Windvanes
 

How about a spirited, yet polite discussion of various wind vane systems
currently available?

--
Dennis Gibbons
dkgibbons at optonline dot net

Windvanes
 

In "Dennis Gibbons" writes:

How about a spirited, yet polite discussion of various wind vane systems
currently available?

Why cant you go trhough the old threads, as about everything is said
already about this topic.

For starters I suggest you read Peter Forthmans exellent book, that can
be loaded fee from the addres: http://www.windpilot.de/

Then you can come back.

- Lauri Tarkkonen

--
Dennis Gibbons
dkgibbons at optonline dot net

Windvanes
 

On Nov 11, 11:57 am, "Dennis Gibbons" wrote:
How about a spirited, yet polite discussion of various wind vane systems
currently available?

--
Dennis Gibbons
dkgibbons at optonline dot net


okay......................

Dont use them. Just more **** on deck and stuff to go wrong.
Bob

Windvanes
 

Lauri Tarkkonen wrote:
In "Dennis Gibbons" writes:

How about a spirited, yet polite discussion of various wind vane systems
currently available?

Why cant you go trhough the old threads, as about everything is said
already about this topic.

For starters I suggest you read Peter Forthmans exellent book, that can
be loaded fee from the addres: http://www.windpilot.de/

Then you can come back.

- Lauri Tarkkonen

--
Dennis Gibbons
dkgibbons at optonline dot net


hydrovane.com also has some useful information with perhaps a different
point of view (aux rudder vs. servo pendulum)

I have a home made aux rudder with trim tab arrangement that works well
but that makes reversing difficult.

Windvanes
 

On Nov 12, 6:14 am, "Roger Long" wrote:
I thought it was good advice Lauri's reply to look up what has already been
said. Just in case you miss it, here's the link to my windvane installation
page:

http://home.maine.rr.com/rlma/Windvane.htm

Ignore Bob's reply. The windvane is the best thing I ever did for the boat,
even for coastal cruising.

--
Roger Long



Good Morning Roger:

Youre up early today. Or are you on the east coast? I agree, best to
ignore the flavor of my message but I truely hold with nyet on the
whirlly birds on a boat. But as with everything about boats it really
boils down to a philosophy.

THere is a joke among the Euro crusiers Ive met. Even read the same
comment somplace. "You can always tell an American boat because of all
the **** on deck." You know, bikes, boats, sailboards, cans, wind
vanes, etc.

As an engineer, Im sure you can "see" an engineer's desgn philosophy
with one look at a boat or motorcycle.

I wonder what WIllburr would say about windmills?

Hope your day goes well Roger.
Bob


But I am sure there is a significant number who

Windvanes
 

In hpeer writes:

Lauri Tarkkonen wrote:
In "Dennis Gibbons" writes:

How about a spirited, yet polite discussion of various wind vane systems
currently available?

Why cant you go trhough the old threads, as about everything is said
already about this topic.

For starters I suggest you read Peter Forthmans exellent book, that can
be loaded fee from the addres: http://www.windpilot.de/

Then you can come back.

- Lauri Tarkkonen

--
Dennis Gibbons
dkgibbons at optonline dot net


hydrovane.com also has some useful information with perhaps a different
point of view (aux rudder vs. servo pendulum)

I have a home made aux rudder with trim tab arrangement that works well
but that makes reversing difficult.

You just said it, why one should avoid Hydrovane. :-).

- Lauri Tarkkonen

Windvanes
 

In "Roger Long" writes:

Bob,

The tone of your reply makes a lot more sense to me when I read what you
just posted and realize that you are tilting at windmills.

I think, but maybe I'm wrong, that the OP was talking about windVANES, those
wonderful devices that steer the boat without using any of the electrical
power that would be produced by a windMILL.

I have no experience with the latter aside from occasionally wondering how
people put up with the noise when I get close to one.

I have had an Aerogen wind generator for some 20 years, and it is
SILENT, so why should one buy a noisy one, when silent ones are available.

- Lauri Tarkkonen

Windvanes
 

On Nov 12, 8:04 am, "Roger Long" wrote:
Bob,

The tone of your reply makes a lot more sense to me when I read what you
just posted and realize that you are tilting at windmills.

