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A love letter from Joe to Bob: ///////////////////////////////////////////// Let me guess you're in Tongo Tongo surrounded by naked maidens, worshiping you as the master mariner you are. ` Damn Bob you progressed from a bum on the street begging for the humble and noble job of scrubbing ****ters on any boat, to a jet setting licenced 200 Ton master mariner in only 6 mo. And you did it workings as a "slave"in the oilfield that you hate sooooo much. U R awesum bobby. Just think if you were in that big union you could be running the worlds largest super tanker by now! Joe //////////////////////////////////////////////// Well close Joe i was in hawaii surrouned by a girls athletic team for the last 10 days. They are a great bunch of fun girls. Hard working athletes doing somthing youll never do...... getting an education. I wasnt exactly a bum, In fact yould **** if I told ya what I did. hmm, but I think i did mention that a couple years ago here. Im not sure why you keep saying I scrub ****ters. Thats what the philipinos do but to tell you the truth I give them a hand sometimes just to proove that not all people who work offshore are lazy southern fat racest. Big union jobs.... As soon as my MMC comes back with my RFPNW I will certainly consider doing a deep water hitch. I think it would be fun to see how real sailors work. Oh, the reason why you cant work for a blue water union job is cause you dont have the training. Crap you can even sail as an AB even with that big 1600 ton license of yours....... urr usta have. Even if you do have AB OSV you wont be able to sail cause you dont have RFPNW. Why is that...? cause its not required in the GOM and you never went the extra mile to get it. Dont worry Joe.... Ill keep posting so you can have somthing to read. Oh, hows this for west coast liberal uppty ness. Im in LA LA LA LA, CA . Thought Id jet on over to the main land and watch some NCAA womens sports here in the LA area. Have fun Joe. I am :) bOB |
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Joe,
For all of us... Quit messing with the troll... |
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On Thu, 19 Nov 2009 01:47:34 -0600, cavelamb
wrote: Joe, For all of us... Quit messing with the troll... As always, it is up to you to provide an alternative. Start some interesting threads. Right now, the Bob & Joe show is the only ticket in town. |
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Joe loves me )
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Joe loves me )
It has it's moments. IDK, it is getting tirsome..... I guess old joe does get some enjoyment from stalking me. It must be the bayou in him. However, you have to admit there is a thread of marine in some of the posts, which I think is helpful. The USCG Licensing structures have under gone and continue to chage rapidly. INcluding new STCW training requirments.The good ol days of going to your local regional Examine Center for a license and upgrad armed with a wink-and-a-nod is gone. Some are just having a difficult time adapting. Hope your day goes well, Im off to watch some NCAA womens sports in suny LA Life is good as a sailor :) BOb |
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wrote:
On Thu, 19 Nov 2009 14:19:53 -0600, cavelamb wrote: wrote: On Thu, 19 Nov 2009 11:17:07 -0600, cavelamb wrote: wrote: On Thu, 19 Nov 2009 01:47:34 -0600, cavelamb wrote: Joe, For all of us... Quit messing with the troll... As always, it is up to you to provide an alternative. Start some interesting threads. Right now, the Bob & Joe show is the only ticket in town. That's pretty lame. Complaining, rather than doing something pro-active to fix the problem is about as lame as it can get. Whining just adds noise, and has even less entertainment value than Bob & Joe arguing. I have done all I can to "fix the problem". I've blocked most of the sock puppets and only see them when someone argues (taunts/ridicules/replies/stalks (with full quotes, of course)) Emotional imbalance is not interesting - at least to me. Too close to home? No. It's just too boring for words. And that's a perfect example of what's wrong here. This newsgroup is NOT the kind of place I would invite friends into. There is simply too much ego - and not enough content. |
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On Thu, 19 Nov 2009 16:36:19 -0600, cavelamb
wrote: wrote: On Thu, 19 Nov 2009 14:19:53 -0600, cavelamb wrote: wrote: On Thu, 19 Nov 2009 11:17:07 -0600, cavelamb wrote: wrote: On Thu, 19 Nov 2009 01:47:34 -0600, cavelamb wrote: Joe, For all of us... Quit messing with the troll... As always, it is up to you to provide an alternative. Start some interesting threads. Right now, the Bob & Joe show is the only ticket in town. That's pretty lame. Complaining, rather than doing something pro-active to fix the problem is about as lame as it can get. Whining just adds noise, and has even less entertainment value than Bob & Joe arguing. I have done all I can to "fix the problem". I've blocked most of the sock puppets and only see them when someone argues (taunts/ridicules/replies/stalks (with full quotes, of course)) Emotional imbalance is not interesting - at least to me. Too close to home? No. It's just too boring for words. And that's a perfect example of what's wrong here. This newsgroup is NOT the kind of place I would invite friends into. There is simply too much ego - and not enough content. Gee, I already miss you... |
