Iridium
 

I think it's time to get an Iridium satellite phone. We're gong to have way
too much time away from cell sites.

Any suggestions as to a cruiser-friendly source of hardware and airtime?

Thanks,
Rusty

Iridium
 

I bought mine from http://www.outfittersatellite.com/ a few years
ago.. I have no complaints, but they don't actually provide the
service either. I'd just shop around if I were you.

-- Tom

Iridium
 

"Rusty" blank wrote in message
. ..
I think it's time to get an Iridium satellite phone. We're gong to have
way
too much time away from cell sites.

Any suggestions as to a cruiser-friendly source of hardware and
airtime?

Thanks,
Rusty


It's my observation that people who have to have a phone so they can
blabbermouth 24/7 while out cruising should just stay home. If you need
to be plugged in to the communications grid 24/7 you're not cut out for
cruising - just stay home and leave the waterways open for real
cruisers, please. Today's men are turning into girly men. Bunch of
sissies. Spend the money on a EPIRB instead. Cruise and try shutting
your mouth for a week or a month. You might learn something for the
first time in your life.

Wilbur Hubbard

Iridium
 

Wilbur Hubbard wrote:

It's my observation that people who have to have a phone so they can
blabbermouth 24/7 while out cruising should just stay home. If you need
to be plugged in to the communications grid 24/7 you're not cut out for
cruising - just stay home and leave the waterways open for real
cruisers, please. Today's men are turning into girly men. Bunch of
sissies. Spend the money on a EPIRB instead. Cruise and try shutting
your mouth for a week or a month. You might learn something for the
first time in your life.

Why are you so bitter? When hundreds of miles off shore, I could have
liked to talk to my daughter who was anxious about my safety as I was
singlehanding a rather large sailboat. It would have been something to
make her feel better.

I tried calling her on my EPIRB but the thing just blinked at me.

-paul

Iridium
 

"Paul Cassel" wrote in message
...
Wilbur Hubbard wrote:

It's my observation that people who have to have a phone so they can
blabbermouth 24/7 while out cruising should just stay home. If you
need to be plugged in to the communications grid 24/7 you're not cut
out for cruising - just stay home and leave the waterways open for
real cruisers, please. Today's men are turning into girly men. Bunch
of sissies. Spend the money on a EPIRB instead. Cruise and try
shutting your mouth for a week or a month. You might learn something
for the first time in your life.

Why are you so bitter? When hundreds of miles off shore, I could have
liked to talk to my daughter who was anxious about my safety as I was
singlehanding a rather large sailboat. It would have been something to
make her feel better.

I tried calling her on my EPIRB but the thing just blinked at me.

-paul

I'm not bitter I'm just fed up with the way people don't seem to be able
to prioritize these days. Why is it that fully half the people you see
walking down a sidewalk or shopping in a store or eating in a restaurant
or driving their automobile are having cell phone conversations. It's
not necessary to be doing so and it's dangerous and most of the time
it's rude.

If you're off cruising then enjoy cruising. If you can't enjoy an
activity without having to be talking on the phone 24/7 about it then
why are you really doing it? So, somebody is "anxious" about your
situation. Too bad! It's their way of thinking and their negativism.
Maybe if they weren't catered to 24/7 they might have a chance to
develop a more mature and realistic attitude. I was always taught that
no news is good news. I have found that old adage to be very accurate.

There are some things that people do like climbing a mountain, or
cruising far offshore or scuba diving where it's reasonable to expect
they will be out of touch with civilization. What makes people think
they are so important that everybody in the world must have instant
access to them and they to the world? Is it an ego problem or is it just
a bad habit? I think it's some of both.

Family and friends should allow a man some space and some freedom
without making him feel guilty about having to constantly keep in touch.
Having keeping in touch as a priority when you're way out on the ocean
somewhere cruising getting away from it all seems an unnecessary burden
to all parties concerned. How can anybody get away from it all while
taking it all with them?

Does anybody really know what it means to cruise or voyage anymore?

Wilbur Hubbard

Iridium
 

"Wilbur Hubbard" wrote in news:46b1165c
:


"Paul Cassel" wrote in message
...
Wilbur Hubbard wrote:

It's my observation that people who have to have a phone so they can
blabbermouth 24/7 while out cruising should just stay home. If you
need to be plugged in to the communications grid 24/7 you're not cut
out for cruising - just stay home and leave the waterways open for
real cruisers, please. Today's men are turning into girly men.
Bunch
of sissies. Spend the money on a EPIRB instead. Cruise and try
shutting your mouth for a week or a month. You might learn something
for the first time in your life.

Why are you so bitter? When hundreds of miles off shore, I could have
liked to talk to my daughter who was anxious about my safety as I was
singlehanding a rather large sailboat. It would have been something
to
make her feel better.

I tried calling her on my EPIRB but the thing just blinked at me.

-paul

I'm not bitter I'm just fed up with the way people don't seem to be
able
to prioritize these days. Why is it that fully half the people you see
walking down a sidewalk or shopping in a store or eating in a
restaurant
or driving their automobile are having cell phone conversations. It's
not necessary to be doing so and it's dangerous and most of the time
it's rude.

If you're off cruising then enjoy cruising. If you can't enjoy an
activity without having to be talking on the phone 24/7 about it then
why are you really doing it? So, somebody is "anxious" about your
situation. Too bad! It's their way of thinking and their negativism.
Maybe if they weren't catered to 24/7 they might have a chance to
develop a more mature and realistic attitude. I was always taught that
no news is good news. I have found that old adage to be very accurate.

There are some things that people do like climbing a mountain, or
cruising far offshore or scuba diving where it's reasonable to expect
they will be out of touch with civilization. What makes people think
they are so important that everybody in the world must have instant
access to them and they to the world? Is it an ego problem or is it
just
a bad habit? I think it's some of both.

Family and friends should allow a man some space and some freedom
without making him feel guilty about having to constantly keep in
touch.
Having keeping in touch as a priority when you're way out on the ocean
somewhere cruising getting away from it all seems an unnecessary
burden
to all parties concerned. How can anybody get away from it all while
taking it all with them?

Does anybody really know what it means to cruise or voyage anymore?

Wilbur Hubbard

Wilbur,

I think that you should understand that others don't share your view.
Up until this year we had an Iridium phone, which we used sparingly. On
a weekly basis we would talk to our parents for probably 5-10 minutes at
a time. When you have aging parents, it's important for them to hear
your voice and for you to hear the tenor of their voice. You can judge
a lot more from a voice conversation than you can from an e-mail.

There are also times when you NEED a reliable phone connection to
resolve a problem. You can't rely on e-mail. You need to discuss
issues with people and get them to do things in real time. One time I
needed to talk to someone to find out of some rollers on the top of the
mast would support my weight as my main halyard was jammed and I needed
to go up the mast while underway to un-jam it (I only have 1 main
halyard).

This year I had terrible issues trying to figure out how to ship a hose
into the Acklins Islands of the Bahamas for my watermaker. You would
have thought that I was inventing a whole new process and I had to rely
on my father to hold long, laborious conversations on what would appear
to be a simple matter.

Wilbur, you can cruise anyway that you want, but don't hold in distain
others who don't share your view. The same thing holds true of
politics. We probably don't share the same views, but that doesn't make
either of us wrong. We simply look at things differently. Have an open
mind and try to accept differing views.

