|
Clean Boating Act of 2008
Looks like we all need to support this bill - unless we wish to be
regulated to death by the EPA. Claus Not having read it yet, and knowing full well the shananigans Senators like to play, I am wondering if it doesn't contain language that will screw us in some other way. Does Boat US have a synopsis on this version? Red |
Clean Boating Act of 2008
March 19, 2008
I received the following email today from BoatUS: ---------------------- quote ---------------------------- Dear BoatUS Member, We need your help now to pass NEW federal legislation in the Senate that would provide a permanent exemption for recreational boats from the upcoming EPA discharge permit requirement. Remember that if we don't get legislation passed, we all need to get EPA permits to operate our boats effective 9/30/08! We appreciate the time that many of you have already taken to let your Senators or Representatives know your support of S. 2067 or HR 2550 "The Recreational Boating Act of 2007." Now there is a new Senate Bill #2766 "The Clean Boating Act of 2008", which is more politically viable, and our best chance to eliminate the permit requirement before it comes in effect on September 30, 2008. Please pick up the phone or email today and ask your Senators to sponsor and vote YES for S 2766. Although Congress is on recess this week and next, we need their staff to hear from us so that this bill can move as soon as the Senators are back in Washington. Remember to contact both of your Senators: (Arizona, New Mexico, Nevada, Oregon, Washington) ---------------------------- unquote ----------------------------- Looks like we all need to support this bill - unless we wish to be regulated to death by the EPA. Claus |
Clean Boating Act of 2008
On Mar 18, 2:06*pm, Red wrote:
Looks like we all need to support this bill - unless we wish to be regulated to death by the EPA. Claus Not having read it yet, and knowing full well the shananigans Senators like to play, I am wondering if it doesn't contain language that will screw us in some other way. Does Boat US have a synopsis on this version? Red So tell me again why I should support this boatus anti clean water effort? Bob |
Clean Boating Act of 2008
Bob wrote:
So tell me again why I should support this boatus anti clean water effort? Because the bill says that all recreational boaters will need to eat their own turds. While that may be ok with you, think of the other guy. |
Clean Boating Act of 2008
Support it??? I am unsure what the bill is about. Is it engine emmissions?
Or is it waste (holding Tank) dumping? Why would I support a bill that allows boaters (recreational or otherwise) to dump their turds into the waterways that our children swin in and we fish for our dinner in?? With the number of recreational boaters on our waterways... disgusting. Perhaps one should post the bill, in it's entirity, before asking for support. Cindy "Paul Cassel" wrote in message . .. Bob wrote: So tell me again why I should support this boatus anti clean water effort? Because the bill says that all recreational boaters will need to eat their own turds. While that may be ok with you, think of the other guy. |
Clean Boating Act of 2008
"Cindy" wrote in message . .. Support it??? I am unsure what the bill is about. Is it engine emmissions? Or is it waste (holding Tank) dumping? Why would I support a bill that allows boaters (recreational or otherwise) to dump their turds into the waterways that our children swin in and we fish for our dinner in?? With the number of recreational boaters on our waterways... disgusting. Perhaps one should post the bill, in it's entirity, before asking for support. Cindy Stop being just another an ignorant twit, Cindy. Certainly YOU are capable of finding and reading the legislation of concern on-line. But, since you women are consistently inept when it comes to this sort of thing and you tend to react with emotions rather than logic mostly because logic is a foreign concept to most women, I shall render a concise summary for your benefit. The legislation (that all recreational boaters should support) excludes recreational boaters from draconian discharge legislation already in place whereby some law makers wish to include all recreational boats but has as its original intent to regulate discharge from shipping where there is a valid reason for such legislation. Due to the language of the requirements for shipping, recreational boaters would not be allowed to discharge ANYTHING into the surrounding waters. In other words you could not discharge water you used to wash your deck, or dishes, or your body. You could not throw food scraps into the water to feed the fishes. NOTHING could be allowed to come from your boat - even clean bilge water and be allowed to go into the surrounding water. You would have to have a holding tank for everything. The sewage issue is already covered and enforced by other existing state and federal legislation. This potential new legislation is another layer on top of that. And for this stupidity you would be required to buy and