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On Thu, 19 Nov 2009 16:36:19 -0600, cavelamb
wrote: This newsgroup is NOT the kind of place I would invite friends into. There is simply too much ego - and not enough content. Content is good. What have you been up to recently? We're in a big push getting the boat ready for a trip south to the islands. |
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Wayne.B wrote:
On Thu, 19 Nov 2009 16:36:19 -0600, cavelamb wrote: This newsgroup is NOT the kind of place I would invite friends into. There is simply too much ego - and not enough content. Content is good. What have you been up to recently? We're in a big push getting the boat ready for a trip south to the islands. I've been working off some winter projects on the boat. I'm almost finished with the cabin redo. Added a couple of cabinets, moves the electrical panel, added shelves behind the settees. etc. On deck I've been rerouting a few lines and making things a bit easier to get at. There was an asymmetrical spinnaker aboard when I bought the boat, but no hardware to support it. That's all together and working now. Still going back and forth on the head sail question. To roll or not to roll... this is my first roller, and I'm not completely in love with it. It works as advertised, but I'm not convinced I want to keep it. We are hoping to head south this coming spring and wander along the coast a ways. I'd love to meet up with you or Skip and Lydia somewhere. What a hoot that would be! Richard |
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"cavelamb" wrote in message
... We are hoping to head south this coming spring and wander along the coast a ways. I'd love to meet up with you or Skip and Lydia somewhere. What a hoot that would be! Richard We'll be in the Bahamas for a year or so from now, December 17-January 17 excepted (and any other time Lydia gets a hankering for the grubby little hands of her grandson, I've gathered). See you on the water... L8R Skip and Lydia -- Morgan 461 #2 SV Flying Pig KI4MPC See our galleries at www.justpickone.org/skip/gallery ! Follow us at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TheFlyingPigLog and/or http://groups.google.com/group/flyingpiglog "You are never given a wish without also being given the power to make it come true. You may have to work for it however." (and) "There is no such thing as a problem without a gift for you in its hand (Richard Bach) |
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On Thu, 19 Nov 2009 19:47:13 -0600, cavelamb
wrote: Still going back and forth on the head sail question. To roll or not to roll... this is my first roller, and I'm not completely in love with it. It works as advertised, but I'm not convinced I want to keep it. There you go. Good topic. Why? --Vic |
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"cavelamb" wrote in message .. .. snipped Still going back and forth on the head sail question. To roll or not to roll... this is my first roller, and I'm not completely in love with it. It works as advertised, but I'm not convinced I want to keep it. Tell us why. My last boat had hanked-on foresails and I have had times when I was nearly losing the sail and myself overboard trying to change jibs in a gale in the dark. Now I have a roller I would never go back to the former system. Mine is a Profurl and it is very strong and I have never had a problem furling by hauling the furling line by hand, but it is better to avoid the more lightly built ones that tell you that you must never use a winch on the furling line. You never know when you might just have to. |
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On Thu, 19 Nov 2009 19:47:13 -0600, cavelamb
wrote: I'd love to meet up with you or Skip and Lydia somewhere. What a hoot that would be! Try George Town in the southern Exumas, late January or early February. We'll be passing through about that time and I believe that S&L will be there also. |
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"Wayne.B" wrote in message
... On Thu, 19 Nov 2009 19:47:13 -0600, cavelamb wrote: I'd love to meet up with you or Skip and Lydia somewhere. What a hoot that would be! Try George Town in the southern Exumas, late January or early February. We'll be passing through about that time and I believe that S&L will be there also. Indeed. ETA late January-mid February... L8R Skip and Lydia, troubleshooting our VHF -- Morgan 461 #2 SV Flying Pig KI4MPC See our galleries at www.justpickone.org/skip/gallery ! Follow us at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TheFlyingPigLog and/or http://groups.google.com/group/flyingpiglog "You are never given a wish without also being given the power to make it come true. You may have to work for it however." (and) "There is no such thing as a problem without a gift for you in its hand (Richard Bach) |
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"Edgar" wrote in message
... "cavelamb" wrote in message .. . snipped Still going back and forth on the head sail question. To roll or not to roll... this is my first roller, and I'm not completely in love with it. It works as advertised, but I'm not convinced I want to keep it. Tell us why. My last boat had hanked-on foresails and I have had times when I was nearly losing the sail and myself overboard trying to change jibs in a gale in the dark. Now I have a roller I would never go back to the former system. Mine is a Profurl and it is very strong and I have never had a problem furling by hauling the furling line by hand, but it is better to avoid the more lightly built ones that tell you that you must never use a winch on the furling line. You never know when you might just have to. I've never had a problem with my Schaefer either, never used the winch and they, as all companies I know, tell you not to do it. I've furled a sail on a 60' boat with no effort greater than arm power. If you need a winch, you're doing something wrong or there's a jam. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