-- Geoff
www.GeoffSchultz.org

Iridium
 

"Geoff Schultz" wrote in message
.. .
"Wilbur Hubbard" wrote in
news:46b1165c
:


"Paul Cassel" wrote in message
...
Wilbur Hubbard wrote:

It's my observation that people who have to have a phone so they
can
blabbermouth 24/7 while out cruising should just stay home. If you
need to be plugged in to the communications grid 24/7 you're not
cut
out for cruising - just stay home and leave the waterways open for
real cruisers, please. Today's men are turning into girly men.
Bunch
of sissies. Spend the money on a EPIRB instead. Cruise and try
shutting your mouth for a week or a month. You might learn
something
for the first time in your life.

Why are you so bitter? When hundreds of miles off shore, I could
have
liked to talk to my daughter who was anxious about my safety as I
was
singlehanding a rather large sailboat. It would have been something
to
make her feel better.

I tried calling her on my EPIRB but the thing just blinked at me.

-paul

I'm not bitter I'm just fed up with the way people don't seem to be
able
to prioritize these days. Why is it that fully half the people you
see
walking down a sidewalk or shopping in a store or eating in a
restaurant
or driving their automobile are having cell phone conversations. It's
not necessary to be doing so and it's dangerous and most of the time
it's rude.

If you're off cruising then enjoy cruising. If you can't enjoy an
activity without having to be talking on the phone 24/7 about it then
why are you really doing it? So, somebody is "anxious" about your
situation. Too bad! It's their way of thinking and their negativism.
Maybe if they weren't catered to 24/7 they might have a chance to
develop a more mature and realistic attitude. I was always taught
that
no news is good news. I have found that old adage to be very
accurate.

There are some things that people do like climbing a mountain, or
cruising far offshore or scuba diving where it's reasonable to expect
they will be out of touch with civilization. What makes people think
they are so important that everybody in the world must have instant
access to them and they to the world? Is it an ego problem or is it
just
a bad habit? I think it's some of both.

Family and friends should allow a man some space and some freedom
without making him feel guilty about having to constantly keep in
touch.
Having keeping in touch as a priority when you're way out on the
ocean
somewhere cruising getting away from it all seems an unnecessary
burden
to all parties concerned. How can anybody get away from it all while
taking it all with them?

Does anybody really know what it means to cruise or voyage anymore?

Wilbur Hubbard

Wilbur,

I think that you should understand that others don't share your view.
Up until this year we had an Iridium phone, which we used sparingly.
On
a weekly basis we would talk to our parents for probably 5-10 minutes
at
a time. When you have aging parents, it's important for them to hear
your voice and for you to hear the tenor of their voice. You can
judge
a lot more from a voice conversation than you can from an e-mail.



If it's that important to you then why are you willing to be so far away
from them?
What are your priorities. To cruise seems to be your first priority. So
cruise. If your priority is to comfort your aging parents, I'm sure they
would be much more comforted by seeing you and hearing your voice in
person and by a hug or two wouldn't they?

Your phone becomes a tool for you to abdicate your real responsiblities,
doesn't it? It makes you feel better about not being there for your
parents, doesn't it? You either care for your parents enough to be
there in person for them or you don't. Your telephone call comforts you
more than it comforts them.


There are also times when you NEED a reliable phone connection to
resolve a problem. You can't rely on e-mail. You need to discuss
issues with people and get them to do things in real time. One time I
needed to talk to someone to find out of some rollers on the top of
the
mast would support my weight as my main halyard was jammed and I
needed
to go up the mast while underway to un-jam it (I only have 1 main
halyard).

Sailing by committee. Oh yes, that's the way it's done today. That's the
way people these days think it should be done. What ever happened to
self-reliance, personal responsiblity and knowing your boat? You should
already know if the halyards and sheeves can hold your weight. You
should have installed mast steps beforehand oo you would not have to
wonder if relying on halyards was safe. But you didn't and you didn't
because your phone allows you to sail by committee. It allows you to be
uninformed. It allows you to be slothful. That's not sailing.


This year I had terrible issues trying to figure out how to ship a
hose
into the Acklins Islands of the Bahamas for my watermaker. You would
have thought that I was inventing a whole new process and I had to
rely
on my father to hold long, laborious conversations on what would
appear
to be a simple matter.

Any real sailor would have stocked spare hoses, filters, pump parts,
gaskets etc. before going offshore. The problem you had was BECAUSE you
rely on a phone. The phone causes you to not prepare. So you end up
using the phone to solve problems you should never have had to solve.


Wilbur, you can cruise anyway that you want, but don't hold in distain
others who don't share your view. The same thing holds true of
politics. We probably don't share the same views, but that doesn't
make
either of us wrong. We simply look at things differently. Have an
open
mind and try to accept differing views.

The disdain I hold others in is caused by their causing problems for me
and other real self-reliant sailors by their not taking sailing
seriously. They give sailing in general a bad name and make everybody
think sailors are just a bunch of lubberly dopes. Just waterbourne
accidents waiting to happen - an unwelcome pain in the arse. . .

If cruisers put as much time and effort into learning the right way to
sail or cruise under power and if they prepared properly they would not
be relying on a telephone to solve problems caused because they figured
they could get on the phone and holler for help. The phone becomes their
"out." Sooner or later this attitude will get you in real trouble.


Wilbur Hubbard

Iridium
 

On Aug 1, 3:52 pm, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:
....
The disdain I hold others in is caused by their causing problems for me
and other real self-reliant sailors by their not taking sailing
seriously. ...

You want to explain exactly how it causes you a problem when I phone
my old dad from a remote Pacific Atoll to see if he's ok? I'm selfish
enough that I'd go cruising even if it meant that I couldn't call
home, but since I can why shouldn't I?

-- Tom.

Iridium
 

wrote in message
ups.com...
On Aug 1, 3:52 pm, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:
...
The disdain I hold others in is caused by their causing problems for
me
and other real self-reliant sailors by their not taking sailing
seriously. ...

You want to explain exactly how it causes you a problem when I phone
my old dad from a remote Pacific Atoll to see if he's ok? I'm selfish
enough that I'd go cruising even if it meant that I couldn't call
home, but since I can why shouldn't I?

-- Tom.

You can do what pleases you. My point is something my dear old Dad
taught me before he died. He told me that if you try doing two things at
one time you'll end up doing neither well. So you can cruise and you can
telephone. But it's not the same as doing one or the other and doing it
well.

Wilbur Hubbard

Iridium
 

"Geoff Schultz" wrote in message
.. .
Wilbur, you can cruise anyway that you want, but don't hold in distain
others who don't share your view. The same thing holds true of
politics. We probably don't share the same views, but that doesn't make
either of us wrong. We simply look at things differently. Have an open
mind and try to accept differing views.

-- Geoff
www.GeoffSchultz.org

Silly Geoff -- Wilbur doesn't cruise. lol

Iridium
 

... So you can cruise and you can
telephone. But it's not the same as doing one or the other and doing it
well. ...

I'm not sure I follow. Are you saying that I'm cruising less well
when, lets say, just for the sake of historical accuracy, I'm anchor
down in Kanton Atoll on a day when it's so calm I can't tell where the
air ends and the water starts and so hot that even the flies have
taken cover in the shade I call my father on my Iridium phone? Are
you telling me that this offends you in some way? Do we need to be
reduced to sail cloth pants and latitude sailing to be cruising
"well"?

-- Tom.