display a sticker that would cost you around 100 to 150 dollars a year. If you did not buy and display the sticker you could be subject to large fines or have your boat confiscated.Just another tax! Just more Big Brother tactics. And another law that could not be enforced and would not be enforced due to lack of manpower but a good way to raise revenue to fatten the paychecks of the bureaucrats. Does this help your fluff-headed understanding of the situation? If not consider you might have a small recreational skiff of say 18 feet in length. You enjoy going out fishing or just cruising around seeing the sights or sunbathing and having a beer or two and some barbeque. You anchor and go swimming. But you won't be allowed to stand on the transom and wash your hair or your body because some soap or shampoo would end up in the water. You would not be able to toss any food scraps to the fish or seagulls. You would not be able to pump your bilge or empty the water from your live well tanks. You would not be able to wash the suntan oil off the deck even with biodegradable soap. You would not be able to discharge anything from your skill. And for this idiocy you would be paying big bucks for a sticker that is nothing more than a tax. Now, run along and do your nails or something . . . Wilbur Hubbard |
Clean Boating Act of 2008
In article s.com,
"Wilbur Hubbard" wrote: Now, run along and do your nails or something . . . Actually not discharging anything is standard over here in old Europe, at least most parts. Marc -- remove bye and from mercial to get valid e-mail http://www.heusser.com |
Clean Boating Act of 2008
"Marc Heusser" d wrote in message ... In article s.com, "Wilbur Hubbard" wrote: Now, run along and do your nails or something . . . Actually not discharging anything is standard over here in old Europe, at least most parts. Marc But do you have to buy an expensive sticker that does NOTHING towards making the water cleaner? It's good common sense to be a responsible steward of the waters and most boaters are. But to charge a heavy fee that does NOTHING but fatten the bureaucratic paycheck is criminal in my opinion. How about firing a hundred or so bureaucrats and use their salaries to put in place a public education system that teaches responsible stewardship of our planet?? Wilbur Hubbard |
Clean Boating Act of 2008
Gee Wilbur, You sound like an obnoxious crabby old SOB that hates women. And
you accuse women of reacting with emotion. I posed the question because the group was asked to support a bill with out any link to the bill. If someone is asking for my support then *they* should privide all of the facts. I sure hope for women everywhere that you are gay. Cindy "Wilbur Hubbard" wrote in message anews.com... "Cindy" wrote in message . .. Support it??? I am unsure what the bill is about. Is it engine emmissions? Or is it waste (holding Tank) dumping? Why would I support a bill that allows boaters (recreational or otherwise) to dump their turds into the waterways that our children swin in and we fish for our dinner in?? With the number of recreational boaters on our waterways... disgusting. Perhaps one should post the bill, in it's entirity, before asking for support. Cindy Stop being just another an ignorant twit, Cindy. Certainly YOU are capable of finding and reading the legislation of concern on-line. But, since you women are consistently inept when it comes to this sort of thing and you tend to react with emotions rather than logic mostly because logic is a foreign concept to most women, I shall render a concise summary for your benefit. The legislation (that all recreational boaters should support) excludes recreational boaters from draconian discharge legislation already in place whereby some law makers wish to include all recreational boats but has as its original intent to regulate discharge from shipping where there is a valid reason for such legislation. Due to the language of the requirements for shipping, recreational boaters would not be allowed to discharge ANYTHING into the surrounding waters. In other words you could not discharge water you used to wash your deck, or dishes, or your body. You could not throw food scraps into the water to feed the fishes. NOTHING could be allowed to come from your boat - even clean bilge water and be allowed to go into the surrounding water. You would have to have a holding tank for everything. The sewage issue is already covered and enforced by other existing state and federal legislation. This potential new legislation is another layer on top of that. And for this stupidity you would be required to buy and display a sticker that would cost you around 100 to 150 dollars a year. If you did not buy and display the sticker you could be subject to large fines or have your boat confiscated.Just another tax! Just more Big Brother tactics. And another law that could not be enforced and would not be enforced due to lack of manpower but a good way to raise revenue to fatten the paychecks of the bureaucrats. Does this help your fluff-headed understanding of the