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On Fri, 20 Nov 2009 14:27:39 +0100, "Edgar"
wrote: "cavelamb" wrote in message .. . snipped Still going back and forth on the head sail question. To roll or not to roll... this is my first roller, and I'm not completely in love with it. It works as advertised, but I'm not convinced I want to keep it. Tell us why. My last boat had hanked-on foresails and I have had times when I was nearly losing the sail and myself overboard trying to change jibs in a gale in the dark. Now I have a roller I would never go back to the former system. Mine is a Profurl and it is very strong and I have never had a problem furling by hauling the furling line by hand, but it is better to avoid the more lightly built ones that tell you that you must never use a winch on the furling line. You never know when you might just have to. I think it's a matter of what type of sailing one does. If racing then the furler won't allow you to reduce sail and maintain the best sail shape but if cruising, i.e., making long passages with small crews then the furler is the way to go. No problem for a single individual to make major sail reduction or let it all hang out. As for using a winch to roll up the sail. Why? The load on the sail is a matter of wind strength and sale area that catches the wind. If it is hard to roll just let off a bit on the sheet. The whole exercise from grabbing the furling line to sitting back with a beer takes only moments. Although I think that are going out of style I have foam leeches in both my head sails. They do make for a better sail shape for the first few feet you reef the sail although they don't help much by the time you get down to nothing but a handkerchief.. .. Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) |
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Bruce In Bangkok wrote:
On Fri, 20 Nov 2009 14:27:39 +0100, "Edgar" wrote: "cavelamb" wrote in message .. . snipped Still going back and forth on the head sail question. To roll or not to roll... this is my first roller, and I'm not completely in love with it. It works as advertised, but I'm not convinced I want to keep it. Tell us why. My last boat had hanked-on foresails and I have had times when I was nearly losing the sail and myself overboard trying to change jibs in a gale in the dark. Now I have a roller I would never go back to the former system. Mine is a Profurl and it is very strong and I have never had a problem furling by hauling the furling line by hand, but it is better to avoid the more lightly built ones that tell you that you must never use a winch on the furling line. You never know when you might just have to. I think it's a matter of what type of sailing one does. If racing then the furler won't allow you to reduce sail and maintain the best sail shape but if cruising, i.e., making long passages with small crews then the furler is the way to go. No problem for a single individual to make major sail reduction or let it all hang out. As for using a winch to roll up the sail. Why? The load on the sail is a matter of wind strength and sale area that catches the wind. If it is hard to roll just let off a bit on the sheet. The whole exercise from grabbing the furling line to sitting back with a beer takes only moments. Although I think that are going out of style I have foam leeches in both my head sails. They do make for a better sail shape for the first few feet you reef the sail although they don't help much by the time you get down to nothing but a handkerchief.. . Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) Perhaps I've been racing too long and can't break the mind set. Joe Berber, my sail maker (Mariner Sails in Dallas), pretty much said the same thing you did, Bruce. The foam tape is tapered - widest in the middle of the luff, tapered down to nothing on the ends, so that when the sail rolls up it rolls up evenly, rather than skinny in the middle. That helps with sail shape by keeping the middle of the roll filled out flush so it doesn't have a bunch of excess fabric to make a deep belly. It also helps extend sail life since the sail doesn't stretch unevenly. My genoa (135%) when fully unrolled in light air (about 8 knots) shows three very distinct scallops along the leech. That's two places where it is "pinched". They correspond to the points where the sail has been "reefed". So the foam luff tape is a possible solution offered for the reefing / sail shape issue. And Bruce, I take careful note of what you said about cruising short handed. Back to that in a moment... What I've seen so far on this boat... The full genny is ok up to about 15 knots of breeze (usually don't have rail meat to stand her up past that). The boat points way higher that I expected. Best I've seen we did 35 degrees off making 3 to 3.5 knots. I had several guests that day (new sailboat owners who had never sailed before!) so there was enough meat on the rail to hold her up. It was a fabulous beat! By 20 knots, it should