dingy question
 

Just looked at a 32' old full keel boat. I really liked the boat, it needs
work but it is the usual paint, etc.

Then I got to thinking ???? Where would I put my dingy when I go off
cruising. I would think that it would be in the way on deck.

Any thoughts? Do the rubber ones deflate and inflate easily?

dingy question
 

On Sat, 07 Jan 2006 17:33:55 GMT, "Thomas Wentworth"
wrote:

Just looked at a 32' old full keel boat. I really liked the boat, it needs
work but it is the usual paint, etc.

Then I got to thinking ???? Where would I put my dingy when I go off
cruising. I would think that it would be in the way on deck.

Any thoughts? Do the rubber ones deflate and inflate easily?


You might consider an inflatable tender - they deflate and inflate
easily and can be stowed on deck if space is really limited. You will
need it if you anchor and want to avoid marinas, or end up on a
pontoon with no shore connections.

dingy question
 

Try the folding boats. real interesting.

http://www.porta-bote.com/

--
Martin-Paul Broennimann
architecte et urbaniste SIA/FSU

14, rue du Diorama
CH 1204 Genève Switzerland
0041 78 627 29 67

arrêt TPG place du Cirque
parking Hôtel des Finances

visit our website= www.broennimann.com

"Thomas Wentworth" a écrit dans le message de news:
7YSvf.510$ID1.371@trndny01...
Just looked at a 32' old full keel boat. I really liked the boat, it
needs work but it is the usual paint, etc.

Then I got to thinking ???? Where would I put my dingy when I go off
cruising. I would think that it would be in the way on deck.

Any thoughts? Do the rubber ones deflate and inflate easily?

dingy question
 

Thomas Wentworth wrote:
Just looked at a 32' old full keel boat. I really liked the boat, it
needs work but it is the usual paint, etc.

Then I got to thinking ???? Where would I put my dingy when I go off
cruising. I would think that it would be in the way on deck.

Many old boats are indeed dingy. A little paint and elbow grease does
wonders, but once you've finished fitting her out she won't any longer be
dingy, so you won't have to worry.

Now where to stow the dingHy is an entirely different issue.

--
Good luck and good sailing.
s/v Kerry Deare of Barnegat
http://kerrydeare.comcast.net

dingy question
 

Try it on the foredeck with the transom on the cabin top. Our 8 foot
dinghy fits quite well up there and I can get it aboard and launched
with the spinnaker halyard and the help of one kid. There is still
room to walk around it to the bow and it doesn't interfere with
sailing at all.

You can see the boat he

http://home.maine.rr.com/rlma/Boat.htm

and the dinghy he

http://home.maine.rr.com/rlma/Boat20.htm#Dinghy

for comparison with your boat.

Most of the time, we tow it. Inflatables don't tow well. I would
rather unlash and launch our solid dink occasionally than pump up;
deflate; and stow an inflatable every time. The solid dink also rows
better which
we prefer to dealing with an outboard, gas storage, etc.

If you ever have a fire or sudden sinking, a solid dinghy will also be
a lot more useful than an inflatable folded up in a deck locker.

--

Roger Long



"Thomas Wentworth" wrote in message
news:7YSvf.510$ID1.371@trndny01...
Just looked at a 32' old full keel boat. I really liked the boat,
it needs work but it is the usual paint, etc.

Then I got to thinking ???? Where would I put my dingy when I go
off cruising. I would think that it would be in the way on deck.

Any thoughts? Do the rubber ones deflate and inflate easily?

dingy question
 

Dave" wrote

I figure it must have been slowing us by at least half a knot.

From the perspective of one who occasionally has to consider speed and
resistance of boats professionally, I really doubt that the dinghy is
costing you half a knot, at least not on the 32 foot size boats
considered in this thread. I've also pulled them in on long painters
and then let them go to see of the speed bumps up. Not that I've ever
been able to detect before the rope runs out anyway. I admit though,
I still can't get it out of my head that we are going slower:)

--

Roger Long

dingy question
 

On Sat, 07 Jan 2006 23:23:44 GMT, "Roger Long"
wrote:

From the perspective of one who occasionally has to consider speed and
resistance of boats professionally, I really doubt that the dinghy is
costing you half a knot, at least not on the 32 foot size boats
considered in this thread.

