August 3 - Sailing in Steerage
 

On 2007-08-05 14:38:13 -0400, Geoff Schultz said:

Aren't you the guy who took me to task for not going up the river from
Charleston???

L8R

Skip :{))

I believe that I suggested heading up the ICW to make miles when the
weather outside didn't cooperate. I don't think that I ever suggested
seeing it on the wrong end of a tow line! :-)

That's something I can agree with. When we went the other way, our pace
was such that we could have made Beaufort, NC to Daytona in 8 travel
days, though we budget a lay day per week or portion, 10 days in that
case. The ICW is a slog, slow and often boring, but it can be traversed
when it's sloppy outside.

--
Jere Lull
Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD
Xan's new pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/
Our BVI pages: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/

August 3 - Sailing in Steerage
 

Vic Smith wrote:

I've read that older boats have flaky electrical systems and it's
often best to rewire them to modern standards right off the bat.

It isn't that obvious, nor is it that easy to do. The wiring worked
perfectly OK until we got a radio that required more power.

Thanks for writing some of your experiences. I notice that most
of them are wiring and installation issues, and that's good to know.
I suspect Skip is having some of the same issues.

Not knowing anything about marine engine installations, it's still
surprising to me that an alternator bracket should break, and
I'll be looking for that kind of weakness if it applies to my boat.
Was the bracket corroded?

I don't know whether the bracket was corroded or not - I don't go into
the engine room. He also was down in the engine room one spring and
put his hand on the exhaust elbow and found it had a big hole in it.
So he replaced it of course, and a friend suggested that he go to a
plumbing supply house and get a stainless elbow and just have the
nipples and or connections put in at the right places. Cheaper than
from a marine supply house. So he did that and has it as a spare.

Was the throttle cable binding before it broke? I've seen automotive
e-brake and clutch cables break with no warning, so maybe fatigue
does them in and they should be changed out on some sort of schedule.

We didn't see that it was binding. It broke near to the binnacle end.
It was VERY tough material, and took him several hours to get a loop
into the end so that he could reattach it and get to a marina where he
could order a new one. The new one (which is now about 6 years old)
is still so slippery that sometimes it won't hold a setting - the
engine keeps going slower and slower unless we catch it and push the
throttle forward again.

Every year he services the through hulls and he also does the winches
on a regular basis - also the windlass. He keeps an eye on the engine
- temperature and oil usage, transmission fluid, and cooling system.
We've also replaced life lines that appear corroded. He repairs the
sails and bimini curtains when they need it. We do know where the
emergency steering is, and he checks the rudder when the boat is out
of the water. But we are too cheap to replace stuff that is working
OK.

Our boat (built in 1979) was a pretty plain vanilla boat when we got
it - it had the original engine (still does), a VHF radio, a corroded
and un useable electric windlass, depth sounder and wind instruments,
a couple of lightweight anchors (no chain rode to speak of), and
that's about it.

We added a newer radio, a SSB, autopilot, radar, and additional
battery bank (and replaced the old batteries when they started not
holding a charge), dinghy davits, radar arch, solar panels, a
windmill, a roller furling staysail, light activated anchor lights, a
manual windlass, a good heavy anchor and 300 feet of chain, and a
spinnaker pole (which Bob made). He's talking about getting a
spinnaker.

August 3 - Sailing in Steerage
 

On Sun, 5 Aug 2007 20:01:47 -0500, "KLC Lewis"
wrote:

Is harbor hopping down the coast possible, avoiding the
ICW? Weather and GS position permitting, of course.

Absolutely possible but the downside is lost time and distance going
in and out. There are also some long stretches on the Florida coast
with no inlets. We usually run these overnight and put in the next
day. Avoiding the Gulf Stream is relatively easy in most places by
staying closer to shore.

August 3 - Sailing in Steerage
 

On Sat, 04 Aug 2007 23:03:32 -0000, Skip Gundlach
wrote:


So, we held on by our fingernails and made it outside the jetties.
Meanwhile, we had a container ship bearing down on us. They'd seen
our
erratic behavior and wanted to make sure we saw them. We advised them
that
we'd had a bit of a steering issue but would be sure to be out of
their way.

After a failed attempt to go upwind, we managed to get out of the
channel to
the downwind side and advised the container ship that we were no
longer a
threat. Using the throttle and the locked-to-starboard rudder to
keep us
pointed relatively into the wind and waves, we called TowBoatUS, where
I
have an unlimited towing policy.

They showed up in due course, and, the various excitements of being
under
tow in a shipping lane,

in a situation like this, do not hesitate to call the USCG. they will
respond immediately...being in a shipping lane, or in danger of going
aground with a steering casualty is a distress situation. just
practice good risk assessment and call for help when you need it.

August 3 - Sailing in Steerage
 

in a situation like this, do not hesitate to call the USCG. they will
respond immediately...being in a shipping lane, or in danger of going
aground with a steering casualty is a distress situation. just
practice good risk assessment and call for help when you need it.- Hide quoted text -


Good idea, but then Skip, Lydia, et al. would no doubt be subject to
boarding and inspection.................. I wonder how that would end?

Been Boarded Bob

August 3 - Sailing in Steerage
 

* Rosalie B. wrote, On 8/6/2007 9:12 AM:
... in
2000 when we made our first trip down the ICW (and the only time that
we had anything to do with Beaufort by boat because I think the
marinas are too expensive - we anchored )
http://p.vtourist.com/953637-Beaufor...e-Beaufort.jpg


Its funny how impressions can be different. We were there at the same
time (we met in the Dismal Swamp) and remember Beaufort, NC as one of
the highlites of our trip. A nice museum, a good bookstore, several
good shops, good restaurants, entertainment, all across the street.
An island with wild horses is a short dinghy ride away. The marina
had a courtesy car for going to the market. I was starting to check
out local real estate! Of course we may have been biased because our
then 5 year old met up with some of her friends from Elizabeth City.
And, our previous stop was Belhaven, were the marina seemed like
something out of the Addams Family.

August 3 - Sailing in Steerage
 

Jeff wrote:

* Rosalie B. wrote, On 8/6/2007 9:12 AM:
... in
2000 when we made our first trip down the ICW (and the only time that
we had anything to do with Beaufort by boat because I think the
marinas are too expensive - we anchored )
http://p.vtourist.com/953637-Beaufor...e-Beaufort.jpg


Its funny how impressions can be different. We were there at the same
time (we met in the Dismal Swamp) and remember Beaufort, NC as one of

Yes I remember you - I have a pictures of you and your boat.
http://p.vtourist.com/807785-Bob_tal...State_Park.jpg

At that time we were still trying to anchor out much of the time. But
after that trip we mostly gave up anchoring and went into marinas
because we could eat dinner out. Exceptions being GA and the river
around Melbourne. My information at the time was that the marinas in
Morehead City were cheaper. Also Bob was not at all interested (i.e.
he absolutely refused to do it) in anchoring with two anchors which
was the information I had about anchoring there because of the
current. We anchored in Town Creek instead

the highlites of our trip. A nice museum, a good bookstore, several
good shops, good restaurants, entertainment, all across the street.

A lot of people really love Beaufort. So we did Beaufort later by car
when we were staying in a condo on Atlantic Beach. We drove out to
the NPS Cape Lookout lighthouse site (it was too rough and cold to do
the boat trip at that time (March) although the wind surfers were
having a good time.
http://p.vtourist.com/2002275-Kite_b...ntic_Beach.jpg
The museum was nice.

We tried to do the historic houses tour but the flyer provided was far
inferior to the one given out by the other Beaufort (SC) and the
people in the visitor's center/historical society were less friendly.
http://members.virtualtourist.com/m/4a9c6/c92c3/8/ I just wasn't all
that thrilled with Beaufort.

An island with wild horses is a short dinghy ride away. The marina
had a courtesy car for going to the market. I was starting to check
out local real estate! Of course we may have been biased because our
then 5 year old met up with some of her friends from Elizabeth City.
And, our previous stop was Belhaven, were the marina seemed like
something out of the Addams Family.

..Which marina was that? We went to Robb's (which has gone out of
business) because it was cheap and available. We've also been to
Dowry Creek - never been to River Forest except to eat dinner once
when it was my birthday and no other restaurants were open.

We almost always go to Oriental between Belhaven and the next place

August 3 - Sailing in Steerage
 

* Rosalie B. wrote, On 8/8/2007 10:13 AM:
Its funny how impressions can be different. We were there at the same
time (we met in the Dismal Swamp) and remember Beaufort, NC as one of

Yes I remember you - I have a pictures of you and your boat.
http://p.vtourist.com/807785-Bob_tal...State_Park.jpg

My wife claims I normally look better than that picture!


At that time we were still trying to anchor out much of the time. But
after that trip we mostly gave up anchoring and went into marinas
because we could eat dinner out.

Before this trip we always anchored out. However, a major reason for
the trip was to see all the small towns that I had sailed or driven by
in the past. Now, we look for moorings so we can be close in without
the heat and noise of the docks. Launch service is nice, but rowing
is my primary exercise!

Exceptions being GA and the river
around Melbourne. My information at the time was that the marinas in
Morehead City were cheaper. Also Bob was not at all interested (i.e.
he absolutely refused to do it) in anchoring with two anchors which
was the information I had about anchoring there because of the
current. We anchored in Town Creek instead

Double anchoring (two off the bow) is so easy once you get used to it
- just set one, then drive over to the side and let out a Fortress.
Even an oversized one is light, and contrary to myth, they only need a
small amount of chain. A Delta (or other plow style) with chain plus
a large Fortress is going to let you get a good night's sleep in
almost any normal situation.

....
An island with wild horses is a short dinghy ride away. The marina
had a courtesy car for going to the market. I was starting to check
out local real estate! Of course we may have been biased because our
then 5 year old met up with some of her friends from Elizabeth City.
And, our previous stop was Belhaven, were the marina seemed like
something out of the Addams Family.

.Which marina was that? We went to Robb's (which has gone out of
business) because it was cheap and available. We've also been to
Dowry Creek - never been to River Forest except to eat dinner once
when it was my birthday and no other restaurants were open.

River Forest, I think. It had the feel of the opening scenes of a
horror movie. Dowry Creek, a few miles away, is a delightful stop.

We almost always go to Oriental between Belhaven and the next place

Yes, I forgot, we stayed in Oriental with friends we fortuitously met
at the marina.

Things that go wrong - First 21 Days on the ICW
 

After Jeff's mention that he saw us in the Dismal Swamp canal on our
first trip down there, I have been re-reading some of the logs I wrote
on that first trip.

Oct 31, 2000 -We started out on the trip with the refrigeration not
working - using bags of ice. The SSB also didn't work and the new VHF
won't even transmit as far as the marina office.

Nov 2 When we went in to Fishing Bay (south of Deltaville), we could
not find a number of the marks but we had the electronic charts to go
by so it was not a problem for us. When we left the next morning the
CG boat was replacing some of them

Nov 3 - As we anchored a work boat putting out crab pots came up
behind us and circled the boat, putting one pot directly in front and
one directly behind the boat. Although the crab pot boat is almost
within arms reach of us, no eye contact was made.

