What the unfortunate comment was meant to represent is the
sad but true fact that the US does not have the best life expectancy
and as a consequence not the best infant mortality figures.
The US does not have the largest proportion of population exposed to
Health care, not the highest literacy rate, etc., etc.

But as many people who are willing to court death to get here will
agree, it is a very desirable place to live.

Brian Whatcott Altus OK


Now that is a true statement.

Cheers
Marty

Jere Lull wrote:
On 2008-01-27 17:25:16 -0500, Stephen Trapani
said:

Marty wrote:
Stephen Trapani wrote:

All that and still the best country in the world.

In your eyes, not in a good many others.

No, not in my eyes, objectively, by any reasonable measure.

"Best" is not objective. It's subjective. The choice of statistics to
include or exclude is based upon the measurer's biases, so the results
will be as well.

The measure that I believe approaches objectivity is how many want to
live there --or leave-- legally or illegally.

(Yes, I think we're in agreement, but this seemed to be the best place
to break in.)


Yup, partly due shear physical size, and proximity; it is after all
somewhat of bitch to propel a home made raft to Iceland or Norway from
one of the many less desirable countries.


Cheers
Marty

Jere Lull wrote:
On 2008-01-27 17:25:16 -0500, Stephen Trapani
said:

Marty wrote:
Stephen Trapani wrote:

All that and still the best country in the world.

In your eyes, not in a good many others.

No, not in my eyes, objectively, by any reasonable measure.

"Best" is not objective. It's subjective. The choice of statistics to
include or exclude is based upon the measurer's biases, so the results
will be as well.

I disagree. For example, there is a sailboat that handles blue water
best, objectively, all other things being equal. It could probably even
be measured with instruments, (maybe one or two of which hasn't been
invented yet). There is a best sailboat for making the best use of the
wind. And on and on.

There is best NFL football team every year, objectively. There is a best
place to start a business, objectively, based upon demand and local
unavoidable expenses, and on and on. Sure, maybe you can say that 'best'
with respect to things like paintings and songs is subjective, but not
every 'best' is subjective and there are plenty of objective measures
for the best country in the world. Including this one:

The measure that I believe approaches objectivity is how many want to
live there --or leave-- legally or illegally.

Stephen

"Stephen Trapani" wrote in message
...
Capt. JG wrote:
"Stephen Trapani" wrote in message
...
Marty wrote:
Stephen Trapani wrote:essels for the USCG
without getting so much as a usable dinghy.

It's so depressing to watch. Even worse to be paying for.
I do not envy you on that - what a pity for such a wonderful land.
All that and still the best country in the world.
In your eyes, not in a good many others.
No, not in my eyes, objectively, by any reasonable measure.

Stephen


Remember the light bulb joke... how many Americans does it take to screw
in a light bulb... just one. He puts the bulb in the socket and the world
revolves around him.

Yeah, US citizens have had guilt about their advantaged place in the world
for decades. So much so that many have turned a microscope on themselves
and magnified their faults so large that they can no longer see much of
the good in their country. Sad, really.

Stephen



The US certainly isn't perfect... witness the current administration... but,
despite our shortcomings and the fact that other countries do a host of
things a lot better/smarter, I wouldn't trade places with anyone from
anywhere.


--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Capt. JG wrote:


The US certainly isn't perfect... witness the current administration... but,
despite our shortcomings and the fact that other countries do a host of
things a lot better/smarter, I wouldn't trade places with anyone from
anywhere.

Indeed, most people living in prosperous, relatively free countries
would say exactly the same thing. My beef is chest beating Neanderthals
screaming "My country is the best!". There are a good many fine places
to live, each has its' merits and its' drawbacks.

Cheers
Marty

Marty wrote:
Capt. JG wrote:


The US certainly isn't perfect... witness the current
administration... but, despite our shortcomings and the fact that
other countries do a host of things a lot better/smarter, I wouldn't
trade places with anyone from anywhere.

Indeed, most people living in prosperous, relatively free countries
would say exactly the same thing. My beef is chest beating Neanderthals
screaming "My country is the best!". There are a good many fine places
to live, each has its' merits and its' drawbacks.