I did some testing on my old Cal-34. Speed loss depended a lot on
wind speed, point of sail and towing method. Half a knot is quite
plausible going to windward in light air, much less likely in 20 kts
of wind on a broad reach. We found that the most efficient towing
with our inflatable was with the bow elevated very close to the
transom. Also keep the dinghy as light as possible when towing.

dingy question
 

"Wayne.B" wrote

Half a knot is quite plausible going to windward in light air.

Does anybody do actually do that without the engine running? :)

I would have an inflatable myself if there wasn't a way to carry it on
deck for times like that or when the psychological effect of 1/8 knot
on a long beat feels burdensome out of proportion to the actual time
lost.

--

Roger Long

dingy question
 

On Sun, 08 Jan 2006 02:39:49 GMT, "Roger Long"
wrote:

I would have an inflatable myself if there wasn't a way to carry it on
deck for times like that or when the psychological effect of 1/8 knot
on a long beat feels burdensome out of proportion to the actual time
lost.

When racing a sailboat, 1/8th of a knot feels like a 100 mph speed
difference. We used to participate in a lot of race/cruise events
where we needed the dinghy at night. If we couldn't get someone not
racing to tow it for us, we would deflate it and roll it up every
morning. That's a major pain of course but there was no way to race
competetively while towing.

In order to get the boat to a competetive level in the first place, we
went to fanatical lengths to reduce drag. The bottom paint was wet
sanded with 220 and 400 grit paper to a mirror finish, through hull
discharge fittings were faired smooth to the hull and covered with
mylar flaps, etc. It may sound extreme but it really makes a
difference in light air. 1/10th of a knot in boat speed equates to
about 12 seconds per mile and most serious racers would kill for a 3
seconds per mile advantage,

dingy question
 

On Sat, 07 Jan 2006 17:33:55 GMT, "Thomas Wentworth"
wrote:

Just looked at a 32' old full keel boat. I really liked the boat, it needs
work but it is the usual paint, etc.

Then I got to thinking ???? Where would I put my dingy when I go off
cruising. I would think that it would be in the way on deck.

Any thoughts? Do the rubber ones deflate and inflate easily?


A rigid dinghy is much easier to row. At night they may bang against
the hull.

An dinghy that deflates in very hard to row and may not take an
engine.

I have seen dinghies that deflate, have a folding plywood floor and
can take a small engine.

A inflatable dinghy with a rigid bottom will probably require an
engine. At night they make less noise that a rigid.

Towing does work, but does knock off some speed. You have keep the
dinghy and your boat in tune with the waves. USE A FLOATING PAINTER.
(emphasis added).

The foredeck is an option. A baby sray will get in the way. Size the
dinghy to fit and use a halyard to lower it and bring it back on deck.

Inder boom might work. Boom vangs and travellers may get in the way,
but on an old full keel boat, may be an issue.

You might be able to add davits to the stern. That presents its own
problems with wind vanes, boarding ladders, etc..

There is no easy solution and lots of opinions.

For cruising, I would go with towing a inflatable with a rigid bottom
amd a small engine. Under way, I would keep the engine on the stern
rail.

My 2 cents.

Jack

_________________________________________
Jack Dale
ISPA Yachtmaster Offshore Instructor
CYA Advanced Cruising Instructor
http://www.swiftsuresailing.com
_________________________________________

dingy question
 

Although I have been involved with a wide variety of boats and marine
activities, racing has been about as far off my radar screen as polo
since shortly after High School (Co-captain of varsity sailing team).

Your towing method makes perfect sense. If the dinghy is close enough
for the painter to take some weight, you are lightening it very
effectively. The downside is steeper flow lines and shorter waterline
but being in the wake of the larger vessel would easily offset that.

Didn't you have trouble with it banging into the transom?

I tow Maine traditional cruising style. I let the dinghy out to just
past the crest of the first stern wave so it's being pulled up the
wave. It rides there rock solid and the wave keeps it from surging
forward if the boat slows down. There's probably a little more drag
that way but we're already where we were going most of the time.

You just have to remember to pull the dinghy up short before going in
reverse with the engine. One of my projects next year is to find a
tow line that floats without being unpleasant to handle.

--

Roger Long

dingy question
 

On Sun, 08 Jan 2006 12:16:03 GMT, "Roger Long"
wrote:

Didn't you have trouble with it banging into the transom?

