Protecting against saltwater
 

I just bought a Sea Ray 215 and I'm somewhat new to the sal****er.
Other than not putting it in the salty water, what is the best way to
protect my boat after I take it out? Are there compounds that I
should use when washing? I sometimes see people spraying their boats
down with something coming out of a weed-sprayer type contraption.
Any idea what that might be?

Also, is regular Turtle Wax fine to use on the boat?

Thanks.

Protecting against saltwater
 

On 14 May 2004 13:46:19 -0700, (Puerto Mio)
wrote:

I just bought a Sea Ray 215 and I'm somewhat new to the sal****er.
Other than not putting it in the salty water, what is the best way to
protect my boat after I take it out? Are there compounds that I
should use when washing? I sometimes see people spraying their boats
down with something coming out of a weed-sprayer type contraption.
Any idea what that might be?

Also, is regular Turtle Wax fine to use on the boat?

Thanks.

Turtle Wax or any kind of good wax is fine to put on your boat.
The best protection for your boat in salt water it to make sure you
have zincs.
There are solutions that you can buy that help dissolve the salt, but
I just wash my boat with some soapy water. Make sure you go over all
your harware ( railings, etc.) with wax at least several times a
season to keep the rust down. Even stainless gets a little rust
buildup on it that turns to pitting if you don't catch it soon enough.
If you trailer, be sure to flush your motor after each outing in salt
water.
John C.

Protecting against saltwater
 

The best protection for your boat in salt water it to make sure you
have zincs.
There are solutions that you can buy that help dissolve the salt, but
I just wash my boat with some soapy water.

huh? zincs and/or soapy water protect a fiberglass boat from sal****er? Since
when?

Protecting against saltwater
 

JAXAshby wrote:

huh? zincs and/or soapy water protect a fiberglass boat from sal****er? Since
when?

Zincs protect against galvanic corrosion, which is more of a problem in
salt water than fresh.

Also, clean never hurts.

Tom
of the Swee****er Sea

Protecting against saltwater
 

protects what kind of fiberglass from what did you say?

huh? zincs and/or soapy water protect a fiberglass boat from sal****er?
Since
when?

Zincs protect against galvanic corrosion, which is more of a problem in
salt water than fresh.

Also, clean never hurts.

Tom
of the Swee****er Sea

Protecting against saltwater
 

"Tom Shilson" wrote in message
...
JAXAshby wrote:

huh? zincs and/or soapy water protect a fiberglass boat from sal****er?
Since
when?

Zincs protect against galvanic corrosion, which is more of a problem in
salt water than fresh.

Also, clean never hurts.

Sacrificial Zincs are designed to deliberately corrode protecting the rest
of the yacht.

Protecting against saltwater
 

Sacrificial Zincs are designed to deliberately corrode protecting the rest
of the yacht.

including the fiberglass, but not the wood?

Protecting against saltwater
 

JAXAshby wrote:
protects what kind of fiberglass from what did you say?
snip
OK, so we got carried away. We were talking about a fiberglass *boat*,
which includes certain metal underwater parts, e.g. propeller,
through-hulls, rudder shaft etc.

You are correct, the zincs don't protect the fiberglass itself. It will
protect the boat.

The biggest danger to the fiberglass parts, other than collision, is
probably UV sunlight. The wax will help protect that. Washing will
remove salt (corrosive) and, properly done, protect the wax.

OK?

Tom
of the Swee****er Sea

Protecting against saltwater
 

JAXAshby wrote:

Sacrificial Zincs are designed to deliberately corrode protecting the rest
of the yacht.


including the fiberglass, but not the wood?

Actually, the zincs will help protect submerged wood on a boat. It is
subject to some galvanic corrosion also.

Tom
of the Swee****er Sea

Protecting against saltwater
 

zincs will help protect submerged wood on a boat. It is
subject to some galvanic corrosion also.

really? wood becomes the anode or the cathode? I guess I have never seen a
battery with wooden plates before.

Protecting against saltwater
 

Appears the galvanic corrosion of a wooden hull comes from the nails, bolts,
screws holding the wood on to the subframe.

"JAXAshby" wrote in message
...
zincs will help protect submerged wood on a boat. It is
subject to some galvanic corrosion also.

really? wood becomes the anode or the cathode? I guess I have never seen
a
battery with wooden plates before.

