has bragged many times about how his boat is "faster than a J-35" because once, several years back, he passed a J-35 that was sailing under blade jib alone because there was a crowd of grandkids aboard. Faster, yep. Fresh Breezes- Doug King |
Is Wilbur the only one here with real cruising experience?
On Thu, 12 Jun 2008 13:17:16 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote: At least one good hot meal a day is a necessary thing when voyaging for maintaining strength and moral. I agree with that, and the only thing that will get it done is a fully gimbled, one burner, SeaSwing stove. I still have one of the original models and they are worth their weight in gold on a cold windy night. |
Is Wilbur the only one here with real cruising experience?
On Thu, 12 Jun 2008 13:24:25 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote: It is hard to muster much respect for any so-called sailor who doesn't demand a dedicated, large and workable chart table with chart stowage nearby. And exactly how do you do that on your 27 ft boat? |
Is Wilbur the only one here with real cruising experience?
On 2008-06-12 12:38:30 -0400, "Capt. JG" said:
I like the look of the Tanzer... sort of a flat-top like some of the Cals, but it has portlights aplenty. Truth be told, it took us a while to appreciate her unconventional beauty. She was nicknamed "A schoolbus with sails" by another Tanzer owner. -- Jere Lull Xan-à-Deux -- Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD Xan's pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/ Our BVI trips & tips: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/ |
Is Wilbur the only one here with real cruising experience?
"Wayne.B" wrote in message ... On Thu, 12 Jun 2008 13:24:25 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard" wrote: It is hard to muster much respect for any so-called sailor who doesn't demand a dedicated, large and workable chart table with chart stowage nearby. And exactly how do you do that on your 27 ft boat? My 32 foot boat you mean? But perhaps you don't remember my mentor, Capt. Neal's, chart table that he built and installed. It was really nice and had chart storage underneath. Looked like something a factory would install. Practical as hell and could even be used as extra galley space when not needed as a chart table like at anchor. Maybe I can find it: Ah, ah. Here it is - http://www.badongo.com/pic/3768007 Now, does than answer your question. Even a 27-footer can have and must have a dedicated chart table of sufficient size to make working there practical. It obviously can be integrated well into the accommodation. But, then again the Good Capt. Neal was a perfectionist. Wilbur Hubbard |
Is Wilbur the only one here with real cruising experience?
"Jere Lull" wrote in message news:2008061220593875249-jerelull@maccom... On 2008-06-12 12:38:30 -0400, "Capt. JG" said: I like the look of the Tanzer... sort of a flat-top like some of the Cals, but it has portlights aplenty. Truth be told, it took us a while to appreciate her unconventional beauty. She was nicknamed "A schoolbus with sails" by another Tanzer owner. More like a wannabe of Morgan Out Island 33. http://www.yachttraderonline.com/lis...nd-33-89833406 Wilbur Hubbard |
Is Wilbur the only one here with real cruising experience?
Sorry guys, I'm having too much fun.....
On 2008-06-12 13:17:16 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard" said: "Jere Lull" wrote in message news:2008061203070616807-jerelull@maccom... On 2008-06-10 20:09:11 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard" said: If you were a dedicated lone-hander Don't want to be a lone-hander! That's what started this all. That tells me you'd rather sail by committee. That's the path to failure - remember the fate of the erstwhile "Red Cloud" which was abandoned and lost due to the whinings of a wimp crew. Oh, we don't *sail* by committee. My primary "crew" are the autopilot and tiller tamer. Pat's capable and sometimes stands watch, but her primary duty is to stay happy. My job is to make the voyage enjoyable, not some testosterone-poisoned survival exercise. We do determine the range of possible destinations by committee though. , a better galley, Only used for coffee. In fact, since switched to a portable stove so I could stay outside. Coffee isn't going to get the job done. You need a real galley where hot meals can be produced while underway. At least one good hot meal a day is a necessary thing when voyaging for maintaining strength and moral. When our longest legs *might* be two days, it's far less a necessity. Truth be told, the galley is somewhat under discussion, but it's not a high priority at this time. Oh, you didn't notice how much stowage I have for groceries? -- two deep shelves along most of the perimeter and caverns under all berths. Groceries stored on those so-called deep shelves will all end up on the sole in a big, dangerous mess when the going gets rough. The lower shelves (where we put the few cans we carry) are enclosed. Top shelves are for light stuff and has a 6" 'fiddle'. Some of our larger stowage areas don't have but a small access on the side, and none have a full-length or width board on top. We're good to 90 degrees as we sit, and I've yet to get past 45 despite some pretty nasty squalls and stupid moves, once or twice at the same time. Limiting ourselves to short legs will minimize the sort of insanity you seem to be expecting. What you describe would telegraph it's existence well in advance. And if we're a slogging upwind a day out and a storm develops, we'll get back to where we started quite a bit faster. I learned a long time ago that if conditions deteriorate, it's best to turn tail and hide out. If it ain't fun for all, it ain't fun. more water tankage and I sure hope those aren't opening ports in the v-berth. Nope. Not needed. Easy to say now but you'll regret saying it if you very find yourself off shore and dying of thirst. . . Sorry, bad snip. More water tankage would be added before we took an extended trip, low and near the mast. We could add 100 gallons easily. And that unbalanced rudder is sure to be way too