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[email protected] December 5th 05 10:23 PM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 

TAYANA VANCOUVER 460 PILOT
Angle of vanishing stability = 110 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.24
Capsize screening ratio = 1.57

BENETEAU 473
Angle of vanishing stability = 119 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.34
Capsize screening ratio = 1.96

CATALINA 42 MARK II
Angle of vanishing stability = 105 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.39
Capsize screening ratio = 1.97

Jeff December 5th 05 11:18 PM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 
The one with the least experienced skipper.



wrote:
TAYANA VANCOUVER 460 PILOT
Angle of vanishing stability = 110 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.24
Capsize screening ratio = 1.57

BENETEAU 473
Angle of vanishing stability = 119 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.34
Capsize screening ratio = 1.96

CATALINA 42 MARK II
Angle of vanishing stability = 105 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.39
Capsize screening ratio = 1.97


Glenn Ashmore December 5th 05 11:24 PM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 
Based on those numbers (which are highly theoretical);
The Tayana will be a bit have a more comfortable motion but most possible of
capsize and slower to recover.
The Catalina will be stiffer and harder to turn over, may turn turtle in a
major knock down but faster to recover.
The Beneteau will be between on comfort and can handle a more severe knock
down but will recover slower than the Catalina and faster than the Tayana.

You need to get over the buy now fever and invest in a few books. .

--
Glenn Ashmore

I'm building a 45' cutter in strip/composite. Watch my progress (or lack
there of) at: http://www.rutuonline.com
Shameless Commercial Division: http://www.spade-anchor-us.com

wrote in message
k.net...

TAYANA VANCOUVER 460 PILOT
Angle of vanishing stability = 110 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.24
Capsize screening ratio = 1.57

BENETEAU 473
Angle of vanishing stability = 119 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.34
Capsize screening ratio = 1.96

CATALINA 42 MARK II
Angle of vanishing stability = 105 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.39
Capsize screening ratio = 1.97




Wayne.B December 5th 05 11:37 PM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 
On Mon, 5 Dec 2005 18:24:41 -0500, "Glenn Ashmore"
wrote:

You need to get over the buy now fever and invest in a few books.


========================

Good advice.

You should also take a look around at what other boats people are
doing serious cruising in.

The boat most likely to capsize is the one that has been put into a
situation where it doesn't belong, and shouldn't have been taken. Go
to a place where serious cruisers hang out and get to know some of
them. You will learn a lot if you listen.


Gary December 6th 05 01:47 AM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 
wrote:
TAYANA VANCOUVER 460 PILOT
Angle of vanishing stability = 110 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.24
Capsize screening ratio = 1.57

BENETEAU 473
Angle of vanishing stability = 119 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.34
Capsize screening ratio = 1.96

CATALINA 42 MARK II
Angle of vanishing stability = 105 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.39
Capsize screening ratio = 1.97

The Beneteau and the Catalina have higher CSR making them more likely to
capsize. 2 is the upper limit for an offshore boat.

The AVS for all these boat sucks. The Catalina and Tayana can barely go
below horizontal! Not good or not right! Tayana claims a much better
AVS than this.

Gaz

Check out:
http://www.image-ination.com/sailcalc.html

Calculate this stuff yourself.

Gary December 6th 05 01:58 AM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 
TAYANA VANCOUVER 460 PILOT
Angle of vanishing stability = 110 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.24
Capsize screening ratio = 1.57

BENETEAU 473
Angle of vanishing stability = 119 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.34
Capsize screening ratio = 1.96

CATALINA 42 MARK II
Angle of vanishing stability = 105 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.39
Capsize screening ratio = 1.97


Glenn Ashmore wrote:
Based on those numbers (which are highly theoretical);
The Tayana will be a bit have a more comfortable motion but most possible of
capsize and slower to recover.
The Catalina will be stiffer and harder to turn over, may turn turtle in a
major knock down but faster to recover.
The Beneteau will be between on comfort and can handle a more severe knock
down but will recover slower than the Catalina and faster than the Tayana.

You need to get over the buy now fever and invest in a few books. .

Boy are you out to lunch.

The Tayana is most stable indicated by the capsize factor. (The lower
the better) The Catalina is least stable.

There are no comfort figures here but the can be worked out at:
http://www.image-ination.com/sailcalc.html
http://www.sailingusa.info/design_winds.htm

I think the Tayana with the pilothouse will recover very fast.

