where2 get cheap sounding lead ?
 

Maybe a fisherman's outlet ?

Hopefully,
Courtney

If you're making your own, go to the tire shops and get their used lead. See
Glenn Ashmore's site about how he built his keel!

L8R

Skip, sold out and headed to moving aboard and cutting the cord

--
Morgan 461 #2
SV Flying Pig
http://tinyurl.com/384p2 The vessel as Tehamana, as we bought her

"Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you
didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail
away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore.
Dream. Discover." - Mark Twain
"Courtney Thomas" wrote in message
. ..
Maybe a fisherman's outlet ?

Hopefully,
Courtney

Go to an automotive tire store and buy some used tire weights. Any old
scrap lead will do.

Melt the lead (do this outdoors) in an old pot, and pour it into a mold
that you make. Make a sounding lead shape using wax.
Make a mold for the lead using 'cement mortar mix' from home depot etc.
with the wax 'image' inside it. Mix up the mortar mix with only enough
water to make the cement 'barely stick together' - 'ram' the barely wet
cement together ... to form a mold that easily breaks apart.
Put the mold in an oven inverted so that the wax melts and runs out the
mold, heat the 'weak cement' at 300 degrees for at least 8 hours to
drive off all moisture in the mold.
Heat the lead in an old pot until it melts (do this outside to prevent
breathing lead vapors)., pour the lead into the mold and let cool.
brreak up the cement mortar mix carefully so as not to also break the
lead, trim the lead to remove all imperfections.

If the tire store wont sell old lead tire balancing weights, buy 4 ox.
fishing sinkers from a fishing shop and melt them, etc. Any old scrap
lead wil do.

Hope this helps.

"Skip Gundlach" skipgundlach at earthlink dot fishcatcher (.net)
wrote:

If you're making your own, go to the tire shops and get their used lead. See
Glenn Ashmore's site about how he built his keel!

Is there that much lead in a sounding lead?

In any case, I really do not agree that melting lead is the way to go
because lead overexposure is no joke, and it can occur even outdoors.
If you were doing it on a very limited basis, it probably would be OK
provided that you were not also exposed in other ways (like removing
lead paint or making your own lead shot).

grandma Rosalie

Courtney,

This is the cheapest one I've found so far:

http://www.elishawebb.com/Leadlines.htm


"Courtney Thomas" wrote in message
. ..
Maybe a fisherman's outlet ?

Hopefully,
Courtney

How does melting lead expose you to lead? There are NO lead fumes and you
can wear gloves. If melting lead was a problem, every person that ever
soldered would have a problem!
That said, old tire weights are covered with dirt, grease, rubber and
everything else off the road and will certainly smoke and smell bad when
melting the lead and that stuff, I would not breathe!
I melt the stuff outside in a coffee can on an old camp stove.
Gordon


"Rosalie B." wrote in message
...
"Skip Gundlach" skipgundlach at earthlink dot fishcatcher (.net)
wrote:

If you're making your own, go to the tire shops and get their used lead.
See
Glenn Ashmore's site about how he built his keel!

Is there that much lead in a sounding lead?

In any case, I really do not agree that melting lead is the way to go
because lead overexposure is no joke, and it can occur even outdoors.
If you were doing it on a very limited basis, it probably would be OK
provided that you were not also exposed in other ways (like removing
lead paint or making your own lead shot).

grandma Rosalie

There's also no reason that I can think of which demands that a lead
actually be made of lead. I should think that one could be fabricated from
mild steel quite cheaply. Epoxy coating would make an effective barrier
against corrosion. Stainless would be better, but more expensive.

KLC Lewis
www.cafepress.com/tmen
www.heavenisforsale.com


"Gordon" wrote in message
...
How does melting lead expose you to lead? There are NO lead fumes and
you
can wear gloves. If melting lead was a problem, every person that ever
soldered would have a problem!
That said, old tire weights are covered with dirt, grease, rubber and
everything else off the road and will certainly smoke and smell bad when
melting the lead and that stuff, I would not breathe!
I melt the stuff outside in a coffee can on an old camp stove.
Gordon


"Rosalie B." wrote in message
...
"Skip Gundlach" skipgundlach at earthlink dot fishcatcher (.net)
wrote:

If you're making your own, go to the tire shops and get their used lead.
See
Glenn Ashmore's site about how he built his keel!

