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Shake and Break, part 8 - April 30
Shake and Break, part 8 - April 30
We left you with more thoughts of potential high-winds squalls, something not normally experienced this time of year here, pondering an oil change without the right gear and having plundered the "fresh" vegetables available in Green Turtle Cay's New Plymouth settlement. We wanted to get down to Marsh Harbour at some point, and the winds looked favorable for departure Monday the 27th. There we could get protection from fetch (the wind-driven waves that build up over open water in squalls) find another pump for the oil change, restock some of our more basic foodstuffs, and other chores. So, at 10 AM, up comes our anchor, again, full of accreted sand and shells. The sea is bucking sufficiently that not only do we have water rushing over it from the front as we head out, the up-down motion of the boat alternately lowers and raises the anchor dangling in the water, and it's soon rinsed. Before we left, we had prepared for raising the main, and then the staysail. So, once the anchor was secured (we have a stopper which takes the force of the mass of the 33KG anchor, rather than the windlass, which is what hauls up the anchor and chain), I went amidships and raised the main. Once that was up, we raised the staysail (recall we have a problem we also can get addressed in the Marsh Harbour area - stitching failure on the clew - where the control lines for this large genoa attach). With 20 knots of apparent wind at 60° on our bow, we set out to get onto the rhumblines that the Explorer Charts had determined to be the best zig-zag course we would take to get to Marsh Harbour. I set the running back for our starboard tack. With the smaller sail up front, we had some weather helm - the boat wants to turn into the wind - which means we had the brake on. That is, the rudder ( big brake in terms of the resistance to passage through the water when the helm isn't centered) corrected our course by pushing the bow away from the wind. That rudder angle would slow us down, of course. But we couldn't balance the sails without the big one up front. However, once we got on our outbound line at 151°T, the wind was behind us at an apparent angle of 120° to starboard. We were rewarded with 7 knots SOG, and a slight lee helm - much less than the prior weather helm. We were running relatively close to shore at that point, so were protected, and the sea was only 1-2' waves. If you look at our track on tinyurl.com/flyingpigspotwalla you'll see many different turns. Each of them was one of the waypoints in our Explorer Chart of the area. They were tested routes which had no hazards, and were amply deep enough for our 7' draft. So, we pretty much let Otto (our autopilot) drive, and we tended the sails and kept up with the charts. If you'd like to play cartographer, our 10:35 waypoint was at 26° 43.17'N/77°19.8'W - and by 10:45, we were turned toward Whale Cut - adjacent (well, on both sides of it) to Whale Cay. It is one of the major cuts into deep water. Unless you were a very shoal draft vessel, you could not go straight across the little banks behind the Whale, as it's called here. So, we went around in winds of 16-20 knots of wind at an apparent 110° - a very nice broad - almost beam - reach. That gave us 6.8 knots STW, and only 6.1 knots SOG. We were fighting the incoming tide, but were outside by 11:15, in 4-6' seas. Which was OK, as it was brief; as we turned into the last couple of legs in the Sea of Abaco, we were running dead downwind. It's not very often you see a boat going wing-and-wing (one sail out to each side) with a staysail, but we did it :{)) One problem with sailing dead downwind is that the sails can't really stiffen (lessen the rolling characteristic of the waves) the boat. As a result, with our rolling, our apparent wind was actually in the 150° range - rolling from port to starboard and back. We were also stealing back the wind we were given to begin with, as we were now subtracting (by moving with the wind) from the apparent wind. Apparent wind went down to only 8-10 knots, and we showed 7.5 knots STW most of the way - the peak was 8.2 knots. Making the final turn and negotiating our way through the old ship channel, we set our course for the entrance to Marsh Harbour. A slight course adjustment at noon, to 157°T, put the wind at 120° apparent, at 12 knots. Of course, we were taking away from the wind at that point of sail, as we puttered along at 6.4 knots STW. At 1 PM, we had a treat I'd never seen before. A lone dolphin came alongside the center cockpit where I was on watch, and rolled a bit to look at me. That, we've seen before. So, I called Lydia, and we went out and encouraged his antics. Surfing off the waves, jumping - and all by himself, something we'd not seen before, either - we were certain he was entertaining us. He kept rolling to check us out, and then, swam upside down for a ways before rolling back over, and then looking at us to say, "Did you see that??" A little while later, he did a barrel roll under water, doing a complete rotation, right in front of us. What a treat. How blessed we are, here in our home. He stayed with us for probably 30 minutes or more, which, no doubt, displaced him from his normal home, and swam off in the direction from which we'd come. He was like our welcoming committee, as we went to manual steering at 1:45, stowed the sails, and by 2:15, had our anchor down in nearly the same spot as we were on the many times we'd anchored here, all of them more than 4 years ago. However, it wasn't at ALL like when we were here last. It was CROWDED! We're used to being among only a handful of boats in this area, most of the others preferring to be further into the harbor. This time, it was "find a spot where we have enough room to swing without hitting someone else." However, we did, and with the steep breeze blowing, doing my normal anchoring method resulted in a half-dozen increasingly sharp pulls, as I let out progressively more chain per instance. When I put on our snubber, a 1" MegaBraid with a special hook to go over the chain, and let it out to tighten, I got the same stretch and rebound as I would have had Lydia backed down sharply on it. Ahhhh.... Back in Marsh Harbour. And just in front of the squalls. Overnight, it spat a bit, but wasn't really serious about it. But about 2PM on Tuesday (28th), a massive squall came in. For a moment, it looked like we'd miss it, as we had one earlier in the day. But, no, it landed on us and dumped a massive amount of water on us, over the newly cleaned decks, scrubbed in anticipation. Out comes the dam (chamois-like cloth) on the deck, and the water starts rushing into the tank in torrents. Meanwhile, it's blowing, hard. Everything is getting scrubbed - including me. I went out, as it happened, just before we saw 40 knots (over 45 MPH) of hard-driven rain. I got a pressure wash to wet down, used