situation? If not consider you might have a small recreational skiff of say 18 feet in length. You enjoy going out fishing or just cruising around seeing the sights or sunbathing and having a beer or two and some barbeque. You anchor and go swimming. But you won't be allowed to stand on the transom and wash your hair or your body because some soap or shampoo would end up in the water. You would not be able to toss any food scraps to the fish or seagulls. You would not be able to pump your bilge or empty the water from your live well tanks. You would not be able to wash the suntan oil off the deck even with biodegradable soap. You would not be able to discharge anything from your skill. And for this idiocy you would be paying big bucks for a sticker that is nothing more than a tax. Now, run along and do your nails or something . . . Wilbur Hubbard |
Clean Boating Act of 2008
Thank you Roger,
It is all I asked of claus or the group and seemed to set Wilbur in a woman hating tizzy. "Roger Long" wrote in message ... Here is the executive version: Another of the stupid laws congress passed without reading the bill themselves or considering the consequences (being too busy raising money for the next election) currently mandates and requires that the EPA bring all recreational vessels into the same discharge permit system as commercial vessels and ships. This is discharge of ANYTHING, i.e., your dish water, shower drain, even the run off from your decks which carries the dirt and pollutants congress and the nation allow with other bills to be poured into the air. When this stuff lands on your deck, it suddenly becomes a pollutant when rain and spray carry it into the water. This will have nothing to do with cleaning up the water or keeping it clean. EPA will simply be required to have every vessel carry a piece of paper stating that they it is a permit for the incidental discharges. The feds will probably delegate this job to the states who will knee jerk, budget crunch - rich people on boats - income stream - big fee. Since the feds are not going to have to administer the system, they will probably load up the permit requirements with required submission of estimates of discharge, discharge plan, another decal to paste somewhere on the vessel, expensive data collection and reporting requirements for the states that will further drive up fees and state costs. Meanwhile, it will be illegal to operate your boat without a permit that doesn't exist yet. Homeland Security will love having all those troublesome boats tied up. DHS will suddenly realize that this permit can be a way to get the national boater ID that they so badly want in the back door the same way they are trying to turn drivers licenses into a national ID card that wouldn't be tolerated if presented that way. The bill Boat US is backing contains language that could eventually bring along something even stupider but it does buy time for the boat lobby to get the attention of the cone heads on the hill. If the bill does not pass, the above nightmare, which is ALREADY LAW, will go into force soon. -- Roger Long |
Clean Boating Act of 2008
"Marc Heusser" d wrote in
message ... In article s.com, "Wilbur Hubbard" wrote: Now, run along and do your nails or something . . . Actually not discharging anything is standard over here in old Europe, at least most parts. Marc -- remove bye and from mercial to get valid e-mail http://www.heusser.com In that case, you definitely want to make sure Neal never gets to Europe. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
Clean Boating Act of 2008
"Cindy" wrote in message
. .. Gee Wilbur, You sound like an obnoxious crabby old SOB that hates women. And you accuse women of reacting with emotion. I posed the question because the group was asked to support a bill with out any link to the bill. If someone is asking for my support then *they* should privide all of the facts. I sure hope for women everywhere that you are gay. Cindy trolling bs removed Neal (aka Wilbur) Warren hasn't gotten laid without money changing hands since Eisenhower was in office. He's just an angry troll. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
Clean Boating Act of 2008
"Cindy" wrote in message . .. Gee Wilbur, You sound like an obnoxious crabby old SOB that hates women. And you accuse women of reacting with emotion. I posed the question because the group was asked to support a bill with out any link to the bill. If someone is asking for my support then *they* should privide all of the facts. Snot-nosed little LIAR! I bet you support Hillary Clinton since you demonstrate a typical, ignorant, liberal, feminist attitude. And, Hillary provides no facts, just lies and pandering. So much for your requirement that you be provided you with all the facts. And, never mind Capt. JG. He's been staking me and confusing me with somebody else ever since I caused his male, live-in lover to break up with him. No, I'm not gay and did not personally steal his gay lover. I just introduced him to somebody who was both gay, intelligent and buff - not some skinny little momma's boy like Jon Boy! Hugs, Wilbur Hubbard Wilbur |