Nov 4 - Bob did figure out how to get out without running into the
crab pots. I was re-figuring the route on the computer on the fly,
but the connection on the trackball was too long to fit into the
computer box, which made it difficult

We came into Point Comfort Marina

The fuel dock is on our starboard as we enter, and we want to tie up port side to the dock. However, due to the wind, the boat is only backing to starboard instead of to port as it usually does, and we end up coming in on the starboard side. We use their lines, since all ours are rigged on the other side.

We get 15 gallons, and Bob goes up to pay. We tell them we are supposed to go into slip B33. They say there is no way we will fit in a slip on B dock (which is mostly small power boats). The guy who seems to be in charge runs up to the office and says it was supposed to be E 33, but he is going to put us into E38 instead. That's really better as that way we don't have to go around between the docks to the other side but just go in as we come around the protective wall. I think he decides this based on how incompetitant we were at getting in to the fuel dock but whatever the reason, it's better for us.

We miss lunch because it is too late for lunch.

Nov 5 - bad weather so we stay at the marina

Nov 6 - still bad weather. Bob got out his tools and started
modifying the cockpit locker that contains the pass-through into the
kitchen so that it has a tray in the top to store things like winch
handles. He also (grumbling) switched the antennas on the radios so
that the one that will send is on the tall antenna.

The people in the marina are afraid that letting me attach the
computer to their phone system will mess it up. When we tried to hook
up the computer to the internet at the hotel (to get email) it took a
long time and a lot of futzing around and I had to use an #800 number
because the phones in the hotel wouldn't accept a local number with an
area code as being local.

Going through Norfolk -the Elizabeth River ferry paddle wheel came out
from his dock and turned down the river along our port side. He
started to pass us and got almost all the way past, and then decided
to come over to the other side of the river, and turned almost right
into us. We speeded up so he went behind us. The ferry is not on the
charts.

Nov 8- 9 - Elizabeth City - We got a sewing needle in the Singer store
next door to Stocks, and I got a new trackball in a computer store. I
call Radio Shack and they've got my spare computer back but lost my
address to send it to me. One boat is out of water, and Bob lends
them his hose because theirs won't reach.

I almost fall in getting back on the boat (there is a very short finger pier and we have to climb off the bow - there is a plastic milk crate to step up on, but it is still a good big step, and this time I knock the crate into the water), and Bob says I won't be allowed off the boat again. He's only half joking.

Nov 10 - Bob has to free up the speed log

When we anchored, Bob was letting out the chain, and I was reversing. He had trouble getting it to stop, so he stomped on it, and I decided I'd gone backwards enough, so put the engine into neutral. As Bob was contemplating the amount of chain that was out, the boat hit the end, and the anchor set and stopped the boat with a jerk.

The moon shown through the dodger and down the companionway hatch very
brightly and waked me up.

Nov 11 - Bob took over the helm as we approached the bridge at about
9:20 and was idling around in the canal and ran aground. He got off
and was blown back on, and then got off again.

We came out of the canal into the Pungo River (at 11:30), and Bob immediately ran aground. He claimed it was because I didn't have enough magnification of the charts. I generally like to have a scale that allows me to see various land features so I can place where I am, and in the canal it doesn't matter. You have to stay in the canal anyway.

We stopped in the True Value/Radio Shack as they were closing, and
bought a cable TV cable. Bob went up to use the bathroom and thought
it was locked but actually both of us forgot the correct combination.

Nov 12 - Bob spends his time polishing the stainless. He says that at
least he didn't try to polish the anchor :-) He opens the engine hatch
in the cockpit floor to check to see if the engine temp on the gauge
is really 170 like it says, instead of 180 like it should be.

Nov 13 - Initially too foggy to see the daymarks 100 feet away. .

The engine hour meter stopped working yesterday and isn't working today either. Also the oil pressure and temperature are not right. Bob starts taking things apart and gets down in the engine compartment twice. Eventually he finds the loose or broken wire that isn't making a good connection and everything is fixed. Later, we heard a really big racket - a throbbing noise. Bob has been into the engine room and thought he fixed the engine electrical stuff which runs the gauges -- what is this racket?? Is the engine coming apart?
We look around and it is a BIG amphibious vehicle with big spinning tires that is making the noise - it passes going north.

As we are going down towards Beaufort, I suddenly look up and find
that Bob is going to go the wrong way - I correct him.

Nov 14 - Bob had some trouble with the wash down pump (which is a
cheap Ruhl bilge pump that he plugs into a 12V plug in the Vberth and
puts over the side into the water and pumps water up out of the creek
or whatever body of water we are anchored in to wash off the anchor
chain and anchor), so he didn't get the anchor actually washed off.
Later, he finds that the plug had a short which caused it to blow a
fuse.

It rains and is hard to see. One burgee has the top snap broken, so I
go out and take both burgees on that side down until Bob can replace
the snap.

When we go to anchor at Mile Hammock Bay we have considerable
difficulty because we start out in 10 feet of water and as he lets out
the anchor chain, we are blown out onto the shallow part and end up in
5 feet of water. Bob resets the anchor once, and then just decides to
put out less scope. A trawler named THE TRAVELER came in late and
anchored so that he was on top of our anchor. The battery operated
light we have has gotten too dim for me to read my notes after
sundown. My computer screen is brighter but hard to read by.

Nov 15 As we went through the Wrightsville Beach bridge, I was telling
Bob to look for a marker to go into Wrightsville Beach to anchor. He
was looking on the wrong side of the channel, plus that was the marker
that DENALI ROSE had reported was gone. So we missed the turnoff,
which is almost as bad as missing the turnoff on the freeway. However,
I knew there was another way to get there and we didn't have to turn
around. We came in Shim's Creek instead of going in the Mott Channel
to the Banks Channel

Nov 16 - None of the charts (only the AAA map) mentions that there is
a ferry across the Cape Fear river. It goes from south of Sunny Point
to the Fort Fisher Historic Site across the river (a car ferry).
Unfortunately, since it isn't marked on the charts it is hard to tell
where to go to get out of the way of the ferry, and for a little
while, the ferry appears to be pursuing us to run us down.

We turn in toward the entrance channel of Bald Head and Bob has the wheel hard over to counter the current. Suddenly he throttles back and spins the wheel. In the entrance channel there is no current.

Nov 17 - wind up to 25 knots in the marina. We decide to stay another
way. Bob starts working on the SSB and gets it to work (I have said
I won't go offshore without it) and we listen to Herb's Southbound II

Nov 18 - We back out over the lump in the marina that is right behind
us - the depth alarm goes off, but we knew the lump was there because
another cruiser told me about it Wind on the nose at 20 knots, but
the waves aren't too bad. Bob saw the markers for Oak Island, and I
nearly directed him in there instead of to Southport. He complained
that the route that I had laid out on the computer didn't go that way
just in time to go the correct direction.

When we get to the Myrtle Beach area (the Rockpile) the marina tells
us that the ICW is closed south of them due to high steel work on a
new bridge. They say that the waterway won't be closed in the rain,
and it is 100% predicted rain for tomorrow. I call the construction
site on the cell phone, and they say they will not close the ICW
tomorrow, but will close Monday. They ask me to announce that on the
VHF.

Our cable is too short to reach for the free cable TV. Bob then sets
out to walk to West Marine. He tried to buy a longer TV cable, but
they only have a 20 foot one and no connector. He did buy a little
hand pump - he had one in the tool box he left at home

Nov 19- It is cold and rainy. We have transited some of the Rock
Pile, and are coming up to Barefoot Landing when *surprise* - there is
a swing bridge here that isn't on the charts and isn't mentioned in
the ICW Guide. It opens on request. I also relay to the bridge tender
what the construction guy told me about the canal being open today and
closed tomorrow.

The SC bridges monitor channel 9 and not 13. People are having trouble
remembering that. The bridge list in the charts doesn't have it
correct either.

We have picked up a covey of boats behind us. We pass the bridge that
is being constructed. Farther down we see *another* construction
barge with a crane. It appears to be deserted.

Bob asks me if he should go to one side or between the barge and something that is being built in the middle of the canal. How should I know? There is only a sign that says "Slow - Construction Area - No Wake". As we passed, it appears that there was an unattended generator pumping out a caisson on the west side. (We did go between the barge and the other thing.) As soon as we went through, everyone behind us passed us. They just wanted to let us go first through the scary bit

We wanted to get to Georgetown tonight or at least down farther on the
Waccamaw River to Thoroughfare Creek to anchor. But we just can't get
that far. It is too much of a strain looking through the fogged up
dodger. And it is going to be cold, so we go into a marina.

Nov 20 - supposed to go down to 29 deg tonight, which means we have to
go to McClellanville because that's the only place that will allow us
to get to Charleston tomorrow that we can get electricity.to run the
heaters. We are going to be in Charleston for Thanksgiving with our
son's family.

We get to McClellenville just before 5 (sunset). Bob cuts into St.
Jerome Creek a little close to the side and the water gets a little
skinny. The entrance to the creek will be too shallow for us at low
tide.-there is a wreck on the chart right at the south side channel
entrance. The guides say (correctly) that there is a sandbar extending
out from the north bank into the channel across the entrance.

The guys on the dock tell us that the owner has gone into town, but
they help us tie up at what proves to be the fuel dock. The guy comes
back and we pay in cash, and hook up to the electric. Someone comes in
for fuel and afterwards there is a pervasive gas smell in the air,
which makes Bob wonder about cooking.

This is a fixed dock, and there is a 6 foot tide. Bob carefully adjusts the lines so that we won't get hung up. He gets up a couple of times to make sure that we are OK and at low tide the dock is over his head when he is standing on the deck. It might have been better for us to raft on another boat. The other boat would be floating too and it would be like being at a floating dock.

Nov 21

I am awakened by a tremendous BANG by my head at 5:40 am. The shrimp boat behind us has clipped us on the way out. Bob pulls on pants and a coat and comes back saying that the bow wave just pushed us into the pole. I don't think so. Later I go out on the stern and look where I think the shrimp boat hit us, and find a rough place. Bob thinks they just put some paint on us, but when I looked at it again later, and there's definitely a chafed place about 3 inches long on the corner. I didn't see how they could hit us there without hurting the dinghy, but Bob said their stern swung into us.

We hear about a sailboat aground up near Isle of Palms

Bob goes to the head, and a power boat passes us, and immediately the depth sounder goes crazy. It looks like we are running aground. One second it is 6.8, then 5 feet, then 4.5, then 6.0. With two examples of sailboats aground behind us, this isn't unlikely, but I can't find the deep channel.

Eventually Bob comes back and we figure that the power boat stirred up the mud and debris so that the depth sounder couldn't read the bottom correctly

I call the Ben Sawyer bridge. They say the bridge is not able to open, and they will let us know when it is fixed. So Bob slows down. Then they say come on down and it will open. So Bob speeds up. Then she says the guy hasn't come out from under the bridge yet (her own private troll?). So Bob doesn't know what to do. The wind is against us but the current is with us, and it is hard to control the boat even in a slack current with no wind. Eventually we got within about a half mile of the bridge and it started to open, so we put the pedal down. There were two boats waiting ahead of us, so we went through in a timely manner behind them at 12:18. She blew the closing horn as we were within the bridge.

