gday
i'm interested in buying a 30ft grp twin keel yacht as a live aboard
retirement option. i've spent most of my life in north australia where the
tidal variation is over 8metres so the twin keel design seems very
practical.

does anyone have any advice/tips/gotchas for a novice sailor in this
class. (offshore rig worker, handyman, old fart)

thanks in advance

bruce
new zealand

On Sat, 01 Nov 2003 11:24:38 +1300, root wrote:

gday
i'm interested in buying a 30ft grp twin keel yacht as a live aboard
retirement option. i've spent most of my life in north australia where the
tidal variation is over 8metres so the twin keel design seems very
practical.

does anyone have any advice/tips/gotchas for a novice sailor in this
class. (offshore rig worker, handyman, old fart)

thanks in advance

bruce
new zealand







You might get beter answers on the "uk.rec.sailing" newsgroup as
bilge-keelers are more popular in the UK.
Mark E. Williams

root wrote in message ...
gday
i'm interested in buying a 30ft grp twin keel yacht as a live aboard
retirement option. i've spent most of my life in north australia where the
tidal variation is over 8metres so the twin keel design seems very
practical.

does anyone have any advice/tips/gotchas for a novice sailor in this
class. (offshore rig worker, handyman, old fart)

thanks in advance

bruce
new zealand

Bruce, put your question toi the "reader to reader" forum at ybw.com
and you'll be snoed under the replies....The Brits have the largest
pool of experience with twin keelers and there'll probably be quite a
few who know the boat you're considering.
john

Westerly's are the primary lot and of them the Centaur is the most well
known. My own, under different owners, is the class record holder with two
circumnavigations plus under the keel. That's a 26' hull. My new one is
the Berwick at 31' LOD. Here's some of the things to watch for. a. they
don't point as high as single keel boats but similar to full keel boats. In
light airs it's easier to 'wear ship' than tack across. b. The draft is
less when upright and more when heeled. Also the righting moment
drastically increases when heeled. The Westerly's are damn near impossible
to broach. c. They don't go near as fast as similar waterline lengths but
they are more comfortable. If you get 'wave slap' between the keels you are
going to fast reef down. d. They surf great! e. Some, mine own included,
eventually get keel bolt leaks. You have to inspect this and occasionally
fix them over the years. The older one's did n't have stiffener sections
built in the keel stub interior. Adding those solved a lot of keel bolt
problems. e. There's no bilge to speak of. f. Some, like the Westerly's
are blue water capable, some are not. g. They are GREAT for shallow water,
canals, and gunkholing.

For the rest follow advice of the others or contact for Twin
Keeler Newsletter. He's in Chicago, USA.

Michael

root wrote:

gday
i'm interested in buying a 30ft grp twin keel yacht as a live aboard
retirement option. i've spent most of my life in north australia where the
tidal variation is over 8metres so the twin keel design seems very
practical.

does anyone have any advice/tips/gotchas for a novice sailor in this
class. (offshore rig worker, handyman, old fart)

thanks in advance

bruce
new zealand


I have been sailing a 1970 (about) bilge keel TylerCraft 39' for
5 years now in fresh water, Grand Lake, and St. John River. The
tides on the river are remarkable, in that while outside the
Harbour at St. John, New Brunswick, the Bay of Fundy tides are
the highest in the world, but once you sail past the Reversing
Falls, a few miles upriver only has about a 2 foot daily tide
variation. Seasonally, the river level changes with the release
of water from the Dam at Mactaquac, changing by as much as about
10 feet, and freezing hard in winter. I joke about sailing on the
ice, with the cast iron sled runners sharpened properly, like ice
skates.

It's funny that despite what sounds like a perfect example to
demonstrate the advantages of a twin keel boat on the tidal
flats, it is only the shallow draft that seems to be an
advantage, the "Bote a Ouel" draws 2' 10" and goes off and on
the flatbed trailer with relative ease. With the keels about 4'
long at the bottom, it has no tendancy to up end. It spends
winter in the back yard, takes shallow short cuts where others
dare not go, can be run up on many beaches with impunity at mid
tide, and floats off well as the tide rises. Waves make it pound,
but in soft sand it has is not been a problm.

It has round bilges and cabin sole, so walking inside while
heeled does not require you to walk on a side hill, you walk in
the bottom of the pipe, so to speak. Very comfortable heeled, but
the centerline is under the saloon table while level. The bilge
is only about 2" below the sole. We don't get much water in the
boat.

The keels are remarkably effective since the leeward one digs in,
increasing draught as we heel by about a foot and does not lose
efficiency to under the bottom tip vortices until heeled way
over. By then the windward keel is almost out of the water, so
the boat is more stable and sails better than might be imagined.