Is there that much lead in a sounding lead?

In any case, I really do not agree that melting lead is the way to go
because lead overexposure is no joke, and it can occur even outdoors.
If you were doing it on a very limited basis, it probably would be OK
provided that you were not also exposed in other ways (like removing
lead paint or making your own lead shot).

grandma Rosalie

There's nothing wrong with bronze:

http://www.robertwhite.com/cgi-local...bar=weatherKLC


Lewis wrote:
There's also no reason that I can think of which demands that a lead
actually be made of lead. I should think that one could be fabricated from
mild steel quite cheaply. Epoxy coating would make an effective barrier
against corrosion. Stainless would be better, but more expensive.

KLC Lewis
www.cafepress.com/tmen
www.heavenisforsale.com


"Gordon" wrote in message
...

How does melting lead expose you to lead? There are NO lead fumes and
you
can wear gloves. If melting lead was a problem, every person that ever
soldered would have a problem!
That said, old tire weights are covered with dirt, grease, rubber and
everything else off the road and will certainly smoke and smell bad when
melting the lead and that stuff, I would not breathe!
I melt the stuff outside in a coffee can on an old camp stove.
Gordon


"Rosalie B." wrote in message
. ..

"Skip Gundlach" skipgundlach at earthlink dot fishcatcher (.net)
wrote:


If you're making your own, go to the tire shops and get their used lead.

See

Glenn Ashmore's site about how he built his keel!


Is there that much lead in a sounding lead?

In any case, I really do not agree that melting lead is the way to go
because lead overexposure is no joke, and it can occur even outdoors.
If you were doing it on a very limited basis, it probably would be OK
provided that you were not also exposed in other ways (like removing
lead paint or making your own lead shot).

grandma Rosalie

"Gordon" wrote:

How does melting lead expose you to lead? There are NO lead fumes and you

There ARE lead fumes. I once sampled in an old garage where they were
melting lead to make flower arranging frogs (those things with the
spikes in them that sit in the bottom of the vase so the flower stems
don't fall over). The whole place was so permeated with lead that
they could not even tear it down without making it hazardous waste.
Great overexposures to lead.

Welding, even on mild steel can create a problem, and also of course
using red lead paint, or doing construction on steel that has been
painted with lead paint. Even children who live near a construction
project on a bridge which has been painted with lead paint can lead
overexposures.

can wear gloves. If melting lead was a problem, every person that ever

Gloves only protect you from the heat. The danger with lead is
inhaling the fume.

soldered would have a problem!

I've also sampled in radiator repair shops - lots of lead exposure
when they solder the radiators. Respirators required and periodic
blood testing. Ventilation helps.

Most people that use lead-tin solder don't do enough of it to have a
problem. The amount of solder is small, and they heat it just barely
hot enough to flow. The amount generated in the microchip industry
for instance is not hazardous.

That said, old tire weights are covered with dirt, grease, rubber and
everything else off the road and will certainly smoke and smell bad when
melting the lead and that stuff, I would not breathe!
I melt the stuff outside in a coffee can on an old camp stove.
Gordon

Dirt, grease and rubber may smell bad, but the lead itself is the
biggest hazard.

I realize that this goes counter to the macho culture, but it is the
truth.

"Rosalie B." wrote in message
.. .
"Skip Gundlach" skipgundlach at earthlink dot fishcatcher (.net)
wrote:

If you're making your own, go to the tire shops and get their used lead.
See
Glenn Ashmore's site about how he built his keel!

Is there that much lead in a sounding lead?

In any case, I really do not agree that melting lead is the way to go
because lead overexposure is no joke, and it can occur even outdoors.
If you were doing it on a very limited basis, it probably would be OK
provided that you were not also exposed in other ways (like removing
lead paint or making your own lead shot).

grandma Rosalie


grandma Rosalie

The boiling point of pure lead is 3180F. The melting point is 621.43F.
Vaporization will not occur at the melting point as you yourself pointed out
with your comment about the microchip industry.
What you sampled, IMHO, was lead dust, not fumes. Did you measure the
particle sizes present?
What was they're method of melting the lead? If they were using a welding
torch, they could very well be exceeding the 3180F temps. This won't happen
with a stove.
Macho Man thump thump thump (sound of beating my chest ;) )


"Rosalie B." wrote in message
...
"Gordon" wrote:

How does melting lead expose you to lead? There are NO lead fumes and
you

There ARE lead fumes. I once sampled in an old garage where they were
melting lead to make flower arranging frogs (those things with the
spikes in them that sit in the bottom of the vase so the flower stems
don't fall over). The whole place was so permeated with lead that
they could not even tear it down without making it hazardous waste.
Great overexposures to lead.

