Bilge Pump Upgrade
I am not satisfied with the existing bilge pump system in my 36. It
consists of a manual Whale Gusher, operated from a lever in the cockpit, with a 1.5" intake and outflow to a thru hull low by the transom and a Rule 800 on an auto switch with a 3/4" outflow to a thru hull high on the topsides. Improving the outflow from the Rule Auto is not an option and a larger pump pushing more water thru the 3/4" out flow won't do anything. Ideally I would keep the small Rule in place and run a new 1.5" outlet from a new high output auto switched pump to its own thruhull but the routing doesn't look doable. So I am considering : 1: Removing the Whale gusher and installing a large auto switched bilge pump to the existing manual pump thruhull. 2: Installing a check valve on the manual pump intake foot and Wye in the large pump outlet after that and push the outlet water thru the manual pump. 3: Remove the manual pump intake foot and use the large auto switched centrifigal as the intake for the manual pump and push the water thru the manual pump. I would appreciate your comments and suggestions. |
Bilge Pump Upgrade
Just did what you are about to do.
I used a 750 gph with a ¾" outlet for deep bilge 3700 gph 11/2 " outlet at higher level 30 Gusher manual 2 buckets Each pump has its OWN separate intake and discharge hose. Not much I to suggest except do a group search. It aint rocket science. Lots of valuable info found here if take time to look and read. However....I do recommend using 1 ½ " pvc "SUCTION" hose. Its found anywhere for about $1.20-$1.80/ foot. Go to a farm supply or contractor supply or home depot. Do not even think about saying marine bilge hose! The wine industry use it too except that stuff is USDA okay and lots more expensive. "Trash pump suction hose" is what ya want. Its very tough with hard plastic spiral. Very smooth inside. Also clear. But some folks would say that algae will grow inside. Has not happened to me. Besides I like the idea of a fast visual assessment to find an obstruction in the system.. Don't forget the vented loops. Still Bobing thanks to suction hose. |
Clear corrugated suction hose (was) Bilge Pump Upgrade
"Bob" wrote in message
oups.com... However....I do recommend using 1 ½ " pvc "SUCTION" hose. Its found anywhere for about $1.20-$1.80/ foot. Go to a farm supply or contractor supply or home depot. Do not even think about saying marine bilge hose! The wine industry use it too except that stuff is USDA okay and lots more expensive. "Trash pump suction hose" is what ya want. Its very tough with hard plastic spiral. Very smooth inside. Also clear. ************ I was not able, in many googlings, to find this stuff ("Trash pump suction hose") easily. However, a couple of potentials surfaced when I went to the ads at the side, speaking of suction hose. Are either of these the sort of thing you're speaking of? http://www.hosecraftusa.com/model.php?modelUID=262 http://www.cat-vacuum-collectors.com...acuum-hose.htm (G-vac or B-flex) Better, if you have a HD part number, can you share it? The costs shown in what I could see suggests it's close to what one would pay for top quality marine sanitation hose (not clear, of course), i.e. 4-6 a foot. Is that your experience? Or, better stated, can you share specific walk-in (vs shipped) sources for this stuff? I'd use it both in discharge (1.125) on the electrics, and suction (1.5) on the whale Gusher manuals, replacing all the old hose present currrently, if I could find it inexpensively. Thanks. L8R Skip, wanting to get rid of the cheap corrugated stuff on the boat now, and not wanting to spend as much as the braided clear poly waterline costs -- Morgan 461 #2 SV Flying Pig KI4MPC http://tinyurl.com/384p2 The vessel as Tehamana, as we bought her "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover." - Mark Twain |
Clear corrugated suction hose (was) Bilge Pump Upgrade
Most clear hoses are not rated for below-waterline connections...so be
careful where you use non-"marine grade" hoses. -- Peggie ---------- Peggie Hall Specializing in marine sanitation since 1987 Author "Get Rid of Boat Odors - A Guide To Marine Sanitation Systems and Other Sources of Aggravation and Odor" http://shop.sailboatowners.com/books...ku=90&cat=1304 |
Clear corrugated suction hose (was) Bilge Pump Upgrade
