Boat battery question???
 

Hi

I bought the two Nautaulis deep cycle big batteries for 139. ea. Also the
motomaster 10/2 amp automatic charger regurlarily 70.

I have had the 2amp charger on one of the batteries for about 6 hours or 8
hours and little bubbling going on I can hear and the charger still is not
changing from red light (charging) to green light (charged).

Should I keep it on the 2am for longer? Batteries are only 1 week old from
Canadian Tire and charger is also new.

Is the bubbling a concern? It is not boiling over, but listening very close
you can hear the bubbling.


http://www.canadiantire.ca/AST/brows...%2BBattery.jsp



http://www.canadiantire.ca/AST/brows...BCha rger.jsp



Nobody at any of the branches could give me any real advice. I wanted to
treat these batteries with kid gloves so they would last more than 4 years.

Any advice or help would be greatly appreciated,,, thanks

Boat battery question???
 

" Tuuk" wrote in
:

I have had the 2amp charger on one of the batteries for about 6 hours
or 8 hours and little bubbling going on I can hear and the charger
still is not changing from red light (charging) to green light
(charged).

Should I keep it on the 2am for longer? Batteries are only 1 week old
from Canadian Tire and charger is also new.

Is the bubbling a concern? It is not boiling over, but listening very
close you can hear the bubbling.



Got a digital voltmeter? They're only $4 at the Chinese cheap tool
stores and are very accurate. With the charger running, you should not
see over 14.8VDC at the battery terminals. You must be awful close if
it's bubbling loud enough to hear. Don't leave it on bubbling so you
can hear... Modern batteries not being overcharged use almost no water
over long periods of time. If you have to refill the battery very
often, you're overcharging it.

While you're foraging for a DVM, buy a temperature compensated
hydrometer, not the cheap crap with the floating colored balls, one that
has a real thermometer buried in a rubber housing from the NAPA store or
where mechanics buy auto parts. That's the ONLY way to tell what
condition your battery cells are in. When it's charged, the specific
gravity, compensated for temperature of the electrolyte which is the
only way to get an accurate reading, should be 1.270 sp gr. All the
cells should be within .005 sp gr of each other. If you find a low
cell, way off from the others...bad battery needs replacment under
warranty. It does happen.

Remember, batteries are only refilled with PURE DISTILLED WATER, not
spring water, city water or that crap in the hose on the dock....(sigh)
Distilled water is available at grocery stores to put in clothes irons.
Make SURE it says STEAM DISTILLED, not just demineralized by pouring it
through a cheap filter gadget.



--
-----
Larry

If a man goes way out into the woods all alone and says something,
is it still wrong, even though no woman hears him?

Boat battery question???
 

Hi Larry

Thanks for the reply and expertise,,

I do not have a dvm or specific gravitity measurer.

So I should shut it off now because it is lightly bubbling on the 2am charge
because it has not reached the capacity point where the automatic shut off
should have shut off. I tried it on an old 12v deep cycle and it did charge
it quickly (maybe an hour) and green light came on. But these two new ones
which are larger in size and weight are not shutting off the automatic
charger yet. I am a bit reluctant to charge it in the 10amp. The folks at
the C.T. told me to bring in the batteries and they will put a 30amp on them
and have them topped up in minutes but I did some reading and that can't be
too good for the deepcycle batteries.

Without the dvm or hydrometer I cannot really do much as I will need to know
the condition of battery and maximum charge coming off that charger.

I will look for those tools,

thanks






"Larry" wrote in message
...
" Tuuk" wrote in
:

I have had the 2amp charger on one of the batteries for about 6 hours
or 8 hours and little bubbling going on I can hear and the charger
still is not changing from red light (charging) to green light
(charged).

Should I keep it on the 2am for longer? Batteries are only 1 week old
from Canadian Tire and charger is also new.

Is the bubbling a concern? It is not boiling over, but listening very
close you can hear the bubbling.



Got a digital voltmeter? They're only $4 at the Chinese cheap tool
stores and are very accurate. With the charger running, you should not
see over 14.8VDC at the battery terminals. You must be awful close if
it's bubbling loud enough to hear. Don't leave it on bubbling so you
can hear... Modern batteries not being overcharged use almost no water
over long periods of time. If you have to refill the battery very
often, you're overcharging it.

