Hi,

Considering buying a radar, so I have a few questions:

1. On a sailboat, where do you put the display? I rarely steer from behind the
wheel, mainly by sitting on one of the gunwales beside the wheel, or sometimes
by Otto while hiding from the rain under the dodger (hence the name... ).

2. Realistically, how far do you set the max range? I'm seeing that unless I
mount the antenna up the mast, I'm not gonna get more than maybe 10 miles range
no matter what unit I buy. Then again, if I see a freighter steaming at 30
knots, 10 miles away, I still have 20 minutes to do something. Is a 20-mile
range worth getting?

3. Do you trust yours enough to use it instead of a "watch" (ie watch the radar
screen instead of where you're going)? Trying to decide if getting a radar will
increase my cruising time significantly (ie more confidence in running at night)

4. I see a "guard zone alarm" but no "constant-bearing alarm". Why not? wouldn't
a constant-bearing alarm be far more useful (and not that hard to implement)?

5. I'm looking at the Furuno 1623 or 1712, or the JRC 1000. I have a Furuno
GP-31 GPS and I'm impressed by the quality (also, probably 90% of commercial
boats around here have Furuno radars). Any comments?

6. Is it worth while to mount the antenna up the mast, or should I use a
"dedicated" mast at the transom?

That's all for now...dreaming on a dull winter's day...

Lloyd Sumpter
"Far Cove" Catalina 36

Will answer those questions I can .... answers interspersed.

Lloyd Sumpter wrote:
Hi,

Considering buying a radar, so I have a few questions:

1. On a sailboat, where do you put the display? I rarely steer from behind the
wheel, mainly by sitting on one of the gunwales beside the wheel, or sometimes
by Otto while hiding from the rain under the dodger (hence the name... ).

Put it where it best suits your conditions when running in fog or at
night. Normally this will end up being a trade-off and may mean you
can't have it where you'd really like it.

2. Realistically, how far do you set the max range? I'm seeing that unless I
mount the antenna up the mast, I'm not gonna get more than maybe 10 miles range
no matter what unit I buy. Then again, if I see a freighter steaming at 30
knots, 10 miles away, I still have 20 minutes to do something. Is a 20-mile
range worth getting?

Your actual radar range will vary at any given time, for a number of
reasons. In open water conditions, use the range which gives you the
maximum range for your individual setup. In closer conditions, stay at
the highest range which give you a good all round view and switch to
lower ranges to get a better look. Be aware that staying on longer
ranges may mean that you may miss close in targets, so always scan.

3. Do you trust yours enough to use it instead of a "watch" (ie watch the radar
screen instead of where you're going)? Trying to decide if getting a radar will
increase my cruising time significantly (ie more confidence in running at night)

Radar is never to be used instead of your "Mark I eyeball", but in cases
of fog, it can be a better alternative, as long as you also maintain the
use of the "MarkI", and it can greatly reduce some of the concerns
regarding running at night.

4. I see a "guard zone alarm" but no "constant-bearing alarm". Why not? wouldn't
a constant-bearing alarm be far more useful (and not that hard to implement)?

Would be easy, for those sets, "gyro stabilized" but I'm not sure that
the benefits of the normal relative motion sets would increase over the
distance "guard zones". To be honest, to begin with, you are more
concerned with all vessels approaching within a certain distance than
you are with individual vessels on a collision course. The idea is to
alert you to ALL traffic within the guard zone.

5. I'm looking at the Furuno 1623 or 1712, or the JRC 1000. I have a Furuno
GP-31 GPS and I'm impressed by the quality (also, probably 90% of commercial
boats around here have Furuno radars). Any comments?

6. Is it worth while to mount the antenna up the mast, or should I use a
"dedicated" mast at the transom?

That's all for now...dreaming on a dull winter's day...

Lloyd Sumpter
"Far Cove" Catalina 36


otn

I agree with 'otn' on all points.

I'll just comment on my watch keeping methods.. On my last boat I had the
Furuno 1721 (crt) on a swivel mount that let me swing it from it's normal
chart table location out into the companion way.. I could see it from the
wheel.. On my present boat I have a Furuno 1720 that is fixed mounted at the
chart table but when I sit in the companion way I can see the display fairly
well. If I need to switch ranges or take a bearing, I'm only a single step
from my companion way seat (autopilot does most of my steering but I remain
in the cockpit/companionway). So, bottom line on display location, is where
you can see or access it while in your normal watch/lookout position. Don't
rely on any alarms zone 'bells or whistles'.. I have had too many boat enter
my alarm zones without these systems catching them (mostly when a vessel is
over taking me).