When we get the marina, the harbormaster picked a slip that would be
the easiest for us to get into (considering the wind and current) Bob
starts to mend some of the bimini curtains where the thread has dry
rotted. There is only one sail shop in this area, and they can't
handle anything this week. He also tries to rent a car, but they are
all reserved

Note - of the things that we KNEW that didn't work at the beginning,
the only one that has been fixed to this point is the SSB.

August 3 - Sailing in Steerage
 

Jeff wrote:

* Rosalie B. wrote, On 8/8/2007 10:13 AM:
Its funny how impressions can be different. We were there at the same
time (we met in the Dismal Swamp) and remember Beaufort, NC as one of

Yes I remember you - I have a pictures of you and your boat.
http://p.vtourist.com/807785-Bob_tal...State_Park.jpg

My wife claims I normally look better than that picture!

Blame the photographerg

snip. Also Bob was not at all interested (i.e.
he absolutely refused to do it) in anchoring with two anchors which
was the information I had about anchoring there because of the
current. We anchored in Town Creek instead

Double anchoring (two off the bow) is so easy once you get used to it
- just set one, then drive over to the side and let out a Fortress.
Even an oversized one is light, and contrary to myth, they only need a
small amount of chain. A Delta (or other plow style) with chain plus
a large Fortress is going to let you get a good night's sleep in
almost any normal situation.

I do not know why Bob does not want to double anchor, but he doesn't,
and I haven't been interested enough to push him to the wall which
would be what would be necessary to find out WHY he doesn't want to.
It isn't one of the battles I want to fight.

We don't have a Fortress. We have only ever used one anchor and that
is the 55 lb SuperMax. We do have a Danforth on the stern, and a 45
lb CQR on the bow in addition to the SuperMax, but have never used
them. The only time that I can remember that we dragged with that
anchor was in Florida Bay where we anchored for lunch one time.

snip
And, our previous stop was Belhaven, were the marina seemed like
something out of the Addams Family.

.Which marina was that? We went to Robb's (which has gone out of
business) because it was cheap and available. We've also been to
Dowry Creek - never been to River Forest except to eat dinner once
when it was my birthday and no other restaurants were open.

River Forest, I think. It had the feel of the opening scenes of a
horror movie. Dowry Creek, a few miles away, is a delightful stop.

I have never been to River Forest which is too exposed to wind and
wakes IMHO. Some people think it is wonderful. Robbs got a lot of
bad press, but it is closed now and last time we were in Belhaven we
went to the Belhaven Waterway Marina which is new since 2000.

We almost always go to Oriental between Belhaven and the next place

Yes, I forgot, we stayed in Oriental with friends we fortuitously met
at the marina.

Things that go wrong - First 21 Days on the ICW
 

There was a time, a more wholesome time, when sailors didn't think it
was cool to tell the whole world about their inadequacies, their
mistakes and their lack of sailing skill. Those were much better days.

You and Bob should be ashamed of yourselves. You are almost as inept as
that boob on Flying Pig.

Wilbur Hubbard


"Rosalie B." wrote in message
...
After Jeff's mention that he saw us in the Dismal Swamp canal on our
first trip down there, I have been re-reading some of the logs I wrote
on that first trip.

Oct 31, 2000 -We started out on the trip with the refrigeration not
working - using bags of ice. The SSB also didn't work and the new VHF
won't even transmit as far as the marina office.

Nov 2 When we went in to Fishing Bay (south of Deltaville), we could
not find a number of the marks but we had the electronic charts to go
by so it was not a problem for us. When we left the next morning the
CG boat was replacing some of them

Nov 3 - As we anchored a work boat putting out crab pots came up
behind us and circled the boat, putting one pot directly in front and
one directly behind the boat. Although the crab pot boat is almost
within arms reach of us, no eye contact was made.

Nov 4 - Bob did figure out how to get out without running into the
crab pots. I was re-figuring the route on the computer on the fly,
but the connection on the trackball was too long to fit into the
computer box, which made it difficult

We came into Point Comfort Marina

The fuel dock is on our starboard as we enter, and we want to tie up
port side to the dock. However, due to the wind, the boat is only
backing to starboard instead of to port as it usually does, and we end
up coming in on the starboard side. We use their lines, since all ours
are rigged on the other side.

We get 15 gallons, and Bob goes up to pay. We tell them we are
supposed to go into slip B33. They say there is no way we will fit in
a slip on B dock (which is mostly small power boats). The guy who
seems to be in charge runs up to the office and says it was supposed
to be E 33, but he is going to put us into E38 instead. That's really
better as that way we don't have to go around between the docks to the
other side but just go in as we come around the protective wall. I
think he decides this based on how incompetitant we were at getting in
to the fuel dock but whatever the reason, it's better for us.

We miss lunch because it is too late for lunch.

Nov 5 - bad weather so we stay at the marina

Nov 6 - still bad weather. Bob got out his tools and started
modifying the cockpit locker that contains the pass-through into the
kitchen so that it has a tray in the top to store things like winch
handles. He also (grumbling) switched the antennas on the radios so
that the one that will send is on the tall antenna.

The people in the marina are afraid that letting me attach the
computer to their phone system will mess it up. When we tried to hook
up the computer to the internet at the hotel (to get email) it took a
long time and a lot of futzing around and I had to use an #800 number
because the phones in the hotel wouldn't accept a local number with an
area code as being local.

Going through Norfolk -the Elizabeth River ferry paddle wheel came out
from his dock and turned down the river along our port side. He
started to pass us and got almost all the way past, and then decided
to come over to the other side of the river, and turned almost right
into us. We speeded up so he went behind us. The ferry is not on the
charts.

Nov 8- 9 - Elizabeth City - We got a sewing needle in the Singer store
next door to Stocks, and I got a new trackball in a computer store. I
call Radio Shack and they've got my spare computer back but lost my
address to send it to me. One boat is out of water, and Bob lends
them his hose because theirs won't reach.

I almost fall in getting back on the boat (there is a very short
finger pier and we have to climb off the bow - there is a plastic milk
crate to step up on, but it is still a good big step, and this time I
knock the crate into the water), and Bob says I won't be allowed off
the boat again. He's only half joking.

Nov 10 - Bob has to free up the speed log

When we anchored, Bob was letting out the chain, and I was reversing.
He had trouble getting it to stop, so he stomped on it, and I decided
I'd gone backwards enough, so put the engine into neutral. As Bob was
contemplating the amount of chain that was out, the boat hit the end,
and the anchor set and stopped the boat with a jerk.

The moon shown through the dodger and down the companionway hatch very
brightly and waked me up.

Nov 11 - Bob took over the helm as we approached the bridge at about
9:20 and was idling around in the canal and ran aground. He got off
and was blown back on, and then got off again.

We came out of the canal into the Pungo River (at 11:30), and Bob
immediately ran aground. He claimed it was because I didn't have
enough magnification of the charts. I generally like to have a scale
that allows me to see various land features so I can place where I am,
and in the canal it doesn't matter. You have to stay in the canal
anyway.

We stopped in the True Value/Radio Shack as they were closing, and
bought a cable TV cable. Bob went up to use the bathroom and thought
it was locked but actually both of us forgot the correct combination.

Nov 12 - Bob spends his time polishing the stainless. He says that at
least he didn't try to polish the anchor :-) He opens the engine hatch
in the cockpit floor to check to see if the engine temp on the gauge
is really 170 like it says, instead of 180 like it should be.

Nov 13 - Initially too foggy to see the daymarks 100 feet away. .

The engine hour meter stopped working yesterday and isn't working
today either. Also the oil pressure and temperature are not right. Bob
starts taking things apart and gets down in the engine compartment
twice. Eventually he finds the loose or broken wire that isn't making
a good connection and everything is fixed. Later, we heard a really
big racket - a throbbing noise. Bob has been into the engine room and
thought he fixed the engine electrical stuff which runs the gauges --
what is this racket?? Is the engine coming apart?
We look around and it is a BIG amphibious vehicle with big spinning
tires that is making the noise - it passes going north.

As we are going down towards Beaufort, I suddenly look up and find
that Bob is going to go the wrong way - I correct him.

Nov 14 - Bob had some trouble with the wash down pump (which is a
cheap Ruhl bilge pump that he plugs into a 12V plug in the Vberth and
puts over the side into the water and pumps water up out of the creek
or whatever body of water we are anchored in to wash off the anchor
chain and anchor), so he didn't get the anchor actually washed off.
Later, he finds that the plug had a short which caused it to blow a
fuse.

It rains and is hard to see. One burgee has the top snap broken, so I
go out and take both burgees on that side down until Bob can replace
the snap.

When we go to anchor at Mile Hammock Bay we have considerable
difficulty because we start out in 10 feet of water and as he lets out
the anchor chain, we are blown out onto the shallow part and end up in
5 feet of water. Bob resets the anchor once, and then just decides to
put out less scope. A trawler named THE TRAVELER came in late and
anchored so that he was on top of our anchor. The battery operated
light we have has gotten too dim for me to read my notes after
sundown. My computer screen is brighter but hard to read by.

Nov 15 As we went through the Wrightsville Beach bridge, I was telling
Bob to look for a marker to go into Wrightsville Beach to anchor. He
was looking on the wrong side of the channel, plus that was the marker
that DENALI ROSE had reported was gone. So we missed the turnoff,
which is almost as bad as missing the turnoff on the freeway. However,
I knew there was another way to get there and we didn't have to turn
around. We came in Shim's Creek instead of going in the Mott Channel
to the Banks Channel

Nov 16 - None of the charts (only the AAA map) mentions that there is
a ferry across the Cape Fear river. It goes from south of Sunny Point
to the Fort Fisher Historic Site across the river (a car ferry).
Unfortunately, since it isn't marked on the charts it is hard to tell
where to go to get out of the way of the ferry, and for a little
while, the ferry appears to be pursuing us to run us down.

We turn in toward the entrance channel of Bald Head and Bob has the
wheel hard over to counter the current. Suddenly he throttles back and
spins the wheel. In the entrance channel there is no current.

Nov 17 - wind up to 25 knots in the marina. We decide to stay another
way. Bob starts working on the SSB and gets it to work (I have said
I won't go offshore without it) and we listen to Herb's Southbound II

Nov 18 - We back out over the lump in the marina that is right behind
us - the depth alarm goes off, but we knew the lump was there because
another cruiser told me about it Wind on the nose at 20 knots, but
the waves aren't too bad. Bob saw the markers for Oak Island, and I
nearly directed him in there instead of to Southport. He complained
that the route that I had laid out on the computer didn't go that way
just in time to go the correct direction.

When we get to the Myrtle Beach area (the Rockpile) the marina tells
us that the ICW is closed south of them due to high steel work on a
new bridge. They say that the waterway won't be closed in the rain,
and it is 100% predicted rain for tomorrow. I call the construction
site on the cell phone, and they say they will not close the ICW
tomorrow, but will close Monday. They ask me to announce that on the
VHF.