Gaz

Danny December 6th 05 02:04 AM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 

wrote in message
k.net...

TAYANA VANCOUVER 460 PILOT
Angle of vanishing stability = 110 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.24
Capsize screening ratio = 1.57

BENETEAU 473
Angle of vanishing stability = 119 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.34
Capsize screening ratio = 1.96

CATALINA 42 MARK II
Angle of vanishing stability = 105 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.39
Capsize screening ratio = 1.97


Poopie:

Did the Tayana dealer prepare you for the 12-24 month wait for construction
on a new one? And the unbelievable cost to rig one once it's delivered? ( I
worked on a new 46 two years ago)

As far as capsizing: Unless you plan to start sailing soon, and then take
many lessons, practice on countless trips for a few years and learn to
master each and every one of the mechanical systems aboard before rounding
one of the Capes, you'll face far worse and more probable problems than
capsizing.

And, as your best friend, I would gladly pay you on Tuesday for the George
Forman grill upgrade today on this baby. Burgers and beers in the tropics!
Yum!

Fair Winds and calm sea,

Whimpie



Gary December 6th 05 02:20 AM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 
Danny wrote:
wrote in message
k.net...

TAYANA VANCOUVER 460 PILOT
Angle of vanishing stability = 110 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.24
Capsize screening ratio = 1.57

BENETEAU 473
Angle of vanishing stability = 119 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.34
Capsize screening ratio = 1.96

CATALINA 42 MARK II
Angle of vanishing stability = 105 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.39
Capsize screening ratio = 1.97



Poopie:

Did the Tayana dealer prepare you for the 12-24 month wait for construction
on a new one? And the unbelievable cost to rig one once it's delivered? ( I
worked on a new 46 two years ago)

As far as capsizing: Unless you plan to start sailing soon, and then take
many lessons, practice on countless trips for a few years and learn to
master each and every one of the mechanical systems aboard before rounding
one of the Capes, you'll face far worse and more probable problems than
capsizing.

And, as your best friend, I would gladly pay you on Tuesday for the George
Forman grill upgrade today on this baby. Burgers and beers in the tropics!
Yum!

Fair Winds and calm sea,

Whimpie


You guys make it all sound so difficult. Buy one Popeye. Your new
sailing friends will be coming out of the woodwork.

Danny December 6th 05 04:19 AM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 

"Gary" wrote in message
news:kz6lf.54743$Eq5.10856@pd7tw1no...
Danny wrote:
wrote in message
k.net...

TAYANA VANCOUVER 460 PILOT
Angle of vanishing stability = 110 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.24
Capsize screening ratio = 1.57

BENETEAU 473
Angle of vanishing stability = 119 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.34
Capsize screening ratio = 1.96

CATALINA 42 MARK II
Angle of vanishing stability = 105 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.39
Capsize screening ratio = 1.97



Poopie:

Did the Tayana dealer prepare you for the 12-24 month wait for
construction on a new one? And the unbelievable cost to rig one once it's
delivered? ( I worked on a new 46 two years ago)

As far as capsizing: Unless you plan to start sailing soon, and then take
many lessons, practice on countless trips for a few years and learn to
master each and every one of the mechanical systems aboard before
rounding one of the Capes, you'll face far worse and more probable
problems than capsizing.

And, as your best friend, I would gladly pay you on Tuesday for the
George Forman grill upgrade today on this baby. Burgers and beers in the
tropics! Yum!

Fair Winds and calm sea,

Whimpie

You guys make it all sound so difficult. Buy one Popeye. Your new
sailing friends will be coming out of the woodwork.


Sounds like naiveté speaking. Sail any distance and you'll feel the same way
as my last response. I only have 20,000 miles under my keel but I tell you
that I'm not overstating the concern. This guy, if he's half serious,
doesn't know enough to pull a dingy off the dock. These are newbie questions
that belie a total lack of essential knowledge. First and foremost, he asks
total strangers for advice! At least join a sailing club and ask guys you
know!

Crossing an ocean IS difficult. But then this is all a fools wag. Poopie is
a mere troll stirring up discussion for amusement.



Larry December 6th 05 05:11 AM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 
"Glenn Ashmore" wrote in news:p_3lf.3909$fz5.168
@dukeread04:

You need to get over the buy now fever and invest in a few books. .