Clean Boating Act of 2008
Wilbur Hubbard wrote:
And, never mind Capt. JG. He's been staking me Ah, vampire phobia raises its' ugly head again. Cheers Marty |
Clean Boating Act of 2008
cavelamb himself wrote:
Marty wrote: Wilbur Hubbard wrote: And, never mind Capt. JG. He's been staking me Ah, vampire phobia raises its' ugly head again. Cheers Marty No, that's just Wilber... Well, he could easily be some kind of lamia. Cheers Marty |
Clean Boating Act of 2008
Marty wrote:
Wilbur Hubbard wrote: And, never mind Capt. JG. He's been staking me Ah, vampire phobia raises its' ugly head again. Cheers Marty No, that's just Wilber... |
Clean Boating Act of 2008
On Mar 19, 3:00�pm, Bob wrote:
On Mar 18, 2:06�pm, Red wrote: Looks like we all need to support this bill - unless we wish to be regulated to death by the EPA. Claus Not having read it yet, and knowing full well the shananigans Senators like to play, I am wondering if it doesn't contain language that will screw us in some other way. Does Boat US have a synopsis on this version? Red So tell me again why I should support this boatus anti clean water effort? Bob For many years the EPA exempted pleasure boats from complying with a law that was drafted to prevent foreign ships from discharging "ballast water" in US harbors. That law, applied to foreign ships, is a good one. Sometimes the ballast water is seriously polluted, or it may contain foreign organisms that become invasive in a new environment. An environmental group in Portland Oregon was suing the EPA over some matter or another, and in the course of pronouncing a ruling the judge also (and very surprisingly) included a statement that the EPA does not have the authority to exempt pleasure boats from the same discharge regulations that apply to commercial shipping. Even the environmentalists bringing the suit were shocked at the ruling, as this was not the outcome they were pursuing. If this ruling is literally applied, *nothing* (!) can enter the water from a boat, unless the boater has purchased a permit allowing it. By "nothing", the rules will include "those discharges incidental to the normal operation of a boat". If you have an inboard or even an outboard engine, you cannot operate it without discharging cooling water in the process. You would need a permit to do so- so you would be reduced to rowing or sailing under all circumstances without a pemit. If you begin taking on water and need to activate your bilge pump, forget it. Before you can begin evacuating water from the bilge you must be certain that your permit is up to date, as the fines can run as high as $32,000 per day if it is not. Wash you boat? Heavens no. Not even with municipal water from a hose and using no soap. That wash water will be carrying dirt from the hull and decks into the lake or ocean below- and that's considered a polluting discharge from a boat. This is not an "anti clean water bill". Discharges of sewage, garbage, petroleum products, etc will continue to be covered by existing rules and regulations. The Clean Boating Act will simply prevent discharges incidental to the normal operation of a boat (and not already prohibited by law) from becoming subject to additional permits and taxation. The bill specifically authorizes the EPA to exempt pleasure boats from the requirements that will still apply to commercial ships. |
Clean Boating Act of 2008
"Chuck Gould" wrote in message ... For many years the EPA exempted pleasure boats from complying with a law that was drafted to prevent foreign ships from discharging "ballast water" in US harbors. That law, applied to foreign ships, is a good one. Sometimes the ballast water is seriously polluted, or it may contain foreign organisms that become invasive in a new environment. An environmental group in Portland Oregon was suing the EPA over some matter or another, and in the course of pronouncing a ruling the judge also (and very surprisingly) included a statement that the EPA does not have the authority to exempt pleasure boats from the same discharge regulations that apply to commercial shipping. Even the environmentalists bringing the suit were shocked at the ruling, as this was not the outcome they were pursuing. If this ruling is literally applied, *nothing* (!) can enter the water from a boat, unless the boater has purchased a permit allowing it. By "nothing", the rules will include "those discharges incidental to the normal operation of a boat". If you have an inboard or even an outboard engine, you cannot operate it without discharging cooling water in the process. You would need a permit to do so- so you would be reduced to rowing or sailing under all circumstances without a pemit. If you begin taking on water and need to activate your bilge pump, forget it. Before you can begin evacuating water from the bilge you must be certain that your permit is up to date, as the fines can run as high as $32,000 per day if it is not. Wash you boat? Heavens no. Not even with municipal water from a hose and using no soap. That