=============================

Sure. We actually chafed a hole in the nose of one inflatable. What
a weird noise that made. The trick is to get the distance just right
for conditions, AND keep an eye on it.

dingy question
 

By no means the nicest looking boat around but I thought they made a lot of
sense. Considering the amount of use most dingy's/tenders get, I don't want
to spend a small fortune and I want something I can tuck away somewhere
until I need it. I'm happy to hear you like yours as I am considering one
myself.

"Martin-Paul Broennimann" wrote in message
...
Try the folding boats. real interesting.

http://www.porta-bote.com/

--
Martin-Paul Broennimann
architecte et urbaniste SIA/FSU

14, rue du Diorama
CH 1204 Genève Switzerland
0041 78 627 29 67

arrêt TPG place du Cirque
parking Hôtel des Finances

visit our website= www.broennimann.com

"Thomas Wentworth" a écrit dans le message de news:
7YSvf.510$ID1.371@trndny01...
Just looked at a 32' old full keel boat. I really liked the boat, it
needs work but it is the usual paint, etc.

Then I got to thinking ???? Where would I put my dingy when I go off
cruising. I would think that it would be in the way on deck.

Any thoughts? Do the rubber ones deflate and inflate easily?

dingy question
 

On Sat, 07 Jan 2006 23:03:08 -0500, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Sun, 08 Jan 2006 02:39:49 GMT, "Roger Long"
wrote:

I would have an inflatable myself if there wasn't a way to carry it on
deck for times like that or when the psychological effect of 1/8 knot
on a long beat feels burdensome out of proportion to the actual time
lost.

When racing a sailboat, 1/8th of a knot feels like a 100 mph speed
difference. We used to participate in a lot of race/cruise events
where we needed the dinghy at night. If we couldn't get someone not
racing to tow it for us, we would deflate it and roll it up every
morning. That's a major pain of course but there was no way to race
competetively while towing.

I raced in a week-long point to point regatta this summer that
included multiple nights at anchor. They allowed a handicap adjustment
of around 15 s/mile for towing a dinghy. We rolled and stowed ours
while our closest competitor towed. I'd like to argue that the
adjustment was too big, but it wasn't far off. Tight finishes just
about all week in good wind. As you say:

1/10th of a knot in boat speed equates to
about 12 seconds per mile and most serious racers would kill for a 3
seconds per mile advantage,

I wouldn't bother deflating the dinghy for cruising speed.

Ryk

dingy question
 

Commodore Joe Redcloud wrote in
:

I'll second that.

Me, too! The 5HP Nissan 4-stroke outboard PLANES Lionheart's 12' Port-a-
Bote with 2 aboard...(c; VERY DRY IN MODERATE CHOP, too! You don't HAVE
to arrive ashore lookin like a drowned rat.

dingy question - another Porta-Bote fan (in depth review)
 

I'll add another vote for the Porta-Bote. We've been using our 12'
non-stop for the last 15 months as we cruise Mexico & Central America's
west coast. While it's far from perfect, I can't see us ever going back
to an inflatable.

Good things:

Rugged. Drag it up on sharp rocks or let it rub against barnacles, and
you wind up with some cosmetic scratches, but nothing that affects it's
performance or lifetime.

Dry. Because you're sitting inside the boat and not on the tubes with
your rear hanging perilously close to the waves, we stay MUCH drier than
we ever did in our 10' inflatable.

Faster. About twice as fast as out soft floor inflatable with the same
outboard. We use a 6hp 4-stroke Mercury (right at the upper recommended
weight limit for the 12') and it flies at almost 12 kts with my 260 lbs
aboard. Somewhat slower with both of us aboard.

Lots of room for groceries. Since much of the volume is not taken up by
inflatable tubes, there's lots more room for groceries, trash, jerry
jugs or people.

The 12' stows flat on the cabin top or our Tayana 37, adding no real
windage and when reefing the main or something, it's tough enough that I
just step up on it.

You never wake up and have to pump up the dinghy.

Bad things:

The plastic seats don't stand up to the tropical sun. After about a
year, we (and everybody else we've met with them down here) have had to
have wooden ones made.

Others (but not us) have had a problem with the black tube that runs
along the keel pulling away from the boat.

The oars that come with it also don't stand up to the tropical/salt
water environment. The fittings rust and the plastic parts become
brittle and break.

Some of the fittings on our wooden transom are not stainless steel (they
now make a plastic transom that I have never seen and would worry if
it's made out of the same stuff our seats were made from).

We will probably have to make a new transom for it eventually.