While you're foraging for a DVM, buy a temperature compensated
hydrometer, not the cheap crap with the floating colored balls, one that
has a real thermometer buried in a rubber housing from the NAPA store or
where mechanics buy auto parts. That's the ONLY way to tell what
condition your battery cells are in. When it's charged, the specific
gravity, compensated for temperature of the electrolyte which is the
only way to get an accurate reading, should be 1.270 sp gr. All the
cells should be within .005 sp gr of each other. If you find a low
cell, way off from the others...bad battery needs replacment under
warranty. It does happen.

Remember, batteries are only refilled with PURE DISTILLED WATER, not
spring water, city water or that crap in the hose on the dock....(sigh)
Distilled water is available at grocery stores to put in clothes irons.
Make SURE it says STEAM DISTILLED, not just demineralized by pouring it
through a cheap filter gadget.



--
-----
Larry

If a man goes way out into the woods all alone and says something,
is it still wrong, even though no woman hears him?

Boat battery question???
 

"Larry" wrote in message
...
" Tuuk" wrote in
:

I have had the 2amp charger on one of the batteries for about 6 hours
or 8 hours and little bubbling going on I can hear and the charger
still is not changing from red light (charging) to green light
(charged).

Should I keep it on the 2am for longer? Batteries are only 1 week old
from Canadian Tire and charger is also new.

Is the bubbling a concern? It is not boiling over, but listening very
close you can hear the bubbling.



Got a digital voltmeter? They're only $4 at the Chinese cheap tool
stores and are very accurate. With the charger running, you should not
see over 14.8VDC at the battery terminals. You must be awful close if
it's bubbling loud enough to hear. Don't leave it on bubbling so you
can hear... Modern batteries not being overcharged use almost no water
over long periods of time. If you have to refill the battery very
often, you're overcharging it.

While you're foraging for a DVM, buy a temperature compensated
hydrometer, not the cheap crap with the floating colored balls, one that
has a real thermometer buried in a rubber housing from the NAPA store or
where mechanics buy auto parts. That's the ONLY way to tell what
condition your battery cells are in. When it's charged, the specific
gravity, compensated for temperature of the electrolyte which is the
only way to get an accurate reading, should be 1.270 sp gr. All the
cells should be within .005 sp gr of each other. If you find a low
cell, way off from the others...bad battery needs replacment under
warranty. It does happen.

Remember, batteries are only refilled with PURE DISTILLED WATER, not
spring water, city water or that crap in the hose on the dock....(sigh)
Distilled water is available at grocery stores to put in clothes irons.
Make SURE it says STEAM DISTILLED, not just demineralized by pouring it
through a cheap filter gadget.



I agree with this... I'd be very concerned about bubbling and temp rise.
I've never been able to actually hear any bubbling, although small bubbles
do form and I can see them if I take a look. Make sure everything is OFF
(and I mean EVERYTHING) and wear eye protection if you decide to open the
fill holes. Obviously, you want to ensure nothing metal comes in contact
with the terminals. A friend of my father's died from a car battery
explosion.

I'd turn off everything, get a volt meter, and try again. Check the water
level before you restart the charging, and if it's low, I'd be even more
concerned.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Boat battery question???
 

" Tuuk" wrote in message
...
Hi Larry

Thanks for the reply and expertise,,

I do not have a dvm or specific gravitity measurer.

So I should shut it off now because it is lightly bubbling on the 2am
charge because it has not reached the capacity point where the automatic
shut off should have shut off. I tried it on an old 12v deep cycle and it
did charge it quickly (maybe an hour) and green light came on. But these
two new ones which are larger in size and weight are not shutting off the
automatic charger yet. I am a bit reluctant to charge it in the 10amp. The
folks at the C.T. told me to bring in the batteries and they will put a
30amp on them and have them topped up in minutes but I did some reading
and that can't be too good for the deepcycle batteries.

Without the dvm or hydrometer I cannot really do much as I will need to
know the condition of battery and maximum charge coming off that charger.

I will look for those tools,

thanks


I don't think one charge like this would do much harm if you decide to have
them do it. They're under warranty, right? Make sure you document when this
is done, then if there's a problem, you've got some leverage.

After, I would monitor the batteries condition closely for a few weeks, then
check them regularly thereafter.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Boat battery question???
 

What about leaving the charger on overnight?

The battery hasn't shut off the 2amp automatic charger yet and its only been
about 8 hours. Could or should i try leaving it on the 2amp auto off, sure
it is light bubbling as i can hear it, and see what it looks like in the
morning.

