A Jeanneau salesperson told me that a Jeanneau 52.2 can
go just as fast under sail as a Fountaine Pajot Belize 42.

Can this be true ? I've always thought that catamarans
in general can go a lot faster than monohulls.

Its highly dependant on a number of factors, the principle your broker
is probably going on is the waterline length, the longer the boat the
fast its hull speed. that why they built such huge yachts in the early
20th century(long and skinny). The the planning hull was developed
which shattered all the big boats dreams!! To answer your question
maybe up wind they both do the same speed but on a beam reach i wold be
surprized if the cat didn't win.

On 10 Jan 2006 04:14:13 -0800, wrote:

Its highly dependant on a number of factors, the principle your broker
is probably going on is the waterline length, the longer the boat the
fast its hull speed. that why they built such huge yachts in the early
20th century(long and skinny). The the planning hull was developed
which shattered all the big boats dreams!! To answer your question
maybe up wind they both do the same speed but on a beam reach i wold be
surprized if the cat didn't win.


Cats generally do not point well. While they might have a a good SOG,
their VMG is wanting.

Jack

_________________________________________
Jack Dale
ISPA Yachtmaster Offshore Instructor
CYA Advanced Cruising Instructor
http://www.swiftsuresailing.com
_________________________________________

We raced our Schock 35 for many years and often there was a multihull fleet
sailing the same course. F-28 Corsair Trimarans and others of the same ilk.
We were very rarely beaten around the course by those multihulls.. I would
tend to agree that in general a large monohull will be as fast if not faster
than a cruising cat.

That said, the ultimate speed machines are multihulls but they are not boats
you want to cruise on. Weight is the enemy of any multihull and beer in
bottles is heavy!



"Jack Dale" wrote in message
...
On 10 Jan 2006 04:14:13 -0800, wrote:

Its highly dependant on a number of factors, the principle your broker
is probably going on is the waterline length, the longer the boat the
fast its hull speed. that why they built such huge yachts in the early
20th century(long and skinny). The the planning hull was developed
which shattered all the big boats dreams!! To answer your question
maybe up wind they both do the same speed but on a beam reach i wold be
surprized if the cat didn't win.


Cats generally do not point well. While they might have a a good SOG,
their VMG is wanting.

Jack

_________________________________________
Jack Dale
ISPA Yachtmaster Offshore Instructor
CYA Advanced Cruising Instructor
http://www.swiftsuresailing.com
_________________________________________

Bryan wrote:
We raced our Schock 35 for many years and often there was a multihull fleet
sailing the same course. F-28 Corsair Trimarans and others of the same ilk.
We were very rarely beaten around the course by those multihulls..

So why does the Shock have a phrf of 72 while the f27 usually has
around 50?

I would
tend to agree that in general a large monohull will be as fast if not faster
than a cruising cat.

Are you seriously saying that a comparison of a Shock 35 to a F28 says
anything about cruising boats??



That said, the ultimate speed machines are multihulls but they are not boats
you want to cruise on. Weight is the enemy of any multihull and beer in
bottles is heavy!

Not sure what you are asking Jeff? The PHRF ratings show that a Schock is a
slower boat then an F28. But in our experience was we usually beat them
around the course. Do they reach faster, yes. Do the go up and down
faster, no. On average we beat them. I can't deny what 30 years of racing
has shown me.

Let's look at the numbers. A Fountaine Pajot 35 rates 138, a Fountaine
Pajot Belize 43 rates 135, a Gemini 105 rates 177. The Jeanneau 52 is 80.
The Jeanneau will most likely get to the anchorage before the Pajot. The
numbers are the numbers.

Big cruising cats are a far cry from the monster racing cats and tri's we
see on magazine covers. Cruising cats are heavy with a very small sail
plans. If you cruise a powered up cat or tri and are very cautious about
payload it will be fast, no doubt. But most people like stuff when
cruising, and stuff is heavy, and heavy is slow for a multi.

Sorry, the nod goes to the Jeanneau.

Bryan

"Jeff" wrote in message
...
Bryan wrote:
We raced our Schock 35 for many years and often there was a multihull
fleet sailing the same course. F-28 Corsair Trimarans and others of the
same ilk. We were very rarely beaten around the course by those
multihulls..

So why does the Shock have a phrf of 72 while the f27 usually has around
50?

I would tend to agree that in general a large monohull will be as fast if
not faster than a cruising cat.

Are you seriously saying that a comparison of a Shock 35 to a F28 says
anything about cruising boats??



That said, the ultimate speed machines are multihulls but they are not
boats you want to cruise on. Weight is the enemy of any multihull and
beer in bottles is heavy!

Jack Dale wrote:
On 10 Jan 2006 04:14:13 -0800, wrote:


Its highly dependant on a number of factors, the principle your broker
is probably going on is the waterline length, the longer the boat the
fast its hull speed. that why they built such huge yachts in the early
20th century(long and skinny). The the planning hull was developed
which shattered all the big boats dreams!! To answer your question
maybe up wind they both do the same speed but on a beam reach i wold be
surprized if the cat didn't win.



Cats generally do not point well. While they might have a a good SOG,
their VMG is wanting.

This is a generalization that doesn't really hold anymore. A number
of the newer cats point reasonably well. The PDQ 44, for example, in
16 knots true will tack through 84 degrees while doing almost 8 knots
for a VMG of 5.9. Reaching, it will do 11 knots. In stronger wind it
does even better.

http://pdqyachts.com/ver2/pdfs/theCa...erformance.pdf

wrote:
A Jeanneau salesperson told me that a Jeanneau 52.2 can
go just as fast under sail as a Fountaine Pajot Belize 42.

Can this be true ? I've always thought that catamarans
in general can go a lot faster than monohulls.

Do you think that the _Jeanneau_ salesperson was trying to
sell you on anything and was a strictly unbiased source of
information?

In general, similar size cruising cats will outsail cruising
monohulls. However in some areas, the mono will probably do
better, especially if the cat has fixed keels instead of
daggerboards. Light winds or light winds upwind are weak
spots. But ease the sheets a bit on a moderate wind day and
most cats will sail away from the monohulls.

FP cats won't point too well, around 100° between tacks.
But a big deck saloon cruising mono won't often be much better.

So in most cases, I think your salesperson is stretching the
truth.

Evan Gatehouse

On Tue, 10 Jan 2006 21:40:34 -0800, Evan Gatehouse
wrote:

In general, similar size cruising cats will outsail cruising
monohulls.

=======================

The vast majority of cruising sailboats that I see, both cats and
monos, are under power. Occasionally motorsailing, but more often
than not, power only. Admittedly these are coastal cruisers not
people on passage. A very high percentage of all cruising is coastal
however.

My point is that sailing performance doesn't necessarily mean too
much. Cats are very difficult to get dock space for, and deep draft
monos have many places they can not go. It's all a compromise, but to
me the ideal cruiser of any type would have ample power, shoal draft,
lots of tankage and plenty of room for storing gear.

Trawlers anyone?