Welding, even on mild steel can create a problem, and also of course
using red lead paint, or doing construction on steel that has been
painted with lead paint. Even children who live near a construction
project on a bridge which has been painted with lead paint can lead
overexposures.

can wear gloves. If melting lead was a problem, every person that ever

Gloves only protect you from the heat. The danger with lead is
inhaling the fume.

soldered would have a problem!

I've also sampled in radiator repair shops - lots of lead exposure
when they solder the radiators. Respirators required and periodic
blood testing. Ventilation helps.

Most people that use lead-tin solder don't do enough of it to have a
problem. The amount of solder is small, and they heat it just barely
hot enough to flow. The amount generated in the microchip industry
for instance is not hazardous.

That said, old tire weights are covered with dirt, grease, rubber and
everything else off the road and will certainly smoke and smell bad when
melting the lead and that stuff, I would not breathe!
I melt the stuff outside in a coffee can on an old camp stove.
Gordon

Dirt, grease and rubber may smell bad, but the lead itself is the
biggest hazard.

I realize that this goes counter to the macho culture, but it is the
truth.

"Rosalie B." wrote in message
.. .
"Skip Gundlach" skipgundlach at earthlink dot fishcatcher (.net)
wrote:

If you're making your own, go to the tire shops and get their used
lead.
See
Glenn Ashmore's site about how he built his keel!

Is there that much lead in a sounding lead?

In any case, I really do not agree that melting lead is the way to go
because lead overexposure is no joke, and it can occur even outdoors.
If you were doing it on a very limited basis, it probably would be OK
provided that you were not also exposed in other ways (like removing
lead paint or making your own lead shot).

grandma Rosalie


grandma Rosalie

Unfortunately, this sort of subjectiveness is the norm for all advertising.
I find it increasingly difficult to do any sort of objective product
evaluations based on the information provided by the manufacturers. Even if
the meaningful data is there, I burnout by the time I wade through all the
marketing BS. I don't know how they can write so much and say so little.


"Dave" wrote in message
...

On Mon, 03 Oct 2005 11:41:06 -0400, Jeff said:


There's nothing wrong with bronze:

This phrase struck me: "safer and more durable than lead." So just how
many
people have gotten lead poisoning from using a sounding lead? How many
lead
sounding weights have disintegrated from corrosion?

Are they simply playing upon the willingness of enviros to accept
unsupported fairy tales?

Just curious, would not a NIOSH organic vapor respirator help? (I mean
the darth vader mask, not the flimpsy paper ones). My guess is, if you
own a boat, you have the half-mask at least anyway (and if not, my
opinion is you should if you ever do bottom or epoxy jobx). All you'd
need is a new set of cartridges if you don't already have the organic
vapor ones; if you do enough of your own boat work to build your own
lead sounder, you should probably already own some serious protective
gear.

I don't knwo what the danger is with lead (other than eathing the paint
like candy), but, as said, was curious.

mickey

Just curious, would not a NIOSH organic vapor respirator help? (I mean
the darth vader mask, not the flimpsy paper ones). My guess is, if you
own a boat, you have the half-mask at least anyway (and if not, my
opinion is you should if you ever do bottom or epoxy jobx). All you'd
need is a new set of cartridges if you don't already have the organic
vapor ones; if you do enough of your own boat work to build your own
lead sounder, you should probably already own some serious protective
gear.

I don't knwo what the danger is with lead (other than eathing the paint
like candy), but, as said, was curious.

mickey

"mickey" wrote:

Just curious, would not a NIOSH organic vapor respirator help? (I mean
the darth vader mask, not the flimpsy paper ones). My guess is, if you

An organic vapor mask won't protect against lead fume because lead
fume isn't an organic vapor. Lead fume is a very small particle.

own a boat, you have the half-mask at least anyway (and if not, my
opinion is you should if you ever do bottom or epoxy jobx). All you'd
need is a new set of cartridges if you don't already have the organic
vapor ones; if you do enough of your own boat work to build your own
lead sounder, you should probably already own some serious protective
gear.