Our cable is too short to reach for the free cable TV. Bob then sets
out to walk to West Marine. He tried to buy a longer TV cable, but
they only have a 20 foot one and no connector. He did buy a little
hand pump - he had one in the tool box he left at home

Nov 19- It is cold and rainy. We have transited some of the Rock
Pile, and are coming up to Barefoot Landing when *surprise* - there is
a swing bridge here that isn't on the charts and isn't mentioned in
the ICW Guide. It opens on request. I also relay to the bridge tender
what the construction guy told me about the canal being open today and
closed tomorrow.

The SC bridges monitor channel 9 and not 13. People are having trouble
remembering that. The bridge list in the charts doesn't have it
correct either.

We have picked up a covey of boats behind us. We pass the bridge that
is being constructed. Farther down we see *another* construction
barge with a crane. It appears to be deserted.

Bob asks me if he should go to one side or between the barge and
something that is being built in the middle of the canal. How should I
know? There is only a sign that says "Slow - Construction Area - No
Wake". As we passed, it appears that there was an unattended generator
pumping out a caisson on the west side. (We did go between the barge
and the other thing.) As soon as we went through, everyone behind us
passed us. They just wanted to let us go first through the scary bit

We wanted to get to Georgetown tonight or at least down farther on the
Waccamaw River to Thoroughfare Creek to anchor. But we just can't get
that far. It is too much of a strain looking through the fogged up
dodger. And it is going to be cold, so we go into a marina.

Nov 20 - supposed to go down to 29 deg tonight, which means we have to
go to McClellanville because that's the only place that will allow us
to get to Charleston tomorrow that we can get electricity.to run the
heaters. We are going to be in Charleston for Thanksgiving with our
son's family.

We get to McClellenville just before 5 (sunset). Bob cuts into St.
Jerome Creek a little close to the side and the water gets a little
skinny. The entrance to the creek will be too shallow for us at low
tide.-there is a wreck on the chart right at the south side channel
entrance. The guides say (correctly) that there is a sandbar extending
out from the north bank into the channel across the entrance.

The guys on the dock tell us that the owner has gone into town, but
they help us tie up at what proves to be the fuel dock. The guy comes
back and we pay in cash, and hook up to the electric. Someone comes in
for fuel and afterwards there is a pervasive gas smell in the air,
which makes Bob wonder about cooking.

This is a fixed dock, and there is a 6 foot tide. Bob carefully
adjusts the lines so that we won't get hung up. He gets up a couple of
times to make sure that we are OK and at low tide the dock is over his
head when he is standing on the deck. It might have been better for us
to raft on another boat. The other boat would be floating too and it
would be like being at a floating dock.

Nov 21

I am awakened by a tremendous BANG by my head at 5:40 am. The shrimp
boat behind us has clipped us on the way out. Bob pulls on pants and a
coat and comes back saying that the bow wave just pushed us into the
pole. I don't think so. Later I go out on the stern and look where I
think the shrimp boat hit us, and find a rough place. Bob thinks they
just put some paint on us, but when I looked at it again later, and
there's definitely a chafed place about 3 inches long on the corner. I
didn't see how they could hit us there without hurting the dinghy, but
Bob said their stern swung into us.

We hear about a sailboat aground up near Isle of Palms

Bob goes to the head, and a power boat passes us, and immediately the
depth sounder goes crazy. It looks like we are running aground. One
second it is 6.8, then 5 feet, then 4.5, then 6.0. With two examples
of sailboats aground behind us, this isn't unlikely, but I can't find
the deep channel.

Eventually Bob comes back and we figure that the power boat stirred up
the mud and debris so that the depth sounder couldn't read the bottom
correctly

I call the Ben Sawyer bridge. They say the bridge is not able to open,
and they will let us know when it is fixed. So Bob slows down. Then
they say come on down and it will open. So Bob speeds up. Then she
says the guy hasn't come out from under the bridge yet (her own
private troll?). So Bob doesn't know what to do. The wind is against
us but the current is with us, and it is hard to control the boat even
in a slack current with no wind. Eventually we got within about a
half mile of the bridge and it started to open, so we put the pedal
down. There were two boats waiting ahead of us, so we went through in
a timely manner behind them at 12:18. She blew the closing horn as we
were within the bridge.

When we get the marina, the harbormaster picked a slip that would be
the easiest for us to get into (considering the wind and current) Bob
starts to mend some of the bimini curtains where the thread has dry
rotted. There is only one sail shop in this area, and they can't
handle anything this week. He also tries to rent a car, but they are
all reserved

Note - of the things that we KNEW that didn't work at the beginning,
the only one that has been fixed to this point is the SSB.

Things that go wrong - First 21 Days on the ICW
 

On Wed, 8 Aug 2007 12:23:36 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

There was a time, a more wholesome time, when sailors didn't think it
was cool to tell the whole world about their inadequacies, their
mistakes and their lack of sailing skill.

And you have never had any foul ups on your boat?

If not I'm pretty certain that the boat has never left the bath tub.

We learn from our own mistakes, and from others honest enough to admit
them. Since you've never reported any of your own, what can we
assume?

Things that go wrong - First 21 Days on the ICW
 

"Wayne.B" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 8 Aug 2007 12:23:36 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

There was a time, a more wholesome time, when sailors didn't think it
was cool to tell the whole world about their inadequacies, their
mistakes and their lack of sailing skill.

And you have never had any foul ups on your boat?

If not I'm pretty certain that the boat has never left the bath tub.

We learn from our own mistakes, and from others honest enough to admit
them. Since you've never reported any of your own, what can we
assume?


Assume whatever your little heart desires. It makes no difference to me.

I'll make a rare mistake from time to time but one mistake I NEVER make
is acting like mistakes are no big deal. And, I would rather stick a
fork in my eye than about them. I think it's an abomination when people
act like mistakes are par for the course and then write posts, letters
or magazine articles so they can have other people say to them, "Oh,
don't worry about it, that's what sailing's all about, isn't it? --
making mistakes."

Excuse me! That's definitely NOT what sailing is all about unless you're
a liberal boob or a clownish wannabe. But, then again, I'm a man. One of
the few left sailing, it seems.

Wilbur Hubbard

Things that go wrong - First 21 Days on the ICW
 

Wayne.B wrote:

On Wed, 8 Aug 2007 12:23:36 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

There was a time, a more wholesome time, when sailors didn't think it
was cool to tell the whole world about their inadequacies, their
mistakes and their lack of sailing skill.

No - there has never been such a time. Only inadequate men who are
afraid to admit their faults will shrink from telling their mistakes.
Besides which - I'm not a sailor as I have often said. We didn't get
out of our depth to the point that we needed rescue. We rescued
ourselves. We didn't go south in a group relying on others to plan
for us - we did our own planning. And we were basically successful.

The fact that we had problems was not unusual. Perhaps the fact that
we faced up to them and overcame them was.


And you have never had any foul ups on your boat?

If not I'm pretty certain that the boat has never left the bath tub.

We learn from our own mistakes, and from others honest enough to admit
them. Since you've never reported any of your own, what can we
assume?

Things that go wrong - First 21 Days on the ICW
 

In article s.com,
"Wilbur Hubbard" wrote:

But, then again, I'm a man. One of
the few left sailing, it seems.

Wilbur Hubbard

I want to thank you Wilbur. Whenever I have mid life crisis feelings or
doubts about some choices I am now living out, you have made it clear to
me I should get down on my knees and give thanks I am not you.

H

--
To respond, obviously drop the "nospan"?

Things that go wrong - First 21 Days on the ICW
 

Harlan Lachman wrote:

In article s.com,
"Wilbur Hubbard" wrote:


But, then again, I'm a man. One of
the few left sailing, it seems.

Wilbur Hubbard


I want to thank you Wilbur. Whenever I have mid life crisis feelings or
doubts about some choices I am now living out, you have made it clear to
me I should get down on my knees and give thanks I am not you.

H


Seconded!

With heartfelt thanks

Things that go wrong - First 21 Days on the ICW
 

"Rosalie B." wrote in message
...

No - there has never been such a time.

How would you know? All you women want to do is turn men into your idea
of a man. In other words, girly-men! Your desire is equality. Your idea
of equality is a man equally as inept when it comes to manly behavior as
a woman is when it comes to manly behavior.

Only inadequate men who are
afraid to admit their faults will shrink from telling their mistakes.

Wrong again, only girly-men have faults or make mistakes they enjoy
bragging about in a public forum. Real men have pride. Real men realize
they will make mistakes but they have as a priority correcting their
mistakes so they don't happen again. You don't have to share you
mistakes in order to correct them. Girly-men make the same mistake time
and time again and they talk about their mistakes as if they are proud
they just keep making them because nothing else is possible for them or
expected of them. This is not how a real man behaves or what a real
woman would accept as manly behavior.

When is the last time you read a magazine story of any sportsman
bragging about how badly he screwed up? Does the NASCAR driver brag
about constantly running off the race course or running out of gas or
spinning out in a corner? Does the big game hunter brag about how many
times he missed the shot or got trampled by elephants? Does the mountain
climber brag about how often his belay lines carry away because he
blotched placing his pitons? Does the private investigator brag about
how badly he blotched an investigation so a criminal went free? Does a
doctor in a medical journal joke about his operating on the wrong leg or
sewing his scapal within the body cavity? Does the airline pilot brag
about all his close calls with respect to crashing head-on into another
airplane? No they do not and they will not. Why is this sordid and
insane behavior considered something to be proud of when it comes to
sailing or cruising? Is it because sailor's have grown up reading
girly-man sailing magazines that print this kind of trash in order to
further their agenda of continuing the trend of turning entire
generations of men into girly-men? I think so. What other reason for it
can there be?


Besides which - I'm not a sailor as I have often said. We didn't get
out of our depth to the point that we needed rescue. We rescued
ourselves. We didn't go south in a group relying on others to plan
for us - we did our own planning. And we were basically successful.


"We rescued ourselves?" Next time try learning how to not screw up so
self-rescue or any other kind of rescue is not required. Lose the
attitude that screwing up is normal fare. It's not! In all my years of
sailing (over 20 years now and thousands of miles river, coastal and
offshore) I have yet to need a rescue either from myself or from anybody
else. That's the way it should be. I have never called for a tow. I have
never hit another boat. I have never dragged anchor and caused anybody
any trouble because of it. I have never been dismasted. I have never
been out of commission because of motor problems. I have never run out
of fuel. I've never been lost. I've never been storm-damaged other than
being struck by lightning which is an act of God. I have never ever. I
believe in the old saying that an ounce of prevention is worth a pound
of cure.

Wilbur Hubbard
In omnia paratus

Things that go wrong - First 21 Days on the ICW
 

"Dave" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 16:24:02 -0400, Rosalie B.

said:

Only inadequate men who are
afraid to admit their faults will shrink from telling their mistakes.

Well spoke, Rosalie. Fits Neal to a T.


Hey, stupid, you have Neal on the brain - what little of it is left in
that thick skull of yours. Now go to the back of the class. You liberals
wouldn't know a man unless your mother introduced you to your real dad.

Wilbur Hubbard

Things that go wrong - First 21 Days on the ICW
 

"Harlan Lachman" wrote in message
...
In article s.com,
"Wilbur Hubbard" wrote:

But, then again, I'm a man. One of
the few left sailing, it seems.