a LITTLE bit of soap in the utterly soft water, and had a shower. Waiting long enough to get fully rinsed from the great suds created in the gale-driven soft water, I went forward to check our water. The forward tank (195 gallons) was literally overflowing. The feed tube was full and the water was rushing over it. So, of course, I closed it, and opened the aft tank. As we'd not used it yet, the supply hose quickly filled, sending up small bubbles to show it was full, too. Thank you, Lord, for all the marvelous and free water! So, replenished fully, the squall passed, and we set about to attend to the various shake-and-break-down items which had developed. These are much more like the normal nature of cruising - there is maintenance to do, all the time, and little stuff (meaning that it's not a gamestopper, where we MUST address it before moving on) needs fixing. The first order of business was to find another pump so we could do an oil change. My previous replacement pump had come from the local Napa store, so we went there first. Sure enough, they had one, though it took some doing to establish that they actually did; once the person behind the counter found it in the catalog, he took me right to it. Off, a bit up the road, to Batelco, now branded as BTC, perhaps to avoid confusion with the unrelated Bahrain Batelco which comes up when you search online, to renew our now-dead cell phone, and to get a cellular hotspot. That's a phone which, if so instructed, becomes a Wi-Fi router. Here in Marsh Harbour, there are no open spots; outside, there are many. Pay Wi-Fi in the Bahamas is all rather more expensive than the data plans offered by BTC, and, as they are not "everywhere" (if you can "see" a cell tower, you can use your hotspot, and if there's an occupied island in the Bahamas, there's a cell tower!), so we took the plunge. There are "free" phone plans available, but as we wanted data only, (to do voice and data was very much more expensive), we had to "buy" (deep discount) our mobile data hotspot. We have no real means of seeing how much data we're using, as, I learned when I took the phone in the next day due to some perceived issues, the phone's estimate of data used is typically high by a third or so. So, if it showed 3 gigabytes of use, likely it was only about 2 gigabytes of use. Once we get our first bill, we'll be able to check the usage accurately online - but for the next several weeks, we'll be ill-informed as to our usage. As we chose the 5G monthly plan, that was reassuring when we saw an initial apparent huge surge of data - but, likely, we'll exceed it, as we will be here in the harbor, where that's our only connection, for some time yet. Added gigabytes are not disproportionate to the base rate, so, that's OK, too. Best yet is that throughput is in the 2-3MB range, far better than we've ever experienced afloat, regardless of source. We have heard that throughput goes down when you get away from major population areas, but we're very grateful to have communication, even in remote areas. Next stop - all of these are on the road leading to the airport - was to the Ace Hardware to see about a cap for the now-empty (it used to have our satellite antenna; I gave that system to a Ham radio buddy, as we now rely on Chris Parker for our weather) pole on the arch which whistles in the wind. Once confronted with the available caps, I realized that I didn't have the proper dimensions, so we headed south to BTC, again, and turned right... .... Which led us to Maxwell's, a supermarket on the scale and style of Publix, Winn-Dixie or Kroger. Variety and pricing is a great deal closer to what you'd find in the US, though perishables have the same issues due to the necessary time for arrival from Florida. We were able to purchase a wide variety of "fresh" vegetables, eggs, OJ at only about a third more than US pricing, and other goodies. It filled our cart, which is a bit larger than a milk crate, at only about double what we paid for the pitifully small haul in Green Turtle's New Plymouth. So, well provisioned, and equipped to be sending this to you today, we headed back to the boat. As it's forecast to be pretty windy, it seems to have rubbed off on me, again - so, we'll leave you here, panting to know whether we succeed in the rest of our attempts to keep our home in "Bristol" condition, topped both with water and electricity. Until next time, Stay Tuned! L8R Skip Morgan 461 #2 SV Flying Pig KI4MPC See our galleries at www.justpickone.org/skip/gallery ! Follow us at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TheFlyingPigLog and/or http://groups.google.com/group/flyingpiglog "Believe me, my young friend, there is *nothing*-absolutely nothing-half so much worth doing as simply messing, messing-about-in-boats; messing about in boats-or *with* boats. In or out of 'em, it doesn't matter. Nothing seems really to matter, that's the charm of it. Whether you get away, or whether you don't; whether you arrive at your destination or whether you reach somewhere else, or whether you never get anywhere at all, you're always busy, and you never do anything in particular; and when you've done it there's always something else to do, and you can do it if you like, but you'd much better not." |
Shake and Break, part 8 - April 30
On Mon, 4 May 2015 09:58:49 -0400, "Flying Pig" wrote:
Shake and Break, part 8 - April 30 We left you with more thoughts of potential high-winds squalls, something not normally experienced this time of year here, pondering an oil change without the right gear and having plundered the "fresh" vegetables available in Green Turtle Cay's New Plymouth settlement. We wanted to get down to Marsh Harbour at some point, and the winds looked favorable for departure Monday the 27th. There we could get protection from fetch (the wind-driven waves that build up over open water in squalls) find another pump for the oil change, restock some of our more basic foodstuffs, and other chores. So, at 10 AM, up comes our anchor, again, full of accreted sand and shells. The sea is bucking sufficiently that not only do we have water rushing over it from the front as we head out, the up-down motion of the boat alternately lowers and raises the anchor dangling in the water, and it's soon rinsed. In White Sound? LOL, nice embellishment, dude. Before we left, we had prepared for raising the main, and then the staysail. So, once the anchor was secured (we have a stopper which takes the force of the mass of the 33KG anchor, rather than the windlass, which is what hauls up the anchor and chain), I went amidships and raised the main. Once that was up, we raised the staysail (recall we have a problem we also can get addressed in the Marsh Harbour area - stitching failure on the clew - where the control lines for this large genoa attach). Try "sheets" instead of control lines. -- Sir Gregory |
Shake and Break, part 8 - April 30
On Mon, 04 May 2015 19:12:40 -0400, "Sir Gregory Hall, Esq."