If battery light shows red and continuing charge, then return the batteries
and charger to C.T. and explain and have them test and replace as necessary
as this is simply normal operations and they said do it anyway.

If battery light shows green then all should be good to go.

I just worry about hearing the light bubbling and know it would go on all
night. I read somewhere the bubbling wasn't good for the deepcycle plates
and reduces their efficiencies and capacity.

I gots to know.







"Capt. JG" wrote in message
easolutions...
"Larry" wrote in message
...
" Tuuk" wrote in
:

I have had the 2amp charger on one of the batteries for about 6 hours
or 8 hours and little bubbling going on I can hear and the charger
still is not changing from red light (charging) to green light
(charged).

Should I keep it on the 2am for longer? Batteries are only 1 week old
from Canadian Tire and charger is also new.

Is the bubbling a concern? It is not boiling over, but listening very
close you can hear the bubbling.



Got a digital voltmeter? They're only $4 at the Chinese cheap tool
stores and are very accurate. With the charger running, you should not
see over 14.8VDC at the battery terminals. You must be awful close if
it's bubbling loud enough to hear. Don't leave it on bubbling so you
can hear... Modern batteries not being overcharged use almost no water
over long periods of time. If you have to refill the battery very
often, you're overcharging it.

While you're foraging for a DVM, buy a temperature compensated
hydrometer, not the cheap crap with the floating colored balls, one that
has a real thermometer buried in a rubber housing from the NAPA store or
where mechanics buy auto parts. That's the ONLY way to tell what
condition your battery cells are in. When it's charged, the specific
gravity, compensated for temperature of the electrolyte which is the
only way to get an accurate reading, should be 1.270 sp gr. All the
cells should be within .005 sp gr of each other. If you find a low
cell, way off from the others...bad battery needs replacment under
warranty. It does happen.

Remember, batteries are only refilled with PURE DISTILLED WATER, not
spring water, city water or that crap in the hose on the dock....(sigh)
Distilled water is available at grocery stores to put in clothes irons.
Make SURE it says STEAM DISTILLED, not just demineralized by pouring it
through a cheap filter gadget.



I agree with this... I'd be very concerned about bubbling and temp rise.
I've never been able to actually hear any bubbling, although small bubbles
do form and I can see them if I take a look. Make sure everything is OFF
(and I mean EVERYTHING) and wear eye protection if you decide to open the
fill holes. Obviously, you want to ensure nothing metal comes in contact
with the terminals. A friend of my father's died from a car battery
explosion.

I'd turn off everything, get a volt meter, and try again. Check the water
level before you restart the charging, and if it's low, I'd be even more
concerned.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Boat battery question???
 

" Tuuk" wrote in message
...
Hi

I bought the two Nautaulis deep cycle big batteries for 139. ea. Also the
motomaster 10/2 amp automatic charger regurlarily 70.

I have had the 2amp charger on one of the batteries for about 6 hours or 8
hours and little bubbling going on I can hear and the charger still is not
changing from red light (charging) to green light (charged).

Should I keep it on the 2am for longer? Batteries are only 1 week old from
Canadian Tire and charger is also new.

Is the bubbling a concern? It is not boiling over, but listening very
close
you can hear the bubbling.


http://www.canadiantire.ca/AST/brows...%2BBattery.jsp



http://www.canadiantire.ca/AST/brows...BCha rger.jsp



Nobody at any of the branches could give me any real advice. I wanted to
treat these batteries with kid gloves so they would last more than 4
years.

Any advice or help would be greatly appreciated,,, thanks


This can't be the 'Tuuk' who caused all the trouble in rec.boats a few years
ago??
You almost sound sensible!

Boat battery question???
 

" Tuuk" wrote in message
...
What about leaving the charger on overnight?

I don't know. I guess you could try it and see what happens.

The battery hasn't shut off the 2amp automatic charger yet and its only
been about 8 hours. Could or should i try leaving it on the 2amp auto off,
sure it is light bubbling as i can hear it, and see what it looks like in
the morning.

If battery light shows red and continuing charge, then return the
batteries and charger to C.T. and explain and have them test and replace
as necessary as this is simply normal operations and they said do it
anyway.

Sounds about right.

If battery light shows green then all should be good to go.

Sounds about right.

