wrote in message
...
On Thu, 16 Aug 2007 09:24:14 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

Yes, cruising catamarans have something extra. As a simple Google and
YouTube search using capsize and catamaran will reveal, the something
extra is the remarkable ease with which catamarans turn turtle.

With this in mind, any potential catamaran buyer must ask himself if
the
paltry advantages of a catamaran - things such as small heel angles,
slightly faster speeds downwind, more elbow room below (but not load
carrying capacity), shallow draft and largish cockpit - outweigh the
fact that sooner or later the whole shebang is going to end up
upside-down and swamped. Don't even think about what happens if you
get
trapped under the thing and drown. Just think about upside-down. In
other words, everything is ruined.

Why put up with a boat that has a designed-in flaw of being more
stable
upside-down than rightside-up? Is the trade-off between a platform
that
doesn't heel quite as much and an upside-down platform worth it? Only
you can answer that question. It depends upon how much you love your
life and the lives of your loved ones.

I wonder when the Coast Guard is going to get some balls and declare
any
and all cruising catamaran ocean voyages "manifestly unsafe voyages"
and put a stop to them?

Wilbur Hubbard

Hey Willy,

You know, every high speed ferry sailing out of Singapore is a cat. If
the catamaran hull form is so unstable how come all the classification
societies will classify them as passenger carriers?


I'm talking sailing cats. Not motor cats. Motor cats are heavy, heavy
and heavy. And they don't have the leverage effect of spars and sails to
turn them over.

Wilbur Hubbard

On Thu, 16 Aug 2007 10:15:32 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:


wrote in message
.. .
On Thu, 16 Aug 2007 09:24:14 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

Yes, cruising catamarans have something extra. As a simple Google and
YouTube search using capsize and catamaran will reveal, the something
extra is the remarkable ease with which catamarans turn turtle.

With this in mind, any potential catamaran buyer must ask himself if
the
paltry advantages of a catamaran - things such as small heel angles,
slightly faster speeds downwind, more elbow room below (but not load
carrying capacity), shallow draft and largish cockpit - outweigh the
fact that sooner or later the whole shebang is going to end up
upside-down and swamped. Don't even think about what happens if you
get
trapped under the thing and drown. Just think about upside-down. In
other words, everything is ruined.

Why put up with a boat that has a designed-in flaw of being more
stable
upside-down than rightside-up? Is the trade-off between a platform
that
doesn't heel quite as much and an upside-down platform worth it? Only
you can answer that question. It depends upon how much you love your
life and the lives of your loved ones.

I wonder when the Coast Guard is going to get some balls and declare
any
and all cruising catamaran ocean voyages "manifestly unsafe voyages"
and put a stop to them?

Wilbur Hubbard

Hey Willy,

You know, every high speed ferry sailing out of Singapore is a cat. If
the catamaran hull form is so unstable how come all the classification
societies will classify them as passenger carriers?


I'm talking sailing cats. Not motor cats. Motor cats are heavy, heavy
and heavy. And they don't have the leverage effect of spars and sails to
turn them over.

Wilbur Hubbard

Well, given that nearly all, if not all, l of the high speed catamaran
ferries I've been on are aluminum I'd have to say that displacement
must play some part of their planing, probably to get them as light as
possible.

The other point that you seem to disregard was that the cat mentioned
in the original post was anchored in a 170 MPH wind. And it flipped
over. During the same hurricane a large number of mono hulls were
sunk. Kinda sounds as though maybe the cat is the better solution when
we view the difference between a bottom side up catamaran and a sunken
mono hull.

By the way Willie, have you ever been out in 170 MPH winds? Do you
think your house trailer will survive 170 MPH winds? Or even a house,
if you owned one? Or perhaps you have traveled through the cyclone
belt and wondered why all those stupid people have cyclone cellars.




Bruce in Bangkok
(brucepaigeATgmailDOTcom)

wrote in message
...
On Thu, 16 Aug 2007 10:15:32 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:


wrote in message
. ..
On Thu, 16 Aug 2007 09:24:14 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

Yes, cruising catamarans have something extra. As a simple Google
and
YouTube search using capsize and catamaran will reveal, the
something
extra is the remarkable ease with which catamarans turn turtle.

With this in mind, any potential catamaran buyer must ask himself if
the
paltry advantages of a catamaran - things such as small heel angles,
slightly faster speeds downwind, more elbow room below (but not load
carrying capacity), shallow draft and largish cockpit - outweigh the
fact that sooner or later the whole shebang is going to end up
upside-down and swamped. Don't even think about what happens if you
get
trapped under the thing and drown. Just think about upside-down. In
other words, everything is ruined.