Iridium
 

"KLC Lewis" wrote in news:comdneOZbO9-
:


"Geoff Schultz" wrote in message
.. .
Wilbur, you can cruise anyway that you want, but don't hold in distain
others who don't share your view. The same thing holds true of
politics. We probably don't share the same views, but that doesn't make
either of us wrong. We simply look at things differently. Have an open
mind and try to accept differing views.

-- Geoff
www.GeoffSchultz.org

Silly Geoff -- Wilbur doesn't cruise. lol

You're so obviously right. I'm sorry that I got sucked into his ranting.

-- Geoff
www.GeoffSchultz.org

Iridium
 

Wilbur Hubbard wrote:

"Rusty" blank wrote in message
. ..
I think it's time to get an Iridium satellite phone. We're gong to
have way
too much time away from cell sites.

Any suggestions as to a cruiser-friendly source of hardware and airtime?

Thanks,
Rusty


It's my observation that people who have to have a phone so they can
blabbermouth 24/7 while out cruising should just stay home. If you need
to be plugged in to the communications grid 24/7 you're not cut out for
cruising - just stay home and leave the waterways open for real
cruisers, please. Today's men are turning into girly men. Bunch of
sissies. Spend the money on a EPIRB instead. Cruise and try shutting
your mouth for a week or a month. You might learn something for the
first time in your life.

Wilbur Hubbard

Folks,

Don't feed the troll. Clearly this guy isn't worth your time.

Just kill file him or filter him out.

Evan

Iridium
 

"Paul Cassel" wrote in message
...
Wilbur Hubbard wrote:

It's my observation that people who have to have a phone so they can
blabbermouth 24/7 while out cruising should just stay home. If you need
to be plugged in to the communications grid 24/7 you're not cut out for
cruising - just stay home and leave the waterways open for real cruisers,
please. Today's men are turning into girly men. Bunch of sissies. Spend
the money on a EPIRB instead. Cruise and try shutting your mouth for a
week or a month. You might learn something for the first time in your
life.

Why are you so bitter? When hundreds of miles off shore, I could have
liked to talk to my daughter who was anxious about my safety as I was
singlehanding a rather large sailboat. It would have been something to
make her feel better.

I tried calling her on my EPIRB but the thing just blinked at me.

-paul


He's a bitter, angry guy. He has no life, no money, and he certainly
couldn't afford a sat phone.


--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Iridium
 

"Geoff Schultz" wrote in message
.. .
"Wilbur Hubbard" wrote in news:46b1165c
:


"Paul Cassel" wrote in message
...
Wilbur Hubbard wrote:

It's my observation that people who have to have a phone so they can
blabbermouth 24/7 while out cruising should just stay home. If you
need to be plugged in to the communications grid 24/7 you're not cut
out for cruising - just stay home and leave the waterways open for
real cruisers, please. Today's men are turning into girly men.
Bunch
of sissies. Spend the money on a EPIRB instead. Cruise and try
shutting your mouth for a week or a month. You might learn something
for the first time in your life.

Why are you so bitter? When hundreds of miles off shore, I could have
liked to talk to my daughter who was anxious about my safety as I was
singlehanding a rather large sailboat. It would have been something
to
make her feel better.

I tried calling her on my EPIRB but the thing just blinked at me.

-paul

I'm not bitter I'm just fed up with the way people don't seem to be
able
to prioritize these days. Why is it that fully half the people you see
walking down a sidewalk or shopping in a store or eating in a
restaurant
or driving their automobile are having cell phone conversations. It's
not necessary to be doing so and it's dangerous and most of the time
it's rude.

If you're off cruising then enjoy cruising. If you can't enjoy an
activity without having to be talking on the phone 24/7 about it then
why are you really doing it? So, somebody is "anxious" about your
situation. Too bad! It's their way of thinking and their negativism.
Maybe if they weren't catered to 24/7 they might have a chance to
develop a more mature and realistic attitude. I was always taught that
no news is good news. I have found that old adage to be very accurate.

There are some things that people do like climbing a mountain, or
cruising far offshore or scuba diving where it's reasonable to expect
they will be out of touch with civilization. What makes people think
they are so important that everybody in the world must have instant
access to them and they to the world? Is it an ego problem or is it
just
a bad habit? I think it's some of both.

Family and friends should allow a man some space and some freedom
without making him feel guilty about having to constantly keep in
touch.
Having keeping in touch as a priority when you're way out on the ocean
somewhere cruising getting away from it all seems an unnecessary
burden
to all parties concerned. How can anybody get away from it all while
taking it all with them?

Does anybody really know what it means to cruise or voyage anymore?

Wilbur Hubbard

Wilbur,

I think that you should understand that others don't share your view.
Up until this year we had an Iridium phone, which we used sparingly. On
a weekly basis we would talk to our parents for probably 5-10 minutes at
a time. When you have aging parents, it's important for them to hear
your voice and for you to hear the tenor of their voice. You can judge
a lot more from a voice conversation than you can from an e-mail.

There are also times when you NEED a reliable phone connection to
resolve a problem. You can't rely on e-mail. You need to discuss
issues with people and get them to do things in real time. One time I
needed to talk to someone to find out of some rollers on the top of the
mast would support my weight as my main halyard was jammed and I needed
to go up the mast while underway to un-jam it (I only have 1 main
halyard).

This year I had terrible issues trying to figure out how to ship a hose
into the Acklins Islands of the Bahamas for my watermaker. You would
have thought that I was inventing a whole new process and I had to rely
on my father to hold long, laborious conversations on what would appear
to be a simple matter.

Wilbur, you can cruise anyway that you want, but don't hold in distain
others who don't share your view. The same thing holds true of
politics. We probably don't share the same views, but that doesn't make
either of us wrong. We simply look at things differently. Have an open
mind and try to accept differing views.

-- Geoff
www.GeoffSchultz.org


His real name is Neal Warren. He's not interested in a serious discussion.
He's only interested in putting down whatever and whomever gets in his way.
He should be pitied.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Iridium
 

On Wed, 1 Aug 2007 15:48:32 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:


"Rusty" blank wrote in message
...
I think it's time to get an Iridium satellite phone. We're gong to have
way
too much time away from cell sites.

Any suggestions as to a cruiser-friendly source of hardware and
airtime?

Thanks,
Rusty


It's my observation that people who have to have a phone so they can
blabbermouth 24/7 while out cruising should just stay home. If you need
to be plugged in to the communications grid 24/7 you're not cut out for
cruising - just stay home and leave the waterways open for real
cruisers, please. Today's men are turning into girly men. Bunch of
sissies. Spend the money on a EPIRB instead. Cruise and try shutting
your mouth for a week or a month. You might learn something for the
first time in your life.

Wilbur Hubbard


Wilbur,

While I realize that weather is of little interest to you on your
trailer-sailer anchored in your snug little Bayou but to people out
there on the water it is one of their primary concerns and there are
three basic ways to get weather reports once you're out of sight of
land (1) H.F. radio, (2) Iridium phone or (3) satellite (immersat, for
example).

I've done cost comparisons and going from nothing to a complete
installation is cheaper using Iridium so more and more cruisers are
opting for Iridium as weather reports through Iridium can be received
24 hours a day while H.F. is greatly dependent upon daily propagation
variations.

As you say, " try shutting your mouth for a week or a month. You might
learn something for the first time in your life."

..








Bruce in Bangkok
(brucepaigeATgmailDOTcom)

Iridium
 

On Aug 1, 4:26 pm, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:
"Paul Cassel" wrote in message

There are some things that people do like climbing a mountain, or
cruising far offshore or scuba diving where it's reasonable to expect
they will be out of touch with civilization.

