"N:dlzc D:aol T:com \(dlzc\)" wrote in newsv_Ii.42363$L_
:

What Brian left to the reader's imagination, is that the head
space of the tubes is at a near perfect vacuum, flooded only with
water vapor. You might recall that a perfect vacuum will lift a
column of water about 32 feet, on a high pressure day. Or had
you not figured that out?

David A. Smith


There's a limit to the vacuum boiling. After a certain point, water goes
from a solid straight to a gas with no liquid state, just like CO2 does at
atmospheric pressure.

You can't pull a full vacuum on it and get liquid water.
http://invsee.asu.edu/ed/phase/phasefeat.htm
(see graph this website, point t.p.)


Larry
--
Search youtube for "Depleted Uranium"
The ultimate dirty bomb......

"Roger Long" wrote in news:46f53eef$0$5006
:

My father won a science fair doing this back in the 1930's.

--
Roger Long


Was his real name Don Herbert and he worked for GE?...

Larry
--
I don't think I ever missed a Mr Wizard TV show. Of course, if you put the
same shows on, today, Mr Wizard would be so far over the heads of the kids
with less than Master's Degrees.....they couldn't follow along...(c;

Keith Hughes wrote in news:46f575f5$0$512$815e3792
@news.qwest.net:

Actually, do a search on "triple point" and look at the phase diagram
for water. That gives a good graphical depiction of the
pressure/temperature/phase relationships.



http://invsee.asu.edu/ed/phase/phasefeat.htm

Larry
--

Dear Wilbur Hubbard:

"Wilbur Hubbard" wrote in
message
anews.com...
....
Lame suggestion and unworkable on most boats. Ya
gotta think outta the box, man.

However, there is another way. I thought it up all by
my lonesome. All you need is a reverse osmosis
membrane. You put it into a chamber that is vented
to atmosphere on the inside and to the ocean on the
outside of the membrane. You lower it into the
ocean to a depth of only 500 feet and the pressure
of the water is enough to push fresh water through the membrane
into the chamber. When it gets full you
haul it up and empty in into your tanks. Reverse
osmosis without any energy used to get it. Ain't Wilbur
brilliant?

You are still displacing that much water... not a small feat.

David A. Smith

Dear Larry:

"Larry" wrote in message
...
"N:dlzc D:aol T:com \(dlzc\)" wrote in
newsv_Ii.42363$L_
:

What Brian left to the reader's imagination, is that the head
space of the tubes is at a near perfect vacuum, flooded only
with
water vapor. You might recall that a perfect vacuum will lift
a
column of water about 32 feet, on a high pressure day. Or had
you not figured that out?

There's a limit to the vacuum boiling. After a certain point,
water goes from a solid straight to a gas with no liquid
state, just like CO2 does at atmospheric pressure.

It actually goes into this state at very high pressures too. But
you are talking "below" the triple point, which is 0.1degC:
http://www.sv.vt.edu/classes/MSE2094...es/triple.html
.... not much of a problem above this temperature.

You can't pull a full vacuum on it and get liquid water.
http://invsee.asu.edu/ed/phase/phasefeat.htm
(see graph this website, point t.p.)

Not a full vacuum, since water vapor does fill it. And if you
boil too fast, you lose your two columns of water. And if you
don't refresh the contents of the two columns then you start
having scaling issues.

Not a slam dunk, but not a bad idea either.

David A. Smith

Larry, I think you are confusing the pressure/pull of a standing/
suspended 40 ft water column and that of a 40 ft air column.

Chris


of a On Sep 21, 6:21 pm, Larry wrote:
Brian Whatcott wrote :





You've heard all about distilling water, and you've heard all about
reverse osmosis, but you haven't heard about low-cost, low energy
stills: they are brand new.

Briefly:
Take one forty ft vertical tube filled with saline.
Take one forty ft vertical tube filled with fresh water.
Connect them with a little engineering help - at the top.

The boiling point of water at sea level pressure is about 100 deg C

The boiling point of water at the top of a sealed 40 ft column of
water is near ambient.
So, it doesn't take much heat to boil the brackish water, and have it
pass to the fresh column where it is slightly cooled to hold the near
vacuum conditions at the boiling level.

