On Mar 17, 7:29 pm, Charlie Morgan wrote:
On Sat, 17 Mar 2007 19:15:27 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"





wrote:

"Scotty" w@u wrote in message
...
Ed, it is good advice to tie an extra line around a RF sail
when leaving the boat for a while. Many, many, many (
Many,many,many) sails that have been shredded could have
been saved.

Scotty

Not a single hank-on sail has been shredded because they are removed and
stored below. That's the way sails are supposed to be taken care of. Not
wound up around the head stay and out in the elements when not being
used.

Yes, I've seen many times how hanked on sails are cared for. It's not pretty.
Wet, dirty and either quicky stuffed in a bag to molder, or crunched up and
stuffed through the forward hatch. Roller furling is MUCH kinder to head sails.

Coming from someone who spends an hour maintaing his brightwork on a
C&C I would expect you are surrounded by lazy sailors. Un hanking
flaking, folding and bagging a jib and putting it in a dry sail locker
only takes a few minutes.

Rollup head sails are for lazy sailors. They ruin the shape of the
sail, they have to have sunbrella sewed to the exposed edges, they get
stuck, ect..ect..ect



I always have several wraps of the sheets PLUS a sail tie.

Just how high can you reach with your sail tie? I
I've seen many shredded to peices that had "A" sail tie, in high
winds.


There is no issue
with removing the sail tie, because every competent captain does a walk around
of the boat before leaving the dock or mooring. Only a complete lubber would
argue with this.

Only a lubber would think leaving your sails out in the weather, and
putting a tie around is better then properly storing them in a sail
locker.

Joe

I expect that Neal/Nellen/Wilbur the uber-lubber will have
something to say!

CWM- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

On Mar 18, 12:01 am, "Scotty" w@u wrote:
"Joe" wrote in message

oups.com..
.



Un hanking
flaking, folding and bagging a jib and putting it in a dry
sail locker
only takes a few minutes.

Rolling up my genny takes about 10 seconds.


Yeah, but it's left in the weather and birds crap on it.

Joe

"Maxprop" wrote in message
hlink.net...

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
"Scotty" w@u wrote in message
...

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
"Maxprop" wrote in message

ink.net...
Yup. Memorial Day, can't recall the year. But we got a
lesson about
docklines that night. Also got a lesson about securing
genoa sheets and
tying a keeper line around the rolled genny.


I don't put a line around the rolled jib,



you should.




Why? What's wrong with the method I described in the secton you deleted?

I don't put a line around the rolled jib, but I do use a keeper line
through
one of the holes on the drum to the pulpit.

Do you take about two or three wraps of the sheets around the genny when
you roll it up? If you're one of those who leaves the clew sticking out
behind the genoa, you should rethink that. You should also pull the
sheets taut around the winches and cleat them--not just in the
self-tailing part of the winch, but a couple of flemishes on a cleat.


I generally put a couple of turns around the jib. I don't pull the sheets
taut around the winches. I just cleat them. I don't think it's good to have
strain on the winches if it's not needed.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Maxprop" wrote in message
ink.net...
A few minor precautions that take about 1 minute to employ solve the
problem nicely. I never worry about my headsail.

All this nonsense about putting sail ties and wrapping extra lines around
it is all well and good but how many people actually take the time to do
it.

Everyone I know with roller furling.

Nearly everyone I know or have seen as well. I also rinse off the furler
with fresh water.

Does the guy in the slip right next to your precious boat do it?

Most hanked-on sails, especially the larger genoas, never make it out of
the bag. Instead the idiots generally sail around on the main, too lazy
to go below, lug the heavy bag and sail up onto the deck and bend on the
sail. And those sails stuffed in bags look like **** after a very short
time. They get stained with spider crap, mildew, and lose their sizing
much more quickly than those on rollers.

Interesting. When I teach on the boat that has the hank-on jib, three jibs
are available. Given the regularly strong winds out here, we hardly ever
break out anything but the smallest of them. We take great care in making
sure it's stowed properly at the end of the day. Take a bit of time making
sure it's folded properly. If it got soaked with salt water, then we have to
lay it out until it dries, which eats up a lot more time.

Perhaps not, but they do often get left on the deck where they can be
stolen, blown into the water, or just accumulate rain and spiders. I'd
never buy another boat without roller furling.

I might buy one, but I'd sure as sh*t put one on sooner vs. later.


I see the diametric opposite. Those boats with hanked-on sails are
generally abused and neglected. Those with furlers are the ones cared for
in a seamanlike manner. As for the sun cover, I've replaced my current
one when it showed abrasive wear due to degradation by UV. The sail is
perfect, and about 8 years old.

So have I. Most people don't sail much, so we see their bagged jib sitting
there collecting all sorts of dirt. Typically, their boat isn't in much
better shape.


--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

I suppose you bag your main sail everytime, too?
SBV


"Wilbur Hubbard" wrote in
message ...

