epoxy thickener
 

I have been working on Minicup #2 but ran out of colloidal silica
epoxy thickener and do not feel like driving all the way across town
to West marine. So, I recalled some discussions about using talcum
powder or wood flour for this purpose. First, I used some of my wifes
powder till she found out and blew a gasket over it. I checked,
powder is expensive, makes the boat smell funny too. Then, I recalled
cornstarch is used as a thicken er for stews and soups and I had a
little and it worked fairly well. When it ran out, I used regular
flour, it does not work as well but is ok. I wonder if I could mix a
bug killer like Sevin dust with it to help preserve the wood.

epoxy thickener
 

Watch this space. It's gonna happen.
One of these days, someone will nominate garden dirt as an epoxy filler.
Hey, it's good for standing on and it's cheap.

Parallax wrote:

I have been working on Minicup #2 but ran out of colloidal silica
epoxy thickener and do not feel like driving all the way across town
to West marine. So, I recalled some discussions about using talcum
powder or wood flour for this purpose. First, I used some of my wifes
powder till she found out and blew a gasket over it. I checked,
powder is expensive, makes the boat smell funny too. Then, I recalled
cornstarch is used as a thicken er for stews and soups and I had a
little and it worked fairly well. When it ran out, I used regular
flour, it does not work as well but is ok. I wonder if I could mix a
bug killer like Sevin dust with it to help preserve the wood.

epoxy thickener
 

I'd wash it through a fine mesh seive first. I don't see why you shouldn't
use clean dirt. A nice sandy loam will be mostly silica. Clay is powdered
rock. Talc is powdered rock. You can mix dirt with cement. Done that. And
dirt doesn't contain perfume so the boat won't smell like the wife's face
powder.

Jim Conlin ) writes:
Watch this space. It's gonna happen.
One of these days, someone will nominate garden dirt as an epoxy filler.
Hey, it's good for standing on and it's cheap.

Parallax wrote:

I have been working on Minicup #2 but ran out of colloidal silica
epoxy thickener and do not feel like driving all the way across town
to West marine. So, I recalled some discussions about using talcum
powder or wood flour for this purpose. First, I used some of my wifes
powder till she found out and blew a gasket over it. I checked,
powder is expensive, makes the boat smell funny too. Then, I recalled
cornstarch is used as a thicken er for stews and soups and I had a
little and it worked fairly well. When it ran out, I used regular
flour, it does not work as well but is ok. I wonder if I could mix a
bug killer like Sevin dust with it to help preserve the wood.



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epoxy thickener
 

On Thu, 27 May 2004 07:54:05 -0700, Parallax wrote:

I have been working on Minicup #2 but ran out of colloidal silica
epoxy thickener and do not feel like driving all the way across town
to West marine. So, I recalled some discussions about using talcum
powder or wood flour for this purpose. First, I used some of my wifes
powder till she found out and blew a gasket over it. I checked,
powder is expensive, makes the boat smell funny too. Then, I recalled
cornstarch is used as a thicken er for stews and soups and I had a
little and it worked fairly well. When it ran out, I used regular
flour, it does not work as well but is ok. I wonder if I could mix a
bug killer like Sevin dust with it to help preserve the wood.

What filler to choose depends on what you want to achieve:

-Colidica Silica for just making a thick but heavy putty.
-Micro baloons for making light-weight and easy to sand putty.
-Fibres to reinforce putty.
-Pigments

You could mix any of the abovementioned fillers to blend the properties
of the putty. Fibres could be anything including sawdust.

Some of the substances you mentioned are probably no good but for
laughs. Stick to the ones I listed and live happy. Do experiements
to find out how the different fillers work and how much to use for
different applications.