[An engineering effort of a U of Utah group I think]

Brian Whatcott Altus OK

My deepest apologies to the engineers who may be rolling under their
desks, crushing their pocket protectors. It took me a while to stop
chortling. I nearly lost my Chinese dinner!

Psst...Brian....40'? What about the lake above 40', it's 400' deep and
above 40' ASL. It hasn't boiled away in millions of years from all that
pressure and lack of pressure.

In Tehran, Iran, my apartment was about 7000' ASL. Water DID boil at a
lot lower temperature. Making a cake at 7000' altitude is simply
amazing! ONE little cake mix makes 4 cakes!.....er, ah, after you clean
out the oven from putting ALL the cake mix in the pan, filling the oven!

But, alas, even at 7000', the water in my glass didn't boil itself at
ambient temperature, even at 110F out on the lawn!

Every engineering firm across the planet is going to be a jolly place
after hearing about this on Monday...(c;

Larry
--
Sure glad it doesn't work that way! We'd all be DEAD!

On Sat, 22 Sep 2007 20:48:22 GMT, (Richard
Casady) wrote:

On Fri, 21 Sep 2007 17:35:02 -0500, Brian Whatcott
wrote:

The boiling point of water at the top of a sealed 40 ft column of
water is near ambient.
So, it doesn't take much heat to boil the brackish water, and have it
pass to the fresh column where it is slightly cooled to hold the near
vacuum conditions at the boiling level.

Fraid not. It takes the same ammount of heat to boil water as at 212F.
Approximately 1175 BTU/lb. You might save a little not heating the
water all the wqy to 212.


When you contradict me, it is always better to check your facts.
I do.

Brian Whatcott Altus OK

On Sat, 22 Sep 2007 10:55:52 -0500, Brian Whatcott
wrote stuff
and I replied:

But what is the cheap source of getting the vacuum? I figured there
had to be a vacuum, although it was not said. But how do you get it?

Well no, he obviously hadn't figured that out. Nor can anybody figure
out what is going to hold a column of water 40 ft high as was stated in
the original post. The tubes may be 40 feet but the column of water will
be considerably less. How much less will depend on how much energy is
heating on the hot side and how much energy is cooling on the cool side.
The total amount of energy needed is not going to be any different than
any other distilling method.
Unless you have the free or cheap sources of cooling and heating at
specific temperatures this isn't going to work any better either.

-jim



Well, at least this respondent Jim, is operating at shall we say the
7th grade level of science/engineering insight. Like so many other
products of the domestic school system, he seems to have a severe
case of self-esteem syndrome.

Still, he may be retrievable, starting with a science demonstration
he may have missed. Place a beaker of water in a bell-jar and pump
the air out.

When 99% of the air has been pumped out, the water in the beaker is
boiling vigorously, until, in the usual way, the beaker boils dry.
The beaker feels cool to the touch, naturally.

To quote him: "unless I have a cheap source of heating this won't
work..."

For the $64 prize: NOW do you get it?

Brian Whatcott Altus OK


Human bevaviour: Bestiality with a brain

Dear OldNick:

"OldNick" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 22 Sep 2007 10:55:52 -0500, Brian Whatcott
wrote stuff
and I replied:

But what is the cheap source of getting the vacuum?
I figured there had to be a vacuum, although it was
not said. But how do you get it?

Fill the tubes, with a small air bubble in between. Lift the
tube at the bubble. No small feat if you are looking to make
hundreds of gallons per day, but a one-shot expense...

David A. Smith

On Sat, 22 Sep 2007 20:43:48 -0700, "N:dlzc D:aol T:com \(dlzc\)"
wrote stuff
and I replied:

Then how do you keep the freshwater tube so cool? It has to be a _lot_
cooler, not so?

Is this a continuous or pulsed process? How do you maintain stasis and
extract fresh water?

If you have a small air bubble, where does the extracted fresh water
go?

etc

Fill the tubes, with a small air bubble in between. Lift the
tube at the bubble. No small feat if you are looking to make
hundreds of gallons per day, but a one-shot expense...

David A. Smith


Human bevaviour: Bestiality with a brain