Not as much reserve bouancy in the stern. This translates to being a
bit more subject to being pooped when landing though the surf (a 12'
dinghy full of water being pounded by the surf while everything in it
washes out does not make for a fun afternoon - trust me on this one).

While we never have to pump up soft tubes, we do have to bail it out.
In a few of the torrential rains down here during the rainy season, it
threatened to swamp itself. On the other hand, when hurricane Adrian
threatened us in El Salvador, we pulled the engine off and intentionally
filled it with water to stabilize it and it was just fine.

The safety floatation plastic foam doesn't stand up to the tropical sun.
It sheds stuff when it gets rubbed.

Bottom line.

I get the impression that it was designed for higher latitude use by
hunters and fishermen, but even with it's weak points, it makes an
overall better dinghy for us than inflatables.

For what it's worth, we've run into several people using Porta-Botes as
dinghies and none are contemplating going back to an inflatable. On the
other hand, there are a few inflatable owners that are considering
switching to Portas when they get back to the states.


Larry wrote:
Me, too! The 5HP Nissan 4-stroke outboard PLANES Lionheart's 12' Port-a-
Bote with 2 aboard...(c; VERY DRY IN MODERATE CHOP, too! You don't HAVE
to arrive ashore lookin like a drowned rat.

dingy question
 

In article ,
"Roger Long" wrote:

"Wayne.B" wrote

Half a knot is quite plausible going to windward in light air.

Does anybody do actually do that without the engine running? :)

I would have an inflatable myself if there wasn't a way to carry it on
deck for times like that or when the psychological effect of 1/8 knot
on a long beat feels burdensome out of proportion to the actual time
lost.

The difference, for me, is that we can sail lighter winds. Often we're
still doing 2-3 knots when everyone else is motoring or dead in the
water. And the decreased drag allows us to point better in more normal
air, valuable when we're fighting wind and current together.

We might be a little unusual though. We were out over 60 days last
season and used 13 gallons of fuel.

--
Jere Lull
Xan-a-Deux ('73 Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD)
Xan's Pages: http://members.dca.net/jerelull/X-Main.html
Our BVI FAQs (290+ pics) http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/

dingy question - another Porta-Bote fan (in depth review)
 

On Thu, 12 Jan 2006 19:51:24 -0500, "TriciaJean192 at comcast dot net"
"TriciaJean192 at comcast dot net" wrote:



For what it's worth, we've run into several people using Porta-Botes as
dinghies and none are contemplating going back to an inflatable. On the
other hand, there are a few inflatable owners that are considering
switching to Portas when they get back to the states.

Interesting comments. The overall impression I'm getting is that the
Porta-Bote wins in quite a few, but by no means all, situations. For
under 30' boats as a dinghy, if you like a small engine, hate davits,
etc.

But I've heard that it's not quite rugged enough before, not in the
sense that it falls apart, but that the auxiliary stuff and seats are
not up to the quality of the folding hull itself.

I'll stick with my RIB, which is for me the best of both worlds. But I
would consider a PortaBote as a second tender I could stow if I could
get decent oars and a rugged seat.

Rowing a RIB can be done, but it ain't pretty.

THanks,
R.

dingy question - another Porta-Bote fan (in depth review)
 

"TriciaJean192 at comcast dot net" "TriciaJean192 at comcast dot net"
wrote in :

While we never have to pump up soft tubes, we do have to bail it out.


Fed up with bailing it, we got it a cordless bilge pump....(c;

Attwood Waterbuster cordless pump
http://www.boatersland.com/att41404.html

$35. The hose stores right around the pump. Alkalines are better than
rechargeables because rechargeables self-discharge at the wrong time, but
it will run on either. 5 hours on alkaline D cells is years of use.

Drop it in the stern, and flip the switch.

dingy question - another Porta-Bote fan (in depth review)
 

rhys wrote in news:efies190dsejg1kpj9sm9mkuji5lgblbmp@
4ax.com:

if you like a small engine

Speaking of engines. The 4-stroke dingy engine is a mistake. Damned
thing is just too much weight, too finicky having to lay it down in a
certain way to keep its oil from running out or to the wrong places, etc.
Not good on a motor you have to haul and unmount so much.

2-strokers don't have this malady. Try to buy one with a DIAPHRAM carb,
too that doesn't have a float bowl you have to empty before storage to
keep it from clogging the jets with shellac, another thing that screwed
our Nissan 4-stroke 5HP outboard. Gas in diaphram carbs doesn't spill
out, evaporate from air because there's no air in the diaphram and can be
used in any position, which is why your chain saw has one.