Why put up with a boat that has a designed-in flaw of being more
stable
upside-down than rightside-up? Is the trade-off between a platform
that
doesn't heel quite as much and an upside-down platform worth it?
Only
you can answer that question. It depends upon how much you love your
life and the lives of your loved ones.

I wonder when the Coast Guard is going to get some balls and declare
any
and all cruising catamaran ocean voyages "manifestly unsafe
voyages"
and put a stop to them?

Wilbur Hubbard

Hey Willy,

You know, every high speed ferry sailing out of Singapore is a cat.
If
the catamaran hull form is so unstable how come all the
classification
societies will classify them as passenger carriers?


I'm talking sailing cats. Not motor cats. Motor cats are heavy, heavy
and heavy. And they don't have the leverage effect of spars and sails
to
turn them over.

Wilbur Hubbard

Well, given that nearly all, if not all, l of the high speed catamaran
ferries I've been on are aluminum I'd have to say that displacement
must play some part of their planing, probably to get them as light as
possible.

The other point that you seem to disregard was that the cat mentioned
in the original post was anchored in a 170 MPH wind. And it flipped
over. During the same hurricane a large number of mono hulls were
sunk. Kinda sounds as though maybe the cat is the better solution when
we view the difference between a bottom side up catamaran and a sunken
mono hull.

By the way Willie, have you ever been out in 170 MPH winds? Do you
think your house trailer will survive 170 MPH winds? Or even a house,
if you owned one? Or perhaps you have traveled through the cyclone
belt and wondered why all those stupid people have cyclone cellars.

If you only knew . . . When it comes to tropical cyclones you can't
even come close to my intimacy with them.

My fine blue water yacht and I have been through 4 tropical storms and
12 hurricanes to date. Been aboard each and every time. The worst winds
were in Andrew and Wilma. Wilma's were stronger because I was in the
core up the Little Shark river in the Everglades. Sustained winds of
over 100 knots. Gusts to 120knots. Ten foot storm surge that had the
river running backwards and sideways over the banks with approximately a
5 knot current. Trees were snapping off like toothpicks and there's some
of the largest mangroves in the world up there. 80 feet tall in some
places. My fine yacht survived without a scratch. The worst thing she
suffered was some temporary staining from the tannic acid in the leaves
and small branches that were turned to mulch and deposited all over the
deck.

My yacht didn't turn upside down nor did she get sunk. She rode every
storm out and took them in stride. The worst any storm ever did was a
lightning strike which would have burned her to the waterline had I not
been aboard at the time to put out the fire that started in the bilge
from burning wiring and an exploded bottle of rum that fed the fire.

Real sailboats don't 'flip over' in high winds. No anchored monohull
worth a darn is going to be sunk unless it's neglected or abandoned.
It's only if the anchors drag or the mooring carries away and the boat
gets washed up on the rocks or laid on its beam ends along the shore
line when the storm surge comes in. You're attempting to fault monohulls
for the faults of their inept crew. When I see a monohull spinning like
a top in the air at the end of her anchor line then and only then will I
say the darned thing's not seaworthy. I've even been hit by a couple of
water spouts that had the spreaders in the water and she bobbed right
back up. No problem. That's the way a sailboat is supposed to react to
winds.

Catamarans are a joke!

Wilbur Hubbard

Wilbur Hubbard wrote:


My fine blue water yacht and I have been through 4 tropical storms and
12 hurricanes to date.

What kind of boat do you have?

"Paul Cassel" wrote in message
. ..
Wilbur Hubbard wrote:


My fine blue water yacht and I have been through 4 tropical storms and 12
hurricanes to date.

What kind of boat do you have?

Either a Swan or a Coronado.

Paul Cassel wrote in
:

Wilbur Hubbard wrote:


My fine blue water yacht and I have been through 4 tropical storms
and 12 hurricanes to date.

What kind of boat do you have?


Oops, I should have written my blue water yacht(s) because . . .

I've got three boats now. My Swan 68, Chippewa, my Allied Seawind 32,
Sea Isle and I recently purchased the world famous Coronado 27, Cut the
Mustard, from the estate of Capt. Neal. Got it at a bargain price and
figure I could sell it and turn a tidy profit seeing how famous the boat
has become. The trouble is I've been sailing it quite a bit and I'm
starting to realize it's just about perfect in every way. It's got about
as much room inside and the layout is better than the Allied and it's
faster, I swear. Cut the Mustard's been through many a hurricane with
the Good Captain aboard but I wasn't referring to that in the above.
It's Sea Isle and the Swan. Mostly Sea Isle, my main squeeze.