Peggie Hall wrote: Most clear hoses are not rated for below-waterline connections...so be careful where you use non-"marine grade" hoses. Hi Peggy: You raised a question I have been think about lately. When people say for "below the water line" applications, just what does that mean? 100% immersion 100% of the time such as hose connected to an under the water through hull or a low spot in a hose run that allows pooled liquid. Does that also apply to a bilge intake and discharge hose which are only seldom and intermittently immersed yet live "below the waterline" in a normally dry area? I realize that installations vary and some bilges are a rather disgusting wet place but on the other hand, there are the painted white guys who dust their bilge out every few months. In my case, the bilge hose I use is that " PVC suction hose" I mentioned. It is reinforced with a PVC coil, smooth inside, with wall thickness about 1/4." Very smooth and extraordinarily stout. But on my boat, the bilge discharge side carries water for only a few seconds a few times each day depending on what's happening. If at the dock, months go by without the bilge tripping on. The suction side may be moist but not immerged for more than a few minutes. What concerns should I have regarding pvc used in a relatively dry place under the water line? Come to think about it I think I sit "below the water line" most of the time. The big problem I have is adding more combustible stuff to the boat. But hey, the boat is nothing but plastic and wood anyway. Poof! Bob |
Clear corrugated suction hose (was) Bilge Pump Upgrade
Skip G.
I'll check on manufacturing and part number RE the pvc suction hose and will post here in a few days. However, I hope Peggy H. responds to my "below the waterline" question and her concerns about pvc. I hope I do not have to rip out my new bilge system. Bob |
Clear corrugated suction hose (was) Bilge Pump Upgrade
Below is company info I copied. It looks like the stuff I use. I
googled a search and I found several companies that manufacture or distribute a similar product. Its your basic clear pvc hose with integrated helix coil. http://www.ajayindcorp.com/products_Suction.htm http://www.hosexpress.com/pvchose/seriesfg.htm http://www.hosexpress.com/pvchose/serieshjk.htm APPLICATIONS Marine: Resistance to Sun, weather and salt water helps it withstand severe marine service. Ease of handling and lightweight are important features during foul weather. Properties: -It is light in weight, easy to handle and yet strong -Does not corrode or rust -Simpler installation and lesser fittings -Superior weathering -Bright and attractive -Economical - inexpensive initial cost and maintenance -Non flammable -Transparent: possible to observe inside conditions -Affluent in flexibility: usable anywhere -Superior to chemical resistance, ideal for conveyance -Excellent in pressure and abrasion resistance, ideal for conveyance of powder as well as fluids -Easily Cut-able into any desired lengths Sounds as though it would work in the bilge. Bob |
Clear corrugated suction hose (was) Bilge Pump Upgrade
Bob wrote:
You raised a question I have been think about lately. When people say for "below the water line" applications, just what does that mean? If the thru-hull is below waterline at least 50% of the time--especially while the boat is at rest (wave, wake, tide), it would be wise to consider it to be a below-waterline thru-hull. If it's only submerged when the boat is heeled--which would also imply "only when you're aboard," it's not. That said, I would not connect ANY clear hose to any thru-hull. 'Cuz IMO, whether it's hoses or anything else, you can never regret erring on the side of caution. And fwiw, I've NEVER seen any clear bilge discharge hose. Boat builders are very cost conscious...if there weren't a good reason to stick with marine-grade bilge pump hose, they'd use something else that's cheaper. And also fwiw, I wouldn't use corrugated hose for anything on a boat, anywhere. But that's what I'd do. It's your boat...your choice. -- Peggie ---------- Peggie Hall Specializing in marine sanitation since 1987 Author "Get Rid of Boat Odors - A Guide To Marine Sanitation Systems and Other Sources of Aggravation and Odor" http://shop.sailboatowners.com/books...ku=90&cat=1304 |
Clear corrugated suction hose (was) Bilge Pump Upgrade