I just worry about hearing the light bubbling and know it would go on all
night. I read somewhere the bubbling wasn't good for the deepcycle plates
and reduces their efficiencies and capacity.

Lite bubbling is normal, but like I said, I've never heard it just seen it.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Boat battery question???
 

On Sat, 20 Jun 2009 15:30:29 -0400, " Tuuk"
wrote:

If battery light shows red and continuing charge, then return the batteries
and charger to C.T. and explain and have them test and replace as necessary
as this is simply normal operations and they said do it anyway.

If battery light shows green then all should be good to go.

You need something more precise than red and green lights. The best
way is with a load tester which you can buy at a reasonable price from
Harbor Freight or Northern Tool. Also, as Larry mentioned, a specific
gravity test using a hygrometer is very useful. Last but not least,
test the battery with a DVM after it has been off the charger for at
least 24 hours. A fully charged battery should read about 12.6 volts
with no load or lightly loaded.

Boat battery question???
 

Tuuk wrote:
Hi

I bought the two Nautaulis deep cycle big batteries for 139. ea. Also the
motomaster 10/2 amp automatic charger regurlarily 70.

I have had the 2amp charger on one of the batteries for about 6 hours or 8
hours and little bubbling going on I can hear and the charger still is not
changing from red light (charging) to green light (charged).

Should I keep it on the 2am for longer? Batteries are only 1 week old from
Canadian Tire and charger is also new.


random thoughts:

Its hard to say about the bubbling because a small amount of bubbling is
expected, but a large amount means possible overcharging. As others
say, get a simple Voltmeter and a cheap specific gravity tester - you
can get both for under $10. And of course make sure the battery has the
proper amount of distilled water.

Your batteries hold a bit over 100 Amp-hours, meaning that if the were
totally dead it would take over 50 hours for your 2 Amp charger to get
one close to full. The last 10% could take some hours more. However,
they should have be delivered with at least a 50% charge - otherwise
you'd have a case to return them as DOA, since taking them below 50%
diminishes the lifetime. Look for a manufacturing code to make sure it
hasn't sat on the dealer's shelf for 6 months or more.

That said, I would expect the batteries to need a significant initial
charge (unless the dealer claimed they were fully charged) so the 2 Amp
mode really will take overnight or more to get it up to full. Or you
could use the 10 Amp mode to do it faster. BTW, I regularly charge at a
rate double that (scaled for my larger bank) but my charger is well
controlled so it doesn't apply too high a Voltage. In fact, the
purpose of a deep cycle battery is to be able to take them down to about
50%, and then recharge them reasonably quickly, and repeat this about
500 times. If you really want to charge at a slow rate, this is the
device to get:
http://www.amazon.com/Battery-Tender...dp/B00068XCQU/

Boat battery question???
 

THanks

Yes, that little charger tender plus is a pretty practical little device.

I been reading a lot and bubbling (to a degree) is common and expected.

Thanks for all the good advice.








"jeff" wrote in message
...
Tuuk wrote:
Hi

I bought the two Nautaulis deep cycle big batteries for 139. ea. Also the
motomaster 10/2 amp automatic charger regurlarily 70.

I have had the 2amp charger on one of the batteries for about 6 hours or
8
hours and little bubbling going on I can hear and the charger still is
not
changing from red light (charging) to green light (charged).

Should I keep it on the 2am for longer? Batteries are only 1 week old
from
Canadian Tire and charger is also new.


random thoughts:

Its hard to say about the bubbling because a small amount of bubbling is
expected, but a large amount means possible overcharging. As others say,
get a simple Voltmeter and a cheap specific gravity tester - you can get
both for under $10. And of course make sure the battery has the proper
amount of distilled water.

Your batteries hold a bit over 100 Amp-hours, meaning that if the were
totally dead it would take over 50 hours for your 2 Amp charger to get one
close to full. The last 10% could take some hours more. However, they
should have be delivered with at least a 50% charge - otherwise you'd have
a case to return them as DOA, since taking them below 50% diminishes the
lifetime. Look for a manufacturing code to make sure it hasn't sat on the
dealer's shelf for 6 months or more.

