On Jan 24, 11:42 am, Jeff wrote:


The difference of our opinion's probly arise because we are thinking
on different levels.

I'm thinking on the level of a small yacht owner, like almost everyone

With the recent "Salvaging or Scavenging" on the British shore I
assumed we were discussing salvage in general, and specifically the
beached booty. Only jon brought up small craft towing, guess because he
has that endorsement on his ticket. When he told me he had a towing
endorsement I thought he had a freight and towing
endorsement...bwahahahahahahahaaa.

I think anyone who pulls salvage on another mariner on his personal
yacht in peril is a scumball, unless thats his profession or the boat
was abandoned and it's not needed anyway.

I would not expect a Lloyds LOS salvage agreement to be carried by
BoatsUS, TowboatUS, ect.ect..

But offshore... commerical vessels..that make up 99 percent of all
salvage needed would be very familar with the Lloyd's contract, and
most likely insured by Lloyds of London.

Jon's right, I did not look at the BoatUS contract because I do not
respect BoatUS or towboatsUS. I would never consider either one of
thier opinions worthy of consideration. They both have good business
plans to make money but I have seen their seamanship knowledge and the
quality of thee crews that man the boats to be a FN joke at best.

Joe





here.- Hide quoted text -- Show quoted text -

"Joe" wrote in message
ups.com...


On Jan 24, 11:42 am, Jeff wrote:


The difference of our opinion's probly arise because we are thinking
on different levels.

I'm thinking on the level of a small yacht owner, like almost everyone

With the recent "Salvaging or Scavenging" on the British shore I
assumed we were discussing salvage in general, and specifically the
beached booty. Only jon brought up small craft towing, guess because he
has that endorsement on his ticket. When he told me he had a towing
endorsement I thought he had a freight and towing
endorsement...bwahahahahahahahaaa.

Sure Joe. I think you just got lazy in your thinking. JLR was talking about
theft, not salvage.

I think anyone who pulls salvage on another mariner on his personal
yacht in peril is a scumball, unless thats his profession or the boat
was abandoned and it's not needed anyway.

That's a gross over-generalization. Don't you think someone should be
compensated for taking time and risk, and expending effort?

I would not expect a Lloyds LOS salvage agreement to be carried by
BoatsUS, TowboatUS, ect.ect..

But offshore... commerical vessels..that make up 99 percent of all
salvage needed would be very familar with the Lloyd's contract, and
most likely insured by Lloyds of London.

So what? For most boat owners in the US, it's not a good contract. And, even
if it were, in your own words, they would be scumballs if they used it.

Jon's right, I did not look at the BoatUS contract because I do not
respect BoatUS or towboatsUS. I would never consider either one of
thier opinions worthy of consideration. They both have good business
plans to make money but I have seen their seamanship knowledge and the
quality of thee crews that man the boats to be a FN joke at best.

Then, you should have before you opened your yap.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

On Jan 24, 12:21 pm, "Capt. JG" wrote:
"Joe" wrote in oglegroups.com...







On Jan 24, 11:42 am, Jeff wrote:

The difference of our opinion's probly arise because we are thinking
on different levels.

I'm thinking on the level of a small yacht owner, like almost everyone

With the recent "Salvaging or Scavenging" on the British shore I
assumed we were discussing salvage in general, and specifically the
beached booty. Only jon brought up small craft towing, guess because he
has that endorsement on his ticket. When he told me he had a towing
endorsement I thought he had a freight and towing
endorsement...bwahahahahahahahaaa


..Sure Joe. I think you just got lazy in your thinking. JLR was talking
about
theft, not salvage.

Let's review what Jolly said....ready.....ok... "When is it salvage and
when is it stealing?" and " thanks".

I think you got lazy when you started to think.



I think anyone who pulls salvage on another mariner on his personal
yacht in peril is a scumball, unless thats his profession or the boat
was abandoned and it's not needed anyway.


That's a gross over-generalization. Don't you think someone should be
compensated for taking time and risk, and expending effort?

Sure they should Jon, but it should not be expected or required.
Mariners are suppose to help each other out...thats the law of the sea
IMO. You do for another at sea what you would like them to do for you.
If your any kind of a man, you make sure the person who helped you gets
compensated for his efforts.


I would not expect a Lloyds LOS salvage agreement to be carried by
BoatsUS, TowboatUS, ect.ect..

But offshore... commerical vessels..that make up 99 percent of all
salvage needed would be very familar with the Lloyd's contract, and
most likely insured by Lloyds of London.