Protecting against saltwater
 

On 15 May 2004 03:53:15 GMT, (JAXAshby) wrote:

The best protection for your boat in salt water it to make sure you
have zincs.
There are solutions that you can buy that help dissolve the salt, but
I just wash my boat with some soapy water.

huh? zincs and/or soapy water protect a fiberglass boat from sal****er? Since
when?
So, if you want to be a argumentative troll, and not add a bit of
help to the discussion, buzz off.

Protecting against saltwater
 

hey squathead, buzz off yourself. the advice given by lowball types such as
yourself was specious. the asking the question was a newbie and so might
thinkthe squathead advice was real. It was not and he was best helped by
knowing it was not. take a hike jc haplame.

The best protection for your boat in salt water it to make sure you
have zincs.
There are solutions that you can buy that help dissolve the salt, but
I just wash my boat with some soapy water.

huh? zincs and/or soapy water protect a fiberglass boat from sal****er?
Since
when?
So, if you want to be a argumentative troll, and not add a bit of
help to the discussion, buzz off.

Protecting against saltwater
 

"Puerto Mio" wrote in message
om...
I just bought a Sea Ray 215 and I'm somewhat new to the sal****er.
Other than not putting it in the salty water, what is the best way to
protect my boat after I take it out?

I assume that this is a runabout style boat, in the 21 foot range? Probably
an I/O, and probably does NOT have fresh water cooling. If any of these
assumptions are incorrect then it will change the advice somewhat.

The fiberglass portion of your boat is not going to be significantly
impacted by the fact that you are in salt water. There is stuff that will
want to attach to your hull and start to grow. It will be different stuff
in fresh water but the idea is the same. If the boat is in the water for a
day or two and then is taken out the "stuff" won't get much of a foothold
and it will die once the boat is taken out of the water. If you leave the
boat in the water for a week or so you may get a buildup on the bottom that
will be a bit harder to wash off and you may have to resort to using oxalic
acid or similar cleaner.

The salt water will be a lot more corrosive to the metal parts of your boat.
Again, if you just in for the day, the aluminum parts should do just fine
(the outdrive). The outdrive should have "zincs" mounted on it , maybe
multiple ones. These will deteriorate fairly rapidly. That is okay, that
is what they are supposed to do. Plan on replacing them once they start
looking ragged.

The engine is perhaps the area that you need to pay attention to. Unless
you have a fresh water cooling system (not common on a boat that size, but
usually an option) then you will be circulating salt water through the
engine. The engine, being based on an automotive engine block, wasn't
really designed for this and you can have rust/corrosion problems fairly
early.

The best thing you can do is to flush the engine out with fresh water as
soon as you can after you take the boat out of the water. Some launch ramps
have a "flushing station" where they provide a fresh water hose so you can
take care of it right after you pull out. You will need some sort of
adapter to connect the hose to your engine, usually an "ear muff" type
device that clamps over the water intake on the outdrive. Connect the hose,
turn the water on, start the engine and let it run until it is up to
temperature (to make sure that the thermostat has opened and circulated
fresh water everywhere).

Sometimes the engine itself is equipped with an "anode" (another zinc) as
part of the cooling system. These usually are thin rods that screw down
into the water system at some point. Read your owner's manual on the engine
to see if you have any. If you do have them, be sure to check them once a
year or so to make sure that they haven't been eaten away.

The salt spray will also get onto all parts of the boat, so you would be
wise to wash down the entire boat in fresh water. This will make a
difference years down the road.


Rod

Protecting against saltwater
 

JAXAshby wrote:

really? wood becomes the anode or the cathode? I guess I have never seen a
battery with wooden plates before.

Every time you post you show how much you have never seen and how little
you know about boating subjects. Tell us all about your wooden boat
experience Jax ... oh, judging by your post above I guess you already did.

Rick

Protecting against saltwater
 

Actually, I got the info I needed.

--Keep the boat clean
--Replace the anodes every once in awhile
--Wash the boat after it comes home from the salt

Is squathead a sailing term?

Thanks again for the help.

Protecting against saltwater
 

Puerto Mio wrote:

Is squathead a sailing term?

Yes. It's that thingy in the bathroom up front in the pointy end.