have been reduced about 25% to 30% with a reef in the main. That would correspond to a 100% working jib. But a working jib would probably be made a bit heavier. We loose maybe 10 degrees to weather. By 25 knots is need to be down to half (call it 50 to 65%), and we've lost another 10 to 15 degrees. At 30 knots, I'm down to reefed main alone and can't point worth squat. She will beam reach pretty well, but maybe a point or two forward is all it's going to do. I have a fantasy of a small stay sail that could be flown in heavy wind. It would be about 20 to 25% of the fore triangle, and cut high to allow the sheets to align on the cabin top tracks. A strong eye pad just aft of the anchor locker for the tack, and a halyard at the spreaders to hoist it. That would technically make my reefed main about a 3/4 fractional rig and probably help recover some of the lost pointing ability. I'm more in favor of this than one of those Gale Sails because of the location. The GS is located all the way forward - no help for the main, and a LONG moment arm back to the keel. Lot's of turning force. A stay sail would help the main some by making a little slot effect, and is located much closer to the mast. (same as the reefed main) I think it would be useful regardless of the jib (rolled up or taken down). Anyway... Back to the roller/hank question... Mechanical reliability? I can't get to the forestay turnbuckle without disassembling part of the furler. Makes it hard to examine very often. If that little furling line comes loose... Never mind! I don't even want to think about that one. (but I'm open to offers of how to deal with it) If the roller jams? I'm told the halyard can do that - top of the mast, of course. Gee, What fun that would be to clear! If the jib should tear? It takes me too long to thread that thin luff in calm conditions at the dock. I'd prefer not to have to do it in any kind of sea! Remember, it has to be fed into the groove of the foil - not like hanking on a bunched up (and tied) head sail. Now... Back to what Bruce said - and what it implies... Balance against all that heavy disaster scenario - conserving strength of the crew. How important is that? From what I've read, more boats are lost at sea because the crew was exhausted or injured - not because the boat came undone. I've raced a lot. But I've not done much long distance (or long duration) sailing. There is still a lot for me to learn. Richard S.V. Temptress |
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"cavelamb" wrote in message ... I have a fantasy of a small stay sail that could be flown in heavy wind. It would be about 20 to 25% of the fore triangle, and cut high to allow the sheets to align on the cabin top tracks. A strong eye pad just aft of the anchor locker for the tack, and a halyard at the spreaders to hoist it. That would technically make my reefed main about a 3/4 fractional rig and probably help recover some of the lost pointing ability. I'm more in favor of this than one of those Gale Sails because of the location. The GS is located all the way forward - no help for the main, and a LONG moment arm back to the keel. Lot's of turning force. A stay sail would help the main some by making a little slot effect, and is located much closer to the mast. (same as the reefed main) I think it would be useful regardless of the jib (rolled up or taken down). My boat came with all that gear to set a staysail just as you describe. I have an eye pad on a track on the foredeck so can adjust its position. Also have additional sheet tracks port and starboard plus extra sheets so that on a long reach I can put up the staysail as well as the jib and turn her into a sort of cutter rig. Never tried all that yet but I took my staysail to my sailmaker here so I could see it open on his floor so I could know exactly what I had rather than getting nasty surprises when opening a large sail on the foredeck for the first time. The sail looked fine but the guy strongly suggested that staysails were not worth bothering with. He should know a thing or two as he was sailmaker once on one of those round the world racers but he never made it clear what he did not like about staysails. So the only thing is to give it a try and see for myself. (Re roller vesus hank) If the jib should tear? It takes me too long to thread that thin luff in calm conditions at the dock. I'd prefer not to have to do it in any kind of sea! Remember, it has to be fed into the groove of the foil - not like hanking on a bunched up (and tied) head sail. I am with you on that one. My boat has a full set of racing sails which I leave ashore. They have all been converted to fit into the foil of the roller which the previous owner (non racing) fitted to her. So now it is impossible for a shorthanded cruising couple to change foresails as you really need two on the foredeck to feed in the new sail while controlling the rest of it (big sail-38' boat) and at least one in the cockpit to winch it up, plus autopilot or preferably another person steering. The really bad thing is that he converted the storm jib in the same way so because there is usually only my wife and myself aboard I have no alternative in a strong wind to using the roller to reef the foresail if it becomes necessary. Maybe I could set the storm jib free flying on the staysail fixings but that is another thing that needs a test to see if it is practical. I doubt if it would set well given that it is always going to be needed only in very strong winds. |