I must admit he must be connected to a GREAT broker who's got him really
fired up!


[email protected] December 6th 05 07:42 AM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 

Gary wrote:
wrote:
TAYANA VANCOUVER 460 PILOT
Angle of vanishing stability = 110 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.24
Capsize screening ratio = 1.57

BENETEAU 473
Angle of vanishing stability = 119 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.34
Capsize screening ratio = 1.96

CATALINA 42 MARK II
Angle of vanishing stability = 105 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.39
Capsize screening ratio = 1.97


The Beneteau and the Catalina have higher CSR making
them more likely to capsize. 2 is the upper limit for
an offshore boat.

The AVS for all these boat sucks. The Catalina and
Tayana can barely go below horizontal! Not good or
not right! Tayana claims a much better AVS than this.

Gaz

Check out: http://www.image-ination.com/sailcalc.html
Calculate this stuff yourself.


Thanks Gary.

The AVS value of 110 degrees for Tayana Vancouver 460
was given to me by Tayana along with the report shown on
my web page at http://tayana46.tripod.com/safety.htm.

Looking at the curve at the bottom of this web page
wouldn't you say that this is the correct value ?

The AVS numbers for the Beneteau 473 and Catalina 42
mark II were taken from:

http://www.rya.org.uk/images/uploade...e_10_11_05.pdf

[email protected] December 6th 05 07:54 AM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 

"Danny" wrote:
Did the Tayana dealer prepare you for the 12-24 month wait for construction
on a new one? And the unbelievable cost to rig one once it's delivered? ( I
worked on a new 46 two years ago)

As far as capsizing: Unless you plan to start sailing soon, and then take
many lessons, practice on countless trips for a few years and learn to
master each and every one of the mechanical systems aboard before rounding
one of the Capes, you'll face far worse and more probable problems than
capsizing.

And, as your best friend, I would gladly pay you on Tuesday for the George
Forman grill upgrade today on this baby. Burgers and beers in the tropics!
Yum!

Fair Winds and calm sea,
Whimpie


Thanks Whimpie

The boat is almost done and I've already seen several pictures taken at
the factory. Both the dealer and the Tayana engineer I talked to told me
that it's just going to take about 2 more months.

I can ask the dealer if the rigging cost is included in the selling price.

I don't plan on crossing any ocean until 2007 or later :-)

d parker December 6th 05 11:17 AM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 
Does it matter? Are you actually planning on sailing out of the bay or
river you live on? Most yacht owners day sail or spend a week in sheltered
bays and never put to sea. My guess is you will be doing the same. All that
is left is Rhetoric.

DP
wrote in message
k.net...

TAYANA VANCOUVER 460 PILOT
Angle of vanishing stability = 110 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.24
Capsize screening ratio = 1.57

BENETEAU 473
Angle of vanishing stability = 119 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.34
Capsize screening ratio = 1.96

CATALINA 42 MARK II
Angle of vanishing stability = 105 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.39
Capsize screening ratio = 1.97




MMC December 6th 05 04:32 PM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 
Apparently you haven't been following. This guy has bought Thailand and is
in no hurry to get there.
"d parker" wrote in message
...
Does it matter? Are you actually planning on sailing out of the bay or
river you live on? Most yacht owners day sail or spend a week in sheltered
bays and never put to sea. My guess is you will be doing the same. All

that
is left is Rhetoric.

DP
wrote in message
k.net...

TAYANA VANCOUVER 460 PILOT
Angle of vanishing stability = 110 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.24
Capsize screening ratio = 1.57

BENETEAU 473
Angle of vanishing stability = 119 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.34
Capsize screening ratio = 1.96

CATALINA 42 MARK II
Angle of vanishing stability = 105 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.39
Capsize screening ratio = 1.97






[email protected] December 6th 05 08:11 PM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 

wrote:

TAYANA VANCOUVER 460 PILOT
Angle of vanishing stability = 110 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.24
Capsize screening ratio = 1.57

BENETEAU 473
Angle of vanishing stability = 119 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.34
Capsize screening ratio = 1.96

CATALINA 42 MARK II
Angle of vanishing stability = 105 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.39
Capsize screening ratio = 1.97


ETAP 46DS (standard deep keel)
Angle of vanishing stability = 129 degrees
Ballast/displacement ratio = 0.32
Capsize screening ratio = 1.92

Maybe I'll just get a Tayana for now and get an unsinkable
ETAP later when I have more money and want to sail across
an ocean :-)

[email protected] December 6th 05 11:23 PM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 
Danny,

Unfortunatly I am periously close to Poopie (love the spelling.) Last
year I bought a bunch of land in Nova Scotia, a 20 year old 33' custom
steel cutter, and moved one to the other. Never sailed before but lots
of time on stink pots. Anyway I got there, after about a week. A
little over 400 miles, on the chart.