--
Good luck and good sailing.
s/v Kerry Deare of Barnegat
http://kerrydeare.home.comcast.net/

Protecting against saltwater
 

Tell us all about your wooden boat
experience Jax

I built a professional Class A/B Racing Runabout the winter I was in eight
grade. Except for the screws, it was all wood.

ricky, you *still* didn't answer my question as to whether the wood is anodic
or cathodic, nor did you tell us where one might see a wooden battery.

do enlighten us with your vast knowledge of uncharted facts.

Protecting against saltwater
 

Is squathead a sailing term?

actually, it is most usually used in reference to powerboters.

Protecting against saltwater
 

JAXAshby wrote:

zincs will help protect submerged wood on a boat. It is
subject to some galvanic corrosion also.


really? wood becomes the anode or the cathode? I guess I have never seen a
battery with wooden plates before.

My understanding is this: Wood is neither the anoode or cathode -- or
rather it is both.

To diverge, brass is a combination of two metals (copper and zinc,
perhaps.) The two metals will corrode each other in salt water. Little
pockets of zinc corrode with little pockets of copper. It
self-destructs. It is not just cannabalistic, but self-dissolving.

Wood has various components as well. It is possible that these
components will self-destruct. The amount would vary with the type of
wood, age, finish, and many other things that I don't understand. If
this explanation is not correct, then the suggestion that wood undergoes
electro-chemical degredation with near-by fittings, fasteners, and
such-like is certainly a possibility. If this were true, it would
certainly

I seem to recall reading this in a sailing magazine in an article about
galvanic corrosion. I may be in error. This discussion is not one that
is important enough to me to research. Do you know of any authoritative
sources that you can reference? I have about 3 feet of old Wooden Boat
magazines that you can have for free (you pay shipping) if you want to
look through them. I am sure that it would be covered there.

Some people seem to consider some of your comments, such as "I have
never seen a battery with wooden plates before." to be unhelpful to the
discussion. It does convey, if nothing else, a certain impatience. For
your own benefit you may choose to change your tone slightly. Even
throwing in a few smilies :-) would change some people's reaction.

Fair winds,

Tom
of the Swee****er Sea

Protecting against saltwater
 

Not really a battery per se, but the wood does get eroded.

Especially if a wooden boat is overprotected, the more noble
fitting creates sodium hydroxide, which eats away the lignin in
the wood. This chemical process leaves only the spongy
cellulose fiber behind. You'll often see a white powdery substance
around the wood. Don't eat it or snort it ;)

Lots of woodenboat owners don't bond their through hulls together
and certainly don't put a lot of zincs on the boat.

Matt

"JAXAshby" wrote in message
...
zincs will help protect submerged wood on a boat. It is
subject to some galvanic corrosion also.

really? wood becomes the anode or the cathode? I guess I have never seen
a
battery with wooden plates before.

Protecting against saltwater
 

tom, my irritation is with those who ignorantly or often time very deliberately
give out false information as fact. If you wish to believe that mounting zincs
on a wooden boat will inhibit corrosion, well go beleive it. BUT don't pass it
off as fact because you seem to recall maybe reading it once somewhere in a
magazine written by tradesmen.

Do chunks of trees floating down rivers suffer "galvanic" action once they
happen on brackish water?

zincs will help protect submerged wood on a boat. It is
subject to some galvanic corrosion also.


really? wood becomes the anode or the cathode? I guess I have never seen
a
battery with wooden plates before.

My understanding is this: Wood is neither the anoode or cathode -- or
rather it is both.

To diverge, brass is a combination of two metals (copper and zinc,
perhaps.) The two metals will corrode each other in salt water. Little
pockets of zinc corrode with little pockets of copper. It
self-destructs. It is not just cannabalistic, but self-dissolving.

Wood has various components as well. It is possible that these
components will self-destruct. The amount would vary with the type of
wood, age, finish, and many other things that I don't understand. If
this explanation is not correct, then the suggestion that wood undergoes
electro-chemical degredation with near-by fittings, fasteners, and
such-like is certainly a possibility. If this were true, it would
certainly

I seem to recall reading this in a sailing magazine in an article about
galvanic corrosion. I may be in error. This discussion is not one that
is important enough to me to research. Do you know of any authoritative
sources that you can reference? I have about 3 feet of old Wooden Boat
magazines that you can have for free (you pay shipping) if you want to
look through them. I am sure that it would be covered there.