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On Fri, 20 Nov 2009 20:15:56 -0600, cavelamb
wrote: Bruce In Bangkok wrote: On Fri, 20 Nov 2009 14:27:39 +0100, "Edgar" wrote: "cavelamb" wrote in message .. . snipped Still going back and forth on the head sail question. To roll or not to roll... this is my first roller, and I'm not completely in love with it. It works as advertised, but I'm not convinced I want to keep it. Tell us why. My last boat had hanked-on foresails and I have had times when I was nearly losing the sail and myself overboard trying to change jibs in a gale in the dark. Now I have a roller I would never go back to the former system. Mine is a Profurl and it is very strong and I have never had a problem furling by hauling the furling line by hand, but it is better to avoid the more lightly built ones that tell you that you must never use a winch on the furling line. You never know when you might just have to. I think it's a matter of what type of sailing one does. If racing then the furler won't allow you to reduce sail and maintain the best sail shape but if cruising, i.e., making long passages with small crews then the furler is the way to go. No problem for a single individual to make major sail reduction or let it all hang out. As for using a winch to roll up the sail. Why? The load on the sail is a matter of wind strength and sale area that catches the wind. If it is hard to roll just let off a bit on the sheet. The whole exercise from grabbing the furling line to sitting back with a beer takes only moments. Although I think that are going out of style I have foam leeches in both my head sails. They do make for a better sail shape for the first few feet you reef the sail although they don't help much by the time you get down to nothing but a handkerchief.. . Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) Perhaps I've been racing too long and can't break the mind set. Joe Berber, my sail maker (Mariner Sails in Dallas), pretty much said the same thing you did, Bruce. The foam tape is tapered - widest in the middle of the luff, tapered down to nothing on the ends, so that when the sail rolls up it rolls up evenly, rather than skinny in the middle. That helps with sail shape by keeping the middle of the roll filled out flush so it doesn't have a bunch of excess fabric to make a deep belly. It also helps extend sail life since the sail doesn't stretch unevenly. My genoa (135%) when fully unrolled in light air (about 8 knots) shows three very distinct scallops along the leech. That's two places where it is "pinched". They correspond to the points where the sail has been "reefed". So the foam luff tape is a possible solution offered for the reefing / sail shape issue. And Bruce, I take careful note of what you said about cruising short handed. Back to that in a moment... What I've seen so far on this boat... The full genny is ok up to about 15 knots of breeze (usually don't have rail meat to stand her up past that). The boat points way higher that I expected. Best I've seen we did 35 degrees off making 3 to 3.5 knots. I had several guests that day (new sailboat owners who had never sailed before!) so there was enough meat on the rail to hold her up. It was a fabulous beat! By 20 knots, it should have been reduced about 25% to 30% with a reef in the main. That would correspond to a 100% working jib. But a working jib would probably be made a bit heavier. We loose maybe 10 degrees to weather. By 25 knots is need to be down to half (call it 50 to 65%), and we've lost another 10 to 15 degrees. At 30 knots, I'm down to reefed main alone and can't point worth squat. She will beam reach pretty well, but maybe a point or two forward is all it's going to do. I have a fantasy of a small stay sail that could be flown in heavy wind. It would be about 20 to 25% of the fore triangle, and cut high to allow the sheets to align on the cabin top tracks. A strong eye pad just aft of the anchor locker for the tack, and a halyard at the spreaders to hoist it. That would technically make my reefed main about a 3/4 fractional rig and probably help recover some of the lost pointing ability. I'm more in favor of this than one of those Gale Sails because of the location. The GS is located all the way forward - no help for the main, and a LONG moment arm back to the keel. Lot's of turning force. A stay sail would help the main some by making a little slot effect, and is located much closer to the mast. (same as the reefed main) I think it would be useful regardless of the jib (rolled up or taken down). Anyway... Back to the roller/hank question... Mechanical reliability? I can't get to the forestay turnbuckle without disassembling part of the furler. Makes it hard to examine very often. If that little furling line comes loose... Never mind! I don't even want to think about that one. (but I'm open to offers of how to deal with it) If the roller jams? I'm told the halyard can do that - top of the mast, of course. Gee, What fun that would be to clear! If the jib should tear? It takes me too long to thread that thin luff in calm conditions at the dock. I'd prefer not to have to do it in any kind of sea! Remember, it has to be fed into the groove of the foil - not like hanking on a bunched up (and tied) head sail. Now... Back to what Bruce said - and what it implies... Balance against all that heavy disaster scenario - conserving strength of the crew. How important is that? From what I've read, more boats are lost at sea because the crew was