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Red Cloud Abandoned!
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Red Cloud Abandoned!
On Wed, 02 Jan 2008 08:20:17 -0500, jeff wrote:
http://www.khou.com/news/local/stories/ khou080102_ac_cgrescue.c061dc.html A sad day - at least they are all safe. A sad day indeed. I was hoping you were playing a tasteless joke. Not only do they lose their boat, but also their home. A very sad day. |
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"jeff" wrote in message . .. http://www.khou.com/news/local/stori...ue.c061dc.html A sad day - at least they are all safe. Is there a fund/account where we could send Joe and Terry some money to help them out? If you know of it please put up the info. BC |
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That is truly sad news. At least they're all okay, even the
dog. Joe's been through a lot of stuff on the water, I'm sure he'll bounce back from this. Once again, thank God for the Coast Guard! SBV "jeff" wrote in message . .. http://www.khou.com/news/local/stori...102_ac_cgrescu e.c061dc.html A sad day - at least they are all safe. |
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A sad day - at least they are all safe. Terrible news. I'm so glad they are okay though. Joe will live to sail another day. Robert B 35s5 NY |
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A sad day Yes it is... I've certainly enjoyed Joe's postings and contributions particularly those having to do with sailing and general marine info. He is a man of maritime experience and knowledge. I wonder if an attempt will be made to salvage Red Cloud or will it be deemed a hazard and sunk assuming it is still afloat? Thanks again Jeff for the alert/thread. Bill Channel Islands Harbor Oxnard, California "The ocean is an immense, powerful and strong entity that doesn't play favorites. Enjoy it's beauty but be wary of it's turmoil." |
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jeff wrote:
http://www.khou.com/news/local/stori...grescue.c061dc.... A sad day - at least they are all safe. That is very sad news... Joe was very proud of Red Cloud and she represented a huge investment.... not just money, but his work & spirit. It was kind of a zany idea to import coffee under sail, maybe it would have worked out profitably. I am very sad to hear about the end of this adventure, and am hoping to hear the tale from Joe himself. Sincerely Doug King |
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"Ted Bunter" wrote in message
... More he http://www.dogflu.ca/01022008/12/coa..._dog_from_boat Wow... after all Joe said/did about his retrofit. It's hard to imagine how rough it must have been (ocean conditions and psychological effect of having to abandon her). I hope we'll hear the first-hand account when Joe gets back and gets settled. Fortunately, it was only a thing that was damaged or lost, not a person. In any case, he was out there doing it, while a lot of others talk a good act, but in fact do little. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
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I'm betting (hoping) we don't. I think Neal has a lot of
respect for Joe. SBV "Dave" wrote in message ... On Wed, 2 Jan 2008 11:41:44 -0800, "Capt. JG" said: In any case, he was out there doing it, while a lot of others talk a good act, but in fact do little. I have not doubt we'll hear from one of Neal's socks shortly. |
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"Scotty" wrote in message
... I'm betting (hoping) we don't. I think Neal has a lot of respect for Joe. SBV "Dave" wrote in message ... On Wed, 2 Jan 2008 11:41:44 -0800, "Capt. JG" said: In any case, he was out there doing it, while a lot of others talk a good act, but in fact do little. I have not doubt we'll hear from one of Neal's socks shortly. Doubtful... Neal doesn't have a lot of respect for anyone. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
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Bill Warnock wrote: A sad day Yes it is... I've certainly enjoyed Joe's postings and contributions particularly those having to do with sailing and general marine info. He is a man of maritime experience and knowledge. I wonder if an attempt will be made to salvage Red Cloud or will it be deemed a hazard and sunk assuming it is still afloat? One news report stated that Joe was looking into the possibility of salvaging Red Cloud. Certainly a sad day for Joe and Terry, but thank God that they are back safe and (mostly) sound. Apparently this was a rather difficult rescue situation for the CC. Jim Cate Incidentally, if the group decides to organize a collection, I would want to contribute. I'm assuming his insurance would cover most related expenses. |
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"JimC" wrote in message
... Bill Warnock wrote: A sad day Yes it is... I've certainly enjoyed Joe's postings and contributions particularly those having to do with sailing and general marine info. He is a man of maritime experience and knowledge. I wonder if an attempt will be made to salvage Red Cloud or will it be deemed a hazard and sunk assuming it is still afloat? One news report stated that Joe was looking into the possibility of salvaging Red Cloud. Certainly a sad day for Joe and Terry, but thank God that they are back safe and (mostly) sound. Apparently this was a rather difficult rescue situation for the CC. Jim Cate Incidentally, if the group decides to organize a collection, I would want to contribute. I'm assuming his insurance would cover most related expenses. Definitely... count me in. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