--
================================================== ==================
Martin Schöön * * * * * * * * * *"Problems worthy of attack
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * prove their worth by hitting back"
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *Piet Hein
================================================== ==================

epoxy thickener
 

Parallax wrote:

I have been working on Minicup #2 but ran out of colloidal silica
epoxy thickener and do not feel like driving all the way across town
to West marine. So, I recalled some discussions about using talcum
powder or wood flour for this purpose. First, I used some of my wifes
powder till she found out and blew a gasket over it. I checked,
powder is expensive, makes the boat smell funny too. Then, I recalled
cornstarch is used as a thicken er for stews and soups and I had a
little and it worked fairly well. When it ran out, I used regular
flour, it does not work as well but is ok. I wonder if I could mix a
bug killer like Sevin dust with it to help preserve the wood.

Is this supposed to be a joke? If not, remind me never to board a vessel
that you've built.

epoxy thickener
 

Brian Nystrom ) writes:

Is this supposed to be a joke? If not, remind me never to board a vessel
that you've built.

talc and flour are used as thickenres in resins. the problem with scented
talc is the smell released when sanding. urea formaldehyde adehsive
(plastic resin marine glue) is sold as a powder which includes either
wheat or rye flour as a thickener.

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epoxy thickener
 

Martin Schöön wrote in message . ..
On Thu, 27 May 2004 07:54:05 -0700, Parallax wrote:

I have been working on Minicup #2 but ran out of colloidal silica
epoxy thickener and do not feel like driving all the way across town
to West marine. So, I recalled some discussions about using talcum
powder or wood flour for this purpose. First, I used some of my wifes
powder till she found out and blew a gasket over it. I checked,
powder is expensive, makes the boat smell funny too. Then, I recalled
cornstarch is used as a thicken er for stews and soups and I had a
little and it worked fairly well. When it ran out, I used regular
flour, it does not work as well but is ok. I wonder if I could mix a
bug killer like Sevin dust with it to help preserve the wood.

What filler to choose depends on what you want to achieve:

-Colidica Silica for just making a thick but heavy putty.
-Micro baloons for making light-weight and easy to sand putty.
-Fibres to reinforce putty.
-Pigments

You could mix any of the abovementioned fillers to blend the properties
of the putty. Fibres could be anything including sawdust.

Some of the substances you mentioned are probably no good but for
laughs. Stick to the ones I listed and live happy. Do experiements
to find out how the different fillers work and how much to use for
different applications.


I appreciate all of this info. However, given the choice between
doing something right and doing it weird, I am unable to stop myself
and inevitably choose weird.
Happened to have some copper dust from a previous experiment to make
antifouling that could be applied underwater (yes, it worked) so I
added some of this to the areas to be enclosed in the theory that it
would prevent fungal rot.

epoxy thickener
 

Brian, we are being trolled.

Brian Nystrom wrote:

Parallax wrote:

I have been working on Minicup #2 but ran out of colloidal silica
epoxy thickener and do not feel like driving all the way across town
to West marine. So, I recalled some discussions about using talcum
powder or wood flour for this purpose. First, I used some of my wifes
powder till she found out and blew a gasket over it. I checked,
powder is expensive, makes the boat smell funny too. Then, I recalled
cornstarch is used as a thicken er for stews and soups and I had a
little and it worked fairly well. When it ran out, I used regular
flour, it does not work as well but is ok. I wonder if I could mix a
bug killer like Sevin dust with it to help preserve the wood.

Is this supposed to be a joke? If not, remind me never to board a vessel
that you've built.

epoxy thickener
 

Jim Conlin ) writes:
Brian, we are being trolled.

Define "trolled". What you are reading may be non-conventional but that is
how progress is made. Many of the advances in boat design and construction
that have made their way into conventional big boat commercial shops came
from the non-conventional small boat projects of amateurs.


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epoxy thickener
 

epoxy thickener
 

Speaking of non-conventional..................
I have used spay paint to color epoxy to match the pieces being glued.
I just spayed into the mix and stirred it up until I got the desired color.

This was done as a cosmetic 'fix' so the repair would not be visible and it
is sandable without changing color.