I think you are right that he is trolling for amusement. But it IS
amusing. Not only his posts but the dead serious answers intermixed
with the others who have "outed" him.

And, you gotta admit, he must have the hide of a rhino. Or is it
brain. Either way, for now he does make me laugh, if only at myself.

Howard


Denis Marier December 6th 05 11:46 PM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 
The Angle of vanishing stability,Ballast/displacement and
the Capsize screening ratio are useful in choosing a sailboat.

However, I would not take all these calculated ratio's for granted.
How can you validate these ratio's. The best thing is to corroborate the
designs in real situation. This is very difficult to accomplish. How can
you duplicate a real situation.
Computer simulations can be helpful to validate your design to a certain
extent but never at 100%. Sea trials, track records and past performance in
all imaginable conditions can be very useful to corroborate computer
simulations and to confirm applicable ratio's.

wrote in message
. net...

wrote:

TAYANA VANCOUVER 460 PILOT
Angle of vanishing stability = 110 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.24
Capsize screening ratio = 1.57

BENETEAU 473
Angle of vanishing stability = 119 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.34
Capsize screening ratio = 1.96

CATALINA 42 MARK II
Angle of vanishing stability = 105 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.39
Capsize screening ratio = 1.97


ETAP 46DS (standard deep keel)
Angle of vanishing stability = 129 degrees
Ballast/displacement ratio = 0.32
Capsize screening ratio = 1.92

Maybe I'll just get a Tayana for now and get an unsinkable
ETAP later when I have more money and want to sail across
an ocean :-)




prodigal1 December 7th 05 12:23 AM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 
Jeff wrote:
The one with the least experienced skipper.


DING! We have a winner folks!
Thread's over
Move on folks, there's nothing left to see

Danny December 7th 05 01:03 AM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 

wrote in message
oups.com...
Danny,

Unfortunatly I am periously close to Poopie (love the spelling.) Last
year I bought a bunch of land in Nova Scotia, a 20 year old 33' custom
steel cutter, and moved one to the other. Never sailed before but lots
of time on stink pots. Anyway I got there, after about a week. A
little over 400 miles, on the chart.

I think you are right that he is trolling for amusement. But it IS
amusing. Not only his posts but the dead serious answers intermixed
with the others who have "outed" him.

And, you gotta admit, he must have the hide of a rhino. Or is it
brain. Either way, for now he does make me laugh, if only at myself.

Howard


Howard:

You and I are tracking. It is indeed amusing and the answers have been
informative. It's a good group.

How's the sailing in NS in the winter? My brother in-law lives in Portland,
Maine. The combination of the ridiculous fog and the rocky shore make the
case for your steel hull.
Danny



Danny December 7th 05 01:03 AM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 

wrote in message
oups.com...
Danny,

Unfortunatly I am perilously close to Poopie (love the spelling.) Last
year I bought a bunch of land in Nova Scotia, a 20 year old 33' custom
steel cutter, and moved one to the other. Never sailed before but lots
of time on stink pots. Anyway I got there, after about a week. A
little over 400 miles, on the chart.

I think you are right that he is trolling for amusement. But it IS
amusing. Not only his posts but the dead serious answers intermixed
with the others who have "outed" him.

And, you gotta admit, he must have the hide of a rhino. Or is it
brain. Either way, for now he does make me laugh, if only at myself.

Howard


Howard:

You and I are tracking. It is indeed amusing and the answers have been
informative. It's a good group.

How's the sailing in NS in the winter? My brother in-law lives in Portland,
Maine. The combination of the ridiculous fog and the rocky shore make the
case for your steel hull.
Danny




Gary December 7th 05 01:11 AM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 
Danny wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...