Some people seem to consider some of your comments, such as "I have
never seen a battery with wooden plates before." to be unhelpful to the
discussion. It does convey, if nothing else, a certain impatience. For
your own benefit you may choose to change your tone slightly. Even
throwing in a few smilies :-) would change some people's reaction.

Fair winds,

Tom
of the Swee****er Sea

Protecting against saltwater
 

ah, someone who knows. Thanks Matt/Meribeth.

Not really a battery per se, but the wood does get eroded.

Especially if a wooden boat is overprotected, the more noble
fitting creates sodium hydroxide, which eats away the lignin in
the wood. This chemical process leaves only the spongy
cellulose fiber behind. You'll often see a white powdery substance
around the wood. Don't eat it or snort it ;)

Lots of woodenboat owners don't bond their through hulls together
and certainly don't put a lot of zincs on the boat.

Matt

"JAXAshby" wrote in message
...
zincs will help protect submerged wood on a boat. It is
subject to some galvanic corrosion also.

really? wood becomes the anode or the cathode? I guess I have never seen
a
battery with wooden plates before.

Protecting against saltwater
 

JAXAshby wrote:
ah, someone who knows. Thanks Matt/Meribeth.

Everyone who knows anything about wooden boats knows, Jax. You continue
to show that your boating knowledge is pathetic, your knowledge of
wooden boats is nonexistent and your attempts to trash the OP based on
your own ignorance clearly shows your only role here is that of a troll.

Rick

Protecting against saltwater
 

so, rick, *you* -- with your immence knowledge gleaned from reading magazines
while bathtub sailing -- KNOW that zincs on a wooden boat protect it from
"galvanic action"??

maybe you might want to find out what the word "galvanic" means.

btw, yo-yo, you missed the part where zincs actually cause deterioration of
wooden boats. How did that happen, ricky, with all that knowledge you have?
Same way you couldn't tell the difference between an ag pilot and an ATP, each
of which you have claimed to be?

ah, someone who knows. Thanks Matt/Meribeth.

Everyone who knows anything about wooden boats knows, Jax. You continue
to show that your boating knowledge is pathetic, your knowledge of
wooden boats is nonexistent and your attempts to trash the OP based on
your own ignorance clearly shows your only role here is that of a troll.

Rick

Protecting against saltwater
 

JAXAshby wrote:

Same way you couldn't tell the difference between an ag pilot and an ATP, each
of which you have claimed to be?

So Jax begins another spin down the spiral of his dementia.

Show the post where I claimed to be an ag pilot, Jax. Your fantasy life
is spilling over to your online delirium. I do have an ATP certificate.
There are quite a few ag pilots who also hold an ATP, and a few airline
pilots who do some ag flying. So if there is somehow a "difference" I
guess you will have to explain it to us.

Once again you show yourself to be no more than an ignorant poseur,
desperately struggling for attention.

Rick

Protecting against saltwater
 

....or you can do like I did a long time ago... just block his posts and
you'll never know he's here, unless somebody else replies.

--


Keith
__
"Bachelors know more about women than married men; if they didn't, they'd be
married too." - H. L. Mencken
"Rick" wrote in message
.net...
JAXAshby wrote:

a bunch of crap as usual.

So Jax begins another spin down the spiral of his dementia.

Show the post where I claimed to be an ag pilot, Jax. Your fantasy life
is spilling over to your online delirium. I do have an ATP certificate.
There are quite a few ag pilots who also hold an ATP, and a few airline
pilots who do some ag flying. So if there is somehow a "difference" I
guess you will have to explain it to us.

Once again you show yourself to be no more than an ignorant poseur,
desperately struggling for attention.

Rick

Protecting against saltwater
 

There are quite a few ag pilots who also hold an ATP, and a few airline
pilots who do some ag flying. So if there is somehow a "difference" I
guess you will have to explain it to us.

ricky, ag pilots know the danger of a downwind turn, ATPs (stupidly and in the
face of the laws of physics) claim their is no such danger. you, ricky,
dropped your claim to be an ag pilot when you dumbly denied the downwind turn
danger, which absolutely made hash of your prior crop dusting experience.

ricky, also claimed to have risen high enough in construction management to be
able o steal plywood from a worksite to make a dinghy. you also claimed to
have liveaboards for years in Mexico as an adult. I also claimed to a high
ranking Merchant Marine.