Not a marine application, by the way.

Bill

"William R. Watt" wrote in message
...
Jim Conlin ) writes:
Brian, we are being trolled.

Define "trolled". What you are reading may be non-conventional but that is
how progress is made. Many of the advances in boat design and construction
that have made their way into conventional big boat commercial shops came
from the non-conventional small boat projects of amateurs.


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epoxy thickener
 

Most progress is made by folks who have both an innovative idea and the
engineering skills and material resources to test it in a rigorous way.
Trolling includes asking fatuous questions like "Can i use dust bunnies instead of

fiberglass?".

"William R. Watt" wrote:

Jim Conlin ) writes:
Brian, we are being trolled.

Define "trolled". What you are reading may be non-conventional but that is
how progress is made. Many of the advances in boat design and construction
that have made their way into conventional big boat commercial shops came
from the non-conventional small boat projects of amateurs.

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epoxy thickener
 

'Troll" or innovator not withstanding,
'Sevin', like just about ALL plant or garden bug/disease 'preventatives' is
TOXIC. While supposedly of no great concern when applied AS it was DESIGNED
to be used, make it airborne as a very fine particulate and THAT is another
story !!

When you mix a fine powder like Talc, etc. into epoxy {etc.}some of it
becomes airborne. We've all experienced that 'little cloud' and thought
nothing of it. Some of it definitely gets inhaled . . . that's why you can
SMELL it. That's the first time.

Secondly, when you are grinding and/or sanding down those lumps, runs, &
fillets . . . you are getting a dose of a combination of particulates . . .
the epoxy, the glass {a 'benign' substance when a solid}, and whatever the
filler material is. Even if you use a mask . . . if you can smell it . . .
guess what that THAT means !?!

There's no reason why you can't 'experiment' with ANYTHING you want . . .
anybody remember how 'Silly Putty' started? Just think FIRST about beyond
the 'immediate' activity.

Regards & Good Luck,
Ron Magen
Backyard Boatshop
{Who STILL has ALL his fingers, toes, hair, etc. HOWEVER, many years ago my
Grandmother warned me about sitting on a cold, hard, marble floor. What she
foretold didn't happen that day, or the next week, or even the next year. It
happened THIS year !! }

"William R. Watt" wrote in message
...
Jim Conlin ) writes:
Brian, we are being trolled.
SNIP

epoxy thickener
 

On Thu, 27 May 2004 20:46:47 -0700, Parallax wrote:

I appreciate all of this info. However, given the choice between
doing something right and doing it weird, I am unable to stop myself
and inevitably choose weird.

So you ask for advice to make sure what you want to do is is really
weird? If you want to do weird things why bother about smell?

Happened to have some copper dust from a previous experiment to make
antifouling that could be applied underwater (yes, it worked) so I

I have heard about a commercial Cu + epoxy antifouling so that's not
too weird.

--
================================================== ==================
Martin Schöön * * * * * * * * * *"Problems worthy of attack
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * prove their worth by hitting back"
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *Piet Hein
================================================== ==================

epoxy thickener
 

Jim Conlin ) writes:
Most progress is made by folks who have both an innovative idea and the
engineering skills and material resources to test it in a rigorous way.

I prefer the kind that start "We were stranded on an isolated island with
nothing but a box of paper clips and a forward hold full of dust bunnies" and
end "Twenty years later and it's never given us a hint of trouble."

I've been taking a bit of flack on the FreeNet for doubting the
advisability of some of the enhancements they've been adding, which have
subsequenlty lead to security problems on our home computers. My response
to "engineers", software and otherwise, is the engineer standing up to his
waist in floodwater seriously explaining how the dam could not possibly
fail.

Trolling includes asking fatuous questions like "Can i use dust bunnies instead of

fiberglass?".

I don't think that's trolling. Trolling is where you post a newsgroup
article for the sole purpose of seeing how many people respond.