Wilbur Hubbard

I want to thank you Wilbur. Whenever I have mid life crisis feelings
or
doubts about some choices I am now living out, you have made it clear
to
me I should get down on my knees and give thanks I am not you.

Mid-life crisis is a liberal, feminist-inspired, girly-man condition.
Doubts about choices is the province of female thinking who rely more on
intuition than facts and logic. Your getting down on your knees and
worshipping anybody but God Almighty is blasphemous. You're definitely
a girly-man.

And so is cavelamb himself who is too pathetic to deserve a separate
reply from this real man.

Wilbur Hubbard

Things that go wrong - First 21 Days on the ICW
 

On Wed, 8 Aug 2007 19:41:30 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

I have never called for a tow. I have
never hit another boat. I have never dragged anchor and caused anybody
any trouble because of it. I have never been dismasted. I have never
been out of commission because of motor problems. I have never run out
of fuel. I've never been lost. I've never been storm-damaged other than
being struck by lightning which is an act of God.

Perfection is such a rare quality.

You are to be commended for building the safest bath tub in the world.
Now go play with your rubber ducky some more.

Things that go wrong - First 21 Days on the ICW
 

On 8 Aug 2007 19:20:02 -0500, Dave wrote:

Come back when you have a little more experience, kid. Preferably on
something in addition to a ****-yellow wannabe cruising boat with an
outboard.

Back off.

It's not just any outboard, it's a 10 horse 4 stroke which burns less
than 1 quart per hour (at idle speed), thereby yielding a fuel range
of better than 24 hours at maybe 5 knots.

You could cross oceans with that rig if only Exxon would build service
stations out there.

Things that go wrong - First 21 Days on the ICW
 

On Wed, 8 Aug 2007 19:41:30 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

I have never called for a tow. I have
never hit another boat. I have never dragged anchor and caused anybody
any trouble because of it. I have never been dismasted. I have never
been out of commission because of motor problems. I have never run out
of fuel. I've never been lost. I've never been storm-damaged other than
being struck by lightning which is an act of God.

In order for any of these things to happen, Willy, you have to actually
sail.

Things that go wrong - First 21 Days on the ICW
 

On 2007-08-08 16:24:02 -0400, Rosalie B. said:

Wayne.B wrote:

On Wed, 8 Aug 2007 12:23:36 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

There was a time, a more wholesome time, when sailors didn't think it
was cool to tell the whole world about their inadequacies, their
mistakes and their lack of sailing skill.

No - there has never been such a time. Only inadequate men who are
afraid to admit their faults will shrink from telling their mistakes.

Truer words have rarely been spoken.

Similarly, there are two types of Chesapeake Bay sailors: Those who
admit to going aground and liers (or Dock Queens).

--
Jere Lull
Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD
Xan's new pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/
Our BVI pages: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/

Things that go wrong - First 21 Days on the ICW
 

Wilbur Hubbard wrote:


"Harlan Lachman" wrote in message
...

In article s.com,
"Wilbur Hubbard" wrote:

But, then again, I'm a man. One of
the few left sailing, it seems.

Wilbur Hubbard


I want to thank you Wilbur. Whenever I have mid life crisis feelings or
doubts about some choices I am now living out, you have made it clear to
me I should get down on my knees and give thanks I am not you.


Mid-life crisis is a liberal, feminist-inspired, girly-man condition.
Doubts about choices is the province of female thinking who rely more on
intuition than facts and logic. Your getting down on your knees and
worshipping anybody but God Almighty is blasphemous. You're definitely
a girly-man.

And so is cavelamb himself who is too pathetic to deserve a separate
reply from this real man.

Wilbur Hubbard

good!

Whata hoot!

Things that go wrong - First 21 Days on the ICW
 

"Harlan Lachman" wrote in message
...
In article s.com,
"Wilbur Hubbard" wrote:

But, then again, I'm a man. One of
the few left sailing, it seems.

Wilbur Hubbard

I want to thank you Wilbur. Whenever I have mid life crisis feelings or
doubts about some choices I am now living out, you have made it clear to
me I should get down on my knees and give thanks I am not you.

H

--
To respond, obviously drop the "nospan"?


Hahahahahaa.... now I need another keyboard!

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Things that go wrong - First 21 Days on the ICW
 

On Aug 8, 11:23 am, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:
There was a time, a more wholesome time, when sailors didn't think it
was cool to tell the whole world about their inadequacies, their
mistakes and their lack of sailing skill. Those were much better days.

You and Bob should be ashamed of yourselves. You are almost as inept as
that boob on Flying Pig.

Wilbur Hubbard

http://www.cartoonstock.com/newscart...es/rten29l.jpg

Joe

Things that go wrong - First 21 Days on the ICW
 

"Wilbur Hubbard" wrote:

"Rosalie B." wrote in message
.. .

No - there has never been such a time.

How would you know?

How do you know that I'm wrong?

All you women want to do is turn men into your idea
of a man. In other words, girly-men! Your desire is equality. Your idea
of equality is a man equally as inept when it comes to manly behavior as
a woman is when it comes to manly behavior.

Equality is not making everyone the same as you seem to imply. Because
we are not the same, and trying to make everyone be the same is
futile. We can treat everyone the same under law - that is each human
has a right to vote and to their dignity, but that's not the same as
trying to make everyone the same.

Only inadequate men who are
afraid to admit their faults will shrink from telling their mistakes.

Wrong again, only girly-men have faults or make mistakes they enjoy
bragging about in a public forum. Real men have pride. Real men realize

Speaking about them in order to learn is different from bragging -
although I guess in your case you might want to have them equated.

What you are calling pride is false pride. Men or women who are
really capable have no problem with admitting that they may make
mistakes. People who insist on being right all the time are fearful
creatures inside.

they will make mistakes but they have as a priority correcting their
mistakes so they don't happen again. You don't have to share you
mistakes in order to correct them. Girly-men make the same mistake time
and time again and they talk about their mistakes as if they are proud
they just keep making them because nothing else is possible for them or
expected of them. This is not how a real man behaves or what a real
woman would accept as manly behavior.

Failing to learn from mistakes and making the same mistakes time after
time is the result of stupidity. Anyone of any sex can be stupid - it
is equal opportunity.

When is the last time you read a magazine story of any sportsman
bragging about how badly he screwed up? Does the NASCAR driver brag
about constantly running off the race course or running out of gas or
spinning out in a corner?

He'd be out of a job whether he talked about it or not.

Does the big game hunter brag about how many
times he missed the shot or got trampled by elephants? Does the mountain
climber brag about how often his belay lines carry away because he
blotched placing his pitons? Does the private investigator brag about
how badly he blotched an investigation so a criminal went free? Does a
doctor in a medical journal joke about his operating on the wrong leg or
sewing his scapal within the body cavity? Does the airline pilot brag
about all his close calls with respect to crashing head-on into another
airplane? No they do not and they will not.

They would either be dead, and thus not able to 'brag' or they'd be
unemployed. In particular the doctor ought to be (as the guy who
operated on the wrong side of the brain recently) be investigated and
have his license to practice taken away. These things that you
mention are much more serious than the things I was talking about.

Why is this sordid and
insane behavior considered something to be proud of when it comes to
sailing or cruising? Is it because sailor's have grown up reading
girly-man sailing magazines that print this kind of trash in order to
further their agenda of continuing the trend of turning entire
generations of men into girly-men? I think so. What other reason for it
can there be?

Magazines print what people want to read. It is boring to read only
about travel where nothing happens.

Besides which - I'm not a sailor as I have often said. We didn't get
out of our depth to the point that we needed rescue. We rescued
ourselves. We didn't go south in a group relying on others to plan
for us - we did our own planning. And we were basically successful.

"We rescued ourselves?" Next time try learning how to not screw up so
self-rescue or any other kind of rescue is not required. Lose the
attitude that screwing up is normal fare. It's not! In all my years of
sailing (over 20 years now and thousands of miles river, coastal and
offshore) I have yet to need a rescue either from myself or from anybody
else. That's the way it should be. I have never called for a tow. I have
never hit another boat. I have never dragged anchor and caused anybody
any trouble because of it. I have never been dismasted. I have never
been out of commission because of motor problems. I have never run out
of fuel. I've never been lost. I've never been storm-damaged other than
being struck by lightning which is an act of God. I have never ever. I
believe in the old saying that an ounce of prevention is worth a pound
of cure.

It's easy to say that you've never been lost if you never go anywhere.

We've been more than 30,000 miles and in only 9 years.
We've needed a tow only once and that was at an unmarked hazard in the
middle of the ICW channel. We've never dragged and caused anyone any
trouble. We've never been demasted, but I think demasting isn't
particularly related to skill or lack or it but rather to whether you
put yourself out there in severe weather. We've never run out of
fuel. Etc.

Things that Go Wrong - First Time ICW from Charleston to Florida
 

The first post on this was in answer to

Vic Smith who wrote:

Regarding cruiser electrical/mechanical shakedowns, hose leaks,
electrical glitches and such shouldn't be part of that, as that should
all be set right while ashore.

I suppose for sailboat cruisers the real shakedown elements are
rigging, sails and drive train related.
But like I said, I don't yet sail, so I'd welcome experienced thoughts
on this as I prepare myself.

This is the continuation - reporting not only our experiences but
those of others we met.

Nov 22 - visiting with our son's family. Bob and our son took the
scuba bottles to be refilled and did some shopping

Nov 23 - Thanksgiving, and I finally got to cut Bob's hair.

Nov 24 - Friday - Bob and our son went shopping in the a.m (Bob
wanted a sewing awl to repair the bimini curtains where the thread was
dry rotting - our son eventually found one at a stable). We also
bought a phone so we could hook up to phone service at marinas. I gave
the cord to the wall to them so that they could hook both their
bedroom phone and the computer up at the same time. And Bob got an
additional extension cable for our TV. We all got into the car and
went to the Piggly Wiggly to get groceries and ice. (note the
refrigeration is still not working so we are still using ice)

Nov 25-26 - Visiting with son's family

Nov 27 - I did a few more rounds by phone with LectraSan (who were
closed from Weds to Mon) while Bob took the hotel van over to
Charleston to shop. LectraSan claimed that they'd shipped us the part
(and charged our credit card for it) and that UPS sent it to
California by mistake. Our son (who used to work for UPS) said they
probably never sent it. I told them to send another one to our
daughter in Miami.

Nov 28 - Took me 3 tries to start the engine because I'd forgotten I
had to pull the tab to put the transmission in neutral. We cruised
across the harbor - me at the wheel (upset because Bob was stowing the
lines and the gate in the life lines was open and he didn't have his
life vest on). The sun was in my eyes but we managed to get across the
harbor. There wasn't much traffic.

After we went through the Wappo Creek and Limehouse Bridges, we passed
under the SC 174 highway bridge. At the other end of the SC 174 bridge
is Whooping Island. We turned up a small creek at mile 501 and
anchored. The Island Packet ISHMAEL which passed us earlier was
already there. We were between narrow banks of mud - within 50 yards
of the bank in 14 feet of water. The boat swung to the tide and not
the wind. When the tide changed all the boats swung around 180
degrees.

