I guess those of us in the marine industry are particularly distraught as we
have
gone over and above the actual tourist spending and made contriubtions to the
bahamas and now feel as if not appreciated. Its not entitlement its
detracting from an on going relationship that has been in place for many years.

I dont know about all the 'economic' downside to all this ....
If the Native Americans during the sixteenth and seventeenth centuries
imposed such a tax .... maybe they wouldnt have lost their country.

I live in an area that attracts a lot of 'tourists'. First the tourists
started arriving, then some started to stay, then the toursists who
stayed changed everything they could so that what was once a pristine
beautiful area .. now looks like the blighted areas where the toursts
come from ....then the whole area collapsed and was ruined due to the
weight of all the tourists: cost of living went up, the tourists
consumed all the open space, changed all the customs and laws to suit
thier own selfish needs, totally destroyed a quaint rural setting to one
of high density suburban sprawl, etc. --- and totally destroyed the area.

Personally if the Bahamians want to preserve their country, they should
RAISE the fees higher and perhaps impose a quota system for entry.

Glenn Ashmore wrote:
Dosn't look all that edited to me other than cutting some profanity.

I have to agree that the Bahamian government has made a big mistake. The
islands already have the highest tourist dissatisfaction rate (12%) of
any tourist oriented country in the world. This is just going to make
it worse. Bimini and Walker Key are really going to be hurt quickly but
overall this is just another nail in the coffen of Bahamian tourism.
There is even some backlash building among travel agents booking
non-boating tourists. The way this fee was handled on top of the high
dissatisfaction rate is going to have an effect on all tourist bookings,
not just our boating comunity.

OTOH, the Bahamian citizens' view is a little different. Most of their
objections about depleting resources is bogus but they do have a couple
of valid points. We can enter the Bahamas with a drivers licence. With
the PATRIOT act in effect, they have to pay $100 for a single entry visa
application which is not refundable if the visa is rejected and 214(b)
rejections are quite common. In their mind it just evens the playing field.

Looks like Van Sant is going to have to find another thorny path.

Yachtbroker wrote:

we also have complete content of site before forcefully edited and
will forward
in doc. format to anyone requesting.

"Yachtbroker" wrote in message
...
I guess those of us in the marine industry are particularly distraught as
we
have
gone over and above the actual tourist spending and made contriubtions to
the
bahamas and now feel as if not appreciated. Its not entitlement its
detracting from an on going relationship that has been in place for many
years.

well that sounds slightly different and polite compared to the domain name
"boycottbahamas.com" and the stories you posted before...

#rb
(who has never been to Bahamas because an island with McDonalds, BurgerKing,
Kentucky,... isn't even close to my personal paradise)

Too late - I already emailed my savings account numbers to that great guy in
africa... I gonna be R I C H...

Denny
"Keith" wrote in message
...
Yea, and soon you'll be getting an invitation to have a private banking
transaction from him to get the $21.5 million USD that his dead uncle left
in the Bahamian treasury.

--


Keith
__
Slogan of 105.9, the classic rock radio station in Chicago: "Of all the
radio stations in Chicago...we're one of them."
"Dennis O'Connor" wrote in message
...
Awwww, ain't he cute! Only two years old and already knows how to blame
the
USA for everything...

Denny
"Yachtbroker" wrote in message
...
If you people think that you can pressure our government through
threats
and
the waving of your yankee dollar you've got a big surprise coming!
What
"conflict of interest", Island state politics" are you people talking
about. I
am a proud Bahamian and I sure as hell will be calling my Member of
Parliment
to keep you lot of free loading, dirt bags out o our Country. Why the
hell
the
entire lot of you go the Keys or wherever you want to go. As a
Bahamian
I
am
sick and tire of hearing you Americans cry for every damn thing when
it
is
not
convenient for your own selfish benefit. I pay taxes way beyond $300
dollars in
Florida on every trip and a $100 for an American Visa do hear us
Bahamian
bitching? To hell with the whoe lot of you snooty caniving *******s

exrcpt from www.boycottbahamas.com click how to help!