wrote: On Mon, 4 May 2015 09:58:49 -0400, "Flying Pig" wrote: Shake and Break, part 8 - April 30 We left you with more thoughts of potential high-winds squalls, something not normally experienced this time of year here, pondering an oil change without the right gear and having plundered the "fresh" vegetables available in Green Turtle Cay's New Plymouth settlement. We wanted to get down to Marsh Harbour at some point, and the winds looked favorable for departure Monday the 27th. There we could get protection from fetch (the wind-driven waves that build up over open water in squalls) find another pump for the oil change, restock some of our more basic foodstuffs, and other chores. So, at 10 AM, up comes our anchor, again, full of accreted sand and shells. The sea is bucking sufficiently that not only do we have water rushing over it from the front as we head out, the up-down motion of the boat alternately lowers and raises the anchor dangling in the water, and it's soon rinsed. In White Sound? LOL, nice embellishment, dude. Before we left, we had prepared for raising the main, and then the staysail. So, once the anchor was secured (we have a stopper which takes the force of the mass of the 33KG anchor, rather than the windlass, which is what hauls up the anchor and chain), I went amidships and raised the main. Once that was up, we raised the staysail (recall we have a problem we also can get addressed in the Marsh Harbour area - stitching failure on the clew - where the control lines for this large genoa attach). Try "sheets" instead of control lines. He is just using a term that the layman might understand.... I thought that you would be appreciative. The term can be explained by a line in the encyclopedia which states: "(nautical) a line (rope or chain) that regulates the angle at which a sail is set in relation to the wind" One of the definitions for "control" is: "check or regulate (a scientific experiment) by conducting a parallel experiment or comparing with another standard" What is that biblical definition ? "There are none so blind as those who refuse to see"? Or perhaps "Stupid is as stupid does"? Which seems to dates back to the U.S. Civil War, at least. -- Cheers, Bruce |
Shake and Break, part 8 - April 30
"Sir Gregory Hall, Esq." wrote in message
... On Mon, 4 May 2015 09:58:49 -0400, "Flying Pig" wrote: Shake and Break, part 8 - April 30 We left you with more thoughts of potential high-winds squalls, something not normally experienced this time of year here, pondering an oil change without the right gear and having plundered the "fresh" vegetables available in Green Turtle Cay's New Plymouth settlement. We wanted to get down to Marsh Harbour at some point, and the winds looked favorable for departure Monday the 27th. There we could get protection from fetch (the wind-driven waves that build up over open water in squalls) find another pump for the oil change, restock some of our more basic foodstuffs, and other chores. So, at 10 AM, up comes our anchor, again, full of accreted sand and shells. The sea is bucking sufficiently that not only do we have water rushing over it from the front as we head out, the up-down motion of the boat alternately lowers and raises the anchor dangling in the water, and it's soon rinsed. In White Sound? LOL, nice embellishment, dude. \ Nice try :{)) Nowhere did I say that we anchored in White Sound. The only place we anchored was out front of Settlement Harbour. You have to pay attention, even though you don't have to pay to get in, here :{)) We DID dinghy to White Sound, once on our anniversary, and again to meet up with the couple we met that day... L8R Skip, filling his tanks again with what Windfinder expects to be as much as 2" of rain Morgan 461 #2 SV Flying Pig KI4MPC See our galleries at www.justpickone.org/skip/gallery ! Follow us at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TheFlyingPigLog and/or http://groups.google.com/group/flyingpiglog When a man comes to like a sea life, he is not fit to live on land. - Dr. Samuel Johnson |
Shake and Break, part 8 - April 30
On 5/5/2015 8:19 AM, Flying Pig wrote:
Skip, filling his tanks again with what Windfinder expects to be as much as 2" of rain Skip Do you treat the water gathered off your decks before consuming? I'm curious why you have such massive ground tackle. What's the displacement of your boat? -paul --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. http://www.avast.com |
Shake and Break, part 8 - April 30
"slide" wrote in message ...
On 5/5/2015 8:19 AM, Flying Pig wrote: Skip, filling his tanks again with what Windfinder expects to be as much as 2" of rain Skip Do you treat the water gathered off your decks before consuming? I'm curious why you have such massive ground tackle. What's the displacement of your boat? -paul --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. http://www.avast.com Hi, Paul, No, and we have a biologist with CDC in the family who tells us we needn't treat it - but it won't hurt if you do - but we put 3 capfuls (about a tablespoon) of Clorox down a 195G tank, and 2 the 120G. However, we do scrub the decks and let a great amount of water flow by before putting up our little dam. Today, we had a real frog-strangler. The water was running so hard that the 1.5" pipe couldn't take it fast enough, and the floaty on the deck key was floating above the torrent. Filled the big tank and the gravity 50G (meaning it filled via the head created in the fill pipe to the main tank under it) in no time. Watching to know when to shut it off had the 50G tank filling from a 3/8" pipe in about 15 minutes. Thank you Lord! We have a 44,000 boat. One rule of thumb would have us have not less than 88#. The factory anchor was a 45# CQR, vastly ill-chosen for real cruising; a dayhop in the Virgins (where she started life), maybe. As to what we DO have, we like to sleep at night. We may, but have yet to, drag. But I'm certain in any situation I can imagine, it will outperform our prior primary anchor, a 55# delta. We HAVE dragged with that on a few occasions... L8R Skip Morgan 461 #2 SV Flying Pig KI4MPC See our galleries at www.justpickone.org/skip/gallery ! Follow us at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TheFlyingPigLog and/or http://groups.google.com/group/flyingpiglog When a man comes to like a sea life, he is not fit to live on land. - Dr. Samuel Johnson |
Shake and Break, part 8 - April 30
On Tue, 05 May 2015 16:12:04 -0600, slide
wrote: I'm curious why you have such massive ground tackle. What's the displacement of your boat? === Heavy ground tackle is the cheapest insurance you can buy, especially if you cruise in an area known for strong thunderstorms and wind squalls. Some light weight anchors have a great deal of holding power *if* they are carefully set in their preferred bottom type, and *if* the wind does not change direction during the night, and *if* there is never a need to set the anchor while the boat is moving. I've heard of people who carry a heavy anchor stowed away for extreme conditions. That's all well and good if you have time to dig out the storm anchor and get it shackled up but I personally prefer to have my best anchor on the bow and ready too deploy when needed. |
Shake and Break, part 8 - April 30
On Wed, 06 May 2015 10:23:38 -0400, Wayne.B wrote:
On Tue, 05 May 2015 16:12:04 -0600, slide wrote: I'm curious why you have such massive ground tackle. What's the displacement of your boat? === Heavy ground tackle is the cheapest insurance you can buy, especially if you cruise in an area known for strong thunderstorms and wind squalls. Some light weight anchors have a great deal of holding power *if* they are carefully set in their preferred bottom type, and *if* the wind does not change direction during the night, and *if* there is never a need to set the anchor while the boat is moving. I've heard of people who carry a heavy anchor stowed away for extreme conditions. That's all well and good if you have time to dig out the storm anchor and get it shackled up but I personally prefer to have my best anchor on the bow and ready too deploy when needed. You should modify your preference. Having that heavy pig of an anchor ready to go is smart. Having it on the bow is dumb. Instead, try storing it all shackled up and ready to go but on chocks amidships. Keep the weight off the ends to decrease the hobby-horsing. -- Sir Gregory |
Shake and Break, part 8 - April 30
On Wed, 06 May 2015 15:56:06 -0400, "Sir Gregory Hall, Esq."