wash water will be carrying dirt from the hull and decks into the lake or ocean below- and that's considered a polluting discharge from a boat. This is not an "anti clean water bill". Discharges of sewage, garbage, petroleum products, etc will continue to be covered by existing rules and regulations. The Clean Boating Act will simply prevent discharges incidental to the normal operation of a boat (and not already prohibited by law) from becoming subject to additional permits and taxation. The bill specifically authorizes the EPA to exempt pleasure boats from the requirements that will still apply to commercial ships. Thank you, sir. Even Cindy fluff for brains might be able to understand the situation now. You provided a most accurate and excellent summary! How is it that there are so many stupid, liberal judges around to cause problems with our liberties? Wilbur Hubbard |
Clean Boating Act of 2008
"Wilbur Hubbard" wrote in message anews.com. .. snipped. How is it that there are so many stupid, liberal judges around to cause problems with our liberties? Correct me if I am wrong, but I am under the impression that in USA judges have to get elected. That being so, who would elect a stupid,liberal judge? Hard to imagine isn't it? |
Clean Boating Act of 2008
"Edgar" wrote in message
... Correct me if I am wrong, but I am under the impression that in USA judges have to get elected. That being so, who would elect a stupid,liberal judge? Hard to imagine isn't it? Not really. The right-wingnuts have got to have someone to rail against, so they elect stuplid, liberal judges. If that fails, they elect a president who appoints stupid, right-wingnut judges. See how it works.... -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
Clean Boating Act of 2008
"Dave" wrote in message ... On Tue, 25 Mar 2008 17:40:51 +0100, "Edgar" said: Correct me if I am wrong, but I am under the impression that in USA judges have to get elected. You are wrong. Well, I admitted that possibility, but if you think I am wrong you might at least have pointed me in what you consider to be the corrrect direction. |
Clean Boating Act of 2008
In article , "Edgar" wrote:
"Wilbur Hubbard" wrote in message tanews.com. .. snipped. How is it that there are so many stupid, liberal judges around to cause problems with our liberties? Correct me if I am wrong, but I am under the impression that in USA judges have to get elected. That being so, who would elect a stupid,liberal judge? Hard to imagine isn't it? Federal Judges are **APPOINTED** by the President of the United States with the advice and consent of Congress (might be just the Senate). |
Clean Boating Act of 2008
"who cares?" wrote in message
news:NTdGj.2379$Ew5.154@trnddc04... In article , "Edgar" wrote: "Wilbur Hubbard" wrote in message ctanews.com. .. snipped. How is it that there are so many stupid, liberal judges around to cause problems with our liberties? Correct me if I am wrong, but I am under the impression that in USA judges have to get elected. That being so, who would elect a stupid,liberal judge? Hard to imagine isn't it? Federal Judges are **APPOINTED** by the President of the United States with the advice and consent of Congress (might be just the Senate). Yes, but not state/local judges. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
Clean Boating Act of 2008
Dave wrote:
On Tue, 25 Mar 2008 21:52:58 +0100, "Edgar" said: Well, I admitted that possibility, but if you think I am wrong you might at least have pointed me in what you consider to be the corrrect direction. Start with the fact that we have 50 States, each with its own court system, and that each State also has at least one Federal District Court. Ah come on Dave, Edgar is on the other side of the pond, would it have pained you that much to provide a brief outline of some of the scenarios? You know, like are Supreme Court Justices appointed or elected, are local traffic court judges elected.. In England *no* judges or justices are elected. Cheers Marty |
Clean Boating Act of 2008
In article , "Capt. JG" wrote:
"who cares?" wrote in message news:NTdGj.2379$Ew5.154@trnddc04... In article , "Edgar" wrote: "Wilbur Hubbard" wrote in message . octanews.com. .. snipped. How is it that there are so many stupid, liberal judges around to cause problems with our liberties? Correct me if I am wrong, but I am under the impression that in USA judges have to get elected. That being so, who would elect a stupid,liberal judge? Hard to imagine isn't it? Federal Judges are **APPOINTED** by the President of the United States with the advice and consent of Congress (might be just the Senate). Yes, but not state/local judges. State and local judges do not have the authority to issue orders that are binding on boaters all over the US. If this issue is really going to affect boaters all over the nation and require action by congress to correct the matter, it is a federal judge who is screwing things up. |
| All times are GMT +1. The time now is 11:38 PM. |
Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004 - 2014 BoatBanter.com