Sorry to tell yo but only girly men use tanks (as in sports scuba).
The only manly path to the under world is Free Diving. Just water,
god, and the air in your lungs..... I also prefer to drink alone and
eat my fish raw. Argggg! But let me tell ya right now. Hve a new epirb
and going to get an Irridium phone. Hell, it use to be $10 bucks a
min. Ive seen poor saps whine a pay check away ytalkig to their
girlfriends at sea. Sad..............
Basalt Bob


Does anybody really know what it means to cruise or voyage anymore?

Wilbur Hubbard- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Iridium
 

On Aug 1, 7:29 pm, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

You can do what pleases you. My point is something my dear old Dad
taught me before he died. He told me that if you try doing two things at
one time you'll end up doing neither well. So you can cruise and you can
telephone. But it's not the same as doing one or the other and doing it
well.

Wilbur Hubbard

Got to agree. Worse thaing that can happen to a man at sea is know
what is going on back on the beach. Once had a buddy who got a dear
jon letter at sea. He had another 60 days left befor the boat was
heading back. He was a walking xombie. Nearly killed a guy and later
himself cause he was day dreamming of some fuffy muffy. All he could
think about was that muffy back home with some Jody.
Bob

Iridium
 

On Wed, 1 Aug 2007 21:52:28 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:


"Geoff Schultz" wrote in message
. ..
"Wilbur Hubbard" wrote in
news:46b1165c
:


"Paul Cassel" wrote in message
...
Wilbur Hubbard wrote:
Much extraneous matter snipped


There are also times when you NEED a reliable phone connection to
resolve a problem. You can't rely on e-mail. You need to discuss
issues with people and get them to do things in real time. One time I
needed to talk to someone to find out of some rollers on the top of
the
mast would support my weight as my main halyard was jammed and I
needed
to go up the mast while underway to un-jam it (I only have 1 main
halyard).

Sailing by committee. Oh yes, that's the way it's done today. That's the
way people these days think it should be done. What ever happened to
self-reliance, personal responsiblity and knowing your boat? You should
already know if the halyards and sheeves can hold your weight. You
should have installed mast steps beforehand oo you would not have to
wonder if relying on halyards was safe. But you didn't and you didn't
because your phone allows you to sail by committee. It allows you to be
uninformed. It allows you to be slothful. That's not sailing.


Wilbur Hubbard

Wilbur, you just to get another boat! Or at least hang around a bigger
boat for a day. I'm sure that when you are sitting on that overgrown
dinghy with no amenities and a 9.9 H.P gasoline outboard as your only
power source you might be deluded into thinking that you can fix
anything that breaks but if you were ever on a real boat you'd find
that you were woefully ignorant of how things work.

In the example cited above, if you are going to depend on a rope to
hold you some 50 or 60 feet in the air you certainly should be aware
of whether it is going to hold, or not. Watch any professional rigger
get ready to make a climb -- watch them check the safety rope foot by
foot.

And, mast steps? Have you got mast steps on that trailer-sailer you
have lived on for 20 years? What a waste. A real sailor would just
grab the shrouds and climb the mast - don't even try to say this can't
be done because I watched a Frenchman do it in the Singapore Straits.
A 25 ft. boat and up the mast he went, no steps, no ropes, just
reached out and grabbed the shrouds and up he went.

Wilbur, old boy, if you are going to talk the talk you got to walk the
walk. No more sitting in the bayou there, you got to get out here on
the water with the rest of us.


Bruce in Bangkok
(brucepaigeATgmailDOTcom)

Iridium
 

On Wed, 1 Aug 2007 22:29:52 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:


wrote in message
oups.com...
On Aug 1, 3:52 pm, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:
...
The disdain I hold others in is caused by their causing problems for
me
and other real self-reliant sailors by their not taking sailing
seriously. ...

You want to explain exactly how it causes you a problem when I phone
my old dad from a remote Pacific Atoll to see if he's ok? I'm selfish
enough that I'd go cruising even if it meant that I couldn't call
home, but since I can why shouldn't I?

-- Tom.

You can do what pleases you. My point is something my dear old Dad
taught me before he died. He told me that if you try doing two things at
one time you'll end up doing neither well. So you can cruise and you can
telephone. But it's not the same as doing one or the other and doing it
well.

Wilbur Hubbard


In other words, you can't walk and chew gum at the same time?

Well, I don't suppose you can.

Bruce in Bangkok
(brucepaigeATgmailDOTcom)

Iridium
 

On Wed, 01 Aug 2007 19:47:43 -0700, "
wrote:

... So you can cruise and you can
telephone. But it's not the same as doing one or the other and doing it
well. ...

I'm not sure I follow. Are you saying that I'm cruising less well
when, lets say, just for the sake of historical accuracy, I'm anchor
down in Kanton Atoll on a day when it's so calm I can't tell where the
air ends and the water starts and so hot that even the flies have
taken cover in the shade I call my father on my Iridium phone? Are
you telling me that this offends you in some way? Do we need to be
reduced to sail cloth pants and latitude sailing to be cruising
"well"?

-- Tom.


Of course it offends him. He's sitting in a trailer-sailer where he
has lived for the past 20 years and nobody will talk to him on the
phone..


Bruce in Bangkok
(brucepaigeATgmailDOTcom)

Iridium
 

Wilbur Hubbard wrote:


I'm not bitter I'm just fed up with the way people don't seem to be able
to prioritize these days. Why is it that fully half the people you see
walking down a sidewalk or shopping in a store or eating in a restaurant
or driving their automobile are having cell phone conversations. It's
not necessary to be doing so and it's dangerous and most of the time
it's rude.

If you're off cruising then enjoy cruising. If you can't enjoy an
activity without having to be talking on the phone 24/7 about it then
why are you really doing it? So, somebody is "anxious" about your
situation. Too bad! It's their way of thinking and their negativism.
Maybe if they weren't catered to 24/7 they might have a chance to
develop a more mature and realistic attitude. I was always taught that
no news is good news. I have found that old adage to be very accurate.

There are some things that people do like climbing a mountain, or
cruising far offshore or scuba diving where it's reasonable to expect
they will be out of touch with civilization. What makes people think
they are so important that everybody in the world must have instant
access to them and they to the world? Is it an ego problem or is it just
a bad habit? I think it's some of both.

Family and friends should allow a man some space and some freedom
without making him feel guilty about having to constantly keep in touch.
Having keeping in touch as a priority when you're way out on the ocean
somewhere cruising getting away from it all seems an unnecessary burden
to all parties concerned. How can anybody get away from it all while
taking it all with them?

Does anybody really know what it means to cruise or voyage anymore?


No argument except I think you are taking this to an extreme. I lived
aboard and sailed for 6 years with nothing at all in communications. I
didn't even have a VHF 'ship to shore'. That was ok.

I used to joke with my (now late) wife that those guys who had CB's were
hoping to get the traffic reports from truckers - or why else did they
have them? I thought it silly.

However, today we have new tech. If I were to sail again far offshore
like I did singlehanded in 2002-2003, I'd like to be able to call my
daughter and tell her things were ok with me. She was very anxious with
me offshore last time. I call to make myself feel better about her
anxiety at my being offshore. It's not like a 14 year old girl can 'give
me space' or I should expect it from her.