"Scotty" w@u wrote in message
. ..
Some of us can afford RF, apparently some can't. :p~



It's not a matter of affording. It's a matter of doing it
the right way.
If you're going to use roll-ups, the least you can do is
take them down
when you're not using them. Like you said yourself,
unattended roll-ups
come unwound in high winds and tear themselves to shreds.
The often
damage the boat in the slips beside them. That's not only
stupid but
inconsiderate of your neighbor.

Wilbur Hubbard

"Charlie Morgan" wrote in message
...

I always have several wraps of the sheets PLUS a sail tie.
There is no issue
with removing the sail tie, because every competent
captain does a walk around
of the boat before leaving the dock or mooring. Only a
complete lubber would
argue with this. I expect that Neal/Nellen/Wilbur the
uber-lubber will have
something to say!


that's right, you should check your lights before you leave.
I have to uncleat the bow lines, anyways.

Damn, now I'm agreeing with chuckles!

SBV

"Joe" wrote in message
oups.com..
..

Un hanking
flaking, folding and bagging a jib and putting it in a dry
sail locker
only takes a few minutes.


Rolling up my genny takes about 10 seconds.

"Wilbur Hubbard" wrote in message
...

"Scotty" w@u wrote in message
. ..
Ed, it is good advice to tie an extra line around a RF sail
when leaving the boat for a while. Many, many, many (
Many,many,many) sails that have been shredded could have
been saved.

Scotty


Not a single hank-on sail has been shredded because they are removed and
stored below. That's the way sails are supposed to be taken care of. Not
wound up around the head stay and out in the elements when not being used.

Wilbur Hubbard

I am sure that many hank-on sails have been lost overboard because when you
are changing jibs you have to release all the hanks and the sheets before
you can put the old sail down the hatch. Then you have to get the new sail
up, take it out of the bag and get it hanked on while it is trying escape
overboard through the lifelines. Then you have to collect the sheets, which
by this time will have blown oout of reach and fix them back on. finally you
are ready to hoist. All very fine if you have a fit young foredeck hand to
do it for you.
It is a totally different story if you are short handed. With just my wife
as crew I have had the experience of unhanking a jib in the middle of the
English Channel in darkness with the boat doing 8 knots downwind and,
despite that, still showing 45 knots of apparent wind on the indicator from
dead aft. I was sitting by the forestay as it was impossible to stand and
water was being shovelled aboard up to my waist. I had a job to stop the jib
going overboard but finally got it below plus gallons of water into the fore
cabin. There was no way I was going to try and get another jib up in those
conditions.
So now I have a roller jib and I suspect that if you had experienced those
conditions you would change too.

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
"Maxprop" wrote in message
hlink.net...

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
"Scotty" w@u wrote in message
...

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
"Maxprop" wrote in message

ink.net...
Yup. Memorial Day, can't recall the year. But we got a
lesson about
docklines that night. Also got a lesson about securing
genoa sheets and
tying a keeper line around the rolled genny.


I don't put a line around the rolled jib,



you should.




Why? What's wrong with the method I described in the secton you deleted?

I don't put a line around the rolled jib, but I do use a keeper line
through
one of the holes on the drum to the pulpit.

Do you take about two or three wraps of the sheets around the genny when
you roll it up? If you're one of those who leaves the clew sticking out
behind the genoa, you should rethink that. You should also pull the
sheets taut around the winches and cleat them--not just in the
self-tailing part of the winch, but a couple of flemishes on a cleat.


I generally put a couple of turns around the jib. I don't pull the sheets
taut around the winches. I just cleat them. I don't think it's good to
have strain on the winches if it's not needed.

Not strain really, but just tension. IF your sheets are slack, the wind can
unwind the turns on your genoa in short order.

Do you clean and repack your winches regularly? That's more important than
leaving them under tension.

Max

"Joe" wrote in message
oups.com...

Coming from someone who spends an hour maintaing his brightwork on a
C&C I would expect you are surrounded by lazy sailors. Un hanking
flaking, folding and bagging a jib and putting it in a dry sail locker
only takes a few minutes.

You'd be surprised at how few people take the time. Well, perhaps you
wouldn't. My impression is that if folks don't have roller furling, they
wish they did. And if they can't afford it, their boats also look to be in
the poverty level. There are always exceptions, but that's the general rule
around here. What I've seen more often is hanked-on headsails dropped to
the deck and shock-corded to a couple of lifeline stanchions--a really lazy
approach that insures the sail's lifespan will be minimal.


Rollup head sails are for lazy sailors. They ruin the shape of the
sail, they have to have sunbrella sewed to the exposed edges, they get
stuck, ect..ect..ect

How do they ruin the shape of the sail?

Just how high can you reach with your sail tie? I
I've seen many shredded to peices that had "A" sail tie, in high
winds.

On my boat the genoa sheets wrap around the sail at the level of the clew,
which is about twelve feet above the deck. I place a single sail tie about
three or four feet below that. I have to stand on the bow pulpit to do it,
however.


Only a lubber would think leaving your sails out in the weather, and
putting a tie around is better then properly storing them in a sail
locker.

Then nearly 90% of sailors are lubbers, because that's the industry estimate
of the number of sailing vessels equipped with roller furling. And some
form of main furling is also increasing, now at about 15% and rising.

Max