That said, I would expect the batteries to need a significant initial
charge (unless the dealer claimed they were fully charged) so the 2 Amp
mode really will take overnight or more to get it up to full. Or you
could use the 10 Amp mode to do it faster. BTW, I regularly charge at a
rate double that (scaled for my larger bank) but my charger is well
controlled so it doesn't apply too high a Voltage. In fact, the purpose
of a deep cycle battery is to be able to take them down to about 50%, and
then recharge them reasonably quickly, and repeat this about 500 times.
If you really want to charge at a slow rate, this is the device to get:
http://www.amazon.com/Battery-Tender...dp/B00068XCQU/

Boat battery question???
 

" Tuuk" wrote in
:

I tried it on an old 12v deep cycle and it did charge
it quickly (maybe an hour) and green light came on. But these two new
ones which are larger in size and weight are not shutting off the
automatic charger yet. I am a bit reluctant to charge it in the 10amp.
The folks at the C.T. told me to bring in the batteries and they will
put a 30amp on them and have them topped up in minutes but I did some
reading and that can't be too good for the deepcycle batteries.


Yes, by all means take them to some dunderheads who think they can recharge
batteries in 30 minutes flat. How horrible most are. Boaters typically
charge the house batteries for 20 minutes at full current, thinking wrongly
they are recharging them....They're not.

10A charging is fine. Huge batteries take forever to charge on 2A, of
course assuming they're discharged. I can't imagine 2A bubbling anything
not fully charged.

Are you SURE there's no loads, at all, on this tiny charger? Aren't these
batteries also hooked to the house circuit?



--
-----
Larry

If a man goes way out into the woods all alone and says something,
is it still wrong, even though no woman hears him?

Boat battery question???
 

" Tuuk" wrote in
:

The battery hasn't shut off the 2amp automatic charger yet and its
only been about 8 hours. Could or should i try leaving it on the 2amp
auto off, sure it is light bubbling as i can hear it, and see what it
looks like in the morning.


2A x 8 Hours = 16AH. Charging isn't very efficient, so you'd be lucky to
get 10AH of real charge this way. Overnight won't hurt them, even if the
charger were locked on. Don't leave them a week without monitoring until
you figure out what's what.



--
-----
Larry

If a man goes way out into the woods all alone and says something,
is it still wrong, even though no woman hears him?

Boat battery question???
 

Wayne.B wrote in
:

On Sat, 20 Jun 2009 15:30:29 -0400, " Tuuk"
wrote:

If battery light shows red and continuing charge, then return the
batteries and charger to C.T. and explain and have them test and
replace as necessary as this is simply normal operations and they said
do it anyway.

If battery light shows green then all should be good to go.

You need something more precise than red and green lights. The best
way is with a load tester which you can buy at a reasonable price from
Harbor Freight or Northern Tool. Also, as Larry mentioned, a specific
gravity test using a hygrometer is very useful. Last but not least,
test the battery with a DVM after it has been off the charger for at
least 24 hours. A fully charged battery should read about 12.6 volts
with no load or lightly loaded.


Harbor Freight has a new load tester, now. 0-500 amps! I gave my 50A
fixed load tester to a boater who is nice to me and got the new one. It's
a beautiful unit for so little money.



--
-----
Larry

If a man goes way out into the woods all alone and says something,
is it still wrong, even though no woman hears him?

Boat battery question???
 

On Sun, 21 Jun 2009 14:22:20 -0400, Gogarty
wrote:

I bought a small automatic 10/2 amp charger to hold
the batteries over the winter. It cost about $50.

Be careful. Those $50 chargers are really not designed for a damp
marine environment or continuous operation. I know of several boat
fires that have been started by them.

Boat battery question???
 

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
easolutions...

The folks at the C.T. told me to bring in the batteries and they will
put a 30amp on them and have them topped up in minutes but I did some
reading and that can't be too good for the deepcycle batteries.




I don't think one charge like this would do much harm if you decide to
have them do it.


Now's that's the voice of experience! Ignore any advice from this
knucklehead he's blowing smoke from his ass.

Boat battery question???
 

"Mac Donald" wrote in news:2tn979.6g0.19.1
@news.alt.net:


"Capt. JG" wrote in message
easolutions...

The folks at the C.T. told me to bring in the batteries and they will
put a 30amp on them and have them topped up in minutes but I did some
reading and that can't be too good for the deepcycle batteries.




I don't think one charge like this would do much harm if you decide to
have them do it.


Now's that's the voice of experience! Ignore any advice from this
knucklehead he's blowing smoke from his ass.