This does not mean that I'd be chatting continually with her or anybody
or that I'd scream for help if a seacock developed a seep. In fact, I
don't see rescue at sea as something which would occur no matter what
electronics I have. I don't see the Navy or whatever having enough
interest in me to do anything.

Being on a cruise and continually chatting with folks on shore about
what their TV stars are up to is one thing. Just being able to call my
daughter, if I see fit to, once a week or so, is another thing.

Can't you see there is a distinction?

-paul

Iridium
 

wrote in message
oups.com...
... So you can cruise and you can
telephone. But it's not the same as doing one or the other and doing
it
well. ...

I'm not sure I follow. Are you saying that I'm cruising less well
when, lets say, just for the sake of historical accuracy, I'm anchor
down in Kanton Atoll on a day when it's so calm I can't tell where the
air ends and the water starts and so hot that even the flies have
taken cover in the shade I call my father on my Iridium phone? Are
you telling me that this offends you in some way? Do we need to be
reduced to sail cloth pants and latitude sailing to be cruising
"well"?

-- Tom.

As long as you aren't doing sailing and telephoning -at the same time-
it doesn't offend me. What offends me is people doing both, trying to do
both, at the same time and sooner or later that's what it amounts to. I
don't want people answering their telephones when they're at the helm of
their boats. It's as bad as doing so while driving a car and sooner or
later those who carry cell phones with them in their cars end up using
them when they're driving.

And sooner or later your phone will make you lazy and inept just like
the poor fella further up this thread who couldn't even figure out how
to get up the mast without making telephone calls and asking people how
to do it safely. That's pretty disgusting in my humble opinion. People
like him, when they get their friends advice about going up the mast,
and then they manage to fall off will likely crawl to their cell phone,
dial up their lawyer and enquire as to how to sue their friends for
giving bad advice. That's how the world works in most cases these days
and telephones are the cause of all the idiocy in many cases. Simply
stated your cell phone allows you to discharge your responsibilities in
rude, obnoxious, and selfish ways. Instead of planning and being
prepared you end up acting on a whim, reacting and being totally
unprepared. "I'm not worried about taking personal responsibility for my
ship. If something goes wrong, I'll just telephone my way out of." So
stupid. I heard a 911 recording of a woman being stabbed to death. It
was horrible but it demonstrates my point. WTF's the woman doing calling
911 when she's being stabbed to death? Maybe she should have not relied
on her phone to pull her fat out of the fire. Maybe she should have
installed bolts on her door, maybe she should have bought a gun and
learned how to use it. Maybe she should have learned karate. Noooo,
instead she relied an the phone and lost her life because of it. What
you're doing is the same thing just to a lesser degree.

And think about this, when you call your dear old dad under the
conditions you describe it's probably the middle of the night in his
part of the world. Pretty rude getting him out of bed because you called
because you had nothing better to do, isn't it? I'll say it again. Cell
phones are the instrument of the selfish, the arrogant, the
world-revolves-around-me type. That's how I see it at least. Lose the
friggin' telephone when you're cruising. Do cruising right. Do it
traditionally. You're cruising to get away from it all. Why take it all
with you? Probably because you're afraid to admit to yourself the world
ACTUALLY CAN get along without you quite easily...

Wilbur Hubbard

Iridium
 

wrote in message
...
On Wed, 1 Aug 2007 22:29:52 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:


wrote in message
roups.com...
On Aug 1, 3:52 pm, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:
...
The disdain I hold others in is caused by their causing problems
for
me
and other real self-reliant sailors by their not taking sailing
seriously. ...

You want to explain exactly how it causes you a problem when I phone
my old dad from a remote Pacific Atoll to see if he's ok? I'm
selfish
enough that I'd go cruising even if it meant that I couldn't call
home, but since I can why shouldn't I?

-- Tom.

You can do what pleases you. My point is something my dear old Dad
taught me before he died. He told me that if you try doing two things
at
one time you'll end up doing neither well. So you can cruise and you
can
telephone. But it's not the same as doing one or the other and doing
it
well.

Wilbur Hubbard


In other words, you can't walk and chew gum at the same time?

Well, I don't suppose you can.

Bruce in Bangkok
(brucepaigeATgmailDOTcom)

Words of wisdom from somebody who claims to be a world cruiser but who
spends all his time stuck in a marina and on the Internet 24/7. Did you
know, Bruce, that you're stuck in a marina in a part of the world most
cruisers say is one of the better cruising grounds. Why aren't you out
cruising? Seeing the sights by water? And, don't give me this monsoon
crap!

Wilbur Hubbard

Iridium
 

"Bob" wrote in message
oups.com...
On Aug 1, 4:26 pm, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:
"Paul Cassel" wrote in message

There are some things that people do like climbing a mountain, or
cruising far offshore or scuba diving where it's reasonable to expect
they will be out of touch with civilization.

Sorry to tell yo but only girly men use tanks (as in sports scuba).
The only manly path to the under world is Free Diving. Just water,
god, and the air in your lungs..... I also prefer to drink alone and
eat my fish raw. Argggg! But let me tell ya right now. Hve a new epirb
and going to get an Irridium phone. Hell, it use to be $10 bucks a
min. Ive seen poor saps whine a pay check away ytalkig to their
girlfriends at sea. Sad..............
Basalt Bob


AGREED! Men who spend a lot of time on the phone are girly-men! The
only legitimate use for telephone when used by men is for business
purposes. A man gossiping on the telephone is no man...

Wilbur Hubbard




Does anybody really know what it means to cruise or voyage anymore?

Wilbur Hubbard- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Iridium
 

"Paul Cassel" wrote in message
. ..
Wilbur Hubbard wrote:


I'm not bitter I'm just fed up with the way people don't seem to be
able to prioritize these days. Why is it that fully half the people
you see walking down a sidewalk or shopping in a store or eating in a
restaurant or driving their automobile are having cell phone
conversations. It's not necessary to be doing so and it's dangerous
and most of the time it's rude.

If you're off cruising then enjoy cruising. If you can't enjoy an
activity without having to be talking on the phone 24/7 about it then
why are you really doing it? So, somebody is "anxious" about your
situation. Too bad! It's their way of thinking and their negativism.
Maybe if they weren't catered to 24/7 they might have a chance to
develop a more mature and realistic attitude. I was always taught
that no news is good news. I have found that old adage to be very
accurate.

There are some things that people do like climbing a mountain, or
cruising far offshore or scuba diving where it's reasonable to expect
they will be out of touch with civilization. What makes people think
they are so important that everybody in the world must have instant
access to them and they to the world? Is it an ego problem or is it
just a bad habit? I think it's some of both.

Family and friends should allow a man some space and some freedom
without making him feel guilty about having to constantly keep in
touch. Having keeping in touch as a priority when you're way out on
the ocean somewhere cruising getting away from it all seems an
unnecessary burden to all parties concerned. How can anybody get away
from it all while taking it all with them?

Does anybody really know what it means to cruise or voyage anymore?


No argument except I think you are taking this to an extreme. I lived
aboard and sailed for 6 years with nothing at all in communications. I
didn't even have a VHF 'ship to shore'. That was ok.

I used to joke with my (now late) wife that those guys who had CB's
were hoping to get the traffic reports from truckers - or why else did
they have them? I thought it silly.

However, today we have new tech. If I were to sail again far offshore
like I did singlehanded in 2002-2003, I'd like to be able to call my
daughter and tell her things were ok with me. She was very anxious
with me offshore last time. I call to make myself feel better about
her anxiety at my being offshore. It's not like a 14 year old girl can
'give me space' or I should expect it from her.