wrote: On Wed, 06 May 2015 10:23:38 -0400, Wayne.B wrote: On Tue, 05 May 2015 16:12:04 -0600, slide wrote: I'm curious why you have such massive ground tackle. What's the displacement of your boat? === Heavy ground tackle is the cheapest insurance you can buy, especially if you cruise in an area known for strong thunderstorms and wind squalls. Some light weight anchors have a great deal of holding power *if* they are carefully set in their preferred bottom type, and *if* the wind does not change direction during the night, and *if* there is never a need to set the anchor while the boat is moving. I've heard of people who carry a heavy anchor stowed away for extreme conditions. That's all well and good if you have time to dig out the storm anchor and get it shackled up but I personally prefer to have my best anchor on the bow and ready too deploy when needed. You should modify your preference. Having that heavy pig of an anchor ready to go is smart. Having it on the bow is dumb. Instead, try storing it all shackled up and ready to go but on chocks amidships. Keep the weight off the ends to decrease the hobby-horsing. The problem with such a statement is that while it sounds logical it really isn't correct. Longitudinal stability is not effected about the amount of weigh in the ends, per se. It is the percentage of the vessel's total weight in the ends that has the effect. A sixty or seventy Kg. anchor in the bow of a , say 25 - 26 foot, toy boat will likely have a decided effect on longitudinal stability while the same weight on a, again lets say, 50 ft., properly built, cruising boat will likely not even be noticed. -- Cheers, Bruce |
Shake and Break, part 8 - April 30
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Shake and Break, part 8 - April 30
On 5/5/2015 4:24 PM, Flying Pig wrote:
Hi, Paul, No, and we have a biologist with CDC in the family who tells us we needn't treat it - but it won't hurt if you do - but we put 3 capfuls (about a tablespoon) of Clorox down a 195G tank, and 2 the 120G. However, we do scrub the decks and let a great amount of water flow by before putting up our little dam. Today, we had a real frog-strangler. The water was running so hard that the 1.5" pipe couldn't take it fast enough, and the floaty on the deck key was floating above the torrent. Filled the big tank and the gravity 50G (meaning it filled via the head created in the fill pipe to the main tank under it) in no time. Watching to know when to shut it off had the 50G tank filling from a 3/8" pipe in about 15 minutes. Thank you Lord! We have a 44,000 boat. One rule of thumb would have us have not less than 88#. The factory anchor was a 45# CQR, vastly ill-chosen for real cruising; a dayhop in the Virgins (where she started life), maybe. As to what we DO have, we like to sleep at night. We may, but have yet to, drag. But I'm certain in any situation I can imagine, it will outperform our prior primary anchor, a 55# delta. We HAVE dragged with that on a few occasions... L8R Skip I never felt ok about doing this given the bird s**t I had to rinse off of the decks and the often serious diseases carried in that stuff. I kept a tarp to deploy in cases of rain instead of bare decks. Even so I did the Clorox trick as well. My last boat was a 42' 35k lb displacement so a bit smaller than yours but I suspect a good deal less windage. I had no issues with a 35# Danforth with an all chain rode except in oysters where nothing holds anyway. I suppose heavier has no issues except you need to winch. I had a winch but didn't use it all too often. I also had a plough about 70# for storms but rarely deployed it. Some like a fisherman for rocks but I figured the plough would suffice if I ever had that bottom which I never did. What shapes are you anchors? Do you also have a lunch hook? --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. http://www.avast.com |
Shake and Break, part 8 - April 30
On Thu, 07 May 2015 11:01:03 -0600, slide wrote:
On 5/5/2015 4:24 PM, Flying Pig wrote: Hi, Paul, No, and we have a biologist with CDC in the family who tells us we needn't treat it - but it won't hurt if you do - but we put 3 capfuls (about a tablespoon) of Clorox down a 195G tank, and 2 the 120G. However, we do scrub the decks and let a great amount of water flow by before putting up our little dam. Today, we had a real frog-strangler. The water was running so hard that the 1.5" pipe couldn't take it fast enough, and the floaty on the deck key was floating above the torrent. Filled the big tank and the gravity 50G (meaning it filled via the head created in the fill pipe to the main tank under it) in no time. Watching to know when to shut it off had the 50G tank filling from a 3/8" pipe in about 15 minutes. Thank you Lord! We have a 44,000 boat. One rule of thumb would have us have not less than 88#. The factory anchor was a 45# CQR, vastly ill-chosen for real cruising; a dayhop in the Virgins (where she started life), maybe. As to what we DO have, we like to sleep at night. We may, but have yet to, drag. But I'm certain in any situation I can imagine, it will outperform our prior primary anchor, a 55# delta. We HAVE dragged with that on a few occasions... L8R Skip I never felt ok about doing this given the bird s**t I had to rinse off of the decks and the often serious diseases carried in that stuff. I kept a tarp to deploy in cases of rain instead of bare decks. Even so I did the Clorox trick as well. A clean tarp is a much better idea. I would hesitate to drink water gathered off the decks even when Cloroxed but it sure could be used safely for bathing, laundry, etc. I suspect most of the water Skippy collects is used for bathing, cleaning and laundry. I have found that one conceited woman with long hair can use 25-50 gallons of water a day. My last boat was a 42' 35k lb displacement so a bit smaller than yours but I suspect a good deal less windage. No kidding!!! I've seen photos of Skippy's "Flying Pig" and the poor boat has more crap hanging all over it, high and low, making windage that's unacceptable to any real sailor. I had no issues with a 35# Danforth with an all chain rode except in oysters where nothing holds anyway. I suppose heavier has no issues except you need to winch. All chain rode is unnecessary, destructive of the environment, prohibitively expensive and it causes undue stress on the deck hardware, deck and boat in general. It is also too heavy and doesn't take long to rust. Responsible and wise sailors use a combination of chain and nylon rode. I had a winch but didn't use it all too often. If you need a winch, then either your boat is too large or your body too weak. -- Sir Gregory |
Shake and Break, part 8 - April 30
On 5/7/2015 12:31 PM, Sir Gregory Hall, Esq. wrote:
I never felt ok about doing this given the bird s**t I had to rinse off of the decks and the often serious diseases carried in that stuff. I kept a tarp to deploy in cases of rain instead of bare decks. Even so I did the Clorox trick as well. A clean tarp is a much better idea. I would hesitate to drink water gathered off the decks even when Cloroxed but it sure could be used safely for bathing, laundry, etc. I suspect most of the water Skippy collects is used for bathing, cleaning and laundry. I have found that one conceited woman with long hair can use 25-50 gallons of water a day. If you read Skip's recent narrative in whole, you'd see he's rather penurious with his fresh water. He bathes in salt, for example, most of the time. In my case, all my boats have had integrated water systems in the sense that fresh water is fungible with no way to pull water from tank A for washing but tank B for drinking. Even if I closed one tank reserving it for drinking, the lines would contain the lesser quality water. This is why I didn't drink from the deck water although others did. Most bird transmitted disease are from pigeons and the like but seagulls were the source of a disease breakout in NYCity a bit back. All chain rode is unnecessary, destructive of the environment, prohibitively expensive and it causes undue stress on the deck hardware, deck and boat in general. It is also too heavy and doesn't take long to rust. Responsible and wise sailors use a combination of chain and nylon rode. I had that on my previous boat finding no issue with nylon bent to chain but this boat came with all chain. I saw no reason to not deploy it. I'm skeptical that it is more damaging to the sea bottom than rope / chain rode. Only a short length is on the bottom and that is the same whether the rode is partly rope or not. I found a few situations where I had to ride a short scope and there the all chain was invaluable. I had a winch but didn't use it all too often. If you need a winch, then either your boat is too large or your body too weak. I'm boatless now but hope to be afloat again in a few years. I will never again buy a large, heavy complex boat like I had before but I don't have an issue with those who wish them. I can remember fewer more pleasurable experiences than, after single handing offshore for a number of days, anchoring in a quiet cove and then going below for a HOT fresh water shower. It was a luxury beyond belief. However, the constant maintenance and cost wore me out. On the balance, I will KISS for sure next time out. --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. http://www.avast.com |
Shake and Break, part 8 - April 30
On Thu, 07 May 2015 15:44:16 -0600, slide wrote:
On 5/7/2015 12:31 PM, Sir Gregory Hall, Esq. wrote: I never felt ok about doing this given the bird s**t I had to rinse off of the decks and the often serious diseases carried in that stuff. I kept a tarp to deploy in cases of rain instead of bare decks. Even so I did the Clorox trick as well. A clean tarp is a much better idea. I would hesitate to drink water gathered off the decks even when Cloroxed but it sure could be used safely for bathing, laundry, etc. I suspect most of the water Skippy collects is used for bathing, cleaning and laundry. I have found that one conceited woman with long hair can use 25-50 gallons of water a day. If you read Skip's recent narrative in whole, you'd see he's rather penurious with his fresh water. He bathes in salt, for example, most of the time. Did I misread or did he not say his *forward* water tank holds 125 gallons. Why, that's totally absurd. If he has an aft water tank of similar size that would mean 250 gallons of water. OMG! Can you say gluttonous waste? I have two water tanks. One is 18 gallons and the second is 12 gallons. They are usually autonomous but can be connected by opening a valve. I also carry two, six-gallon plastic water jugs and five or six one-gallon jugs of the spring water type in various stages of fill. I prefer to haul water from shore to the boat in one gallon jugs as they are ever so much easier to deal with than the heavy six-gallon type. In my case, all my boats have had integrated water systems in the sense that fresh water is fungible with no way to pull water from tank A for washing but tank B for drinking. Even if I closed one tank reserving it for drinking, the lines would contain the lesser quality water. This is why I didn't drink from the deck water although others did. Most bird transmitted disease are from pigeons and the like but seagulls were the source of a disease breakout in NYCity a bit back. One could always boil it in a pinch but that would consume too much stove fuel. All chain rode is unnecessary, destructive of the environment, prohibitively expensive and it causes undue stress on the deck hardware, deck and boat in general. It is also too heavy and doesn't take long to rust. Responsible and wise sailors use a combination of chain and nylon rode. I had that on my previous boat finding no issue with nylon bent to chain but this boat came with all chain. I saw no reason to not deploy it. I'm skeptical that it is more damaging to the sea bottom than rope / chain rode. Only a short length is on the bottom and that is the same whether the rode is partly rope or not. Depends upon the strength of wind and current. In many cases if you have out 100 feet of chain, 80 or so feet can be scraping back and forth along the bottom, wreaking unnecessary havoc on the ecosystem there. I found a few situations where I had to ride a short scope and there the all chain was invaluable. The ONLY time I would not decry all-chain is in areas with coral heads or sharp rock ledges that might chafe through combination rodes. I find it ludicrous that so-called sailors use nylon *snubbers*. I see them struggling with them, leaning over the bow trying to hook them, etc. So freaking stupid when a combination chain/nylon rode eliminates the need for such stupidity. I had a winch but didn't use it all too often. If you need a winch, then either your boat is too large or your body too weak. I'm boatless now but hope to be afloat again in a few years. I will never again buy a large, heavy complex boat like I had before but I don't have an issue with those who wish them. I can remember fewer more pleasurable experiences than, after single handing offshore for a number of days, anchoring in a quiet cove and then going below for a HOT fresh water shower. It was a luxury beyond belief. However, the constant maintenance and cost wore me out. On the balance, I will KISS for sure next time out. Yup, let the pretenders like Skippy have the big, cluttered, system-laden, wallowing well below the load waterline, garbage scows on which they spend 90% of the time they could be cruising working on them instead. Examine his diary entries. Perhaps 5% is about sailing while the other 95% is all about problems he has with one unnecessary system after another. So myopic yet so typical, these days where trying to impress takes precedence over ease of sailing. -- Sir Gregory |
Shake and Break, part 8 - April 30
On Thu, 07 May 2015 18:39:10 -0400, "Sir Gregory Hall, Esq."
