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dock box A/C mystery
I've recently had an interesting, perplexing, and disturbing situation come
up. I connect my boat in the usual way to the dock box supplied A/C. It can easily sit for a week (without me visiting) or more during the colder months here, especially during the holiday season between late November and early January. I believe it's a 20 am circuit. In any case, I have very modest A/C requirements when I'm not on the boat, namely, maintaing the two bilge pumps and keeping the two batteries (starting and house) topped up. I have a newish 30 amp rated cord, and the charger is very new, as well as the batteries. Haven't had any problems aboard, as far as circuit tripping or even a fuse popping. I tested both bilge pumps, and they work fine, dumping the small amount of water without a problem. In the last month, I've arrived at the dock to find that the dock box switch in the off position three times. The first time I chalked it up to me forgetting to switch it on when I arrived back at the slip. The second time to my neighbor perhaps switching it off by mistake. However, the third time I did some checking. My neighbor didn't do it (hasn't been to his boat in over a month), the marina hasn't been working on the docks (check with the maintenance guy), and I haven't been there to forget (unless I forgot going, which is unlikely LOL). When I spoke with the maintenance guy on the phone, he went down to take a look, then tried to claim that it was an old cord (it's less than two years old, shows practically no weather wear, and the terminals look fine - no charring/pitting - on either end). The boat connection is secure with a ring lock, so none of that flies. I'm fairly certain that no one else who has a boat has even been around this last month, except for possibly the rich guy on the end tie who rarely leaves the dock. So, I'm left with a couple of possibilities... either someone has been deliberately turning off the A/C (not necessarily maliciously) or something in the box is tripping the switch. Am I missing something? Could it be something else? -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
dock box A/C mystery
"Capt. JG" wrote in message easolutions... I've recently had an interesting, perplexing, and disturbing situation come up. I connect my boat in the usual way to the dock box supplied A/C. It can easily sit for a week (without me visiting) or more during the colder months here, especially during the holiday season between late November and early January. I believe it's a 20 am circuit. In any case, I have very modest A/C requirements when I'm not on the boat, namely, maintaing the two bilge pumps and keeping the two batteries (starting and house) topped up. I have a newish 30 amp rated cord, and the charger is very new, as well as the batteries. Haven't had any problems aboard, as far as circuit tripping or even a fuse popping. I tested both bilge pumps, and they work fine, dumping the small amount of water without a problem. In the last month, I've arrived at the dock to find that the dock box switch in the off position three times. The first time I chalked it up to me forgetting to switch it on when I arrived back at the slip. The second time to my neighbor perhaps switching it off by mistake. However, the third time I did some checking. My neighbor didn't do it (hasn't been to his boat in over a month), the marina hasn't been working on the docks (check with the maintenance guy), and I haven't been there to forget (unless I forgot going, which is unlikely LOL). When I spoke with the maintenance guy on the phone, he went down to take a look, then tried to claim that it was an old cord (it's less than two years old, shows practically no weather wear, and the terminals look fine - no charring/pitting - on either end). The boat connection is secure with a ring lock, so none of that flies. I'm fairly certain that no one else who has a boat has even been around this last month, except for possibly the rich guy on the end tie who rarely leaves the dock. So, I'm left with a couple of possibilities... either someone has been deliberately turning off the A/C (not necessarily maliciously) or something in the box is tripping the switch. Am I missing something? Could it be something else? -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com I would suspect a bad circuit breaker at the dock. |
dock box A/C mystery
Capt. JG wrote:
So, I'm left with a couple of possibilities... either someone has been deliberately turning off the A/C (not necessarily maliciously) or something in the box is tripping the switch. Am I missing something? Could it be something else? If the breaker trips, it should do so in a fashion that indicates a trip,, i.e. the handle is only 3/4 or 1/2 way over, you have to move it to "off" before closing it. If it's tripped manually than it will be at the "off" position. Cheers Martin |
dock box A/C mystery
"KLC Lewis" wrote in message
... "Capt. JG" wrote in message easolutions... I've recently had an interesting, perplexing, and disturbing situation come up. I connect my boat in the usual way to the dock box supplied A/C. It can easily sit for a week (without me visiting) or more during the colder months here, especially during the holiday season between late November and early January. I believe it's a 20 am circuit. In any case, I have very modest A/C requirements when I'm not on the boat, namely, maintaing the two bilge pumps and keeping the two batteries (starting and house) topped up. I have a newish 30 amp rated cord, and the charger is very new, as well as the batteries. Haven't had any problems aboard, as far as circuit tripping or even a fuse popping. I tested both bilge pumps, and they work fine, dumping the small amount of water without a problem. In the last month, I've arrived at the dock to find that the dock box switch in the off position three times. The first time I chalked it up to me forgetting to switch it on when I arrived back at the slip. The second time to my neighbor perhaps switching it off by mistake. However, the third time I did some checking. My neighbor didn't do it (hasn't been to his boat in over a month), the marina hasn't been working on the docks (check with the maintenance guy), and I haven't been there to forget (unless I forgot going, which is unlikely LOL). When I spoke with the maintenance guy on the phone, he went down to take a look, then tried to claim that it was an old cord (it's less than two years old, shows practically no weather wear, and the terminals look fine - no charring/pitting - on either end). The boat connection is secure with a ring lock, so none of that flies. I'm fairly certain that no one else who has a boat has even been around this last month, except for possibly the rich guy on the end tie who rarely leaves the dock. So, I'm left with a couple of possibilities... either someone has been deliberately turning off the A/C (not necessarily maliciously) or something in the box is tripping the switch. Am I missing something? Could it be something else? -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com I would suspect a bad circuit breaker at the dock. This is what I thought, but see Marty's post.. it's in the fully off position. :( -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