This does not mean that I'd be chatting continually with her or
anybody or that I'd scream for help if a seacock developed a seep. In
fact, I don't see rescue at sea as something which would occur no
matter what electronics I have. I don't see the Navy or whatever
having enough interest in me to do anything.

Being on a cruise and continually chatting with folks on shore about
what their TV stars are up to is one thing. Just being able to call my
daughter, if I see fit to, once a week or so, is another thing.

Can't you see there is a distinction?

-paul

I can't see the distinction. In my opinion, my relatives just have to
accept the fact that I'll be out of touch. I will not enable them to be
worrywarts every time they don't get a daily or weekly telephone call.
That's not the real world and my relatives must accept the fact I live
in the real world even if they choose to live in a technological fantasy
land.

Just once, I'd like to hear another man saying something like this: "I
call my (relative or loved ones) more because it makes ME feel more
secure and necessary than because it makes them less anxious."

Go ahead, be honest. Admit you're doing it mostly for YOU. Don't try to
beat around the bush and couch it in terms of easing somebody else's
mind. That's a cop-out and you know it.

Wilbur Hubbard

Iridium
 

wrote in message
...
On Wed, 1 Aug 2007 15:48:32 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:


"Rusty" blank wrote in message
m...
I think it's time to get an Iridium satellite phone. We're gong to
have
way
too much time away from cell sites.

Any suggestions as to a cruiser-friendly source of hardware and
airtime?

Thanks,
Rusty


It's my observation that people who have to have a phone so they can
blabbermouth 24/7 while out cruising should just stay home. If you
need
to be plugged in to the communications grid 24/7 you're not cut out
for
cruising - just stay home and leave the waterways open for real
cruisers, please. Today's men are turning into girly men. Bunch of
sissies. Spend the money on a EPIRB instead. Cruise and try shutting
your mouth for a week or a month. You might learn something for the
first time in your life.

Wilbur Hubbard


Wilbur,

While I realize that weather is of little interest to you on your
trailer-sailer anchored in your snug little Bayou but to people out
there on the water it is one of their primary concerns and there are
three basic ways to get weather reports once you're out of sight of
land (1) H.F. radio, (2) Iridium phone or (3) satellite (immersat, for
example).

I've done cost comparisons and going from nothing to a complete
installation is cheaper using Iridium so more and more cruisers are
opting for Iridium as weather reports through Iridium can be received
24 hours a day while H.F. is greatly dependent upon daily propagation
variations.

As you say, " try shutting your mouth for a week or a month. You might
learn something for the first time in your life."


Correction, there is a fourth and more reliable way of getting weather
reports. That's knowing how to look at the glass and the sky and being
able to interpret what they tell you for your part of the world. How do
you think sailors got around before your exclusive reliance on
technology?

Your little do-it-like-a-lubber screed simply reinforces my opinion that
you're no sailor.
But, then again, anybody who has good opportunity to do coastal cruising
in your part of the world, (considered premiere cruising grounds) but
instead sits in a marina on the Internet probably won't ever understand
that.

Wilbur Hubbard

Iridium
 

wrote in message
...
On Wed, 1 Aug 2007 21:52:28 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:


"Geoff Schultz" wrote in message
...
"Wilbur Hubbard" wrote in
news:46b1165c
:


"Paul Cassel" wrote in message
...
Wilbur Hubbard wrote:
Much extraneous matter snipped


There are also times when you NEED a reliable phone connection to
resolve a problem. You can't rely on e-mail. You need to discuss
issues with people and get them to do things in real time. One time
I
needed to talk to someone to find out of some rollers on the top of
the
mast would support my weight as my main halyard was jammed and I
needed
to go up the mast while underway to un-jam it (I only have 1 main
halyard).

Sailing by committee. Oh yes, that's the way it's done today. That's
the
way people these days think it should be done. What ever happened to
self-reliance, personal responsiblity and knowing your boat? You
should
already know if the halyards and sheeves can hold your weight. You
should have installed mast steps beforehand oo you would not have to
wonder if relying on halyards was safe. But you didn't and you didn't
because your phone allows you to sail by committee. It allows you to
be
uninformed. It allows you to be slothful. That's not sailing.


Wilbur Hubbard

Wilbur, you just to get another boat! Or at least hang around a bigger
boat for a day. I'm sure that when you are sitting on that overgrown
dinghy with no amenities and a 9.9 H.P gasoline outboard as your only
power source you might be deluded into thinking that you can fix
anything that breaks but if you were ever on a real boat you'd find
that you were woefully ignorant of how things work.

In the example cited above, if you are going to depend on a rope to
hold you some 50 or 60 feet in the air you certainly should be aware
of whether it is going to hold, or not. Watch any professional rigger
get ready to make a climb -- watch them check the safety rope foot by
foot.

And, mast steps? Have you got mast steps on that trailer-sailer you
have lived on for 20 years? What a waste. A real sailor would just
grab the shrouds and climb the mast - don't even try to say this can't
be done because I watched a Frenchman do it in the Singapore Straits.
A 25 ft. boat and up the mast he went, no steps, no ropes, just
reached out and grabbed the shrouds and up he went.

Wilbur, old boy, if you are going to talk the talk you got to walk the
walk. No more sitting in the bayou there, you got to get out here on
the water with the rest of us.

Sorry, but I won't be joining you "on the water" as I don't believe in
being tied up in a slip in a marina. . . I'd just as soon rent a
single-wide in a low rent trailer park!

I just keep cruising and anchoring out, thank you.

Wilbur Hubbard

Iridium
 

"Wilbur Hubbard" wrote in
anews.com:


wrote in message
oups.com...
... So you can cruise and you can
telephone. But it's not the same as doing one or the other and doing
it
well. ...

I'm not sure I follow. Are you saying that I'm cruising less well
when, lets say, just for the sake of historical accuracy, I'm anchor
down in Kanton Atoll on a day when it's so calm I can't tell where
the air ends and the water starts and so hot that even the flies have
taken cover in the shade I call my father on my Iridium phone? Are
you telling me that this offends you in some way? Do we need to be
reduced to sail cloth pants and latitude sailing to be cruising
"well"?

-- Tom.


And sooner or later your phone will make you lazy and inept just like
the poor fella further up this thread who couldn't even figure out how
to get up the mast without making telephone calls and asking people
how to do it safely. That's pretty disgusting in my humble opinion.
People like him, when they get their friends advice about going up the
mast, and then they manage to fall off will likely crawl to their cell
phone, dial up their lawyer and enquire as to how to sue their friends
for giving bad advice.


Ocne again you're making assumptions about things that you know nothing
about. In this case I was calling someone who used to work for Freedom
to ask what the load rating was for the flag halyard rollers. As it
turns out, the rollers designed to support a person. I wasn't about to
go up the mast while underway without checking. It sounds like you
would have goen up as you wouldn't have had any other option. I did and
I took it.

You act like I know nothing about sailing. I typically spend 6-7 months
a year sailing and I've logged over 30,000 miles. I believe that know a
lot about my boat and sailing. Check my web site if you have any doubt.

You're just an arrogant SOB who thinks that everyone should do things
your way. Based upon your discourse in this and other threads, I'm very
glad that most of the world isn't like you. I suggest that you go back
to alt.sailing.asa where you're quite prolific and the people in that
group enjoy bashing one another.