exhausted or injured - not because the boat came undone. I've raced a lot. But I've not done much long distance (or long duration) sailing. There is still a lot for me to learn. Richard S.V. Temptress Lets see; re small head sail. There was a guy (can't remember his name, Illingsworth? Something like that) that was active in the midget ocean racing group (don't remember the initials) in England in the 60's. He advocated a "cutter" rig with a big jib and a small. very high cut, stay sail. Something like you are talking about. By the way, if you do rig this up I would view the "eye bolt through the deck attaching point" with some suspicion . Check to see how much deck movement you get when the sail is up. There can be more force here then you thought there would be. You may have to rig a stay rod down to the keel. Re rollers. Yes, a furler can jam and even actually untwist the stay if you don't install it correctly. One of the correct parts of installing it is using a guide, or other means of ensuring that the halyard cannot get twisted around the stay when the foil is rotated. As for the reefing line "coming off". I can't speak for all of them but on mine the reefing line runs through the top flange of the drum and is secured with a knot. Certainly it could come undone or chaff but so can the shrouds :-) I assume that anyone who sails does at least rudimentary inspections of the rig and rigging fairly regularly. Re sailing close to the wind. first of all "Gentlemen don't sail to Windward", at least that was what the book said :-) But more seriously, I seldom worry about how high the boat will point. Most of my sailing is either day sailing - go out to the island, have lunch, comeback; or trips of 100 miles or so. Because I'm in a monsoon region the winds are always either from the S.W. or N.E. so depending on what season of the year I either have head winds or tail winds depending on what way I'm going since I can basically only go north or south. Ocean crossings are usually planned on a seasonal basis to you normally have the winds with you. No one, for instance, is going to set off on a trip to India with the winds in their face - that would be nearly a month of up wind slogging. The best method of sailing close hauled is START THE MOTOR :-! Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) |
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Edgar wrote:
"cavelamb" wrote in message ... I have a fantasy of a small stay sail that could be flown in heavy wind. It would be about 20 to 25% of the fore triangle, and cut high to allow the sheets to align on the cabin top tracks. A strong eye pad just aft of the anchor locker for the tack, and a halyard at the spreaders to hoist it. That would technically make my reefed main about a 3/4 fractional rig and probably help recover some of the lost pointing ability. I'm more in favor of this than one of those Gale Sails because of the location. The GS is located all the way forward - no help for the main, and a LONG moment arm back to the keel. Lot's of turning force. A stay sail would help the main some by making a little slot effect, and is located much closer to the mast. (same as the reefed main) I think it would be useful regardless of the jib (rolled up or taken down). My boat came with all that gear to set a staysail just as you describe. I have an eye pad on a track on the foredeck so can adjust its position. Also have additional sheet tracks port and starboard plus extra sheets so that on a long reach I can put up the staysail as well as the jib and turn her into a sort of cutter rig. Never tried all that yet but I took my staysail to my sailmaker here so I could see it open on his floor so I could know exactly what I had rather than getting nasty surprises when opening a large sail on the foredeck for the first time. The sail looked fine but the guy strongly suggested that staysails were not worth bothering with. He should know a thing or two as he was sailmaker once on one of those round the world racers but he never made it clear what he did not like about staysails. So the only thing is to give it a try and see for myself. I envy you that set up, Edgar. I'd have to do a lot of fixing before I could even try to try it. I called it a stay sail, because that's the correct term for a sail there. It would (obviously) have to be built heavier than a light air stay sail. But I would use it as the storm jib. |
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Bruce In Bangkok wrote:
The best method of sailing close hauled is START THE MOTOR :-! Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) Motor? You have a MOTOR? Huh! Maybe I out to get one of those!?! |
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On Sat, 21 Nov 2009 13:32:51 -0600, cavelamb
wrote: Bruce In Bangkok wrote: The best method of sailing close hauled is START THE MOTOR :-! Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) Motor? You have a MOTOR? Huh! Maybe I out to get one of those!?! Picky, picky. All right - ENGINE :-) Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) |
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Bruce In Bangkok wrote:
On Sat, 21 Nov 2009 13:32:51 -0600, cavelamb wrote: Bruce In Bangkok wrote: The best method of sailing close hauled is START THE MOTOR :-! Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) Motor? You have a MOTOR? Huh! Maybe I out to get one of those!?! Picky, picky. All right - ENGINE :-) Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) It's ok, Bruce. Not being picky - just jelousy. I have an outboard. I sail faster, but power? Well, we do sail faster! |