dock box A/C mystery
"Capt. JG" wrote in message easolutions... This is what I thought, but see Marty's post.. it's in the fully off position. :( -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com Ya, I did see Marty's post and he may be right. I haven't seen breakers trip less than all the way, though. |
dock box A/C mystery
"Capt. JG" wrote in
easolutions: either someone has been deliberately turning off the A/C (not necessarily maliciously) or something in the box is tripping the switch When a breaker trips from overcurrent, it needs to be "reset" by pushing it into the off position, or pushing a popout button on some breakers. You talk as if the breaker has just been switched off as you said nothing about having to reset the breaker before turning it on. So, I'm thinking deliberately turning it off...saving the marina $$$, a motivation unto itself. To turn the breaker off requires a finger to push on one side of the breaker toggle handle. Coat that side with greasepencil lightly so it's not very evident. Make the coat smooth so we can see that fingerprint of the SOB that's flipping the breaker on you. That will let use at least see "SOMEONE" is flipping it off. Office supply places also have a permanent staining red ink that won't wash off. It's available in non-drying printer's ink like they put on a press with a roller. It takes months to "dry". You could coat the toggle with that then casually watch marina people's fingers for the indelible red stain.... |
dock box A/C mystery
"Larry" wrote in message
... "Capt. JG" wrote in easolutions: either someone has been deliberately turning off the A/C (not necessarily maliciously) or something in the box is tripping the switch When a breaker trips from overcurrent, it needs to be "reset" by pushing it into the off position, or pushing a popout button on some breakers. You talk as if the breaker has just been switched off as you said nothing about having to reset the breaker before turning it on. Yeah, there was no resetting. It's either on or off, and the maint. guy mentioned the "possibility" of it tripping. I think it's bs. So, I'm thinking deliberately turning it off...saving the marina $$$, a motivation unto itself. They have no motivation, as far as my boat is concerned. The guy across the walk from me is power hog many times over by comparison. To turn the breaker off requires a finger to push on one side of the breaker toggle handle. Coat that side with greasepencil lightly so it's not very evident. Make the coat smooth so we can see that fingerprint of the SOB that's flipping the breaker on you. That will let use at least see "SOMEONE" is flipping it off. Office supply places also have a permanent staining red ink that won't wash off. It's available in non-drying printer's ink like they put on a press with a roller. It takes months to "dry". You could coat the toggle with that then casually watch marina people's fingers for the indelible red stain.... I would do this, but I'll just end up with a red finger. LOL I was thinking of getting a lock for the flip up cover, but I don't think the marina would like that too much. I'm going to talk to my neighbor and see if I can use his A/C connection for a while. He doesn't have anything plugged in anyway. His switch was on when I got there... just mine was off. For the next couple of weeks, I asked the maint. guy to be kind enough to check it from time to time, which he agreed to do. They don't have much interest in having someone's bilge pump fail after a rain and end up with a boat on the bottom. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
dock box A/C mystery
"KLC Lewis" wrote in message
et... "Capt. JG" wrote in message easolutions... This is what I thought, but see Marty's post.. it's in the fully off position. :( -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com Ya, I did see Marty's post and he may be right. I haven't seen breakers trip less than all the way, though. Neither have I, although a weak/old one might fool you. At least that's been the case at the house in the past... well, it _looked_ like it was on, but it wasn't. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
dock box A/C mystery
Larry wrote:
To turn the breaker off requires a finger to push on one side of the breaker toggle handle. Coat that side with greasepencil lightly so it's not very evident. Make the coat smooth so we can see that fingerprint of the SOB that's flipping the breaker on you. That will let use at least see "SOMEONE" is flipping it off. Office supply places also have a permanent staining red ink that won't wash off. It's available in non-drying printer's ink like they put on a press with a roller. It takes months to "dry". You could coat the toggle with that then casually watch marina people's fingers for the indelible red stain.... Larry, you are a devious son-of-a-bitch! :-) Cheers Martin |
dock box A/C mystery
"Capt. JG" wrote in message easolutions... "Larry" wrote in message ... "Capt. JG" wrote in easolutions: either someone has been deliberately turning off the A/C (not necessarily maliciously) or something in the box is tripping the switch When a breaker trips from overcurrent, it needs to be "reset" by pushing it into the off position, or pushing a popout button on some breakers. You talk as if the breaker has just been switched off as you said nothing about having to reset the breaker before turning it on. Yeah, there was no resetting. It's either on or off, and the maint. guy mentioned the "possibility" of it tripping. I think it's bs. So, I'm thinking deliberately turning it off...saving the marina $$$, a motivation unto itself. They have no motivation, as far as my boat is concerned. The guy across the walk from me is power hog many times over by comparison. To turn the breaker off requires a finger to push on one side of the breaker toggle handle. Coat that side with greasepencil lightly so it's not very evident. Make the coat smooth so we can see that fingerprint of the SOB that's flipping the breaker on you. That will let use at least see "SOMEONE" is flipping it off. Office supply places also have a permanent staining red ink that won't wash off. It's available in non-drying printer's ink like they put on a press with a roller. It takes months to "dry". You could coat the toggle with that then casually watch marina people's fingers for the indelible red stain.... I would do this, but I'll just end up with a red finger. LOL I was thinking of getting a lock for the flip up cover, but I don't think the marina would like that too much. I'm going to talk to my neighbor and see if I can use his A/C connection for a while. He doesn't have anything plugged in anyway. His switch was on when I got there... just mine was off. For the next couple of weeks, I asked the maint. guy to be kind enough to check it from time to time, which he agreed to do. They don't have much interest in having someone's bilge pump fail after a rain and end up with a boat on the bottom. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com You can't lock the breaker because it's probably against the law - either firecode or NEC (National Electrical Code). Do you have a GFI circuit? Sometimes they go when a stray ground current appears. Also check to see if the polarity of your circuit and any of your neighbors are reversed. You can do that with one of these: http://shopping.msn.com/prices/3-led...0v-outlet-5-15 They're inexpensive and handy in the home. You can get the cord checked with something called a Megger - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megger One may be available at the marine radio place nearby. If it's none of them then replace the breaker. It costs about $15 bucks and plugs in. If it's not that then someone is throwing your breaker and it's probably someone who doesn't like you for whatever reason. You haven't gotten them ****ed at you at the marina too, have you? Is anyone from SEA docked near you? Hope this helps. Regards, Admiral Momsen |
dock box A/C mystery
"Marty" wrote in message
... Larry wrote: To turn the breaker off requires a finger to push on one side of the breaker toggle handle. Coat that side with greasepencil lightly so it's not very evident. Make the coat smooth so we can see that fingerprint of the SOB that's flipping the breaker on you. That will let use at least see "SOMEONE" is flipping it off. Office supply places also have a permanent staining red ink that won't wash off. It's available in non-drying printer's ink like they put on a press with a roller. It takes months to "dry". You could coat the toggle with that then casually watch marina people's fingers for the indelible red stain.... Larry, you are a devious son-of-a-bitch! :-) Cheers Martin I have known that for years...... Leanne |
dock box A/C mystery
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dock box A/C mystery
"Leanne" wrote in :
"Marty" wrote in message ... Larry wrote: To turn the breaker off requires a finger to push on one side of the breaker toggle handle. Coat that side with greasepencil lightly so it's not very evident. Make the coat smooth so we can see that fingerprint of the SOB that's flipping the breaker on you. That will let use at least see "SOMEONE" is flipping it off. Office supply places also have a permanent staining red ink that won't wash off. It's available in non-drying printer's ink like they put on a press with a roller. It takes months to "dry". You could coat the toggle with that then casually watch marina people's fingers for the indelible red stain.... Larry, you are a devious son-of-a-bitch! :-) Cheers Martin I have known that for years...... Leanne Hey! Watch it! |
dock box A/C mystery
Capt. JG wrote:
I've recently had an interesting, perplexing, and disturbing situation come up... I suspect someone is doing it. To find out when, go to the thrift shop and find an old clock that has a mechanical calendar and run it on the A/C power. |
dock box A/C mystery
"Larry" wrote in message
... Marty wrote in news:DZ- : Larry, you are a devious son-of-a-bitch! :-) Cheers Martin Thank you!.... He's probably made an enemy on the dock. They can do more to you than an emeny on usenet... Is that another conspiracy theory we should check out? LOL They're all friends of mine... -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
dock box A/C mystery
"jeff" wrote in message
... Capt. JG wrote: I've recently had an interesting, perplexing, and disturbing situation come up... I suspect someone is doing it. To find out when, go to the thrift shop and find an old clock that has a mechanical calendar and run it on the A/C power. Interesting suggestion. I think it's probably maint. crew that won't fess up, since they've been doing a lot lately. I was thinking it would be nice to get notified when it goes out. I'm betting there's some device on the market that could email me, but it's probably expensive. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
dock box A/C mystery
On Fri, 19 Dec 2008 21:11:11 -0800, "Capt. JG"
wrote: Interesting suggestion. I think it's probably maint. crew that won't fess up, since they've been doing a lot lately. I was thinking it would be nice to get notified when it goes out. I'm betting there's some device on the market that could email me, but it's probably expensive. Do you have WiFi internet available at the dock ? If so you could rig a web cam. |
dock box A/C mystery
Wayne.B wrote:
On Fri, 19 Dec 2008 21:11:11 -0800, "Capt. JG" wrote: Interesting suggestion. I think it's probably maint. crew that won't fess up, since they've been doing a lot lately. I was thinking it would be nice to get notified when it goes out. I'm betting there's some device on the market that could email me, but it's probably expensive. Do you have WiFi internet available at the dock ? If so you could rig a web cam. Or if not, a still camera *could* be rigged to take a photo on power failure. If there is WiFi, install something like Skype or other VOIP solution hooked to a hailer as well. "{siren} **STAND** **AWAY** **FROM** **THE** **DOCK** **BOX** {siren}" If you are lucky and it is a person they might be so startled they fall off the pontoon :-) But seriously, take the lead off and open each end for a full visual inspection. Any rust staining or other buildup on the plastic insulator between the pins *MUST* be cleaned off, if it doesn't clean up well replace it. Dead spiders removed etc. Any signs of water penetration and you'll need to either replace the plug or line socket or at least make sure the rubber boot is sealing properly. If you have to disconnect any wires, be sure you know where they go and reassemble with a very little silicone dielectric grease. |
dock box A/C mystery
On Dec 19, 9:09*pm, Larry wrote:
He's probably made an enemy on the dock. * More likely that someone has a heavy electrical load and is tripping one of the main breakers at the distribution panel. The power pylons are wired based on the assumption that not all pylons will be supplying full power at the same time. I don't know what the conventional ratios are; it would not surprise me if ten 30A outlets are fed by a 100A distribution circuit. If someone is plugged into two 30A outlets (charger/house/water heater on one and heat pumps on the second) and regularly drawing a total of 50As it wouldn't take very many other smaller consumers on the same circuit to trip the distribution breaker. Through a couple of electric heaters into the mix and the loads get big. I have wintered at a couple of marinas with home runs from each power pylon to the distribution panels. The cabling under the docks was truly impressive. In other places the winter liveaboards and frequent winter boaters were redistributed in the slips to keep loads on different distribution circuits. Even so we quickly figured out which boats we could turn off power to on really cold nights. It's polite to turn them back on in the morning however. Just a thought. sail fast, dave |
dock box A/C mystery
"Capt. JG" wrote in
ons: "Larry" wrote in message ... Marty wrote in news:DZ- : Larry, you are a devious son-of-a-bitch! :-) Cheers Martin Thank you!.... He's probably made an enemy on the dock. They can do more to you than an emeny on usenet... Is that another conspiracy theory we should check out? LOL They're all friends of mine... With your ****ty attitude, if you were on the dock, you'd be a prime suspect. |
dock box A/C mystery
|
dock box A/C mystery
"Capt. JG" wrote in message easolutions... I've recently had an interesting, perplexing, and disturbing situation come up. I connect my boat in the usual way to the dock box supplied A/C. It can easily sit for a week (without me visiting) or more during the colder months here, especially during the holiday season between late November and early January. I believe it's a 20 am circuit. In any case, I have very modest A/C requirements when I'm not on the boat, namely, maintaing the two bilge pumps and keeping the two batteries (starting and house) topped up. I have a newish 30 amp rated cord, and the charger is very new, as well as the batteries. Haven't had any problems aboard, as far as circuit tripping or even a fuse popping. I tested both bilge pumps, and they work fine, dumping the small amount of water without a problem. In the last month, I've arrived at the dock to find that the dock box switch in the off position three times. The first time I chalked it up to me forgetting to switch it on when I arrived back at the slip. The second time to my neighbor perhaps switching it off by mistake. However, the third time I did some checking. My neighbor didn't do it (hasn't been to his boat in over a month), the marina hasn't been working on the docks (check with the maintenance guy), and I haven't been there to forget (unless I forgot going, which is unlikely LOL). When I spoke with the maintenance guy on the phone, he went down to take a look, then tried to claim that it was an old cord (it's less than two years old, shows practically no weather wear, and the terminals look fine - no charring/pitting - on either end). The boat connection is secure with a ring lock, so none of that flies. I'm fairly certain that no one else who has a boat has even been around this last month, except for possibly the rich guy on the end tie who rarely leaves the dock. So, I'm left with a couple of possibilities... either someone has been deliberately turning off the A/C (not necessarily maliciously) or something in the box is tripping the switch. Am I missing something? Could it be something else? 1. If the switch in the dock box is also a circuit breaker you should be aware that some of these are very hair trigger and if you have fitted a large charger with a transformer in it the current to build up the flux in the transformer can be very high for a couple of milliseconds and some breakers will trip at that point. I had this trouble on my boat which , having come from USA, has a lot of 110v stuff on board. I fitted a 2:1 transformer to run it off 220 volts and it tripped all power to the whole of the dock finger every time I connected. Spoke to the transformer manufacturers and they said this transformer (rated 21/2 kw.) takes 300 amps for a few milliseconds before it stabilises. They said this is a common problem in marinas where boats are fitted with isolating transformers. Acting on their recommendations I fitted a'current limiter', which seems to be a capacitor about the size of a quarter, in series on the input side and problem was solved. 2. Sometimes people come to the marina to work on their boat and find that there are no vacant sockets available for plugging in their tools so they are apt to unplug someone at random and may forget to switch back on when they go home. Perhaps it was the maintenance guy you refer to and he is just putting up an excuse by blaming your cord. |
dock box A/C mystery
"Larry" wrote in message
... "Capt. JG" wrote in ons: "Larry" wrote in message ... Marty wrote in news:DZ- : Larry, you are a devious son-of-a-bitch! :-) Cheers Martin Thank you!.... He's probably made an enemy on the dock. They can do more to you than an emeny on usenet... Is that another conspiracy theory we should check out? LOL They're all friends of mine... With your ****ty attitude, if you were on the dock, you'd be a prime suspect. What ****ty attitude is that Larry? Please be specific if you can. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
dock box A/C mystery
Interesting... it was actually something the maint. guy mentioned (without
me prompting) saying that that didn't happen. "Auspicious" wrote in message ... On Dec 19, 9:09 pm, Larry wrote: He's probably made an enemy on the dock. More likely that someone has a heavy electrical load and is tripping one of the main breakers at the distribution panel. The power pylons are wired based on the assumption that not all pylons will be supplying full power at the same time. I don't know what the conventional ratios are; it would not surprise me if ten 30A outlets are fed by a 100A distribution circuit. If someone is plugged into two 30A outlets (charger/house/water heater on one and heat pumps on the second) and regularly drawing a total of 50As it wouldn't take very many other smaller consumers on the same circuit to trip the distribution breaker. Through a couple of electric heaters into the mix and the loads get big. I have wintered at a couple of marinas with home runs from each power pylon to the distribution panels. The cabling under the docks was truly impressive. In other places the winter liveaboards and frequent winter boaters were redistributed in the slips to keep loads on different distribution circuits. Even so we quickly figured out which boats we could turn off power to on really cold nights. It's polite to turn them back on in the morning however. Just a thought. sail fast, dave -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