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epoxy thickener
 

William R. Watt wrote:

Jim Conlin ) writes:

Brian, we are being trolled.


Define "trolled". What you are reading may be non-conventional but that is
how progress is made. Many of the advances in boat design and construction
that have made their way into conventional big boat commercial shops came
from the non-conventional small boat projects of amateurs.

I understand what you're saying and I realize that nearly anything
fibrous can be used as a thickner, but I think it's safe to say that
building a boat with epoxy mixed with insecticide powder goes well
beyond the definition of "non-conventional".

Maybe the next time I need to do some fillets, I'll thicken the epoxy
with Metamucil. It's got plenty of fiber and it should help to produce
fillets that are quite "smooth" and "regular". ;-)

epoxy thickener
 

William Watt says:

My response
to "engineers", software and otherwise, is the engineer standing up to his
waist in floodwater seriously explaining how the dam could not possibly
fail.

That was no engineer, that was a research scientist ;-P

Real engineers are the ones who say "Oh, bvgger! THe dam's bust. Now, how do
we fix that?"

Steve

epoxy thickener
 

Brian Nystrom writes:

Maybe the next time I need to do some fillets, I'll thicken the epoxy
with Metamucil. It's got plenty of fiber and it should help to produce
fillets that are quite "smooth" and "regular". ;-)

That would only work if the fillet were to be extruded. ;-

Steve "beyond the pale, probably..."

epoxy thickener
 

I eagerly await the results of the dust bunny longevity test and have marked my 2024
calendar.

"William R. Watt" wrote:

Jim Conlin ) writes:
Most progress is made by folks who have both an innovative idea and the
engineering skills and material resources to test it in a rigorous way.

I prefer the kind that start "We were stranded on an isolated island with
nothing but a box of paper clips and a forward hold full of dust bunnies" and
end "Twenty years later and it's never given us a hint of trouble."

I've been taking a bit of flack on the FreeNet for doubting the
advisability of some of the enhancements they've been adding, which have
subsequenlty lead to security problems on our home computers. My response
to "engineers", software and otherwise, is the engineer standing up to his
waist in floodwater seriously explaining how the dam could not possibly
fail.

Trolling includes asking fatuous questions like "Can i use dust bunnies instead of

fiberglass?".

I don't think that's trolling. Trolling is where you post a newsgroup
article for the sole purpose of seeing how many people respond.

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epoxy thickener
 

epoxy thickener
 

On Thu, 27 May 2004 14:54:05 UTC, (Parallax)
wrote:

[mega cut]

"mindspring" in your e-mail makes sense.... :-)

--
steen - menzi.dk
Ready for OpenOffice?
---

epoxy thickener
 

In my view, Scotty, the issue isn't the six bucks for a bag of commercial
thickener.

I'm still trying to figure out how the guy is going to wash the black carbon
off the tiny beads used in toner. Let's see, open washing machine, pour in
five pounds of toner, one cup of detergent, set wash cycle to "delicate",
run the drain through a super-fine filter to catch the cleaned beads, and
buy five dozen long-stemmed roses to try to placate wife when she sees the
inside of the washing machine has turned black.


"Backyard Renegade" wrote in message
om...
(William R. Watt) wrote in message
...
Brian Nystrom ) writes:

Is this supposed to be a joke? If not, remind me never to board a
vessel
that you've built.

talc and flour are used as thickenres in resins. the problem with
scented
talc is the smell released when sanding. urea formaldehyde adehsive
(plastic resin marine glue) is sold as a powder which includes either
wheat or rye flour as a thickener.