I think, but maybe I'm wrong, that the OP was talking about windVANES, those
wonderful devices that steer the boat without using any of the electrical
power that would be produced by a windMILL.

I have no experience with the latter aside from occasionally wondering how
people put up with the noise when I get close to one.

--
Roger Long



Hey Roger !

Duhhh, a second read I find myself embarrassed by my critical and
shallow understanding of the post.
You are right ! Ah, wind vanes............ got one, an Aries. Works
great but always a bit nervous when stuffing the stern into a tight
slip. Lots of money hanging off the stern to get bent out of shape.

Thanks for the correction Roger. But I still draw the line at wind
mills on a boat. :)

Bob

Windvanes
 

In . com Bob writes:

On Nov 12, 8:04 am, "Roger Long" wrote:
Bob,

The tone of your reply makes a lot more sense to me when I read what you
just posted and realize that you are tilting at windmills.

I think, but maybe I'm wrong, that the OP was talking about windVANES, those
wonderful devices that steer the boat without using any of the electrical
power that would be produced by a windMILL.

I have no experience with the latter aside from occasionally wondering how
people put up with the noise when I get close to one.

--
Roger Long



Hey Roger !

Duhhh, a second read I find myself embarrassed by my critical and
shallow understanding of the post.
You are right ! Ah, wind vanes............ got one, an Aries. Works
great but always a bit nervous when stuffing the stern into a tight
slip. Lots of money hanging off the stern to get bent out of shape.

Thanks for the correction Roger. But I still draw the line at wind
mills on a boat. :)

Bob

If you had a Windpilot, you did not have this problem. :-).

- Lauri Tarkkonen

Windvanes
 

Lauri,
Read Peter's book and have emailed back and forth with him. Unfortunately,
old thread on that subject no longer available.

BTW, what is your experience with the Windpilot?
"Lauri Tarkkonen" wrote in message
...
In "Dennis Gibbons"
writes:

How about a spirited, yet polite discussion of various wind vane systems
currently available?

Why cant you go trhough the old threads, as about everything is said
already about this topic.

For starters I suggest you read Peter Forthmans exellent book, that can
be loaded fee from the addres: http://www.windpilot.de/

Then you can come back.

- Lauri Tarkkonen

--
Dennis Gibbons
dkgibbons at optonline dot net

Windvanes
 

Lauri Tarkkonen wrote:

In . com Bob writes:


On Nov 12, 8:04 am, "Roger Long" wrote:

Bob,

The tone of your reply makes a lot more sense to me when I read what you
just posted and realize that you are tilting at windmills.

I think, but maybe I'm wrong, that the OP was talking about windVANES, those
wonderful devices that steer the boat without using any of the electrical
power that would be produced by a windMILL.

I have no experience with the latter aside from occasionally wondering how
people put up with the noise when I get close to one.

--
Roger Long




Hey Roger !


Duhhh, a second read I find myself embarrassed by my critical and
shallow understanding of the post.
You are right ! Ah, wind vanes............ got one, an Aries. Works
great but always a bit nervous when stuffing the stern into a tight
slip. Lots of money hanging off the stern to get bent out of shape.


Thanks for the correction Roger. But I still draw the line at wind
mills on a boat. :)


Bob


If you had a Windpilot, you did not have this problem. :-).

- Lauri Tarkkonen



I've read the book, looked at the setup Roger has on Strider and
just can't go there (my boat is just way too small).

I went out and sailed today and thought about all this.

In the scale I would need I was wondering if anybody had seen a
trim tab on the rudder that was operated by a vane?

Or is that completely nuts?

Richard

Windvanes
 

"cavelamb himself" wrote in message
...
Lauri Tarkkonen wrote:

In . com Bob
writes:


On Nov 12, 8:04 am, "Roger Long" wrote:

Bob,

The tone of your reply makes a lot more sense to me when I read what you
just posted and realize that you are tilting at windmills.

I think, but maybe I'm wrong, that the OP was talking about windVANES,
those
wonderful devices that steer the boat without using any of the
electrical
power that would be produced by a windMILL.

I have no experience with the latter aside from occasionally wondering
how
people put up with the noise when I get close to one.

--
Roger Long




Hey Roger !


Duhhh, a second read I find myself embarrassed by my critical and
shallow understanding of the post.
You are right ! Ah, wind vanes............ got one, an Aries. Works
great but always a bit nervous when stuffing the stern into a tight
slip. Lots of money hanging off the stern to get bent out of shape.