dock box A/C mystery
"Wayne.B" wrote in message
... On Fri, 19 Dec 2008 21:11:11 -0800, "Capt. JG" wrote: Interesting suggestion. I think it's probably maint. crew that won't fess up, since they've been doing a lot lately. I was thinking it would be nice to get notified when it goes out. I'm betting there's some device on the market that could email me, but it's probably expensive. Do you have WiFi internet available at the dock ? If so you could rig a web cam. Unfortunately, it's spotty at best right now. However, that'll be changing supposedly come summer. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
dock box A/C mystery
"IanM" wrote in message
... Wayne.B wrote: On Fri, 19 Dec 2008 21:11:11 -0800, "Capt. JG" wrote: Interesting suggestion. I think it's probably maint. crew that won't fess up, since they've been doing a lot lately. I was thinking it would be nice to get notified when it goes out. I'm betting there's some device on the market that could email me, but it's probably expensive. Do you have WiFi internet available at the dock ? If so you could rig a web cam. Or if not, a still camera *could* be rigged to take a photo on power failure. If there is WiFi, install something like Skype or other VOIP solution hooked to a hailer as well. "{siren} **STAND** **AWAY** **FROM** **THE** **DOCK** **BOX** {siren}" If you are lucky and it is a person they might be so startled they fall off the pontoon :-) But seriously, take the lead off and open each end for a full visual inspection. Any rust staining or other buildup on the plastic insulator between the pins *MUST* be cleaned off, if it doesn't clean up well replace it. Dead spiders removed etc. Any signs of water penetration and you'll need to either replace the plug or line socket or at least make sure the rubber boot is sealing properly. If you have to disconnect any wires, be sure you know where they go and reassemble with a very little silicone dielectric grease. Are you talking about the lead inside the box or the cord that runs to the boat. I like the siren idea! LOL -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
dock box A/C mystery
"Edgar" wrote in message
... "Capt. JG" wrote in message easolutions... I've recently had an interesting, perplexing, and disturbing situation come up. I connect my boat in the usual way to the dock box supplied A/C. It can easily sit for a week (without me visiting) or more during the colder months here, especially during the holiday season between late November and early January. I believe it's a 20 am circuit. In any case, I have very modest A/C requirements when I'm not on the boat, namely, maintaing the two bilge pumps and keeping the two batteries (starting and house) topped up. I have a newish 30 amp rated cord, and the charger is very new, as well as the batteries. Haven't had any problems aboard, as far as circuit tripping or even a fuse popping. I tested both bilge pumps, and they work fine, dumping the small amount of water without a problem. In the last month, I've arrived at the dock to find that the dock box switch in the off position three times. The first time I chalked it up to me forgetting to switch it on when I arrived back at the slip. The second time to my neighbor perhaps switching it off by mistake. However, the third time I did some checking. My neighbor didn't do it (hasn't been to his boat in over a month), the marina hasn't been working on the docks (check with the maintenance guy), and I haven't been there to forget (unless I forgot going, which is unlikely LOL). When I spoke with the maintenance guy on the phone, he went down to take a look, then tried to claim that it was an old cord (it's less than two years old, shows practically no weather wear, and the terminals look fine - no charring/pitting - on either end). The boat connection is secure with a ring lock, so none of that flies. I'm fairly certain that no one else who has a boat has even been around this last month, except for possibly the rich guy on the end tie who rarely leaves the dock. So, I'm left with a couple of possibilities... either someone has been deliberately turning off the A/C (not necessarily maliciously) or something in the box is tripping the switch. Am I missing something? Could it be something else? 1. If the switch in the dock box is also a circuit breaker you should be aware that some of these are very hair trigger and if you have fitted a large charger with a transformer in it the current to build up the flux in the transformer can be very high for a couple of milliseconds and some breakers will trip at that point. I had this trouble on my boat which , having come from USA, has a lot of 110v stuff on board. I fitted a 2:1 transformer to run it off 220 volts and it tripped all power to the whole of the dock finger every time I connected. Spoke to the transformer manufacturers and they said this transformer (rated 21/2 kw.) takes 300 amps for a few milliseconds before it stabilises. They said this is a common problem in marinas where boats are fitted with isolating transformers. Acting on their recommendations I fitted a'current limiter', which seems to be a capacitor about the size of a quarter, in series on the input side and problem was solved. Well, I don't have a high end charger... and I don't run ac when I'm not on the boat. 2. Sometimes people come to the marina to work on their boat and find that there are no vacant sockets available for plugging in their tools so they are apt to unplug someone at random and may forget to switch back on when they go home. Perhaps it was the maintenance guy you refer to and he is just putting up an excuse by blaming your cord. This is what I think.... he's probably aware of it right now. :-) The plug next to mine is typically empty, but it's possible someone needed both. It's a mystery of the sea I guess. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
dock box A/C mystery
"Capt. JG" wrote in message easolutions... I've recently had an interesting, perplexing, and disturbing situation come up. I connect my boat in the usual way to the dock box supplied A/C. It can easily sit for a week (without me visiting) or more during the colder months here, especially during the holiday season between late November and early January. snipped to end There's no mystery. Somebody is shutting the switch off because Gaynze is a condo commando and his demeanor at the dock is likely no different than his demeanor in his neighborhood. Somebody is hoping his boat is really really leaky and might sink without an operational bilge pump. Ask yourself this question: Who in their right mind would want a chronic complainer like Gaynze on their dock? It's a wonder he hasn't complained to the power company demanding they remove the unsightly outlets, switches and wires. http://www.sailnow.com/ardenbluffs/ Wilbur Hubbard |