While fixed monokeels protect the prop and rudder, I can see that
the 'sled runners' on my boat could let a boulder slide under the
centerline while level. The prop extends about even with a little
skeg that covers up the area that would be occupied by the
missing centre keel. Still, this would occur in about 2' of
water, where I usually do not go. The rudder is a foot deeper,
and has no protection from a centre keel. I haven't hit anything
with those tender bits, yet.

I am not so experienced as many, have not sailed in rough ocean
conditions, so cannot tout it's performance wrt other types, but
I am happy with it. It goes to windward well enough with only
small sails using a self tending club footed jib sheeted inboard
or free footed outboard, and because of the way it's rigged, can
be flown very flat going upwind. This, I feel, is key to it's
performance. I do not race, so can't really say.

I have no complaints, except it lacks a genset and air
conditioning, and I have had to repair soggy deck core, but these
have nothing to do with twin keels. Construction quality
depends on other factors.

--
Terry K - My email address is MY PROPERTY, and is protected by
copyright legislation. Permission to reproduce it is
specifically denied for mass mailing and unrequested
solicitations. Reproduction or conveyance for any unauthorised
purpose is THEFT and PLAGIARISM. Abuse is Littering, Invasion of
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footer released to public domain. Spamspoof salad by spamchock -
SofDevCo

root wrote:
gday

I have "owned - been owned by" my Westerly 22
more than ten years ( and an Albin 25 ):

She loves 'small craft warnings' and, in those
moments, looks for multihulls to toy with...

A gentleman wrote me, '...change the cockpit
drain hoses, they can sink your boat. I know.'
These hoses were getting rotty looking and felt
strange. Changed those hoses and six chiro-
practic sessions later, I am OK.

Twin keels are good for drying out on sandy
beaches, trailers and such. Boulders and
large rocks seem likely to hole the unwary -
look around while the water drains out.

A mahogany skeg can be badly damaged
by rocks and moorings, I know.

Do not even think of anchoring where the
water is thin, no matter what the local know
it alls say, until you have checked your
landing spot with your own eyes. And
thought seriously about what you have
seen.

Live and learn, or drown. ( Thank you, RAH )

It is time for me to check chainplates
and all rigging. Try to styrene melt my
3 section masthead light together.
Replace a sail, upgrade winches, make
better anchor mounts ( CQR35, Danforth40
and Fortress14. ) And fabricate singlehander
mast stepping hardware.

Twin keel Westerly boats put a lot of
metal under the grp hull. Lightning
could be a problem. I need to run a
very heavy cable, without bends, to
a keel. I need to rethink my Dynaplate
sintered bronze radio ground. I have
read that they boil water explosively
when carrying a lightning strike. A
large hole is blasted into the under-
water hull.....

I will consider a larger Westerly, Valiant
or whichever, if I decide to cruise.
I do know that a slower boat needs
more consumables, period.

Good luck,
Bligh (Bill) (Captain)

root wrote:
gday

I have "owned - been owned by" my Westerly 22
more than ten years ( and an Albin 25 ):

She loves 'small craft warnings' and, in those
moments, looks for multihulls to toy with...

A gentleman wrote me, '...change the cockpit
drain hoses, they can sink your boat. I know.'
These hoses were getting rotty looking and felt
strange. Changed those hoses and six chiro-
practic sessions later, I am OK.

Twin keels are good for drying out on sandy
beaches, trailers and such. Boulders and
large rocks seem likely to hole the unwary -
look around while the water drains out.

A mahogany skeg can be badly damaged
by rocks and moorings, I know.

Do not even think of anchoring where the
water is thin, no matter what the local know
it alls say, until you have checked your
landing spot with your own eyes. And
thought seriously about what you have
seen.

Live and learn, or drown. ( Thank you, RAH )

It is time for me to check chainplates
and all rigging. Try to styrene melt my
3 section masthead light together.
Replace a sail, upgrade winches, make
better anchor mounts ( CQR35, Danforth40
and Fortress14. ) And fabricate singlehander
mast stepping hardware.

Twin keel Westerly boats put a lot of
metal under the grp hull. Lightning
could be a problem. I need to run a
very heavy cable, without bends, to
a keel. I need to rethink my Dynaplate
sintered bronze radio ground. I have
read that they boil water explosively
when carrying a lightning strike. A
large hole is blasted into the under-
water hull.....

I will consider a larger Westerly, Valiant
or whichever, if I decide to cruise.
I do know that a slower boat needs
more consumables, period.

Good luck,
Bligh (Bill) (Captain)