When the tide was going out, I could see ISHMAEL's anchor light by
looking out the aft port from bed. When the tide changed and the boat
swung around I looked out and saw lights moving across rapidly. I said
to Bob - the boat's swinging wildly!! He went out and looked - the
creek was mirror calm. I had been looking at the car lights on the
highway! (This became a family joke)

I discovered we didn't have any computer charts for GA or FL.

Nov 29 - Bob started the engine about 6:30. Oops - throttle cable
broke. He worked on it and finally got it back together about 9:30.
Meanwhile I called the computer chart people and ordered the charts I
needed. We went to Dataw Island Marina which was about 20 miles away.
There we ordered a new cable, and transmission seals, did laundry,
downloaded email on the courtesy phone, and had dinner

Nov 30 - We got the new cable, but Bob ordered the connectors too
small and he used the old ones. The new cable works fine and we saved
the old one in case. The seals came and we paid for them. Got a guy
to align the transmission. Our son and granddaughter came over with
the charts (we weren't that far from Charleston) and I installed them
on the computer.

Dec 1 - The new throttle spring was too stiff and I couldn't move it
up past 1500 rpm without it automatically returning. He fixed it once
he realized that it really was that way and not just whimpy throttle
handling on my part.

AGREEMENT I (a Canadian boat from Montreal with a yellow bimini) had a
hammock slung across the stern. AGREEMENT was on our starboard and
two power boats passed at the same time - one between us and one on
our port - they didn't see the one on our port and the wake dumped the
hammock occupant back into the cockpit.

PRIME INTEREST said they'd anchored 35 miles N. of Charleston but let
out an extra 10 feet of anchor rode which meant that at low tide they
were aground on the bank. He said without the extra 10 feet they'd
have been OK. This turned out to be a blessing in disguise because
they called Tow Boat US, and when the tide came up and they were free,
their water pump went out, so they needed TBUS anyway and had already
called. They said the tow boat person recommended a marina to them
(didn't say which one) and the repair person there was able to fix
their water pump on Sat a.m. of Thanksgiving weekend.

We got to the Outdoor Resorts Marina at Hilton Head earlier than
planned. We wanted fuel and there was a big motor boat at the fuel
dock so they asked us to slow down and not get there for 10 minutes.

PRIME INTEREST was circling around with us but a wake from a small
boat pushed their dinghy under their swim platform and punctured it.
Completely unrepairable.

When we inquired about the tides (the tide was on the ebb when we came
in) we discovered that we won't be able to get out until about 9 the
next day. Low tide is about 6.

Dec 2 - It is starting to rain and be nasty, so we went up into the
Herb River and anchored The tide and current has more effect and the
boat swings around 180 degrees, and Bob worries that we will swing or
drag into someone's dock so he doesn't sleep well and is up and down
all night

Dec 3 - It was another raw damp day, and Bob got chilled and started
to shiver. I wanted electricity so we could have heat. So we went to
Kilkenny Creek Marina. Their floating docks are wooden on blue
barrels, so you have to walk carefully as they bounce around a bit.
When you stop on it, it gives under your weight. The bigger pieces
just give a little, but the smaller connector ones dip down a lot. It
is like walking on a jungle suspension bridge.

MERIDIAN a big power boat came in and got 300 gal. of fuel. They
expect to be in Jacksonville tomorrow. They complained of being cold
because they have only 3 sides to the steering station.

Dec 4 - Last night the heater made the cabin so hot that I got up and
turned it off. I was wearing a heavy shirt and sleeping under a
blanket and a quilt. Bob was not sleeping under his quilt. It got down
to 64 deg F inside, and Bob got cold and complained (and turned on the
heater again) but still didn't get out his quilt. It was back up to 69
by 7 a.m., but he was still complaining. There was frost on the inside
of the bimini which later melted and dripped on us.

There was also frost on the enclosure curtains and on the dock. Since
we are tied to the dock starboard side to, and the boat backs to
starboard, and there is a lot of current pushing us forward, Bob is
concerned that we will hit the boat ahead of us while trying to get
out. I suggest that he pull the boat back a couple of feet (there's no
one behind us on the face dock), and then let the bow go first, and
then back up onto the dock which will make the bow swing out. So
that's what we did. The guy from the boat ahead came out to help, or
to be sure we don't hit him or both, but we did OK without him having
to help much.

The day is sunny and bright to the starboard without a cloud in the
sky, and on the port side the clouds are grey and lowering. Some
hysterical lady is lambasting power boats about their passing wake.
She does not identify her boat, and we can't tell if she's ahead or
behind us.

We pass two boats anchored in the Back River where I wanted to stop,
but Bob wanted to go as far as possible and so I could not persuade
him to stop and anchor there or in the Duplin, or Darien Rivers. I
think he felt that we had lost a lot of time by stopping off at
Kilkenny Creek.

We go off the ICW at SM 658 in the Altamaha River west of Dolbow
Island and north of Little Saint Simons Island. Holding is good but
there is little or no wind protection.

Dec 5 - It got down to 34 deg F, but we were not cold inside the boat
as the temperature inside was about 10 deg. higher. We both wore our
clothes to bed like we used to do camping when I was a little girl,
and this time we both slept under our quilts, and were not at all
cold. Although getting up to use the bathroom was a bit like getting
up to use an outhouse must have been. Bob started the engine at 7 and
we were pulling the anchor by 7:45. His wash down pump got a short, so
he just let the current wash off the chain.

The Jekyll Island fuel dock (where we are stopping tonight) is on the
north end, almost in the shadow of the bridge. Fortunately, the
current is away from the bridge. CHARISMA is there in the best
easiest spot getting fuel and that restricts the area that we have to
put the boat into. But Bob eventually maneuvers us into the dock and
we get 25 gallons of fuel.

Bob had bought a new heater in Charleston and he got it out and
started using it tonight - it has a thermostat so I won't be tempted
to turn it off like I did in Kilkenny Creek!!!

Dec 6 - We've decided to go out Brunswick Inlet into the ocean to go
down to the St. Mary's River. This will be our first venture out into
the ocean. The weather forecast seems good - light north winds are
forecast.

There is a LONG line of breakers (marked on the chart, and visible
with binoculars) extending down from the north on each side of the
channel. Bob takes in the jib and then starts fooling with a way to
keep the boom over to one side so that we won't have an accidental
jibe.

Suddenly I notice that the breaker line is very close and it is
getting shallower.

I yell "Breakers, Breakers", at Bob. He doesn't understand the
situation, and apparently thinks he's too close to the buoy on our
starboard. The depth alarm goes off and he's still going the wrong
direction.

Then WHAM, we come down hard on something - probably a sand bar - I
hope not rocks. The breaking waves wash us off and then back down
again. We hit at least 3 times really teeth-jarring hard. Eventually
the waves lift us and Bob guns the motor, and we are over on the other
side.

Bob hopes aloud that the rudder is OK. We idle along because there are
two shrimp boats with their nets across where we want to go, and then
resume speed. Bob checks the engine room, and all appears to be OK.

When I snorkeled around the boat in Key West and the Dry Tortugas, I
report to Bob that all the paint (both the base red paint and the top
blue coat) down to the bare white fiberglass has been scraped off the
front end of the keel up 3 or 4 inches on each side

Coming in the St. Mary's inlet is a piece of cake. There are ranges to
use and the water is deep and has a lot of buoys. The only problem is
a multitude of shrimp boats all of which appear to be heading toward
us.

I start calling the Tiger Point Marina, but they don't answer. I try
the cell phone and it won't even call. I try the bag phone and it
rings and rings with no answer - even the emergency number. I try the
radio and again no answer. Eventually, someone whom I apparently
talked to last night comes up on the radio and advises me that Tiger
Point is chock full and have stopped answering the phone, and tells me
a couple other marinas to try.

So I call on the bag phone to Fernandina Harbor Marina. He says that
they don't take reservations, but that he's sure they can accommodate
me. they put us on the west side of dock #2. We have a hard time
getting into that dock because we are port side to the dock and the
boat won't back over that way

While downloading e-mail, I hear about an accident that happened in
the anchorage here last week - a tug hit and sank a sailboat that was
anchored either in or very close to the channel (a no no). I don't
think that the boat had an anchor light either because they were
having electrical problems. One of the guys on board got out with no
injuries. The other was killed. The tug was fined for not having a
lookout.

Things that go wrong - First 21 Days on the ICW
 

On Thu, 09 Aug 2007 09:27:36 -0400, Gogarty
wrote:

In article ,
says...


On Wed, 8 Aug 2007 12:23:36 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

There was a time, a more wholesome time, when sailors didn't think it
was cool to tell the whole world about their inadequacies, their
mistakes and their lack of sailing skill.

And you have never had any foul ups on your boat?

If not I'm pretty certain that the boat has never left the bath tub.

We learn from our own mistakes, and from others honest enough to admit
them. Since you've never reported any of your own, what can we
assume?

Don't feed the troll. As for Rosali, keep it coming. Very instructive.

Second that. I always appreciate somebody pointing out the ways
things go wrong. That's gives us more chance to sidestep the same
predicaments.
Thanks, Rosalie.

--Vic

Things that go wrong - First 21 Days on the ICW
 

"Vic Smith" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 09 Aug 2007 09:27:36 -0400, Gogarty
wrote:

In article ,
says...


On Wed, 8 Aug 2007 12:23:36 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

There was a time, a more wholesome time, when sailors didn't think
it
was cool to tell the whole world about their inadequacies, their
mistakes and their lack of sailing skill.

And you have never had any foul ups on your boat?

If not I'm pretty certain that the boat has never left the bath tub.

We learn from our own mistakes, and from others honest enough to
admit
them. Since you've never reported any of your own, what can we
assume?

Don't feed the troll. As for Rosali, keep it coming. Very instructive.

Second that. I always appreciate somebody pointing out the ways
things go wrong. That's gives us more chance to sidestep the same
predicaments.
Thanks, Rosalie.

--Vic

And it makes you feel better knowing your chronic screw-ups are also
experienced by others who are just as inept as you are? Have you ever
considered that side-stepping one predicament may end you up in another
predicament that's even more dire? When sailing you don't react; you do
things proactively if you want to be safe and if you want to sail
problem free. You have a plan based on the consensus of the right way to
do things and you take advantage of the successful experiences written
about by others.

Stop dwelling on failures and screw-ups. Consider your very own
situation and do what it takes to avoid any and all screw-ups. It's a
matter of reading the right way to do things. There are thousands of
books published that will tell how to do things right. Only a moron
would rather read about how to do things wrong. The Beasley's and those
idiots on Flying Pig are accidents waiting to happen because of their
lackadaisical attitudes.

Your similar attitude tells me you're no sailor. Probably a girly-man as
well as all the others who like to read tales of woe and pat themselves
on the back thinking, "I'm a screw-up myself but not nearly as bad as
those idiots. They make me feel good about myself." Sad.

Wilbur Hubbard

Things that go wrong - First 21 Days on the ICW
 

Your similar attitude tells me you're no sailor.

Things that go wrong - First 21 Days on the ICW
 

On Thu, 9 Aug 2007 14:38:16 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

"Vic Smith" wrote in message
.. .
On Thu, 09 Aug 2007 09:27:36 -0400, Gogarty


Second that. I always appreciate somebody pointing out the ways
things go wrong. That's gives us more chance to sidestep the same
predicaments.
Thanks, Rosalie.

