Hello Roger,

Welcome "back" ...

It is a pleasure for me - again - to have the opportunity to read your
interesting viewpoints and comments.
Your inputs (comments and homepage and project descriptions etc.) are
most often very inspiring and relevant to me, and you seem to be very
well informed about "maritime stuff and technology" of all kinds ...

I'm curious - therefore - about your opinion - if any - on the new so
called 'broadband radar' ...

See f.ex

http://www.navico.com/en/Media/Press...oadband-Radar/

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WOWmWvojp98

http://www.cruisingworld.com/gear-an...000071492.html

Is it something you have studied? Considered? Seen for real?

When I read about it, I get the impression, that this is exactly what I
need as a supplement to my AIS receiver and chartplotter and the PC on
board. The material, I have seen, is - however - produced by the
respective marketing departments ... So your opinion would be highly
appreciated ... or some one elses opinion, who has specific experience
with this technology ...

--
Flemming Torp - X-342 - Denmark
Sailing in the busy "Nordic waters" may give several days with dense fog
....

"Roger Long" skrev i en meddelelse
...
On Sep 27, 4:57 pm, "Capt. JG" wrote:

Sure... explain away!

I'm not a huge fan of radar...

I thought SF Bay was quite foggy. Am I wrong? Back when I was saying
I could do fine without radar in Maine I would also think, "Now if I
was someplace like SF Bay..."

I looked at the small stand alone radars of size and power draw
appropriate to my boat and learned that Garmin has done a clever thing
(muc has it pains me to say since there is much I hate about Garmin in
general). Their radars do all the signal processing up in the radome
and then turn it into a signal that runs along a standard Cat 5
computer network cable like the one that probably is plugged into the
back of your computer. A clever person could certainly hack software
to make it display on a lap top. Most of their chartplotters accept
this signal. So, for less than $200 more than a stand alone unit, I
could buy a radome and a 3205 chartplotter with charts for the entire
U.S. preloaded. I essentially got a second larger and more
sophisticated chartplotter for free and a color display instead of the
BW of comparably priced stand alone radars. Instrument space is
precious on my small boat so it was also nice not to have yet another
box.

The best thing about the set up is that the radar display can be
overlaid on the chart with the GPS position. This is a huge
improvement in situational awareness. You can figure out almost
instantly whether a blip is a buoy or a vessel as opposed to going
back and forth between a dedicated radar display and a GPS or chart
transferring ranges and bearings. When you are sailing single or
shorthanded, these workload savings reduce fatigue and improve lookout
and attention to other navigational issues.

It's very difficult to run a proper radar plot in close, complex,
waters such as along the coast of Maine. Radars of this size are not
very conducive to plotting directly on the screen although some people
do it. There are enough asterisks scattered around Maine waters that
I'm reluctant to clutter up my screen with marks as well. The chart
overlay is a great plotting substitute. You can see by watching
soundings and other landmarks if a target is just wandering around
randomly and is probably a lobster boat or maintaining a straight
course and make a good estimate of speed. If it is close to
maintaining a constant bearing, it will be pretty obvious. Switching
to full screen radar mode gives your all the standard tools which I
some times use but I have to use them a lot less because I can rule
out most targets as a CPA danger just from the chart display.

There's much more of a learning curve than I expected. I spent the
first week or two thinking "Why did I spend all this money?" I
thought the overlay was pretty useless because it was so hard to find
the little red targets in the clutter. The brain trains. Now, I
little red spot pops up and my brain zeros right in on it from six
feet away at the helm. Working with it a lot in clear weather, I
developed enough trust to do my singlehanded radar running on
autopilot trusting to the advance warning. The straighter course the
autopilot can keep, (at least when I'm standing radar watch) makes the
whole picture clearer. I have the dodger in my hand and it only adds
a couple of boat lengths to the distance in which I can spring to the
controls and do a full stop or 180 turn which is much faster in my
boat. As I said, I wouldn't sail without it now.

--
Roger

On Sep 30, 6:00*pm, "Flemming Torp" fletopkanelbolle2rp.danmark
wrote:

I'm curious - therefore - about your opinion - if any - on the new so
called 'broadband radar' ...

Sorry Torp, I haven't given broadband a thought. When I went to buy
radar last spring, some people said, "This is a terrible time to buy
radar, broadband will be here next year."