I don't knwo what the danger is with lead (other than eathing the paint
like candy), but, as said, was curious.

In men, lead can damage sperm and affect the sperm's ability to move.
It can affect the number of sperm that is produced in the testes.
These effects on sperm can harm a man's ability to father children and
have been linked to miscarriages and birth defects in their partners.
These health effects can occur at 40-50 ug/dl. Some studies have also
indicated that lead can affect a man's sex drive and ability to have
an erection.

In women, exposure to high levels of lead may cause miscarriages,
premature births, stillbirths and decreased fertility. More recently,
some studies found that pregnant women with levels of lead in the
umbilical cord blood of 10-15 ug/dl had children who suffer from
learning and behavioral problems later in life. This is because lead
in the pregnant mother's blood passes into the blood of the fetus and
may affect brain development.

grandma Rosalie

"Gordon" wrote:

The boiling point of pure lead is 3180F. The melting point is 621.43F.
Vaporization will not occur at the melting point as you yourself pointed out
with your comment about the microchip industry.
What you sampled, IMHO, was lead dust, not fumes. Did you measure the
particle sizes present?

It doesn't really matter to the body whether the lead is breathed in
as dust or fume. Both are hazardous.

What was they're method of melting the lead? If they were using a welding
torch, they could very well be exceeding the 3180F temps. This won't happen
with a stove.

The radiator shops were frequently using propane torches. Welding
cutting or burning on metal with lead paint will release lead fume.
If a shop just used a soldering iron, then I didn't get much exposure.

The people doing the lead frogs were using a propane heated pot. The
actual reason I went there was that the lead melted into the propane
heater orifices and plugged them up so propane was being discharged
unburnt into the atmosphere, and they got propane poisoning. When
they got to the hospital, and alert ER doctor tested their blood for
lead and found high amounts. They also tested the homes of the
workers and found lead contamination there especially where they
dropped their work clothing.

I did once get an exposure to lead in a factory that made fuses when
they weren't using lead solder, but were using silver solder. This
made no sense until I found that they coated the terminals that they
were soldering with lead to keep them from corroding, and when they
did the silver soldering (which is higher temperature than lead solder
as you know), it just vaporized the lead immediately.

Macho Man thump thump thump (sound of beating my chest ;) )


"Rosalie B." wrote in message
.. .
"Gordon" wrote:

How does melting lead expose you to lead? There are NO lead fumes and
you

There ARE lead fumes. I once sampled in an old garage where they were
melting lead to make flower arranging frogs (those things with the
spikes in them that sit in the bottom of the vase so the flower stems
don't fall over). The whole place was so permeated with lead that
they could not even tear it down without making it hazardous waste.
Great overexposures to lead.

Welding, even on mild steel can create a problem, and also of course
using red lead paint, or doing construction on steel that has been
painted with lead paint. Even children who live near a construction
project on a bridge which has been painted with lead paint can lead
overexposures.

can wear gloves. If melting lead was a problem, every person that ever

Gloves only protect you from the heat. The danger with lead is
inhaling the fume.

soldered would have a problem!

I've also sampled in radiator repair shops - lots of lead exposure
when they solder the radiators. Respirators required and periodic
blood testing. Ventilation helps.

Most people that use lead-tin solder don't do enough of it to have a
problem. The amount of solder is small, and they heat it just barely
hot enough to flow. The amount generated in the microchip industry
for instance is not hazardous.

That said, old tire weights are covered with dirt, grease, rubber and
everything else off the road and will certainly smoke and smell bad when
melting the lead and that stuff, I would not breathe!
I melt the stuff outside in a coffee can on an old camp stove.
Gordon

Dirt, grease and rubber may smell bad, but the lead itself is the
biggest hazard.

I realize that this goes counter to the macho culture, but it is the
truth.

"Rosalie B." wrote in message
.. .
"Skip Gundlach" skipgundlach at earthlink dot fishcatcher (.net)
wrote:

If you're making your own, go to the tire shops and get their used
lead.
See
Glenn Ashmore's site about how he built his keel!