Thanks for the correction Roger. But I still draw the line at wind
mills on a boat. :)


Bob


If you had a Windpilot, you did not have this problem. :-).

- Lauri Tarkkonen



I've read the book, looked at the setup Roger has on Strider and
just can't go there (my boat is just way too small).

I went out and sailed today and thought about all this.

In the scale I would need I was wondering if anybody had seen a
trim tab on the rudder that was operated by a vane?

Or is that completely nuts?

Richard


I saw one out in the Pacific that was mounted on an outboard rudder. The
wind vane was a simple V shape on top of the rod leading to the trim tab.
The vane was mounted on a collar that could be adjusted for the wind.
Actually I think he loosened the set screw and let it weather cock and the
reached back and tightened it up. Very simple and he had used it from Samoa
to Japan, on a home built 36'r.

Leanne

Windvanes
 

On Mon, 12 Nov 2007 20:13:20 -0600, cavelamb himself
wrote:

Lauri Tarkkonen wrote:

In . com Bob writes:


On Nov 12, 8:04 am, "Roger Long" wrote:

Bob,

The tone of your reply makes a lot more sense to me when I read what you
just posted and realize that you are tilting at windmills.

I think, but maybe I'm wrong, that the OP was talking about windVANES, those
wonderful devices that steer the boat without using any of the electrical
power that would be produced by a windMILL.

I have no experience with the latter aside from occasionally wondering how
people put up with the noise when I get close to one.

--
Roger Long




Hey Roger !


Duhhh, a second read I find myself embarrassed by my critical and
shallow understanding of the post.
You are right ! Ah, wind vanes............ got one, an Aries. Works
great but always a bit nervous when stuffing the stern into a tight
slip. Lots of money hanging off the stern to get bent out of shape.


Thanks for the correction Roger. But I still draw the line at wind
mills on a boat. :)


Bob


If you had a Windpilot, you did not have this problem. :-).

- Lauri Tarkkonen



I've read the book, looked at the setup Roger has on Strider and
just can't go there (my boat is just way too small).

I went out and sailed today and thought about all this.

In the scale I would need I was wondering if anybody had seen a
trim tab on the rudder that was operated by a vane?

Or is that completely nuts?

Richard

Had a friend who had this arrangement on a Bristol Channel Cutter,
worked fine.


Bruce-in-Bangkok
(Note:remove underscores
from address for reply)

Windvanes
 

In cavelamb himself writes:

Lauri Tarkkonen wrote:

In . com Bob writes:


On Nov 12, 8:04 am, "Roger Long" wrote:

Bob,

The tone of your reply makes a lot more sense to me when I read what you
just posted and realize that you are tilting at windmills.

I think, but maybe I'm wrong, that the OP was talking about windVANES, those
wonderful devices that steer the boat without using any of the electrical
power that would be produced by a windMILL.

I have no experience with the latter aside from occasionally wondering how
people put up with the noise when I get close to one.

--
Roger Long




Hey Roger !


Duhhh, a second read I find myself embarrassed by my critical and
shallow understanding of the post.
You are right ! Ah, wind vanes............ got one, an Aries. Works
great but always a bit nervous when stuffing the stern into a tight
slip. Lots of money hanging off the stern to get bent out of shape.


Thanks for the correction Roger. But I still draw the line at wind
mills on a boat. :)


Bob


If you had a Windpilot, you did not have this problem. :-).

- Lauri Tarkkonen



I've read the book, looked at the setup Roger has on Strider and
just can't go there (my boat is just way too small).

I went out and sailed today and thought about all this.

In the scale I would need I was wondering if anybody had seen a
trim tab on the rudder that was operated by a vane?

Or is that completely nuts?

There are several systems and it was very common before they came up
with the servo pendulum. If you have read Peter Förthmanns books, then
you should have noticed him explaining such things on pages 46-47 and
there are pictures of two on page 46.

I think you should take Peter's book seriously, he knows what he is
talking about. I studied this topic about 5 years before I decided on
the system and now my vife says: Why did you not buy this earlier.