dock box A/C mystery
"Capt. JG" wrote in message easolutions... "Larry" wrote in message ... "Capt. JG" wrote in easolutions: either someone has been deliberately turning off the A/C (not necessarily maliciously) or something in the box is tripping the switch When a breaker trips from overcurrent, it needs to be "reset" by pushing it into the off position, or pushing a popout button on some breakers. You talk as if the breaker has just been switched off as you said nothing about having to reset the breaker before turning it on. Yeah, there was no resetting. It's either on or off, and the maint. guy mentioned the "possibility" of it tripping. I think it's bs. So, I'm thinking deliberately turning it off...saving the marina $$$, a motivation unto itself. They have no motivation, as far as my boat is concerned. The guy across the walk from me is power hog many times over by comparison. To turn the breaker off requires a finger to push on one side of the breaker toggle handle. Coat that side with greasepencil lightly so it's not very evident. Make the coat smooth so we can see that fingerprint of the SOB that's flipping the breaker on you. That will let use at least see "SOMEONE" is flipping it off. Office supply places also have a permanent staining red ink that won't wash off. It's available in non-drying printer's ink like they put on a press with a roller. It takes months to "dry". You could coat the toggle with that then casually watch marina people's fingers for the indelible red stain.... I would do this, but I'll just end up with a red finger. LOL I was thinking of getting a lock for the flip up cover, but I don't think the marina would like that too much. I'm going to talk to my neighbor and see if I can use his A/C connection for a while. He doesn't have anything plugged in anyway. His switch was on when I got there... just mine was off. For the next couple of weeks, I asked the maint. guy to be kind enough to check it from time to time, which he agreed to do. They don't have much interest in having someone's bilge pump fail after a rain and end up with a boat on the bottom. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com We had an issue with AC problems at our marina. When the demand was high, certain 110v items wouldn't work or would work right - seems the power thinned out to the rest of the boats on our circuit. Obviously I'm not an electrician. I might suspect the power hog guy you mentioned. Maybe his ceramic heaters won't work will the wifes curling iron was plugged in and he decides your boat doesn't need the power. What about putting a lock on the box for just a few days? If it's tripped when you open it you'll know. |
dock box A/C mystery
"Wilbur Hubbard" wrote in message anews.com... "Capt. JG" wrote in message easolutions... I've recently had an interesting, perplexing, and disturbing situation come up. I connect my boat in the usual way to the dock box supplied A/C. It can easily sit for a week (without me visiting) or more during the colder months here, especially during the holiday season between late November and early January. snipped to end There's no mystery. Somebody is shutting the switch off because Gaynze is a condo commando and his demeanor at the dock is likely no different than his demeanor in his neighborhood. Somebody is hoping his boat is really really leaky and might sink without an operational bilge pump. Ask yourself this question: Who in their right mind would want a chronic complainer like Gaynze on their dock? It's a wonder he hasn't complained to the power company demanding they remove the unsightly outlets, switches and wires. http://www.sailnow.com/ardenbluffs/ Wilbur Hubbard I wouldn't be so quick to turn the breaker back on without venting out the bilge and boat first. Any gas fume build up plus a faulty sparking circuit on board may send Jonathan a couple of hundred feet into the air. Maybe upgrade the circuit breaker to an arc detection type. If you want to catch the guy try this: http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/te...quest id=4437 The pictures taken by these are very good unlike the cheapo webcams. After you catch the guy at the boat you can use it at home. |
dock box A/C mystery
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dock box A/C mystery
Capt. JG wrote:
"IanM" wrote in message ... Wayne.B wrote: On Fri, 19 Dec 2008 21:11:11 -0800, "Capt. JG" wrote: Interesting suggestion. I think it's probably maint. crew that won't fess up, since they've been doing a lot lately. I was thinking it would be nice to get notified when it goes out. I'm betting there's some device on the market that could email me, but it's probably expensive. Do you have WiFi internet available at the dock ? If so you could rig a web cam. Or if not, a still camera *could* be rigged to take a photo on power failure. If there is WiFi, install something like Skype or other VOIP solution hooked to a hailer as well. "{siren} **STAND** **AWAY** **FROM** **THE** **DOCK** **BOX** {siren}" If you are lucky and it is a person they might be so startled they fall off the pontoon :-) But seriously, take the lead off and open each end for a full visual inspection. Any rust staining or other buildup on the plastic insulator between the pins *MUST* be cleaned off, if it doesn't clean up well replace it. Dead spiders removed etc. Any signs of water penetration and you'll need to either replace the plug or line socket or at least make sure the rubber boot is sealing properly. If you have to disconnect any wires, be sure you know where they go and reassemble with a very little silicone dielectric grease. Are you talking about the lead inside the box or the cord that runs to the boat. I like the siren idea! LOL Your lead is *your* problem, the fixed wiring is the marina's problem and shouldn't be touched unless you are a licensed electrician under contract to the marina. If you have an isolating transformer *without* soft start, and the power has been going on and off to the whole pontoon, that can definitely trip your boxes breaker. I doubt it is anyone unplugging you as basic courtesy would be to check the plug's back in and on afterwards, you haven't found the plug out and if they forgot to switch you on, they almost certainly forgot to switch off before changing the plugs over. Put a tamperproof sticker across the gap between the plug and the socket and another on the breaker cover flap and see if they get broken. |