Joe loves me )
On Sun, 22 Nov 2009 02:01:26 -0600, cavelamb
wrote: Bruce In Bangkok wrote: On Sat, 21 Nov 2009 13:32:51 -0600, cavelamb wrote: Bruce In Bangkok wrote: The best method of sailing close hauled is START THE MOTOR :-! Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) Motor? You have a MOTOR? Huh! Maybe I out to get one of those!?! Picky, picky. All right - ENGINE :-) Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) It's ok, Bruce. Not being picky - just jelousy. I have an outboard. I sail faster, but power? Well, we do sail faster! This is the new boat your were talking about a couple of years ago? Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) |
Joe loves me )
Bruce In Bangkok wrote:
On Sun, 22 Nov 2009 02:01:26 -0600, cavelamb wrote: Bruce In Bangkok wrote: On Sat, 21 Nov 2009 13:32:51 -0600, cavelamb wrote: Bruce In Bangkok wrote: The best method of sailing close hauled is START THE MOTOR :-! Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) Motor? You have a MOTOR? Huh! Maybe I out to get one of those!?! Picky, picky. All right - ENGINE :-) Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) It's ok, Bruce. Not being picky - just jelousy. I have an outboard. I sail faster, but power? Well, we do sail faster! This is the new boat your were talking about a couple of years ago? Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) No, that one fell through. Dorothy's uncle passed away and she was supposed to inherit his Hunter. But the kids threw a fuss (none of them wanted the boat - just the money) and it didn't happen. This one, "Temptress", is a much smaller Catalina Capri 26 that I bought last year. http://www.home.earthlink.net/~capri26/ We are hoping to move her down to the coast (that's Galveston Bay area) in the spring and wander down the coast a ways - maybe get sea sick and puke a lot - and hopefully have fun anyway. Richard |
Joe loves me )
On Sun, 22 Nov 2009 09:29:20 -0600, cavelamb
wrote: Bruce In Bangkok wrote: On Sun, 22 Nov 2009 02:01:26 -0600, cavelamb wrote: Bruce In Bangkok wrote: On Sat, 21 Nov 2009 13:32:51 -0600, cavelamb wrote: Bruce In Bangkok wrote: The best method of sailing close hauled is START THE MOTOR :-! Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) Motor? You have a MOTOR? Huh! Maybe I out to get one of those!?! Picky, picky. All right - ENGINE :-) Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) It's ok, Bruce. Not being picky - just jelousy. I have an outboard. I sail faster, but power? Well, we do sail faster! This is the new boat your were talking about a couple of years ago? Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) No, that one fell through. Dorothy's uncle passed away and she was supposed to inherit his Hunter. But the kids threw a fuss (none of them wanted the boat - just the money) and it didn't happen. This one, "Temptress", is a much smaller Catalina Capri 26 that I bought last year. http://www.home.earthlink.net/~capri26/ We are hoping to move her down to the coast (that's Galveston Bay area) in the spring and wander down the coast a ways - maybe get sea sick and puke a lot - and hopefully have fun anyway. Richard Thus the confusion. I remembered the "hope we get it" messages and then there was the "New boat" sort of stuff and somehow I mentally tied them together and envisioned you floating about in a larger boat. Nice looking little boat though. Frankly I would assume that with the rather restricted deck forward you would be enthusiastically installing a furler. By the way, where do you stow the dinghy when cruising? If on the foredeck it adds even more reason to have a furler :-) Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) |
Joe loves me )
Bruce In Bangkok wrote:
On Sun, 22 Nov 2009 09:29:20 -0600, cavelamb wrote: Bruce In Bangkok wrote: On Sun, 22 Nov 2009 02:01:26 -0600, cavelamb wrote: Bruce In Bangkok wrote: On Sat, 21 Nov 2009 13:32:51 -0600, cavelamb wrote: Bruce In Bangkok wrote: The best method of sailing close hauled is START THE MOTOR :-! Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) Motor? You have a MOTOR? Huh! Maybe I out to get one of those!?! Picky, picky. All right - ENGINE :-) Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) It's ok, Bruce. Not being picky - just jelousy. I have an outboard. I sail faster, but power? Well, we do sail faster! This is the new boat your were talking about a couple of years ago? Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) No, that one fell through. Dorothy's uncle passed away and she was supposed to inherit his Hunter. But the kids threw a fuss (none of them wanted the boat - just the money) and it didn't happen. This one, "Temptress", is a much smaller Catalina Capri 26 that I bought last year. http://www.home.earthlink.net/~capri26/ We are hoping to move her down to the coast (that's Galveston Bay area) in the spring and wander down the coast a ways - maybe get sea sick and puke a lot - and hopefully have fun anyway. Richard Thus the confusion. I remembered the "hope we get it" messages and then there was the "New boat" sort of stuff and somehow I mentally tied them together and envisioned you floating about in a larger boat. Nice looking little boat though. Frankly I would assume that with the rather restricted deck forward you would be enthusiastically installing a furler. By the way, where do you stow the dinghy when cruising? If on