- Lauri Tarkkonen

Windvanes
 

On Mon, 12 Nov 2007 20:13:20 -0600, cavelamb himself
wrote:

I've read the book, looked at the setup Roger has on Strider and
just can't go there (my boat is just way too small).

What about a small tiller pilot with a small wind vane sensor?

Windvanes
 

Lauri,
What boat do you have and what sort of sailing do you do?
Yes I have read the book. I am deciding between Aries, Monitor, Sailomat
and Windpilot.

Regards,
Dennis Gibbons
S/V Dark Lady
CN35-207
"Lauri Tarkkonen" wrote in message
...
In cavelamb himself
writes:

Lauri Tarkkonen wrote:

In . com Bob
writes:


On Nov 12, 8:04 am, "Roger Long" wrote:

Bob,

The tone of your reply makes a lot more sense to me when I read what
you
just posted and realize that you are tilting at windmills.

I think, but maybe I'm wrong, that the OP was talking about windVANES,
those
wonderful devices that steer the boat without using any of the
electrical
power that would be produced by a windMILL.

I have no experience with the latter aside from occasionally wondering
how
people put up with the noise when I get close to one.

--
Roger Long




Hey Roger !


Duhhh, a second read I find myself embarrassed by my critical and
shallow understanding of the post.
You are right ! Ah, wind vanes............ got one, an Aries. Works
great but always a bit nervous when stuffing the stern into a tight
slip. Lots of money hanging off the stern to get bent out of shape.


Thanks for the correction Roger. But I still draw the line at wind
mills on a boat. :)


Bob


If you had a Windpilot, you did not have this problem. :-).

- Lauri Tarkkonen



I've read the book, looked at the setup Roger has on Strider and
just can't go there (my boat is just way too small).

I went out and sailed today and thought about all this.

In the scale I would need I was wondering if anybody had seen a
trim tab on the rudder that was operated by a vane?

Or is that completely nuts?

There are several systems and it was very common before they came up
with the servo pendulum. If you have read Peter Förthmanns books, then
you should have noticed him explaining such things on pages 46-47 and
there are pictures of two on page 46.

I think you should take Peter's book seriously, he knows what he is
talking about. I studied this topic about 5 years before I decided on
the system and now my vife says: Why did you not buy this earlier.

- Lauri Tarkkonen

Windvanes
 

In "Dennis Gibbons" writes:

Lauri,
What boat do you have and what sort of sailing do you do?
Yes I have read the book. I am deciding between Aries, Monitor, Sailomat
and Windpilot.

I have a 40-foot sloop, I am cruising with my vife in the Baltic,
visiting in the summer Sweden, Denmark, Germany, Poland, Lithuania,
Latvia and Estonia.

I made some studies in the same field and Windpilot won hands down. I
have installed and sailed with Aries on a friends boat, it is heavy and
clumsy, more trouble to install, and the dimensions of the components do
not match the loadings applied on them. Monitor is a stainles steel copy
of Aries. Sailomat is too complicated, they did not get it right. Read
the book again, Förthman knows what he is talking about.

The auxiliary rudder systems are a nuisance when you try to reverse and
manouver in harbours, Aries and Monitor are vulnerable in close
quarters, Windpilot is superior in all aspects to these.

- Lauri Tarkkonen

Regards,
Dennis Gibbons
S/V Dark Lady
CN35-207
"Lauri Tarkkonen" wrote in message
...
In cavelamb himself
writes:

Lauri Tarkkonen wrote:

In . com Bob
writes:


On Nov 12, 8:04 am, "Roger Long" wrote:

Bob,

The tone of your reply makes a lot more sense to me when I read what
you
just posted and realize that you are tilting at windmills.

I think, but maybe I'm wrong, that the OP was talking about windVANES,
those
wonderful devices that steer the boat without using any of the
electrical
power that would be produced by a windMILL.

I have no experience with the latter aside from occasionally wondering
how
people put up with the noise when I get close to one.

--
Roger Long




Hey Roger !


Duhhh, a second read I find myself embarrassed by my critical and
shallow understanding of the post.
You are right ! Ah, wind vanes............ got one, an Aries. Works
great but always a bit nervous when stuffing the stern into a tight
slip. Lots of money hanging off the stern to get bent out of shape.


Thanks for the correction Roger. But I still draw the line at wind
mills on a boat. :)


Bob


If you had a Windpilot, you did not have this problem. :-).