--Vic

And it makes you feel better knowing your chronic screw-ups are also
experienced by others who are just as inept as you are? Have you ever
considered that side-stepping one predicament may end you up in another
predicament that's even more dire? When sailing you don't react; you do
things proactively if you want to be safe and if you want to sail
problem free. You have a plan based on the consensus of the right way to
do things and you take advantage of the successful experiences written
about by others.

The only way to get the consensus on how to do it right is to find the
consensus of what goes wrong. Knowing about that throttle cable
breaking on Rosalie's boat might help somebody avoid having that
happen at a critical time. I know that I'll pay more attention to
throttle cables - and possible backups - than I otherwise might have.
That's proactive.
Knowing the sailor's consensus of common mishaps helps others who read
of them avoid those mishaps.
As much as you tout your avoidance of such mishaps, it can only be
because you have learned from others, or suffered them yourself.
Or you're just plain lucky, or you never sail.
Take your pick. It's not rocket science.

Stop dwelling on failures and screw-ups. Consider your very own
situation and do what it takes to avoid any and all screw-ups. It's a
matter of reading the right way to do things. There are thousands of
books published that will tell how to do things right. Only a moron
would rather read about how to do things wrong. The Beasley's and those
idiots on Flying Pig are accidents waiting to happen because of their
lackadaisical attitudes.

Your similar attitude tells me you're no sailor. Probably a girly-man as
well as all the others who like to read tales of woe and pat themselves
on the back thinking, "I'm a screw-up myself but not nearly as bad as
those idiots. They make me feel good about myself." Sad.

Don't be silly. I learn from those with experience in order to avoid
their mistakes, or be prepared for common gear break downs.
If I make a mistake or suffer a gear break down, I'll be happy to
share it with others. Just part of being an adult.
On a different note, some of the everyday hassles cruisers encounter
are useful info. Shrimpers, powerboaters, no mooring space, other
boats drifting into you at anchor, etc, etc, might give potential
cruisers food for thought.

--Vic

Things that go wrong - First 21 Days on the ICW
 

Allow me to show you by comments within your text a different attitude -
a professional attitude. Read on . . .


"Vic Smith" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 9 Aug 2007 14:38:16 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

"Vic Smith" wrote in message
. ..
On Thu, 09 Aug 2007 09:27:36 -0400, Gogarty



Second that. I always appreciate somebody pointing out the ways
things go wrong. That's gives us more chance to sidestep the same
predicaments.
Thanks, Rosalie.

--Vic

And it makes you feel better knowing your chronic screw-ups are also
experienced by others who are just as inept as you are? Have you ever
considered that side-stepping one predicament may end you up in
another
predicament that's even more dire? When sailing you don't react; you
do
things proactively if you want to be safe and if you want to sail
problem free. You have a plan based on the consensus of the right way
to
do things and you take advantage of the successful experiences written
about by others.

The only way to get the consensus on how to do it right is to find the
consensus of what goes wrong.

No, that's incorrect. There might be a thousand ways to screw something
up but only ONE way to do it right. A professional attitude is to learn
the one right way to do something and ignore all the wrong ways. Make
sense?

Knowing about that throttle cable
breaking on Rosalie's boat might help somebody avoid having that
happen at a critical time.

Wrong again. A professional attitude is an awareness of the fact that,
sooner or later, EVERYTHING breaks especially moving parts. With that in
mind, a professional will have a regular inspection, maintenance and
replacement schedule. If the Beasley's throttle cable broke it's because
they FAILED to do proper inspections, maintenance and replacement. It's
that simple. Since you already know everything will break what's the
real use of reading from some klutz that their whatever broke? Make
sense?

I know that I'll pay more attention to
throttle cables - and possible backups - than I otherwise might have.

But, you'll do it while ignoring other things about which you haven't
heard a breakage tale of woe. See the trap you've set for yourself.
Your logic says, "If it broke for the Beasley's then it might break for
me so I'd better keep an eye on it." Illogical. Keep in mind that
EVERYTHING breaks and act accordingly. Make sense?

That's proactive.

Nope, it's not proactive. It's reactive. You're reacting to the
consequences of some idiot's mistakes. If you are proactive you take
action beforehand so you don't suffer such failures on your boat. You
institute a regular inspection, maintenance and replacement schedule.
You don't wait until things break and then react. Make sense?


Knowing the sailor's consensus of common mishaps helps others who read
of them avoid those mishaps.

No it doesn't. It makes you complacent. It makes you think only certain
things have to be inspected, maintained and replaced. It makes you
sloppy. Same goes with navigation and running aground. It does you no
good to hear about some fool going aground. It only makes going aground
more acceptable when going aground is not part of navigation, rather
going aground is part of sloppy navigation. It's a mistake. A screw-up.
Avoidable with professional seamanship.

As much as you tout your avoidance of such mishaps, it can only be
because you have learned from others, or suffered them yourself.
Or you're just plain lucky, or you never sail.
Take your pick. It's not rocket science.

Sure there's some luck involved with everything. But it's only a small
part. Taking action before any problem occurs is the key. Knowing
EVERYTHING ON YOUR BOAT needs to be looked at regularly, maintained
regularly and replaced regularly and doing it is what avoids mishaps
with mechanicals, systems and structures. Make sense?

I'm not perfect when it comes to maintaining my boat but I'm a lot
closer to it than most people who have the nerve to call themselves
sailors these days. I know EVERYTHING breaks, I know how to inspect,
maintain and replace everything. I do it. I also have contingency plans,
spares, tools, alternate methods. You know "if - then." I have it
already scoped out. Then I do it all over again. When I have three
layers of protection I figure I've got it covered.

When you're sailing along uneventfully, perhaps a little bored, try
playing this game. The "what if" game. Ask yourself what you'd do if the
forestay suddenly carried away and make a firm mental plan of how to
handle it. Ask yourself what if you suddenly saw water covering the
sole. What is your plan to find the source and plug it up? Where are the
supplies to do so? Ask yourself what if your rudder stopped working.
What is your plan to understand exactly why in about half a minute. It
goes on and on. In other words - prepare, prepare, prepare. Know what to
do, how to act in any eventuality. I bet you don't come close to doing
that. When you learn how, you're close to being a real sailor.

Now consider the screw-ups bragged about by Skip Grundick and Mrs.
Beasley. Neither one has a clue. They blunder, they react. They hit and
miss. They have no plan to eliminate such idiocy in the future because
they think that's the way everybody does it.

The point I'm making is that's NOT the way everybody does it. That's the
way foolish, ignorant, stupid, inexperienced people do it. I don't
wished to be lumped in with fools, thus my vehement objections to this
unprofessional behavior and those who advocate it.

Don't be silly. I learn from those with experience in order to avoid
their mistakes, or be prepared for common gear break downs.

Bunk! Your mistakes are your own. All your own.


Wilbur Hubbard

August 3 - Sailing in Steerage
 

On Aug 7, 12:41 pm, Bob wrote:
in a situation like this, do not hesitate to call the USCG. they will
respond immediately...being in a shipping lane, or in danger of going
aground with a steering casualty is a distress situation. just
practice good risk assessment and call for help when you need it.- Hide quoted text -

Good idea, but then Skip, Lydia, et al. would no doubt be subject to
boarding and inspection.................. I wonder how that would end?

Been Boarded Bob

:{)) I believe we'd be fine. However, as seen in the original (holy
cow, has this thing grown legs!), we made it a point not to be a
nuisance to anyone other than ourselves, and to address our problems
before setting out again. I'm typing this from in front of Beaufort
NC where we've checked in to address a windlass issue and do some
touring before heading north inside. I'll put up the next couple of
reports on separate headings in order to keep things a bit simpler...

L8R

Skip

Morgan 461 #2
SV Flying Pig KI4MPC
See our galleries at www.justpickone.org/skip/gallery !
Follow us at http://groups.google.com/group/flyingpiglog and/or
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TheFlyingPigLog

"You are never given a wish without also being given the power to
make it
come true. You may have to work for it however."
(and)
"There is no such thing as a problem without a gift for you in its
hands.
You seek problems because you need their gifts."
(Richard Bach, in The Reluctant Messiah)

Things that go wrong - First 21 Days on the ICW
 

On Thu, 9 Aug 2007 16:22:42 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

Allow me to show you by comments within your text a different attitude -
a professional attitude. Read on . . .


"Vic Smith" wrote in message
.. .
On Thu, 9 Aug 2007 14:38:16 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

"Vic Smith" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 09 Aug 2007 09:27:36 -0400, Gogarty



Second that. I always appreciate somebody pointing out the ways
things go wrong. That's gives us more chance to sidestep the same
predicaments.
Thanks, Rosalie.

--Vic

And it makes you feel better knowing your chronic screw-ups are also
experienced by others who are just as inept as you are? Have you ever
considered that side-stepping one predicament may end you up in
another
predicament that's even more dire? When sailing you don't react; you
do
things proactively if you want to be safe and if you want to sail
problem free. You have a plan based on the consensus of the right way
to
do things and you take advantage of the successful experiences written
about by others.

The only way to get the consensus on how to do it right is to find the
consensus of what goes wrong.

No, that's incorrect. There might be a thousand ways to screw something
up but only ONE way to do it right. A professional attitude is to learn
the one right way to do something and ignore all the wrong ways. Make
sense?

Knowing about that throttle cable
breaking on Rosalie's boat might help somebody avoid having that
happen at a critical time.

Wrong again. A professional attitude is an awareness of the fact that,
sooner or later, EVERYTHING breaks especially moving parts. With that in
mind, a professional will have a regular inspection, maintenance and
replacement schedule. If the Beasley's throttle cable broke it's because
they FAILED to do proper inspections, maintenance and replacement. It's
that simple. Since you already know everything will break what's the
real use of reading from some klutz that their whatever broke? Make
sense?

I know that I'll pay more attention to
throttle cables - and possible backups - than I otherwise might have.

But, you'll do it while ignoring other things about which you haven't
heard a breakage tale of woe. See the trap you've set for yourself.
Your logic says, "If it broke for the Beasley's then it might break for
me so I'd better keep an eye on it." Illogical. Keep in mind that
EVERYTHING breaks and act accordingly. Make sense?

That's proactive.

Nope, it's not proactive. It's reactive. You're reacting to the
consequences of some idiot's mistakes. If you are proactive you take
action beforehand so you don't suffer such failures on your boat. You
institute a regular inspection, maintenance and replacement schedule.
You don't wait until things break and then react. Make sense?


Knowing the sailor's consensus of common mishaps helps others who read
of them avoid those mishaps.

No it doesn't. It makes you complacent. It makes you think only certain
things have to be inspected, maintained and replaced. It makes you
sloppy. Same goes with navigation and running aground. It does you no
good to hear about some fool going aground. It only makes going aground
more acceptable when going aground is not part of navigation, rather
going aground is part of sloppy navigation. It's a mistake. A screw-up.
Avoidable with professional seamanship.

As much as you tout your avoidance of such mishaps, it can only be
because you have learned from others, or suffered them yourself.
Or you're just plain lucky, or you never sail.
Take your pick. It's not rocket science.