Is there that much lead in a sounding lead?

In any case, I really do not agree that melting lead is the way to go
because lead overexposure is no joke, and it can occur even outdoors.
If you were doing it on a very limited basis, it probably would be OK
provided that you were not also exposed in other ways (like removing
lead paint or making your own lead shot).

grandma Rosalie


grandma Rosalie


grandma Rosalie

Dave wrote:


On Mon, 03 Oct 2005 11:41:06 -0400, Jeff said:


There's nothing wrong with bronze:

This phrase struck me: "safer and more durable than lead." So just how many
people have gotten lead poisoning from using a sounding lead? How many lead
sounding weights have disintegrated from corrosion?

I don't think anyone would get lead poisoning from using a sounding
lead. Lead in bulk is pretty much non-hazardous.

Are they simply playing upon the willingness of enviros to accept
unsupported fairy tales?


grandma Rosalie

where2 get cheap sounding lead ?
 

Dave wrote:


On Mon, 03 Oct 2005 18:31:49 GMT, Rosalie B.
said:


The boiling point of pure lead is 3180F. The melting point is 621.43F.
Vaporization will not occur at the melting point as you yourself pointed out
with your comment about the microchip industry.
What you sampled, IMHO, was lead dust, not fumes. Did you measure the
particle sizes present?

It doesn't really matter to the body whether the lead is breathed in
as dust or fume. Both are hazardous.

It makes a great deal of difference, however, to the matter under
discussion. You argue that melting lead in a can over a stove creates lead
fumes. Gordon argues that the temperature is too low to create lead fumes.
The fact that lead might be ingested by breathing dust is utterly irrelevant
to that issue.

Except that lead fume, if it isn't breathed in BECOMES lead dust when
it cools.

What did you think happened to it?


grandma Rosalie

I use a big, old wrench
 

Courtney Thomas wrote:
Maybe a fisherman's outlet ?

Hopefully,
Courtney

where2 get cheap sounding lead ?
 

Landfall Navigation.

"Courtney Thomas" wrote in message
. ..
Maybe a fisherman's outlet ?

Hopefully,
Courtney

where2 get cheap sounding lead ?
 

Sounding leads are generally made of bronze.

"Gordon" wrote in message
...
How does melting lead expose you to lead? There are NO lead fumes and
you
can wear gloves. If melting lead was a problem, every person that ever
soldered would have a problem!
That said, old tire weights are covered with dirt, grease, rubber and
everything else off the road and will certainly smoke and smell bad when
melting the lead and that stuff, I would not breathe!
I melt the stuff outside in a coffee can on an old camp stove.
Gordon


"Rosalie B." wrote in message
...
"Skip Gundlach" skipgundlach at earthlink dot fishcatcher (.net)
wrote:

If you're making your own, go to the tire shops and get their used lead.
See
Glenn Ashmore's site about how he built his keel!

Is there that much lead in a sounding lead?

In any case, I really do not agree that melting lead is the way to go
because lead overexposure is no joke, and it can occur even outdoors.
If you were doing it on a very limited basis, it probably would be OK
provided that you were not also exposed in other ways (like removing
lead paint or making your own lead shot).

grandma Rosalie

where2 get cheap sounding lead ?
 

Here's the scoop. Liquids much over their freezing point have a small
but increasing vapor pressure.

Take water for example - you are not shocked to hear that room
temperature water puts water vapor into the air.

It is the same with lead. Or mercury, or tin or whatever....

Lead that has melted puts a little vapor into the air - the hotter the
lead, the more vapor.

At the boiling point, the vapor pressure gets as high as atmospheric
and can drive out all the air....

It doesn't take much to impact kids' intelligence.

Brian Whatcott Altus OK

On Mon, 3 Oct 2005 09:59:34 -0700, "Gordon"
wrote:

The boiling point of pure lead is 3180F. The melting point is 621.43F.
Vaporization will not occur at the melting point as you yourself pointed out
with your comment about the microchip industry.
///
"Rosalie B." wrote in message
.. .
"Gordon" wrote:

How does melting lead expose you to lead? There are NO lead fumes


There ARE lead fumes. I once sampled in an old garage where they were
melting lead to make flower arranging frogs (those things with the
spikes in them that sit in the bottom of the vase so the flower stems
don't fall over). The whole place was so permeated with lead that
they could not even tear it down without making it hazardous waste.
Great overexposures to lead.
///
grandma Rosalie

where2 get cheap sounding lead ?
 