wrote: On Thu, 07 May 2015 15:44:16 -0600, slide wrote: On 5/7/2015 12:31 PM, Sir Gregory Hall, Esq. wrote: I never felt ok about doing this given the bird s**t I had to rinse off of the decks and the often serious diseases carried in that stuff. I kept a tarp to deploy in cases of rain instead of bare decks. Even so I did the Clorox trick as well. A clean tarp is a much better idea. I would hesitate to drink water gathered off the decks even when Cloroxed but it sure could be used safely for bathing, laundry, etc. I suspect most of the water Skippy collects is used for bathing, cleaning and laundry. I have found that one conceited woman with long hair can use 25-50 gallons of water a day. If you read Skip's recent narrative in whole, you'd see he's rather penurious with his fresh water. He bathes in salt, for example, most of the time. Did I misread or did he not say his *forward* water tank holds 125 gallons. Why, that's totally absurd. If he has an aft water tank of similar size that would mean 250 gallons of water. OMG! Can you say gluttonous waste? I have two water tanks. One is 18 gallons and the second is 12 gallons. They are usually autonomous but can be connected by opening a valve. I also carry two, six-gallon plastic water jugs and five or six one-gallon jugs of the spring water type in various stages of fill. I prefer to haul water from shore to the boat in one gallon jugs as they are ever so much easier to deal with than the heavy six-gallon type. Thus speaks the great (or at least very noisy) authority on "cruising" who depends on carrying water from shore to his boat. Ever actually "cruise", say a Trans-Atlantic voyage? Or maybe an off-shore trip from, say Bermuda to New York City? Obviously not if you depend on water hauled from shore. So, you really aren't a cruising sailor are you, "Floating Trailer Trash" would seem a far more accurate description. Perhaps we need a Usenet group entitled rec.marinetrailer.noncruising In my case, all my boats have had integrated water systems in the sense that fresh water is fungible with no way to pull water from tank A for washing but tank B for drinking. Even if I closed one tank reserving it for drinking, the lines would contain the lesser quality water. This is why I didn't drink from the deck water although others did. Most bird transmitted disease are from pigeons and the like but seagulls were the source of a disease breakout in NYCity a bit back. One could always boil it in a pinch but that would consume too much stove fuel. All chain rode is unnecessary, destructive of the environment, prohibitively expensive and it causes undue stress on the deck hardware, deck and boat in general. It is also too heavy and doesn't take long to rust. Responsible and wise sailors use a combination of chain and nylon rode. I had that on my previous boat finding no issue with nylon bent to chain but this boat came with all chain. I saw no reason to not deploy it. I'm skeptical that it is more damaging to the sea bottom than rope / chain rode. Only a short length is on the bottom and that is the same whether the rode is partly rope or not. Depends upon the strength of wind and current. In many cases if you have out 100 feet of chain, 80 or so feet can be scraping back and forth along the bottom, wreaking unnecessary havoc on the ecosystem there. The eco-system of a mud bank? Or do you really think that people seek out coral clumps to anchor in? My experience has been that "knowledgeable", as apposed to those who gain their knowledge from reading magazines, cruisers avoid coral reefs as anchorages to the greatest extent possible. I found a few situations where I had to ride a short scope and there the all chain was invaluable. The ONLY time I would not decry all-chain is in areas with coral heads or sharp rock ledges that might chafe through combination rodes. I find it ludicrous that so-called sailors use nylon *snubbers*. I see them struggling with them, leaning over the bow trying to hook them, etc. Quite obviously you really don't know much about how an "anchor system" works. The great advantage to an all chain rode is that the weight of the chain forces a much larger catenary in the rode and thus reduces the angle at which tension is applied to the anchor, which, of course, reduces the force tending to pull the anchor up, out of the sea bed. Which, by the way, is the reason for the recommendations on how much scope to use depending on currents and wind, and whether chain or rope rode. So freaking stupid when a combination chain/nylon rode eliminates the need for such stupidity. Of course it seems stupid..... to someone that so obviously doesn't know what he is talking about. I had a winch but didn't use it all too often. If you need a winch, then either your boat is too large or your body too weak. I'm boatless now but hope to be afloat again in a few years. I will never again buy a large, heavy complex boat like I had before but I don't have an issue with those who wish them. I can remember fewer more pleasurable experiences than, after single handing offshore for a number of days, anchoring in a quiet cove and then going below for a HOT fresh water shower. It was a luxury beyond belief. However, the constant maintenance and cost wore me out. On the balance, I will KISS for sure next time out. Yup, let the pretenders like Skippy have the big, cluttered, system-laden, wallowing well below the load waterline, garbage scows on which they spend 90% of the time they could be cruising working on them instead. Examine his diary entries. Perhaps 5% is about sailing while the other 95% is all about problems he has with one unnecessary system after another. Strange, you know. I've been aboard a number of vessels ranging from super tankers to ocean going fishing boats and they all, I say "all", have anchor winches. Are you sure you know what you are talking about? It certainly doesn't sound as though you do. So myopic yet so typical, these days where trying to impress takes precedence over ease of sailing. Exactly. Except the "ease of sailing" needs changing to "experience". -- Cheers, Bruce |
Shake and Break, part 8 - April 30
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Shake and Break, part 8 - April 30