Danny,

Unfortunatly I am periously close to Poopie (love the spelling.) Last
year I bought a bunch of land in Nova Scotia, a 20 year old 33' custom
steel cutter, and moved one to the other. Never sailed before but lots
of time on stink pots. Anyway I got there, after about a week. A
little over 400 miles, on the chart.

I think you are right that he is trolling for amusement. But it IS
amusing. Not only his posts but the dead serious answers intermixed
with the others who have "outed" him.

And, you gotta admit, he must have the hide of a rhino. Or is it
brain. Either way, for now he does make me laugh, if only at myself.

Howard



Howard:

You and I are tracking. It is indeed amusing and the answers have been
informative. It's a good group.

How's the sailing in NS in the winter? My brother in-law lives in Portland,
Maine. The combination of the ridiculous fog and the rocky shore make the
case for your steel hull.
Danny


I am enjoying the banter. I find it enlightening that folks can
absolutely confidently say things that are so wrong. I wonder if they
are embarrassed when caught or if it is always a troll.

Gaz

Danny December 7th 05 01:27 AM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 

"Gary" wrote in message
news:NEqlf.57472$Gd6.335@pd7tw3no...
Danny wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...

Danny,

Unfortunatly I am periously close to Poopie (love the spelling.) Last
year I bought a bunch of land in Nova Scotia, a 20 year old 33' custom
steel cutter, and moved one to the other. Never sailed before but lots
of time on stink pots. Anyway I got there, after about a week. A
little over 400 miles, on the chart.

I think you are right that he is trolling for amusement. But it IS
amusing. Not only his posts but the dead serious answers intermixed
with the others who have "outed" him.

And, you gotta admit, he must have the hide of a rhino. Or is it
brain. Either way, for now he does make me laugh, if only at myself.

Howard



Howard:

You and I are tracking. It is indeed amusing and the answers have been
informative. It's a good group.

How's the sailing in NS in the winter? My brother in-law lives in
Portland, Maine. The combination of the ridiculous fog and the rocky
shore make the case for your steel hull.
Danny


I am enjoying the banter. I find it enlightening that folks can
absolutely confidently say things that are so wrong. I wonder if they are
embarrassed when caught or if it is always a troll.

Gaz


I have to admit, Poopie is far and away the best troll I've seen. If he is a
troll.
If he's serious, he needs to take up something safer like Motocross. Some of
the advice has been awful and ill informed. But there are some gems. When
I'm flummoxed, I ask the older salts in my club because I can see the
position of their tongue when they answer.
Poopie asks lamo questions in a way that stimulates good dialog. As Howard
pointed out, Poopie has the hide of a Rhino! He comes back for more and with
more. Most trolls just sling meaningless threats, insults and non sense.
I've learned a few things reading the serious replies.



[email protected] December 7th 05 03:02 AM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 
Danny,

I wish I knew how the sailing was. I live in Philadelphia and my wife
said I had to keep my mistress at a fair distance. Thus she sits on
the hard in Sydney, NS.

But this summer, I get a month off, 200 miles to St. Pierre and
Bastille Day, then back along the south coast of Newfoundland. If my
steel hull "thwangs" when I bump you may hear me unaided where you
live.

I can attest to the fog in SE Nova Scotia. I could see the variations
in fog density in an arms length and one evening I litteraly saw the
shadow of my sails on the edge of a fog bank. I throughly under
estimated the variation in temperature. Several tmes, within an hour,
I went from shorts to full fleece and gear to shorts. I was lucky to
stay dry for I didn't bring half enough warm clothes had things gone
south.


[email protected] December 7th 05 03:17 AM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 

I'm waiting for Robert Harris, the designer of the Tayana
Vancouver 460, to explain to me why I shouldn't be too
concerned about the stability of this boat and will let you
know what he has to say.

If you still think I'm a troll just call the Tayana and Beneteau
dealers in San Diego and ask if Popeye has come to see them.

Jere Lull December 7th 05 03:30 AM

Asking total strangers for advice
 
In article ,
"Danny" wrote:

First and foremost, he asks total strangers for advice!


By in large, the total strangers on this list are more knowledgeable
and honest than his friends at the dock -- because many of us aren't AT
the dock.

Most if the times I hear our dock gurus speak, I snicker.

Yes, there is a wide range of opinions and that's a good thing. There's
rarely one right answer, only a continuum of trade-offs.

Yes, there are some on the list that should be ignored, but they're
easily discovered to be the ones who flame rather than debate.