Every time I see these threads I just puke. Geeze guys, 6 bucks for a
bag of aerosil enough to do three to four small boats, this thread is
just rediculous...Scotty

epoxy thickener
 

Stephen Baker ) writes:
Brian Nystrom writes:

Maybe the next time I need to do some fillets, I'll thicken the epoxy
with Metamucil. It's got plenty of fiber and it should help to produce
fillets that are quite "smooth" and "regular". ;-)

That would only work if the fillet were to be extruded. ;-

I'm not familiar with Metamucil but suspect it may be one of those fine
clay (kaolin) powders suspended in a flavoured water solution. If you boil
off the water all you have left is clay which, like powdered talc, which
would be less expensive to buy dry in the first place. And of course,
water mustn't be mixed with epoxy or polyester resins.

I'm not suggesting insecticide powder as a thickner for fillets. Some kind
of additive for sheathing might be interesting but expoxy itself is
supposed to be impermiable to air and water so it's probably a waste of
money. If the expoxy wears off to the point air and water get at the
wood the insecticide is gone then too.

From what I've read I would use fibre for reinforicing for structural
strength and powder to simply make the resin go further, or in the case of
silica, for added abraision resistance. Both fibre and powder would make
the resin more viscous if that's needed while curing. I've also read that
that the need to sand the cured resin influences which powder to use. I
usually collect wood "flour" for free (sandable fibre) and use that. I've
used powdered talc with epoxy for non-marine repairs around the house.
Laser toner sounds interesting except for the graphite coating. I don't
know what graphite does to resins. Carbon fibre is sought after for
combining with resins, but graphite? Imagine trying to clean up after
sanding. Ugh.


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Re epoxy thickener
 

Maybe the next time I need to do some fillets, I'll thicken the epoxy
with Metamucil. It's got plenty of fiber and it should help to produce
fillets that are quite "smooth" and "regular". ;-)

Offhand, that sounds like kind of a ****ty idea......
Anyway,sort of related to the topic,if I have to make a fillet of
some kind here's how I do it.I stick the corner of a sandwich bag a
few inches down into a regular soup can and drape the rest of the bag
down the outside of the can.I mix up some fillet stuff and put it in
the bag with a putty knife,twist the bag closed,snip off the corner
and end up with a disposable bag of fillet material that looks like
and is used exactly like the pastry apparatus that pastry people use
to write on pastries with,the name of which I cannot think of at the
moment,but you know what I mean,hopefully.To finish the fillet I
choose an appropriate sized socket from my toolbox,clean of the
grease,wax it up and drag it along at a low angle, ending up with a
fillet flanked by two lines of excess material, which I let set-up
enough to not be all gooey and to be easily taken off with a putty
knife. (Unrelated to the topic, Google won't let me post this as
" epoxy thickener"unless it is a followup,which it is.If I remove
the ":",everything's tits according to Mr. Google, but it starts a new
thread).

epoxy thickener
 

William R. Watt wrote:

Laser toner sounds interesting except for the graphite coating. I don't
know what graphite does to resins. Carbon fibre is sought after for
combining with resins, but graphite? Imagine trying to clean up after
sanding. Ugh.

My understanding is that toner is not coated. Toner is micro fine,
ground, black plastic that is melted and fused to the paper in the
printer/copier. It's only real use with epoxy is as a tint.

Graphite is sometimes used an a epoxy additive to produce a slippery,
abrasion resistant surface on hulls.

epoxy thickener
 

Brian Nystrom ) writes:

My understanding is that toner is not coated.

that was my original assumption but in an earlier article in this thread
we were informed it is coated with graphite.

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epoxy thickener
 

William R. Watt wrote:

Brian Nystrom ) writes:


My understanding is that toner is not coated.


that was my original assumption but in an earlier article in this thread
we were informed it is coated with graphite.

The pigment used in black toner is carbon black, not graphite. Here's a
link to an MSDS with the details:

http://www.biggestbook.com/MSDSFiles/bbmsds00739.pdf

epoxy thickener
 

Jim Conlin wrote:
Watch this space. It's gonna happen.
One of these days, someone will nominate garden dirt as an epoxy filler.
Hey, it's good for standing on and it's cheap.

Makes good non-skid too.

DSK