much of a chore, especially when close-hauled. It's one-finger steering up through 20+ knots. (NACA 0012, with center of lift 1" behind the pintles.) Poppycock! No transom hung rudder is balanced unless they dogleg under the transome on the lower part. Straight ones like yours all have severe imbalance problems by their very design. Do you even know what a balanced rudder is? Yup! Designed and built that one. IdaSailor produces a near-identical blade. Really, it's got one-finger balance at all points of sail. That keel, I don't think I'd trust it in heavy weather. It looks to be only about four inches thick where it connects to the hull. It's got to be way overstressed in that area. What you don't see is the flange above, MUCH wider. That thinness, btw, improves the water flow right where it counts. Sorry but thicker above the thin still results in the thin part being the weakest. Not only that but the thicker part atop the thin concentrates the forces onto the thin portion. And the stress that a 4 inch by 3 foot cross section can take is ...? A quick calc tells me that if anything submits us to that sort of force, we have far worse things to worry about. The 1+ inches of fiberglass a bit away from the keel reinforcement will certainly have turned to powder, and anything once-living would be tomato paste. Quality boats don't have "persistent leaks!" All boats have leaks. They get worse over time, particularly when not fixed. And, I couldn't help but notice the deck about which you swell with pride looks like a layman's copy of a Morgan Out Island 33 deck. Butt ugly! No disagreement, there. But one thing it gives us is *enormous* reserve buoyancy against a knock-down. At 90 degrees, the center of mass of the keel is a good 7' from the center of buoyancy. But coastal's fine for me for the foreseeable future, island-hopping with a couple of 1-2 day legs between anchorages. I've no interest in going outside of the east coast and Caribbean for a while, and there are a bunch of places along that path we want to visit. Why rush, bypassing all of them? Nothing wrong with short legs but short legs can often throw at you conditions worse than you'll find further offshore by virtue of shoal water, currents and seas with very short periods and wavelengths. Excuse me, but that describes our usual cruising area to a "T", so we are comfortable with that sort of triviality. (Every once in a while around here, the knotmeter reads higher than the depth ;-) In most areas I'm talking about, it's no big thing to get out a couple of miles to deep water, but we could comfortably choose to take the "shoal" hit to take advantage of the wind shift and lesser current. Would feel just like home. -- Jere Lull Xan-à-Deux -- Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD Xan's pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/ Our BVI trips & tips: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/ |
Is Wilbur the only one here with real cruising experience?
On 2008-06-12 22:22:19 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
said: "Jere Lull" wrote in message news:2008061220593875249-jerelull@maccom... On 2008-06-12 12:38:30 -0400, "Capt. JG" said: I like the look of the Tanzer... sort of a flat-top like some of the Cals, but it has portlights aplenty. Truth be told, it took us a while to appreciate her unconventional beauty. She was nicknamed "A schoolbus with sails" by another Tanzer owner. More like a wannabe of Morgan Out Island 33. http://www.yachttraderonline.com/lis...nd-33-89833406 Wilbur Hubbard Naaah! More like an uglier little sister ;-) -- Jere Lull Xan-à-Deux -- Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD Xan's pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/ Our BVI trips & tips: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/ |
Is Wilbur the only one here with real cruising experience?
On 2008-06-12 22:05:20 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
said: "Wayne.B" wrote in message ... On Thu, 12 Jun 2008 13:24:25 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard" wrote: It is hard to muster much respect for any so-called sailor who doesn't demand a dedicated, large and workable chart table with chart stowage nearby. And exactly how do you do that on your 27 ft boat? My 32 foot boat you mean? But perhaps you don't remember my mentor, Capt. Neal's, chart table that he built and installed. It was really nice and had chart storage underneath. Looked like something a factory would install. Practical as hell and could even be used as extra galley space when not needed as a chart table like at anchor. Maybe I can find it: Ah, ah. Here it is - http://www.badongo.com/pic/3768007 OhMyGawd, that looks like a slightly modified version of our "crib" berth above the "coffin" berth, just forward of the galley. (the starboard settee's seat back, locked up.) We stow our charts there, but it's more comfortable to work the charts while sitting at the table. If I have to stand up, I don't consider it a chart table. -- Jere Lull Xan-à-Deux -- Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD Xan's pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/ Our BVI trips & tips: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/ |
Is Wilbur the only one here with real cruising experience?
"Jere Lull" wrote in message
news:2008061220593875249-jerelull@maccom... On 2008-06-12 12:38:30 -0400, "Capt. JG" said: I like the look of the Tanzer... sort of a flat-top like some of the Cals, but it has portlights aplenty. Truth be told, it took us a while to appreciate her unconventional beauty. She was nicknamed "A schoolbus with sails" by another Tanzer owner. -- Jere Lull Xan-à-Deux -- Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD Xan's pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/ Our BVI trips & tips: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/ Flat top Cals are not conventionally beautiful, but the sailing part is what really counts. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
| All times are GMT +1. The time now is 10:12 PM. |
Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004 - 2014 BoatBanter.com