Go to your local lumber yard and buy a plumb bob! They come in different
sizes and materials including lead and brass.
Gordon


"Doug Dotson" dougdotson@NOSPAMcablespeedNOSPAMcom wrote in message
...
Landfall Navigation.

"Courtney Thomas" wrote in message
. ..
Maybe a fisherman's outlet ?

Hopefully,
Courtney

where2 get cheap sounding lead ?
 

If you like to know my lead adveture go he
http://www.geocities.com/szczurowski...uary_2003.html
and here
http://www.geocities.com/szczurowski...arch_2003.html

or www.seagoatonline.com and folow January and March 2003 of boat
jurnal


Adam
S/V Seagoat
Courtney Thomas wrote:
Maybe a fisherman's outlet ?

Hopefully,
Courtney

where2 get cheap sounding lead ?
 

Dave wrote:


On Mon, 03 Oct 2005 21:20:25 GMT, Rosalie B.
said:

It doesn't really matter to the body whether the lead is breathed in
as dust or fume. Both are hazardous.

It makes a great deal of difference, however, to the matter under
discussion. You argue that melting lead in a can over a stove creates lead
fumes. Gordon argues that the temperature is too low to create lead fumes.
The fact that lead might be ingested by breathing dust is utterly irrelevant
to that issue.

Except that lead fume, if it isn't breathed in BECOMES lead dust when
it cools.

What did you think happened to it?

Again, the argument doesn't hold up. The question is whether the temperature
at which lead melts is sufficiently high to create lead fumes. Lead dust is
not relevant unless you assume your conclusion that it is, rather than that
the lead dust came from another source such as, for example, applying a wire
brush or other abrasives to old solder.

The folks that had the contaminated workplace and clothing were in
effect melting lead on a stove. They weren't doing wire brushing or
other operations, so the lead dust must have come from melting the
lead.

While they do wire brushing in radiator shops, they were also using a
propane torch which was also way hotter than usual, so the lead dust
could have come from either operation.

grandma Rosalie

where2 get cheap sounding lead ?
 

Dave wrote:

On Tue, 04 Oct 2005 17:08:13 GMT, Rosalie B.
said:

The folks that had the contaminated workplace and clothing were in
effect melting lead on a stove. They weren't doing wire brushing or
other operations, so the lead dust must have come from melting the
lead.

While they do wire brushing in radiator shops, they were also using a
propane torch which was also way hotter than usual, so the lead dust
could have come from either operation.

Thus suggesting that Gordon's initial proposition--that melting lead at its
normal melting point doesn't create lead dust--is likely as not correct.

QED

I think it suggests that small amounts of lead in a soldering
operation wouldn't make much lead dust, but that melting larger
amounts (like for pouring into a small mold, even one as small as
making lead shot for hunting) requires more heat and would make lead
dust.

grandma Rosalie

where2 get cheap sounding lead ?
 

Dave wrote:

On Wed, 05 Oct 2005 00:38:48 GMT, Rosalie B.
said:

melting larger
amounts (like for pouring into a small mold, even one as small as
making lead shot for hunting) requires more heat and would make lead
dust.

More heat, yes. Higher temperature, no. Big difference.

If you have a point of use item like a small soldering iron it isn't
necessary to heat the lead solder up to a higher temperature. But if
you have a larger vessel to get heated up, you are going to have to
use a more heat which will result in a higher temperature at some
places in the pot. And if you use something like a cutting torch, it
will give you more heat and also make things hotter. So more heat
being applied WILL result in higher temperatures than less heat.


grandma Rosalie

where2 get cheap sounding lead ?
 

Dave wrote:

On Wed, 05 Oct 2005 03:41:42 GMT, Rosalie B.
said:

So more heat
being applied WILL result in higher temperatures than less heat.

I'm afraid your physics is faulty.

I'm not surprised. I've never had any physics. Probably the terms
I'm using are wrong

I know that if I have a lot of something to melt or defrost, I have
to apply heat for a longer time, or apply higher heat than if I have
just a little bit or if the stuff is short and fat (like a turkey)
rather than long and skinny like a french fry (or a coil of solder).