- Lauri Tarkkonen



I've read the book, looked at the setup Roger has on Strider and
just can't go there (my boat is just way too small).

I went out and sailed today and thought about all this.

In the scale I would need I was wondering if anybody had seen a
trim tab on the rudder that was operated by a vane?

Or is that completely nuts?

There are several systems and it was very common before they came up
with the servo pendulum. If you have read Peter Förthmanns books, then
you should have noticed him explaining such things on pages 46-47 and
there are pictures of two on page 46.

I think you should take Peter's book seriously, he knows what he is
talking about. I studied this topic about 5 years before I decided on
the system and now my vife says: Why did you not buy this earlier.

- Lauri Tarkkonen

Windvanes
 

In "Roger Long" writes:

You should take a look at the Cap Horn. Although primarily designed for the
very neat, integrated installation, they are also available for outboard
mounting with outboard rudders in which form the installation is no more
difficult than the other models. Their mechanism is dead simple and very
reliable. They were new on the scene when the book was written so they
don't get much coverage aside from some comments that they don't have some
adjustments that other vanes do. Not a big issue in my experience.

I love mine.

--
Roger Long

The idea is neat, but the geometry of the 2:1 gear gives you better
steering and better damping. This is a bit complicated to explain, but
because it is in the books so I do not bother to do it here.

To my taste it is too complicated. There was a professor in general
mechanics and engineering who started every lecture by telling: Simple
macines are reliable. This has been forgotten. I gave Cap Horn a very
serious look and thought in the Düsseldorf boat fair, but it really did
not have anyting to compensate for the complications of installation.

- Lauri Tarkkonen

Windvanes
 

In "Roger Long" writes:

"Lauri Tarkkonen" wrote:

There are two different issues here that I think you are mixing up.
Complexity of mechanism and complexity of installation.

Yes, the Cap Horn is complicated to install if you do it as intended but the
result is a simpler boat, cleaner appearance, and simplicity in maintenance
and operation. You can buy an outboard model and have the simple
installation.

The mechanism of the Cap Horn is elegantly simple. That's one of the things
that attracted me to it as a designer of boats and nautical things. They
have certainly proven themselves.

The installation won't be as big a deal on all boats as it was on mine. My
lazzarett was just a couple inches too big to reach the critical spots so I
had to work inside. I also could have done it in a much easier fashion but
I wanted to get the braces up and out of the way. I would rather have done
that stuff for a few days in the winter and spring than have lived with a
drum on my wheel and lines running all around the cockpit for the rest of my
sailing days.

It might be different for voyaging where you set up the self steering and
then don't go to that part of the boat for days on end. The Cape Horn makes
self steering practical in coastal waters. The ability to disconnect it in
two seconds is great. Whether I am using it or not, there is no visible
sign of it inside the cockpit coaming other than the wheel turning magically
back and forth.

Obviously you do not know Windpilot. You have the gear bolted on with
four bolts, and you can remove for winter removing two bolts, and about
the appearance in the cockpit, only two strings coming to the tiller. You
can release the tiller in a second by just pulling the chain of the
slot. If you do not use it, it is turned up and in my case it does not
go over the transom when turned up.

- Lauri Tarkkonen


--
Roger Long

Windvanes
 

"Roger Long" wrote:

Ah, a tiller. Yes, a tiller installation would close the complexity
gap
considerably but I have a wheel.

Take a look at the Fleming servo unit.

316L investment cast parts, common bearings with popular winches, no
control lines req'd, provides emergency rudder as std.

Add a push-pull stick type auto pilot and your home free.

Free that is, except in your wallet.

Lew

Windvanes
 

In "Roger Long" writes:

Ah, a tiller. Yes, a tiller installation would close the complexity gap
considerably but I have a wheel.

I very much like the appearance of something that is part of the boat
instead of another thing bolted on the back. Personal preference but I also
get a frame strong enough to support an effective emergency rudder and some
other things.

I won't argue about final choice but anyone, especially with a wheel, should
look closely at the Cap Horn.

BTW, I have looked at the Windpilot. Getting my boat ready for those "4
bolts" and wheel control lines would have been a considerable amount of
work as well. The Cap Horn took a lot of days but they were short days a
ways a way under less than optimum conditions. I also installed an electric
autopilot and reinforced a bulkhead at the same time.