Yachtbroker wrote:

post was real.... we didnt make it up.
came from www..boycottbahamas.com
the site has now been edited due to numerous cancellations of tournaments and
asta members complaining. reason forwarded not to incite but to inform so that
anyone traveling there will have
some sense of feeling of "some of the citizens" and be heads up accordingly.


Unluckily, I believe the Bahamians have not done an actual survey of
what cruisers contribute to the economy compared to other tourists,
particularly compared to the relative costs the Bahamians have to pay to
support each.

Maryland did one of those a few years back -- wish I could remember the
source -- and to the surprise of all, they found that sailboats spend
something like twice or four times as much as the average powerboater
each year.

In the BVI, they found that bareboat charterers contribute something
like ten or twenty times as much to the economy as the cruise ship
passengers PER DAY. (my average BAR bill exceeded the number I
remember.) While that probably includes the boat rental, which doesn't
apply to cruisers (and often doesn't go into the local economy, but
foreign firms' pockets), neither cruisers or bareboaters require very
elaborate shore-side facilities. No need to build a multi-million dollar
complex to let them dock more easily, or quadruple the taxi fleet to
handle the momentary surges in need, or improve the roads, or add
traffic lights, or other expensive infrastructure..... And no need for
the expensive hotels, vastly increased per-person water, power and sewer
demands.

Doesn't take much to support the several thousand cruisers in the BVI
during peak season.

If they really do look at the true numbers, I think they'd find that
their economy will suffer from the short-term cruisers, the weekend and
several-week boat-based visitors, who will choose another location.

I'm almost certain that they'll continue to soak the cruisers and court
the land-based visitors, mega-resorts like Atlantis that can contribute
mightily to (sad to say) political campaigns and allow the politicians
to gloss over the immense costs of supplying things like water, power
and sewage treatment. Quite likely, resorts' sewage treatment is less
effective than the average cruising boat, and their visitors are quite a
bit less respectful or understanding of the environments.... AND they of
course love the cruise ship lines with such comparatively deep pockets,
whose passengers demand and damage so much and spend so little on shore.

I don't think anyone will cover my bet that the "mega" tourist
industries damage their environments and cultures far more (per tourist
dollar) than cruisers ever could, even on a per-person basis.

Sadly, I doubt that they'll rescind this tax and I doubt it'll change
things much in the long run, except to make some well-connected
Bahamians and foreigners richer.

Some long-term cruisers will bypass the Bahamas, but $300 isn't that
much when amortized over the 6 or so months they take to wander through,
so I don't expect there will be much change there. Heck, it's a pittance
compared to what the Panama Canal charges, yet very few choose to take
the REALLY thorny path between the Atlantic and Pacific. *I* don't like
the charge, but since we'll only go for an extended cruise, we'll likely
pay the charge and be done with it.

--
Jere Lull
Xan-a-Deux ('73 Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD)
Xan's Pages: http://members.dca.net/jerelull/X-Main.html
Our BVI FAQs (290+ pics) http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/

you are absolutely right in my view.
The PLp will do everything they can to turn the bahmas into the megavisitor
tourist attracting leaving the fledgling marine industry in grand bahama and
abacos in the dirt. You are also right about the cruise ships, bring hoardes of
people that carelessly throw cups and the lot overboard let alone and under
paid and overworked worker slips up and empties a bilge or holding tank
accidentally.
Its all about the really big bucks and who stands to make the most. whats even
worse is that the 300 is the testing the waters for 1,000. and that they are
spoon feeding this tax to their citizens under the quise of ecology.

On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 19:32:29 -0400, "Leanne" wrote:
Gee, are you talking about Beaufort County, SC. It has happened here and is
going out of control.
One of the biggest things you hear is, " Gee, we didn't do it this way up
north."

We have bumper stickers that say, "We don't give a damn how you did it
up north!"