On Fri, 08 May 2015 07:59:32 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote: On Fri, 08 May 2015 07:30:12 +0700, wrote: Strange, you know. I've been aboard a number of vessels ranging from super tankers to ocean going fishing boats and they all, I say "all", have anchor winches. === Yes, the navy and merchant marine have been using chain rodes and anchor winches/windlasses for hundreds of years, and with a great deal of success. Small, weight sensitive boats, not so much. It's amusing that folks with boats under 30 feet who rarely cruise anywhere feel qualified to offer a "one size fits all" solution. The first, publicized, use of a steel anchor rode seems to have been in 1808 but even more revealing is that in 1834: Lloyd's Register rules stating the length of cable to be supplied, called for a reduced length for iron cables compared to hemp cables at a 6:7 ratio. The IASCS (International Association of Classification Societies) has, for many years, required steel anchor "cables". I think that "rarely" should be replaced by "never" :-) -- Cheers, Bruce |
Shake and Break, part 8 - April 30
I had a winch but didn't use it all too often. I also had a plough about 70# for storms but rarely deployed it. Some like a fisherman for rocks but I figured the plough would suffice if I ever had that bottom which I never did. What shapes are you anchors? Do you also have a lunch hook? Our primary is a Rocna, our secondary is a Delta (73 and 55# respectively). Because we have a windlass, there is no 'lunch hook' as it's very convenient to launch and retrieve. We also have a Fortress 37 KD and in a bag, along with the 50'/150 5/16G40 chain/1"MegaBraid bag. We've never deployed it. Two larger-than-dinghy (maybe 25#) Danforth-style have been used in the past when we've wanted to not swing with the current, as dual stern anchors. We had to tighten the lines from time to time, but they were OK to the purpose. L8R Skip, off Fowl Cay National Park --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. http://www.avast.com Morgan 461 #2 SV Flying Pig KI4MPC See our galleries at www.justpickone.org/skip/gallery ! Follow us at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TheFlyingPigLog and/or http://groups.google.com/group/flyingpiglog When a man comes to like a sea life, he is not fit to live on land. - Dr. Samuel Johnson |
Shake and Break, part 8 - April 30
Neal, if you want to pull my chain (pardon the expression) you MUST read for
not only content, context and tone, but for specifics, particularly when you use them in support of an argument. :{)) That said, I'm sorry we didn't get together - there was no southing (as you'd see if you read the beginning) in our dash to the exit... "Sir Gregory Hall, Esq." wrote in message ... On Thu, 07 May 2015 15:44:16 -0600, slide wrote: On 5/7/2015 12:31 PM, Sir Gregory Hall, Esq. wrote: I never felt ok about doing this given the bird s**t I had to rinse off of the decks and the often serious diseases carried in that stuff. I kept a tarp to deploy in cases of rain instead of bare decks. Even so I did the Clorox trick as well. We are blessed/cursed (some of them are very nice to be around) with a general lack of birds in the area where we currently find ourselves. In any event, a scrub in the start of a squall, and a good rinse time, quickly renders our surface drinkable. As to how much water it takes for us to be comfortable that way, it has to be sluicing hard enough to hit the back side of the scupper just downstream from our fills. A clean tarp is a much better idea. I would hesitate to drink water gathered off the decks even when Cloroxed but it sure could be used safely for bathing, laundry, etc. I suspect most of the water Skippy collects is used for bathing, cleaning and laundry. I have found that one conceited woman with long hair can use 25-50 gallons of water a day. If you read Skip's recent narrative in whole, you'd see he's rather penurious with his fresh water. He bathes in salt, for example, most of the time. Did I misread or did he not say his *forward* water tank holds 125 gallons. Why, that's totally absurd. If he has an aft water tank of similar size that would mean 250 gallons of water. OMG! Can you say gluttonous waste? Yes, you misread. Forward tank is nominally (based on dimension; reality makes it a bit less) 195G, aft 120 (ditto)G, and the supplemental tank in the settee 50G. Nominally, as much as 365 gallons of water. However, there's only 80G of diesel; we're a sailboat, after all. It rained hard enough yesterday that we again not only filled our tanks to overflowing, we also filled the supplemental tank by merely the standing water in the fill tube's force, coming up from the forward tank through its 3/8" tube - 50 gallons in, again, mere minutes. Under those circumstances (and, of course, the weather pattern could change), the summertime pattern of occasional squalls out of nowhere (this one was 37 knots in a gust, 30 sustained) allowing, we're being a bit more casual about our water. However, passages such as our Fernandina to Portland always find us with ample water left. If we're not being VERY conservative, we typically will get as much as two months out of a complete fill. I'd like to see you do that in your world cruiser; stepping out for a jug of water's a bit challenging hundreds of miles offshore :{)) Or, if you arrived in two months with water to spare, likely I'd want to stay upwind! clip All chain rode is unnecessary, destructive of the environment, prohibitively expensive and it causes undue stress on the deck hardware, deck and boat in general. It is also too heavy and doesn't take long to rust. Responsible and wise sailors use a combination of chain and nylon rode. We have both aboard; our secondary is 150' chain and 150' MegaBraid bent on. Both chains will rust at about the same rate if they're in the water at the same time; ergo, you should have only rope rode, as you're either pregnant or you're not, so to speak. As to the weight, it helps offset all that windage and junk we have hanging off our stern :{)) And, by the way, as that increases mass at the end of a pendulum, it swings more slowly. Ergo, this 2-3' chop we have is mere wiggles. What would your yacht look like anchored here, in 9' of water? With all the weight concentrated in the center, I'd imagine it would be VERY responsive to every wave :{)) (which is about a 2 second interval, FWIW) I note that you have some interesting stuff hanging off the back of your boat, too, but the scale to accommodate the dinghy is striking on Cut The Mustard compared to what is astern aboard Flying Pig. I had that on my previous boat finding no issue with nylon bent to chain but this boat came with all chain. I saw no reason to not deploy it. I'm skeptical that it is more damaging to the sea bottom than rope / chain rode. Only a