--
Jere Lull
Xan-a-Deux ('73 Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD)
Xan's Pages: http://members.dca.net/jerelull/X-Main.html
Our BVI FAQs (290+ pics) http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/

Danny December 7th 05 03:53 AM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 

wrote in message
.net...

I'm waiting for Robert Harris, the designer of the Tayana
Vancouver 460, to explain to me why I shouldn't be too
concerned about the stability of this boat and will let you
know what he has to say.

If you still think I'm a troll just call the Tayana and Beneteau
dealers in San Diego and ask if Popeye has come to see them.


You've got heart and grit Popeye. I suspect you'll do fine. Keep at it.



Gary December 7th 05 05:50 AM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 
Danny wrote:
"Gary" wrote in message
news:NEqlf.57472$Gd6.335@pd7tw3no...

Danny wrote:

wrote in message
egroups.com...


Danny,

Unfortunatly I am periously close to Poopie (love the spelling.) Last
year I bought a bunch of land in Nova Scotia, a 20 year old 33' custom
steel cutter, and moved one to the other. Never sailed before but lots
of time on stink pots. Anyway I got there, after about a week. A
little over 400 miles, on the chart.

I think you are right that he is trolling for amusement. But it IS
amusing. Not only his posts but the dead serious answers intermixed
with the others who have "outed" him.

And, you gotta admit, he must have the hide of a rhino. Or is it
brain. Either way, for now he does make me laugh, if only at myself.

Howard


Howard:

You and I are tracking. It is indeed amusing and the answers have been
informative. It's a good group.

How's the sailing in NS in the winter? My brother in-law lives in
Portland, Maine. The combination of the ridiculous fog and the rocky
shore make the case for your steel hull.
Danny



I am enjoying the banter. I find it enlightening that folks can
absolutely confidently say things that are so wrong. I wonder if they are
embarrassed when caught or if it is always a troll.

Gaz



I have to admit, Poopie is far and away the best troll I've seen. If he is a
troll.
If he's serious, he needs to take up something safer like Motocross. Some of
the advice has been awful and ill informed. But there are some gems. When
I'm flummoxed, I ask the older salts in my club because I can see the
position of their tongue when they answer.
Poopie asks lamo questions in a way that stimulates good dialog. As Howard
pointed out, Poopie has the hide of a Rhino! He comes back for more and with
more. Most trolls just sling meaningless threats, insults and non sense.
I've learned a few things reading the serious replies.


I think he is genuinely soliciting advice.

d parker December 7th 05 12:30 PM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 
Hmmm... ok.. yeh. i have to admit. I have left a lot this guys posts alone
as there seems to be a Trolling warning on every post he makes.

DP
"MMC" wrote in message
...
Apparently you haven't been following. This guy has bought Thailand and is
in no hurry to get there.
"d parker" wrote in message
...
Does it matter? Are you actually planning on sailing out of the bay or
river you live on? Most yacht owners day sail or spend a week in
sheltered
bays and never put to sea. My guess is you will be doing the same. All

that
is left is Rhetoric.

DP
wrote in message
k.net...

TAYANA VANCOUVER 460 PILOT
Angle of vanishing stability = 110 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.24
Capsize screening ratio = 1.57

BENETEAU 473
Angle of vanishing stability = 119 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.34
Capsize screening ratio = 1.96

CATALINA 42 MARK II
Angle of vanishing stability = 105 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.39
Capsize screening ratio = 1.97








Leanne December 7th 05 03:08 PM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 
I think he is genuinely soliciting advice.

I have been wondering about this person and just how much
experience he has. If he is just looking for a live aboard in
Thailand, why not buy some roomy dock queen and have it shipped
to one of the ports in the Gulf of Siam or Andaman sea and the
move it to where the dock or mooring chains are located. I don't
believe he could make the trip under sail no matter which boat
he bought.

Leanne



MMC December 7th 05 07:05 PM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 
Right, sounds like he can't keep track of his stories as he's now talking
about not crossing an ocean in the new yacht.
"d parker" wrote in message
...
Hmmm... ok.. yeh. i have to admit. I have left a lot this guys posts alone
as there seems to be a Trolling warning on every post he makes.