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On Wed, 02 Jan 2008 08:20:17 -0500, jeff wrote this
crap: http://www.khou.com/news/local/stori...ue.c061dc.html A sad day - at least they are all safe. They lost the coffee! Oh the humanity!!! I'm Horvath and I approve of this post. |
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Dave wrote:
I have not doubt we'll hear from one of Neal's socks shortly. That would be far better than hearing from one of Neal's shorts sockly. DSK |
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Capt. JG wrote:
"Ted Bunter" wrote in message ... More he http://www.dogflu.ca/01022008/12/coa..._dog_from_boat Wow... after all Joe said/did about his retrofit. It's hard to imagine how rough it must have been (ocean conditions and psychological effect of having to abandon her). I hope we'll hear the first-hand account when Joe gets back and gets settled. Fortunately, it was only a thing that was damaged or lost, not a person. In any case, he was out there doing it, while a lot of others talk a good act, but in fact do little. As I'm rarely here now, just seen all of this, watched the video. Video or photos won't show the half of it (the Sydney Hobart disaster photos just looked like a rough sea...) But there's a video shot of Red Cloud falling off a wave that gives a good (=very bad)feel for the conditions. And yes, well put. They were out there doing... -- Flying Tadpole ---------------------------------- http://www.myspace.com/timfatchen http://www.soundclick.com/flyingtadpole |
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On Jan 2, 7:20*am, jeff wrote:
http://www.khou.com/news/local/stori...grescue.c061dc.... A sad day - at least they are all safe. A sad day indeed. Glad to hear everyone is safe and hope Joe is able to find Red Cloud and bring her home safely. Barb |
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On Thu, 03 Jan 2008 10:55:20 +1030, Flying Tadpole
wrote this crap: As I'm rarely here now, just seen all of this, watched the video. Video or photos won't show the half of it (the Sydney Hobart disaster photos just looked like a rough sea...) But there's a video shot of Red Cloud falling off a wave that gives a good (=very bad)feel for the conditions. And yes, well put. They were out there doing... At least nobody was eaten by tigers. I'm Horvath and I approve of this post. |
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On Wed, 2 Jan 2008 17:38:11 -0800 (PST), ladysailor
wrote: On Jan 2, 7:20*am, jeff wrote: http://www.khou.com/news/local/stori...grescue.c061dc.... A sad day - at least they are all safe. A sad day indeed. Glad to hear everyone is safe and hope Joe is able to find Red Cloud and bring her home safely. Barb Yes, sad...though I'd respectfully suggest that if Red Cloud manages to stay afloat unmanned then she was abandoned way to quickly. OzOne of the three twins I welcome you to Crackerbox Palace. |
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A sad day indeed. Glad to hear everyone is safe and hope Joe is able
to find Red Cloud and bring her home safely. One of the news articles said that the USCG had put a tracking device aboard to make here easy to find. With any luck at all, Joe is out there now towing her back. OzOne wrote: Yes, sad...though I'd respectfully suggest that if Red Cloud manages to stay afloat unmanned then she was abandoned way to quickly. Well, the problem is not that she was sinking (although apparently taking on water thru broken elements of the superstructure) but that one of the crew was injured. Changes the equation entirely, and the USCG will not evacuate one person of the crew. It's either all or none (a policy that I can see the reason for, but don't agree with). Fresh Breezes- Doug King |
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Bloody Horvath wrote:
And yes, well put. They were out there doing... At least nobody was eaten by tigers. Tigers? What are you havering on about, Horvath? It's heat, snakes and dingoes these days. http://www.panoramio.com/user/1004507 -- Flying Tadpole ---------------------------------- http://www.myspace.com/timfatchen http://www.soundclick.com/flyingtadpole |
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OzOne wrote in message ... Yes, sad...though I'd respectfully suggest that if Red Cloud manages to stay afloat unmanned then she was abandoned way to quickly. Bzzzzzzzzzt ! Go back and read it again, Ozwald. |
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wrote in message news:9bb0fa09-162d-41ab-b835- Well, the problem is not that she was sinking (although apparently taking on water thru broken elements of the superstructure) but that one of the crew was injured. Changes the equation entirely, and the USCG will not evacuate one person of the crew. It's either all or none (a policy that I can see the reason for, but don't agree with). What would they do if you sent the injured up first and then refused to go? I'm guessing they'll arrest you when you get back to port? SBV |
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On Fri, 4 Jan 2008 00:33:20 -0500, "Scotty" wrote:
OzOne wrote in message .. . Yes, sad...though I'd respectfully suggest that if Red Cloud manages to stay afloat unmanned then she was abandoned way to quickly. Bzzzzzzzzzt ! Go back and read it again, Ozwald. Read what? If the boat can stay afloat without any assistance , It would certainly have with someone aboard to help her. You need to read a little about the boats taht have survived storms with severely injured people aboard...in one case without any coachhouse left standing. OzOne of the three twins I welcome you to Crackerbox Palace. |
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On Fri, 04 Jan 2008 00:34:52 -0500, Scotty wrote:
What would they do if you sent the injured up first and then refused to go? I'm guessing they'll arrest you when you get back to port? SBV I don't know about arrest, but they surely could pull Joe's license and ship's documentation. The Satori, of Perfect Storm fame, was a similar situation. http://www.westsail.org/satori.html |
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You need to read a little about the boats taht have survived storms with severely injured people aboard...in one case without any coachhouse left standing. Yes and Rheinhold Messner dragged himself by his hands across a Himalayan glacier for three days with frozen stumps for feet and went on to solo Mt Everest and ski across Antarctica. Doug Scott downclimbed an 8,000 meter Himalayan peak on his kness because of two broken legs. We shouldn't expect anything less of Terry. Right. |
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"Bob Crantz" wrote in message ... You need to read a little about the boats taht have survived storms with severely injured people aboard...in one case without any coachhouse left standing. Yes and Rheinhold Messner dragged himself by his hands across a Himalayan glacier for three days with frozen stumps for feet and went on to solo Mt Everest and ski across Antarctica. Doug Scott downclimbed an 8,000 meter Himalayan peak on his kness because of two broken legs. We shouldn't expect anything less of Terry. Right. phht, a walk in the park for the mighty Oz. |
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"Scotty" wrote:
What would they do if you sent the injured up first and then refused to go? I'm guessing they'll arrest you when you get back to port? As somebody else suggested, they would at the very least pull Joe's license, possibly arrest them. The one case I know of where a boat defied a USCG "suggestion" (which was that they return to dock, not abandon) the boat was followed by the Coasties and about an hour later boarded by Treasury agents who arrested... in a rather forceful & ugly way... everyone on board including a couple of kids. Now sure what the ultimate shake-out of that case was, last I heard the boat owner (who was not a licensed captain) was suing Uncle Sam to get his boat out of impoundment by several Federal agencies. Anyway, ****ing off the USCG would be very very likely to get you Homeland Security's sh** list, at the very least. OzOne wrote: Read what? Hello? Injured crew? If the boat can stay afloat without any assistance , It would certainly have with someone aboard to help her. Agreed. But exercising that option would certainly have involved a face-down with the USCG. The fact that Joe is working on finding & recovering his boat shows that he doesn't think it sank; and probably didn't think it was sinking at the time. They called the USCG to evacuate an injured crewman and ended up being ordered to *all* evacuate. Standard policy- the Coasties don't want to come twice to the same rescue. Honestly don't know I'd do in Joe's situation. I know of another case (last year) where the USCG did actually tow a vessel in distress; which AFAIK has been against their policy for years. They weren't as far out as Joe was though. DSK |
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wrote in message ... A sad day indeed. Glad to hear everyone is safe and hope Joe is able to find Red Cloud and bring her home safely. One of the news articles said that the USCG had put a tracking device aboard to make here easy to find. With any luck at all, Joe is out there now towing her back. OzOne wrote: Yes, sad...though I'd respectfully suggest that if Red Cloud manages to stay afloat unmanned then she was abandoned way to quickly. Well, the problem is not that she was sinking (although apparently taking on water thru broken elements of the superstructure) but that one of the crew was injured. Changes the equation entirely, and the USCG will not evacuate one person of the crew. It's either all or none (a policy that I can see the reason for, but don't agree with). Fresh Breezes- Doug King Surely that depends on what message Joe called in ? I cannot believe that the USCG would insist on bringing everybody off if Joe had simply asked for an injured crewmember to be taken off.. Surely a Captain does not relinquish his rights and responsibilities and has to accept orders from USCG just because he asked for an injured person to be taken off? I do not believe that any coastguard service in Europe has such powers. I understand that Joe wanted to stay aboard and the price for wanting his injured wife to be helped is that he has possibly lost his ship. |
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On Fri, 4 Jan 2008 08:17:02 -0700, "Bob Crantz"