Sure there's some luck involved with everything. But it's only a small
part. Taking action before any problem occurs is the key. Knowing
EVERYTHING ON YOUR BOAT needs to be looked at regularly, maintained
regularly and replaced regularly and doing it is what avoids mishaps
with mechanicals, systems and structures. Make sense?

I'm not perfect when it comes to maintaining my boat but I'm a lot
closer to it than most people who have the nerve to call themselves
sailors these days. I know EVERYTHING breaks, I know how to inspect,
maintain and replace everything. I do it. I also have contingency plans,
spares, tools, alternate methods. You know "if - then." I have it
already scoped out. Then I do it all over again. When I have three
layers of protection I figure I've got it covered.

When you're sailing along uneventfully, perhaps a little bored, try
playing this game. The "what if" game. Ask yourself what you'd do if the
forestay suddenly carried away and make a firm mental plan of how to
handle it. Ask yourself what if you suddenly saw water covering the
sole. What is your plan to find the source and plug it up? Where are the
supplies to do so? Ask yourself what if your rudder stopped working.
What is your plan to understand exactly why in about half a minute. It
goes on and on. In other words - prepare, prepare, prepare. Know what to
do, how to act in any eventuality. I bet you don't come close to doing
that. When you learn how, you're close to being a real sailor.

Now consider the screw-ups bragged about by Skip Grundick and Mrs.
Beasley. Neither one has a clue. They blunder, they react. They hit and
miss. They have no plan to eliminate such idiocy in the future because
they think that's the way everybody does it.

The point I'm making is that's NOT the way everybody does it. That's the
way foolish, ignorant, stupid, inexperienced people do it. I don't
wished to be lumped in with fools, thus my vehement objections to this
unprofessional behavior and those who advocate it.

Don't be silly. I learn from those with experience in order to avoid
their mistakes, or be prepared for common gear break downs.

Bunk! Your mistakes are your own. All your own.

Sure, and I hate making mistakes. I agree with what you've said about
preparation, but that's part of my nature.
When I was a boilerman in the Navy I'd spend my watches going over
casualty control procedures in my head while others were gabbing or
daydreaming. In the 3 instances when a failure occurred I was a ball
of fire turning valves, pushing switches and cutting out burners while
everybody else - including those much senior to me - stood around with
their jaws hanging open until I yelled at them to perform a task.
The casualties were successfully resolved.
I *do* believe that everything breaks, but that was part of my
training, and my nature.
But many people don't have that training and experience, and many
don't have the nature to ever really pay close attention to never
making a mistake and always having a backup plan.
That's just how it is. We're dealing with human beings here.
The average cruiser never had to deal with life-threatening casualties
before they started cruising, so any accounts of cruiser experience of
what goes wrong is a boon to them.
Some will take the "things that go wrong" accounts to heart and it may
get them thinking and save some lives or avoid some pain. For others
- like me probably - it's a reminder to stay on their toes, and also
provides info on gear selection. Anyway, it's all good.

--Vic

Things that go wrong - First 21 Days on the ICW
 

"Wilbur Hubbard" wrote in news:46bb7756
:

Now consider the screw-ups bragged about by Skip Grundick and Mrs.
Beasley. Neither one has a clue. They blunder, they react. They hit and
miss. They have no plan to eliminate such idiocy in the future because
they think that's the way everybody does it.



Willie, whatever you do don't let anyone offering to help your sorry,
marooned ass out there on the water know who you are.

If it were anyone from here, I'd bet they'd simply drive away calling on
VHF to warn the others headed to help not to bother, you being such an
asshole as you are......

People like you are the reason most boaters are hesitant to help anyone
they don't know......




These *******s keep calling me so I'm feeding them to the spambots.
--
Sunrise Communications
1374 E. Republic Rd.
Springfield, MO 65804
866-483-1228
417-886-7091
http://www.sunrisecommunicationsinc.com/
877-842-3210
866-842-3278
United Healthcare
http://www.unitedhealthcareonline.com/

Things that go wrong - First 21 Days on the ICW
 

On 2007-08-09 14:38:16 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
said:

And it makes you feel better knowing your chronic screw-ups are also
experienced by others who are just as inept as you are? Have you ever
considered that side-stepping one predicament may end you up in another
predicament that's even more dire? When sailing you don't react; you do
things proactively if you want to be safe and if you want to sail
problem free. You have a plan based on the consensus of the right way
to do things and you take advantage of the successful experiences
written about by others.

Stop dwelling on failures and screw-ups. Consider your very own
situation and do what it takes to avoid any and all screw-ups. It's a
matter of reading the right way to do things. There are thousands of
books published that will tell how to do things right. Only a moron
would rather read about how to do things wrong. The Beasley's and those
idiots on Flying Pig are accidents waiting to happen because of their
lackadaisical attitudes.

Sorry Wilbur, but some of us can learn from hearing of others' experiences.

Because of stories related here, I have added drills for when the
"stuff" hits the fan.

Because of those drills, the few times that "stuff" happened in the
last decade or two, it wound up being a non-event as we had a number of
alternatives and could choose the most appropriate with full confidence
that we could pull it off, as we'd done it already in less-stressful
times.

A month or two ago, our rudder broke free. Yeah, it was my screwup for
not dismounting the pintle and examining the base of the weld,
invisible to my regular inspection of our transom-hung rudder. but when
we found ourself with no rudder, the obvious first action was to
anchor. Because of our previously-decided choice of ground tackle, we
knew that once the anchor was deployed, we weren't going anywhere,
which gave us all the time in the world. When I then unshipped the
rudder to discover our problem, I already had three alternative next
steps, one of which included scavaging interior fittings to create an
emergency rudder.

Pretty much all of that came about because I'd listened to others'
travails on this list and thought of solutions that would work for our
particular boat.

What's the quote? "Those who don't learn history are doomed to repeat
it", or something like that?

I'd rather learn from others' history, not my own.

--
Jere Lull
Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD
Xan's new pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/
Our BVI pages: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/

Things that go wrong - First 21 Days on the ICW
 

On Fri, 10 Aug 2007 11:17:17 GMT, Jere Lull wrote:

On 2007-08-09 14:38:16 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
said:

And it makes you feel better knowing your chronic screw-ups are also
experienced by others who are just as inept as you are? Have you ever
considered that side-stepping one predicament may end you up in another
predicament that's even more dire? When sailing you don't react; you do
things proactively if you want to be safe and if you want to sail
problem free. You have a plan based on the consensus of the right way
to do things and you take advantage of the successful experiences
written about by others.

Stop dwelling on failures and screw-ups. Consider your very own
situation and do what it takes to avoid any and all screw-ups. It's a
matter of reading the right way to do things. There are thousands of
books published that will tell how to do things right. Only a moron
would rather read about how to do things wrong. The Beasley's and those
idiots on Flying Pig are accidents waiting to happen because of their
lackadaisical attitudes.

Sorry Wilbur, but some of us can learn from hearing of others' experiences.

Because of stories related here, I have added drills for when the
"stuff" hits the fan.

Because of those drills, the few times that "stuff" happened in the
last decade or two, it wound up being a non-event as we had a number of
alternatives and could choose the most appropriate with full confidence
that we could pull it off, as we'd done it already in less-stressful
times.

A month or two ago, our rudder broke free. Yeah, it was my screwup for
not dismounting the pintle and examining the base of the weld,
invisible to my regular inspection of our transom-hung rudder. but when
we found ourself with no rudder, the obvious first action was to
anchor. Because of our previously-decided choice of ground tackle, we
knew that once the anchor was deployed, we weren't going anywhere,
which gave us all the time in the world. When I then unshipped the
rudder to discover our problem, I already had three alternative next
steps, one of which included scavaging interior fittings to create an
emergency rudder.

Pretty much all of that came about because I'd listened to others'
travails on this list and thought of solutions that would work for our
particular boat.

What's the quote? "Those who don't learn history are doomed to repeat
it", or something like that?

I'd rather learn from others' history, not my own.


To quote Hubby:

here are thousands of
books published that will tell how to do things right. Only a moron
would rather read about how to do things wrong

What Hubby (apparently) isn't bright enough to realize is that
everyone of these books he reads about "doing things right" came about
because somebody did something wrong, got out of trouble and then
wrote a book about how to do it right.


Bruce in Bangkok
(brucepaigeATgmailDOTcom)

Things that go wrong - First 21 Days on the ICW
 

On Fri, 10 Aug 2007 19:57:50 +0700, wrote:

What Hubby (apparently) isn't bright enough to realize is that
everyone of these books he reads about "doing things right" came about
because somebody did something wrong, got out of trouble and then
wrote a book about how to do it right.

Getting out of trouble is important, sort of like the old joke about
history being written by the winners.

Things that go wrong - First 21 Days on the ICW
 

wrote in message
...
On Fri, 10 Aug 2007 11:17:17 GMT, Jere Lull wrote:

On 2007-08-09 14:38:16 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
said:

And it makes you feel better knowing your chronic screw-ups are also
experienced by others who are just as inept as you are? Have you
ever
considered that side-stepping one predicament may end you up in
another
predicament that's even more dire? When sailing you don't react; you
do
things proactively if you want to be safe and if you want to sail
problem free. You have a plan based on the consensus of the right
way
to do things and you take advantage of the successful experiences
written about by others.

Stop dwelling on failures and screw-ups. Consider your very own
situation and do what it takes to avoid any and all screw-ups. It's
a
matter of reading the right way to do things. There are thousands of
books published that will tell how to do things right. Only a moron
would rather read about how to do things wrong. The Beasley's and
those
idiots on Flying Pig are accidents waiting to happen because of
their
lackadaisical attitudes.

Sorry Wilbur, but some of us can learn from hearing of others'
experiences.

Because of stories related here, I have added drills for when the
"stuff" hits the fan.

Because of those drills, the few times that "stuff" happened in the
last decade or two, it wound up being a non-event as we had a number
of
alternatives and could choose the most appropriate with full
confidence
that we could pull it off, as we'd done it already in less-stressful
times.

A month or two ago, our rudder broke free. Yeah, it was my screwup for
not dismounting the pintle and examining the base of the weld,
invisible to my regular inspection of our transom-hung rudder. but
when
we found ourself with no rudder, the obvious first action was to
anchor. Because of our previously-decided choice of ground tackle, we
knew that once the anchor was deployed, we weren't going anywhere,
which gave us all the time in the world. When I then unshipped the
rudder to discover our problem, I already had three alternative next
steps, one of which included scavaging interior fittings to create an
emergency rudder.

Pretty much all of that came about because I'd listened to others'
travails on this list and thought of solutions that would work for our
particular boat.

What's the quote? "Those who don't learn history are doomed to repeat
it", or something like that?

I'd rather learn from others' history, not my own.


To quote Hubby:

here are thousands of
books published that will tell how to do things right. Only a moron
would rather read about how to do things wrong

What Hubby (apparently) isn't bright enough to realize is that
everyone of these books he reads about "doing things right" came about
because somebody did something wrong, got out of trouble and then
wrote a book about how to do it right.

There's even a couple good books on how to live aboard for years at a
time tied up to a dock. Perhaps you should write one of your own??
You're as qualified as anybody, it seems.

Wilbur Hubbard