Something else to consider when you equip your boat with radar.. In the
event you are involved in a disputed accident, the boat with radar will be
held to a higher degree of responsibilty and the operater is expected to
know how to use his radar to observe other vessels manouvers, calculate CPA,
etc. (I can't quote Chapter and Verse, but that is what I was taught.)

Steve
s/v Good Intentions

I agree with 'otn' on all points.

I'll just comment on my watch keeping methods.. On my last boat I had the
Furuno 1721 (crt) on a swivel mount that let me swing it from it's normal
chart table location out into the companion way.. I could see it from the
wheel.. On my present boat I have a Furuno 1720 that is fixed mounted at the
chart table but when I sit in the companion way I can see the display fairly
well. If I need to switch ranges or take a bearing, I'm only a single step
from my companion way seat (autopilot does most of my steering but I remain
in the cockpit/companionway). So, bottom line on display location, is where
you can see or access it while in your normal watch/lookout position. Don't
rely on any alarms zone 'bells or whistles'.. I have had too many boat enter
my alarm zones without these systems catching them (mostly when a vessel is
over taking me).

Something else to consider when you equip your boat with radar.. In the
event you are involved in a disputed accident, the boat with radar will be
held to a higher degree of responsibilty and the operater is expected to
know how to use his radar to observe other vessels manouvers, calculate CPA,
etc. (I can't quote Chapter and Verse, but that is what I was taught.)

Steve
s/v Good Intentions

"Lloyd Sumpter" wrote in message
...
Hi,

Considering buying a radar, so I have a few questions:

1. On a sailboat, where do you put the display? I rarely steer from behind
the
wheel, mainly by sitting on one of the gunwales beside the wheel, or
sometimes
by Otto while hiding from the rain under the dodger (hence the
name... ).

Ours is in the pilothouse such that it can be seen from inside
or from the outside. I've seen many that are mounted on a
swing arm such that it can be swung into the companionway.

2. Realistically, how far do you set the max range? I'm seeing that unless
I
mount the antenna up the mast, I'm not gonna get more than maybe 10 miles
range
no matter what unit I buy. Then again, if I see a freighter steaming at 30
knots, 10 miles away, I still have 20 minutes to do something. Is a
20-mile
range worth getting?

The long range is nice for tracking storms. I usually keep ours
set at 3 or 4 miles while cruising.

3. Do you trust yours enough to use it instead of a "watch" (ie watch the
radar
screen instead of where you're going)? Trying to decide if getting a radar
will
increase my cruising time significantly (ie more confidence in running at
night)

It's no substitute for a proper watch, just an adjunct. I do feel
alot more secure at night with it there.

4. I see a "guard zone alarm" but no "constant-bearing alarm". Why not?
wouldn't
a constant-bearing alarm be far more useful (and not that hard to
implement)?

Mine not fancy enough for either. I can see that a constant
bearing alarm would be nice though.

5. I'm looking at the Furuno 1623 or 1712, or the JRC 1000. I have a
Furuno
GP-31 GPS and I'm impressed by the quality (also, probably 90% of
commercial
boats around here have Furuno radars). Any comments?

Ours is a Furuno and works very well. It came with the boat and
so kind of old.

6. Is it worth while to mount the antenna up the mast, or should I use a
"dedicated" mast at the transom?

Ours is mounted on an arch. Works very well.

That's all for now...dreaming on a dull winter's day...

Lloyd Sumpter
"Far Cove" Catalina 36

Lloyd Sumpter wrote in message
...
Hi,

Considering buying a radar, so I have a few questions:

1. Not qualified. Power boater.

2. Try some more numbers. At 6 knots you travel a half-mile in 5 min. That
Alaska bound cruise ship travels 2 miles in 5 min. You know which direction
the cruise boat or freighter are going in B.C. and Alaska Coastal waters.
You have lots of time to make a right angle turn and get out of the way with
12 mile max. There are other features more important. You will be shifting
ranges regularly.

3. I trust mine implicitly, as long as it's used in conjunction with 4
eyeballs, Nobeltec on 2 laptops, paper chart, compass, depth sounder, and
.... a radar reflector that allows them to see you.

5. Raytheon SL72 - lower helm only. Simple.

That's all for now...dreaming on a dull winter's day...

Get the radar. If you actually use your boat, you will find many more
applications than driving at night or in the fog, although those two are
pretty important. It's pretty easy to stay in the middle of the channel in
the daylight, if that's where you need to be, when your radar is painting
the channel walls for you, and anchoring in a summer crowd is made easier,
if not a piece of cake, when radar is showing you were all the holes are,
and the distances between the other boats. In Cosmos Cove, AK I even found
a place to anchor among the commercial crab pots in the inner cove using my
radar.