-- Geoff
www.GeoffSchultz.org

P.S. In one thread you said

In my opinion, my relatives just have to accept the fact that I'll be
out of touch. I will not enable them to be worrywarts every time they
don't get a daily or weekly telephone call.

Did you ever consider that they don't want to hear from you if you act
this way towards them?

Iridium
 

First of all, thanks to Tom for his response to my question.

Second, empathy is a human quality that allows one to place themselves in
anothers shoes and try to understand their viewpoint. What is 'Right' for
one person is not the same as it is for another. Those with the human
quality of empathy understand that. I must conclude Wilbur is something less
than human.

Third. This sure is entertaining!

Thanks
Rusty

Iridium
 

On Aug 2, 11:08 am, "Rusty" blank wrote:
First of all, thanks to Tom for his response to my question.

Second, empathy is a human quality that allows one to place themselves in
anothers shoes and try to understand their viewpoint.


TO do that interpersonal communication is needed and leads many times
on one concept: Uncertanty Reduction.
Whech means you get to know about the oter person. ANd many times my
worse fewrs are confirmed......... they are idots and girly men.

What is 'Right' for
one person is not the same as it is for another.

There ur wrong. There are crtain things that are simply dangerous or
wrong. your staring to sound like a cultural antropologist.

Those with the human
quality of empathy understand that. I must conclude Wilbur is something less
than human.

Third. This sure is entertaining!


Regarding who is the most qualified to sail.........................
unless some one here can step up and show me their OICNW indorsment on
their 500 ton license id say we are all rather luberly. Me included.
But mabe in another 360 days of deck service and 21 weeks of class. :)

Bob


Thanks
Rusty

Iridium
 

"Bob" wrote in message
ups.com...
On Aug 2, 11:08 am, "Rusty" blank wrote:
First of all, thanks to Tom for his response to my question.

Second, empathy is a human quality that allows one to place
themselves in
anothers shoes and try to understand their viewpoint.


TO do that interpersonal communication is needed and leads many times
on one concept: Uncertanty Reduction.
Whech means you get to know about the oter person. ANd many times my
worse fewrs are confirmed......... they are idots and girly men.

What is 'Right' for
one person is not the same as it is for another.

There ur wrong. There are crtain things that are simply dangerous or
wrong. your staring to sound like a cultural antropologist.

Those with the human
quality of empathy understand that. I must conclude Wilbur is
something less
than human.

Third. This sure is entertaining!


Regarding who is the most qualified to sail.........................
unless some one here can step up and show me their OICNW indorsment on
their 500 ton license id say we are all rather luberly. Me included.
But mabe in another 360 days of deck service and 21 weeks of class. :)

Bob


Thanks
Rusty


How about a Master Mariner license instead?

http://captneal.homestead.com/files/mastermariner.jpg

I'd say that says it all . . . My mentor, the World Famous Captain Neal.

Wilbur Hubbard

Iridium
 

Wilbur Hubbard wrote:


Go ahead, be honest. Admit you're doing it mostly for YOU. Don't try to
beat around the bush and couch it in terms of easing somebody else's
mind. That's a cop-out and you know it.


Admit what's not true? Hardly. I spent weeks offshore singlehanding in
perfect comfort mentally if not physically. If you mean a double back
slash something or other that I want to call my daughter to make her
feel better because that way I feel better, ok, that's true. In the same
way I give flowers to my wife (I'm remarried) to make her feel better
but when I please her, I feel good about that.

My daughter was anxious when I went offshore a few years ago. She said
so before I left and after I returned. My idea of a good time isn't
making her unhappy. She's my daughter - do you have one? If you do, you
surely understand what I'm driving at.

-paul

Iridium
 

"Paul Cassel" wrote in message
...
Wilbur Hubbard wrote:


Go ahead, be honest. Admit you're doing it mostly for YOU. Don't try
to beat around the bush and couch it in terms of easing somebody
else's mind. That's a cop-out and you know it.


Admit what's not true? Hardly. I spent weeks offshore singlehanding in
perfect comfort mentally if not physically. If you mean a double back
slash something or other that I want to call my daughter to make her
feel better because that way I feel better, ok, that's true. In the
same way I give flowers to my wife (I'm remarried) to make her feel
better but when I please her, I feel good about that.

My daughter was anxious when I went offshore a few years ago. She said
so before I left and after I returned. My idea of a good time isn't
making her unhappy. She's my daughter - do you have one? If you do,
you surely understand what I'm driving at.

-paul

I understand because you're more like most of the people these days. But
that doesn't make it right or even productive.

Your daughter points out the difference in our outlooks. While your
daughter was anxious about your well-being mine just said, "Have fun,
Daddy, and be careful. I'll see you when you get back."

You raised your daughter to be just like her Dad - a dependent person
who worries. I raised mine to be just like me - an independent person
who doesn't worry. She's somebody who is secure and happy and does not
derive her happiness from an old man and I wouldn't have her any other
way . . .

Look at it this way. When you die your poor daughter will be
grief-stricken and lost while mine will say in her mind, "Fair winds,
Daddy, wherever you may be sailing now. It was good knowing you and I
will always love you for raising me to appreciate the way the world
works and to enjoy the positive and to reject the negative."

Wilbur Hubbard

Iridium
 

On Thu, 2 Aug 2007 12:16:58 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:


wrote in message
.. .
On Wed, 1 Aug 2007 22:29:52 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:


wrote in message
groups.com...
On Aug 1, 3:52 pm, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:
...
The disdain I hold others in is caused by their causing problems
for
me
and other real self-reliant sailors by their not taking sailing
seriously. ...

You want to explain exactly how it causes you a problem when I phone
my old dad from a remote Pacific Atoll to see if he's ok? I'm
selfish
enough that I'd go cruising even if it meant that I couldn't call
home, but since I can why shouldn't I?

-- Tom.

You can do what pleases you. My point is something my dear old Dad
taught me before he died. He told me that if you try doing two things
at
one time you'll end up doing neither well. So you can cruise and you
can
telephone. But it's not the same as doing one or the other and doing
it
well.

Wilbur Hubbard


In other words, you can't walk and chew gum at the same time?

Well, I don't suppose you can.

Bruce in Bangkok
(brucepaigeATgmailDOTcom)

Words of wisdom from somebody who claims to be a world cruiser but who
spends all his time stuck in a marina and on the Internet 24/7. Did you
know, Bruce, that you're stuck in a marina in a part of the world most
cruisers say is one of the better cruising grounds. Why aren't you out
cruising? Seeing the sights by water? And, don't give me this monsoon
crap!

Wilbur Hubbard



Well, for one reason we have been cruising Asian waters for ten years,
or more, so some of the new has worn off, as they say. But, if you
take the trouble to have a look in the archives you'll notice that,
unlike you, there have been long periods when I haven't posted during
which time I was out on the water.

You see, Hubby, unlike you my whole life does not evolve around the
Internet. When I'm in port I post, when I'm sailing I don't.

Monsoons - you obviously don;t know a thing about monsoons so I'll
tell you. For about half the year the Monsoon winds in S.E. Asia blow
from the N.E. and bring dry air from China. During the other half of
the year the S.W. Monsoon brings wet air from the S. Indian Ocean.

During the N.E. Monsoon you get dry weather with few squalls and
during the S.W. Monsoon you get tons of rain, thunder storms and
squalls with winds up to 60 - 70 MPH.