All before you turned 35 years old.

Protecting against saltwater
 

...or you can do like I did a long time ago... just block his posts and
you'll never know he's here, unless somebody else replies.

keith won't see this, but he just proven conclusively that he is too stupid to
learn, for you already knows everything there is to know.

sad.

Protecting against saltwater
 

JAXAshby wrote:

ricky, ag pilots know the danger of a downwind turn, ATPs (stupidly and in the
face of the laws of physics) claim their is no such danger. you, ricky,
dropped your claim to be an ag pilot when you dumbly denied the downwind turn
danger, which absolutely made hash of your prior crop dusting experience.

ricky, also claimed to have risen high enough in construction management to be
able o steal plywood from a worksite to make a dinghy. you also claimed to
have liveaboards for years in Mexico as an adult. I also claimed to a high
ranking Merchant Marine.

All before you turned 35 years old.

You seem to be mixing your delusions, Jax. It's time you had your meds
adjusted again. Or maybe your Speedos are a bit too tight ...

Care to share the posts where you imagine you read those "claims" or are
you just going to show the readers one more time what a mess your poor
muddled brain has become? Show us the posts, Jax. For once in your
pathetic existence, back up one of your claims.

I for one will not hold my breath waiting. You haven't backed up a
single one of your claims since you fouled usenet with your presence.

Poor Jax, are you really so lost or just insanely jealous of those who
do what you can only read about or pretend to be? Silly little poseur,
Jax. Take your meds and get some rest, maybe you can do better tomorrow.

Rick

Protecting against saltwater
 

so, ricky, not a thing you claimed prior is true except what? your choices
a

-- ATP
-- ag pilot
-- Merchant Marine
-- thief of plywood
-- ten year liveaboard in Mexico
-- senior construction site manager
-- you are an expert in a downwind turns
-- age 35
-- male

ricky, ag pilots know the danger of a downwind turn, ATPs (stupidly and in
the
face of the laws of physics) claim their is no such danger. you, ricky,
dropped your claim to be an ag pilot when you dumbly denied the downwind
turn
danger, which absolutely made hash of your prior crop dusting experience.

ricky, also claimed to have risen high enough in construction management
to be
able o steal plywood from a worksite to make a dinghy. you also claimed to
have liveaboards for years in Mexico as an adult. I also claimed to a high
ranking Merchant Marine.

All before you turned 35 years old.

You seem to be mixing your delusions, Jax. It's time you had your meds
adjusted again. Or maybe your Speedos are a bit too tight ...

Care to share the posts where you imagine you read those "claims" or are
you just going to show the readers one more time what a mess your poor
muddled brain has become? Show us the posts, Jax. For once in your
pathetic existence, back up one of your claims.

I for one will not hold my breath waiting. You haven't backed up a
single one of your claims since you fouled usenet with your presence.

Poor Jax, are you really so lost or just insanely jealous of those who
do what you can only read about or pretend to be? Silly little poseur,
Jax. Take your meds and get some rest, maybe you can do better tomorrow.

Rick

Protecting against saltwater
 

One more time just for grins, Jax.

--------------------

Care to share the posts where you imagine you read those "claims" or are
you just going to show the readers one more time what a mess your poor
muddled brain has become? Show us the posts, Jax. For once in your
pathetic existence, back up one of your claims.

---------------------

Your self generated "choices" aside from those of ATP and the Merchant
Marine officer (which are well known to regular readers) are no more
than your own fantasies given momentary existence online.

You are running true to form and ignoring the simple challenge to post
the "claims" you attribute to me. Put up or shut up Jax. A loser like
you will have to work a lot harder than your posts indicate you are capable.

Goodnight, Jax.

Rick

Protecting against saltwater
 

so, ricky, you don't have a clew what a downwind turn is and once you check it
out you have no clew why it is dangerous as all ag pilots know? And now you
don't recall just why you once said you were an AG pilot NOT a cropduster?

ricky, you have more stories/more excuses than a con man just out of jail.

Care to share the posts where you imagine you read those "claims" or are
you just going to show the readers one more time what a mess your poor
muddled brain has become? Show us the posts, Jax. For once in your
pathetic existence, back up one of your claims.