the foredeck it adds even more reason to have a furler :-) Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) Thanks for remembering, Bruce! Yeah - we were pretty disappointed. The boat was a 38 foot Hunter - light for it's size, and not particularly pretty but what the heck!? It was only a few years old and the price for sure was right! Then it went for 25% market value - and no, we didn't get a chance to bid on it. Bummer. So I went looking for a boat I could afford to buy my own bad self! I've sailed Catalina 27s and 28s and liked them. This 26 has considerably more room below (10 feet beam) and sails as well (or better?). It's a Frank Butler design and I suspect the transition between the old Catalina line and the new (3 digit) boats. I think they used it to work out the new design and construction techniques. We actually do have a foredeck! A very roomy one too. More so than the old Catalina lines did. I've been looking at that space thinking about loading and carrying a dinghy there. It looks "do-able" - for a small dink. Problem is that I want a larger dinghy than will comfortably fit. An 8 foot Walker Bay with the rid collar? Or a 10 foot - same. That's just to carry two people and a weight of supplies. I've seen one towed (hang on a sec!) towed backwards with the transom elevated and hung on the stern rail with only the bow in the water. It is basically an articulation of the main boat - not following on a rope. But with only 3'3" draft, we should be in close enough that maybe a smaller dinghy would serve ok? More learnin' to come... |
Joe loves me )
On Sun, 22 Nov 2009 19:01:51 -0600, cavelamb
wrote: Bruce In Bangkok wrote: On Sun, 22 Nov 2009 09:29:20 -0600, cavelamb wrote: Bruce In Bangkok wrote: On Sun, 22 Nov 2009 02:01:26 -0600, cavelamb wrote: Bruce In Bangkok wrote: On Sat, 21 Nov 2009 13:32:51 -0600, cavelamb wrote: Bruce In Bangkok wrote: The best method of sailing close hauled is START THE MOTOR :-! Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) Motor? You have a MOTOR? Huh! Maybe I out to get one of those!?! Picky, picky. All right - ENGINE :-) Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) It's ok, Bruce. Not being picky - just jelousy. I have an outboard. I sail faster, but power? Well, we do sail faster! This is the new boat your were talking about a couple of years ago? Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) No, that one fell through. Dorothy's uncle passed away and she was supposed to inherit his Hunter. But the kids threw a fuss (none of them wanted the boat - just the money) and it didn't happen. This one, "Temptress", is a much smaller Catalina Capri 26 that I bought last year. http://www.home.earthlink.net/~capri26/ We are hoping to move her down to the coast (that's Galveston Bay area) in the spring and wander down the coast a ways - maybe get sea sick and puke a lot - and hopefully have fun anyway. Richard Thus the confusion. I remembered the "hope we get it" messages and then there was the "New boat" sort of stuff and somehow I mentally tied them together and envisioned you floating about in a larger boat. Nice looking little boat though. Frankly I would assume that with the rather restricted deck forward you would be enthusiastically installing a furler. By the way, where do you stow the dinghy when cruising? If on the foredeck it adds even more reason to have a furler :-) Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) Thanks for remembering, Bruce! Yeah - we were pretty disappointed. The boat was a 38 foot Hunter - light for it's size, and not particularly pretty but what the heck!? It was only a few years old and the price for sure was right! Then it went for 25% market value - and no, we didn't get a chance to bid on it. Bummer. So I went looking for a boat I could afford to buy my own bad self! I've sailed Catalina 27s and 28s and liked them. This 26 has considerably more room below (10 feet beam) and sails as well (or better?). It's a Frank Butler design and I suspect the transition between the old Catalina line and the new (3 digit) boats. I think they used it to work out the new design and construction techniques. We actually do have a foredeck! A very roomy one too. More so than the old Catalina lines did. I've been looking at that space thinking about loading and carrying a dinghy there. It looks "do-able" - for a small dink. Problem is that I want a larger dinghy than will comfortably fit. An 8 foot Walker Bay with the rid collar? Or a 10 foot - same. That's just to carry two people and a weight of supplies. I've seen one towed (hang on a sec!) towed backwards with the transom elevated and hung on the stern rail with only the bow in the water. It is basically an articulation of the main boat - not following on a rope. But with only 3'3" draft, we should be in close enough that maybe a smaller dinghy would serve ok? More learnin' to come... Well. I suppose that with 3'3"" draft a pair of waders *might* work. (All you foreigners are tall, they say :-) I've never actually seen a "Walker Bay" dinghy but my 8 ft. plywood dinghy will easily carry myself, the wife and say two 5 gallon water cans, although I admit that my dinghy was built to fit on the forward portion of the cabin top and to compensate for the short length I widened it somewhat so I have nearly 4 ft. of beam and I deliberately built a pram design so I didn't waste space with a sharp bow. Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) |
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