Mac? Don't you have 4 500A alternators in parallel so you can charge the
house batteries in 5 minutes, like some boats I know?....(c;]

(It's not funny...I actually saw one like this!....with kids aboard going
offshore!)

--
-----
Larry

If a man goes way out into the woods all alone and says something,
is it still wrong, even though no woman hears him?

Boat battery question???
 

On Tue, 23 Jun 2009 15:58:11 +0000, Larry wrote:

Mac? Don't you have 4 500A alternators in parallel so you can charge the
house batteries in 5 minutes, like some boats I know?....(c;]

We have a pair of 250 amp alternators. They won't charge the
batteries in 5 minutes, but at half power they will drive a 2500 watt
inverter at full output.

http://www.alternatorparts.com/Extreme%20Duty%20Dual%20Rectifier%20CS-144%20type.htm

Boat battery question???
 

Capt. JG wrote:
" Tuuk" wrote in message
...
Hi Larry

Thanks for the reply and expertise,,

I do not have a dvm or specific gravitity measurer.

So I should shut it off now because it is lightly bubbling on the 2am
charge because it has not reached the capacity point where the automatic
shut off should have shut off. I tried it on an old 12v deep cycle and it
did charge it quickly (maybe an hour) and green light came on. But these
two new ones which are larger in size and weight are not shutting off the
automatic charger yet. I am a bit reluctant to charge it in the 10amp. The
folks at the C.T. told me to bring in the batteries and they will put a
30amp on them and have them topped up in minutes but I did some reading
and that can't be too good for the deepcycle batteries.

Without the dvm or hydrometer I cannot really do much as I will need to
know the condition of battery and maximum charge coming off that charger.

I will look for those tools,

thanks


I don't think one charge like this would do much harm if you decide to have
them do it. They're under warranty, right? Make sure you document when this
is done, then if there's a problem, you've got some leverage.

After, I would monitor the batteries condition closely for a few weeks, then
check them regularly thereafter.



Actually, the Amperage is of secondary importance, even though every
charger is identified by its max current output. The important thing is
the Voltage. If the charger is gentle (or intelligent) it will keep the
Voltage at a level that's appropriate for the state of the battery.
Your 100 Amp-hour batteries can accept about 20-25 Amps as long as the
charger start tapering off the charge as it gets past about 85-90%. If
it is really putting in 30 Amps, then the Voltage is probably too high,
and the batteries will start gassing. (An undersized charger will
likely not be able to hold the Voltage high on a discharged battery.)

Of course then you have to figure out whether your CT man is just some
bozo who is BS'ing you while he trashes your battery, or a professional
who knows exactly how much the battery can handle and will monitor it
carefully so that no damage is done. Worse, you have to figure out if
that already happened while the battery was sitting in the store all
winter. This unfortunately is a "crap shoot" but I try to maximize my
odds by getting new batteries as part of the Spring shipment to a golf
cart vendor.

Boat battery question???
 

On Tue, 23 Jun 2009 15:58:11 +0000, Larry wrote:

"Mac Donald" wrote in news:2tn979.6g0.19.1
:


"Capt. JG" wrote in message
easolutions...

The folks at the C.T. told me to bring in the batteries and they will
put a 30amp on them and have them topped up in minutes but I did some
reading and that can't be too good for the deepcycle batteries.




I don't think one charge like this would do much harm if you decide to
have them do it.


Now's that's the voice of experience! Ignore any advice from this
knucklehead he's blowing smoke from his ass.




Mac? Don't you have 4 500A alternators in parallel so you can charge the
house batteries in 5 minutes, like some boats I know?....(c;]

(It's not funny...I actually saw one like this!....with kids aboard going
offshore!)

How much voltage do you need to pump 2,000 amps into a battery?

Cheers,

Bruce
(bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom)

Boat battery question???
 

On Tue, 23 Jun 2009 12:12:42 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Tue, 23 Jun 2009 15:58:11 +0000, Larry wrote:

Mac? Don't you have 4 500A alternators in parallel so you can charge the
house batteries in 5 minutes, like some boats I know?....(c;]

We have a pair of 250 amp alternators. They won't charge the
batteries in 5 minutes, but at half power they will drive a 2500 watt
inverter at full output.

http://www.alternatorparts.com/Extreme%20Duty%20Dual%20Rectifier%20CS-144%20type.htm

Without a battery that would be in the region of 200 amps, not
considering system loss.

Cheers,

Bruce
(bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom)

Boat battery question???
 