---------------------

Your self generated "choices" aside from those of ATP and the Merchant
Marine officer (which are well known to regular readers) are no more
than your own fantasies given momentary existence online.

You are running true to form and ignoring the simple challenge to post
the "claims" you attribute to me. Put up or shut up Jax. A loser like
you will have to work a lot harder than your posts indicate you are capable.

Goodnight, Jax.

Rick

Protecting against saltwater
 

"Matt/Meribeth Pedersen" wrote in message
ink.net...

Especially if a wooden boat is overprotected, the more noble
fitting creates sodium hydroxide, which eats away the lignin in
the wood.

I don't understand what you mean by "overprotected".

I think I know what you are saying about the more noble fittings, which
would be the various through hull fittings.I have seen the wood surrounding
the fittings become deteriorated and spongy to the extent that the plank had
to be replaced.

Lots of woodenboat owners don't bond their through hulls together
and certainly don't put a lot of zincs on the boat.

Are you saying that they don't, but should? Or that they don't to avoid the
effects you are talking about?

Ten to 18 years ago I owned a 1956 Stephens, a wooden hull boat. The boat
was in poor condition when I got it and I spent a lot of time in the boat
yard over the 8 years that I owned it. I talked with lots of other wood
boat owners and did a fair amount of research. The general wisdom was that
you DID need to have a zinc anode and all the through hulls bonded to the
boat's electrical system.

If the through hull fitting was completely isolated electrically (such as a
seacock that was only connected via a rubber hose) then there would be no
current flow through it, assuming that the interior wood was dry so that
bilge water couldn't complete a circuit. In this case, that fitting would
be okay. But there are always fittings that you can't isolate, such as the
shaft log, rudder post and strut. These will create a current path,
especially when you connect up to shore power.

If you didn't have a zinc to provide an alternate path, then the current
flowing through the through hull fittings would create an "electrolysis
burn" on the wood. And NO, I am not saying the wood undergoes electrolysis,
I am saying that the effects of adjacent electrolysis damages the wood. Go
to a boatyard that has some wooden boats in it and look at the wood around
the fittings, it will be darker and in many cases severely deteriorated.

When the zincs are mounted you want to space the zinc away from the wood so
that you don't create an electrolysis burn around the zinc.

By the way, I understand that you can create the same situation when using a
Magnesium anode on an aluminum hull. I have heard stories of people who
directly bolted a magnesium anode to the transom of their aluminum boat,
then put the boat in salt water. The resulting "accelerated" galvanic
action with the anode "burned" the aluminum it was in contact with to the
point that an anode sized hole opened up in the transom and the boat sank.
Consider this "hear-say" as I can't confirm it, but I can believe it. It is
best to put bolts through the transom with nuts and washer on the outside,
then mount the anodes on the excess thread length spaced a 1/2" or so from
the hull.

Rod McInnis

Protecting against saltwater
 

"Rod McInnis" wrote in message
...

"Matt/Meribeth Pedersen" wrote in message
ink.net...

Especially if a wooden boat is overprotected, the more noble
fitting creates sodium hydroxide, which eats away the lignin in
the wood.

I don't understand what you mean by "overprotected".

Overprotected means having too much zinc in comparison to the more
noble metal, i.e. having five zincs on your prop shaft when only
one will do the trick. When it comes to protection, the "some is
good, more is better" theory doesn't work.

ABYC recommends, for wooden boats, a potential of -550 to
-600 mV, in reference to a silver/silver chloride cell.

I think I know what you are saying about the more noble fittings, which
would be the various through hull fittings.I have seen the wood
surrounding
the fittings become deteriorated and spongy to the extent that the plank
had
to be replaced.

Lots of woodenboat owners don't bond their through hulls together
and certainly don't put a lot of zincs on the boat.

Are you saying that they don't, but should? Or that they don't to avoid
the
effects you are talking about?

They don't to avoid the effects.

Protecting against saltwater
 

Subject: Protecting against sal****er
From: (Puerto Mio)

I sometimes see people spraying their boats
down with something coming out of a weed-sprayer type contraption.
Any idea what that might be?

My guess is they are spraying on something like Salt Away or Salt-X.

http://www.salt-x.com/



Also, is regular Turtle Wax fine to use on the boat?

Try Zaino (zainostore.com) way better that wax

Capt. Bill