And the part on the edges (like the skin of the turkey) will melt or
defrost first and get hotter than the stuff in the middle (like the
giblets) which are still cold and un melted or un defrosted..

If I heat something up in a pan, the stuff on the edges will get hot
and start to bubble first. It seems to me that the part of a liquid
or a solid that one is trying to liquefy that gets hot first would put
out moisture (in the case of water) or fume (in the case of metal)
while the part in the middle was still getting hot.



grandma Rosalie

where2 get cheap sounding lead ?
 

Dave wrote:
On Wed, 05 Oct 2005 03:41:42 GMT, Rosalie B.
said:


So more heat
being applied WILL result in higher temperatures than less heat.


I'm afraid your physics is faulty.

So you support Gordon's original claim that there is no harmful
vaporization below the boiling point?

where2 get cheap sounding lead ?
 

Printed circuit card assembly involves heating a large amount of solder
(60/40) in a large pot with heaters and a pump in the bottom. This solder
melts just under 500F. It is held at 500 by the temperature controller via
the heaters. When the pump is turned on, the solder surges up thru some
screens, out the top of an opening making a solder wave. The printed circut
card is on a conveyer and passes over the wave thus soldering the leads to
the traces. And guess what. No lead fumes! As even Grandma has admitted.
Why? Because the heat is not high enuf!
Now, I don't know the alloy, if any, used in wheel weights and I don't
know the actual melting temp. But I do know it is not high enuf to make lead
fumes.
Are there other dangers? You bet.
Spilling molten solder on yourself could really ruin your day!
Also wheel weights leave behind the little metal clips and lots of dross.
This all floats and needs to be fished out before pouring. Another good way
to get a nasty burn.
So, you do as you see fit and I'll do my thing and why don't we leave it
at that. ')

Gordon
"Rosalie B." wrote in message
...
Dave wrote:

On Wed, 05 Oct 2005 03:41:42 GMT, Rosalie B.
said:

So more heat
being applied WILL result in higher temperatures than less heat.

I'm afraid your physics is faulty.

I'm not surprised. I've never had any physics. Probably the terms
I'm using are wrong

I know that if I have a lot of something to melt or defrost, I have
to apply heat for a longer time, or apply higher heat than if I have
just a little bit or if the stuff is short and fat (like a turkey)
rather than long and skinny like a french fry (or a coil of solder).

And the part on the edges (like the skin of the turkey) will melt or
defrost first and get hotter than the stuff in the middle (like the
giblets) which are still cold and un melted or un defrosted..

If I heat something up in a pan, the stuff on the edges will get hot
and start to bubble first. It seems to me that the part of a liquid
or a solid that one is trying to liquefy that gets hot first would put
out moisture (in the case of water) or fume (in the case of metal)
while the part in the middle was still getting hot.



grandma Rosalie

where2 get cheap sounding lead ?
 

Dave wrote:
On Wed, 05 Oct 2005 11:47:19 -0400, Jeff said:


So you support Gordon's original claim that there is no harmful
vaporization below the boiling point?


As I said before, please try to follow these discussions more closely so you
won't have to ask silly questions like that.

Without taking a position one way or the other on the merits, I simply
pointed out the logical fallacies in Grandma R's reasoning.


So you ignore the faulty information, which is a serious safety issue,
and criticize someone because they did not frame their story to your
satisfaction. Hmmmm.

The truth is that lead will vaporize at temperatures far below the
boiling point. Using minimal heat (i.e. staying close to the melting
point) is usually safe, but heating to higher temperatures, which is
possible with home equipment, can be hazardous. In other words,
soldering with a 40 Watt iron is safe; firing up the portable blast
furnace indoors to cast large leads is not.

where2 get cheap sounding lead ?
 

"Gordon" wrote:

Printed circuit card assembly involves heating a large amount of solder
(60/40) in a large pot with heaters and a pump in the bottom. This solder
melts just under 500F. It is held at 500 by the temperature controller via
the heaters. When the pump is turned on, the solder surges up thru some
screens, out the top of an opening making a solder wave. The printed circut
card is on a conveyer and passes over the wave thus soldering the leads to
the traces. And guess what. No lead fumes! As even Grandma has admitted.
Why? Because the heat is not high enuf!