I had to say, "Yeah, but I've got to have it for this spring's trip."
I've just tried not to think about it since then and be happy with
what I have.

Hopefully, someone else here can fill us in.

--
Roger Long

Don't know much about it, but it sure looks interesting. Amazing detail if
you believe the marketing hype.

"Roger Long" wrote in message
...
On Sep 30, 6:00 pm, "Flemming Torp" fletopkanelbolle2rp.danmark
wrote:

I'm curious - therefore - about your opinion - if any - on the new so
called 'broadband radar' ...

Sorry Torp, I haven't given broadband a thought. When I went to buy
radar last spring, some people said, "This is a terrible time to buy
radar, broadband will be here next year."

I had to say, "Yeah, but I've got to have it for this spring's trip."
I've just tried not to think about it since then and be happy with
what I have.

Hopefully, someone else here can fill us in.

--
Roger Long





--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

On Thu, 1 Oct 2009 00:00:30 +0200, "Flemming Torp"
fletopkanelbolle2rp.danmark wrote:

I'm curious - therefore - about your opinion - if any - on the new so
called 'broadband radar' ...

The reports I've gotten have not been all that positive. Apparently
it does what it says on short ranges under a mile but is pretty much
useless on targets more than a mile away. If you already have a good
long range radar it might make a good hi-res supplement for close
quarters.

On Sun, 27 Sep 2009 13:41:09 -0700 (PDT), Roger Long
wrote:

I think, if you poke around in the archives of this group, you'll find
a post from me about a year ago pontificating about how I couldn't
justify the cost, weight, and power draw of radar cruising in Maine.

Yes. You thought I was quite foolish to have RADAR on my boat, and
couldn't understand why I thought it was good to have. G

In late June we sailed from Point Judith Pond to Wickford, RI without
being able to see more than 100 feet, and often less. Without RADAR,
we would have been stuck in Point Judith for several days. During the
entire 10 days of that trip, there was heavy fog, or fog/rain much of
the time. It did clear up while we were visiting Wickford and riding
our bikes around.

This is normal conditions for the first couple months of the season in
the Eastern LIS and Naragansett Bay areas. "Fair weather only"
sailors have a much shorter season than we do. We are often heading
out, as everyone else seems to be headed in.

wrote in message
...
On Sun, 27 Sep 2009 13:41:09 -0700 (PDT), Roger Long
wrote:

I think, if you poke around in the archives of this group, you'll find
a post from me about a year ago pontificating about how I couldn't
justify the cost, weight, and power draw of radar cruising in Maine.

Yes. You thought I was quite foolish to have RADAR on my boat, and
couldn't understand why I thought it was good to have. G

In late June we sailed from Point Judith Pond to Wickford, RI without
being able to see more than 100 feet, and often less. Without RADAR,
we would have been stuck in Point Judith for several days. During the
entire 10 days of that trip, there was heavy fog, or fog/rain much of
the time. It did clear up while we were visiting Wickford and riding
our bikes around.

This is normal conditions for the first couple months of the season in
the Eastern LIS and Naragansett Bay areas. "Fair weather only"
sailors have a much shorter season than we do. We are often heading
out, as everyone else seems to be headed in.

Last summer from July to end of August I was cruising the coast of Nova
Scotia.

I was glad to have an all integrated system mounted in the cockpit.

My radar attitude as changed. I found that using the radar side by side with
the plotter and watching the depth was very helpful. Having the direction
of the tide and current showing on your plotter helps.

At time when its high tide you may not see rocks (ex Brazil Rock) on your
radar screen but you will on your plotter and by validating your position
with the depth give you a warmer feeling. I have found it very practical to
plot my routes on the plotter first.

Normally radar works well in all but very bad weather conditions.
Conversely in heavy seas and heavy fog I have experienced sea clutters. The
book shows you how to control sea clutters.

While in reality I was only able to degrease and minimize the clutters.
After checking with commercial fishermen and Coast Guard vessels I learned
that this is true.

After this summer cruise I concluded that I needed to replace my radar
reflector.

Other vessels can easily interpret a small blip as part of sea clutters.
While in reality it's a small sailboat with an inadequate radar reflector.