Most sensible people do their sailing during the good weather half of
the year. Fools go sailing during the bad weather.


Bruce in Bangkok
(brucepaigeATgmailDOTcom)

Iridium
 

On Thu, 2 Aug 2007 12:38:28 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:


wrote in message
.. .
On Wed, 1 Aug 2007 15:48:32 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:


"Rusty" blank wrote in message
om...
I think it's time to get an Iridium satellite phone. We're gong to
have
way
too much time away from cell sites.

Any suggestions as to a cruiser-friendly source of hardware and
airtime?

Thanks,
Rusty


It's my observation that people who have to have a phone so they can
blabbermouth 24/7 while out cruising should just stay home. If you
need
to be plugged in to the communications grid 24/7 you're not cut out
for
cruising - just stay home and leave the waterways open for real
cruisers, please. Today's men are turning into girly men. Bunch of
sissies. Spend the money on a EPIRB instead. Cruise and try shutting
your mouth for a week or a month. You might learn something for the
first time in your life.

Wilbur Hubbard


Wilbur,

While I realize that weather is of little interest to you on your
trailer-sailer anchored in your snug little Bayou but to people out
there on the water it is one of their primary concerns and there are
three basic ways to get weather reports once you're out of sight of
land (1) H.F. radio, (2) Iridium phone or (3) satellite (immersat, for
example).

I've done cost comparisons and going from nothing to a complete
installation is cheaper using Iridium so more and more cruisers are
opting for Iridium as weather reports through Iridium can be received
24 hours a day while H.F. is greatly dependent upon daily propagation
variations.

As you say, " try shutting your mouth for a week or a month. You might
learn something for the first time in your life."


Correction, there is a fourth and more reliable way of getting weather
reports. That's knowing how to look at the glass and the sky and being
able to interpret what they tell you for your part of the world. How do
you think sailors got around before your exclusive reliance on
technology?

Your little do-it-like-a-lubber screed simply reinforces my opinion that
you're no sailor.
But, then again, anybody who has good opportunity to do coastal cruising
in your part of the world, (considered premiere cruising grounds) but
instead sits in a marina on the Internet probably won't ever understand
that.

Wilbur Hubbard

Wilbur, that is one of the stupidest posts I've ever had the
misfortune to read.

You are right, years ago people didn't have any technology and relied
on all kind of signs and portents to determine what to do.

Originally no one could figure out how where they were once they were
out of sight of land. Then came the compass so we could tell what
direction we were going. Then somebody made a clock that would keep
accurate time and people learned how to take sun shots and we got even
better at knowing where we were, now we have GPS and we know down to a
yard, or so exactly where we are.

Sure, there a lot of old sailor's rhymes and jingles -- Red sky at
night, sailor's delight....., most of them wildly inaccurate, but now
we have a little more science in weather forecasting. Satellites,
weather buoys, there is even a US Navy buoy system in most oceans
where you can get real time wave height, and you want to go back to
looking at clouds to predict the weather? Why? Because you think it is
"lubberly" to use technology?

Throughout history those who adopted the latest technology win and
those who stuck with the old traditional ways end up in the garbage
can.

Hubert, do a little reading about the Tea Clippers. They sailed the
way you are recommending -- lousy charts, poor navigation systems, no
communications, no weather information except clouds. Real Sailor! No
Lubbers here!

And the average life of a tea clipper was something like two years.
Their records read "lost on Scudder's Bank", "demasted in Bay of
Bengal", "believed sunk in typhoon in S. China Seas".......

If you want to go back to the days of Salt Junk and Biscuits for
breakfast, pulling ropes by hand and drowning because you ran into a
typhoon that you didn't know was coming then you are welcome to it.

But for me, I'm going to have every technical advantage I can get.



Bruce in Bangkok
(brucepaigeATgmailDOTcom)

Iridium
 

On Thu, 2 Aug 2007 20:09:10 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:


"Bob" wrote in message
oups.com...
On Aug 2, 11:08 am, "Rusty" blank wrote:
First of all, thanks to Tom for his response to my question.

Second, empathy is a human quality that allows one to place
themselves in
anothers shoes and try to understand their viewpoint.


TO do that interpersonal communication is needed and leads many times
on one concept: Uncertanty Reduction.
Whech means you get to know about the oter person. ANd many times my
worse fewrs are confirmed......... they are idots and girly men.

What is 'Right' for
one person is not the same as it is for another.

There ur wrong. There are crtain things that are simply dangerous or
wrong. your staring to sound like a cultural antropologist.

Those with the human
quality of empathy understand that. I must conclude Wilbur is
something less
than human.

Third. This sure is entertaining!


Regarding who is the most qualified to sail.........................
unless some one here can step up and show me their OICNW indorsment on
their 500 ton license id say we are all rather luberly. Me included.
But mabe in another 360 days of deck service and 21 weeks of class. :)

Bob


Thanks
Rusty


How about a Master Mariner license instead?

http://captneal.homestead.com/files/mastermariner.jpg

I'd say that says it all . . . My mentor, the World Famous Captain Neal.

Wilbur Hubbard

If you had taken the photo from a little further away it might work,
but it can be read -- it is a 25 tonner for domestic inshore waters.

I believe that the OP was talking about a real ship officers license
with indorsement probable foreign going all tonnage.





Bruce in Bangkok
(brucepaigeATgmailDOTcom)

Iridium
 

wrote in message
...
On Thu, 2 Aug 2007 20:09:10 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:
How about a Master Mariner license instead?

http://captneal.homestead.com/files/mastermariner.jpg

I'd say that says it all . . . My mentor, the World Famous Captain Neal.

Wilbur Hubbard

If you had taken the photo from a little further away it might work,
but it can be read -- it is a 25 tonner for domestic inshore waters.

I believe that the OP was talking about a real ship officers license
with indorsement probable foreign going all tonnage.





Bruce in Bangkok
(brucepaigeATgmailDOTcom)

Hey Willy -- you should tell yourse....er, "Capt Neal," that the license has
expired. No matter, we all have to start somewhere. Self-documenting sea
time for the 25 ton MM and OUPV license is as good a start as any.

Iridium
 

Wilbur Hubbard wrote:

You raised your daughter to be just like her Dad - a dependent person
who worries. I raised mine to be just like me - an independent person
who doesn't worry.

Wilbur Hubbard

Willlll burrrr:


There are a few things in this world are simply wrong. As a parent to
a daughter you should know the rule: Thy shall not dis a dad about
his daughter.

For me, I got up at 3AM drove my daughter to the airport to catch her
fligh for shool. As a freshman she was a llittle home sick. Now its
bada bing, "luv ya D c u late." I grew mine to want to leave home.
But ya shouldnt be crowdn a man bout his daughter.Bob

Iridium
 

On 2007-08-02 00:16:16 -0400, Bob said:

Sorry to tell yo but only girly men use tanks (as in sports scuba). The
only manly path to the under world is Free Diving. Just water, god, and
the air in your lungs..... I also prefer to drink alone and eat my fish
raw. Argggg! But let me tell ya right now. Hve a new epirb and going to
get an Irridium phone. Hell, it use to be $10 bucks a min. Ive seen
poor saps whine a pay check away ytalkig to their girlfriends at sea.
Sad..............
Basalt Bob

Agree with most everything except the drinking alone. Much more fun
with a lovely lady by your side, or better ;-)

How much IS Iridium these days?

--
Jere Lull
Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD
Xan's new pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/
Our BVI pages: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/