Peggie Hall wrote: That said, I would not connect ANY clear hose to any thru-hull. 'Cuz IMO, whether it's hoses or anything else, you can never regret erring on the side of caution. And fwiw, I've NEVER seen any clear bilge discharge hose. Boat builders are very cost conscious...if there weren't a good reason to stick with marine-grade bilge pump hose, they'd use something else that's cheaper. And also fwiw, I wouldn't use corrugated hose for anything on a boat, anywhere. But that's what I'd do. It's your boat...your choice. Hi Peggy: Thank you for the fast reply. So If I under stand correctly, "below the water line" indicates 100% emersion 100% of the time? What about a bilge system that discharges through an above the water line (6") through hull? Never wet until the pump starts and then its empty? Would that situation be considered "below the waterline?" On a slightly different thought, one thing that I do hold strongly, or was that strongly hold, is that the maritime industry is permeated with tradition. In fact, "tradition" is a selling attribute for many companies. Do not want to try anything that is not test by time, ya sure, ya betcha. The problem with that is who is going to take a chance and test it first? And as far as boat builder are concerned, I agree they are there to make a profit. COuld be that the pvc hose just takes alttle mroe time to install because it is more robust that the the stuff installed at the factory. I know the white 3/4" hose on my new PH 2 could not take the slight bend to the bowl. The hose was colapsed at the radious and restrist the flow. I "up graded" that factory OEM asap!. I looked over the specs for the pvc. No corrugation. Its very smooth inside. Temp, PSI, flamibility, 1/4" wall, it all looks good. I was reviewing the different industries that use it in some very horindous applications. Looks tough! I just belive that looking outside the marine industry is a reasonable thing to do IF the product is designed for similar applications but not called "marine." Silaprene adhesive/sealant is an excellent example. Used in the trucking industry for decades to "glue" 40' trailers together only recently "discovered" by sailors to bed through-the-deck chain plates. So your apprehension to use the pvc hose for a bilge system is based on what engineering specification? Bob |
Clear corrugated suction hose (was) Bilge Pump Upgrade
Yes, there are many traditions around boats and the sea. The one I'm most
fond of is that boats float. Accordingly, while I do experiment elswhere in boat construction, I will leave to others experiments with the materials and components that keep the ocean out. "Bob" wrote in message ups.com... Peggie Hall wrote: That said, I would not connect ANY clear hose to any thru-hull. 'Cuz IMO, whether it's hoses or anything else, you can never regret erring on the side of caution. And fwiw, I've NEVER seen any clear bilge discharge hose. Boat builders are very cost conscious...if there weren't a good reason to stick with marine-grade bilge pump hose, they'd use something else that's cheaper. And also fwiw, I wouldn't use corrugated hose for anything on a boat, anywhere. But that's what I'd do. It's your boat...your choice. Hi Peggy: Thank you for the fast reply. So If I under stand correctly, "below the water line" indicates 100% emersion 100% of the time? What about a bilge system that discharges through an above the water line (6") through hull? Never wet until the pump starts and then its empty? Would that situation be considered "below the waterline?" On a slightly different thought, one thing that I do hold strongly, or was that strongly hold, is that the maritime industry is permeated with tradition. In fact, "tradition" is a selling attribute for many companies. Do not want to try anything that is not test by time, ya sure, ya betcha. The problem with that is who is going to take a chance and test it first? And as far as boat builder are concerned, I agree they are there to make a profit. COuld be that the pvc hose just takes alttle mroe time to install because it is more robust that the the stuff installed at the factory. I know the white 3/4" hose on my new PH 2 could not take the slight bend to the bowl. The hose was colapsed at the radious and restrist the flow. I "up graded" that factory OEM asap!. I looked over the specs for the pvc. No corrugation. Its very smooth inside. Temp, PSI, flamibility, 1/4" wall, it all looks good. I was reviewing the different industries that use it in some very horindous applications. Looks tough! I just belive that looking outside the marine industry is a reasonable thing to do IF the product is designed for similar applications but not called "marine." Silaprene adhesive/sealant is an excellent example. Used in the trucking industry for decades to "glue" 40' trailers together only recently "discovered" by sailors to bed through-the-deck chain plates. So your apprehension to use the pvc hose for a bilge system is based on what engineering specification? Bob |
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