dock box A/C mystery
"mmc" wrote in
ng.com: We had an issue with AC problems at our marina. When the demand was high, certain 110v items wouldn't work or would work right - seems the power thinned out to the rest of the boats on our circuit. Obviously I'm not an electrician. That sounds like a loose neutral connection. That forces the current from one load going into the neutral bus to go out to the other phase of the 240 through the loads on the other side of neutral. When something switches off on the other phase, your side loses voltage because they are in series across 240VAC. When a motor starts on one side, the other side bears the brunt of most of the 240VAC as the motor is drawing very heavy current. This will blow out anything on the side opposite the starting motor with overvoltage...lights blink very bright, fuses in electronics blow en masse trying to protect their hosts. Loose neutral is very dangerous for everything hooked up. Any time you see lights suddenly get BRIGHTER for an instant it's almost always loose neutral connections to the power grid. |
dock box A/C mystery
"mmc" wrote in message
ng.com... "Capt. JG" wrote in message easolutions... "Larry" wrote in message ... "Capt. JG" wrote in easolutions: either someone has been deliberately turning off the A/C (not necessarily maliciously) or something in the box is tripping the switch When a breaker trips from overcurrent, it needs to be "reset" by pushing it into the off position, or pushing a popout button on some breakers. You talk as if the breaker has just been switched off as you said nothing about having to reset the breaker before turning it on. Yeah, there was no resetting. It's either on or off, and the maint. guy mentioned the "possibility" of it tripping. I think it's bs. So, I'm thinking deliberately turning it off...saving the marina $$$, a motivation unto itself. They have no motivation, as far as my boat is concerned. The guy across the walk from me is power hog many times over by comparison. To turn the breaker off requires a finger to push on one side of the breaker toggle handle. Coat that side with greasepencil lightly so it's not very evident. Make the coat smooth so we can see that fingerprint of the SOB that's flipping the breaker on you. That will let use at least see "SOMEONE" is flipping it off. Office supply places also have a permanent staining red ink that won't wash off. It's available in non-drying printer's ink like they put on a press with a roller. It takes months to "dry". You could coat the toggle with that then casually watch marina people's fingers for the indelible red stain.... I would do this, but I'll just end up with a red finger. LOL I was thinking of getting a lock for the flip up cover, but I don't think the marina would like that too much. I'm going to talk to my neighbor and see if I can use his A/C connection for a while. He doesn't have anything plugged in anyway. His switch was on when I got there... just mine was off. For the next couple of weeks, I asked the maint. guy to be kind enough to check it from time to time, which he agreed to do. They don't have much interest in having someone's bilge pump fail after a rain and end up with a boat on the bottom. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com We had an issue with AC problems at our marina. When the demand was high, certain 110v items wouldn't work or would work right - seems the power thinned out to the rest of the boats on our circuit. Obviously I'm not an electrician. I might suspect the power hog guy you mentioned. Maybe his ceramic heaters won't work will the wifes curling iron was plugged in and he decides your boat doesn't need the power. What about putting a lock on the box for just a few days? If it's tripped when you open it you'll know. It would be a nice thought, but I don't believe the marina would allow a lock, given the potential hazard. I have a call into my neighbor... apparently my other neighbor saw him working on his boat lately. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
dock box A/C mystery
"IanM" wrote in message
... Capt. JG wrote: "IanM" wrote in message ... Wayne.B wrote: On Fri, 19 Dec 2008 21:11:11 -0800, "Capt. JG" wrote: Interesting suggestion. I think it's probably maint. crew that won't fess up, since they've been doing a lot lately. I was thinking it would be nice to get notified when it goes out. I'm betting there's some device on the market that could email me, but it's probably expensive. Do you have WiFi internet available at the dock ? If so you could rig a web cam. Or if not, a still camera *could* be rigged to take a photo on power failure. If there is WiFi, install something like Skype or other VOIP solution hooked to a hailer as well. "{siren} **STAND** **AWAY** **FROM** **THE** **DOCK** **BOX** {siren}" If you are lucky and it is a person they might be so startled they fall off the pontoon :-) But seriously, take the lead off and open each end for a full visual inspection. Any rust staining or other buildup on the plastic insulator between the pins *MUST* be cleaned off, if it doesn't clean up well replace it. Dead spiders removed etc. Any signs of water penetration and you'll need to either replace the plug or line socket or at least make sure the rubber boot is sealing properly. If you have to disconnect any wires, be sure you know where they go and reassemble with a very little silicone dielectric grease. Are you talking about the lead inside the box or the cord that runs to the boat. I like the siren idea! LOL Your lead is *your* problem, the fixed wiring is the marina's problem and shouldn't be touched unless you are a licensed electrician under contract to the marina. If you have an isolating transformer *without* soft start, and the power has been going on and off to the whole pontoon, that can definitely trip your boxes breaker. I doubt it is anyone unplugging you as basic courtesy would be to check the plug's back in and on afterwards, you haven't found the plug out and if they forgot to switch you on, they almost certainly forgot to switch off before changing the plugs over. Put a tamperproof sticker across the gap between the plug and the socket and another on the breaker cover flap and see if they get broken. Excellent idea! It wouldn't even have to be really tamper proof... just something that would have to be open the box... A piece of tape would do it, since I know it's not malicious... either it's a mistake or some power issue. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
dock box A/C mystery
Go get a 12V relay, a 12V Power supply and a loud 12V lower current piezo.