short length is on the bottom and that is the same whether the rode is partly rope or not. Depends upon the strength of wind and current. In many cases if you have out 100 feet of chain, 80 or so feet can be scraping back and forth along the bottom, wreaking unnecessary havoc on the ecosystem there. It sounds as though you advocate moorings only. I =have= known folks to carry three danforths which they strung together to make a mooring, so, perhaps you could do it. But then, there would be all that extra weight. (You WERE going to use chain on those to make the mooring right? Oh. It won't move around at all, leaving that ecosystem pristinely as it was when you arrived.) clip Yup, let the pretenders like Skippy have the big, cluttered, system-laden, wallowing well below the load waterline, garbage scows on which they spend 90% of the time they could be cruising working on them instead. Examine his diary entries. Perhaps 5% is about sailing while the other 95% is all about problems he has with one unnecessary system after another. So myopic yet so typical, these days where trying to impress takes precedence over ease of sailing. -- Sir Gregory ----------- \ Ah, the nobility has spoken. We're sitting in the middle of the Bahamas at anchor, communicating over WiFi to a point a dozen miles away (which, by the way, if your memory is long enough, you may recall my posting under way south of Staniel, using the Sampson Cay Marina hotspot, is our usual). Lydia's using her cellphone over our network (most smartphones can connect to the internet and avoid minutes/data charges) to face-time her kids, and her computer to send pictures she took on her 'real' camera to her family. I check in to the MMSN (maritime mobile service net) occasionally; yesterday the anchor playfully yelled that his ears hurt, as I'd nearly blasted the roof off that Dallas-based ham shack. That, by the way, was one of those unnecessary system problems we had and conquered. So much for systems. Can you do that aboard your fine yacht? By the way, congratulations on solving that OpenCPN challenge and continuing to manufacture 134a; you perhaps could earn a bit on the side providing those whose systems only USE it. Oh. Systems. Never mind. We sailed up from Marsh Harbour yesterday, and after anchoring on our all-chain-and-Rocna, we had a 37knot squall during which we moved not an inch; our catenary took all the major stuff, and our snubber did the stretch and respond routine. FWIW, it's NO difficulty to attach our snubber; I clip the receiver over the link right at the windlass and let it down. Today we'll scrub the dinghy, and swim off the beach here at the national park, as it's a bit too rough for snorkeling/free diving; I get a break from being the Cruisers' Net anchor on my birthday tomorrow, but we did just fine broadcasting from here today, as we have in the past. The radio I used was replaced during one of those unnecessary problem solving situations. Of course, I just reached under the bed (OOPS! Berth!) and pulled out the identical radio, which went right into the same hole and used the same, already installed plugs. OUR boat has plenty of room for spares - so, we carry them :{)) What? You don't? Don't go all Robert Redford on me now, and be unprepared! L8R, y'all Skip, starkers because nobody without binocs could see us, and if the binox folks want to see me au naturel, they are welcome to it :{)) Morgan 461 #2 SV Flying Pig KI4MPC See our galleries at www.justpickone.org/skip/gallery ! Follow us at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TheFlyingPigLog and/or http://groups.google.com/group/flyingpiglog When a man comes to like a sea life, he is not fit to live on land. - Dr. Samuel Johnson |
Shake and Break, part 8 - April 30
On 5/10/2015 8:23 AM, Flying Pig wrote:
We also have a Fortress 37 KD and in a bag, along with the 50'/150 5/16G40 chain/1"MegaBraid bag. We've never deployed it. Two larger-than-dinghy (maybe 25#) Danforth-style have been used in the past when we've wanted to not swing with the current, as dual stern anchors. We had to tighten the lines from time to time, but they were OK to the purpose. L8R Skip, off Fowl Cay National Park I had a Fortress but found it'd plane in a current on its way down on occasion. It was rather odd seeing an anchor not head straight or almost straight down. I think mine was a 23 or about 15 lbs. I am going entirely by memory. It worked well and would have been a boon if I ever had to row an anchor out. Heck, I could almost swim this one out if needed (never tried). My guess is your 37 would be highly effective in the bottoms that Danforth style anchors work best in. Given you're in the Bahamas, doesn't anybody use a Bahamian moor to limit boat swing? --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. http://www.avast.com |
Shake and Break, part 8 - April 30
"slide" wrote in message ...
Given you're in the Bahamas, doesn't anybody use a Bahamian moor to limit boat swing? Rarely, any more. They were mostly to overcome the shortcomings of the CQR, Danforth/Fortress and other second- or first-generation anchors which didn't reset well. The new third-generation (Rocna and lookalikes, Spade, et. al.) anchors generally stay put. Indeed, the Rocna folks caution against the typical in telling their prospects NOT to oversize it. That was before we knew that, so went up two sizes (the Delta secondary is one up). L8R Skip Morgan 461 #2 SV Flying Pig KI4MPC See our galleries at www.justpickone.org/skip/gallery ! Follow us at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TheFlyingPigLog and/or http://groups.google.com/group/flyingpiglog When a man comes to like a sea life, he is not fit to live on land. - Dr. Samuel Johnson |
Shake and Break, part 8 - April 30
On Sun, 10 May 2015 13:09:58 -0400, "Flying Pig"
wrote: The new third-generation (Rocna and lookalikes, Spade, et. al.) anchors generally stay put. Indeed, the Rocna folks caution against the typical in telling their prospects NOT to oversize it. That was before we knew that, so went up two sizes (the Delta secondary is one up). === We've had both a Rocna and a Spade, and they are both terrific anchors. With the Spade we did go a size or two larger than necessary (125 pounds) and at times our windlass could barely get it up from deep water. Coming up from 50+ feet with the combined weight of anchor, chain and attached mud was a real struggle. We ended up downsizing to an 88 lb Rocna and it seems like a better compromise. |
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