Denis M wrote:
wrote in message
...
On Sun, 27 Sep 2009 13:41:09 -0700 (PDT), Roger Long
wrote:

I think, if you poke around in the archives of this group, you'll find
a post from me about a year ago pontificating about how I couldn't
justify the cost, weight, and power draw of radar cruising in Maine.
Yes. You thought I was quite foolish to have RADAR on my boat, and
couldn't understand why I thought it was good to have. G

In late June we sailed from Point Judith Pond to Wickford, RI without
being able to see more than 100 feet, and often less. Without RADAR,
we would have been stuck in Point Judith for several days. During the
entire 10 days of that trip, there was heavy fog, or fog/rain much of
the time. It did clear up while we were visiting Wickford and riding
our bikes around.

This is normal conditions for the first couple months of the season in
the Eastern LIS and Naragansett Bay areas. "Fair weather only"
sailors have a much shorter season than we do. We are often heading
out, as everyone else seems to be headed in.

Last summer from July to end of August I was cruising the coast of Nova
Scotia.

I was glad to have an all integrated system mounted in the cockpit.

My radar attitude as changed. I found that using the radar side by side with
the plotter and watching the depth was very helpful. Having the direction
of the tide and current showing on your plotter helps.

At time when its high tide you may not see rocks (ex Brazil Rock) on your
radar screen but you will on your plotter and by validating your position
with the depth give you a warmer feeling. I have found it very practical to
plot my routes on the plotter first.

Normally radar works well in all but very bad weather conditions.
Conversely in heavy seas and heavy fog I have experienced sea clutters. The
book shows you how to control sea clutters.

While in reality I was only able to degrease and minimize the clutters.
After checking with commercial fishermen and Coast Guard vessels I learned
that this is true.

After this summer cruise I concluded that I needed to replace my radar
reflector.

Other vessels can easily interpret a small blip as part of sea clutters.
While in reality it's a small sailboat with an inadequate radar reflector.





It is a well known fact to eastern Mexico cruisers that the
electronic charts are not to be trusted and MUST be backed up with
radar. These charts were made from 1800s surveys. I understand
Worldcharts are up to date having been made from a recent survey.
As to radar reflectors. Here is a site on making your own. Haven't
been tested, but should work better than any off the shelf cheapos.
http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/07/...adar/index.htm
I made mine from 10" al flashing material. Mounted it on the mizzen
spreader.
Gordon

In article ,
"Denis M" wrote:

After this summer cruise I concluded that I needed to replace my radar
reflector.

An active one will work wonders.
And (active) AIS is an even better option, provided you are aware that
only vessels over 500 tons are mandatorily fitted with one. This will
even give you the equivalent of MARPA.

HTH

Marc

--
remove bye and from mercial to get valid e-mail
http://www.heusser.com

On Mon, 28 Sep 2009 09:39:08 +0200, Marc Heusser
d wrote:

In article ,
"Denis M" wrote:

After this summer cruise I concluded that I needed to replace my radar
reflector.

An active one will work wonders.
And (active) AIS is an even better option, provided you are aware that
only vessels over 500 tons are mandatorily fitted with one. This will
even give you the equivalent of MARPA.

HTH

Marc

Those big boats can (and do) filter out all signals from AIS-B
transponders to reduce clutter on their display. You may see them, but
they still don't see you.

wrote in message
...
On Mon, 28 Sep 2009 09:39:08 +0200, Marc Heusser
d wrote:

In article ,
"Denis M" wrote:

After this summer cruise I concluded that I needed to replace my radar
reflector.

An active one will work wonders.
And (active) AIS is an even better option, provided you are aware that
only vessels over 500 tons are mandatorily fitted with one. This will
even give you the equivalent of MARPA.

HTH

Marc

Those big boats can (and do) filter out all signals from AIS-B
transponders to reduce clutter on their display. You may see them, but
they still don't see you.

Very true, when a target is showing on the radar. I use MARPA's
information and contact the vessel with DSC. This way (hopefully) the
vessel or radar base can identify me with my MMSI number and get my GPS
position on their screen. In theory this is how it should work. I practice
it's a difference story. Most of the foreign ships have not had their
personnel trained to use DSC yet!

When practicing with friend I can track their GPS positions and they can
track me without problems.