The control lines need only one or two block each, with two you get them
better out of way. It took me two hours to install the Windpilot. I do
not know if this picture is good enough to show how it is:

http://www.helsinki.fi/~tarkkone/person/SansuliH6.jpg

- Lauri Tarkkonen

Windvanes
 

In "Lew Hodgett" writes:


"Roger Long" wrote:

Ah, a tiller. Yes, a tiller installation would close the complexity
gap
considerably but I have a wheel.

Take a look at the Fleming servo unit.

316L investment cast parts, common bearings with popular winches, no
control lines req'd, provides emergency rudder as std.

Add a push-pull stick type auto pilot and your home free.

Free that is, except in your wallet.

Lew

Fleming is in principle very much like Windpilot. The difference being
that now and then Fleming seems to be out of operation, but Förthman
keeps on working. I had a long discussion with Fleming representative in
London Boat show when I still was pondering various options. The fellow
making monitors is a Swede, I have discussed with thim several times at
London Boats show, but both Monitor and Aries are just too bulky and
have too much material where it is not needed.

- Lauri Tarkkonen

Windvanes
 

In "Roger Long" writes:

Purdy, yes. Looks very expensive.

Another big collection of flabingi on the back of a boat. When the vane is
stowed, a lot of people don't even realize I have a windvane on the boat.
It's a great handhold instead of an obstruction to the boarding ladder.

No more looking for me, I'm mated for life to my Cape Horn by six layers of
epoxy and fiberglass mat:)

--
Roger Long

Unless you sell your boat. If I sell my boat, I can loosen four bolts,
put some putty and topcoat to the holes and take my Windpilot with me.
Very few people are prepared to buy with the boat any gear at full
price.

- Lauri Tarkkonen

Windvanes
 

Roger Long wrote:
There is a much better book out there, long out of print, from back in
the days when most of these were home brew items. See if you can find a
copy of (I think) "Self Steering for Sailing Craft" by John Letcher.
He's still in business at Aerohydro in Southwest Harbor, Maine so he
might be able to help. I wish I knew what happened to my copy.

Does your boat have a raked rudder? If so, the straight through, direct
connect tab is incredibly simple. Tabs do have problems but they can
also make hand steering a delight on even a heavy handed boat. You just
put in an adjustable auxilliary link to the tiller and use the tab to
take out the weather helm.


No, the rudder is vertical (and external).
She's a daysailer with delusions of cruising.

It looks to me like the tab sense is direct.
Whichever way the wind turns the vane, the tab should follow.

Will check Amazon for the book you mentioned.

Thank you.


Richard

Windvanes
 

Lauri Tarkkonen wrote:

There are several systems and it was very common before they came up
with the servo pendulum. If you have read Peter Förthmanns books, then
you should have noticed him explaining such things on pages 46-47 and
there are pictures of two on page 46.

I think you should take Peter's book seriously, he knows what he is
talking about. I studied this topic about 5 years before I decided on
the system and now my vife says: Why did you not buy this earlier.

- Lauri Tarkkonen

Are you refering to the auxillary rudder approach on pager 46?

Windvanes
 

Roger Long wrote:

Purdy, yes. Looks very expensive.

Another big collection of flabingi on the back of a boat. When the vane
is stowed, a lot of people don't even realize I have a windvane on the
boat. It's a great handhold instead of an obstruction to the boarding
ladder.

No more looking for me, I'm mated for life to my Cape Horn by six layers
of epoxy and fiberglass mat:)


I followed the installation description on your web site and have to
agree. While the installation may be a bit complicated, the machine
itself is simple. And it's unobtrusive.

But that's for Strider. Won't work on my 18 footer...

But a mount behind the tiller might.

Richard

Windvanes
 

Wayne.B wrote:

On Mon, 12 Nov 2007 20:13:20 -0600, cavelamb himself
wrote:


I've read the book, looked at the setup Roger has on Strider and
just can't go there (my boat is just way too small).


What about a small tiller pilot with a small wind vane sensor?

That's about what I drew up last night to check out my thinking.
Looks simple enough at first blush but I'd love to see some prior art
on the subject.

My ex-wife is a chemestry professor. She often says,"Twoo weeks in the
lab will save three days inthe library every time".