Rick


S/V Final Step
http://www.morelr.com/coronado/

I have no problem with a country saying "we don't want visitors".
There are many countries like this in the world that make it
difficult or expensive to visit. North Korea comes to mind.

It is certainly their country, and they can do what they like.
However, they need to also accept the negative impact on the
local economy from the decline of tourism. That is a lot of
small bars and restaurants that go out of business, and a lot
of people who were waiting tables, cooking, cleaning, etc that
go back to subsistence fishing or whatever.

As far as I'm concerned, as soon as a country does not welcome
visitors, I'll go somewhere else. Not because I'm trying to
punish them, but because I don't enjoy the feeling of not being
welcomed.

Later,

Don W.


Terry Spragg wrote:


Hmmm, seems like it may be that the Bahamians are getting tired
of all the Yanqui invaders (among others, to be fair), despoiling
their nicer beaches with huge hotels the natives cannot afford
and whom's motorised competition and effluent ruins the fishing
inshore? Perhaps they fear becoming Tahitized or Cubanized?
Perhaps their democracy is actually working to the betterment of
"The People," most of whom do not benefit from or appreciate the
hordes of 'rich *******s' that keep trying to buy the very dirt
out from under their feet? Perhaps their reserves are getting too
crowded?

Punishing them by not going may be exactly what they want. How
much of "Their" Island still belongs to them? How much of their
culture actually remains? Don't take it as a personal insult,
just consider how you might feel in their shoes. Not the rich
business hotelier wanks, I mean the real people.

Let them charge what they want, you have no right to complain,
they have no duty to let all of you in. Pay up or stay home.
The result will no doubt be seen for what it will be. Time cures
all ills.

Are they actually crazy like foxes?

Hehe! We had one during the 80's. "Welcome to Texas. Now go home."

--


Keith
__
"I'll always be Number 1 to myself."
-Moses Malone
"Rick Morel" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 19:32:29 -0400, "Leanne" wrote:
Gee, are you talking about Beaufort County, SC. It has happened here and
is
going out of control.
One of the biggest things you hear is, " Gee, we didn't do it this way up
north."

We have bumper stickers that say, "We don't give a damn how you did it
up north!"

Rick


S/V Final Step
http://www.morelr.com/coronado/

x-no-archive:yes

I didn't know about the $100 per visit fee for Bahamians in the US,
but I talked to some of them when I was there last. They said that it
is cheaper for them to fly over to the US, rent a car, and buy stuff
(like furniture) and ship it back even with all the import taxes etc
that they have to pay on it then to buy it in the Bahamas.

In any case, if they are charging $15 (or $18 in the case of Freeport)
exit fee per person that's not equivalent to charging a boat with two
to 4 persons $300. And I don't know if they charge the cruise ship
passengers anything extra or maybe it is included in their passage.

Most Bahamians have no contact with private boat cruisers or they
don't realize that they are cruisers. So the animosity towards people
from the US is probably toward non-boating tourists.

As for our getting parts for free that are in Bahamian stores - that's
a laugh. Bob went to all the stores in Bimini and all the stores in
Nassau and quite a few of them in Freeport, and he bought what he
could which wasn't much. We had to go back to the states to get any
serious engine parts. Even when they had them, they didn't want to
look for them, or couldn't find them.

And we don't get them for free - we have to pay for them and pay sales
tax just like anyone else. All we escape is paying Bahamian duty.

I also wonder how this is going to affect Canadian visitors who
usually live a little closer to the bone because of the exchange rate
than we do.

In any case, my SIL who is the sort who will run over to Bimini for
the weekend has said he won't go anymore - not so much because of the
fees in the Bahamas, but because of the hassle getting back into the
states.

We first went to the Bahamas in order to stay longer in FL than the 90
days allowed. It's cheaper to pay the fee now than to go to the
Bahamas, particularly if they charge us additional for each dinghy.


grandma Rosalie