DP
"MMC" wrote in message
...
Apparently you haven't been following. This guy has bought Thailand and

is
in no hurry to get there.
"d parker" wrote in message
...
Does it matter? Are you actually planning on sailing out of the bay or
river you live on? Most yacht owners day sail or spend a week in
sheltered
bays and never put to sea. My guess is you will be doing the same. All

that
is left is Rhetoric.

DP
wrote in message
k.net...

TAYANA VANCOUVER 460 PILOT
Angle of vanishing stability = 110 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.24
Capsize screening ratio = 1.57

BENETEAU 473
Angle of vanishing stability = 119 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.34
Capsize screening ratio = 1.96

CATALINA 42 MARK II
Angle of vanishing stability = 105 degrees
Ballast/displacement = 0.39
Capsize screening ratio = 1.97









[email protected] December 7th 05 07:55 PM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 

"Leanne" wrote:
I think he is genuinely soliciting advice.


I have been wondering about this person and just how much
experience he has. If he is just looking for a live aboard in
Thailand, why not buy some roomy dock queen and have it shipped
to one of the ports in the Gulf of Siam or Andaman sea and the
move it to where the dock or mooring chains are located. I don't
believe he could make the trip under sail no matter which boat
he bought.


I don't plan on sailing across the Pacific before 2007 or 2008.
I'm going to build a house on Lanta Island and may want to live
aboard while the house is under construction.

I've read the book "The Voyage of the Northern Magic" about
a Canadian family's circumnavigating the globe. Their entire
sailing experience before they departed was six afternoons on
the Ottawa River. So there's no reason why I couldn't make it
across the Pacific with 1-2 years sailing experience.

[email protected] December 7th 05 08:12 PM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 

"MMC" wrote:
Right, sounds like he can't keep track of his stories as
he's now talking about not crossing an ocean in the new yacht.


I said "Maybe I'll just get a Tayana for now and get an
unsinkable ETAP later when I have more money and want to
sail across an ocean :-)"

":-)" indicates that I may be kidding.

krj December 7th 05 08:39 PM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 
wrote:
"Leanne" wrote:

I think he is genuinely soliciting advice.


I have been wondering about this person and just how much
experience he has. If he is just looking for a live aboard in
Thailand, why not buy some roomy dock queen and have it shipped
to one of the ports in the Gulf of Siam or Andaman sea and the
move it to where the dock or mooring chains are located. I don't
believe he could make the trip under sail no matter which boat
he bought.



I don't plan on sailing across the Pacific before 2007 or 2008.
I'm going to build a house on Lanta Island and may want to live
aboard while the house is under construction.

I've read the book "The Voyage of the Northern Magic" about
a Canadian family's circumnavigating the globe. Their entire
sailing experience before they departed was six afternoons on
the Ottawa River. So there's no reason why I couldn't make it
across the Pacific with 1-2 years sailing experience.


Read John Caldwell's book "Desperate Voyage" and see what an
inexperienced sailor went through sailing from Panama to Australia.
krj

[email protected] December 7th 05 09:26 PM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 

krj wrote:
I've read the book "The Voyage of the Northern Magic" about
a Canadian family's circumnavigating the globe. Their entire
sailing experience before they departed was six afternoons on
the Ottawa River. So there's no reason why I couldn't make it
across the Pacific with 1-2 years sailing experience.


Read John Caldwell's book "Desperate Voyage" and see what an
inexperienced sailor went through sailing from Panama to
Australia.
krj


So how many years or miles of experience would you suggest
I have before taking such a trip ?

[email protected] December 7th 05 10:35 PM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 

wrote:

I'm waiting for Robert Harris, the designer of the Tayana
Vancouver 460, to explain to me why I shouldn't be too
concerned about the stability of this boat and will let you
know what he has to say.


I've just been told that Bob has a family member in hospital
so it may be a few days before I hear from him.

Wayne.B December 7th 05 11:15 PM

Which boat is most likely to capsize ?
 
On Wed, 07 Dec 2005 21:26:14 GMT, wrote:

Read John Caldwell's book "Desperate Voyage" and see what an
inexperienced sailor went through sailing from Panama to
Australia.
krj


So how many years or miles of experience would you suggest
I have before taking such a trip ?


============================================

Work your way up to it with shorter trips closer to landfall. Once
you've spent a few days with the boat heeled over 25 degrees and
punching through solid waves, you will realize that it's not just the
strength of the boat that is at issue. The romance goes out of it
pretty quickly in tough conditions.



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