On Wed, 24 Jun 2009 16:10:49 +0700, Bruce In Bangkok
wrote:

Mac? Don't you have 4 500A alternators in parallel so you can charge the
house batteries in 5 minutes, like some boats I know?....(c;]

(It's not funny...I actually saw one like this!....with kids aboard going
offshore!)

How much voltage do you need to pump 2,000 amps into a battery?

More to the point, how much battery do you need? I'd estimate about
40 pairs of golf cart batts at about 120 lbs per pair. Maybe the
question is "how much boat do you need" ?

Boat battery question???
 

On Wed, 24 Jun 2009 16:15:09 +0700, Bruce In Bangkok
wrote:

We have a pair of 250 amp alternators. They won't charge the
batteries in 5 minutes, but at half power they will drive a 2500 watt
inverter at full output.

http://www.alternatorparts.com/Extreme%20Duty%20Dual%20Rectifier%20CS-144%20type.htm

Without a battery that would be in the region of 200 amps, not
considering system loss.

Yes, and there are losses, even with big cables and heavy duty lugs.

Boat battery question???
 

"Bruce In Bangkok" wrote:


How much voltage do you need to pump 2,000 amps into a battery?


How muich time do you have?

Lew

Boat battery question???
 

Bruce In Bangkok wrote in
:

How much voltage do you need to pump 2,000 amps into a battery?



How dead is it?

--
-----
Larry

If a man goes way out into the woods all alone and says something,
is it still wrong, even though no woman hears him?

Boat battery question???
 

On Wed, 24 Jun 2009 18:43:20 GMT, "Lew Hodgett"
wrote:


"Bruce In Bangkok" wrote:


How much voltage do you need to pump 2,000 amps into a battery?


How muich time do you have?

Lew

What? Amps have nothing to do with time.

Cheers,

Bruce
(bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom)

Boat battery question???
 

On Wed, 24 Jun 2009 20:57:31 +0000, Larry wrote:

Bruce In Bangkok wrote in
:

How much voltage do you need to pump 2,000 amps into a battery?



How dead is it?

Dead enough to have to charge it :-)

Cheers,

Bruce
(bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom)

Boat battery question???
 

Bruce In Bangkok wrote in
:

Dead enough to have to charge it :-)



25% of AH rating tapering to zero after 12 hours....

Chemistry is slow....


--
-----
Larry

If a man goes way out into the woods all alone and says something,
is it still wrong, even though no woman hears him?

Boat battery question???
 

Bruce In Bangkok wrote in
:

What? Amps have nothing to do with time.


Amps X Hours X charging efficiency as a decimal = AH

Amps have a lot to do with time....



--
-----
Larry

If a man goes way out into the woods all alone and says something,
is it still wrong, even though no woman hears him?

Boat battery question???
 

Bruce In Bangkok" wrote:


What? Amps have nothing to do with time.

Ah but in the case of a battery, they do.

How big is the batttery?

Recharge rate won't exceed 15% average of the battery AH capacity.

For every 100 AH taken out of a battery, you must replace 125AH.

Wet cell batteries are not efficient, just convenient.

As you can see the number of replacement AH put back in a battery is
very much time dependant.


Lew

Boat battery question???
 

On Thu, 25 Jun 2009 01:12:46 +0000, Larry wrote:

Bruce In Bangkok wrote in
:

What? Amps have nothing to do with time.


Amps X Hours X charging efficiency as a decimal = AH

Amps have a lot to do with time....

You are talking about charging time. I was talking about measurement
:-)

Cheers,

Bruce
(bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom)

Boat battery question???
 

On Thu, 25 Jun 2009 01:14:11 GMT, "Lew Hodgett"
wrote:

Bruce In Bangkok" wrote:


What? Amps have nothing to do with time.

Ah but in the case of a battery, they do.

How big is the batttery?

Recharge rate won't exceed 15% average of the battery AH capacity.

For every 100 AH taken out of a battery, you must replace 125AH.

Wet cell batteries are not efficient, just convenient.

As you can see the number of replacement AH put back in a battery is
very much time dependant.

Again, you are talking about charging time. I was talking about
measurement of current, which has nothing to do with time.

Cheers,

Bruce
(bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom)

Boat battery question???
 

"Lew Hodgett" wrote in message
...
Bruce In Bangkok" wrote:


What? Amps have nothing to do with time.