Ah, the simple pleasure of cranking an old Seagull you can fix yourself
in any cove on the planet.

dingy question - another Porta-Bote fan (in depth review)
 

Larry wrote:
Ah, the simple pleasure of cranking an old Seagull you can fix yourself
in any cove on the planet.


With only a hammer

DSK

dingy question - another Porta-Bote fan (in depth review)
 

DSK wrote:
Larry wrote:

Ah, the simple pleasure of cranking an old Seagull you can fix
yourself in any cove on the planet.


With only a hammer

DSK



As long as you're not choking on the 10:1 gas/oil ratio.
Can't get the conversion for my 1954 40 Plus Seagull.

dingy question
 

On Sat, 7 Jan 2006 11:16:15 -0800, Armond Perretta wrote
(in article ):

Thomas Wentworth wrote:
Just looked at a 32' old full keel boat. I really liked the boat, it
needs work but it is the usual paint, etc.

Then I got to thinking ???? Where would I put my dingy when I go off
cruising. I would think that it would be in the way on deck.

Many old boats are indeed dingy. A little paint and elbow grease does
wonders, but once you've finished fitting her out she won't any longer be
dingy, so you won't have to worry.

Now where to stow the dingHy is an entirely different issue.



Mr. Perretta,

A man asked for help.

You didn't have to, but you responded.

However, instead of offering a helpful response, you smugly mocked a spelling
error.

You could have responded to his question and then reminded him of the
accurate spelling of the word 'dinghy', if his common spelling error really
bothered you, but you chose not to.

You chose to respond to his post but chose NOT to be helpful.

You chose, instead, to be spiteful.

I can only speculate as to what emotional or psychological problems drive
someone to this type of behavior.

You have my sympathy, but I won't waste time reading anything else you post.

dingy question - another Porta-Bote fan (in depth review)
 

Don White wrote in news:mZOxf.154628$Ph4.4714258
@ursa-nb00s0.nbnet.nb.ca:

As long as you're not choking on the 10:1 gas/oil ratio.
Can't get the conversion for my 1954 40 Plus Seagull.



What conversion? Why do you think it's been running since 1954?

According to my calculations, by the way, if 2-stroke motors are so
dangerous to the lakes and have been running in them for about 100
years....The lakes should be about 3" deep in lube oil, by now.

Wonder what happened to all that oil??

dingy question - another Porta-Bote fan (in depth review)
 

Larry wrote:
Don White wrote in news:mZOxf.154628$Ph4.4714258
@ursa-nb00s0.nbnet.nb.ca:


As long as you're not choking on the 10:1 gas/oil ratio.
Can't get the conversion for my 1954 40 Plus Seagull.




What conversion? Why do you think it's been running since 1954?

According to my calculations, by the way, if 2-stroke motors are so
dangerous to the lakes and have been running in them for about 100
years....The lakes should be about 3" deep in lube oil, by now.

Wonder what happened to all that oil??


The models that came after mine could be retrofitted with a new
carburator part (jet??)that allowed you to use a 25:1 ratio.

dingy question - another Porta-Bote fan (in depth review)
 

Don White wrote in news:rb%xf.155035$Ph4.4723436
@ursa-nb00s0.nbnet.nb.ca:

The models that came after mine could be retrofitted with a new
carburator part (jet??)that allowed you to use a 25:1 ratio.



I've always been convinced the reason "they" want you to run so thin a
lube oil is to hit the target of the powerhead wearing out 3 days after
the end of the warranty period.

Case in point was a 1997 Sea Rayder F16XR2 jetboat I owned. After seeing
several recalls of the cheap plastic oil injection system that failed a
lot blowing powerheads for lack of oil, even at 50:1, I removed all that
and used 25:1 mixture for the rest of the time I owned it, long over 1000
hours. The present owner has another thousand hours on it mixing just
that way and the engine is still tight, starts instantly and turns as
many RPM as the day it was purchased. Unfortunately, for him, his
girlfriend, a beautiful Eurasian in her 20's now, would always ride with
me in it to the beach. He, stupidly, scared her and she doesn't like to
ride around with him in it, now....(c;

I don't believe you can overoil a 2-stroker. It's just a matter of what
you find the acceptable life of it to be. Since 1954 sounds like you'd
be better off not screwing around with a mixture that works great for 50
years!