Lloyd Sumpter "Far Cove" Catalina 36

Relax and Enjoy

Hi Lloyd,,

1. On a sailboat, where do you put the display?

On a swing out arm in the companion way. That way, it's visible
anywhere in the cockpit and out of the way when not using it. You could
also see it form inside, but we never really use it from inside.

2. Realistically, how far do you set the max range?

Depends on conditions and what your doing. During night/inclement
weather horizon checks, we scan both close in and far out.

3. Do you trust yours enough to use it instead of a "watch"

No. In heavy fog/rain, we rely on it, but we use it in addition to eyes
and ears.

4. "constant-bearing alarm". Why not?

Dunno, But we just set a bearing line on a target and if it stays on the
line, alter course.

5. I'm looking at the Furuno 1623 or 1712,

We put the Raymarine SL-72 on both our last two boats and love it. I
really don't like the display on the JRC.

6. Is it worth while to mount the antenna up the mast

We had it on a self leveling unit on the mast on our last boat. But
decided to put it on a manual leveling unit on a tower on this one.

FWIW, I used to think of radar as a toy I'd like to have but couldn't
really justify the cost (sorta like a mast mounted wind indicator) .
Then, after we ran into heavy fog while approaching an unfamiliar harbor
one evening, my wife got me a set for my birthday. After using it for a
few years, when we bought our current boat, it was one of the very first
additions we did. I now think of it as almost a must have for the kind
sailing that we do. (I'm still hoping for the wind indicator for my
birthday some day)

Hope this helps - Dan

--
Dan Best - (707) 431-1662, Healdsburg, CA 95448
B-2/75 1977-1979
Tayana 37 #192, "Tricia Jean" http://rangerbest.home.comcast.net/TriciaJean.JPG

"Daniel E. Best" wrote in message
news:2xwEb.600052$Fm2.547268@attbi_s04...
On a swing out arm in the companion way.

That's what I'd like to do too. Did you make yours yourself or are ready
made items available? If so, could you point me to the site?

"Daniel E. Best" wrote in message
news:2xwEb.600052$Fm2.547268@attbi_s04...
On a swing out arm in the companion way.

That's what I'd like to do too. Did you make yours yourself or are ready
made items available? If so, could you point me to the site?

On Thu, 18 Dec 2003 17:40:10 -0800, "Lloyd Sumpter"
wrote:

Hi,

Considering buying a radar, so I have a few questions:

1. On a sailboat, where do you put the display? I rarely steer from behind the
wheel, mainly by sitting on one of the gunwales beside the wheel, or sometimes
by Otto while hiding from the rain under the dodger (hence the name... ).

You need it where you can see it when you will actually be using it. I
have it mounted over the wheel. If you expect to use it while steering
from the side, you might consider making it turnable.

2. Realistically, how far do you set the max range? I'm seeing that unless I
mount the antenna up the mast, I'm not gonna get more than maybe 10 miles range
no matter what unit I buy. Then again, if I see a freighter steaming at 30
knots, 10 miles away, I still have 20 minutes to do something. Is a 20-mile
range worth getting?

I usually switch between 3 and 6 miles. I occasionally go to 12 or 24
momentarily to see land or large ships.

The default settings of my radar make it show rain on 6 mi and filter
it out on 3, a handy combination.

3. Do you trust yours enough to use it instead of a "watch" (ie watch the radar
screen instead of where you're going)? Trying to decide if getting a radar will
increase my cruising time significantly (ie more confidence in running at night)

I use it when I can't see anything in dense fog. At night, I can see
the radar and look ahead as well, although the radar impairs night
vision. My biggest beef with my Raytheon SR72 is the coarse steps in
the illumination. The dimmest setting that lights at all is far too
bright for dark nights.


6. Is it worth while to mount the antenna up the mast, or should I use a
"dedicated" mast at the transom?

I put it on a stern mast, because it added less to the pitching moment
and I could mount it lower than I could on the mast without
interfering with spinnaker gear. I didn't want it higher because it
was more vulnerable to sea clutter.

The sea clutter consideration applied to my original radar, a Furuno
1720. It may be that the Raytheon has good enough filtering so this
wouldn't be as big a problem, but I still have it on a mast. I don't
want the genoas hitting it during tacks anyway.



Rodney Myrvaagnes J36 Gjo/a


"In this house we _obey_ the laws of thermodynamics." --Homer Simpson