And one of them has the most merits and the least drawbacks. Whether or
not that is the US, there is nothing wrong with having an opinion about
which one it is, even if it is one's own, especially when one is not
screaming.

There is also nothing wrong with defending one's own country from false
criticism. You should have more confidence and less self loathing. There
is nothing wrong with living in the best place on earth, really. You
don't have to feel guilty.

Stephen

Capt JG spoke:
The US certainly isn't perfect... witness the current administration...

Yes, and the last one, and the one before that, and... Oh yeah, remember
Carter - now THAT was quite an effective leadership! Sheesh! Of course
according to the Democraps the Career Criminals Clintons were just
disliked by the press... How about Truman? Turns out that everything
Sen. McCarthy said about commie spies in his administration was true
including the names he named - and that was corroborated by the Soviets
when they opened up their KGB files. You might want to take a look at
ALL the administrations the U.S. has ever had, you will find that there
has never been a "perfect" U.S. or administration. After all, they are
two things that make having a "perfect" country pretty difficult - they
(the leaders and politicians) are human and therefore faulty, and, a
democracy, even a republican form of democracy is a very difficult thing
to manage without the 'Gimme what I want and everything I can get' crowd
destroying it from within like most other democracies before. And oh
yeah, the politicians - ALL the politicians, are the biggest 'Gimme'
crowd out there. Sad to say, there can be no politics without
corruption. If you can find a totally uncorrupted administration of any
country then I know I can point to an outright liar. And don't forget
the 'Gimme everything I can get' crowd of citizens that push their fav
politician to be as corrupt as possible, and then make excuses for him
and re-elect him. Anyone here want to trash this country in favor of
letting that paragon of virtue, the UN, come in and run things? Can you
imagine this country run just like, or by the UN? And you have the gall
to think *WE* are corrupt??? (Hell, compared to them, we are the
greatest most honest and benign nation that ever existed) Well, it very
possibly could happen if we as a country don't wise up soon and stop
supporting politicians that support that assinine criminal organization.
And as for the idiots (and I really do mean idiots) who think anything
the UN says about us is valid or even slightly resembles truth, then you
are blinded by your hatred and predjudices just like the UN and you
clearly don't have the cognitive abilities to recognize anything true or
false, you just repeat what your politicians told you to think and say.
Besides, most people in this country, just like outsiders, don't do ANY
research on their own to find out what actually *is* true about what
goes on here, nor are many honest enough to report what is totally true
rather than just what supports their own political leanings. They just
enjoy trashing us from within and without to suit their personal
agendas. And as bad as some of you (US citizen) America haters think
this country is, I don't see you leaving. Try living in some other
country for a few years (we won't miss you, promise), you will most
likely, unfortunately, come back - they nearly all eventually come back
- because in spite of our shortcomings, taken as a whole, we still have
the best, most desireable country in the world to live in.
Rave on, I'm deleting this thread.
Red

"Marty" wrote in message
...
Capt. JG wrote:


The US certainly isn't perfect... witness the current administration...
but, despite our shortcomings and the fact that other countries do a host
of things a lot better/smarter, I wouldn't trade places with anyone from
anywhere.

Indeed, most people living in prosperous, relatively free countries would
say exactly the same thing. My beef is chest beating Neanderthals
screaming "My country is the best!". There are a good many fine places to
live, each has its' merits and its' drawbacks.

Cheers
Marty


I wouldn't mind living in New Zealand... that's a nice place, and the
sailing is almost as good. LOL

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Red" wrote in message
...
Capt JG spoke:
The US certainly isn't perfect... witness the current administration...

Yes, and the last one, and the one before that, and...

snip

Take two drinks and call someone else in the morning..

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

On Jan 28, 2:54 am,
Capt JG spoke:
The US certainly isn't perfect... witness the current administration...

Red wrote:
Yes, and the last one, and the one before that, and... (snip)...
... How about Truman? Turns out that everything
Sen. McCarthy said about commie spies in his administration was true
including the names he named - and that was corroborated by the Soviets
when they opened up their KGB files.

Right. You mean the KGB had Uncle Joe's laundry list in their files?
My my my.

Alger Hiss was indeed a spy, although a very ineffective one. As for
the rest, it was a right-wing whack-job fantasy... guess that must be
the attraction for you...

DSK