--
Wilbur Hubbard

Considering the easy availability of weather forcast, especially
nowadays, I'd suggest you may want to take a course in weather and storm
avoidance







Wilbur Hubbard wrote in news:46c7355d$0
:

Paul Cassel wrote in
:

Wilbur Hubbard wrote:


My fine blue water yacht and I have been through 4 tropical storms
and 12 hurricanes to date.

What kind of boat do you have?


Oops, I should have written my blue water yacht(s) because . . .

I've got three boats now. My Swan 68, Chippewa, my Allied Seawind 32,
Sea Isle and I recently purchased the world famous Coronado 27, Cut the
Mustard, from the estate of Capt. Neal. Got it at a bargain price and
figure I could sell it and turn a tidy profit seeing how famous the
boat
has become. The trouble is I've been sailing it quite a bit and I'm
starting to realize it's just about perfect in every way. It's got
about
as much room inside and the layout is better than the Allied and it's
faster, I swear. Cut the Mustard's been through many a hurricane with
the Good Captain aboard but I wasn't referring to that in the above.
It's Sea Isle and the Swan. Mostly Sea Isle, my main squeeze.

"otnmbrd" wrote in message
.70...

Considering the easy availability of weather forcast, especially
nowadays, I'd suggest you may want to take a course in weather and
storm
avoidance

Actually, I'm doing just the opposite. I'm currently having a yacht
built that is stout enough to survive the worst hurricane ever imagined
and the worst seas it can produce. It consists of a 90 foot steel hull
on the outside, then comes three feet of floatation foam, then comes an
inside steel hull. Between the two steel hulls are ribs welded to each
hull. Inside the inside hull there's a gimbaled and padded accommodation
that sleeps six. It has four, watertight, transverse steel bulkheads and
it's heavily ballasted with moderately deep fin/bulb keel. There's
three, free-standing masts that telescope so in the retracted position
they only protrude 20 feet above the deck. The hatches are all like
submarine hatches, sealed and able to hold pressure. It has air tanks so
it can be sealed up for up to 12 hours. It has an apparatus that can
draw in outside air when it's sealed up. Of course it is self-righting
to the max.

The plan is for the ultimate survival sailing adventure. Purposely sail
out and put the vessel in the path of a hurricane and then ride it out
in safety. Clients would have bragging rights. "I sailed Hurricane
Dennis when it was Cat 5."

What do you think?

Wilbur Hubbard

"Wilbur Hubbard" wrote in message
anews.com...
Paul Cassel wrote in
:

Wilbur Hubbard wrote:


My fine blue water yacht and I have been through 4 tropical storms
and 12 hurricanes to date.

What kind of boat do you have?


Oops, I should have written my blue water yacht(s) because . . .

I've got three boats now. My Swan 68, Chippewa, my Allied Seawind 32,
Sea Isle and I recently purchased the world famous Coronado 27, Cut the
Mustard, from the estate of Capt. Neal. Got it at a bargain price and
figure I could sell it and turn a tidy profit seeing how famous the boat
has become. The trouble is I've been sailing it quite a bit and I'm
starting to realize it's just about perfect in every way. It's got about
as much room inside and the layout is better than the Allied and it's
faster, I swear. Cut the Mustard's been through many a hurricane with
the Good Captain aboard but I wasn't referring to that in the above.
It's Sea Isle and the Swan. Mostly Sea Isle, my main squeeze.

--
Wilbur Hubbard

Can it be? Craptain Kneel is deceased? Nah, can't be. Just reincarnated. Ad
nauseam.

"KLC Lewis" wrote in message
et...

"Wilbur Hubbard" wrote in message
anews.com...
Paul Cassel wrote in
:

Wilbur Hubbard wrote:


My fine blue water yacht and I have been through 4 tropical storms
and 12 hurricanes to date.

What kind of boat do you have?


Oops, I should have written my blue water yacht(s) because . . .

LOL.....fergot who you were for a moment?


I've got three boats now. My Swan 68, Chippewa, my Allied Seawind 32,
Sea Isle and I recently purchased the world famous Coronado 27, Cut the
Mustard, from the estate of Capt. Neal. Got it at a bargain price and
figure I could sell it and turn a tidy profit seeing how famous the boat
has become. The trouble is I've been sailing it quite a bit and I'm
starting to realize it's just about perfect in every way. It's got about
as much room inside and the layout is better than the Allied and it's
faster, I swear. Cut the Mustard's been through many a hurricane with
the Good Captain aboard but I wasn't referring to that in the above.
It's Sea Isle and the Swan. Mostly Sea Isle, my main squeeze.

--
Wilbur Hubbard

Can it be? Craptain Kneel is deceased? Nah, can't be. Just reincarnated.
Ad nauseam.

Well, he can now post about his favorite boat. Wonder if he got the log
(and cedar bucket) with the purchase?