Ah but in the case of a battery, they do.


In the case of a battery, you find, typically, a battery.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Boat battery question???
 

How much voltage do you need to pump 2,000 amps into a battery?



Bruce In Bangkok" wrote:


Again, you are talking about charging time. I was talking about
measurement of current, which has nothing to do with time.


Flow rate (current) is by definition, time related.

Lew

Boat battery question???
 

On Thu, 25 Jun 2009 02:08:30 GMT, "Lew Hodgett"
wrote:

How much voltage do you need to pump 2,000 amps into a battery?



Bruce In Bangkok" wrote:


Again, you are talking about charging time. I was talking about
measurement of current, which has nothing to do with time.


Flow rate (current) is by definition, time related.

Lew

O.K., if you want to be pedantic,
How much voltage do you need to pump approximately 2000 X ( 6.242 ×
1018^18) electrons per second into a battery.
Cheers,

Bruce
(bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom)

Boat battery question???
 

On Thu, 25 Jun 2009 14:40:38 +0700, Bruce In Bangkok
wrote:

O.K., if you want to be pedantic,
How much voltage do you need to pump approximately 2000 X ( 6.242 ×
1018^18) electrons per second into a battery.

If the battery is sized properly, 14.2 volts will get the job done,
maybe 14.4 for the first 70 or 80% if you're in a hurry.

Boat battery question???
 

On Thu, 25 Jun 2009 05:08:26 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Thu, 25 Jun 2009 14:40:38 +0700, Bruce In Bangkok
wrote:

O.K., if you want to be pedantic,
How much voltage do you need to pump approximately 2000 X ( 6.242 ×
1018^18) electrons per second into a battery.

If the battery is sized properly, 14.2 volts will get the job done,
maybe 14.4 for the first 70 or 80% if you're in a hurry.


Larry posted about people who had multiple 250 Amp alternators
installed. I simply asked how many volts it would take to charge a
battery bank at the installed 2,000 amps.

You seem to be saying that with 14.2 - 14.4 VDC the current flow will
be 2,000 amps, which would make the battery resistance about .00715
Ohms.

Somehow I don't think that is correct..

Cheers,

Bruce
(bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom)

Boat battery question???
 

On Thu, 25 Jun 2009 18:50:25 +0700, Bruce In Bangkok
wrote:

Larry posted about people who had multiple 250 Amp alternators
installed. I simply asked how many volts it would take to charge a
battery bank at the installed 2,000 amps.

You seem to be saying that with 14.2 - 14.4 VDC the current flow will
be 2,000 amps, which would make the battery resistance about .00715
Ohms.

Somehow I don't think that is correct..

Actually it is because that is the voltage that *all* 12 volt lead
acid batteries get charged at. The point is, that to charge at 2,000
amps, you need to have about 8,000 amp-hours of battery capacity,
which is not very practical for a 12 volt system because of connection
and wiring losses.

Boat battery question???
 

Bruce In Bangkok wrote:
On Thu, 25 Jun 2009 05:08:26 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Thu, 25 Jun 2009 14:40:38 +0700, Bruce In Bangkok
wrote:

O.K., if you want to be pedantic,
How much voltage do you need to pump approximately 2000 X ( 6.242 ×
1018^18) electrons per second into a battery.
If the battery is sized properly, 14.2 volts will get the job done,
maybe 14.4 for the first 70 or 80% if you're in a hurry.


Larry posted about people who had multiple 250 Amp alternators
installed. I simply asked how many volts it would take to charge a
battery bank at the installed 2,000 amps.

You seem to be saying that with 14.2 - 14.4 VDC the current flow will
be 2,000 amps, which would make the battery resistance about .00715
Ohms.

Somehow I don't think that is correct..

Cheers,

Bruce
(bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom)

Hey Bruce,

Your math is correct.

The problem is that the internal resistance of a healthy battery is a lot higher
than that (which would limit current).

Boat battery question???
 

Bruce In Bangkok wrote:

O.K., if you want to be pedantic,
How much voltage do you need to pump approximately 2000 X ( 6.242 ×
1018^18) electrons per second into a battery.

Remember this from an earlier post?

"Recharge rate won't exceed 15% average of the battery AH capacity."

Thus:

2000/15% = 13,333 AH of battery bank is required for a 2,000 amp
charging rate.

Normal charging voltage is anywhere from 13.2VDC-13.8VDC.

Lew