Made her point.

Richard

Windvanes
 

In cavelamb himself writes:

Lauri Tarkkonen wrote:

There are several systems and it was very common before they came up
with the servo pendulum. If you have read Peter Förthmanns books, then
you should have noticed him explaining such things on pages 46-47 and
there are pictures of two on page 46.

I think you should take Peter's book seriously, he knows what he is
talking about. I studied this topic about 5 years before I decided on
the system and now my vife says: Why did you not buy this earlier.

- Lauri Tarkkonen

Are you refering to the auxillary rudder approach on pager 46?

There is one wit an auxiliary and one on the main rudder.


- Lauri Tarkkonen

Windvanes
 

Roger Long wrote:
"Lauri Tarkkonen" wrote

Unless you sell your boat. If I sell my boat, I can loosen four bolts,
....

That might have influenced my thinking if I planned on selling the
boat. My plan is to sail it until everyone I know is shaking their
heads and saying, "We've got to get the old guy off the boat before he
hurts himself."

The economics of boats are such a black hole though that the lose of
value I would get selling the windvane would be the least of it. I've
got about 40K of hard cash and hard labor in a boat I would be lucky to
get 16 thousand for in today's depressed market. Nobody wants old
sailboats no matter how solid they are.

Don't know much about today's depressed market where you are, but 16K
looks at least 10K low to me, compared to what other similar boats sell
for here in the PNW.

Stephen

Windvanes
 

Stephen Trapani wrote:
Roger Long wrote:
"Lauri Tarkkonen" wrote

Unless you sell your boat. If I sell my boat, I can loosen four
bolts, ....

That might have influenced my thinking if I planned on selling the
boat. My plan is to sail it until everyone I know is shaking their
heads and saying, "We've got to get the old guy off the boat before he
hurts himself."

The economics of boats are such a black hole though that the lose of
value I would get selling the windvane would be the least of it. I've
got about 40K of hard cash and hard labor in a boat I would be lucky
to get 16 thousand for in today's depressed market. Nobody wants old
sailboats no matter how solid they are.

Don't know much about today's depressed market where you are, but 16K
looks at least 10K low to me, compared to what other similar boats sell
for here in the PNW.

Stephen

Go to yachtworld and compare prices on the same boat in the PNW and
the NE. Significant differences.
Gordon

Windvanes
 

Roger Long wrote:

You really should not be thinking about self steering on an 18 footer
unless it is one of those miniature keel boats with full deck and
cockpit. A sudden wind increase in a capsizable boat that is trying to
keep maintaining a relative wind direction could be very bad.



It is just exactly that, Roger.
Catalina Capri 18 - ballasted fin keel - NOT a ceterboard -
with a cozy cabin for two.

Windvanes
 

Lauri Tarkkonen wrote:

In cavelamb himself writes:


Lauri Tarkkonen wrote:


There are several systems and it was very common before they came up
with the servo pendulum. If you have read Peter Förthmanns books, then
you should have noticed him explaining such things on pages 46-47 and
there are pictures of two on page 46.

I think you should take Peter's book seriously, he knows what he is
talking about. I studied this topic about 5 years before I decided on
the system and now my vife says: Why did you not buy this earlier.

- Lauri Tarkkonen


Are you refering to the auxillary rudder approach on pager 46?


There is one wit an auxiliary and one on the main rudder.


- Lauri Tarkkonen


Ok, the trim tab on an exernal main rudder seems to be about page 51.
46-47 are trim tab on aux rudder,
At least that's what I'm seeing here...

I'm not quite sure how the H vane design works, though.
Must be a "turn the corner" joint hidden at the bottom?

Richard

Windvanes
 

On Tue, 13 Nov 2007 23:07:58 -0600, cavelamb himself
wrote:

Wayne.B wrote:

On Mon, 12 Nov 2007 20:13:20 -0600, cavelamb himself
wrote:


I've read the book, looked at the setup Roger has on Strider and
just can't go there (my boat is just way too small).


What about a small tiller pilot with a small wind vane sensor?

That's about what I drew up last night to check out my thinking.
Looks simple enough at first blush but I'd love to see some prior art
on the subject.

===============

Looks like the Raymarine S1 TillerPilot has an option for apparent
wind angle input:

http://www.boatersland.com/raye12190.html