(Actually... you can use any power supply as long as the relay matches the power supply specs) Wire the Piezo to go off when the AC power to the boat is OFF. (you do this by wiring the relay to normally CLOSED and use the power supply to keep the relay OPEN or off by hooking up the PS to the relay coil. You wire the boats 12V battery through a tiny breaker, through the relay switches NC and common to the piezo) So... When the shore power is unhooked and the genset is off the piezo horn makes a nice annoying sound until someone turns it back on. If someone is doing this on purpose, then it may scare them... if not, somone on the dock may notice when the noise comes on and help you figure it out. You also may want to notify the boats around you of the new alarm and how to fix it by turning on your breaker. I also like the Deer camera idea to catch the guy... my friend caught a serial "car-keyer" with one... |
dock box A/C mystery
"Ed" wrote in message
.. . Go get a 12V relay, a 12V Power supply and a loud 12V lower current piezo. (Actually... you can use any power supply as long as the relay matches the power supply specs) Wire the Piezo to go off when the AC power to the boat is OFF. (you do this by wiring the relay to normally CLOSED and use the power supply to keep the relay OPEN or off by hooking up the PS to the relay coil. You wire the boats 12V battery through a tiny breaker, through the relay switches NC and common to the piezo) So... When the shore power is unhooked and the genset is off the piezo horn makes a nice annoying sound until someone turns it back on. If someone is doing this on purpose, then it may scare them... if not, somone on the dock may notice when the noise comes on and help you figure it out. You also may want to notify the boats around you of the new alarm and how to fix it by turning on your breaker. I also like the Deer camera idea to catch the guy... my friend caught a serial "car-keyer" with one... Nice suggestion. The small piezo would be easy to rig, and I have the contact info for all but one neighbor. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
dock box A/C mystery (update)
"Capt. JG" wrote in message
easolutions... In the last month, I've arrived at the dock to find that the dock box switch in the off position three times. The first time I chalked it up to me forgetting to switch it on when I arrived back at the slip. The second time to my neighbor perhaps switching it off by mistake. However, the third time I did some checking. My neighbor didn't do it (hasn't been to his boat in over a month), the marina hasn't been working on the docks (check with the maintenance guy), and I haven't been there to forget (unless I forgot going, which is unlikely LOL). So... talked to the neighbor who I didn't talk to originally. Seems he was doing work on his boat, and in the process discovered that the second receptacle on his box wasn't working, so he used mine (it was more convenient, because it's located on the inside vs. my other neighbor's which is on the water side). No problem with that. Unfortunately, even though he reattached my cord, he didn't flip the switch. Even better, he's pretty certain that he did this maneuver twice, separated by a couple of weeks. :-) -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
dock box A/C mystery (update)
"Capt. JG" wrote in message easolutions... "Capt. JG" wrote in message easolutions... In the last month, I've arrived at the dock to find that the dock box switch in the off position three times. The first time I chalked it up to me forgetting to switch it on when I arrived back at the slip. The second time to my neighbor perhaps switching it off by mistake. However, the third time I did some checking. My neighbor didn't do it (hasn't been to his boat in over a month), the marina hasn't been working on the docks (check with the maintenance guy), and I haven't been there to forget (unless I forgot going, which is unlikely LOL). So... talked to the neighbor who I didn't talk to originally. Seems he was doing work on his boat, and in the process discovered that the second receptacle on his box wasn't working, so he used mine (it was more convenient, because it's located on the inside vs. my other neighbor's which is on the water side). No problem with that. Unfortunately, even though he reattached my cord, he didn't flip the switch. Even better, he's pretty certain that he did this maneuver twice, separated by a couple of weeks. :-) -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com Keel haul 'im! |
dock box A/C mystery (update)
"mmc" wrote in message
g.com... "Capt. JG" wrote in message easolutions... "Capt. JG" wrote in message easolutions... In the last month, I've arrived at the dock to find that the dock box switch in the off position three times. The first time I chalked it up to me forgetting to switch it on when I arrived back at the slip. The second time to my neighbor perhaps switching it off by mistake. However, the third time I did some checking. My neighbor didn't do it (hasn't been to his boat in over a month), the marina hasn't been working on the docks (check with the maintenance guy), and I haven't been there to forget (unless I forgot going, which is unlikely LOL). So... talked to the neighbor who I didn't talk to originally. Seems he was doing work on his boat, and in the process discovered that the second receptacle on his box wasn't working, so he used mine (it was more convenient, because it's located on the inside vs. my other neighbor's which is on the water side). No problem with that. Unfortunately, even though he reattached my cord, he didn't flip the switch. Even better, he's pretty certain that he did this maneuver twice, separated by a couple of weeks. :-) -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com Keel haul 'im! I'm actually more po'd about the maint. guy claiming everything was fine with the dock box. Ok, mine was fine, but the one next door isn't. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
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