wrote: You need to read a little about the boats taht have survived storms with severely injured people aboard...in one case without any coachhouse left standing. Yes and Rheinhold Messner dragged himself by his hands across a Himalayan glacier for three days with frozen stumps for feet and went on to solo Mt Everest and ski across Antarctica. Doug Scott downclimbed an 8,000 meter Himalayan peak on his kness because of two broken legs. We shouldn't expect anything less of Terry. Right. I've sailed some 400 miles through a severe storm with a crew member cocooned in bedding to help stop the jarring to a broken leg...he did not have a twisted ankle. BUT, YOU digress.........IF the boat is still afloat without assistance...It was in all likelihood abandoned too soon. OzOne of the three twins I welcome you to Crackerbox Palace. |
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On Fri, 4 Jan 2008 11:34:11 -0500, "Scotty" wrote:
phht, a walk in the park for the mighty Oz. So just how far could you get with a sprained ankle Scooter? OzOne of the three twins I welcome you to Crackerbox Palace. |
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On 4 Jan 2008 16:01:01 -0600, Dave wrote:
On Fri, 4 Jan 2008 20:17:35 +0100, "Edgar" said: Surely a Captain does not relinquish his rights and responsibilities and has to accept orders from USCG just because he asked for an injured person to be taken off? What is the basis for that conclusion? What is the source of those "rights" you cite? Near as I can tell there isn't any right to specify to the Coast Guard how they'll conduct a rescue you have asked for. There may, perhaps, be a right to say "oh, never mind." It's not a conclusion...IT'S a QUESTION!!!!! OzOne of the three twins I welcome you to Crackerbox Palace. |
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On 4 Jan 2008 17:05:02 -0600, Dave wrote:
On Sat, 05 Jan 2008 09:29:18 +1100, OzOne said: Surely a Captain does not relinquish his rights and responsibilities and has to accept orders from USCG just because he asked for an injured person to be taken off? What is the basis for that conclusion? What is the source of those "rights" you cite? Near as I can tell there isn't any right to specify to the Coast Guard how they'll conduct a rescue you have asked for. There may, perhaps, be a right to say "oh, never mind." It's not a conclusion...IT'S a QUESTION!!!!! Do you start questions with the word "Surely?" I don't. Surely you noticed the question mark? OzOne of the three twins I welcome you to Crackerbox Palace. |
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On 4 Jan 2008 18:37:02 -0600, Dave wrote:
On Sat, 05 Jan 2008 10:35:17 +1100, OzOne said: On 4 Jan 2008 17:05:02 -0600, Dave wrote: On Sat, 05 Jan 2008 09:29:18 +1100, OzOne said: Surely a Captain does not relinquish his rights and responsibilities and has to accept orders from USCG just because he asked for an injured person to be taken off? What is the basis for that conclusion? What is the source of those "rights" you cite? Near as I can tell there isn't any right to specify to the Coast Guard how they'll conduct a rescue you have asked for. There may, perhaps, be a right to say "oh, never mind." It's not a conclusion...IT'S a QUESTION!!!!! Do you start questions with the word "Surely?" I don't. Surely you noticed the question mark? I did indeed. I attributed it to the author's lack of familiarity with the English grammar. Surely you don't regard that language you speak as English? OzOne of the three twins I welcome you to Crackerbox Palace. |
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OzOne wrote in message ... On Fri, 4 Jan 2008 11:34:11 -0500, "Scotty" wrote: phht, a walk in the park for the mighty Oz. So just how far could you get with a sprained ankle Scooter? only 1/1,000,000 of what you could. I can't even walk in your shadow, Ozwald. Scooter |
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OzOne wrote in message ... I've sailed some 400 miles through a severe storm with a crew member cocooned in bedding to help stop the jarring to a broken leg... THE MIGHTY OZ HAS SPOKEN !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
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On 4 Jan 2008 19:15:02 -0600, Dave wrote:
On Sat, 05 Jan 2008 11:43:18 +1100, OzOne said: Surely you don't regard that language you speak as English? LOL. This from an Aussie? Surely you jest? from an Ozzie with an understanding of Enlish as it's supposed to be written...with 's's not zeeee's. OzOne of the three twins I welcome you to Crackerbox Palace. |
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On Fri, 4 Jan 2008 19:55:08 -0500, "Scotty" wrote:
OzOne wrote in message .. . On Fri, 4 Jan 2008 11:34:11 -0500, "Scotty" wrote: phht, a walk in the park for the mighty Oz. So just how far could you get with a sprained ankle Scooter? only 1/1,000,000 of what you could. I can't even walk in your shadow, Ozwald. Scooter In that case Scooter you could manage a 10 metres or so.....with ease. OzOne of the three twins I welcome you to Crackerbox Palace. |
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On Fri, 4 Jan 2008 19:56:47 -0500, "Scotty" wrote:
OzOne wrote in message .. . I've sailed some 400 miles through a severe storm with a crew member cocooned in bedding to help stop the jarring to a broken leg... THE MIGHTY OZ HAS SPOKEN !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Yep, and my crew was very happy to get to hospital in Crete. Tell me Scooter would you abandon your boat if you sprained an ankle? (Now that this has degenerated from my original comment that if the boat is still afloat unmanned then it was abandoned too quickly) OzOne of the three twins I welcome you to Crackerbox Palace. |
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