On Tue, 09 Jan 2007 04:41:48 GMT, "William Longyard"
wrote:

I really wonder if wind driven self-steering gear is better than electronic
gear.

A. Though electronic gear can fail, carrying a few spare units is less
expensive than the initial installation of a windvane system.

B. Though electronic gear consumes power, power generation is not a major
issue for many cruisers.

C. Electronic gear will probably fail at no greater rate than the
wind/mechanical system, and would be infinitely easier to replace a as a
complete assembly than would be a windvane and its associated gearing.

D. Electronic gear takes us much less real estate and leaves an already
cluttered transom untouched.

My two cents. Glad to hear other opinions.
Bill Longyard


I've never owned either but it seems the wind driven models get more
efficient the harder it blows whereas the electric ones work harder
and demand more power.
I think there were disasters with the early powered autopilots too.
Racing boats broaching at the peak of a massive wave in the Southern
ocean and such due to computer malfunction.
I sailed with someone who ran under power in high seas while flying a
small foresail and had an electrical steering arrangement on a huge
quadrant. It was very noisy on board both from the weather, the engine
and the steering gears swinging around. The quarter birth was
unusable. We had no reliability problems though, even in very confused
seas. Someone had to sit in the cockpit and keep watch anyway, which
seemed weird and useless without something to do.
Also, the steering vanes all seem to have loads of lines and pulleys
led to the cockpit which just seems awful to me, taking up most of
the cockpit space. It seems like you'd be fighting all that rig to
attend to anything at the stern like handling a drogue, fish line,
skiff, anchor or such.
Be nice to hear the pro and cons of each from people who have lived
with both.

Sorry to say i thought the question was rather pertinent.
As i am looking to a wind vane too... but my eyes lead toward the cape
horn brand
http://www.caphorn.com/CadreAnglais.htm
to me it seems a better style and more user friendly
as i have NO experience with any of them but do have a rather mechanical
mind i feel the extra cost well worth power savings
Shaun

Shaun,, the Cape Horn is a great windvane self steering system. Probably
better than the Voyager.

What has drawn me to the Voyager is the set up will work with a tiller very
easily. I have a tiller.

The Voyager is cheaper also.

I know someone who swears by the Cape Horn. And many think the Monitor is
the best one ever.

I just like the set up for the Voyager... just a personal opinion.

Oh,, one big problem with my opinion. I don't know jack about any of the
windvane systems except what I have read and seen on the net.

===
"shaun" wrote in message
...
Sorry to say i thought the question was rather pertinent.
As i am looking to a wind vane too... but my eyes lead toward the cape
horn brand
http://www.caphorn.com/CadreAnglais.htm
to me it seems a better style and more user friendly
as i have NO experience with any of them but do have a rather mechanical
mind i feel the extra cost well worth power savings
Shaun

I've sailed with a Navik (great for boats 30') and Autohelm 3000 and
Navico (now Simrad) PH500 hydraulic below deck pilots.

- The Navik was quiet, efficient and did pretty well, except in big
quartering seas where it steered an S-course. No power required of
course and fairly

- The Autohelm 3000 computer case sealing was rudimentary at best.
Took it apart a few times to find salt crystals inside. Did fine,
even in big quartering seas. We had hydraulic steering with ~4.5
turns lock to lock, which was

- the hydraulic one was fast and efficient but used a lot of power

Evan Gatehouse

William Longyard wrote:
I really wonder if wind driven self-steering gear is better than electronic
gear.

A. Though electronic gear can fail, carrying a few spare units is less
expensive than the initial installation of a windvane system.

B. Though electronic gear consumes power, power generation is not a major
issue for many cruisers.

C. Electronic gear will probably fail at no greater rate than the
wind/mechanical system, and would be infinitely easier to replace a as a
complete assembly than would be a windvane and its associated gearing.

D. Electronic gear takes us much less real estate and leaves an already
cluttered transom untouched.

My two cents. Glad to hear other opinions.
Bill Longyard

Comparing a wind powered self-steerer to an
electronic autopilot is kind of comparing apples
to oranges. Although both will allow you to leave
the helm (under certain circumstances) they
acomplish this quite differently.

For example, an electronic autopilot is useless if
the main rudder is jammed or broken off, while
most wind powered steering systems have their own
rudder. However, the autopilot will continue to
work in very light wind, or when motoring when the
windvane is useless.

IMHO a well-found long distance cruiser will have
both, and they will both be in bristol shape.

In the past a number of boats have broken their
rudders while surfing down large waves and
starting to broach due to the lack of storm
drogues to slow them down. Some were consequently
rolled due to lack of steering capability, and
lack of a storm parachute anchor to keep the bow
into the waves.

A self-steering gear on the transom gives you dual
redundency should you ground and jam your rudder
shaft, or if the rudder is broken off. OTOH, I
like the autopilot as well.

YMMV,

Don W.

There is a good guide worth downloading here

http://www.windpilot.com/

click on the link that says self steering under sail, 7.4mb pdf file. Its
well written, independantly and gives a good overview of general types of
windvanes (horizontal versus vertical etc) and specific comparisons and pros
and cons as well as the evolution of different manufacturers. It has some
info on autopilots as well, but it should give you a bit of an overview.
The consensus seems to be that a windvane and an autopilot each have their
purposes, but for longer ocean voyages on anything less than a modern
ultralight mega racing yacht, you'll probably use the windvane most of the
time. Most boats would do well to have both if you have the space and the
budget.

For myself (thunderbird 26, mostly coastal single handed cruising or with
one other person) a windvane is what im aiming for.

There is some other good info on self made windvanes at these addresses

http://netti.nic.fi/~poltsi/
http://www.mindspring.com/~waltmur/Self-Steering/
http://www.jsward.com/steering/
http://www.backyardpublisher.com/sub4.htm

these are worth a read even if you arent going to build one yourself (id
reccomend not building one yourself!!!) they can at least give you some
understanding of the advantages and problems inherent.

Shaun

"NE Sailboat" wrote in message
news:mUyoh.3844$1h.3593@trndny09...
I am interested in a Voyager Windvane for self steering. If you know about
this model, or product or have one??

Could you take a minute and give your opinion.