So what? For most boat owners in the US, it's not a good contract. And,
even
if it were, in your own words, they would be scumballs if they used it.

You're getting thick as a brick lately Jonboy. Most small boat owners
in the USA are not professional mariners, you are a classic example. In
my words,I will post again.....ready....ok..."unless thats his
profession or the boat was abandoned and it's not needed anyway".

In other words Jon IMO it's ok for a person to set up a biz rescuing
weekend warriors, and he may need a tool to make sure he gets paid, and
if the boat is abandoned than I have no pity for the person who
abandoned the vessel.

I carry the LOS contract because I go offshore and have enough power
to tow or rescue a small commerical vessel. I never suggested you carry
a copy.


Jon's right, I did not look at the BoatUS contract because I do not
respect BoatUS or towboatsUS. I would never consider either one of
thier opinions worthy of consideration. They both have good business
plans to make money but I have seen their seamanship knowledge and the
quality of thee crews that man the boats to be a FN joke at best.Then, you should have before you opened your yap.

Why?

Joe

--
"j" ganz - Hide quoted text -- Show quoted text -

"Joe" wrote in message
oups.com..
..

Sure they should Jon, but it should not be expected or
required.
Mariners are suppose to help each other out...thats the
law of the sea
IMO. You do for another at sea what you would like them to
do for you.


Unless the boat has NY plates on it.

Nellen

"Nellen MacArthur" wrote
Unless the boat has NY plates on it.

Manheim, PA. Isn't that where Scotty's from? roflmsvao

Cheers,
Ellen

--
Scott Vernon
Plowville Pa _/)__/)_/)_



"Ellen MacArthur" wrote in
message
reenews.ne
t...

"Nellen MacArthur" wrote
Unless the boat has NY plates on it.

Manheim, PA. Isn't that where Scotty's from?
roflmsvao

Cheers,
Ellen

"Scotty" wrote
Scott Vernon
Plowville Pa _/)__/)_/)_

That's where your house is. Your IP number comes from Manheim. I searched it.....

Cheers,
Ellen

"Scotty" wrote

I forgot the map. Here it is: http://www.google.com/maps?q=Manheim...i=map&ct=title
Just go south on 72 to Lancaster then north on 501 to Manheim.
This girl can google. :-)

Cheers,
Ellen

"Joe" wrote in message
oups.com...

Let's review what Jolly said....ready.....ok... "When is it salvage and
when is it stealing?" and " thanks".

I think you got lazy when you started to think.

Trying thinking some more. You're the one who decided to put both your feet
in your mouth when you defined the clear lines by using the Lloyds contract
form. That form is not appropriate for the vast majority of small craft
issues.



I think anyone who pulls salvage on another mariner on his personal
yacht in peril is a scumball, unless thats his profession or the boat
was abandoned and it's not needed anyway.


That's a gross over-generalization. Don't you think someone should be
compensated for taking time and risk, and expending effort?

Sure they should Jon, but it should not be expected or required.
Mariners are suppose to help each other out...thats the law of the sea
IMO. You do for another at sea what you would like them to do for you.
If your any kind of a man, you make sure the person who helped you gets
compensated for his efforts.

If you agree, then you just contradicted yourself! We all know that we're
required to help fellow boaters, but there are limits to the requirement,
and if one decides that one needs to be compensated for extenuating
circumstances, a good contract is a good idea. Some people are not
fair-minded and a contract is good way of making sure they act
appropriately. Just because you have a contract doesn't mean you're limited
to what you'll insist on collecting.

You're getting thick as a brick lately Jonboy. Most small boat owners
in the USA are not professional mariners, you are a classic example. In
my words,I will post again.....ready....ok..."unless thats his
profession or the boat was abandoned and it's not needed anyway".

In other words, your Lloyds contract isn't worth it and best not used. If
one has to use a contract to feel more secure, one based and enforced by US
jurisdiction would be more appropriate; thus, the one I mentioned from
BoatUS.


In other words Jon IMO it's ok for a person to set up a biz rescuing
weekend warriors, and he may need a tool to make sure he gets paid, and
if the boat is abandoned than I have no pity for the person who
abandoned the vessel.

Sorry, but this has to be in at least pigeon English before I can understand
it.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

On Jan 24, 1:29 pm, "Capt. JG" wrote:
Sorry, but this has to be in at least pigeon English before I can
understand
it.

Take a few hits of purple micro-dot, or orange sunshine then try to
understand.

Joe

--
"j" ganz