I haven't actually sampled a wave solder operation for lead fumes, but
the ones I've seen seemed to be more or less totally enclosed and
ventilated so that people are not exposed. And other people's results
for similar operations seemed to bear this out. If people were not
exposed, I did not care whether there was lead fume or not.

However most "home" lead usages are not this closely controlled IME.

Now, I don't know the alloy, if any, used in wheel weights and I don't
know the actual melting temp. But I do know it is not high enuf to make lead
fumes.
Are there other dangers? You bet.
Spilling molten solder on yourself could really ruin your day!
Also wheel weights leave behind the little metal clips and lots of dross.
This all floats and needs to be fished out before pouring. Another good way
to get a nasty burn.
So, you do as you see fit and I'll do my thing and why don't we leave it
at that. ')

Gordon
"Rosalie B." wrote in message
.. .
Dave wrote:

On Wed, 05 Oct 2005 03:41:42 GMT, Rosalie B.
said:

So more heat
being applied WILL result in higher temperatures than less heat.

I'm afraid your physics is faulty.

I'm not surprised. I've never had any physics. Probably the terms
I'm using are wrong

I know that if I have a lot of something to melt or defrost, I have
to apply heat for a longer time, or apply higher heat than if I have
just a little bit or if the stuff is short and fat (like a turkey)
rather than long and skinny like a french fry (or a coil of solder).

And the part on the edges (like the skin of the turkey) will melt or
defrost first and get hotter than the stuff in the middle (like the
giblets) which are still cold and un melted or un defrosted..

If I heat something up in a pan, the stuff on the edges will get hot
and start to bubble first. It seems to me that the part of a liquid
or a solid that one is trying to liquefy that gets hot first would put
out moisture (in the case of water) or fume (in the case of metal)
while the part in the middle was still getting hot.



grandma Rosalie


grandma Rosalie

where2 get cheap sounding lead ?
 

On 5 Oct 2005 14:33:03 -0500, Dave wrote:
///
I try to avoid getting dragged into the substance of playground arguments in
which I have no horse in the race.


Hmmm, by my count, Rosalie stacked up 11 contributions, and Dave was
close behind with 9 to this playg...er.. thread.

:-)

But let me throw a little factual stuff on the fi the vapor
pressure of melted lead is 1 mm Hg at 973 degC and and 10 mmHg at
1162 degC
(42nd Rubber Book) i.e 1316 parts per million (ppm) by pressure and
13 parts per thousand respectively for those two temperatures.

Brian W

where2 get cheap sounding lead ?
 

On 6 Oct 2005 08:56:02 -0500, Dave wrote:

On Thu, 06 Oct 2005 00:23:11 GMT, Brian Whatcott
said:

I try to avoid getting dragged into the substance of playground arguments in
which I have no horse in the race.


Hmmm, by my count, Rosalie stacked up 11 contributions, and Dave was
close behind with 9 to this playg...er.. thread.

And how many of those 9 argued for or against the proposition that melting
lead to make a sounding lead would create lead dust, as opposed to the
validity of the argument being made for that proposition.

I used the phrase "the substance of" for good reason. The distinction is
apparently too subtle for your comprehension.



Hmmm....not only willing to conduct an extensive two-way ..er..
dialog, but able to make distinctions too subtle for my
comprehension.... That will show me - for importing
actual data of the numeric or scientific kind into this very special
dialog.

Brian Whatcott

where2 get cheap sounding lead ?
 

On Mon, 03 Oct 2005 03:05:55 +0000, Courtney Thomas wrote:

Maybe a fisherman's outlet ?

Hopefully,
Courtney

Here's a thought. I haven't tried this but it seems like
it would work. How about a window sash counter weight.
They're the right weight and shape and they are designed
to be suspended on a line. If you go to a vendor that
installs windows they might have a pile of them that they
have collected when they replace old windows with new and
let you have one.

If not try:

http://www.kilianhardware.com/cwsascoun2.html

http://www.alchemycastings.com/lead-...%20Weights.htm

Bob

where2 get cheap sounding lead ?
 

Adam...nice photos and a great set of project
photos on the main web site...good luck !!
she looks like quite a project !!....